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2:00 PM
fuck arrays
oh wait xeo already said that
 
@AndyProwl say i want to store &, and const& Ts by reference, but move && into an object
 
user1804599
@gnzlbg have them pass iterators instead.
 
user1804599
@gnzlbg have them pass std::array<T, N> instead.
 
why? they should be able to pass anything rightfold
don't do that is not good enough
i can specializate for arrays and solve the problem, but it breaks my balls
 
user1804599
Nobody should be able to pass values of broken types!
 
user1804599
2:05 PM
std::arrayu akbar!
 
@gnzlbg this was all soooo obvious in the time that C was created, it was really a no-brainer
That's the thing. We're trying to use it for wildly different things now
 
@gnzlbg don't do it
you won't be able to have offspring
rightfold think of the guy!
 
@рытфолд code readability isn't the issue at hand though (fonts can also help with code readability)
@wilx perhaps they don't want to encourage it
 
2:08 PM
@sehe I mean, they built in arrays, and then decided to make char arrays special from all other arrays... it might have made sense somehow, but I doubt they thought it was a great consistent decision
 
@sehe It is either that or running Apache Ant using its ant.bat file through cmd.exe which seems even worse.
 
@gnzlbg how are char arrays different from int arrays?
 
@gnzlbg that's not actually true at. char a[] = { '1','2','\0','4','5' }; has worked in all versions C AFAIR
 
end delimiter
what is the end delimiter for an int array?
 
2:10 PM
there is no end delimiter implied by the use of a char array
(see what sehe wrote just above)
 
@wilx depending on what you're achieving, I'd say the latter expresses the intent mo betterer and hence I prefer it
 
Xeo
String literals are special, not char arrays
 
but the sentinel '\0' allows you to iterate over it using only a pointer to the front
which is not possible for any other sequence
 
Xeo
@gnzlbg does it?
You'd stop in the middle of sehe's array there
 
@gnzlbg such a notion doesn't exist. The NUL terminated string is not related to the character arrays.
 
2:11 PM
@gnzlbg That is possible for every other sequence that doesn't use 0.
 
people pass const char* all the time and iterate till '\0'
 
@Xeo though I understand. People find my full array intimidatingly large, and only few people have been able to take it in fully
 
most people passing an int* also pass the size, or a one past end int*
 
they should pass string or string_view
 
Xeo
people shouldn't pass int* for an array at all
 
2:12 PM
at a language level there is no difference between an array of char and an array of int
 
@sehe Sucks to be your wife.
6
 
in C, not C++
 
@gnzlbg And they should go back to the 80's when this still remotely made sense. Well, first half of
 
Xeo
@gnzlbg So? We're writing C++ here.
 
im just talking about C only, no C++
we have to deal with people writing C back at us
 
Xeo
2:13 PM
Are you writing a C or a C++ library?
 
foo("abcd") vs foo(std::string{"abcd"})
 
@gnzlbg I don't think there is a difference at a language level in C either
although I'm not a C programmer so I might be wrong
 
@gnzlbg well. No argument there. There's nothing to redeem
 
We're deploying an updated version of the Data Explorer with updates from @tmslft, http://data.stackexchange.com will be back in a moment.
 
hi Feeds
 
2:14 PM
hmpfm <clears eyebrow sweat> this article is actually more demanding than I thought
I knew it's nontrivial
 
@gnzlbg wut. As long as foo takes a std::string (or even char const(&)[N]) they'll be fine
 
a char(&)[N] won't work with arbitrary length strings that people decide to pass as const char*, so I have to make an overload that takes a string :/
 
So what's this about a new unconference?
 
@gnzlbg (a) templates (b) what's stopping you
 
Xeo
@jalf ohai
 
2:16 PM
@jalf London, either 13th or 20th, depending on votes. You going?
 
Xeo
Or maybe before 13th
 
@Xeo AFAIK Ell won't be able to come before the 18th
 
@AndyProwl Which month?
 
@jalf June
 
Xeo
@AndyProwl Oh, hm
 
2:17 PM
@sehe might make an extra copy/heap allocation, i've just worked around it, but it is the fact that one has to explicitly work around this what is annoying
 
ah, I don't plan that far ahead. I'll probably be fine with either date :D
 
Xeo
@gnzlbg C++ is an annoying language vOv
 
@jalf Now you do.
 
@Xeo we have to live with it :/ the sad thing is I kind of like it, is that masochism?
 
:)
 
2:19 PM
@gnzlbg Depends which parts you like
int**** j = r // yes
 
@jalf Played anything interesting recently?
 
speaking of games @R.MartinhoFernandes ever been into Warhammer?
I remember you were into Total War
the next Total War is going to be placed in the Warhammer universe
 
Xeo
I lost a round of Star Realms yesterday because my opponent had one Trade left which he had no use for :<
 
I have Dawn of War, but haven't played much.
 
@AlexM. I dabbled a tiny bit in 40k once, ages ago. Back when I was able to play with a friend's army so I didn't have to spend the money myself :p
 
2:21 PM
@AlexM. I thought it was Attila.
 
Played Dawn of War a ton though :)
 
@jalf Yeah, I think he meant video games.
 
Xeo
He decided to just buy the only 1-Trade card in the trade row, which revealed an event that healed him for 7. My next attack put him to 5. :<
 
@AndyProwl i hate having to do that :/
 
@Xeo I won BSG as the humans yesterday.
 
2:22 PM
@gnzlbg :P
 
Weirdest game I played, actually.
We found a Cylon on the very first turn.
 
Atilla was released already, no?
 
@AndyProwl dump<decltype(r)>{}; makes me hate it a bit less tho
 
@AlexM. Next month.
 
2:23 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes In terms of boardgames, not really. Still playing Tash-kalar whenever I get the chance, and our Descent campaign is still ongoing. In terms of video games, uh... Chaos Reborn is probably the most noteworthy one
 
Do you know Patchwork?
 
nope?
 
Neat simple little game for two players.
And although simple, it's surprisingly deep.
@jalf Someone is running a Descent campaign in our group, but since I'm now officially running a Paranoia campaign, I don't have the time.
 
lol, crypto locker is still getting people
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh, I got me a copy of Death Angel, it's actually rather fun. Damn hard though. The mechanics are fairly simple.
 
Never heard of that.
RPG?
 
2:33 PM
No...
Well, like all good games there's a role to be played :P
Ben has a copy
it's a card game...
 
Oh, the Space Hulk thing?
lol
hahahaha
 
mostly each player just chooses which action they want, out of two (they have three, but can't repeat last turn). There are choices to be made that can have impact on stuff...
 
@thecoshman Cryptolocker is actually pretty sophisticated, I'm pretty sure they are very well funded. Last I checked they were using several zero days to get in.
 
Ben started explaining the game to us once, and he did some silly mistake that we mocked him for, for about five whole minutes and then he got pissed off and stormed out.
So, yeah, never played it.
Never seen him react like that, actually.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Ah, Descent doesn't take any real preparation time to run at least. Takes forever to play though
Paranoia sounds like fun though
 
2:40 PM
@jalf To be honest, Paranoia doesn't take a lot of preparation for me either. Its design lends itself very well to improvisation, and that's my favourite GM style.
Players have a tendency to shoot first and make up the answers later, anyway.
 
Which one's Ben again?
 
Not in the Lounge.
 
Benjamin Franklin, duh
 
Oh damn I got some crazy Android shit
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit A friend of mine, whose house we invaded to play boardgames during the last unconference.
 
2:43 PM
@Rerito wat
 
> Note: you need FlexibleContexts for that, despite the fact that if you don't enable it and omit the signature, GHC will infer it correctly.
the more you know
 
@gnzlbg It's not for string literals. It — in concert with array noncopyability — is so people in the 1970s didn't copy arrays when they didn't mean to ... but still had a way to pass them into functions without having to take the address and whatnot. Shite but C so...
 
I bind to a service (so I expect a onServiceConnected() callback)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh ok
Thought it was a lounger every time you said it
 
Nah. He hates programmers.
 
2:43 PM
Which I think is reasonable given the context l;p
@R.MartinhoFernandes Pfft, so do we
 
If my phone is held in portrait mode => no prob, onServiceConnected() is called
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes interesting :P
 
If held in landscape mode => onServiceConnected() never happens
 
are you switching between orientations?
watch out when doing that
the underlying activity gets reset altogether
 
Reset? Could you elaborate?
 
2:45 PM
or at least it did when I developed for Android
that was in the pre 3.0 time
 
That may be the reason I get this weird shit
 
@AlexM. pre what
 
pre honeycomb
@Rerito one sec
0
Q: Activity Restarts when Orientation changes android?

user2699728I have a application ,where I am using Landscape and potrait mode. I have used android:configChanges="orientation|keyboardHidden" in my every activity. So When I run this on device 2.3 its completely working fine and the activity is not restarted. But When I open the same application in android ...

 
I thought it was never called 3.0
 
> If your application doesn't need to update resources during a specific configuration change and you have a performance limitation that requires you to avoid the activity restart, then you can declare that your activity handles the configuration change itself, which prevents the system from restarting your activity.
that means that if you don't specify the thing yourself, the activity will be restarted
onCreate/onStart/onWhatever get called again
as if the app was restarted
it was annoying when I discovered it
because it feels counter-intuitive
@BartekBanachewicz it's the official version tho
 
2:48 PM
Alright thx @AlexM. I'll investigate that way
 
Activities are supposed to expect being restarted at any point.
 
Honeycomb | Welcome to Android 3.0! developer.android.com/about/versions/…
 
@Jefffrey I have a project idea for you
 
I remember something like that mentioned early in the fine manuals.
 
write a script that goes through a module and looks for missing top-level signatures and adds them
 
2:49 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes yes, especially because of the OS killing apps to make room for others
when returning to your app, you may find it it has restarted
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes see, so good you've had fun with out even having to play the game properly
 
instead of resumed
 
That panic when you're not sure if the music sounds muffled because it is supposed to or if suddenly everyone is forced to rock out too
 
@thecoshman EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
 
Xeo
I'd be way too annoyed at that stupid tinitus to not go to a doctor.
 
2:56 PM
> sudo can I have a pony?
 
@Xeo I've been to a doctor weeks ago.
 
Xeo
About your tinitus?
 
Xeo
Oh. Sorry then. Must've missed that.
 
@sehe "If you know where the pony repository is..."
 
Xeo
2:57 PM
What did he say?
 
Pretty much that everything is ok.
IOW "Suck it up"
 
Xeo
:/
 
@Xeo hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
 
@sehe no ponies for root.
 
what about sheep for wood?
 
3:02 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'd say: take rest (perhaps sleep during the nights) and suck it up. If it is still there with some time (defined by your patience and common sense) see a doctor who specializes. There are special institutions/peer groups that know what actually exists.
 
Say I want to write a function that perfect forwards the argument, but the argument is not a template, do I have to write it 3 times? Or is it better to write it once and enable_if it for a single type?
 
@Rerito Air is heated when you breathe it in. You don't actually get cold air in your lungs.
@AlexM. No, you don't. You really don't.
 
Xeo
@gnzlbg 16 times or something, actually, to achieve the same effect. :P
 
@Xeo a shit, const volatile, i always forget about volatile
 
Xeo
no wait, only 8
const, volatile, const-volatile, nothing - each of those for & and &&
 
3:04 PM
@EtiennedeMartel I had -20 a dozen days ago and I do want -18
you don't tell me what I want
 
@EtiennedeMartel 'Course but I tried running in the cold (around -5°C), and deep breathing was giving me a burning sensation
 
hmph
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes There are some treatments (""?) e.g. with counter noise, but it very much depends on the type of tinnitus (brain triggered or ear triggered). It seems people can actually "control" the tinnitus if they recognize the trigger (or the increase) and apply the mitigating strategies.
 
@Xeo enable if then
this is just ugly
 
Xeo
Search for is_related on robot's blog
 
3:05 PM
it would seem that the comittee doesnt write c++
 
@Xeo const && is p. much equivalent to const&
 
Xeo
@sehe Which is why I said "for the same effect"
 
@Rerito That's because you're out of shape.
 
Xeo
You can still overload on it
 
Also, -5 isn't cold.
 
Xeo
3:05 PM
Just because it doesn't make sense doesn't mean it's not possible
 
Out of shape?
 
You're a shape shifter
 
a doppelganger
 
-5°C is cold here
 
@Xeo i'm basically defining a false trait, and then specializing it to true for std::decay_t of my type, and then enable_if on that with a forwarding reference
 
3:06 PM
In the Dungeons & Dragons fantasy role-playing game, Doppelgangers are monstrous humanoids, identified primarily by their ability to change their shape and appearance to mimic almost any humanoid creature. They can be used in the game by Dungeon Masters as allies or opponents of the player characters. == Publication history == The doppelganger was one of the earliest creatures introduced in the D&D game. === Dungeons & Dragons (1974-1976) === The doppelganger was introduced to the game in its first supplement, Greyhawk (1975). It is described as a creature with a mutable form, able to s...
 
Xeo
@gnzlbg wat
 
@EtiennedeMartel I do not speak the language...
 
> Attention également aux températures extrêmement froides demain, parfois jusqu'à -6 dans certaines régions ou au delà.
@wilx -6 in France is "extreme cold".
 
@EtiennedeMartel Why bother spending a lot of money for an emergency situation (snow) that rarely happens
 
3:08 PM
@EtiennedeMartel Ah, heh. :)
 
That would be insane
 
They got Alps. Some of them must be used to that.
 
And Jura, where temperatures can drop very low as well
 
template <class F> storage{};
template <class F> struct is_storage : std::false_type {};
template <class F> struct is_storage<storage<std::decay_t<F>> : std::true_type {};
// is_storage_t..

template<class F>
auto foo(storage<F>&&) // ooops

// right way
template<class Storage, REQUIRES_(is_storage_t<Storage>{})>
auto foo(Storage&&); // happy
 
@EtiennedeMartel lol
 
3:09 PM
@Rerito Because not being prepared can cost you even more money than what you spend on being prepared.
 
people in Miercurea Ciuc here are often experiencing -25 and below during winter
five years ago they had -30
 
Anyway, the Gulf Stream makes all of Western Europe soft.
 
what you on about?
 
You don't know what true cold is.
 
Is that a dick contest?
 
3:12 PM
We get -25C or so pretty regularly in michigan winters
 
Bah
 
@Rerito Yes.
gg no re
 
Well, we actually experience temperature in F, obviously. But it should be equivalent.
 
TIL no major browser does anything amusing on receiving a HTTP/1.1 418 response. Twats.
 
@EtiennedeMartel My brother came back from Montreal and experienced your cold, he actually enjoyed it
 
3:15 PM
@SamDeHaan no, F is like twice as hot as C
 
@Rerito yes, smallest dick contest
you win
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit what is 418 meant to be?
 
@AlexM. Yay! What's my prize?
 
@sehe I know. I've met someone that works at a company specialising in that sort of thing.
 
@thecoshman no way, it's at most like 9/5s as hot.
 
3:18 PM
@Rerito experience
 
@EtiennedeMartel Er, you're the ones losing, because it's sooooooooooo cold.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Smart pun
 
how the hell do you google :->
 
"weirdass smiley"
 
it's supposed to be equivalent to Simple Lens
Simple Lens a b ~ a :-> b
 
3:21 PM
I found it by googling "haskell simple lens" hackage.haskell.org/package/lens-3.7.2/docs/…
 
@AlexM. yeah, but that's in 3.7
I need to find it in 4.7
 
@SamDeHaan ... because I is totes serios
@BartekBanachewicz o_0
 
that's 4.1
 
3:24 PM
if you remove the version it will take you to the newest one
 
@Rerito It's not a pun.
 
@Xeo i am disapoint
 
@thecoshman y so srs?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Now I'm slacking off watching Infoman videos
 
3:29 PM
@wilx is that a movie starring a meme?
 
@AlexM. lol, dunno, see for yourself :D
 
@thecoshman "I Am A Teapot"
 
I think someone might be broken.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It's just your imagination.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes gnome control centre?
 
3:34 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I can read that just fine
 
ugly ass icon
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes What's wrong with that?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit oh :P
 
@AndyProwl noooo :(
 
> We noticed you haven't yet voted in the 2015 IGDA Global Board of Directors Election. Your vote is very important in determining the direction of the organization and we ask that you please take a moment review the candidates and make your voice heard.
Well now.
 
3:39 PM
@sehe I have no idea what it is. I just set a vnc profile to use Xfeces, and that was the first thing that showed up.
 
A draft of my newest article - proofreading welcome. Bash it at will.
 
th;dr :P
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Xfæces*
@BartekBanachewicz IRTA my new testicle
 
if I knew the language I'd read it tho
 
3:42 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes How is your inner Unicode geek feeling about this?
 
Looks better.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes "the first start of the panel" derp
 
Has anyone here used NX?
 
Yes. ~5 years ago it looked very promising.
 
Should I prefer it over VNC?
 
3:44 PM
These days I'm lazy and just X11vnc again
 
I'm curious about trying that haskell tiling window manager tho
I never used tiling window managers
 
i3 is better
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You should probably. It was faster but required me to manually install on all systems. I got tired of it
 
@CatPlusPlus it looks like an OS with Vim as UI
 
3:51 PM
@EtiennedeMartel lol
the weapon models look really cool
 
@EtiennedeMartel lol, awesome.
 
> Unsigned 32 bit colors!
 
@EtiennedeMartel I'm
not sure
if I want to play that
 
Xeo
> STRAFE® is the fastest, bloodiest, deadliest, most adjective-abusing, action-packed first-person shooter of 1996!
> most adjective-abusing
lol
 
Regarding the answers: grandchild processes in our case is just a test case, I'm looking for a general solution, we are talking about an execution software - being able to execute a command line provided by the user, on several Linux flavors and Windows, user can run a script that starts an installation that runs another installation, and stuff like that, Our only knowledge here is the root of the tree, which my process starts. Regarding the ptrace, I'm looking into this but unfortunately as I said, I'm trying to solve it for both Windows and Linux. — Ron.B.I 2 mins ago
Damn. That's the third today that thinks we're here to make the impossible happen and an answer is not helpful until it completely solves their task
 
Xeo
3:58 PM
> The insanely detailed worlds of STRAFE®: From concept art to breathtaking reality.
 
Reminds me a little too much of people asking "I'm writing a virusscanner, how would I go about this".
Dammit. If it's not trivial, put in the work. Or adjust the goals.
 
cat, does Vagrant have any restrictions about running long-running commands in the VM?
 
Xeo
> pledged of $185,096 goal
 
I might stop lurking in if the quality drops to this level
 
Xeo
The goal is pretty ambitous though, eh.
 
3:59 PM
I'm trying to automate a process, but it seems that Vagrant keeps killing and restarting it, even if it's still running happily
 
In his spare time, I like to imagine Torvalds roaming round Apple stores, playing with the dock animation in Yosemite and gleefully humming.
lmao
 
@Xeo probably to cover the expenses for the trailer
 

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