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8:00 PM
@Squiggle: What is the best way of managing angular and friends? bower?
 
@scheien whatever you're comfortable with.
I scaffold with yeoman then don't touch the buggers
 
THEM: Wow, you're a programmer? you must be smart! ME: https://t.co/XZhiB6YZiw
 
@Squiggle It should have expected that answer from you :)
 
good stuff :)
 
@Squiggle is that usable only for new apps, or also for existing ones? that's a new thing for me.
 
8:04 PM
@Jeremy How did you know that's what I've been doing all these years?
 
mmm
local chicken and short ribs with mixed grilled mushrooms and acorn squash for lunch
 
local chicken
 
Loco Chick
 
@Codeman you better jicama that shit up if you know what's good for you
 
Chicken and ribs?
 
8:07 PM
Anyone around that knows about the inner workings of AutoResetEvent and ManualResetEvent?
 
@Codeman i had breakfast tacos! :^)
 
@Rachel What do you need to know?
 
@Rachel dot net reference source is a good reference ;)
 
Reed for threading comes out of the weekend slumber
 
@Rachel ha, I'd just that moment put finger to keyboard to say "Ask @ReedCopsey"
 
8:08 PM
Why two AutoResetEvents would work where one ManualResetEvent would not...
It doesn't make sense to me
-1
Q: Why would two AutoResetEvents work where a ManualResetEvent does not?

RachelI'm trying to test some code where on application startup, some stuff does not load correctly. The basic code is this : public class SomeSingleton { public AutoResetEvent A; public bool IsModulesFinishedLoading = false; } public MyApplication : FormShellApplication<WorkItem, MyForm> { ...

 
311
Q: What is the difference between ManualResetEvent and AutoResetEvent in .NET?

kazakdogofspaceI have read the documentation on this and I think I understand. An AutoResetEvent resets when the code passes through event.WaitOne(), but a ManualResetEvent does not. Is this correct?

 
Also, I love the fact that these exception handlers manage to remove all relevant information from the exception so by the time it actually bubbles up the call stack to the point it's an unhandled exception about the only thing it says is "something bad happened"
 
I understand the difference, but I don't understand why it doesn't work in my case
 
want to post some code?
 
everything I try to find online is all about whether you want one thread or all threads to signal..
I posted the simplified complete code sample in my question, but if more is needed let me know
 
8:10 PM
MRE should be the right answer in this case
 
I'm at a loss, and frustrated because I can't find anythign and a co-worker is just insisting we go back to using two AutoResetEvents... I don't like using code I don't understand
 
but - you don't have your code
so its tough to know where things went wrong using it
That being said, this type of scenario is almost always easier/cleaner to do with Task/Task<T> nowadays
 
hrm ok, as long as there isn't something I am simply missing about this than I think I will be OK to keep trying to make her understand
sadly I am stuck with .net 3.5, and no TPL
 
since you're trying to control order of initialization, awaiting a task is typically easier than using event handles
 
I've been arguing to upgrade to a higher version of .net for two years now...
 
8:12 PM
well, the 2 auto events is working because you're basically just chaining events - but if you wanted to add a third, you'd be adding a 3rd event, etc
which isn't the right approach
ie: you're doing a waits on b waits on c
 
I agree it's not the right approach, but I don't understand why MRE isn't working
 
instead of a and b wait on c
 
@Rachel Microsoft doesn't even provide updates now for anything under 4.6
 
I don't either :) but you didn't show the code with MRE
 
and my co-worker is saying she is too busy to try and debug from her machine right now, and she'll just re-add the two events before our release =(
MRE code is just replacing the AutoResetEvent with ManualResetEvent. No change other than that
 
8:13 PM
I guess I'm just really lucky to work at a company that always develops from latest .NET, but I don't think I understand what the argument is to not update
 
I think the argument is MS only supports the latest version of the .Net framework, with the exception of 3.5
in a big financial institution, being able to say your technology stack is backed by Microsoft is a huge deal, and they don't want to always be updating to the latest version
 
Yes - well, you don't show where things get set - and if there's anything going on there
@Rachel .NET 3.5 is not backed by Microsoft anymore
 
@Rachel They don't support 3.5 anymore
 
so using it now is negligent
 
@Rachel They pulled support for all below 4.6, no security updates or anything for anything under 4.6
 
8:15 PM
good to know, I'll make that argument next time it comes up this year. I've been really trying to push for 4.5 or 5.0
 
well, they sort of support it
but it's part of OS support
 
@ReedCopsey What part of the code do you need to see? I can edit to explain it further if you want
 
@ReedCopsey Might as well not, Windows 10 disables 3.5 and 4.0 by default.
@Rachel Is 5.0 even out?
 
Yes, other sections in my company code on 5.0
 
I thought they were only on 4.6.
@Rachel C# 5.0 or .Net?
 
8:16 PM
4.6.2
 
oh wait, maybe it was 4.5.... am not entirely sure, woul dhave to look into it more
 
@Rachel Because the latest .Net is 4.6.2
 
beta woops
was doing some MVC 6 dev friday
 
Cause C# should be at 6, .Net is at 4.6.2 last I know. That is beta, official is 4.6.1
 
when I first started, I was told they were migrating to WPF. Then the guy leading that effort switched teams, and we went back to just using WinForms and 3.5...
and the WPF effort died
 
8:18 PM
that's sad
in general, I will say, this entire approach isn't very good
 
My company is still trying to work out licensing/testing of VS2015 (since pricing changed), so no C#6 at work yet for me... :(
 
I am very sad about it, but it would be a huge effort. The existing code base is very bad though imo
 
you shouldn't really be doing threads, etc, to launch this and delay
 
it would be a huge pain to migrate it because it's not coded very well.
 
would be much cleaner in .NET (anything not obsolete)
 
8:19 PM
I agree, we're using CAB and a MDI workspace... and the infrastructure code is so overengineered and it's very hard to change anything
 
MDI mmmm
 
See this for an example of code I am regularly trying to fight to refactor...
0
Q: Was the performance of older versions of String.Equals poor due to not checking for nulls first?

RachelI keep coming across code like this in the code base I am working on : private bool Equals(string s1, string s2) { if (s1 == null && s2 == null) return true; else if (s1 != null && s2 == null) return false; else if (s1 == null && s2 != null) return false; ...

its so frustrating to see poorly written code that only adds confusion and complexity, and be told not to touch it because nobody has complained about it
 
3 weeks later
Catch ಠ_ಠ As Exception
Throw ಠ_ಠ
End Try
still there
mfw
 
did a check that in?
 
yep
 
8:23 PM
why would you check that in...
rofl
 
+1 for getting away with it
 
because it's hilarious
 
Are generic functions that only accept a handful of types a bad practice?
 
when you have a new, lengthy code review process now, you'll have yourself to blame
 
of course you could chekcing - this place is fucked and would get past QC
 
8:23 PM
@Jeremy I am the code review process
lol
nah that's not true i am just one step on a chain
 
@Rachel We have this problem at my company, too. Some are more reckless and will just root it out on sight, and others treat touching any code like a surgical procedure.
I've moved from the latter camp to the former. I guess I'm lucky nobody's tried to force a policy down about things like this.
 
ok i changed it
lol
 
git blame-someone-else
 
@Jeremy I guess I am part of the former, however I am always getting in trouble for it. And if there's always a ton of noise if something I change does break
The code will never improve though if nobody fixes it
and new developers just copy/paste existing code the majority of time...
 
existing code from where
SO?
 
8:27 PM
the internet.. Poof Cut Copy Works done
 
@Rachel and you still work there because?
 
@Rachel Sounds familiar. I'm not in finance, but in another heavily-regulated area. Similar gripes.
 
I mean at my place I tell new dev's to copy paste from existing projects
we have a standard to enforce
 
Recently I did a big project with a slightly different structure to it (that actually made sense). Next few months, I saw my structure copied to new projects by other devs, with the same names for folders and classes, too.
Made me feel all fuzzy :^)
 
Standards... Beer Beer - Standard Lowered
 
8:29 PM
thats good
makes it easier to maintain
 
Nice slide:
A slide from my #CodeMash talk coming up on Thursday. https://t.co/SGPh7FisPa
 
+1 @Jeremy for thinking about the future
 
@TomW They let me work from home and pay really well for my area. I'd be happy to move on if something with similar benefits came along... I really miss working with WPF :)
 
@ReedCopsey Wasn't there a futures/async proposal for C++17, too? Did it die?
 
I've finally gotten to the point that I'm trusted to make a lot of changes, and am counted as one of the "senior" programmers on the team, which is nice. I feel like I have a lot more say in future projects. It's just going back and changing old code is horribly difficult
 
8:30 PM
Oh, it's on the slide
I'm dumb
 
shit
 
@Jeremy See the "Resumable Functions" section below?
 
last time i used C++ version 11 just came out
 
;)
 
now we are on 17
time flies
 
8:31 PM
@Rachel I just pick battles carefully, make sure to do lots of ego-stroking/give credit where due, and have difficult conversations cleanly and early.
 
@Jeremy lol thanks, I'm learning as I go :) was a solo programmer before this, and could pretty much do what I wanted. One of the reasons I took this job was to get experience working as part of a team
 
@Failsafe if you're copy pasting you should just insert good advice here that I'm too tired to type out, but you know what I'd say
 
definitely think I've learned a lot, and sometimes I am completely wrong in the directions I am going
 
@Rachel Yep. The team inter-personal stuff is always the hardest, in any job, really.
 
Best reason to join a bigger team - to learn
 
8:33 PM
Its nice to have a team to bounce stuff off of, but when I need real solid advice I still turn to Stack Overflow lol
 
@Rachel Yeah. I don't work with @ReedCopsey or anything lol
 
@Codeman Eh, We have to. There was a standard set in place by people above my paygrade and I am not in a position to go against it. It seems to work for our mission, which works for me.
 
the water is warmer here
 
If I have to use custom templates and copy paste from existing projects then so be it
i am getting paid either way
 
@Failsafe :(
This "10x" developer thing is so funny
We had a "10x" developer on our team... he was a 30x bug-causer
 
8:38 PM
@Jeremy Lol it doesn't stop me from complaining though.
!!urban 10x developer
 
@Failsafe No definition found for 10x developer
 
dang
 
copy/paste should be refactored into a method or service so that you don't have to change the logic in a thousand places
:D
not that anyone TRULY refactors though
unless you work in a bona fide tech company
 
@Jeremy 9 women can't make a baby in 1 month
 
refactor for speed
 
8:40 PM
@Bardicer what does "truly refactor" mean
 
@Jeremy which 10x developer thing?
 
@Bardicer "But I haven't GOT a FooFrobber! Why does this stupid lib need so much BS config?"
 
I wouldn't consider a 10x dev that causes 30x bugs a 10x dev - that's just a cowboy coder
 
@Rachel - So with regards to your earlier question, is that being done to millions of strings?
 
@Codeman This whole notion that some developers work an order of magnitude (or two) more efficiently than the average dev
And that's what I mean lol
 
8:41 PM
@Failsafe but they still can make 9 babies in 9 months... or even 18 or 27
 
@Jeremy I'm aware of that and I believe it to be true :)
 
It is definitely true.
 
meaning nobody does refactoring as a standard procedure
 
@Codeman See, I kind of suspect it is true, and that the "average developer" is a really LOW watermark
 
I write less code and get more features shipped than my juniors usually
 
8:42 PM
10x dev?
 
@Jeremy I've found that the "average developer" is really, really, surprisingly, horribly shitty at engineering.
 
If Jon Skeet was on your team, you would probably look like a 0.1x dev
 
@Codeman enjoy that while it lasts
 
@TomW how do you mean?
 
@Codeman Do you have "average developers" at MSFT?
 
8:42 PM
how much teaching/code review do you do @Codeman?
 
@Codeman you'll become a manager, one of these days
 
Ive never worked with a rockstar dev before
 
Meetings are in your future
 
@Bardicer quite a lot, actually. I spend a lot of time on code reviews. We have lots of juniors on my team so it's important
 
how do you do code reviews?
 
8:43 PM
I spend a lot of time trying to press engineering principles into them
@Bardicer well, we use Visual Studio Team Services for it ;)
 
@Jeremy - Of course they do. Entry level positions exist in every company, even MSFT. Perhaps at higher levels that doesn't exist as much, but at some rate they have to be present.
 
i've heard that after a spring, some companies have a meeting and pull random bits of code and everyone goes over it
 
@Jeremy I mean... our average is much higher than the industry average
@Bardicer code is reviewed before it is merged
 
ew
welllll
 
we require two juniors or one intermediate/senior to sign off before a PR can be merged
 
8:44 PM
you said merged, not committed...right?
 
I think that's a good way to do it. Catches lots of bugs
oh yeah, lol
 
ok i can see that
 
you can do whatever the hell you want in your own branches
when you wanna merge to master, that's code review time
 
at zywave code reviews were a daily thing - everyone on the team had to review everyone else's code
 
@TravisJ But you're conflating entry-level with "average." MSFT can hire all-star entry-levels, too.
 
8:45 PM
we sorta had that when I started and I was happy to see it go away
I think team code reviews are a huge waste of time
code reviews are best done asynchronously
 
it was team only in that everyone had to look at everyone else's code
we did it on our own
 
design reviews are fine to do as a team, but if I hear "you missed a tab there..." in a room of people getting paid six figures a year, I will literally scream
 
i.e. i allocated 4 - 4:45pm for code review
lol
 
I usually do my code reviews, email, etc. before lunch because I am not a morning person
I get most of my work work done in the afternoon
 
we didn't do design review because stylecop would fail a CI build and everyone would get an email
 
8:46 PM
I am answering email like 70% of my day
 
most of my Nerf wars done in the evening
 
@Codeman rofl I've been in meetings with all devs before and gone over stuff like this
I was squirming
 
the VP of software development getting an email that your build failed because you forgot a space between if (...
 
@Jeremy I am asking every dev on the team to use CodeMaid with automatic format on save enabled
I never ever ever want to see whitespace errors in a code review
that is a huge waste of your time. there are automated tools to resolve this for free
 
@Codeman Why CodeMaid (never used it)
What does it do that R# doesn't
 
8:47 PM
he never belittled anyone... but he would make a point to mention it and poke at us
 
@Jeremy it's simple, lightweight, on demand
 
Ctrl+K,Ctrl+D works for me
 
i never enjoyed working for someone more than i enjoyed working for him
 
Ctrl+E, Ctrl+D
 
never really had to use a TPP
 
8:47 PM
fuck SVN blame
 
@Codeman one slight problem with that is that if you have a file that doesn't conform to standards (tabs vs spaces for example) is that it'll fuck your diff over
 
i taught our senior dev at my last employer about CTRL K,D
 
@Failsafe that doesn't clean up usings, doesn't clean up many bracket mistakes, doesn't clean up access modifiers
 
he promptly named it "kill dumb sh*t"
 
@TravisJ which one? :) If it's about the string.equals question.... not millions but it's definitely in the hundreds
 
8:48 PM
@Bardicer ok i'm re-using that lol
 
@mikeTheLiar I recommend including a "format commit" then doing your "functional commit" in the case of a large churn
 
lol
 
the diff will only get worse and worse the longer you wait for something like that
and frankly I don't give a shit about tabs vs spaces as long as it's consistent
 
@Codeman doesn't save from doing diffs across that format change
 
@mikeTheLiar it does if you are competent at using GIT :)
 
8:49 PM
Our app apparently started with tabs and eventually switched over to spaces.
Turning on "display whitespace" was a horror show.
 
yeah, so in that case, you can just use WinMerge as your difftool and disable whitespace comparisons
 
@Codeman Do you guys do copyright with year at top of files?
 
git config difftool blah blah blah
 
i don't see M$ using GIT when they have that awesome TFS thing
 
@Jeremy it's in some files, I was going to ask if we could remove it, actually
 
8:50 PM
inno
 
@Codeman I wanted to remove, but legal wants it to stay
So the alternative (imo) is updating all files year to next release year
 
@Jeremy shrug
 
So I never hear about it in a code review ever again
Mine or anyone else's
 
I think including it in the assembly config covers the entire source tree
 
^
 
8:51 PM
there is specifically a copyright field there
 
@Codeman The idea i guess is that an infringer can't argue they didn't know the file was under copyright
So makes the case easier
You don't need it though
 
@Jeremy yeah, but what is stopping them from saying "my version of the file didn't have that"
 
@Codeman Us saying "it's always been there, dumbass."
 
version control proves everything
as long as no one deletes anything
 
I mean this is all a theoretical concern
Don't think we've had any infringments
 
8:53 PM
brb gotta tell the senior dev i need him to deploy to the pms server mwahaha
 
I think in 3 years i am moving to another state
i am thinking NC or CO
 
Def CO over NC
 
is Raleigh not good?
 
@Failsafe Raleigh is beautiful
 
no hurricanes out there - ya that is Great for IT jobs
 
8:54 PM
That whole research triangle area
 
and it is Really Nice
 
CO and NC are both nice places to live
 
i've always wanted to live in raleigh
might be easy to find a job out there
 
@Failsafe my team is hiring in Durham ;)
 
@Failsafe yeah. A coworker messed up today, and started to blame everyone. Turns out he copied the wrong assembly.
 
8:54 PM
I am loving version control :)
how did I live my life programming without it before..
 
made a copy local
vb6 ftw
 
In before someone complains about TFS
 
@Rachel something i wish they'd told me about in college
complains about TFS dammit @Jeremy
:D
 
"I hate you TFS" but you saved my life last night on the dance floor
 
College seemed like such a waste of money to me...
 
8:56 PM
They tried to explain git to us in an elective college course, but they didn't provide any working examples, so it didn't stick really well for anyone.
 
@Codeman Idk if I really want to work at MSFT
 
they didn't really teach me anything useful
 
ugh TFS shivers
 
I've never worked for a small company before or any startups
 
i completely agree
 
8:56 PM
just gave me the motivation and tools to go learn stuff for myself :)
 
I might try that
It's been enterprise since day 1
>.>
 
i learned RPG, COBOL, C++, PHP, Access and MySQL in college
 
@Rachel they taught you how to think
 
first job was C#, .Net, Silverlight, WCF services
 
@juanvan Yes, for those of us that were willing to think :)
 
8:57 PM
@Rachel College teaches you how to learn
 
put all this crap in my head, and one day I used it
 
Sadly, they gave degress to everyone, thinkers and non-thinkers alike
 
no it doesn't... it just shows people you can learn
 
True Everyone gets a trophy
 
@Rachel Very few of the required college courses for CS were of great value, but the electives (mostly 600+) are ones I can think back to when I have a coding problem.
 
8:57 PM
i grew up when 2nd place was also known as "the first loser"
maybe that's why i'm so competitive
 
I'm still sore over the other girl in my class who couldn't even write 4 lines of code to call a constructor with 4 separate sets of arguments in our final group project graduating....
 
@Rachel The degree gets in you in the door, what you learned keeps you there.
 
@Sidney Same
 
Like to know I will suck at times, it makes laughing at myself easier
 
lol
i figure as long as i stick in businesses that don't do applications as their line of business, i'll keep looking like a rockstar
 
8:59 PM
@Rachel ha in my final I did all the code, then when it came time to present the other Girl did my slides.. Had nothing to talk about.. So I talked about how bad flash was
 

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