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3:00 PM
well
ill leave when my boss leaves or 5:30, whatever comes first
 
lol
whats your bosses number, i'll call him and tell him his house is on fire
 
@EricJavierHernandezSauraCouldYourNamePossiblyGetAnyLonger?
 
does it bother you when people don't close quotation marks?
<Application>
   <VisualElements>
      <ApplicationView MinWidth=ā€¯width320 />
   </VisualElements>
</Application>
 
Is someoone bothered to answer a very simple problem related to linq
 
3:10 PM
@Hmmmmmmmmmm is anyone bothered to answer someone asking if they can ask? no.
 
@kush It bothers me more when they use Unicode quotes :P
 
and yes i understand the hypocrisy of that
just ask bro. just ask. we are very good at ignoring questions we dont want to answer
 
Does anyone know the stylecop rule that says

if (something)
return somethingElse;

should be written

if (something) return somethingElse;

?
 
@dav_i stylecop would tell you to use brackets
 
@KendallFrey Word "helpfully" converts quotes like that if I recall correctly.
 
3:12 PM
@dav_i sec, i can find out
 
this is my question
0
Q: How to do multiple joins when using groupby in linq

HmmmmmmmmmmI have a picturerating table in my database. For every new rating ,a new picture rating table row will be created. I am grouping those ratings by lastweek and pictureid, meaning all the ratings for one single pic in the last week will be accumulated and become one rating.Then i will be able to so...

 
@kush I "helpfully" disabled that
 
@drch thanks
 
@dav_i well firstly, i get the brackets issue: SA1503 : CSharp.Layout : The body of the if statement must be wrapped in opening and closing curly brackets.
 
@drch Yeah, I disabled that :)
 
3:15 PM
isn't it outputting a message?
 
i don't get any warnings for this:
private static int Bar(bool foo)
{
    if (foo) return 1;
    return 2;
}
 
Is there a reward for fixing typos?
 
nope... using VS2012, R# 8 and StyleCop (which I've just installed) - it's started auto correcting my two-line ifs to single line when I hit enter...
so assumed it was a SC ruling that it was autocompleting
could be it's just poked something in R#
 
nah thats R#
 
3:17 PM
been using R# for a while and it's not done it before... ugh... time to go diving into menus
 
altho...
you should probably leave force braces ;)
its pretty standard
 
yeah - I find it a bit too much visual noise though
thanks for your help @drch
 
Hello.. is it possible to send out 1K Webrequests concurrently without hanging the GUI?
 
@user2511798 Yes
 
my programmer says no
 
3:24 PM
Fire your programmer.
 
we are planning to create some software which visit websites and check for required text.. without making the GUI hang!.. now the problem with our software is its making the GUI components load slowly while minimizing and maximizin.
 
There are probably too many of them.
 
yea. like 8 buttons and 2 listbox and there are delegates to update the GUI from threads
you think the updating the GUI causing the harm?
 
@user2511798 don't spin up 1k threads obviously
 
3:28 PM
@drch Any idea where in the sea of R# options the one I want is?
 
do something like threadpool.QueueUserWorkItem 1k times
@dav_i yeah, Formatting -> Braces -> Force Braces
id probably set it to 'dont change' rather than explicitely picking one or the other
there are a lot of settings in R# its nice to just say "dont fuck with this please"
 
@drch I don't think it's that because it's not adding braces - it's moving it to one line from two :S
 
@user2511798 also if those 1k webrequests are to the same hostname, .net will limit those by default
to 2 concurrent i think
 
@drch Oh maybe Formatting>Line Breaks>Keep existing
 
well yeah thats a good one to check
but the one youre after is the very next
 
3:32 PM
not on same host @drch . so threadpool wont process all of 1K request at once?
 
"break line in single embedded statement"
 
whats the difference between normal spawing threads using loop and by using threadpool
 
@drch Yep just found that! Cheers! So... many... options...
 
@user2511798 it will do its best. but spinning up 1000 threads doesn't make things 1000x faster
you can't take 9 women and make a baby in 1 month
11
but the threadpool will do its best to run as many as possible at the same time
 
@ton.yeung re: onion architecture - for some reasons it's coming off as if Jeffrey Palermo is saying business logic doesn't change... which strikes me as funny when working for a company that's making business logic changes to assembler programs written from the 70s ;)
 
3:33 PM
@user2511798 The threadpool will probably be faster, because it doesn't need to create the threads
 
@user2511798 a thread pool has a set number of threads. as they complete their work, they are freed up to do other work
there are diminishing returns on spawning shitloads of threads due to context switching and whatnot
 
Since you're doing web requests, you shouldn't need more than 10 threads for 1000 requests.
 
and 1000 threads even if theyre done right would probably lock up your GUI as well as the rest of your computer
 
so Tasks by default will get processed based on ThreadPool?
 
fwiw, i think you can just Task.Factory.StartNew() 1k times, and theyll all go on the threadpool
@user2511798 mostly. some task types will start on their own, eg long running tasks
but yes that is the default
 
3:41 PM
thanks all for the help :)
 
Hello. Bit off-topic quick question. A good site with development resources like images and buttons?
 
@dino for web or desktop
also the answer is yes. there's like a zillion sites for that.
 
I was thinking in general. I'm on Android right now, but am developing for desktop too. I couldn't find ANY :S Just couldn't think of right phrase to search on google
Give me one for web, please
 
you could check out fontawesome for a starting point. it's basically all the twitter bootstrap icons in svg format
for search keyword I would use 'icon'
eg android icon packs
 
I'll check it out. Thanks (feel kind of dumb right now :) )
 
3:55 PM
in Lounge<C++>, 2 days ago, by Cat Plus Plus
Girls are like compiler warnings, I don't get any.
 
Haha nice one
you probably all heard about:

99 little bugs in the code
99 little bugs in the code
Take one down, compile it around
117 little bugs in the code
 
"compile it around"?
Days like these I wish I'd become a drive-thru cashier.
3
 
Hi, everybody!
I have a question if you don't mind me asking
Hello??
 
Hello.
 
4:03 PM
Hi. Feel free to ask.
 
This works when Resources/Themes/files.xaml are of Resource type. Uri uri = new Uri("pack://application:,,,/Resources/Themes/" + fileName + ".xaml"); But how do you get a list of all files in the Themes folder when the Resource type embeds the files? directory.GetFiles errors out as there is no themes folder. Changing the files to Content type breaks the UriPack...
 
@KendallFrey drive-thru cashier sounds like someone who drives up to people and and rings through their purchases
 
4:22 PM
any one knows a good c# programmer?
 
i know one. and he's super handsome
(spoiler: not kendall)
 
lol... looking to hire a guy
 
@user2511798 I know one, too
 
my competitor software runs on 700 threads and my programmer saying he just can make it 100 :/
 
This is so frustrating.
 
4:24 PM
@user2511798 You do realize that 700 threads is not very effective, right?
 
neither is 100 :S]
(most of the time)
 
yea.. i do but we are running it on the server with 1Gbps line
 
just that statement suggests you need somebody who knows what they're doing
 
52 mins ago, by drch
@user2511798 it will do its best. but spinning up 1000 threads doesn't make things 1000x faster
49 mins ago, by Kendall Frey
Since you're doing web requests, you shouldn't need more than 10 threads for 1000 requests.
 
@user2511798 What are you doing? Crawling? Then you just need someone with an understanding of completion ports and not some idiot who randomly spawns threads.
 
4:25 PM
@user2511798 1Gbps isn't that much.
 
the 1Gbps is only going to be relevant if you are transferring a lot of data
 
yea.. kinda of crawling @RoelvanUden
 
@drch That is also true.
 
its less relevant for 1000 unique short requests
 
@drch but one has to assume it is 1000 porndownloads until given more info.
 
4:27 PM
@user2511798 So get someone with a fundamental understanding of how to do asynchronous operations without spawning and blocking threads. The amount of thread switching that will be going on is significant with that many threads and just adds additional strain on your system where there should not be any.
 
ok
will try to find one from freelancer
 
(Or you know, invest in your current employee and make them happy too, training!)
 
or just Task.Factory.StartNew(()=>{}) 1k times and let the .NET framework give it its best shot at scheduling shit for you
tweak from there
 
ack
 
@drch That.. is painful >_<
 
4:28 PM
Don't do that!
 
haha
 
if nothing else, rework it to use PLINQ or Parallel.ForEach, so you get some partitioning at least
 
srsly tho whats so terrible about that. it would be on the threadpool so whats the major malfunction?
 
Or let one NodeJS worker per core do the fetching instead of .NET.
Muchos easier.
 
@drch I normally agree with you for almost everything, but I hope you accidentally missed your sarcasm font on that one. Or you are at least drunk.
 
4:30 PM
perhaps i misunderstand the implementation of the default scheduler
 
@ReedCopsey This is working fine when I know `fileName`, but how do you get a list of files in Resources/Themes when they are Resources?

Uri uri = new Uri("pack://application:,,,/Resources/Themes/" + fileName + ".xaml");
ResourceDictionary resourceDict = new ResourceDictionary { Source = uri };
 
@drch The thread pool is limited to a number of threads, but that can be disabled. However, the scheduler will pick up threads and run them without re-creating threads all the time (hence the pool). Having a thousand threads in the thread pool is just as bad as spawning a thousand threads manually. All that context switching will still be going on.
 
I was using return Path.Combine(Path.GetDirectoryName(Assembly.GetExecutingAssembly().Location), @"Resources\Themes\"); when they were Page
 
@RoelvanUden threads in the threadpool are re-used
 
@drch It's not horrible - the TP will handle it, but it adds a LOT of extra strain. You lose all of the parititioning, and then you'll also have to handle all of the results individually
 
4:31 PM
The pool is there to make it quick and non-expensive to run small tasks on threads that don't get destroyed. :)
 
using something like PLINQ partitions the work out so you get much better throughput, and gives you a much nicer way to process the results
 
@drch Yes, they are re-used, but 1000 CONCURRENT threads..
 
@Roel youre not creating 1000 threads, youre creating 1000 work items
 
and you still get all of the benefits
@drch Yes, but that's a LOT on the TP queues ;)
 
As far as I have seen, the TP will continuously spawn more threads as work is available.
 
4:32 PM
@RoelvanUden it has a maximum
 
@dirt I think you have to fallback to using msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/… and then enumerating to find the ones you want
 
Thank you sir genius, but he's talking about a massive amount of concurrent web requests. Blocking the maximum concurrent threads while they do nothing but wait for data is not exactly the most effective design.
 
@RoelvanUden There is a max, and it won't do it instantly
@RoelvanUden Yes, in this case, the work should all be async
async/await makes this type of operation far nicer, especially the composition of results, and lets you do it without eating up threads
 
Indeed, it is quite easy with 4.5 or Node. A major pain in most other environments.
 
you don't have to call me sir
but thx
 
4:35 PM
:)
 
@drch This service is driving me to drink, any good recommendations?
 
@Greg im a drunk, not a connoisseur
2
 
Hey guys
 
@drch Well, isn't helpful it is is worth a star.
 
I have an interesting problem: How to manage Sleeps/Hybernates/Unexpected shutdowns
 
4:37 PM
@Greg This is my all time favorite: springbankdistillers.com/shop/…
@ginkner What type of app?
 
@user2511798 the other thing to consider is the fact that your biggest bottleneck is going to be network I/O. spawning a zillion threads isn't going to give you much in terms of overall processing. I'd be surprised to see much of an improvement over 1 thread per core.
 
@ReedCopsey Hm, you like it?
 
@Greg Springbank? Yeah - it's my absolute favorite - just very tough to find
 
What does it taste like?
 
@ReedCopsey Just a desktop app.
 
4:40 PM
Sucks: PLEASE NOTE: WE ARE UNABLE TO SHIP THIS ITEM TO THE USA OR CANADA @ReedCopsey Is that why it is hard to find / order?
 
@ReedCopsey I've added event handlers to Win32.SystemEvents.SessionEnding and PowerModeChanged, but I'm only using Thread.sleep to try to wait till all the work is done.
 
@Greg Yeah - only place I know to get it is hitimewine.net/SPRINGBANK-18YR.html The 15 year is also quite good (not quite as good) hitimewine.net/SPRINGBANK-15YR-750.html
@ginkner If you're using Thread.Sleep, you're going to have a tough time canceling events or handling suspending cleanly
since you can't process the events well
 
@ReedCopsey It is quite expensive, $149 bones. Better turn my liver into an indestructible juggernaut. Obviously not the type of booze to drink to get hammered; just sip and enjoy.
 
i wonder if the 'we cant ship to usa/canada' is a legal thing
 
@Greg It's a very smooth scotch - but has a lot of interesting character. Very strong vanilla on the nose, and a fairly high amount of fruit flavors up front
 
4:42 PM
@ReedCopsey Let me guess, I should make the event handler asynchronous and await some sort of Finnished task?
 
@ReedCopsey Sounds good.
 
@ginkner Depends on what it is - but typically, yes - or move the work into a bg thread if that's not an option
@Greg Yeah - if I want to splurge and celebrate, that's my #1 choice ;) Not something to do very often, though
 
@ReedCopsey Yeah, I don't drink ever usually. So that would be a huge splurge. Unfortunately I still need to purchase kitchen cabinets. I've spent quite a bit money lately; my savings is nearing death.
 
@ReedCopsey ok, I think I can manage that. The other issue, which you can just give me a link to if you have a resource, is exactly what happens to an application if I say...pulled the power from my box.
 
@ginkner It just stops - and there's no way to do much about that
 
4:44 PM
@ReedCopsey Luckily I'm doing all these home improvements our-self.
 
@ReedCopsey ok. Btw the waiting for work to finnish looks like this
Task.WaitAll(Task.Run(new Action(delegate()
            {
                Console.WriteLine("Sleeping");
                while (!ManagerUI.model.Free)
                {
                    System.Threading.Thread.Sleep(1);
                }
            })));
 
okay - that's pointless
just run the code
there's quite a few things you could do better there
use Task.Wait instead of WaitAll, since there's only one task
but - that' being said, since you're starting a task and immediately blocking and waiting
just do the code
Console.WriteLine("Sleeping");
while (!ManagerUI.model.Free)
            {
                System.Threading.Thread.Sleep(1);
            }
absolutely no reason to start a task, then wait on it immediately ;)
 
I dont have a task.Wait
Only Wait All
 
Task.WaitAll(
that blocks
 
string themeName = "Modern";
Uri uri = new Uri("pack://application:,,,/Resources/Themes/" + themeName + ".xaml");
ResourceDictionary resourceDict = new ResourceDictionary { Source = uri };

Cannot convert the value in attribute 'Property' to object of type 'System.Windows.DependencyProperty'.
 
4:46 PM
wait would be:
Task.Run(new Action(delegate()
        {
            Console.WriteLine("Sleeping");
            while (!ManagerUI.model.Free)
            {
                System.Threading.Thread.Sleep(1);
            }
        })).Wait();
but again, that's pointless
 
@ReedCopsey isnt that what I want though? I don't want the OS to call whatever method it has of shutting down my app on shutdown without blocking till it's done
 
@ginkner Thats' going to be exactly the same as if you just do the code (without the task stuff)
 
Ok. But it's still not a good way
 
in terms of your app, but with less overhead
what is ManagerUI.model?
 
How do I manually select source/symbol information to load when debugging an exception minidump?
 
4:48 PM
It's a UI Wrapper for another class
Free is updated whenever the work is done
 
@ginkner Better to expose a Task, so you could just do Task.ContinueWith( your code) or await theTask; your code
would avoid the spin wait
 
I would, but it's bound to all the buttons
I suppose I could do both
have a property that binds to the button.IsEnabled properties, and then a task for waiting until that property is set to true
 
You can easily use a TaskCompletionSource to turn that into a Task
and then await the task
no spin/sleep required then
 
yes
thanks
OH
no
 
4:53 PM
I'll google that first
 
If y'all have any thoughts, I'd welcome them :)
0
Q: Validation and data persistence in a domain model

Jeff BridgmanMy (first and current) workplace (a .NET shop) suffers from an over-abundance of anemic domain models, to the extent that I don't really know how validation and data persistence should be handled in a proper domain model. Data Persistence One option would be to give the domain model a way to do...

 
@JeffBridgman How many anemic models we talking about?
I'm not familiar with Onion Architecture, I believe some in this room aren't fond of it though. Not sure.
 
Hello good sires!
I just found out about these chats
 
Halloe
you are me 2 months ago
welcome
 
: )
 
5:00 PM
Hi @BrianRizo, welcome to the hidden world of SO.
 
Thanks!
Now i can get more distracted from my work
Muahahaha
As if reddit was not enough
 
lol
reddit seems less productive
at least here you can ask work-related questions
 
Yeah, true enough.
 
brb...I need to test the logoff behavior
 
@Greg All our domain models are basically classes with a list of properties. They could probably be structs. No logic in them at all, no even validation.
@Greg @ton.yeung was recommended I check it out onion architecture recently. We actually do that pretty well already I think. The thing I got out of it was dependency injection + interface to keep your business logic core from depending on non-core concerns like data-persistence.
 
5:05 PM
Yeah, thinking about this room, this could an amazing learning opportunity
 
I think I saw an alert about a new course on Pluralsight to do with enterprise architectures, you've just reminded me to watch it
 
@ReedCopsey the resources thing we had working yesterday is no longer working :( when trying to new ResourceDictionary I'm now getting Cannot convert the value in attribute 'Property' to object of type 'System.Windows.DependencyProperty' gist.github.com/dirte/f0b11be16e798c79ffd2
 
Some may balk at paying for online tuts, but IMHO, anything that costs less than what I spend a month on beer is quite reasonable when it's for my professional development
 
@dirt That typically means you have an error in your resource dictionary
and the xaml loader is barfing on it - any inner exceptions?
 
It's only quite recently that I spotted the zero-day exploit in the point of view above: It strongly encourages inflation of the beer budget in order to cover more expensive educational materials
 
5:08 PM
lol
 
@dirt This usually means you have a Setter in a style that's trying to set a regular property, not a DP (they only work on DPs)
 
crap
 
@dirt Can you temp. revert to yesterday's xaml? that'll likely make it work
and you can verify then track down the difference
 
I'm looking through sourcetree now to see what could have changed, in the theme files you're saying right? I dont know if anything was even changed though
 
that typically is an error in the theme you're trying to load
are there inner exceptions?
they usually will give you the actual line #
 
5:15 PM
null
 
C# calls them Exceptions. JavaScript calls them Errors. I'm going to make a language and just call them Fuck, Shit, etc.
 
@ReedCopsey I literally just copied my "Modern.xaml" to "New.xaml" and I can load New.xaml with no errors......
oh wait
ignore me
 
Okay! Click on dirt -> ignore this user (everywhere)
 
@JeffBridgman I just answered your question.
@JeffBridgman The book I quoted will actually go into several forms of validation within a Domain Model; with benefits and faults to each.
 
:'(
 
5:20 PM
Sad, this question solved his problem but didn't get voted as an answer :( stackoverflow.com/posts/comments/28146089?noredirect=1
 
is it conflicting to have a <ControlTemplate x:Key="WindowTemplateKey" TargetType="{x:Type Window}"> and a <Style TargetType="{x:Type Window}"> ?
 
@JeffBridgman I mention two of the techniques in the question; but he goes into even more variation.
 
@dirt I think it could well be.
You would ideally be setting the control template in the style anyway.
Actually, you set the key manually, so it shouldn't collide.
I'm not sure that it will be automatically applied then.
 
Ahoy hoy.
 
@Greg Different user
arg - that's frustrating - been fighting with this for a full day, and just realized my whole problem was that I've been running the wrong version of regasm :S
 
5:27 PM
@ReedCopsey What is a different user?
 
I know the feeling.
 
I've got a DB-first EF project, and several of the entities should implement an interface (table-each, but they all share an identical property structure). Should I just shoe-horn them in via the partial-class approach, or is there a better way?
 
@Greg The person who commented
 
@ReedCopsey Sounds like me with: **Stack Trace:
  at Framework.Core.IIS.ConfigureIIS.CreateSiteDirectory(String root, String path, String log)
  at Framework.Core.IIS.ConfigureIIS.InitializeIIS(ServerInformation server, CustomerInformation customer)
Message:
Error Message:
You currently do not have the proper permission to access the  following directory: C:\inetpub\wwwroot\ Please ensure the account is  running within the proper account to perform this task.**
 
@Greg The person on that post who said your solution worked - wasn't the OP
 
5:29 PM
@ReedCopsey Oh.
 
@Greg Though your comment did get you an extra upvote from me ;)
 
how the hell do you troubleshoot a xaml style file... 1000 lines of style
 
carefully
 
@dirt Was there an inner exception?
 
Negative
 
5:31 PM
(This, btw, is one place where R# can come in handy - they do some extra xaml checking that can be useful)
 
Im trying to comment out section by section but that in itself causes more issues heh
 
damn - that sucks
try commenting out from teh bottom
I've found that typically works better than from the top
 
@ReedCopsey Thanks.
@ReedCopsey Question, for some odd reason a method keeps evaluating to false:
    if(EvaluateAccess.IsAbleToWriteToFolder(root) == false)
        throw new Exception("Error Message: " + Environment.NewLine
            + "You currently do not have the proper permission to access the "
            + " following directory: " + root + " Please ensure the account is "
            + " running within the proper account to perform this task.");
Though the account has valid permission to the directory.
 
Have you stepped through it?
 
@KendallFrey I'm not the one consuming it, so no. And it is running live on a production server remotely.
It works fine local.
 
5:35 PM
If you're not consuming it, why do you care?
 
@KendallFrey Are you serious with that remark?
 
sounds like there's a permissions issue - though I'm not an IIS expert at all, so its tough to tell where it'd be
something's got to be different between you and the remote user hitting that
 
@Greg Mostly.
 
@ReedCopsey Yeah, it is permission issue- Originally it didn't like this:
        public static bool IsAbleToWriteToFolder(string folder)
        {
            WindowsIdentity account = WindowsIdentity.GetCurrent();
            DirectoryInfo directory = new DirectoryInfo(folder);
            DirectorySecurity access = directory.GetAccessControl(AccessControlSections.Access);
            AuthorizationRuleCollection rules = access.GetAccessRules(true, true, typeof(NTAccount));

            return rules.Cast<AuthorizationRule>()
                .Where(rule => rule.IdentityReference.Value.Equals(account.ToString(), StringComparison.CurrentCultureIgnoreCase))
@KendallFrey I care because he is consuming a service I wrote which is used for our business; that will remotely invoke a series of automation steps in building Content management Systems. Which need to work so clients can signup for the service.
 
IIS would have nothing to do with NTFS permissions
 
5:37 PM
@ReedCopsey Could the GetCurrent grab the physical account not the Application Pool identity?
 
What account do you end up with?
 
@Greg Yes, I believe it can
 
@dirt @ReedCopsey Not sure, but I know for a fact the Pool Identity is valid and elevated.
 
Application Pool Identity is a physical account, its just not created until it is ran
 
@dirt So the client consuming the service should be grabbing that account then when they call the service method.
 
5:40 PM
Can you log to file what account is to be sure cause thats the underlying issue is who
 
@Greg Is web.config set to impersonate?
if so, WindowsIdentity.GetCurrent will return the user's actual account info, not the server's account info
 
The site must be configured to actually use the ApplicationPoolIdentity as well
instead of IUSR
Site > Authentication > Anonymous (Edit)
 
Log generates:
<failedRequest url="http://framework.mypinkunit.com:80/CustomerProfile.svc"
               siteId="5"
               appPoolId="Framework"
               processId="6900"
               verb="POST"
               remoteUserName=""
               userName=""
               tokenUserName="NT AUTHORITY\IUSR"
               authenticationType="anonymous"
               activityId="{00000000-0000-0000-BB02-0080030000FD}"
               failureReason="STATUS_CODE"
               statusCode="500"
               triggerStatusCode="500"
 
IUSR
 
yeah
 
5:41 PM
check IIS > Site > Authentication > Anonymous (click edit) and change it from Specific User (IUSR) to Use Application Pool Identity
 
It's because the authentication type is anonymous
 
mmm it can remain anonymous but its statically assigned to use the IUSR account and not the apppool id
 
 
I don't have that as a choice.
Changed
 
5:44 PM
well thats an older screen shot
 
Found
 
I perk up when IIS questions come up,,, I can actually help you guys for a change :)
 
@dirt I appreciate it, I've been smacking my face against my desk for two days.
 
does this look right?
if (IsValid) {
	if ((x!= null) && (y!= null) && (z.a!= null) && (z.a.b != null) && (c != null)) {
		c.Comment = Comment;
		c.CompletedDatetime = x;
		c.CompletedByAppUserID = z.a.b;
	}
}
 
what is the y check in there for?
it's unused in this case...
 
5:58 PM
@dirt Same error dude.
@Dirt Should I not write to the root IIS Folder, write them to like Documents or something?
 

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