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1:00 PM
what do you think [32] > [12] is going to do?
 
@WayneWerner it will append 32 to results
 
but it won't
 
guys I got a new job. Is ruby hard?
 
ah, you mean the block after it
 
No. It might append [32] to results
 
1:02 PM
Ruby is easy and fun, I assume
 
but that's not the same thing
 
@WayneWerner but 32 > 12 so it will and not might
 
Ruby.is.a.pretty.nice.language!
 
@AndyK try performing each of those statements separately in the interpreter, and see what happens. This is known as "debugging".
 
@corvid It's mostly like python, only with the ability to completely muck with the language so you can write something like 32nd + 43rd and it's valid syntax
 
1:03 PM
> Rubies have a hardness of 9.0 on the Mohs scale of mineral hardness. Among the natural gems only moissanite and diamond are harder, with diamond having a Mohs hardness of 10.0 and moissanite falling somewhere in between corundum (ruby) and diamond in hardness.
— https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby#Physical_properties
 
@ZeroPiraeus rofl
 
@davidism let me check
 
@AndyK There appear to be multiple things wrong with your code as is, you're doing a terrible job communicating what you have and what you want, and it's starting to get frustrating.
 
@davidism it is not easy
 
1:04 PM
@davidism hence my feeling like Olivia Pope. "What. Do. You. Want?"
 
I know what I have in my mind
 
@AndyK the burden is on you is to figure out how to communicate that first
 
that's why debugging yourself is your best shot
you don't have to explain it all to yourself
 
argh
 
I'm not piling up on you, just noting:)
it's a good skill to pick up in the long run
 
1:06 PM
@corvid Yeah I saw. A couple of my wishlist games are normally $60 but with all the sales they're like $40 each now. The sales used to be way better...
 
That's a large part of why I joined SO - so that I could learn how to ask people good questions
 
@AndrasDeak no, not you're not piling. If you were, it would be different
 
Sometimes I still get it wrong :P
 
Damn, I thought my logic was sound and yet, implementation is even more trickier
 
Debugging is what we're doing anyway, you might as well do it yourself and cut out the middleman. It's how we know whether you've actually tried anything first.
 
1:07 PM
@AndyK OK, I just wanted to be sure that you don't feel attacked by me (it's easy to get this impression when multiple people are instructing you at the same time:D)
 
so, will or will not brexit actually happen?
 
Mildly related, I keep associating to "you brexit you buy it"
I know that doesn't make sense for a native, but there:P
 
@WayneWerner @corvid Not only is that kind of nonsense possible, but Rubyists delight in it, creating arcane DSLs that will make you curse their name.
 
nah @AndrasDeak , none of you are. I've been in rooms where the heat was much more tough and you can feel people were here for your skin. Here, it is just blunt but not piling
 
slimy Farage <3
 
1:08 PM
real rooms mean
 
Also, propagating nils all over the place rather than exceptions. Also also, an idiotic approach to strings.
 
waiting for the inevitable "still beats perl"
 
Oh and a lovely habit of monkeypatching builtin objects to create behaviours that are a pain to track down and badly, if at all, documented.
 
@ZeroPiraeus NameError: name 'nil' is not defined
 
1:13 PM
If 32nd is just an ordinary identifier in Ruby, that's not too crazy. "anything starting with a digit that can't be parsed as a number is a variable" is relatively consistent behavior.
 
@ZeroPiraeus With great power comes great responsibility
@Kevin No - as a number
not as an identifier
 
But why would you even want to do that.
 
Because you have the full power of the Lisp chainsaw?
 
The back end is ruby on rails and the front end is angular, seems pretty standard
 
Can you mix Nth style numbers and regular numbers? What's 1st + 2, 3 or 3rd?
 
1:15 PM
@WayneWerner "Consenting adults" is a great philosophy. It does rather require that the authors of libraries you have to rely on behave like adults.
 
That's roughly the reason I'm apathetic about learning Ruby any more than I have. Took a course about Ruby and that was one of the first lessons
 
so in ruby, does wrong+wrong==right?
 
@Kevin Whatever you want. You're the one hacking the meta(meta?)class of ints
 
Hmm, did I link this album before? The Flipout III - Johny Rock It's so upbeat.
 
@AndrasDeak In ruby, right? is a method returning a boolean, so yeah, sure, why not, that seems like a perfectly reasonable return value for an addition :-P
 
1:17 PM
@ZeroPiraeus That's a great point. I hadn't really thought about that part. I had mostly put things down to the Zen, but I bet that the consenting adults philosophy has also influenced a lot of design decisions.
 
Incidentally it's really hard to google the word for "the set of words {"1st", "2nd", "3rd" ...}".
 
you can always search verbatim:P
 
why would anyone want to program in ruby?
like...really?
 
They enjoy TMTOWTDI
 
1:18 PM
Ah, it's ordinal. Got it on my fourth google.
 
morning all
 
@AnttiHaapala The bottom line - the referendum isn't actually legally binding. So "yam knows!". Welcome to British democracy. He who's left holding the bag, loses!
 
@Kevin oooh, you meant it like that
I could've told you that it's either ordinal or cardinal
I can't discern those
 
I knew it was <something>al.
 
it already occupies 10% of my language processor to remember numerator vs denominator
 
1:21 PM
I'm sure "something" can be "magic", sometimes :P
@AndrasDeak if you picture "n" and "d", you'll notice that "n" can fit on the stem of "d" like a hat. That's how I remember what goes on top
 
@AndrasDeak you remember them?
 
@AnttiHaapala I do!
 
I always deduce which one is which
 
well it depends on what level of deduction you call "remembering"
 
how?! etymological deduction?
 
1:23 PM
the value scales linearly with the numerator, as if that was the "number" of little bits:D
 
@inspectorG4dget exactly
 
do share
 
so one of them shows the number, and the other the denomination...
 
@WayneWerner In fact for will iterate over either an iterator or an iterable, since both have a __iter__ method. In the former case a reference to the iterator is returned, in the latter a new iterator.
 
1:23 PM
so... it must be n/d
 
Heheheh.
Stop what you are doing. This is the single best thing to come out of the #EURefResults https://t.co/Ed68EIlFmm
 
when I first learned about them (this was in grade school), I wrote out the words, and noticed that len("denominator") > len(n"numerator"). Therefore, since it would be structurally unsound to put the bigger thing on top of the smaller thing, I figured the the numerator had to go on top
 
lol:D
I'm glad it's not just me
 
1:26 PM
I'm all about cheesy mnemonics, but I've always just remembered N goes on top because N goes on top. It's not typical for things to be so straightforward for me.
 
@inspectorG4dget I'm always incredibly pleased by things like that. For instance, username and password contain the same number of characters
I used to sort my imports by shortest visual length, then alphabetical order
 
It's nice that username and password are the same length, but on the flip side I hate that "height" and "width" are off by one
 
right and left, too
 
That is garbage.
 
Linguists, please abolish W and make everyone use literal double U's.
#Then I can do:
height = 23
uuidth = 42
 
1:28 PM
If God had meant us to shoot ourselves in the foot he'd have given us ... oh, wait
 
Blessed alignment.
 
or pronounce W like the French - double-v
 
UUhy would they do that?
 
@Kevin not only that but the ht vs th always bugs me
 
UUouldn't that be fun?
 
1:29 PM
at least that used to be a single th letter
 
UUhat have we done!
 
Use stature and breadth :-)
 
You mean uue
 
oh! my download script just finished. Time for me to do some real work. Rbrb folks
 
Need an autohotkey script to replace the double-v with the double you.
 
1:29 PM
@ZeroPiraeus A fine solution, but we'd have to convince every third party library author to get on board.
 
@Kevin
good luck with uuids
 
I just noticed I have a generator inside of a for loop inside of a while loop inside of a for loop... I can't think of any more efficient way to do this though
 
People will just have to use context clues to determine whether any particular double U is actually a W or just two Us in a row.
Reminds me of the classic:
Ghoti is a creative respelling of the word fish, used to illustrate irregularities in English spelling. == Explanation == The word is intended to be pronounced in the same way (/ˈfɪʃ/), using these sounds: gh, pronounced [f] as in tough [tʌf]; o, pronounced [ɪ] as in women [ˈwɪmɪn]; and ti, pronounced [ʃ] as in mention [ˈmɛnʃən]. However, linguists have pointed out that the location of the letters in the constructed word is inconsistent with how those letters would be pronounced in those placements, and that the expected pronunciation in English would be "goaty". For instance, the letters "gh"...
 
Finnish has only ~3 spelling/pronunciation differences.
 
1:34 PM
... and they are?
 
Heh - I like that Farage picture, Zero
 
1. the nasals preceding plosives are collocated in pronunciation despite writing, so nk, np, nt are pronounced ngk, mp and nt
 
Oh those rascally collocated plosive preceding nasals.
 
Speaking of spelling issues, I wonder what maltpoltlib does? :) stackoverflow.com/questions/38014587/…
 
Mm, malt.
 
1:37 PM
2. ng is not written with a single letter, even though it is the nasal sound as in sing
 
Oh no I overwrote a builtin and now my computer is on fire.
 
3. there is glottal stop/weak consonant after certain noun endings, nouns ending in -e and some verb forms (which actually are regular).
All of these exceptions are pretty much regular.
other than that it is pretty much bijection between Finnish spelling <-> IPA.
 
@AnttiHaapala That sort of thing happens in Sanskrit, too. And since Finnish isn't even an Indo-European language I guess it's a fairly natural transformation to make nasals align to the stop they precede. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandhi
 
yeah lazy tongues.
@PM2Ring you get n - p, n - t and n - k only, because m cannot be a final and within words if the next syllable starts with p, the preceding nasal is written with m (like in sympathy). However, there are some non-inflectional suffixes that you can add to words and these do not change the spelling.
so yes, all these spelling differences are due to sandhi/sound linking and the fact that there is a defective normally unpronounced consonant at the end of certain words and how it is linked with the next word.
 
1:50 PM
@AnttiHaapala Ok. In Sanskrit, the spelling always changes; I'm not sure what happens with the more modern Indian languages.
 
if aid rait inglish as finish iz rit'n, it'd luk samthing laik thiz.
 
So, like tweens ;)
 
TIL lolcats write in Finnish
 
Also, in Sanskrit writing the basic unit is a syllable, generally consisting of a consonant (or possibly a consonant cluster) followed by a vowel. By default the vowel is a short "a", unless otherwise marked; it's also possible to inhibit the vowel. Also, some words can start with a vowel.
But if a word ends in a consonant and the following word starts with a vowel you have to join the two words together. This makes it hard for people learning the language because you can't easily determine word boundaries.
 
@PM2Ring strictly in Finnish the spelling always changes as well, within a single morpheme or a single word. But not in compound words.
@PM2Ring nothing compared to French
 
1:56 PM
Yeah, internal sandhi is pretty common in many languages, but it's so ingrained that native speakers are barely aware of it, unless you point it out to them. Eg "dogs" and "cats" both end in "s", but your average English speaker wouldn't be able to explain why the "s" in "dogs" sounds like "z". It's just "obvious" that that's the way you say it. :)
@AnttiHaapala The French should just stop writing all those terminal letters that they never pronounce. :)
 
@PM2Ring so how would you write Août
Aoû
or u?
 
@PM2Ring Mais si il faut les prononcer (You have to!) ;)
 
Hey, I wasn't being serious with that remark about French. And as an English speaker I can sympathise with spellings that preserve etymology.
 
@PM2Ring Just chidding you, matey. These bloody frenbc
 
I like that the French pronounce the normally silent terminal "e" when they sing. It makes it much easier to understand them. :)
 
2:06 PM
ha ha
 
@PM2Ring had to google and I found this: melodietreasury.com/singinginfrench.html
 
Interesting.
 
@WayneWerner That's a sad story.
I've never heard of "bacon cat" before but I guess I can cry for a cat even if I've never lol'd for it.
 
Quite :-\ but the Ghoti thing made me think of that :)
 
user559633
2:27 PM
@Ffisegydd I'll go big data over my 3 users
 
@tristan big data? That's enormous data!
 
The only numbers that programmers should think about are: zero, one, and infinity. If you've got 3 users, you should be prepared to handle unlimited users.
5
 
user559633
It's so big that our boffins have started calling it datas
 
Tricksy little datases
 
user559633
They're taking the Datas to Eigengard
 
2:31 PM
Are your 3 users, by any chance, idjaw, Jenkins, and your mother?
 
@tristan Nice.
 
user559633
@Ffisegydd Okay, 4 users then
 
And yourself, of course.
 
user559633
No, I'm good with the number I just provided.
 
If yo momma is a user you're definitely going to need to scale quickly. Because she breaks scales pretty fast. Because she's fat.
 
2:33 PM
You should move your base of ops to London, gonna be some vacant office space soon when everyone abandons the sinking ship.
 
user559633
London will be fine. I wouldn't move my company there though because the British don't like drinking
 
If yo momma comes with you, it really will sink. See, because... Ok I'm done.
 
A fairly contemporary French song: Pas besoin de permis Vanessa Paradis & Benjamin Biolay
 
@tristan lolwat.
 
user559633
I was trying to come up with some sort of log data/logarithm function yo momma joke. Couldn't get it to connect, but there's the parts
 
Yo momma ate all your logs because she thought they were cinnamon logs.
 
user559633
yo momma figured out a way to get your logs to grow exponentially
 
Which is quite a feat considering they're abstract mathematical ideas or intangible files on your computer.
 
I wasn't here the other day when the Sir Mixalot conversation happened, but anyway... i.chzbgr.com/full/5135416320/hC5E8024F
 
2:41 PM
man... I wish that people answering typo questions lost -(abs(rep_change)) when it was closed >.<
 
user559633
that's the joke dot jpeg
 
Wow... I had heard the term mendacious
but steatopygia is impressive
 
That's a ten dollar word right there.
 
@WayneWerner I've been reasonably successful in explaining to newbies why it's bad to write full answers to typos; they usually self-delete.
 
2:44 PM
me too ^
peer pressure works great for those
the problematic ones are high-reps
 
Sometimes I write answers for typo questions because I am a bad person it grates me to see a question hang around with a solution in the comments and a "zero answers" header in the question queue, tricking me into clicking on it every time I scroll past
 
Heh. I don't know that I have that problem because the questions usually disappear from my home screen fast enough.
 
It's fairly rare that a typo question lingers around with not enough close votes though
 
@WayneWerner I thought so too. That was created by a regular on a now-defunct forum I used to frequent. See here for more of his work: profile.cheezburger.com/Daz_Voz
 
I suppose you could alway mark the answers CW
 
2:46 PM
The reason I don't mark my answer as CW is definitely because I'm a bad person.
Won't even attempt a defense there.
 
@Kevin we wouldn't believe you anyway
also, you can cv-pls fairly blatant typo questions in SOCVR
then they get roombad fast with sufficiently low score
 
I have far too much empirical proof of your dastardliness.
 
Alright fine I'll attempt a defense. Uh... "I forget that CW is even an option, since it takes up so little screen real-estate". There, I'm absolved.
 
DSM
Morning cabbage. Come in to find out that an error managed to make its way through our testing process because someone was wrong about whether a particular command tested all the code paths, but under the circumstances I can't throw them under the bus. :-/
 
@Zero for your consideration (and possible signature :P) you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/…
 
2:48 PM
Add them to your "to revenge upon" list and move on
 
Signed it about 40,000 signatures ago :-)
 
@DSM that wouldn't be nice anyway. Being stuck in traffic is really bad, consider a drop from the top of a building.
 
Steal his hockey stick and replace it with a mirror-reversed replica. Deny that anything has changed.
"But you've always been left handed. Are you feeling all right?"
 
@DSM You should look into en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation_testing - Cosmic Ray is a Python tool for that
 
DSM
@Kevin: that's diabolical.
@WayneWerner: interesting-looking tool.
 
2:56 PM
Sinister, even.
 
DSM
Ouch.
 
user559633
beardchievement unlocked: i can now carry a comb in it
 
Nice. Soon you'll be able to use it to house emergency snacks.
 
@tristan Good job
 
3:07 PM
I have a quick question about Python 3.5
 
Let's hear it.
 
user559633
I'm still waiting for its mystical properties to kick in. I wonder if it's going to be bonus to science or bonus to culture.
 
has anyone used Python 3.5 for AWS Lambda
 
Not me.
 
user559633
Oh, so an AWS Lambda question.
 
3:08 PM
I couldnt find AWS Lambda chat group, so had to post it here
 
user559633
What's the part of the question that's Python related?
 
 
user559633
Yessir ^^
 
struggles with the concept of an internal beard
 
well i feel like an idiot.
 
3:09 PM
It's good to feel dumb sometimes. It means you're not in a safe & easy rut where everything goes right all the time.
 
@tristan the fact that how can I use Python 3.5 in AWS Lambda
 
You should be looking for help in AWS Lambda circles, not here.
 
You are right. Now that I am reviewing the mistake, I don't feel so dumb anymore since it won't occur again. I got asked on a C++ interview what function would be used if Animal a = new Dog was declared. But that's illegal syntax.
 
I don't even know what AWS Lambda is, so there's definitely no point in coming to me for help
 
Not an unreasonable question, though, given that AWS lambdas can be written in Python
 
3:12 PM
@Ffisegydd is there a AWS Lambda circle?
 
I don't know, but that's not really our problem.
And by circle I mean "any appropriate support platform"
 
ok thanks everyone for your interesting inputs
 
user559633
any time :) glad we could help
 
DSM
We do usually consider installation difficulties on-topic, although I don't know if that's at play here or not, given that I also don't know anything about AWS Lambda.
 
OK, got Hyper Light Drifter for 20% off. Contemplating $35 for Stellaris.
 
3:14 PM
 
Take my money, Steam.
 
user559633
with aws lambda it's not at all installation, it's a "does the ice cream shop sell pistachio" question
 
@AbhishekUpd given the age of this blog post I'd say you should be able to do that
 
@Ffisegydd shakes cane at old people
 
Same demographic profile as the scottish Indyref
 
3:15 PM
 
Obvious solution is to uh... end the baby boomers.
 
lol:D
 
user559633
on average, the 5-12 year old demographic prefers to remain in front of the television eating candy. can you believe the older population disagrees?!?!?!??!
 
You guys ever answer interview questions, then later realized you got them wrong?
 
DSM
No. It's an unending stream of brilliant answers on the spot.
 
3:18 PM
No.
 
user559633
No. I normally gets roses and offers to merge our houses with my pick of the interviewer's daughters.
 
well thats nice.
 
@tristan just don't acquire a debt
 
differences are fine. It's when one generation's pretty systematically screwing over another that i start to get a bit riled tbf.
 
He can just vote to leave the merger later, because that will totally solve the debt problem.
 
user559633
3:20 PM
Yes, and I will continue pretending that monetary factors are the primary factor in the vote.
 
Leave voter on BBC: "I'm shocked & worried. I voted Leave but didn't think my vote would count - I never thought it would actually happen."
wtf
"I voted for what I didn't want because I didn't think it would count."
 
Need to ramp up the DC.
 
Meanwhile, I can't vote for what I want in the US because I want neither option.
 
you keep acting as if a collection of human beings was any more intelligent than a wooden plank
 
user559633
@davidism Yeah, what are we going to do in November?
 
user559633
I'm still waiting for our "real candidates" to come forward.
 
@tristan grow a mustache?
 
To quote a genius, who definitely didn't take the quote from somewhere else:
10 hours ago, by J Richard Snape
Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all the others.
 
user559633
katamari democracy was the worst of the series
 
That was your man Churchill
Pretty sure he plagiarised it as well.
in not-entirely-unrelated-news, I'm applying for a canadian visa.
:D
 
3:24 PM
:D
bring home Justin Bieber
 
DSM
@Withnail: why would you come to Canada? We're not going to join the EU.
 
□ Trump
□ Clinton
☑️ Elon Musk's Mars colony
 
Partly because it looks like I can get one, I have some (relatively distant, no bonus points for me) family in Canada, and because Canada's awesome, eh?
Also, trudeau's dreamy, and I'm a massive commie pinko, so totally into that.
 
user559633
and plus, it's 2016. come on!
 
3:26 PM
Jesus. Have just seen the damage today's done to my kid's trust fund. Anyone have a profitable trading bot?
 
Fizzy, how bad is it over there? Is Grexit causing as much trouble there as the breaking of the internet did on the IT Crowd?
 
user559633
@Withnail Yes, send along your details and I'll enable it for you. It's also a one time payment of $99
 
Canada Pros: Nice weather, English speaking, friendly. Canada Cons: Too fixated on cold-stick-puck.
Australia Pros: English speaking, friendly, like to swear. Australia Cons: Death weather, death animals, too good at rugby and would make me feel bad.
NZ Pros: Nice weather, hobbits, friendly. NZ Cons: Way too good at rugby, orcs.
I think it's a toss up between Canada and NZ.
 
DSM
@Withnail: Venezuela has better weather, and sounds like it'd be more up your alley. ;-) Plus, then you'd be ruled by genuine revolutionaries, not by our shiny pony.
 
Australia cons: even more racist and bigoted than the UK, by the accounts of all the academics I know out there.
 
user559633
3:28 PM
America pros: Nick weather, english speaking, friendly, full of freedom.
America cons: You got a problem with America, bro?
 
I'm definitely feeling Canada right about now. NZ would be nice too.
 
Sounds like Fizzy needs MOAR FREEDOM
Isn't venezuela totally in the crapper atm?
 
America Cons: Donald Trump
 
Canada Extra Con: Might get shot my some American visiting with his assault rifle.
 
Canada pros: Socialised healthcare and britain-style death panels
 
3:29 PM
Canada pros: some of them are in this room right now
 
user559633
American presidential politics: No matter who wins, it doesn't matter, as the world is too complex for a single person to control
 
^^ I think that's v true.
 
NZ Pro: Super fast internet; NZ Con: Data caps.
 
DSM
@Withnail: what? I'm sure you're mistaken, Venezuela is full of fellow-travelling commie pinkos and so must be very successful. The stories about its catastrophic failure are just neoliberal propaganda. Enjoy your stay!
 
user559633
Canada Pros: Wayne Gretzky, Mario Lemieux, Bobby Orr
 
3:30 PM
My mate said, when I was super excited about Obama - "It doesn't matter. Obama as President still has to be President of the United States". Totally get what he meant now.
Heh.
 
user559633
@Withnail I like how you're talking shit about the country I live in. Great approach bro!
 
user559633
Haha america is terrible guys, what a dump!
 
Yes, the fact that you live there means we can't talk crap about it, I forgot that EU rule.
 
Am I?
 
user559633
Man be careful or you'll be state 51
 
3:31 PM
Luckily, in 2+ years time we'll be able to tell you what we really think!
 
@tristan "what a Drumpf"
 
DSM
@tristan: you mean state 58. #nobelprize
 
user559633
Eh, maybe my hackles are up because you just used an anecdote to call Australia bigoted and racist
 
umm... multiple anecdotes, please
 
I wouldn't say that's an anecdote anyway. I'm willing to accept what other people tell me and factor that into my opinion of a place.
Assuming I trust that person.
 
3:34 PM
Pffft, how dare you use normal human interaction to form an opinion about something.
 
For instance, one could assume that America is a country full of fools who love guns far too much, but I take into consideration the opinions of PEOPLE LIKE MORGAN HERE.
 
I did say it was just second hand, tbf, but yeah - didn't mean to cast vicious slanders or anything.
 
user559633
It's cool. I read the "still has to be president of the united states" as if it's a bad thing. I'm probably being oversensitive
 
I'm pretty sure he meant it as a bad thing.
:P
 
@Ffisegydd Wait, really? If my opinion matters, you're about to get some WEIRD recommendations. :D
 
3:35 PM
You can put a savant in charge of a dysfunctional country and they won't magically change it :P
 
user559633
Yes, Obama the savant.
 
@tristan I read it as "he is still bound by all sorts of complicated obligations which tie his hand in many ways"
 
cbg
 
user559633
cbg
 
3:37 PM
cbg
 
It's because of the bicameral system. The president has vast powers, but he has to share an office with two ornery camels. It's distracting.
"Why don't you see the camels in pictures of the oval office?" you ask? It's because the camels are taking the picture.
 
Why does it require both camels to take the picture?
 
user559633
Because unions.
 
They don't have opposable thumbs so they have to oppose each other.
 
they tried to take over the tobacco industry once
 
3:44 PM
Spot on Andreas.
 
I don't think so:P
 
I feel like there should be a 'Two opposable thumbs walk into a bar...' joke. Can't successfully think of one though.
@DSM
 
Heh.
stackoverflow.com/q/38017264/344286 anyone got a dupe for that?
 
What would a typical salary range be for junior backend dev in Toronto?
 
this was what I found: "Two ducks walk into a bar because they don't have opposable thumbs to open the door."
 
3:47 PM
hahaha
got a tuple question for y'all
 
(This is my favourite no opposable thumbs joke - reddit.com/r/Jokes/comments/26t9qn/…)
 
I can do t = (1,2)
and then, I can't do t[0] = 3 because tuples are immutable
however, if a tuple contains a mutable object, that object can be mutated:
 
because the reference which is the element of the tuple doesn't change?
 
t = ([1], [2])
t[0] = []  #error
t[0].append(1) # no problemo
Andras: exactly
 
huh that's interesting.
 
3:49 PM
so what's the question?
 
now, lists are dynamic arrays, which means that they are initialized with some additional buffer space to append elements into
however, when that space is exhausted, the array is copied over somewhere else in memory
so at that point, wouldn't the reference change?
so, if I did this, I should eventually hit an error?
 
I don't think so, this sounds like an implementation detail
 
t = ([1], [2])
for i in range (10**8):
    t[0].append(i)
 
looking from afar, the list is an abstract thingy with other thingies inside
then again I'm only guessing:)
you could append a huge object at the first step
 
@tristan: lest I should be thought part of the common herd, I underline that I speak whereof I know when it comes to America, having lived on the East and West coasts for twenty years.
 
3:51 PM
 
that would mean reallocation could happen early on
which would be very surprising behaviour
 
In a world where my fellow voters choose to leave the European Union and where it looks like yours might end up having to choose between Trump and Clinton all I can say is things have clearly gone to hell in a handbasket
4
 
not seen that @Withnail. Thanks for the link
 
The question of what happens to the reference id if you end up having to move in memory is interesting though, not 100% clear from that question & answers
 
user559633
@holdenweb Agreed. 100%.
 
3:54 PM
Cause that specific answer - stackoverflow.com/a/9756061/1293222 suggests you would hit an error in the scenario you describe
 
@Withnail: that answers part of the question. The other part is "doesn't the reference change when the list has to memloc when it grows too big?". I guess the answer to that is "no", but then, I'd like to know how that reference is maintained
 
well, all that is left is to try it:P
does appending a list(range(1000000)) give a shortcut to reallocation?
 
user559633
I'd suggest that things have been getting pretty bad in the US for a while. Our current president got elected by the marketing of "change" as if the changes would be good.
 
user559633
Politics 2016: Hope y'all like being sad
 
after 4 years of Trump I'm sure that most kinds of change will be good:P
 
3:59 PM
Yeah, I mean anything you build on glassy nuclear blasted sand is bound to be an improvement
 
such as reinventing the wheel and the fire after the world burns
 
@holdenweb I wouldn't be surprised if pigs started flying
 
user559633
Things will be fine. One muppet with a combover can't ruin USA
5
 
@inspectorG4dget simple.
 

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