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7:00 PM
thats why I was confused.
 
Anyway two rows are better because I'm arrogant and it's what I'm used to /standardargument
 
I've already written the query, and it is going out t his way, but I'm curious to hear some ideas on how you guys solve the ugly ass query problem. Imagine you have a user_info table with like 30 columns all need to be updated from the profile-settings page. Do you just (after validation) have a huge query? do you generate said query? if so does your form input names 1:1 your column names? do you have a mapping object to do this? am I over thinking things?
(he says with a 300 col length query)
 
I've done DB work once, and I just went with the ugly query. I'm sure there's a better way, though.
 
@rlemon we use something that builds the query
not a full ORM like Hibernate
but a fluent-style query builder of some sort
 
Excerpt from a typical Ruby program: end; end; end; end; end
 
7:07 PM
$ cat /etc/systemd/system/pkgfs.service
[Unit]
Description=dpkg as filesystem

[Service]
ExecStart=/home/florian/common-lisp/dpkg-fs/dpkg-fs /pkg
Type=simple

[Install]
WantedBy=multi-user.target
@Zirak ^
 
Ruby uses semi-colons :o
 
@FlorianMargaine There isn't a per-user systemd config?
 
@Zirak systemctl didn't find it :/
so I'm probably doing it wrong
but it's working
 
@Callum only if you want to stuff multiple statements on one line
 
7:08 PM
@ssube just seems like an ORM is over kill here (I literally only have the authentication queries and the profile page update)
but yea, that would be better
 
@FlorianMargaine Also, can you post install instructions for dpkg-fs?
 
@Zirak yeah, I put it in /usr/lib/systemd/user
didn't work
@Zirak uh, sure
 
@Zirak Does that make sense? systemd manages system-level services that run as a user, not the other way round.
 
@JanDvorak Oh, shows how much I know about Ruby.
 
> ~/.config/systemd/user/ where the user puts its own services.
 
7:08 PM
Right?
 
lemme steal your readme for the doc stuff
 
@rlemon ORM is usually overkill, yeah
 
@Zirak yeah no, I want to install it system-wide...
or at least, installed by my package
 
oh. m'kay
 
or it'd mean that the mount is on ~/pkg
 
7:09 PM
@rlemon I do like the query.select().column("foo").column("bar").from.table("baz") syntax, though.
 
what driver?
 
or even query({verb: "select", columns: ["foo", "bar"], table: "baz"})
for JS, I do not know :(
there is that one for stuff like this, knex maybe?
 
I'm using node-pg
there is similar syntax I think
 
@Luggage console shows everything is fine. It fires on click
 
@rlemon yeah, knex is the only one I know of
 
7:11 PM
Ajax still somehow displays the result on second click for no reason that im familiar with
 
I'll check it out
might need it for another project with more intensive db
 
it's a fluent builder for SQL queries
 
@Zirak pushed instructions
 
Wait, you can use knex client-side? I'm sure nobody would steal passwords from that :S
 
@FlorianMargaine Thanks
 
7:14 PM
@Callum you can use anything anywhere
 
@Zirak ask if you want help for quicklisp... it's not straightforward
 
you shouldn't use knex clientside, unless each user has their own credentials, but you could
 
@FlorianMargaine <_< can you post that there as well, or links?
 
@ssube I'm aware, it just sounds really, really stupid unless, of course, each user is supplying their credentials.
 
@Zirak well, you have to know that quicklisp is per-user. Instructions are fine here: quicklisp.org/beta/#installation
(it will install itself in ~/quicklisp)
 
7:19 PM
@ssube psssst
 
> Some things in this readme may be not technically exist
english may be fail too
 
^^
 
@SomeKittens that said, nice.
 
@FlorianMargaine @Mosho pointed that out earlier, haven't gotten to it since.
took last night off from FOSS work
 
@SomeKittens lazy
 
user1596138
7:23 PM
@SomeKittens iO
 
@SomeKittens hm
still unclear on how you can run realtime ETL
seems super useful for monitoring and log transforms and stuff
 
user1596138
That naming
 
user1596138
I know that's so nitpicky. But whyyyy
 
@SomeGuy thanks! Are you gonna do one?
 
@Jhoopins Well, you managed to find a nittier nit than @FlorianMargaine, so achievement unlocked there.
@ssube Yeah, the project's transformed a bit since inception.
dogfooded a lot, helped me get a grip on what exactly I was building.
 
7:25 PM
@SomeKittens it looks like you're mostly writing a more flexible, reasonable version of fluentd/td-agent
 
The original concept was "Luigi, but in realtime/with streams"
 
user1596138
It's like, reversed camelCase on an acronym maan
 
considering how light JS is and how it can connect to most protocols well, that's not a bad thing
especially since fluent isn't the most flexible
 
@ssube I've also received comparisons to Apache's Storm
What I'd really like is a dashboard so you can watch Gustav process all the data as it happens.
"Watch realtime, in realtime!"
 
7:29 PM
@Zirak Your idea of var MyItem = new Gustav.Transformer( is growing on me
anyway, off to lunch
thanks all!
 
@SomeKittens realtime dashboards are too slow
the dashboard should poll
think about how much echo can slow down a shell script
 
noted
 
you might keep a rolling (circular) queue of the last 20 items to be processed and supply that to the dashboard
 
user1596138
One of my pet peeves is when people do something "just in case" in code
 
that's usually a good balance between making sure things show up and making sure the dashboard is buffered
 
user1596138
7:34 PM
Like.... !(thing instanceof Object)
 
user1596138
Y U xtra parens??
 
without parens, isn't that (!thing) instanceof Object?
 
yep
 
user1596138
Is it?
 
user1596138
Cause I broke some stuff if it is
 
7:35 PM
if thing = false, they do different things
nobody knows the associativity of instanceof so I ran it
 
user1596138
Hmm code example?
 
!!> var thing = false; !(thing instanceof Object)
 
@ssube true
 
!!> var thing = false; !thing instanceof Object
 
@ssube false
 
user1596138
7:36 PM
Nice
 
@Jhoopins not the same. Not sure why, but...
 
!(false instanceof Object)
true
!false instanceof Object
false
 
user1596138
Alright, I have nothing to bitch complain about I tried.
 
user1596138
@FlorianMargaine No.
 
user1596138
It's not right when you say it
 
user1596138
7:37 PM
But @ssube is right ;P
 
ok
sounds about right
 
@Jhoopins that's often the other way around
 
user1596138
I hate those moments. I have been doing something bad for 3 years
 
user1596138
I mean it's not like I do instanceof a lot, but still. Oh well
 
You can see that it's instanceof(not(false), object)
 
user1596138
7:40 PM
@Zirak holy shit why haven't I seen that site
 
that's useful
 
esprima 2.9
 
You can also consult the Operator precedence table, courtesy of mdn
! has a precedence of 15, instanceof has a precedence of 11
 
user1596138
I thought it was 1337
 
@Jhoopins that's the basement operator
 
user1596138
7:47 PM
@ssube momsbasement
 
That's what your mom's basement.
 
my god.. I should just find a new industry.
I forgot to add a where clause to my update query..........
 
They are all full of childish imbeciles.
ohh.
 
user1596138
@rlemon lmfao
 
user1596138
Backups right?
 
7:56 PM
"that's a lot of record upda.. dear god"
 
@Luggage EXACTLY that
 
Been there.
 
Wanna come work on release engineering and piss off a bunch of entitled developers who don't understand why we can't just deploy a Node app if we can deploy Java apps?
 
no because I'll update all apps with one
I'm good at making booze. people like booze.
maybe I can do that.
 
I'm one of those developers
I can't be 'the man'. I fight the man.
I'm the one that put coffeescript in our codebase. I ruin days for people like you.
 
user1596138
7:58 PM
Bleh fuckin bank needs to call me
 
user1596138
That's ruinin my day. I had to bum a ride from @Loktar to get to work today
 
and listen to his shit?
"blah blah, god made React on the 7th day", blah blah"
 
!!s/a ride from//
 
@rlemon That's ruinin my day. I had to bum @Loktar to get to work today (source)
 
@Luggage you know what would've happened there?
 
8:00 PM
Do go on.
 
"We don't support that. If you'd like to use CS in a project, file a Jira to add support and we'll schedule a meeting with your manager to look into it. At the meeting, you'll need to explain what it does, what you use it for, how to run it, provide a list of all dependencies that will need to be installed on the build agents, make sure Compliance has audited and approved them, and fuck off."
 
man, that's horrible.
 
That's if you're an annoying contractor who asks for things you don't need all the time.
 
I jsut gave the guy that makes the build scripts a hand-job and all was fine.
 
If you actually know what you're doing, write up a Jira and it'll take a day or two to get the tools installed.
 
8:02 PM
(I'm that guy that made the build scripts.)
I'm also the guy repying to emails with "Jira.".
 
@rlemon hyper protip when working on databases shells
 
I'm the guy who reads your email, plans on responding, gets side tracked, no response
 
but that's to users..
 
START TRANSACTION;
 
@FlorianMargaine write the where clause first?
ohh, or that
 
8:04 PM
@rlemon you're the one I schedule meetings with after the third email
 
then, after your updates are run, and you know it's what you want, run commit;. If you don't like something, run rollback;
 
@ssube schedule how? email :P
 
@FlorianMargaine can you run explain or an equivalent before commit?
@rlemon yes. If you skip the meeting, it's grounds to decide for you. :D
 
doesn't fly here.
lone dev powahs!
 
@ssube ?
 
8:05 PM
@ssube I do actually see why you do what you do, I'm mostly joking, as long as people have a way to change tech without getting too non-tech people approving it for no good reason
 
well, looks like I'm truncating this table now :/
fuck.
 
Like at xerox when some accountant in TX I've never met has to approve my buying Visual studio and the like
 
@Luggage yeah. If someone abuses that, they start to run into more process.
If you ask for reasonable things, we can just hand them to you.
If it's going to prod, compliance has to sign off on it, because it will come up during an audit and clients will ask questions.
For example, node isn't in prod yet, because of that.
 
yea
 
but java is in prod?!
what is this world
wait, what about common lisp?
 
8:08 PM
We had a dev email me the other day saying "hey, I wrote this node service and want to deploy it, how does that work?" to which the answer was "You can't."
 
does compliance sign off on it?
 
We have a meeting tomorrow where he's going to explain why they need node and we'll eventually support it.
Although that's going to get held up until we start running OpenShift
 
you corporate stiff
 
the real problem is that if (when) I spend my time supporting every little thing devs want, we don't have time to do useful stuff like roll out a container service that will let them do whatever they want
 
user1596138
Oh yay the bank calls right after I complain
 
8:09 PM
they waste enough of our time that they don't get the things that would actually help
 
user1596138
God I am so off-topic today sorry
 
@ssube wait.. Node stuff isn't compliant, but containers running node is?
 
well not whatever they want
 
Also... Don't bother with docker.
 
@FlorianMargaine we'll start with Tomcat and Python, then allow Node when Compliance signs off on it
 
8:11 PM
I wonder what "Compliance" is?
 
we're not using docker, it'll be OpenShift. Our servers run OpenStack now.
 
A group of people?
 
what should I use. Say I have postgres, redis, node, node (2 separate node processes) and want to containerize. What tech should I use, if any?
 
oh, cool.
 
@FlorianMargaine the compliance department. Internal security, auditing, access control, etc.
 
8:12 PM
for my small-time app
 
Isn't openstack a little bit... Heavy?
 
@FlorianMargaine No?
We've got it on a few TB of RAM and some dozens of cores.
 
The only thing I hear about openstack is that it's hyper over engineered
lol
 
We've almost got it so a CI build can spin up an environment (which currently is a database and ~24 app nodes), run real tests against it, and knock the whole thing down again.
Using Heat for templates and a REST API to tie the CI server and OS together.
Everything is puppetized, so Ops just merges the dev changes into their repo (devs can fork and change), merges it up to the appropriate level, and we go from there.
By the end of the year, developers will be making Puppet changes and producing container-ready apps, which Ops and I will build, create environments, deploy, test, destroy environments, stage, promote, and have almost CD.
 
8:15 PM
Compact Disc (or Continuous Deploy)
 
Continuous delivery. There will be four-ish human interactions.
 
delivery, damn.
 
Devs push manually, QA signs off manually, the release manager promotes manually, and compliance approves manually.
 
QA, you guys are fancy :P
 
yeah...
@ssube do you guys hire remote?
 
8:17 PM
@FlorianMargaine yes
 
send info to florian at margaine dot com
 
@FlorianMargaine looking for a job?
 
when I say remote, I mean international full remote, of course
 
@rlemon it's not like QA does things. They mostly complain that they don't have time to run their tests manually because they're busy writing test plans.
 
not necessarily
 
@FlorianMargaine full remote we do. Not sure if we have anybody overseas.
 
@ssube wow, my experience was opposite. they gave me a 'bug quota' and once I filled that (monday) I just kinda did my own thing
 
What sort of position/stacks are you interested in?
 
@rlemon but always open to opportunities
@ssube yours :) "devops"
 
lol
 
8:19 PM
I wanna steal your job
 
if I can get more help on that, hell yeah
nah, I'm the only person who knows how our build system works :D
I am trying to open-source most of it, though
 
@ssube I suppose they can't fire you then :p
 
@ssube I'll be the other one, and they'll fire you once I know better than you
 
I want to create an HTML page that will display the overall status of our application. I want an element from our Freshservice account, a few different elements from our monitoring service and so on. I'm having a hard time not only because the all the XSS limitations, but also because of all the different CSS used by all the different sites to ensure their respective elements look correct. Anyone want to offer any better solutions for what I'm trying to do?
 
@Soviero Welcome to the JavaScript chat! Please review the room pseudo-rules. Please don't ask if you can ask or if anyone's around; just ask your question, and if anyone's free and interested they'll help.
@Soviero Welcome to the JavaScript chat! Please review the room pseudo-rules. Please don't ask if you can ask or if anyone's around; just ask your question, and if anyone's free and interested they'll help.
 
8:20 PM
@Callum they could, but things would fall apart. They're putting me and two other guys on getting us to real CD, instead.
@FlorianMargaine I'll send you some more info tonight or tomorrow.
 
ok... my polyfill lib now has partial support for shadow dom... I'm gonna have to check if the browser has mutation observation, and make a more complex polyfill for those
 
@ssube cheers
 
@Soviero Do they offer a widget?
 
@FlorianMargaine Do you Python?
 
@CapricaSix huh?
!!info
 
8:22 PM
@rlemon I awoke on Tue, 01 Sep 2015 16:00:08 GMT (that's about 4 hours ago), got invoked 19 times, learned 402 commands, but forgotten 1 commands, teleported 68 goats
 
@Callum Nope. They're specific div's within their page that I want to grab.
 
Error 404 occured, I will call the maid (@Zirak)
 
@ssube I python and puppet most of the time in my current job
 
okay
 
And you have to be logged in, so I have to do it client side.
 
8:22 PM
so you are being stupid
!!refresh
 
You... want to log in from client side? Wot?
 
@FlorianMargaine all of our ops scripts are in python and I finished up translating our build (dev-side) scripts to it an hour ago.
 
Have you considered thinking about the implications of that?
 
@Callum No, I'm already logged into all these services, so I just want to load elements from each of them and display them on a single page.
 
@ssube too bad, lisp is better
 
8:23 PM
On the dev side, we've got TeamCity, Gitlab, and Sonatype Nexus running with 18 agents. Ops side is using Pulp for packages to Puppet.
 
but hey, you couldn't know
 
Python comes on all Macs and CentOS
I would've used Node if it was preinstalled
one of my dreams is to set up Puppet modules to provision dev machines when they walk in the door, or every night so they can use vagrant
 
This isn't something that's going to be used externally, I just want to display an overview of the health of our application on a big monitor.
 
@ssube static binaries come on all Macs and CentOS
 
true, but OpenStack and OpenShift and most of our other infrastructure stuff is already in Python
as in, using Python for build scripts, I can just import the OpenStack libraries and spin up VMs
 
8:27 PM
yeah, I know, pragmatically it's better to use python
that said, since everything is puppetized, adding a lisp package to be able to run lisp scripts shouldn't be hard
 
importing the Swift client library to upload files instead of shelling out is pretty sweet
 
I dream of the day I'll be able to write lisp at work tho
 
@FlorianMargaine it's not "everything" yet, or I wouldn't have near as much of a job
our goal is to have functional, pretty smooth CD by the end of the year
today we have CI and manage things through Puppet for the most part
 
my shadow DOM 'partial support' polyfill allows you to use the createShadowRoot method, and use the API like usual, but you can't change the content of the shadowRoot after you've appended your shadow elements (usually a template) into it... I think it's fine if all you need is simple shadowDOM things
The main purpose is to allow you to use the API (with expected modern behaviour) and also be able to at least run the code in older browsers; effectively allowing you to use all the fun things without being angry over IE's shit
 
What's the link? Cannae be arsed looking through my history
 
8:36 PM
"cba"
 
> cannae -- you glorious scottish bastard
None of this code is on the github repo... I'm scrapping what I had and doing it over to be a giant polyfill lib
 
user1596138
!!urban cannae
 
@Jhoopins Cannae Scottish slang for can't
@Jhoopins Cannae Scottish slang for can't
 
user1596138
That is a double execution
 
user1596138
!!urban cannae 5
 
8:38 PM
Y'know, not even sorry I let that slip. Bring on the slang ya bassas.
 
she dead
 
rip cap
 
call the maid @Zirak
 
user1596138
!!stat
 
@Jhoopins You (http://stackoverflow.com/users/1596138/jhoopins) have 1563 reputation, earned 0 rep today, asked 8 questions, gave 28 answers, for a q:a ratio of 2:7.
avg. rep/post: 43.41. Badges: 0g 11s 29b
@Jhoopins You (http://stackoverflow.com/users/1596138/jhoopins) have 1563 reputation, earned 0 rep today, asked 8 questions, gave 28 answers, for a q:a ratio of 2:7.
avg. rep/post: 43.41. Badges: 0g 11s 29b
 
user1596138
8:38 PM
Hah
 
what is happening
 
user1596138
@rlemon she is having trouble
 
RAGNAROK
 
I know she is
already refreshed her once.
 
user1596138
stop
 
user1596138
8:39 PM
Is she running twice by chance on the same tab?
 
nope
 
user1596138
Or just nuts
 
but when I got to her, chat was frozen mid refresh again
 
Where's she running? Just on a laptop, or?
 
my work pc
on FF
 
user1596138
8:40 PM
My chat has been refreshing me/logging me out today a lot
 
Ah, waow. I should probably read the repo.
 
user1596138
Maybe related.
 
possibly.
seems okay now
back to my laptop
 
cap runs on a hacked xbox 1
 
user1596138
Wait a minute can someone get rid of that
 
user1596138
8:41 PM
Enough trouble for one day.
 
user1596138
Meh, can't flag me now
 
!!undo
:(
 
user1596138
@Luggage I would've if I could've :P
 
what magic is this
 
Black magic, ye ken like?
 
8:43 PM
!!tell r3wt help
 
@r3wt I awoke on Tue, 01 Sep 2015 20:39:42 GMT (that's about 3 minutes ago), got invoked 4 times, learned 400 commands, teleported 32 goats
 
no, the saying is: "what sorcery is this"
 
@r3wt Information on interacting with me can be found at this page
 
cap will remove her last message if a room own says "!!undo". that's all.
 
oops, wrong command.
she has wildcards as well
!!echo delete this
 
8:43 PM
she's wild ;-)
 
!!echo but not this
 
pretty neat, who made it?
 
but not this
 
!!undo ~2
@r3wt @Zirak did
 
8:44 PM
Feature Suggestion: Cap removes her message if the original message she replied to was deleted.
 
@Callum write a pr
 
PR
 
how will we troll people
 
Not an issue... no. A full PR.
 
8:44 PM
It was soooo tempting to actually remove the other message as well and sit back and laugh while you figured out what was suddenly wrong :p
 
Okay, gimme like two weeks or sout,
 
@JonClements too bad I can see who deleted it
:D
the one thing in the chats that actually works
 
Yeah... but kinda hoping you wouldn't check that :)
 
I should go rep whore so I can see things..
 
Or rlemon and Jon could double up and troll the living shite outta everyone?
 
8:46 PM
Don't think I can stomach it.
 
@Luggage RO's can see deleted messages in their room
nothing to do with 10K
 
ah
i still need rep, though.
but the questions all bore me
 
> i still need rep, though.
 
the one thing I still wanna see changed on the chats is to remove the throttle for RO's in their room and Mods in any room
 
!!stats
 
8:47 PM
@Callum You (http://stackoverflow.com/users/4589557/callum) have 36 reputation, earned 0 rep today, asked 2 questions, gave 4 answers, for a q:a ratio of 1:2.
avg. rep/post: 6. Badges: 0g 1s 10b
 
only 402 here, Callum, and a lot of that I got as a bonus for signing into a few other SE sites
well, maybe 100. I think that's the bonus.. you get 100 on all SE sites once you have a few accounts
so you never start at 0 again on a new site, which is nice.
 
402 is still ~11 times more than I have :p
Google have fully updated the logos on their site, looks absolute pish. But hey, I won't see it again for a while.
 
we're still in the same class of low.
sub 1000
you'll get used to it, that's all it is
but at the same time.. why change? it's a logo.
 
I don't really mind the rep, though, as long as I'm >= 20 I'm good.
 
Maybe Apple patented serifs on fonts.
 
8:52 PM
Has Apple patented the actual apple yet?
 
sent google a C&D
only once you take a bite out of it. The second bite is destruction of Apple property
 
Damn, don't have any Apples to go marauder,
 
rlemon better be making "that fruit like a pear" cider and not Appleā„¢ Cider.
 
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