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11:01 AM
@Abhishrek except for the ridiculous subscripting of null, LGTM
@Abhishrek also he is passing the array wrapped value of def to def, and calling def without storing the return value anywhere in the wild. looks like code smell.
 
@AwalGarg def adds all of those to a global hashmap
builders
 
@Abhishrek ewwww
 
yeah
 
It is time to say good bye to windows.
o/
 
so many definings
 
11:04 AM
but then you see the guys profile
 
@Abhishrek oh, works for Meteor. that explains :D
 
Formely : Facebook, Mozilla, Quora, Meebo
 
if (value && typeof value === "object") :p
 
always use Object(value) === value
 
meh. Gotcha continue with my work: designing a domain model :/
 
11:08 AM
@Abhishrek looks like that guy coded it drunk :P the techniques used themselves are ok, though.
 
vOv
I like his definition
He makes it obvious the better way to build that thing is via classical oop
 
yes
 
and not composition by far
and amazingly I cannot do that if I generate my classes dynamically
using my def
cause 1. it doesn't has an extends
2. Given I can solve extends problem
actually nevermind i can definitely solve that
 
@Abhishrek If you can afford relaying the parsing to your server, Spidermonkey ships with Reflect.parse these days. Not sure about the stability, though.
 
@AwalGarg I don't need to parse on server, I am parsing it in acorn
 
11:14 AM
@Abhishrek ofcourse you don't, you can just use it to validate.
 
which does validate :D (when i use escodegen to build that code --- escodegen will just throw out if i do something wrong)
 
oh, cool
 
@Abhishrek github.com/darkyen/vis/blob/master/app/scripts/components/… How are you writing classes in JS?
 
!!tell hassan mdn class
 
@hassan class
 
11:14 AM
@HassanAlthaf babel
i precompile thecode before pushing it to the client
 
I do know ES6 has them.
Oh.
 
@AwalGarg see the example ?
 
@Abhishrek The Love Loader is amazing. Where did you learn JS dude?
 
myself
and that is nothing compared to codepen.io/loktar00
or
/cc @rlemon @Loktar
@towc please put your awesome codepen url here
and yes
 
Like, what resources did you guys use?
Books, sites.
 
11:18 AM
This webpage for a lot of good guidance
 
Bolbi do bhai. :P
 
I have told you, already
also @SomeGuy :P is better to guide you than I am
 
Nice.
@SomeGuy You gonna guide me mate.
Lekin ye sabh seekha kahan se bhai?
Ye log guide karte hain, ye samaj gaya.
 
1. Talk in English
2. Make soemthing and learn while you are building it. Things get much easier
3. Follow lots of good people on github and start contributing / following some open source project.
 
Ok. Thanks.
(y)
 
11:26 AM
@Abhishrek English deserves much more hate than PHP.
 
So, how to store thoes results-list in a JS array ^ ?
 
array.push(document.documentElement.outerHTML)
 
@AwalGarg you know what I want exactly?
 
yes, you want to start learning from scratch
 
nope ..! my search engine is ok, I want to do that using Ajax. also I want to create a back-button.
 
11:29 AM
bah dum tsssh
 
@AwalGarg anyway ok tnx :-)
 
@Shafizadeh if you interpret that level of sarcasm with whatever you did, you also need common sense and humor.
 
@Shafizadeh sorry I am kinda irritated right now :( @Abhishrek can possibly help you out, though.
 
Oh that was sarcasm?! sorry :-) ! I don't know english very well
 
export default def('IfStatement', [
	Child('condition').ofType(ValueNode),
	ChildArray('body').ofType(FlowNode)
], Statement);
and how does this look awal ?
 
11:33 AM
> “JavaScript has the best dev tool ecosystem I’ve ever seen for any language.”
^ truer words have never been said
@Abhishrek good
 
 
@towc codepen.io/towc/pen/WQqpMg this one's da best :D
 
GeorgeTekeiOhMY.mp3 for that one
 
@AwalGarg glad you like it :D
 
11:35 AM
@towc in my codepens somewhere
i have done that with pure css
 
@Abhishrek you can't elegantly add randomness to css. In any case, svg? Or what trickery did you use for the roundness? I'm actually quite curious
 
border-radius and border for the arcs :P
and clever transforms
 
@AwalGarg I'll have to transform this into that 0.o probably today, I might livecode it if you're interested
 
@towc codepen.io/darkyen/pen/ptyhn the same trick but a different pen
 
@towc jesus fucking christ
 
11:39 AM
@Abhishrek wow, that's interesting!
 
@towc very smart
 
@towc @Abhishrek can you do this? If not, @towc is my new teacher
 
:')
@AwalGarg with ease
 
ok then
 
@Abhishrek so it's just a clip?
 
11:39 AM
yep
who'd have thought clip can be helpful heh ?
its actually a clip and a transform
 
yeah, I've never actually used it
 
and a hidden element iirc
 
(btw, I can do that in css only now, no JS :P )
 
yeah me too ;-)
the clock..
 
@Shafizadeh it sounds like what you really want is caching for the results
 
11:41 AM
but it was pre css era
 
whatevz XD
 
@tereško It seemed ot me what he really wanted was history.push and popState
 
srsly, good one tho, I wouldn't actually have thought about clips
 
@towc oi mate i am antique
 
@Abhishrek maybe
 
11:42 AM
@tereško how should I cache them?
 
@Shafizadeh How do you represent them in your code?
 
@towc codepen.io/darkyen/pen/kfLve your powerlevel its its over 9000 !
 
You get the results from some request, in the form of JSON or XML or whatever
Then what do you do with them?
 
for a single-server setup, I would just dump the search results in $_SESSION['lastSearch']
 
@MadaraUchiha exactly like when user search something
 
11:44 AM
@tereško Not needed.
This also requires an additional request...
This can (and should) be solved entirely client-side
 
@Abhishrek lol
 
@tereško no, I don't want to use session, because I want to retrieve them even without internet
@MadaraUchiha yes yes
 
@MadaraUchiha you are welcome to teach him how to use AJAX then. Have fun, c ya.
 
@Shafizadeh if the data is for clientside, check for localStorage
 
11:47 AM
ffor history purposes
PUSH STATE PEOIPLE
 
@tereško Not AJAX
 
@tereško actually I know to work with AJAX, I just want to store some data in JS array and use them later ..., how?
 
localStorage
 
even better , he's all yours @MadaraUchiha
 
^-- as said again
 
11:47 AM
@Shafizadeh You want localStorage
 
@MadaraUchiha yes, I want local.
 
LOCAL STORAGE
 
Or rather, sessionStorage
 
^--
 
Read about those
 
11:48 AM
!! tell Shafizadeh mdn localStorage
 
@MadaraUchiha ok
 
@tereško I'm on you from first until ever :-) !!! and sometimes other people!
@KarelG tnx
 
what does this term mean? "Lifecycle scripts included in foldername"
then server shuts down
saaggy18@nick:~/node-projects/login-system$ sudo npm run
Lifecycle scripts included in login-system:
  start
    node ./bin/www
saaggy18@nick:~/node-projects/login-system$
 
12:12 PM
got it
btw I didn't know that app.use(multer({dest:'./uploads/'}) produces error
 
just means you should run "npm start". npm run doesn't do anything on its own, it's " npm run something"
@nickB you're missing a closing parenthesis, so it's obviously wrong.
 
that's type here.
typo*
 
@MadaraUchiha your PHP / Node statement dipresses me
 
@Abhishrek In what way?
That there are some cases that PHP is more suitable than node?
 
crl
for running a .php file
 
12:16 PM
but app.use(multer({dest:'./uploads/'})) producing error
then i found this
 
@MadaraUchiha that you are comparing hours of thought and effort to hillucinations
 
4
Q: Cannot app.use(multer). "requires middleware function" error

João MenighinI'm just starting learning NodeJS and I am stuck with a problem. I would like to upload files to my server. To do so I searched and found out this module multer. Doing as the example on GitHub works: var express = require('express'); var multer = require('multer'); var upload = multer({ dest: 'u...

 
and fiction :P
 
es6 module loader vs webpack, any opinions?
for new project
 
querying databases from node is still " in child shoes "
 
12:16 PM
@SuperUberDuper depends on what you are doing
 
@SuperUberDuper both
 
@KarelG That
 
webpack will give you a unified package with all css js and even html files packed into a dense opaque package
 
Java has very mature database API and libraries
 
that also means until this gigantic file is done loading you are locked out
 
12:17 PM
PHP has very mature database API and libraries
 
but over a year or two, Node will be a valid opponent to PHP about querying db's
 
Node, not so much
 
@MadaraUchiha totally agree
 
@MadaraUchiha alas, people still use mysql_* api functions :(
 
@AwalGarg PHP 7 gets rid of those, doesn't it?
 
12:18 PM
@AwalGarg that's because they're reading/getting outdated info's
 
i thought it's deprecated
 
Abe
it did @MadaraUchiha
 
it is
 
@MadaraUchiha yep
 
@nickB Doesn't stop people from using it.
 
12:18 PM
mysqli is also not recommended
PDO is what you should use
 
but does it work still now?
 
@KarelG why not?
 
yes, to provide compatibility
 
Given that still over 90% of PHP tutorials online have mysql_ examples
@nickB Easy, they just don't upgrade.
 
Abe
mysqli is meh. it's just badly designed
 
12:19 PM
since mysqli revolves around only mysql
 
@Abe Not really
 
anyone played with babylonjs?
 
Nope
 
crl
smells php
 
mysqli is an extreme effort to make an API that's as close as possible to mysql_*
 
12:19 PM
@AwalGarg PDO is more flexible than mysqli , and if you keep being consistent, you get used with it.
 
While providing better functionality
 
There is the pgsql lib for PHP, which basically slams PDO to the ground
 
Abe
@MadaraUchiha yes. so it is badly designed :p
 
it also support named queries, which you can use a factory for ORM
 
DB specific extensions done good are better than PDO
@KarelG there are things you can't do with PDO, but can with mysqli. Async queries, for one.
 
12:20 PM
@Abe mysql_ is badly designed
 
what is the future of php.
 
true
 
mysqli_ is not
For the purpose it was made, it was very well designed.
 
does mysqli support transactions ?
 
Abhishrek has moved entire past 30 minutes to PhP room
 
Abe
12:21 PM
PDO is far less flexible than any vendor driver actually @KarelG
 
@KarelG Yes
Seriously, people tend to forget that the people behind PHP are very smart people
 
ok. it's equally to PDO
 
The average programming and language design level of the top PHP devs is probably a lot higher than the top JS devs.
 
^ very true
 
@MadaraUchiha this. PHP internals can pawn esdiscussers in 2 minutes.
 
12:22 PM
@AwalGarg now thats an overexaggeration
 
lol no
 
it is.
 
25 secs ago, by Awal Garg
lol no
 
In fact, PHP was so successful at dumbing down complex problems like the HTTP protocol and database querying, that people hate it so much for attracting the noobs
 
^ Very true
So was Python, initially but then ugh
 
12:23 PM
but hey, it got mismanaged in the past .... like javascript
now, they're on the right track
 
@KarelG Personally, I don't think they're out of it just yet.
 
same for js, with the ES
 
Python never even touched the complexities of HTTP, let alone dumbing it down
 
Internals is still a bit toxic.
 
@AwalGarg shut up
 
12:24 PM
Not nearly as much as it was when I was a PHP dev at my prime
 
before you get cut by copy
 
@MadaraUchiha give them time. At least i thought " finally " when i saw the new release notes
 
@KarelG Yes
 
@Abhishrek I don't mean to say Python is bad for that. Just that Python doesn't need to do it.
PHP was meant to done right for web, not python.
 
Mostly because most of the real things are coordinated from room 11, rather than internals
 
12:24 PM
but i hope that google filters out these idiotic tutorials
 
I was refering to rich user friendly abstractions.
 
There's where the big cannons hang.
 
@Abhishrek there are many, sure. But not in the Python core lib.
There never have been
 
Abe
@MadaraUchiha it's the same people. but communicating on a chat is simpler
 
which is why the ugh
urllib * makes me wanna break my head with a sledgehammer*
 
12:25 PM
@Abe Are you active on internals?
(Or ever were?)
 
Abe
not really. never
but i do read some discussions sometimes
 
crl
@KarelG my google does :)
 
The people in the PHP room are the normal, reasonable ones. There are (or were, in my time) childish, tantrum throwing, always-right, Sheldon Coopers in the PHP internals.
 
People People People
can we just accept that
ES and Internal both sides are smarter than the sum of this room ? (at the moment)
 
I mean, DateTimeImmutable COME ON
 
crl
12:27 PM
only limited to 10 results, you have to pay for more
 
@MadaraUchiha Isn't date time logically immutable though ?
 
first item, people would click that directly ;p
 
@Abhishrek No, it isn't.
Is a number immutable?
 
@Abhishrek not what you think it refers to
 
That was a mere joke, I apologize
 
12:28 PM
check this out cool playcanv.as/p/aP0oxhUr
 
heh
 
The problem was this, people were passing DateTime objects into functions and methods and were surprised when they changed on the outside
 
In Java8, the new Date API (LocalDate) is immutable
 
Abe
@MadaraUchiha from my experience there is talent everywhere. and in both room11 and internals there is of course people that is wrong. only by sane discussion you can have advancements
 
@Abe Yes
 
12:29 PM
@KarelG I am pretty sure in JAVA 9 everything will be immutable
 
hah
we will see
 
including the file you will open to write code in
 
And internals (again, at least accordring to my old experience) is not capable of actual sane discussion,
 
we're insane already bro
 
why append to a file ? write a new one and erase the old one
 
12:29 PM
LET THE MADNESS BEGIN
 
@MadaraUchiha I saw the drama spewed by Zeev for STH on twitter and internals. It was sooo much immature.
 
Abe
@MadaraUchiha imho, it's just because of the used media
because again, it's the same people
newsgroups are so last century
 
@Abe I proposed to change it
People from room 11 pushed me to raise it in internals
Internals shot it down very quickly.
 
irony
 
And I was promised support from room 11, and didn't get it.
 
12:31 PM
@MadaraUchiha how much of the internals is made up of room 11?
 
betrayal
 
Then they asked me to keep pushing, so I said "I don't even use PHP anymore, you want it really bad? You push it"
 
Abe
they are slowly changing... a lot of discussions moved to github
 
@AwalGarg At least 10 users
If not more
Total voting strength is somewhere around 50s
 
so room 11 is more like cult inside the internals ?
 
12:33 PM
@Abhishrek Yes
 
nice
@FlorianMargaine pastie.margaine do you actively update language specs ?
 
Abe
@MadaraUchiha more than that, there are also hhvm developers
 
I like how we call the room "room 11". It sounds badass ;)
 
@AwalGarg We should call ourselves room 17
BTW, can someone send me an invite to the JS room team?
 
@MadaraUchiha email?
 
12:34 PM
@AwalGarg your nick @ madara . ninja
 
sent
 
@AwalGarg invite me too
 
sent
 
Abe
invite me too. will troll
 
@AwalGarg Cheers
 
12:35 PM
internal room ?
private chit chat right ? :p
 
who removed that ?
@MadaraUchiha / @AwalGarg whoever did, many thanks !
 
@Abhishrek I sent it to you on our regular hangouts chat
 
removed my email i meatn
 
Madara did, probably
 
> Whats your role on the team ? Shrek
 
12:54 PM
@Abhishrek I did
You're welcome
 
1:06 PM
@MadaraUchiha hows modding btw ?
github.com/benjamn/ast-types/blob/master/lib/types.js#L113 @AwalGarg It seems that building wrappers is useful afterall
 
Is anyone else having problems with signing git commits?
cc @FlorianMargaine
 
@MadaraUchiha no issue with that
@MadaraUchiha I had a week ago because my gpg key was expired
it was weird... I was working et al, doing many commits, and suddenly it didn't work anymore
I quickly figured it out though
 
@FlorianMargaine This is exactly the phenomenon I'm observing, only my key has no expiration date.
 
@Abhishrek what languague spec?
@MadaraUchiha that's bad
@MadaraUchiha I'd tell you to double check it :)
 
> $ gc --allow-empty                                                                                                                                                                ⬡ 5.1.0 [±release/185.x]

You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for
user: "keybase.io/madara <madara@keybase.io>"
2048-bit RSA key, ID 8DB43DD1, created 2015-06-16 (main key ID DCF01746)

gpg: problem with the agent - disabling agent use
gpg: Invalid passphrase; please try again ...
 
1:15 PM
ah, sounds like another issue
 
I had the same issue happen simultaneously on my laptop and on my main PC
Out of the blue.
@FlorianMargaine Yeah, no, my key is set to expire at "Never".
 
the date doesn't match either anyway, that's not it
 
@FlorianMargaine When I give the correct passphrase, I see this
 
not sure if it's wise to not expire the key
i replace it each 6 months
 
one year for me
 
1:18 PM
You need a passphrase to unlock the secret key for
user: "keybase.io/madara <madara@keybase.io>"
2048-bit RSA key, ID 8DB43DD1, created 2015-06-16 (main key ID DCF01746)

gpg: problem with the agent - disabling agent use
error: gpg failed to sign the data
fatal: failed to write commit object
 
I should also switch to sub keys and put my master key on an USB stick...
 
When I give an incorrect passphrase, it asks for it again and again
 
@MadaraUchiha "problem with the agent" doesn't sound good anyway
 
Is it possible to make it more verbose?
 
run strace to see where it's failing
strace gc
strace is my go-to debugging tool
 
1:23 PM
never heard of that command
 
it shows you all the system calls an application is doing
you can also attach it to a running process to debug it live
it helped me to debug e.g. perf issues many times
 
> strace - trace system calls and signals
even signals
 
strace is great :)
very easy to use, very hard to make sense of the output sometimes though :P
 
why do all paths nowadays seem to start with './'
 
it's also very verbose
@SuperUberDuper because you're finally using nodejs where it's the way to require local modules?
 
1:27 PM
ah ok
well its local to the current directory
 
1:40 PM
@FlorianMargaine I am drafting one for my VPL
so far I have been reading others
and while I build the spec I am also trying to build something to build ast's
 
2:30 PM
@FlorianMargaine "sometimes" heh
> Speaking via a video, the hacktivists said:
where is the video?
 
bastard
 
2:51 PM
@Abhishrek how is it related to pastie.margaine...
 
@FlorianMargaine oh you were talking about that
well pastie.margaine works fine with ES6
i wonder how
 
@AwalGarg no, really, it's easy to make sense of it most of the times.
@Abhishrek it's using Google code prettifier
a js lib
 
oh so you just load it from cdn ?
 
I think so? I don't remember
 
;D great
 
i had to google "puppet" ...
 
@KarelG Google knows that I use puppet at work, so the results are fine for me.
"puppetlabs" might help to have better results
 
it's one of the results ;)
anyways, i'm fiddling with gae (google app engine) for Java (work). The documentation in Python is far better than the java ones. keh
 

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