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yea pusleaudio was (is?) is proper fuckup
 
@DaveRandom service systemd stop :P
 
> Note that traditional init scripts continue to function on a systemd system. An init script /etc/rc.d/init.d/foobar is implicitly mapped into a service unit foobar.service during system initialization.
guess what I would do... :-P
 
!!uptime
 
1:04 PM
@PeeHaa I have been running for 16 seconds, since 2016-09-01 13:04:20
 
@DaveRandom That's the rookie way out :D
 
guys, gals! I think I have uncovered a computer science sensation. I have thought about it long and hard and I am convinced now. Whoever coined the term duck typing really wanted to say duct taping but the guy who wrote it down misheard it.
8
 
To be "installed", it needs to be "in" (symlinks are fine I think) /etc/systemd/system, /run/systemd/system, or /usr/lib/systemd/system. To be enabled, it is symlinked from within /etc/systemd/system/target-name.wants/
 
@KevinMGranger Ok I have done the first now. And at least I can start it as service again
 
PulseAudio was screwed up because Ubuntu decided that it was time to ship it (spoiler alert: the developers of it didn't agree)
 
Jay
1:06 PM
guys why won't my soap work?
$client = new SoapClient(site_url('api?WSDL'), array(
'soap_version' => SOAP_1_2,
'trace' => 1
));

$client->setClass(site_url($this->module_details['path'].'/libraries/soap_schema.php'));

print_r($client);
 
@Jay because soap is only for washing hands. really.
 
@KevinMGranger That's what systemctl servicename enable does. Just adds a symlink. No more run-level messes
 
Jay
what should be at the api url?
At the moment the api url is where this code is
 
It's one of the things systemd got right
 
darn tootin
I've never seen that error though. Maybe it doesn't like double-symlinks? Try copying the config to /etc/systemd/system instead
 
1:08 PM
So I will just symlink the thing to multi-user.target in my case?
 
Eh, we should figure out why it's complaining first
 
@KevinMGranger uhhmm let me test it
 
You may need some systemctl daemon-reload -s in between this stuff
 
@Jay what do you mean by "API URL"?
 
omfg
 
1:09 PM
The "bindings", as SOAP meaninglessly calls them, should be defined in the WSDL
 
We got a "winner"
> ]# systemctl enable jeeves
Created symlink from /etc/systemd/system/multi-user.target.wants/jeeves.service to /etc/systemd/system/jeeves.service.
The issue was indeed the extra symlink :(
 
Jay
Dave I have a class set up which is called soap_schema.php
 
It's not like the service changes often so it works for me
 
Jay
@DaveRandom I am trying to make it display this schema but can't seem to
 
@KevinMGranger
 
1:11 PM
Interesting. Well, if something is installed on your system, it should be in /usr/lib/systemd/system from a package, or /etc/systemd/system if you want to customize it further
But making a package might be more work than it's worth :P
 
@Jay what do you mean by a "class"?
 
yea :D
one last reboot incoming
 
err, you shouldn't need to reboot for this
 
Jay
the soap class which contains the xml stuff @DaveRandom
 
@KevinMGranger It's the easiest way to test everything
 
1:13 PM
@PeeHaa do me a favour, symlink it the other way around, so that if you vim the file in config/ it actually modifies the service
otherwise that's going to be a major wtf in two years
 
will do
 
and it means that when you ls -l config/ it will make sense
 
Jay
@DaveRandom
Fatal error: Uncaught SoapFault exception: [WSDL] SOAP-ERROR: Parsing WSDL:
 
!!uptime
 
lolz
 
1:13 PM
oh goddamnit jeeves
 
@Jay OK, terminology is really important here. What do you mean by "soap class"? You mean some XML schema stuff, or some PHP code, or some PHP code than generates and XML schema or... what?
 
Jay
Well I have a class which I want to use to generate the xml schema
By using setClass?
 
!!uptime
hmm it actually crashed
 
@PeeHee uptime: 00:00:00 - E_HEAD_ON_DESK
 
!!uptime
 
1:16 PM
@PeeHaa I have been running for 20 seconds, since 2016-09-01 13:15:43
 
Farewell Jeeves. We hardly knew ye
 
Jay
@DaveRandom I want to use the class to generate the ?wsdl file
 
An exception was not handled:
Sep 01 15:12:34 149-210-224-55.colo.transip.net php[661]: Amp\Dns\ResolutionException: Connection to udp://80.69.67.66:53 failed: [Error #101] Network is unreachable in /srv/www/Jeeves/vendor/amphp/dns/lib/DefaultResolver.php:446
Might be just that the interface wasn't ready yet
Is there an easy way to implement a retry @DaveRandom?
 
@Jay Right. a) that sounds sounds like a bad idea. XML schemas are generally static. Sure, you would use code to generate it rather than hand crafting it, but you would generate that file once and pass the path of the static file, don't generate it every request. b) SoapClient does not have a method called setClass(). Did you mean to instantiate SoapServer instead?
 
do it at the systemd level. make it wait for the network
 
1:18 PM
!!? systemd wait for network interface
 
Search for "systemd wait for network interface" (https://www.google.com/search?q=systemd+wait+for+network+interface&lr=lang_en)
• NetworkTarget - Freedesktop.org - 21 aug. 2016 - www/ Software/ systemd/ NetworkTarget. Edit · Page … Whether any network interfaces… (https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/NetworkTarget/)
• systemd-networkd-wait-online.service - Freedeskto… - systemd-networkd-wait-online is a one-shot system service that waits for the network to be … Networ… (https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd-networkd-wait-online.service.html)
 
Jay
@DaveRandom I am meaning this
 
@PeeHaa I guess so, but waiting for the network to be ready sounds like a better fix...
 
agreed
 
in [Unit], add After=network.target
 
1:19 PM
@Jay right, but your code does not create one of those. It creates one of these.
I cannot express this strongly enough: you really should try to explain to whoever told you to do this that it is a terrible idea. SOAP is borked, and trying to run a SOAP server based on anything other than ASP.net is insane.
The tooling just doesn't exist for any other architecture, and the reason for that is that everyone except MS realised how bad SOAP is many, many years ago.
 
!!uptime
 
@PeeHaa I have been running for 1 minute and 22 seconds, since 2016-09-01 13:21:05
 
Jay
@DaveRandom most requests are coming from net
 
\o/
tnx @KevinMGranger <3
 
@Jay right, and what exactly is stopping you from building your SOAP server in .net?
 
1:23 PM
tips hat
 
/me implements !!crash command
 
Jay
@DaveRandom we are on php only
@da these requests come from the client
 
@Jay So what?
 
Jay
@DaveRandom now I have fixed that how would I get the xml to show?
@DaveRandom The head IT want it this way I can't change it :(
 
@Jay By dumping the request
 
1:26 PM
@Jay As much as I sympathise, they have asked you to do something that is going to take you literally weeks of learning before you can even start to write it. This is an unbelievably complex (read: dumb) thing to do. You need to go to them ASAP and explain this to them otherwise it is going to come back and bite you.
 
Jay
I just need to know a few things to get me on my way
@DaveRandom I have this in the file
$client = new SoapServer(site_url('quote/api/wsdl'), array(
'soap_version' => SOAP_1_2,
'trace' => 1
));

$client->setClass(site_url($this->module_details['path'].'/libraries/soap_schema.php'));
What would I put in the quote/api/wsdl file for the xml to show?
 
Right, but that tells me nothing
Also, setClass() takes a class name, not a URL
I don't doubt you can do it, but I do doubt that you comprehend just how wide the river you have to bridge is
Put it this way: my gf works in a place that does nothing but maintain a SOAP API. They employ 6 experienced devs.
(and they use .net, incidentally)
 
@DaveRandom Oh wow. That's scary. You need to take things into account like not feeding it at after midnight and not letting it get in contact with water
 
lol
 
@DaveRandom uhm… don't we already have this in form of badly coded commands?
 
1:37 PM
actually no, not any more, now we have silently swallowed exceptions instead \o/
 
@PeeHaa uhm… isn't it falling back to TCP?
 
The core architecture actually seems to work properly now
 
@bwoebi Dunno. That's the exception I got for you
TCP would also fail btw if the network is just down
:)
so maybe it does fall back but the exception does the udp message
 
is the network down?
 
yes it was
It was just after reboot
 
1:39 PM
ah
@PeeHaa it only falls back if the message was truncated
 
I've thrown some chicken bones at it though so now all is good
@bwoebi ah k
 
… ah, it falls also back upon timeout, I see
 
makes sense
 
@bwoebi Yeh, if bind() fails (which is what I assume happened there) there's no point in falling back anyway
 
BTW @DaveRandom why did you start on pecl/pq instead of the native pgsql ext?
 
1:42 PM
@DaveRandom Ah, okay, that's why there was no fallback
 
@PeeHaa because I understand it better, it's a nicer API and it's more powerful
 
kk
 
as it stands, ext/pgsql can't actually do "true" async anyway
 
?
I always thought you got that for free
 
it's missing a couple of critical poll-related functions, I forget exactly what but I have a partial patch somewhere
 
1:44 PM
coolio
 
That's also why the ext/pg adapter is incomplete, because I only discovered that ^^ when I started trying to write it
 
@PeeHaa bleh. now I got gangstas paradise in my head
 
At least it's a nice track :)
 
soso… they overplayed it back then
 
!!dad
 
1:55 PM
What does an annoying pepper do? It get’s jalapeño face
 
any oauth 2.0 expert?
 
Depends on whether I get sucked into some debugging session or not
 
you will
 
@asfandahmed1 @PeeHee is an OAuth 2.0 expert! Ask him anything, he'll tell you all about it.
 
thanks @salathe
hello @PeeHaa
 
1:59 PM
> Support group for those afflicted with PHP. Don't ask to ask, just ask. Chat Guidelines : guide.room11.org
 
/me grabs popcorn
 
I'd star that but no one would read it there either
 
@salathe Oh you.
 
@PeeHaa i want my clients to consume resources from web. what should i do?
 
...
 
2:02 PM
Can you narrow it down to a specific question?
 
i need some guidance about how to use oauth 2.0
 
This is a good start oauth.net/2
 
I wouldn't call that specific
 
i am using this code
http://bshaffer.github.io/oauth2-server-php-docs/cookbook/
i have followed all cookbook instructions and everything is working fine.
 
So what is the question?
 
2:05 PM
i'm confused
 
That's a statement not a question
 
how to integrate it into my application so that my clients can consume resources
 
by writing some code?
 
no
workflow
 
Gee this is going places...
 
2:09 PM
@asfandahmed1 what do you expect? that someone is going to write a 10-page tutorial as an answer in a chat?
 
no i dont want it
 
you need to ask much more specific questions, ideally about some problem you encountered while trying to implement it
 
just some stepls
 
not just "plz help how do i write php app"
 
it's just a step to the left…
 
2:11 PM
jump to the left, step to the right
 
i'm confused?
 
@PeeHaa yw ^
 
hehehehehe <3
 
2:16 PM
Jeeves becoming more adorable day by day
 
i'm confused?
 
oh wow
I didn't think it would be that clever
 
:P
 
2:19 PM
apparently I'm cleverer than I thought \o/
 
Anonymous
that is pretty clever
 
The command is not in params
 
no but I didn't think it would match that as a "quote"
 
Anonymous
but a link within a link ?
 
it probably shouldn't have matched it tbh
 
2:20 PM
oic
 
I think postMessage() should probably bork if the message starts with !!
 
is bork a technical term?
 
it's certainly common
 
@rabbitguy As technical as fucky
 
!!define bork
 
Anonymous
2:22 PM
^ that'd be cool
 
!!? bork
 
Search for "bork" (https://www.google.com/search?q=bork&lr=lang_en)
• Bork Horeca Automatisering: Home - Bork Horeca is de leverancier voor uw horeca-automatisering. Van Touchscreen kassa afrekensystemen… (http://www.bork.nl/)
• Bork Sloopwerken: De kunst van het slopen - Voor Bork bedrijven is slopen meer dan alleen slopen. Wij willen goed en verantwoord slopen. Dat vr… (http://www.borksloopwerken.nl/)
• BORK BEDRIJFSPRESENTATIE - YouTube - Een korte impressie van http://www.borksloopwerken.nl/ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEPZ_V08oo8)
 
If by "technical term" you mean a term used by technical people, then I'd say it definitely is
 
@JayIsTooCommon well that's what !!urban does really
 
Anonymous
!!urban bork
 
2:22 PM
!!command alias define urban
 
[ bork ] Irreversibly damaged.
Command 'define' is now mapped to Urban # Search
 
Anonymous
@DaveRandom Yeah I guess, 1/10 chance of it being funny too
 
Do we get another php rc?
@hakre wtf
${(int)!${0}=$variable->other['class']}::my_static_method();
:P
 
@PeeHaa nobody writes it like that
The pattern in !${''}=
 
lol
sauce btw
 
2:37 PM
I really don't think the PHP core should have a native machine code generator.
It significantly complicates development and alienates contributors.
 
that's nice
 
@LeviMorrison if it ever does, it should be largely generated (i.e. we add more and more specializations to VM [we do not have to use them all in normal builds else the compiled output size would explode], and the code is then compiled by concatenating the highly specialized handlers together and piping it then through the LLVM optimizer or similar)
i.e. the native code generation should be abstracted away as much as possible and not really raise the bar to contributions
so, like, we compile the VM code normally, but with volatile placeholders which get replaced at run-time or similar, and LLVM optimizer can do constant propagation afterwards + further optimizations
 
Also I don't think it is our critical bottleneck either.
Better concurrency > native code execution
 
@LeviMorrison it gets more and more important though
 
You can probably find some pretty conclusive data on that by investigating HHVM's async/await.
 
2:47 PM
concurrency is not the bottleneck from my experiments with Aerys.
 
@bwoebi I wonder if this is because of the overhead of doing concurrency with current userland tools.
 
the bottleneck is cache fetches and function calls
… and objects.
 
There are also optimizations that can be done in interpreters that we aren't doing.
Function inlining, for example.
 
@LeviMorrison That's the one I'm looking for
 
It would also work nicely if we ever did have a JIT.
Native code execution usually happens on function boundaries - making those boundaries larger through inlining means more opportunity to generate optimized native code.
 
2:50 PM
but after inlining and CV constant propagation we pretty much reach the limits what we can do at this level
 
@LeviMorrison This would be fantastic, and something I would think could be implemented in the VM right now.
 
@Trowski @NikiC could you please remind us what's still problematic after the changes to 7.1 that we cannot do generic function inlining?
 
Identifying targets for inlining can be difficult but there are some fairly safe things we could start with, such as inline functions that aren't saved to variables (just used as parameters)
We also need opcodes for adjusting scope still.
For example, inlining this:
public function call($f, $m, ... $args) {
    return $f->$m(... $args);
}
If $f->$m calls a private method inside it we need to pass visibility checks.
So we need opcode for adjusting scope or a way to elide the visibility checks on inlining.
 
Right… scope certainly complicates things.
At the moment I think I'd rather see effort going toward async/await and a native event loop.
 
3:16 PM
@bwoebi Inlining should allow us to copy fewer variables.
And potentially do less reference counting.
 
that's true.
 
If those are in loops... can probably be a significant speedup.
 
@Trowski Our custom event loop + coroutine handling doesn't even take 10% of total runtime - it just isn't the bottleneck.
 
Oh! And type checking.
 
@bwoebi No, but I wonder if anyone will take async in PHP seriously without some native support.
 
3:20 PM
If we type check the callback every time inside a loop... that adds up.
Of course, we may not be able to elide all checks.
 
@bwoebi mainly that it doesn't seem to be worthwhile, the inlining overhead is too high
 
@LeviMorrison I remember to have used assert(... instanceof ...) instead of type checks just to lower down CPU instructions on a very resource intensive script (that shouldn't have been in PHP at the first place), but it doesn't really compare to how function calls are expensive.
 
@NikiC Even in the context of a long running program?
 
@NikiC Inlining in combination with avoiding copies etc.?
 
@bwoebi yes
 
3:24 PM
@NikiC What's the overhead there?
 
I'm mostly interested in inlining things in loops. I assume that's most people's hope as well?
Inlining functions that get called once would be pointless at this stage of PHP, anyway.
 
@bwoebi Apart from the obvious increase in code size, you get an increased CV space and an UNSET_VAR sled
Also something as simple as "avoiding copies" or removing dead unsets is pretty tricky due to destructor semantics
 
@NikiC I'm just talking about small functions, with very few tmps/cvs
@NikiC isn't it enough to do this in a single cleanup opcode? (where you'd also take care of changing scope back)
 
Hi All
How to restrict the php file upload file type like .gitingore and ._trashes ?
 
@bwoebi if you keep all inlined cvs consecutive, yes
 
3:30 PM
@NikiC sure, is there a reason not to?
 
Of course, another huge issue for inlining (or really anything) is the damn single-file limitation
I think getting rid of that is the no 1 priority if you want to exploit any kind of static optimization
 
@NikiC so, why can't we lift it?
 
@bwoebi We can, but it would require caching to manage dependencies
 
right
 
Which is non-trivial
 
3:33 PM
I admit I haven't given it much thought yet … What's the issue with it?
 
Any one , please answer my question
How to restrict the php file upload file type like .gitingore and ._trashes ?
 
@NikiC What exactly is problematic about it? if (rand(0, 1) { require "MyClass.php"; } try { (new MyClass)->do(); } catch (Error $e) { require "MyClass.php"; echo "now included\n"; (new MyClass)->do(); } or where lie the main issues?
 
@bwoebi I don't know exactly, I haven't tried myself. I can imagine that autoloading a pretty large issue
Due to the randomized loading order and the fact that files that would be important for optimization (e.g. the parent class) are only loaded afterwards
 
3:50 PM
@NikiC That's true. But autoloading will still be triggered if the class does not exist yet. and if it turns out to a be different class loaded by autoloader, then we can fatal error and tell the user to turn the optimization of inlining off
 
@NikiC At least I consider it non-trivial to rollback from an optimized/inlined version to a newly compiled non-inlined version of the code, at run-time, preserving current execution state
 
thanks
 
Evenin'
 
4:06 PM
evenin
 
good mid day :D
 
@bwoebi Mind if I change all the \LogicException (and decedents) in Aerys to \Error?
 
@Trowski feel free
 
@PeeHaa sup
 
@bwoebi Small issue I noticed: WatcherProcess asks for an instance of PsrLogger, but then calls flush() on that object. Should it call flush conditionally or should the class require an instance of Logger?
s/WatcherProcess/WorkerProcess
 
4:27 PM
Hi seniors, This is to ask that I've been in development field since 2 years and I've done diploma but yet I am not able to start from the scratch. I am always dependent on frameworks. Any way round to get stick with and be a good engineer.
Your suggestions are welcome
Thanks
 
Ekn
evenings
 
o/
 
Ekn
\o
 
4:30 PM
@PaulCrovella thanks
 
\o
 
4:45 PM
@Trowski Do a method_exists check (I think flush() is pretty unambiguous)
 
s/unambiguous/ubiquitous
 
s/ubiquitous/sexy
 
s/flush()/@rdlowrey
 
:P
 
s/sexy/""
@Trowski and I are gonna completely change that sentence before it's all said and done
 
4:51 PM
did you guys see the php and java runnable program that produces the same output?
 
yes. we did.
 
@Trowski lol
 
5:14 PM
@PeeHaa ask @bwoebi or @Trowski they should be able to help you with amp :)
 
@WyriHaximus I know there is no amp specific lib for me. I was more wondering whether you know anything loosely coupled enough to be repurposed for amp :)
 
@PeeHaa What sort of lib are you looking for?
 
oauth
or twitter in specific
 
Probably would have to roll your own using Artax.
 
I already did / do :)
But I don't actually wanna :D
 
5:17 PM
@PeeHaa I have something in the pipeline but that is months out though, planning to use both async-interop event loop and awaitable for that :)
 
@WyriHaximus Any idea about React officially using the async-interop standards?
Otherwise it's trivial to write bridges for them.
 
@Trowski don't know yet, have the next two weeks off so will use that time to work on the adapter
 
@WyriHaximus Only months? :)
 
@PeeHaa yeah :)
 
5:19 PM
@WyriHaximus I made an adapter for Icicle -> React. Much of that can probably be copy/pasted. github.com/icicleio/react-adapter
 
@WyriHaximus can you ping me when you have something useful. I'll see whether I am patient enough :)
 
@Trowski yeah it's more off actually sitting down for a few hours without interruption and doing it, currently my time consists off small 30 to 60 chunks with interruptions in my spare time. Great for working on small things for projects, kicking something off not so much :X. (ADHD is truly a P.I.T.A. with these kind of things.)
@PeeHaa anything specific you're looking for? Currently working it out in reactphp, plan is to add the interop later on when they is more matured/supported
 
A twitter oauth implementation that supports media uploads in specific
brb foodness
 
how do I var_dump a zval from inside an extension?
 
lxr search for definition of var_dump, figure it out from there ^_^
 
5:34 PM
@PeeHaa github.com/kelunik/chat-main/tree/master/src/OAuth is all oauth related ever done with amp AFAIK
 
Ekn
hOi
 
hO
 
Ekn
!!lxr var_dump
 
@Ekn There were no results for that search
 
Ekn
5:37 PM
huh, if you click search on ^ results, there are..
 
@LeviMorrison I did that already.
php_debug_zval_dump(&zv); or php_var_dump(&zv) doesnt work. it compiles but when I start a script it will print empty lines
also tried the dump function at phpinternalsbook.com/zvals/basic_structure.html
 
@Gordon php_var_dump requires a second param php_var_dump(zval *struc, int level) - so not sure how that whould compile missing one?
 
@MadaraUchiha the bounties on this question were apparently started by an alt account of the asker. They don't seem to be doing this to transfer rep between their own accounts, is this still abuse worth flagging anyway?
 
@Danack what do I. I can only tell you what I see happening. will try with level
 
5:44 PM
@PaulCrovella How the hell did that get +15?
 
@Gordon I think I was implying that you were running an executable that didn't include the code you thought it was.
 
@PeeHaa it's called Diffie-Hellman youtube.com/watch?v=3QnD2c4Xovk
 
@MadaraUchiha maybe people watching will upvote any horrible piece of trash they find with a bounty on it? maybe they've got a, um, circle of friends - I've no idea.
 
then you get into a "can we trust this public key?" situations, which is largely the open question plaguing net security
 
@Danack it works with level. thanks. not giving the results I was hoping for though
 
5:47 PM
@bwoebi Yeah. E_NOT_ENOUGH for me :(
 
ACME + Certificate Transparency + HTTP Public Key Pinning + widely-deployed DNSCrypt -> good luck with attacking PKI (especially without getting caught)
DNSCrypt and RFC 7858 are superior proposals to DNSSEC
 
@ScottArciszewski Holy shit. I was look for an ELI5ish video like that
 
@Ekn only if you already have a project selected, otherwise you get "You must select a project!"
 
Ekn
right
 
5:53 PM
I did a Twitter poll recently, and it seems most devs aren't interested in hybrid cryptosystems
What would you like to see covered next on the @ParagonIE blog?
 
@Ekn you wanna open a bug about that? I'm guessing it should default to master or something
 
Ekn
should I? it's been like that since first time I used that opengrok thingy
 
@ScottArciszewski It's hard to know you want something for random devs if you don't understand why you would want it
 
@Ekn a jeeves bug, yes, so it can actually retrieve results
 
I may sit on the secure password reset one
and just say "pay me if you want that in your code"
 
5:57 PM
@Ekn It's because the official thing is stil not up and this workaround uses different branches
cc @PaulCrovella
Considering the official thing may very well take another year feel free to pr the fix
 
Ekn
I remember when lxr.php.net was in use it was working ™
 
Exactly, but then a machine got lost :P
@ScottArciszewski That should always be the default imo :)
 
@Gordon It looks like it should - what is wrong with the output?
 
@Danack the ouput says Unknown which doesnt help me troubleshoot my issue. Though I guess the issue is not inside the extension
 
I get so many requests for free work that I can't even find time to say "No" to them all :P
 

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