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9:01 PM
So the other day I was watching a dev stream by one of the devs from Assetto Corsa. Their code looked pretty wonky man. The workflow was like a billion tabs open in VS, very little commenting throughout, relying on intellisense to figure out what stuff did... seemed strange. I haven't seen a lot of commercial closed codebases so I have no idea if that's the norm but the dev style seemed very messy
How they talk about physics in their engine is pretty cool though, and its interesting to watch them tweak it / drive cars around / tweak some more etc.
 
Still not as bad as @Nooble's workflow
 
Nooble's like 12 though
 
hi
 
Oh god this function is like 350 lines long
pls send halp
 
Help yourself.
 
9:03 PM
only 350?
 
I've had the liberty to look into "new programmers" (but university students - so tasks are always complicated) code.
 
@набиячлевэлиь pretty sure I've written functions longer than that before
 
1k plus lines for a single (python!) function are not uncommon
 
I've got this mozzarella here it's 2 days expired and the package was left open for 4 days and it says max 1 day
 
9:05 PM
And then the problem comes: "Why did the total static pressure variable turn negative?" "Paul you know code - fix it!"
 
but it still tastes normal
yolo
 
@AlexM. It can only become more cheese
 
Church spamming the depressed sauce
 
haha
 
Anyone on Mumble?
I got a new mic I want to test.
 
9:08 PM
Test it yourself?
Even skype has that build in
 
user1804599
@sehe make the black thing a girl and you have rightfold
 
Much confuse, what?
 
@Mikhail No I'm trying to summon @jaggedSpire
 
@набиячлевэлиь My thoughts exactly
 
9:10 PM
@Morwenn what is this?
 
user1804599
@Morwenn telekinesis much
 
@AlexM. An image.
 
I was sure you'd say that
 
@elyse That's the hardest part.
 
Oh god this supports VMS
Do I need to support VMS yes/no?
 
9:12 PM
@Morwenn so what does it represent
 
This supports Amigas, too
I don't need to support Amigas, do I?
 
@AlexM. Whatever you want to see in it. It's always open to interpretation.
 
COME ON AND SLAM
AND WELCOME TO THE JAM
 
hmm I'm wondering: if I get a laptop with 1 TB hdd + 128 SSD, is the SSD enough for windows + visual studio (and boost/libpng like C++ libraries)?
 
Yes.
 
Maybe.
 
128GB is not enough for an SSD
 
FILE_NOT_FOUND
 
Hmm I'm wondering how expensive it is to upgrade the SSD (later?)..
 
VS takes 25 GB with a full installation. Windows 10 takes... I dunno, let's be hyperactive and say 32 GB. The NTFS file system could chop off a good 5 GB for... I don't know, reason.
You've still got a lot of space left.
 
9:19 PM
MSI is according to some reviews quite good in that respect (you can easily add/remove parts on the laptop). But then again I have no experience with MSI.
 
 
@Morwenn ugh
 
GPLv3 is so long, I'm just gonna trust GitHub that GNU/whatever-the-copyright-holder-is is not gonna hunt me down
 
@elyse I hope you're not clinically depressed though. If you are, I hope you have been getting help
 
@набиячлевэлиь Protection by long licenses..
 
user1804599
9:20 PM
@sehe top kek
 
@sehe ITT the front page of Imgur
 
That's how all software companies work nowadays with their EULA
 
user1804599
@sehe I'm not, but in a guy costume :P
 
@paul23 exactly
 
@набиячлевэлиь I don't even know where "the frontpage" of that thing is.
 
9:21 PM
@paul23 Lol laptops.
 
@elyse I got that part :)
 
user1804599
I am not depressed at all.
 
And also lol Visual Studio.
 
user1804599
rather hopeful
 
@sehe Exactly where you're looking (the first thing you see after opening it)
 
9:21 PM
And also lol < 256GB SSDs.
 
@Nooble Lol actually working while on the move!
 
@elyse ^_^
 
I just hope they don't have a clause in there that lets them take my firstborn
 
user1804599
@Morwenn :3_:3
 
@paul23 Get a normal laptop and a desktop for home use.
You don't need an MSI GT80 lel.
 
9:22 PM
I've got a 128GB SSD and it's fine
 
@Nooble uh I need a high end as I have no room for a desktop in my home
9 sq meter
 
@Puppy I always run out too fast.
 
user1804599
btw @sehe you prolly know this
 
@Nooble Well the other option is a laptop with JUST an 256 GB ssd.. Instead of 128 SSD + 1TB hd
 
@paul23 Or you can stop worrying about that and buy an SSD and put it in one of the SATA cages your laptop will have.
 
user1804599
9:24 PM
I want to expose SSH access for rsync and only rsync, with custom auth checking (single Linux user, but custom auth system for rsync).
 
user1804599
Currently doing this: unix.stackexchange.com/a/147319/5130 with a custom shell
 
user1804599
but I have no idea how to make such a thing work with rsync. I want a certain user only to be able to rsync a certain directory, and only read-only
 
@Nooble $$$ - I wish to keep everything together below 1000 euros.
I'm a student you know, money is hard to find nowadays
 
@paul23 A usable high end laptop below €1000? Good luck :P
 
user1804599
Kinda like GitHub does with Git. They have a single SSH user (hence ssh://git@github.com/...), but manage auth based on keys submitted by users through a web app.
 
9:26 PM
@paul23 You doing graphics stuff?
 
CATIA - so yes my study is all about CAD & fluid dynamics
(Computational fluid dynamics, so creating and calculating differential equation fields)
 
It doesn't sound like you need a high end laptop.
 
Well I do like to game :P
 
:(
 
9:28 PM
Get an Asus G751 perhaps.
 
user1804599
@paul23 OMG DUTCH
 
Get whatever then. You know these laptops won't be at all portable?
I have an Asus G750.
Man that thing is pretty much an MITX build with a display.
Have fun lugging it around.
 
@Nooble portable? I need to lift it like 10 times a day, but only from room to room.
I live on the campus, so max travel distance in my life is about 200 meters :P
 
You need to talk in freedom units for me to understand you.
 
9:32 PM
Current laptop weighs 2.9 kg I got no problem with that at all.
 
6 pounds.
 
200 meter = about 2000 white male penis lengths.
Bit less than that actually, more like 1800-1900
That freedom units?
 
Yes.
Now you need to add more things about eagles.
 
@набиячлевэлиь no no no! That's what's on the homepage. That's a different thing
@elyse I'd personally run an rsync daemon; But if you insist on ssh, see e.g. mennucc1.debian.net/howto-ssh-rsyncd.html or something
 
user1804599
I thought rsync only worked with SSH.
 
user1804599
9:40 PM
Can an rsync daemon be used with custom authentication (i.e. not Linux users)?
 
Seems on point:
6
A: Can't get rsync to work in daemon-over-ssh mode

rjmunroThere seems to be a bug in the documentation or the implimentation of rsync. man rsync says: Rsync supports connecting to a host using a remote shell and then spawning a single-use “daemon” server that expects to read its config file in the home dir of the remote user. but when...

@elyse Yes IIRC
 
user1804599
Nice.
 
Maybe I shoudl just buy both models.
Can't decide
 
And of course you can always engage pam.d (that's for sysadmins if you ask me)
 
@paul23 What...
Can you just get a desktop and make me happy.
 
user1804599
9:42 PM
Don't want to restart rsyncd after adding or removing or changing a user, though.
 
yaydrugs
 
@elyse Why not. Running connections could just keep on running (is it not using fork model?)
 
@Nooble Lol I need a laptop with at least the quality of an quadro K1100m anyways for my masters (which equates according to notebookcheck to a GTX760m). And they strongly recommend a 250GB ssd / I7 processor.
 
you should really get on that
sounds like a Critical Issue.
 
So if I take above I get to the ~800 euros region. For 200-400 extra euros I am not able to get another good desktop (and screen etc).
 
user1804599
9:44 PM
@sehe Because it would terminate existing connections.
 
@paul23 First of all that i7 is going to equate to a desktop i5.
 
user1804599
If rsyncd.secrets updates don't require restarts then that'd be great.
 
The i7-4720HQ is about the same as an i5-4690K.
If they asked for a quadro, get a quadro.
GeForce GPUs are not really meant for what you're doing. Although at that end (low-end) I doubt it will matter.
Give me that star back!
@paul23 I bet you could.
 
@Nooble indeed doesn't really matter - but still need something there, and a geforce is about 200 euros cheaper
 
i5 + GTX 960M can be done for $1000.
Err, 960.
Not M.
 
user1804599
9:48 PM
@sehe Yes, rsyncd opens the secrets file every time somebody wants to authenticate.
 
user1804599
According to the check_secret function.
 
user1804599
lol, strtok
 
@Nooble No I mean: I need the laptop. So if I take the minimum requirements the university said, I have 400 euros left over in my budget to make myself a nice extra computer. I can either use that to get a better laptop, or a desktop.
 
@paul23 Oh I see.
Well, I suppose you should just get a beefy laptop then.
 
> There are no concepts defined in the Concepts TS (source: I wrote the Concepts TS).
lol
 
user1804599
9:51 PM
rsyncd.secrets does store passwords in plain-text, though
 
user1804599
which is laughable at best
 
@Nooble And that's what I've been researching last week :P. GT 940 with ssd vs GTX 960 with 5400 RPM laptop.. In my price category it seems I have to make a tradeoff somewhere.
 
A GT940 sounds like crap.
Doubt it exists.
 
Oh.
Well don't get that.
 
user1804599
9:54 PM
Oh, rsyncd doesn't support encryption at all.
 
user1804599
SSH, it is, then.
 
Get the 960M and buy an SSD.
 
Well that's the other thing: warranty - I've always wondered how strict the warranty is when opining it. (None of the laptops I bought actually survived their first two years completelly).
 
Stop breaking laptops.
 
From one the keyboard/mousepad stopped functioning -up to the point that if you touched the mousepad the laptop would blue screen of death-
And the other had a failure with the boot sector, where it simply refused to read my hard drive. - Even after they put in a completelly new one it kept happening.
Oh and then there was my brotherslaptop.. That started smelling like burning hair while playing league of legends. And actually smoke came out of the fan...
It died a few minutes later
Lost me the game!
 
10:01 PM
@elyse are you sure
 
user1804599
No, but I don't care.
 
@elyse ah good
 
user1804599
I'm not going to use rsync anymore.
 
user1804599
I'll just filter data by last updated time.
 
what have you switched to?
 
user1804599
10:02 PM
And download only files updated since the last fetch.
 
@elyse how? just general shell access?
 
I'm working with an ubuntu VM to compile & run an SDL-based game. Is there a setting in VirtualBox I need to tweak, or compiler flag I need to set in order to get SDL_SetVideoMode in SDL 1.2 to render properly? My display looks like ASCII art...
 
user1804599
No, custom shell. like GitLab does
 
@elyse sounds an enourmous lot like reinventing wheels :)
@elyse which one?
 
user1804599
10:03 PM
@sehe eh?
 
@SammyK nice. For the '90s.
@SammyK libcaca is ascii art
 
@sehe Haha. Yeah, trying to learn C++ the old-school way
 
user1804599
or, actually
 
user1804599
I'll just use HTTP for this. Much easier than SSH.
 
user1804599
because why the fuck not
 
10:04 PM
3
A: How to get SDL to use fbcon not caca

genpfaultMake sure that your SDL install is built with framebuffer support (--enable-video-fbcon and/or --enable-video-directfb) and that the SDL_VIDEODRIVER environment variable is set to fbcon or directfb.

 
@SammyK You mean the completely incorrect way?
 
Ah - libcaca. I was wandering why the title bar had "caca" in it
 
It's apparently some french pun. Which, too, was nice in the '90s
 
user1804599
@sehe lol SDL using caca
 
@Puppy Gotta learn a little history :)
 
10:05 PM
not really.
 
@sehe Yeah. Caca means "shit".
 
@sehe Thanks! I'll check this out!
 
the history here is a complete waste of time.
 
@SammyK There's "old school" and there's prehistoric.
 
@Puppy Only one way to know that
 
10:05 PM
@sehe The deleted answer right below it is very high quality.
 
@EtiennedeMartel SDL2 is not prehistoric. He's just accidentally running it with the wrong frontend
 
@sehe He's using SDL 1.2, right?
 
@EtiennedeMartel sad it got deleted
 
@EtiennedeMartel Haha. I don't know the difference yet. That's what I'm determined to learn going forward though :)
 
@EtiennedeMartel oh maybe. Not rechecking those screen caps
> going forward
 
10:06 PM
besides, there's a big difference between what version of SDL he's using, and actually learning the language the old-school way.
 
^ Manager speak detected. Are you sure you want to be a dev?
 
@sehe He explicitly stated in his help vampire question dump that he was using 1.2
 
Oh I never saw such a thing.
I just responded to the screen shot
 
@sehe I'm worse than a manager... I'm coming from PHP. :) I'm not quite as cut & pasty as the average PHP joe, but compiled languages are def next on my list of things to master
 
> compiled languages
are not a homogeneous entity
 
user1804599
10:09 PM
funfact PHP is typically compiled to bytecode
 
Freaking brilliant. And call me sentimental... but don't forget to loot the bride and groom. — Feral Chimp Apr 21 '12 at 22:24
heh, I love Arqade comments
 
@elyse Wrong, it's compiled to shit.
Zend consumes excrements as its input.
 
Indeed. Thought C/C++ would be a good place to start though. Especially since I've been getting involved in PHP internals (C) and HHVM (C++)
 
C and C++ are completely different things.
also C is shit.
 
@Puppy He knows. He clarified
 
10:10 PM
I only see even more hopelessly vague and inaccurate generalizations
 
@Puppy Haha! So I've heard :)
 
user1804599
C++ is also shit.
 
And libcaca is shit.
 
@Puppy That's all noobs start.
(I am fully aware of the irony of my statement)
 
WOO, I GOT MY PYTHON HOMEWORK!
... I'll do it later.
 
10:15 PM
I actually did not notice until you pointed it out
 
@Morwenn I wonder if libshit exists.
> Libshit (liberal + shit)
Well.
So much for that idea.
 
> libcaca (libérez le caca)
I'm stopping there. I won't go down that hole.
5
 
@Morwenn Jooooin uuuuus.
 
11:03 PM
So quiet
 
Time to go to bed.
 
I can disrupt the peace.
I'm struggling with unique_ptr. How is that for peace distruption? :(
My problem in the line declaring the unique_ptr.
I want to inject a mock sdl library to test code using sdl
 
@Morwenn nn
 
so building for debug would use the SDL include, and building to run unit tests would instead use the include path of the mock.
but it won't build.
because of the ampersand in that line.
 
@villageidiot Wrap SDL_DestroyWindow in the operator() of a struct and feed that struct to std::unique_ptr. You won't have to give the function anymore when constructing the pointer, and if you're lucky, the compiler will even use EBCO.
 
11:07 PM
because i think that when i specify a free function as the deleter i have to use an ampersand in the deleter parameter. but when i use a std::function i must not.
 
@villageidiot awesome
 
@Borgleader Thanks, you're almost the only to consistently say it :p
 
Night all :)
 
^_^
 
Don't fall asleep now
that would be a waste of time
@thecoshman I can remind you of this periodically
~~consistency~~
 
11:09 PM
lol
 
@Morwenn why won't i need to give the function to the deleter anymore?
 
It's hardcoded (a default constructed instance of your function object type will do the right thing)
 
it's a a resource manager. i have to somehow describe how to free the window.
@sehe but. that's what the window class is for. that's what it does right now.
window w; does the cleanup.
 
So?
 
i'm at a loss.
i don't follow.
i'm the village idiot, recall.
slow with me.
 
11:13 PM
@villageidiot Us too. You don't give enough information. Go to Stack Overflow. Author a proper question ;S
@villageidiot Wait a second. Did you really just create a global named SDL_DestroyWindow, but /typed/ std::function<...>? That's... gross
 
yes yes
... for testing .. ?
 
.. ? ..
Why would you have cruft for testing
@villageidiot pastie.org/10418116
 
here's a test:

TEST_CASE("window destroys") {
int destroyed = 0;
SDL_DestroyWindow = [&](SDL_Window*) { ++destroyed; }
window w;
}
i'm sure it's wrong. i just typed it quicly now. i have done this work yet.
 
Oh ahahahaha. You want to /test/ std::unique_ptr then
 
no, the wrapper. the widnow wrapper.
 
11:18 PM
I ~~get~~ it. It's just. Well. You don't want to be subverting your whole API for that.
 
Test first doesn't mean "Every horribly thing can be excused if you think it helped testing"
 
auto x = init; is quicker to type than any global shenanigans anyway.
 
i wanted it to be as easy on my code as possible. i hate changing code for "testability"
 
You could... add the tracing to the window wrapper. Make a nice derived class. Override destructor. Add tracing
@villageidiot Yet that's the only excuse you had for global fake functions. And yes, it's weird to pass the address of a global std::function<...> object as the deleter. No wonder unique_ptr refused
@LucDanton Trying to make sense of this in context. Failing
 
11:22 PM
it's a mock library. the entire "library" ive hacked consists of things in that spirit. no definitions other than class definitions when i had to, like

struct SDL_Event {
SDL_EventType type;
};
 
@sehe I don’t want to give a free pass to the 'I typed it quickly' excuse.
 
i wanted to then bolt on the function definitions in unit tests, depending on the need
 
@villageidiot Well. Good luck with that. (I don't think mocking SDL is a worthy goal)
 
how would i test code that uses sdl then?
surely people test games?
 
@villageidiot ON a slightly higher level? Just check for resource leaks using specialized tools.
 
11:24 PM
so no unit tests?
i thought people frowned upon this
 
@villageidiot Yes. But they do not test whether windows get destroyed. Because, you know, you'd notice that.
@villageidiot Well. What about a bit of balance?
Be smart about what you test. Pretty soon, you'll be testing string concatenation
 
well no. string concatenation is a standard library thing. window destruction isn't an sdl thing... it's a user land thing... no?
okay i'm not insisting to be wrong. i'm letting go of this testing work.
 
@villageidiot Rhetorics aren't going to cut it, right?
 
it's a good thing you stopped an idiot and it's a good thing the idiot came in so early. there's not much work to throw out the window. maybe 25 lines of code.
@sehe rhetorics will definitely do the magic. i listen.
 
@villageidiot Yeah. Well. It's fine if (a) you can live with yourself for making the code brittle by using globals (b) you can afford the cost of type erasure in std::function (c) you know how to code this (IOW: do not take the address for no raisin)
@villageidiot whoosh. I noticed you were trying to "manipulate" me into agreeing, "no?". People frown on this. Me in particular
 
11:29 PM
debug and release code would have none of these globals nonesense. only unit tests. i planned to have a debug build, a release build, and a unit-tests build.
 
@sehe I’m not seeing it.
 
Oh well. I guess that would remove objections (b), but it would exacerbate (c) - quite a bit
 
lern2english
 
no no i don't manipulate. sorry if it sounded like that. i thought it would be a good idea to hijack the sdl calls for testing via CPPFLAGS= setting.
 
wokay. Possible. It was just the trend of vacuous questions like "So no unit tests?", "surely people test games?", "it's a user land thing... no?" etc. Especially the "no?" irked me. I don't think it's my Engrish.
Maybe I'm over sensitive
 
11:32 PM
I’ve 'no?'’d plenty of times. It’s fine.
Those were very reasonable questions.
 
@villageidiot Yes, certainly! So, that's where you specify the rigged testing version of the library :)
 
k. sorry. thanks, i'll watch it with over-testing.
 
@sehe lol
 
@sehe Did you setup a cron job?
 
Doing useless things manually creates more jobs
 
11:52 PM
@Borgleader 'sup, Garrus.
 
sup
 
I'm so damn hot
 
google pulls in answers from SO now... cool
Or maybe it isn't new and I just haven't noticed it
@AlexM. are you a black mage
 
@Borgleader nope. While searching for prior answers I found this interesting tidbit
Mar 21 '12 at 7:33, by wilx
Heh, Tomalak has managed to alienate even this room?
2012
@Prismatic that's old as hell. Usually they index it in minutes
 
oh
 

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