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12:00 AM
Don't fall asleep now
that would be a waste of time
 
@sehe Business and markets create jobs. Super-wealthy people may only favour one type of business over another for some period of time. If they choose wrong unprofitable product to manufacture - they will lose capital soon, and workers from that business will go to another one, which is favored by another capital.
 
@sehe I keep narrowing it to housing because for the vast majority of Americans, the value of their house really is pretty much equal to their net worth. Most cars depreciate almost as fast as people pay them off. Few have more than, say, $100K in savings/other investments. Most other "stuff" (clothes, dishes, furniture, stereo, etc.) works out to a few thousand dollars at most (even though it cost a lot more than that).
@sehe Nobody's said that. I merely said it was deceiving. Yes, there's a great deal of inequality, and yes it would probably be better of there was less--but a lot of what's shown in the video is also a by-product of what was really a fairly short-term situation (though it's certainly true that recovery has been a lot slower than anybody would like).
 
@JerryCoffin Isn't the problem that measuring things according to the logic for the "vast majority" (99%?) totally misses the big picture because the extremes don't fit in that at all?
 
@sehe Most wealthy people who don't own or operate businesses still invest quite a bit of their money, in which case most of it is financing companies. It's less direct, but it still creates jobs. The primary exceptions are investments in things like art work and such.
 
Note I was specifically pointing this out, but doubting the ratio is healthy/reasonable/rational
19 mins ago, by sehe
(I sure hope the successful business do, but certainly the number of jobs created is not in a direct proportion to the wealth of those people/corporations.)
What I see is that big corporations start to realize they can become power blocks, sit on their resources and apply them where they need when they need [e.g. to override government] (Big Pharma? IBM? Google?).
Do you think the Epi-pen price increase goes towards more jobs? (Perhaps, ironically, yes, because it forces competitors into the market, after which the price extortion can be reverted, and the corporation just has a lot more fat to weigh in with)
2
Anyways, this is not what we were talking about. Just something I was reminded of.
 
12:19 AM
@sehe I think there are a number of problems. The main one is that what it's measuring has little to do with anything for most people most of the time. Much of what most people buy is just terrible as an investment. Americans spend over $200 billion/year on alcoholic drinks. In most cases, there's no chance any of that will have any return as an investment at all. Restaurants: another $800 billion, again, no chance of (direct) return for most of that.
 
Since when is it about return on investment (alone).
I'd say it's about freedom and power.
 
If people really cared about their net worth, taking half what they spend on eating out and drinking would contribute quite a bit.
 
There's a reason why so much goes to waste. It's not because the middle class "doesn't want to fund cancer research"
 
@sehe That's why I said what they're measuring isn't something most people are about.
 
@JerryCoffin "taking"?
 
12:22 AM
@sehe If they took it, and invested it instead of spending it on things with no chance of a return.
 
@JerryCoffin It's very related. It's funny you don't want to acknowledge there is a relation between free-to-spend wealth and freedom?
@JerryCoffin That's really funny. You're basically saying: the middle-class should be more frugal, and then they would become (super) wealthy.
It doesn't work that way. You cannot "save" yourself into that class. You have to have a high income stream (inheriting or top salaries, preferrably both)
 
@sehe I didn't say they'd become super wealthy. I did say they'd become more wealthy.
@sehe Wait. Let me back up a ways. Hmm...maybe if I take off my glasses I won't notice that this man is made entirely from straw. Well, maybe I can close my eyes and imagine an argument where you weren't using a straw man...
 
@JerryCoffin Even if wealthy people would not invest anything, but just have money in account, or in "cash", and do not use these money anyhow - that would increase price of this currency, it is kind of revaluation, what in effect would mean "investing" into everything and everyone equally.
 
@JerryCoffin lol. Talk about relevant :) It's not about shifting a little to the left or to the right. It's about fundamentally changing the curve (or at least realizing it might not be the best curve)
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk Unless they literally keep it in a pile of cash (or gold, etc.), most of it is being invested. When you put money in a bank, they turn around and loan it out or invest it as fast as they can.
 
12:37 AM
@JerryCoffin Yes, sure. My point is that by their actions with capitals they just favor one sector of economy/business or another, even if they would do nothing (pile of cash, gold) - it still would make some positive effect for others (even some jobs can be created in the result of such action).
 
@sehe There's certainly room for argument that it isn't the best (and I'd tend to agree that it's probably not). It's not immediately clear how you change it without doing a lot of damage though. A more progressive income tax might be a good thing--but the top-level there has been modified several times already, with little effect on median income, average net worth, etc.
It does, however, probably have a fairly substantial effect on things like federal deficits, which have (indirect) effects throughout the economy.
 
@JerryCoffin That's a whole nuther question. But you can't change what you don't see. And rejecting the problem because it's hard to see or hard to change is not a very good approach.
I think it's best to tackle unbalance while there's an option. There are whole regions of the earth where this station seems to have passed by a decade or so ago. :(
I'm the optimistic kind. "Yes we can" could be my daily motto
 
@sehe I think for the most people "fairness" mean resource consumption level, standard of living - such kind of things, not the power or influence. But the right part of chart is not proportional to "fair" measures - CEO does not consume 380x resources.
 
I don't think it's about that much if at all
I think it's purely and only about the surpluses
They are what creates opportunity.
To fund those tuitions, the local church, cancer research, the presidential campaign, start that business, take that year off to write a book, risk that executive position with a startup, donate to OSS projects - in short: innovate and steer.
 
@sehe I'm simply concerned that a fair number of plans I've seen that were (supposedly) intended to reduce inequality did it almost entirely by basically robbing from the rich--but not giving to the poor. Congressional budget office does studies on proposed tax changes, and quite a few show drops in median income (from proposed increases in taxes in wealthy). I don't think that's necessarily always the case, but benefit from such changes isn't obvious or straightforward either.
 
12:51 AM
HELP I CAN'T THINK OF PRETTY PHYSICS THINGS TO MODEL.
Aaaaaaahhh.
 
Yeah that's a risk. In effect (certainly in the US, it seems from here) the government is part of the establishment that might sit on that oversized share of wealth. So, taxes would just bring it from one pocket to another within that same group
 
@ThePhD Computational Fluid Dynamics can generate some pretty pictures.
 
@JerryCoffin We're not at fluids yet.
All I have are springs, damping forces, and gravity.
 
@JerryCoffin It can't be too hard. A minimum wage would be an obvious start (yeah I know all the scepsis, but really, look around the world to see it works)
 
I'm trying to like
make blackholes and stuff but it's not working out.
Particles get sucked in, but then they ZIP past the star. Nothing's getting stuck.
And I have less than 30 minutes to put ti all together aFfAFFFfff.
 
12:53 AM
@ThePhD Finite element analysis. Remember, under enough pressure, everything's fluid.
 
@JerryCoffin I could simulate pressure with different gravitational forces...
Buh. Thinking in terms of physics and not just "do the thing" is hard.
 
@sehe Already have a minimum, and already have plans to increase it. Doubt it helps much though. No matter what number you attach, if your job is flipping burgers at McDonalds, your pay is gonna be crappy. Increases temporarily improve that a little, but only temporarily and only a little.
They also (essentially every time) put at least some people out of work entirely, and move more from full time to part time, so their hourly wage goes up, but they lose hours and (more importantly) benefits. It is (I think) usually more of a gain than a loss overall, but not by a huge margin.
Anyway, got to go. Catch you all later.
 
It's not about whether the pay is crap. It's more about whether the cost of the labour is reasonable. The gap between value added and wage earned is like the 'mantissa' in the exponential growth of the wealth disparity (companies make lots more than the labour costs and the money goes to the upper echelon/more corporations)
 
@JerryCoffin is right here. I've seen plenty of videos and articles where people just say "yeah we'd just decrease hours and lay people off if the minimum wage went up".
@sehe An bracketed income tax is theoretically supposed to help with that. Problem is: taxation breaks, tax havens, etc. etc...
Which I think is all stuff you two already brought up so why am I even here, I'm just late to the party. <_>
 
The pay might be crap, but "reasonably" so. You shouldn't expect to become rich doing effectively nothing. But when the business makes a shit ton of money off your work, you should expect to be rewarded in some relation to that. It's basic entrepreneurship (but the power dynamics favour the employing parties too much for it to work)
 
1:00 AM
The rough thing about minimum wage is that it hurts smaller business owners too, because then they have to account for a pretty large increase in monthly / yearly expense.
 
user406009
@ThePhD Actually, a somewhat significant majority of small business owners want a n increased minimum wage (smallbusinessmajority.org/small-business-owners-say-raise-wage)
 
^ Me on company hipchat
 
user406009
(Newer data with the more popular $12 figure: smallbusinessmajority.org/our-research/workforce/…)
 
@ThePhD Do you have any speed limit? Blackholes require speed limit. In other case object with sufficient escape velocity can escape it.
 
When the conference organizer gives you a better conversation starter than you submitted. Thanks @_JonKalb https://t.co/rn5fGVFxwS
 
1:07 AM
@sehe what a hip chat
 
It is. Showing all the signs of Java IYAM
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk Nope. I should probably add that.
@Lalaland Those are some neat numbers: thanks for showing me that.
 
@ThePhD Also you can add some kinetic energy/velocity lose on collision (it goes into heating, etc).
 
@EvgenyPanasyuk No collision detection, unfortunately.
 
user406009
I think the best argument against a national minimum wage is that it's national. A good minimum wage needs to vary by city and state to be effective.
 
1:15 AM
Honestly, I'm just going to wait for collision detection.
 
user406009
Otherwise you are going to have something that is way too low for a high cost of living area and way too high for a low cost of living area.
 
@ThePhD When two bodies met - their kinetic energy is at maxium. Without collision detection they can go thru each other and fly away.
 
1:47 AM
@EvgenyPanasyuk One cool thing is that matter can escape a blackhole if the gravity tears apart molecular/atomic bonds :D
 
2:15 AM
@Aaron3468 So this time, I really have it narrowed down to this:
Before:
std::unique_ptr<ctype, ym_heap> make_C_block    (upL_t blocks) const{
    upL_t bytes = blocks * this->m_cLa * sizeof(ctype);
    auto uptr = ym_heap::malloc_uptr<ctype>(nullptr, bytes, sizeof(ctype));
    memset(uptr.get(), 0, bytes);
    return uptr;
}
After:
SmartBuffer<ctype> make_C_block     (upL_t blocks) const{
    upL_t items = blocks * this->m_cLa;
    auto uptr = make_trivial_array<ctype>(items);
    memset(uptr.get(), 0, items * sizeof(ctype));
    return uptr;
}
The first one lasts the full 8 hour test. The second one fails within 20 minutes.
Wakaranai
 
2:27 AM
そうか?It looks like memset might not always be allocating the amount of memory SmartBuffer is using. The only other major change looks like the make_trivial_array function
 
There is one difference which I'm compiling a test for right now. ym_heap::malloc_uptr doesn't call constructors. But make_trivial_array does. However, that shouldn't matter since ctype is __m256i which is a POD.
The difference between the allocators themselves will be harder to sort through. Both of them use the same alignment algorithm, but ym_heap::malloc_uptr does some extra stuff which isn't needed.
 
why do I feel like this is deja vu
 
2:43 AM
Because you're in the lounge :)
 
@Mysticial fucking weeb
<3
 
3:15 AM
Interesting, neither MSVC nor ICC treats placement new for __m256i as a no-op.
It looks like it zeros the memory. But that doesn't explain why it would be a heisen-failure.
Oh, the standard seems to require it.
new (ptr) PODType()
 
compare new (ptr) PODType
 
I'm running the last failing binary with the placement new loop commented out:
for (upL_t c = 0; c < size; c++){
    ::new (ptr + c) T();
}
It hasn't failed yet.
 
How to efficiently run program on computers with NUMA?
 
I don't understand how double zero-initialization of newly allocated memory can cause heisen-failures.
And only on my laptop.
@hwlau You pin them to a node.
If you want to use the entire system efficiently, good luck. That's a major research problem.
 
what does that mean?
Is it the thread will stay there and the cache etc is not changing over time
It is not possible, I cannot use the whole system anyway
 
3:32 AM
It's more about the memory. If program isn't NUMA-aware the OS's will put all the memory it allocates onto whatever node that thread is on. When the process migrates to another node, bad things will happen.
So ideally, you pin the process to one node so that both the memory and the computation stays on one node and doesn't need to access the other node.
But if you're trying to utilize all the nodes with one process, that will take some very serious application-specific research work to design the right algorithms to efficiently utilize multiple nodes.
 
I am just using a simple omp directive, are there easy way to optimize it a bit?
It has about 256 nodes there, and I am not going to use them all
otherwise, I better write mpi program instead
 
256 nodes? What kind of machine is this? A supercomputer?
lolno OpenMP and any other shared memory thing is not gonna work on 256 nodes.
Unless you only intend to use like 1 node.
Though I'm unsure on the status of Charm++ which is supposed to be a scalable shared-ish memory framework.
 
ya, supercomputer. But the support tell me I can try
So I am trying. I don't want to rewrite the codes right now
 
In short, if you want to use OpenMP. The answer is no. OpenMP will not let you efficient use 256 nodes. You can maybe use 2 or 4 efficiently and that's it.
And if you're really asking this question, then the answer is no. You will not be able to get anything that isn't embarrassingly parallel to scale to 256 nodes without specifically designing for it.
So no, a piece of already working C or C++ code is not going to magically scale on to 256 nodes (and however many thousands of cores) without a significant amount of work.
 
I think omp have some scheduler too, and it can slice the array in certain way. Doesn't it help
 
3:40 AM
If you're really asking that question, then I suggest you first get a better understanding of how supercomputers work before jumping into this.
 
I only use 32 or 64. I don't need perfect scaling, 50% at that number of node is probably enough.
Then what is the point of have large ccNUMA compared with computers with MPI
 
For programs that are NUMA-aware and very well NUMA-optimized. OpenMP is designed to make basic parallelism simple. It's not designed for large systems.
It's meant for your quad-core desktops. Not for thousand core multi-node clusters.
 
ok
 
OpenMP would argue with you there.
 
Sure you can try it anyway. But unless the program uses no memory at all, you're probably gonna get backwards scaling at around 4+ nodes depending on the application.
 
3:43 AM
then NUMA should have better performance if optimize well
Let me see. It is just grid based simulations
 
First of all:
1. Does your application need more than 1 MB of memory per thread?
2. Do the threads need to share data?
 
@ThePhD what do you mean?
 
@hwlau I mean that OpenMP would just argue that it's sueful for all kinds of Multithreaded uses.
 
@Mysticial 1. 100MB to 1GB. 2. Yes for sure
 
@ThePhD That's what they want, but that's not the reality.
 
3:46 AM
@ThePhD any tips to use it in this case?
 
@hwlau If you answer yes to either one of those and you want to get any sort of efficiency beyond 2 to 4 cores, don't use OpenMP. Use MPI. If you need to use shared memory, then you're gonna need to get your hands dirty with pthreads and libNuma for memory pinning.
There's also Charm++ which was under development while I was still in school. Not sure if it's production ready though.
Generally speaking, you use MPI across nodes. One MPI process per node. Within each node, you use OpenMP to utilize all the cores within the node.
 
@Mysticial I actually do hope so. Because the most intense part that require cross memory access is the FFT. I am using FFTW3 so I hope they have an algorithm that works here.
@Mysticial Using both MPI and OpenMP is really complex that I don't really want to do with my simple stuffs.
 
@hwlau Is FFTW3 NUMA-aware?
And what parallel framework does it use?
 
@Mysticial I am not sure, probably no. But there are many contribute algorithm. And it is initialized by really execute part/most of the algorithm to find the best one.
 
The FFT is one of the ugliest things to do on supercomputers. I was a researcher on that during my grad school days. There is absolutely no way you're gonna get a shared memory FFT to run any in way efficient across more than like 2 nodes.
 
3:54 AM
UV1000's ccNUMA architecture. Intel's Quickpath + SGI's NUMAlink 5
 
My experience was backwards scaling starting from about 3 nodes on the AMD Opterons at the time. And the machines I had access to didn't have OS-instances that covered more than one motherboard (4 sockets).
Anything larger required MPI.
 
There was basically no point in having shared memory beyond one motherboard because the latencies are so high and the bandwidth is so poor that directly accessing them as shared memory is so slow that it's pointless.
@hwlau Those libraries are NUMA-aware or they use MPI.
 
They do. That why I am hoping
 
Oh, that paper doesn't even do NUMA. It's MPI all the way.
All the efficient FFT algorithms for large NUMA shared memory are basically shared-memory emulations of the MPI algorithms.
Partial FFT, transpose, partial FFT. And maybe an extra pre/post transpose depending on how you want the inputs and outputs to be.
 
4:01 AM
@Mysticial MPI+OpenMP and MPI+GPU
 
@hwlau I meant MPI at the top level. But basically the same as what I said earlier.
 
@Mysticial I know transpose is hard to do efficiently
 
If you can tap into the libraries than do it.
I'm just saying you can't take a shared memory program written for a desktop and expect it to run well on 256 nodes.
If there's a library to do it for you than use it if possible. Otherwise, there's no free lunch.
 
I get the point, but let me see
 
I've personally tried to take a desktop FFT. And like I said, I got backwards scaling after like 3 nodes on a 4 node system.
And there were no single instance/OS systems with more than 4 nodes.
Instances were connected with 10Gb infiniband. And the only way for them to talk was MPI.
 
4:10 AM
Then it is not NUMA
 
Yes it is NUMA. 4 sockets per motherboard. Each socket is a NUMA node. One OS per motherboard. And a whole bunch of them.
 
4:29 AM
@Aaron3468 Running without the placement new seems to have "fixed" it. I have no fucking clue why. I'll it run overnight. Then tomorrow during the day, I'll run trunk with the same change (and assert that the type is trivially constructible).
 
@Mysticial Weird... That seems like undocumented/obscure behaviour
 
Even if that does turn out to be the "fix", I'm obviously not happy about without an explanation. But I'm out of ideas.
ICC seems to do a 32-byte memset for each item.
MSVC inlines the memset, but still does it per-element.
I might try testing with MSVC to see if the problem still flips on that placement new.
 
@hwlau Being defined negatively, NUMA covers a lot of ground--i.e., anything and everything except the (mostly fairly small) machines that have uniform memory access.
 
@Aaron3468 Whatever the case is, I am more convinced that it's an environmental problem. And that's it's somehow triggered by a large array of 32-byte wide memsets.
It happens even if the memory has been committed to memory with a preceeding memset over the all the data. So it's probably not related to the kernel virtual memory manager.
And it only happens on the really large arrays.
 
4:47 AM
> I think even James McNellis would understand that -1 is less than 1.
Jon Kalb right now. :D
 
@Griwes Not in unsigned arithmetic it isn't...
 
That's the point, yes.
The -1 was signed int variable.
 
@Mysticial True, and if that's the case, the only option would be to find a work around for platforms with the issue
 
@Mysticial Oh, hey. We finally have some official specs up on our web site:
 
@Aaron3468 I'm gonna try running memtest86's hammer test the next time I shutdown the machine.
 
4:54 AM
And in case somebody wants to try it out:
 
1. The placement new memsets happen *before* any computation takes place.
2. The unit tests manually do another (one large) memset before running the test.
3. The failures only happen under specific system-wide load configurations.
IOW, there's no way the placement new's can directly affect the test itself. It seems as though it's affect other test processes running at the same time.
So another thing I might try later is to mix test binaries with and without placement new's.
Only the AVX2 binaries ever fail. So I can disable the placement new's in the AVX2 binaries.
And then toggle the placement new's in all the other binaries. If that toggling affects the stability of the AVX2 binaries... lol
 
@Mysticial If I didn't know better (and I don't) I'd wonder if this isn't a matter of insufficient decoupling. When you do a lot of separate writes, you end up doing extra toggling on the power lines, which (in heavy enough usage of the system overall) manages to drain the decoupling capacitors to the point that the memory isn't completely dependable.
 
@JerryCoffin That would be the row hammer.
 
@Mysticial Similar, but not exactly identical.
 
When I ran memtest86 a few weeks ago, I ran it with default settings and I don't recall it doing a row hammer test.
@JerryCoffin True.
I "eliminated" the hardware factor when I did the downclocking tests.
But perhaps row hammer and related problems aren't sensitive to the memory frequency.
 
5:13 AM
@Mysticial The effect I'm thinking of would depend on the access frequency, but (as long as the clock counts were reduced to match, as they usually would be) that wouldn't necessarily be related to the bus frequency. I think row hammer probably works out a little the same way.
 
Two of the sticks in my laptop are Hyundai which is Micron.
Row hammer requires hitting the same row repeatedly. That means sequential access to a large array will hit the same row repeatedly.
The theory here holds up so far.
My other two sticks are G.Skill Ripjaws.
When I did the reduced memory test, I took out the two G.Skill Ripjaw sticks because those are the only ones I could access. The two Hyundai/Micron ones are behind the motherboard which are inaccessible.
The row refresh time on the laptop is 374 cycles. On my 8-core box (also DDR4), it's 313 cycles.
And the memory is clocked higher on my desktop. So the row refresh wall-time is 34% higher on my laptop than my desktop.
My desktop doesn't have this problem.
 
@Mysticial Are they both running at the same voltage? I'd expect a lower voltage to require faster refresh.
 
Hey, is anyone familiar with inverted page tables?
 
5:30 AM
> So the solution is to use force to vaccinate other peoples children? I hate pseudoscience, but I hate attacks on liberty even more.
Muh freedumbs
6
 
@JerryCoffin Yes. 1.2v.
At least I have a new lead now.
I can test the row hammer hypothesis with memtest86 and by manually setting the refresh time.
I have a feeling that manually setting the refresh time is more likely to produce meaningful results since memtest86 doesn't load the CPU and produce the same kind of heat that my code does.
 
I got an email from a recruiter of BMW Munich who liked my SO profile :)
That's the first one I got in months.
 
5:47 AM
Nice. You just started a new job too right?
 
Xeo
6:01 AM
@fredoverflow I don't think I ever got one
 
6:18 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes HN?
 
@Mysticial yes
 
@Mysticial That sounds plausible. And so we've come full circle except that we now know the line which causes the issues :D
 
so, in slingshot maneuvers
how precise do you need to be WRT system plane?
My friend told me that he found some info that inclination correcting maneuvers are generally avoided
I presume that would be the case for say moon missions, because a skewed orbit would still give you a useful periapsis, albeit at a different angle. For longer missions, though, like Voyager, it'd need to be rather precise, no?
 
Ven
6:46 AM
Hi
 
 
1 hour later…
8:07 AM
I like how the lounge is refusing to accept into their lives
 
Ven
OpenCola is a brand of open-source cola, where the instructions for making it are freely available and modifiable. Anybody can make the drink, and anyone can modify and improve on the recipe. The original version 1.0 was released on 27 January 2001. Current version is 1.1.3. Although originally intended as a promotional tool to explain free and open source software, the drink took on a life of its own and 150,000 cans were sold. The Toronto-based company Opencola founded by Grad Conn, Cory Doctorow, and John Henson became better known for the drink than the software it was supposed to promote....
 
The more you read that article, the more hipster it gets
 
@thecoshman meh, still can't use C++14 at work
 
new versions are great and all but useless if adoption takes forever
 
Subnautica is quite a tense game and I'm kind of happy to see the dev team making progress. I really don't expect much from early access games but it's been pleasant so far.
 
Ell
8:20 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, education would be preferable, right?
 
I was referring to the fact the tag isn't in the description yet
 
> The Wartsila, 14 cylinder marine diesel produces 108,920 horsepower at 102 RPM. Averaged over an eight day, photocells produce 1.5 watts per square foot. One horsepower is 747 watts. Calculate the area of solar cells for an ocean freighter, then multiply delivery time by three, for the 'low light idle' periods.
 
woah... I'm surprised this was allowed to stay... picture of a horse mounting a policeman
 
15 millions of m^2 of solar panels
that's ~1500ha or ~3600 acres
to power one container ship
moreover, the total area of earth is only about 510 100 000 km^2
 
@BartekBanachewicz if you launch into the plane of the ecliptic, you don't need a lot of corrections along the way.
However...
 
8:26 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I guess that's easier on Kerbin than on Earth
uegh, welp I fucked up units
earth's area is in km^2
 
Voyager 1 could have been aimed for Pluto, but Titan was prioritised. The maneuver to aim for Titan sent the probe upwards of the ecliptic, too much to correct with fuel onboard, so it didn't visit any other planets.
 
Ven
seen at work:
> const std::string &&blabla = fn();
 
Had Voyager 2 aimed for Pluto (there was enough fuel) the aim point was inside Neptune so it wouldn't actually work :D
But for all the (now) planets, you can encounter with small plane changes.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes mhhmm
(not related to space travel)
> Average over the entire earth = 164 Watts per square meter over a 24 hour day So the entire planet receives 84 Terrawatts of Power our current worldwide consumption is about 12 Terrawatts
all of those figures seem to be super spaced apart
I've seen, in three consecutive articles, 1.5W/sqft, 1000W/msq, 164W/msq
that spans 3 orders of magnitude
 
(Even though Saturn is pretty much on the ecliptic plane, Saturn's ring plane, where Titan orbits, is tilted 27 degrees, hence Voyager 1 having to leave the Solar System upwards)
 
8:35 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes but that still would be very slightly upwards, right
on the distance to Saturn, had it gone at more than 1 degree up it would overshoot waaaay above it
 
@BartekBanachewicz it's enough to have no further possible encounters.
 
space is very empty vOv
 
@BartekBanachewicz if you're going to do capture, you can miss by a lot, because gravity helps out. If you're doing a flyby headed elsewhere yeah, there's a narrower window.
But early corrections are cheap.
 
Sam
Hello guys..!
 
9:13 AM
user image
15
Ominous
 
Ven
9:26 AM
helo
 
9:37 AM
@BartekBanachewicz Not the Solar System, though.
There's a shit ton of objects in a variety of orbits.
But at the time no TNOs other than Pluto were known.
Well, and Charon. However you want to count that.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes cool
 
9:58 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes isn't on escape velocity any way?
 
Ven
Youtube is fucking retarded.
You gain points when you report stuff. As a frenchie... NO.
 
@thecoshman That could change with an encounter.
(Not with any TNO, though; they're too small)
 
@Ven Uprzejmie donoszę...
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes sorry, I read what you said earlier. I thought you were implying that V1 would eventually return got more encounters. Never mind
 
Oh, Oort cloud objects are technically not TNOs. Well, anything outside the ecliptic plane or beyond Neptune is too small.
 
Ven
10:12 AM
N'abuse pas de pastilles (de vichy)
 
> You can use the gcc flag -Wsuggest-final-types and -Wsuggest-final-methods . Compile in -O3 with -flto. Gcc will tell you which classes could be devirtualized if they are marked final.
^ Nice.
 
user1804599
Lol
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes ... that we have seen so far :O
#AlienConspiracy
 
Planet Nine is a hypothetical large planet in the far outer Solar System, the gravitational effects of which would explain the improbable orbital configuration of a group of trans-Neptunian objects (TNOs) that orbit mostly beyond the Kuiper belt. In a 2014 letter to the journal Nature, astronomers Chad Trujillo and Scott S. Sheppard inferred the possible existence of a massive trans-Neptunian planet from similarities in the orbits of the distant trans-Neptunian objects Sedna and 2012 VP113. On 20 January 2016, researchers Konstantin Batygin and Michael E. Brown at Caltech explained how a massive...
:(
My abuse of initializer_lists as "type-erased static arrays" doesn't seem to work well.
Fuck you, clang.
 
10:38 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes that's just a statistically there planet though last I knew...
> Brown thinks that if Planet Nine is confirmed to exist, a probe could reach it in as little as 20 years, with a powered slingshot around the Sun.
that would be epic
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes do you mean pluto? :D
 
std::is_lvalue_reference<const int&>::value // true
I am actually happy about this.
I thought I'd have to strip CV qualifiers.
 
@orlp ¬_¬
oh oh oh, I've learnt me some so fine Port talk @R.MartinhoFernandes
 
> note: pointer to subobject of temporary is not a constant expression
 
I know 'boiola' and 'foda-se' :D
 
10:54 AM
Second one is good.
First one is more Brazilian, I think.
 
probably, I learnt it from brazies
 
I'd use "panilas" or "paneleiro".
 
which one is for a girl?
 
(Literally "cooking pot maker")
 
oh...
is that an insult in normal use?
 
10:55 AM
@thecoshman It's basically "faggot".
 
lol
 
(Not the bundle of sticks kind)
 
panilas would be the feminine form right?
 
No, just a slangier form.
 
ah
said like: panny lear oh?
 
10:56 AM
Pluralizing words can be used to make them genderless. Just realized this.
 
strange...
 
@thecoshman -lush
 
panny lush
the second one I'm trying to say
 
Well, a bit more involved than. Pluralizing and using as singular.
This is pretty widely applicable, in fact.
(Colloquial use only, but still)
 
panny lush
time to practice :D
 
10:59 AM
@thecoshman I guess puh-NEE-lush is closer.
 
> The lesson here is that enumerating over a NULL-terminates list of strings is a damn common pattern in C. The way you do it should look like the same way that everybody does it,
I seriously expected that way to be while(*p++) or something.
Ok, I see now why that's not the way.
for(p = str; *p; ++p), I guess.
 
That must be a Portuguese thing... Rather than Brazilian
 
11:37 AM
Faggot
2
 
Yeah, Brazilians use different words. I know "boiola" (no other meaning) and "veado" (deer).
Cultural dissemination is asymmetric, so Brazilians are less familiar with Portuguese idioms than vice-versa.
 
Yeah, I know boiola 😁
 
@Ell I don't think that's enough because knowing the facts alone doesn't lead to the "right" choice; it's a matter of ethics.
And the "greater good" result relies on massive cooperation.
The reason for my mockery is that you can't frame this question in terms of your freedom alone. By choosing against vaccination, you're affecting the freedom of others (e.g. another kid can't go to school because he can't be vaccinated and as such will be in a high risk environment, which you made risky by making that choice).
I'd argue it's ok to exercise that freedom knowing that it will cost you the freedom to go to school, i.e. enforce mandatory vaccination in schools. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
(And for clarity, the missing context for that quote is about mandatory vaccination in schools)
 
11:54 AM
ruby -e 'a=0.000001; (1..10000).each { sleep a; a = [a*1.01,1].min; puts "#{a}"; }'
^ Exponential backoff is fun to watch.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes: youtube.com/watch?v=bn9elWR13Z4
 
hello
 
^ This is how I view meaning of words, i.e., strictly.
 
Yeah, that's unrealistic vOv.
Also, what. He's complaining about pronunciation.
That's stupid. He's the one who need look shit up.
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes I agree
 
Ven
11:58 AM
@StackedCrooked to each their own as they say
 
@wilx Anyway, you say "strictly", I say "arbitrarily".
The people who make those "mistakes" make them consistently. They are strict in their usage too.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It seems in the US you don't have the rule that says it's acceptable to forgo individual liberties if it's for the safety of people around you (iow, people wander the streets with guns)
 
exponentially, that is.
 

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