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6:00 PM
I need a new gamepad
the Y button on this one is borked
it did last me 6 years so I cannot complain :D
 
ugh 4 euro for renting a movie
or 10 to buy it
 
thats pretty expensive
 
iTunes right
 
user406009
You don't have those vending machines near supermarkets?
 
I don't a bluray player
 
6:02 PM
@Lalaland You don't words do you?
 
user406009
@Borgleader Didn't get enough sleep today.
 
bartek bro google
<movie title here> 1080p torrent
 
user406009
I guess it's sorta what I deserve for saying "just one more episode" like 4 times last night.
 
Or just use Strike Search
 
$4/$12 on mazon
so pretty much the same
@AlexM. I don't want to pirate movies anymore :/
 
6:04 PM
I'm ok with paying for cinema because it's a different experience
 
@BartekBanachewicz You gotta do what'cha gotta do
 
user406009
In the US we have these nice DVD rental machines at supermarkets.
 
it's pretty lot for a movie
 
user406009
It's like 1$ per movie.
 
why is there no humble bundle for movies
 
6:05 PM
there was one for porn
 
@AlexM. haha wat
 
yeah the porn bundle or sth
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz cheaper than the cinema
 
hump the bundle
 
6:05 PM
steam has movies now, maybe well get steam sales for movies :)
 
top comment
> Probably because movies usually cost a lot more to make.
closes tab.
@Ell it's an old movie come on
 
user406009
Well, movies do cost more money.
 
hump the bundle is still a thing lol
you can get porn there for more expensive than free
 
@Lalaland vs video games? I'd be interested to see some comparison
 
they consider 720p HD as well
 
user406009
6:07 PM
@Borgleader It would really depend on what you mean by "video games".
 
speaking of cinemas just one more month until the new james bond
yay
 
user406009
Indie games are certainly much cheaper.
 
Maybe if gamedevs started publishing budgets and revenues like movie industry
 
user406009
AAA games probably have similar budgets to movies.
 
Humble Bundle doesnt do just indie games though
and thats my point
 
6:07 PM
I've a hard time finding humble bundles with games I do not own :<
 
user406009
Humble Bundle doesn't do AAA though.
 
sadly they lost flavor for me
@Lalaland yea they do, humble EA bundle etc.
 
Ell
they did sims
and cs:go and some other AAA
 
@BartekBanachewicz 720p is HD
 
@Lalaland wrong
 
6:08 PM
1080p is Full HD
 
They did THQ when it was going under :v
 
@Lalaland borderlands was AAA alright
@AnalPhabet uh
 
and they make humble ubishit regularly
god I hate ubishit
the gameloft of PC
 
old Prince of Persia was cool
the WW I mean
 
they have this shitty way of doing everything
as if they just want to insult
they released an unfinished HoMM and by unfinished I mean that they didn't even bother to get their ideas to an end
 
6:11 PM
Rayman is cool.
 
they eventually released M&M X which is a great game like its predecessors but they didn't invest in anything so it's a mess from a technical POV
they released M&M VI on Steam as bonus but didn't bother to give it a banner and icon
 
@Morwenn You know what's cool? Liquid nitrogen is cool
 
they keep Heroes 3 and the rest on GoG just so Steam people can only get Heroes 3 HD
 
@AlexM. lol
 
their bundles are Uplay only
 
6:12 PM
@AnalPhabet So funny ._____.
 
just so bad
it's like they know what everyone wants so they do it differently
 
@Morwenn about as much as his username ;)
 
k chose the source dling
i wonder if i could have a beer
either a beer or a painkiller
i should choose wisely
 
Ell
alcohol and drugs don't tend to mix well
 
6:13 PM
@Borgleader Well, between Anal Phabet, Luc Danton and Mai LongDong, we can feel some kind of orientation.
 
user406009
What's the joke behind Luc's name?
 
@Ell hence either
 
It's some French pun
 
Left Painkiller or Right Beer
hmmmm I want popcorn now
 
6:15 PM
@Lalaland Luc Danton -> Danton Luc -> Danton Cul -> Dans ton cul -> French for « In your ass ».
9
 
are Żabka stores open at sunday
 
i mean now
 
Also yes
 
@Morwenn that's...some leap
 
6:16 PM
let's go then
 
6-22 every day, some longer
 
@melak47 Not really, bad puns with Luc -> Cul are well-known in France.
 
@melak47 Yeah, I didnt make the connection either but apparently its "obvious"
 
Mr. Kbok already mentioned it a few weeks ago.
 
6:18 PM
Oct 24 '12 at 19:07, by Etienne de Martel
@Collin "Dans ton cul".
Slowpokes
 
Aug 26 '13 at 18:45, by Etienne de Martel
@ThePhD It's not his real name. It's a play on "Dans ton cul", which means "In your ass".
Thats when I learned of it
 
PayPal charged my card and apparently greenlighted the transaction but there's no confirmation or mention of it in the history
Ugh
 
in romanian we have a pun on "notre poulle en votre court" because when said it sounds like "our dick in your ass"
 
Aug 13 at 11:52, by Mr. kbok
Mai Long Dong Danton Luc
 
TIL std::owner_less is a thing
 
6:20 PM
I learned about it like yesterday or two days ago too.
Probably in Lawrence Crowl's paper about comparison.
 
owner_less?
 
Whoa.
Kinky.
 
@ThePhD you overuse that word
 
6:25 PM
I do?
 
I dunno. "Kinky" is kinda like my "cool". Like @Rapptz's "neat" I guess.
 
yeah, except neither of those words have completely different pre-existing meanings
 
Don't you have a phrase like that?
 
Ell
Hmm
what are my consumer rights when I buy a pair of shoes and find that after wearing them they don't fit properly? :3
 
6:27 PM
I basically use « stuff » everywhere to mean stuff.
 
Return policy rules.
Consult your store.
 
@Ell you take them back and see if they'll take them but why did you not try them on
 
Ell
I tried them on
 
unless... you got them online
 
@Bartek did you get testing to work? I have a working sample here.
 
6:28 PM
in that case you try to isolate yourself from the rest of the world
 
@Ell None, really. The shoes are not defective.
 
Ell
but it's always different wearing them regular vs walking up and down the aisle in a shop :L
 
however you may find that the retailer you bought them from has a completely separate and entirely voluntary return policy
 
but here taking clothing back because it doesn't fit (+ shoes) is a common thing
 
they'll likely take them back if you haven't ruined them or something
 
Ell
6:29 PM
I will go tomorrow
 
hey folks I have a question which will not fit into the so concept.
 
inb4 it fits even less here
 
but where should i ask it then?
 
the fuck do we care?
that's your problem
 
lol
 
6:30 PM
ur cool
donk
 
did you just fail to call me a dork?
 
you could ask and see if you get answers you know
 
you could, but don't
 
but what if his question was "How can I send Puppy $1.000.000?"
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r You can ask your question here. People will answer if they feel like it.
 
we both know it wasn't
 
user1804599
learn to type first
 
user406009
@Borgleader That title is really misleading.
 
user406009
It was not a normal party. It was a paid event.
 
6:33 PM
@elyse did you have a trait for the square thing?
 
@Lalaland Which he cancelled
 
@Lalaland It was a paid event where the organizer lost money, the tickets cost like $5 or something.
 
:D I have an application which should be extensible by "plugins". When I want to use and pass a class between both of the binaries, do I have to make a third lib an link both of them against the latter?
 
@elyse :) ty ty
 
6:34 PM
ahahahahaa
 
Was this supposed to be English?
 
or how are those cases handled?
 
@JohanLarsson not yet. I'm drinking myself to sleep today
 
Boost.Hana is quite impressive.
 
@ManuelSchneid3r Try inserting your penis
 
user1804599
6:35 PM
If you want a plugin system, you're probably better off using something that doesn't have a brittle fragile linkage system like C++.
 
user1804599
E.g. use Lua or Python or something.
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r Look into dynamic linking. In particular dlload or LoadLibrary on linux.
 
@Borgleader At least the fundraiser is at 3737$
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r I would only provide a C api. I wouldn't try to pass C++ constructs around.
 
user1804599
6:35 PM
If you expose a C++ plugin API, you're going to run into ABI issues sooner or later.
 
user1804599
If you expose a C API, usage of it will be a pain.
 
you failed at timing it
 
user1804599
I.e. use Boost.Python and call it a day.
 
@AnalPhabet Sure, but that doesn't make the whole situation less ridiculous
 
Ell
Why doesn't someone write a thing that wraps a c++ abi into a documented middleman abi?
 
6:36 PM
@Borgleader Yep
 
Ell
if that is possible :P
 
@Ell Why don't you do it :G
 
user1804599
Hmm, ABI proxy.
 
user1804599
Very difficult to achieve.
 
@elyse Only if you don't know how to handle it ;p
 
6:36 PM
A nice idea though
 
Ell
@AnalPhabet I'm busy doing assignment
 
user406009
SWIG sorta does a API proxying.
 
ass ignment
 
@Ell Because it's impossible
 
@Ell lol good luck with that
@Ell no
 
Ell
6:37 PM
@Puppy How come?
 
how come?
 
Ell
why is it impossible?
 
because a shitload of the ABI occurs at compilation time, that's how come.
there's nothing you can do that will make an Itanium vtable an MSVC vtable.
they're completely incompatible.
 
Ell
Right, I mean at compile time
err well
I mean half compile time half run time
 
@elyse but this could be avoided by PIMPL, could it?
 
Ell
6:38 PM
at compile time the proxy ABI is written
at runtime the proxy ABI is read
 
you mean like a "conversion layer" ?
 
You could generate functions with a universal signature that call functions with arbitrary ABIs
 
the dpointer stuff
 
@Ell And what happens if you pass a pointer to the class between two functions that use different ABIs?
 
@BartekBanachewicz here is a minimal sample showing inline and in tests directory.
 
Ell
6:40 PM
@Puppy idk man I haven't thought this through yet :P
I only suggested it 5 mins ago
and I followed it with "if it's possible"
 
well, it's completely impossible and cannot ever be done.
and that's pretty much that.
 
You'd have to basically write something that converts one representation into another....
But, that means understanding the compiled executable, doesn't it?
 
all you can do is have the compiler understand more than one ABI and then have each type have one dedicated ABI.
but that's not really the same thing.
 
user1804599
You can't do it.
 
user1804599
Type erasure breaks all of it.
 
6:42 PM
type erasure is irrelevant, at the ABI level.
 
Xeo
Hey @R.MartinhoFernandes, seen this?
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r Everybody pretty much uses C api's for extension type things.
 
user406009
Sure, you could theoretically make it work with C++.
 
user406009
But the C ABI is just so much better.
 
it's not so much better at all
it's merely more widespread.
 
6:44 PM
It's widespread and technically easier to understand? I guess.
I would imagine writing a C++ ABI loader is borderline nightmarish.
 
> I'm widespread and technically easier to understand? I guess.
 
not really.
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r You can still use C++ on both ends. Just keep the API between the two a C api.
 
it's mostly when exceptions enter the system that problems arise.
the rest of the ABI is really not that tough at all.
 
@Lalaland void * super_function(void *)
 
6:47 PM
Do clang++ and g++ have the same ABI?
 
AFAIK yes
 
user406009
@ThePhD Depends on the platform.
 
user406009
Linux follows the Itanium ABI.
 
Assuming relevant platform details are the same.
@BartekBanachewicz You forgot the time.
 
user406009
6:47 PM
clang and gcc probably have different stories for Windows.
 
Why does it make a difference if the api is c or c++? And what exactly is the differnece
 
Name mangling (or lack thereof)
 
@ManuelSchneid3r ABI, not API
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r C++ has a much more complicated ABI.
 
user406009
6:51 PM
Especially if you start passing around standard library classes such as std::strings.
 
@BartekBanachewicz First time seeing that?
 
Would it have been possible for the C++ standard to define the ABI as well?
 
@AnalPhabet lel
 
@ManuelSchneid3r Google ABI.
@Borgleader That's pretty much not the language's concern.
 
Yeah, the ABI is... well, a binary interface.
It's supposed to interface with the machine.
 
6:53 PM
I read somwhere that the abi will be extensible/backward compatible as long as I use pimpl and only add functions to the end.
 
@ElimGarak I didnt ask if it should have, only if it could have
 
It probably could have.
But then it probably would have also been a trainwreck.
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r Just make sure you don't pass around stuff like std::string as well.
 
whats the problem with strings?
 
And make sure you never upgrade your compiler either
ABI compatibility in C++ is extremely hard thing to do
 
6:56 PM
I wonder at what level people would want ABI compatibility.
 
Naturally, a lot of things the C++ standard could envelop. Even recipes for cookies. It is primarily a matter of should or not, rather than could or not.
 
P much the only way is to only expose C-compatible ABI
 
Between same compilers on the same platform?
Between different compilers on the same platform?
 
And enforcing it would be a whole 'nother level of hell.
 
user406009
@ManuelSchneid3r The format of std::string can change between compiler versions.
 
6:56 PM
libstdc++ has done an amazing job of not breaking its ABI too much for GCC 5.0.
 
Which is why you still had COW strings until the latest g++, believe?
 
yeah, they didn't implement that as soon as they could have done to preserve ABI
 
okay thanks. but thats not a problem since I will ship app and libs in a bundle. its more the fact that there will be some functionalities that users want to disable.
 
@Puppy No, I mean that they kept the old symbols so that stuff compiled with GCC 4.9 still links.
 
this way it should not be a problem, should it?
 
user406009
6:58 PM
Oh. If you control the compilation of all sides, then the ABI compatibility isn't an issue.
 
If... that's the case, then just rebuild the app, ship it again, and then everything's fine? There's no ABI issues if you control the code and libs...
 
@Morwenn That sounds terrible. You don't want it to link if it has binary incompatibilities.
 
ABIs only a problem when you're trying to link against something that's already compiled...
 
user1804599
More fun: you're gonna be screwed again the next time ABIs need to be changed to accommodate new C++ features.
 
user1804599
Just use Python for your plugins.
 
6:59 PM
@Puppy I don't know what they did exactly, but what I had compiled with GCC 4.9 still links and still works (with GCC 5.2).
 
but to the first question. If I have a bunch of extensions and the app all using the same class (some sort of helper utility) do I have to make a lib and link it to all extensions?
 

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