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6:01 PM
Three-draft-chapters from Scott's blog should help me wait for Modern Effective C++.
 
ewww; I'm so horrible at marking stuff noexecept
I usually simply forget
 
@FredOverflow I get a bunch of alerts on that blog because whatever lib he uses for syntax highlighting decided that using alert for error reporting was a reasonable thing to do.
 
@FredOverflow They're all articles from the robot's blog so if you've been awake in here you've already read them.
 
did he credit him?
 
they're linked right to his blog
 
6:08 PM
who is the best programmer in this room?
 
I am obviously
 
private:
    Foo() = default; // will constructor be private?
 
yes of course it will be
changing accessibility without changing semantics is practically the point of = default;.
 
no
~Foo() references ~Base() which is private.
 
6:11 PM
Ah, clang generates an error.
 
ah yeah and the same problem for the default constructor of course
 
Xeo
Hey Puppy, I got a question
You have lambdas-returning-optionals as lists / streams, right?
 
@CatPlusPlus rofl; this gargoyle fighter has been extremely easy so far
 
When would you choose boost::any over shared_ptr<void>?
 
6:14 PM
Worship Okawaru
He gives melee boosts and weapon/armour gifts
Fight things one-on-one in corridors
 
Xeo
@StackedCrooked Different semantics. One is shared, the other not. :P Also, any is more 'type-safe' due to storing the typeid
 
Train Maces to 16, then some Armour/Dodging/Fighting
 
Xeo
If I could, I'd stay away from both though
 
If you want to keep using shields, you eventually need 15 Shields to use the regular shield with no penalty (you'll probably find a good 2h mace by then though)
 
@Xeo Yep.
 
6:17 PM
Also train Invo to 10 for Okawaru powers
Also, playing online?
 
Xeo
@DeadMG How would you represent an empty list-of-lists?
I mean, type-wise
 
not sure what Invo is; I have leveled up twice so far; put one point into strength
 
return none;
ah.
 
Invocations
 
Xeo
Seems kinda difficult without polymorphic values
 
6:18 PM
haven't been offered this option yet; but I will, thanks
 
You'll see it on the skill list (m) once you find an altar
 
well, that would be a function returning optional<std::function<optional<T>()>> which returns none when first invoked.
 
Well, once you join the religion
 
but the std::function can be any callable.
it's just easier to express using std::function.
 
If you're playing WebTiles I can peek and give you horrible situational advice that will get you killed
 
6:19 PM
and frankly if you're gonna return none first time it doesn't matter anyway what the type is since you'll never construct it.
 
Xeo
@DeadMG Sure, but you can't have a simple nil value (akin to [] in Haskell)
@DeadMG It does matter for matching types (in my case it's about concat(nil))
which should result in simply nil again, but the types are throwing bricks at me
since concat :: [[a]] -> [a] and nil would be [a] where a could not change like it can in Haskell
 
@DeadMG I didn't know Robot had a blog :)
 
Xeo
@FredOverflow ... have you been living under a rock at the bottom of the sea?
 
I'm not a lobster. @rightfold used to be one. Maybe he can share with us tales of that experience :)
 
Xeo
Right, since Patrick is a starfish
 
6:24 PM
don't really see why not.
 
user1804599
Fredrick.
 
right, excuse me, my Internet dropped out twice
let me just read what you've written
@Xeo Yes, you'd have to have an empty range of some T.
e.g. empty<int>, empty<callable<optional<int>>>, etc.
 
Xeo
Yeah
 
@DeadMG Why would the robot post drafts from Effective Modern C++ on his blog? I think you are confusing this with something else.
 
C++ certainly can't do better
@FredOverflow He isn't. The articles in MEC++ are based on the robot's blog posts. The links from Meyers' post all lead back to the robot's blog.
and I don't know if Wide can, it might be able to but not sure.
oh wait
ignore me, because I totally didn't actually check the links you posted.
if you just load Meyers's blog, the top entry is three links to the robot's blog.
 
6:28 PM
That makes sense.
 
hence my confusion
 
Xeo
meh, I fucked up somewhere. concat(singleton(nil)) (aka concat [[]]) doesn't halt.
 
(allowing curiosity to lead me on a search for this mysterious robot's blog)
 
4 mins ago, by DeadMG
if you just load Meyers's blog, the top entry is three links to the robot's blog.
 
Xeo
6:33 PM
or you could just link to flamingdangerzone.com
 
yeah, but that didn't carry a minor "I already told you this" vibe.
 
Xeo
hm... actually, I think I could make nil work as an empty-list-for-everything
The element type just needs to be something that will always evaluate to false but still allows dereference in decltype (which is where it's currently dying in my case)
and that dereference just has to return that type itself
 
what, like have nil be an empty list of nil?
 
Xeo
no, it's just an empty list. but the interface gives the illusion of it being any kind of nested list
although I'll admit that it's just a band-aid fix for that particular issue
 
struct nil_t { std::optional<nil_t()> operator()() { return std::none; } }; static const auto nil = nil_t();.
 
6:41 PM
 
part of std::optional
 
Xeo
@DeadMG optional<nil_t> you mean?
 
which is now std::experimental::optional or someshit like that
@Xeo Almost certainly.
 
Xeo
Still, too bad that fixes only that particular issue
still doesn't make the element type, say, printable. Or part of anything else.
you really need polymorphic values to do this properly
 
what even is a polymorphic value
 
Xeo
6:44 PM
Nothing :: Maybe a is a Nothing value for all possible types a.
 
ah yeah that stuff.
ISTR deciding that it was mostly unfeasible when interacting with OR
 
Xeo
particularly construction / assignment
 
hmm
rebuilding my analyzer for incremental re-analysis and delayed codegen is a bitch.
 
hello folks
hmm, coliru not running gcc 4.9 yet
 
user1804599
7:01 PM
LiveScript <- is nice.
 
I'm not sure I understand what's particularly better in python compared to ruby really
performance is basically the same in ruby 1.9
language wise, yes, in ruby you have redundant methods
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey Python people usually don’t fuck around with classes that aren’t theirs.
 
I'm talking about the language :)
not the people that use it
 
user1804599
x <- (x) -> x
 
user1804599
Lol, that syntax.
 
user1804599
Heh, this can lead to funky control flow.
 
someone edited my answer... not too fond of it =/
is there a revert change button?
 
@Borgleader Rollback?
 
yes thank you
didnt notice it
 
fuck me, I wish Haskell support was much better
I really feel the urge to write some haskell
 
7:18 PM
@Jefffrey It's not a clusterfuck of terrible design decisions
 
@CatPlusPlus what terrible design decisions are you talking about?
 
And also has a community that's generally more competent and less HO MY GOD THIS IS SO PWEETTTY
Open classes, manual modules and file-based requires, sigils and optional parens, redundant syntax that serves no purpose other than ~~it's prettier~ (if/unless, &&/and etc), Perl-style qualified statements (X unless Y), magic variables, horrible scoping rules wrt blocks (return inside a blocks returns from the outer function :laffo:), implicit returns but still has statements
I'm probably missing a few
But that's from the top of my head :v
 
do you like F#?
 
Haven't really tried
I'm kinda meh about OCaml
Also fucking Facebook doesn't allow localhost to be in app domains in dev mode
Eat shit Facebook
 
so it is really good!
 
7:26 PM
It's supposedly nice for DSLs
 
user1804599
Woohoo.
 
user1804599
module.exports = class
    ({@name}) !->
 
Alright, FFS.
 
user1804599
Most cryptic code ever. \o/
 
I'll drop ruby.
 
7:27 PM
:lol:
 
Any Python book will do? Any suggestions?
 
I only ever did the official tutorial
 
user1804599
Ruby: where requiring a module that ships with the stdlib changes how integer division works everywhere. http://t.co/pa2rgfNytH
 
user1804599
@Jefffrey You don’t learn Python from a book. You just code and ship it.
 
I'm slowly losing my identity. I once liked PHP, then loved Ruby, then liked C++. Now I hate everything except Haskell and Python (I guess).
 
user1804599
7:29 PM
Python is called Python because even creatures as dumb as pythons can learn it (although I must admit pythons are smarter than most humans).
 
PHP.. what does it mean
PHP... sounds like an emergency station somehow
 
user1804599
Pretty Horrible Programming
 
PHP Hurts Puppies
 
user1804599
That’d be a huge reason to use PHP.
 
user1804599
Unless PHP Hurts Pussies too. :'(
 
7:33 PM
Meany!
 
user1804599
But then again I’d hurt pussies too.
 
user1804599
Beh.
 
Peerless Horror Potential.
 
user1804599
I have only two tests and they already take 8ms.
 
user1804599
Fuck Nodeunit.
 
7:41 PM
Oh no 8ms
@rightfold Ahaha "Crazy, but interesting that Ruby has rational number support"
rubyprogrammers.txt
Also those idiots trying to compare it to Python's __future__ :allears:
From better news, I made a complete Puppet config for a project VM and it works :toot:
 
user1804599
What is Puppet?
 
> Programming is essentially all problem solving. You have a problem and you break it into smaller problems. You break the problem down enough until you have something you can Google. Then you put all of the pieces together and you have a program. Then the program doesn't work and you have to figure out why. That is programming.
Finally something sensible on gamedev :)
 
Configuration management. Describing state of a computer in code and then just executing it
Packages, config files, services, cron jobs etc
 
user1804599
Sounds cool.
 
It's crazy
 
7:48 PM
Oh. My. Fucking. God. Scott Meyers sent me his draft on move semantics. And he replied in German :) What an awesome guy!
 
Facebook has 10000+ servers managed by like 4 people
I'd never reply in German
 
user1804599
I am unable to reply in German.
 
(Though Facebook uses Chef; I think I'm liking Puppet more though)
 
It's super great with Vagrant
You get identical dev environments, and then just apply the same state on staging and then in production
 
7:49 PM
He says he has never seen a stackoverflow answer with 630 upvotes (or more). Apparently, he doesn't spend much time on stackoverflow :)
 
And you've got identical environments everywhere
I love automation
 
0
Q: calling super method from unrelated method

FredOverflowToday I realized that calling super.foo() is possible not only inside an overriding foo method, but also inside completely unrelated methods: class Base { void foo() { } } class Derived extends Base { void foo() { } void bar() { super.foo(); } } ...

Another Java question of mine that is destined to go unanswered? :(
 
Automation is computers at their finest
Fuck shitty ~~perforemance~~ and PATTERNS code, let's make things happen
 
user1804599
lol
 
user1804599
x = true
! = x
assert(x === false)
 
7:52 PM
With Packer you can go one step backwards and automate OS installation into VM images
You can literally automate entire node configuration, from metal to application
Hell, with some netbooting you could probably do it on the bare metal, too
Generalisation of WDS and shit
 
user1804599
I should also automate more stuff at work.
 
Yesss
I'm spearheading Project Automation in my company
Automate fucking everything
 
user1804599
Deployment now involves running rake dist, uploading it to the server using scp, SSHing into the server, running tar xf and then swapping directories. :v
 
user1804599
Manually. :v
 
Yeah you're doing it wrong :v
 
user1804599
7:56 PM
I know. :v
 
Though at least you have a consistent procedure
 
user1804599
Not a production environment yet, luckily.
 
user1804599
But it costs too much time.
 
We have some of that and some of remote git clones
I'm implementing Fabric
 
@FredOverflow do a regex search in the java libs' sources; chances are you might find some usage of that feature
 
user1804599
7:58 PM
@CatPlusPlus What’s that?
 
user1804599
Also, Rake is horrible. I need something better for invoking lessc, coffee, tsc and phpunit. c:
 
Fabric can do that too
Though for compilers you're probably better off with an actual build engine, like ninja
 
user1804599
@CatPlusPlus Yeah.
 
user1804599
I could generate the Ninja files using CoffeeScript, PHP or TypeScript, since we already use that anyway.
 
user1804599
8:03 PM
I used Ninja once before for a C++ project and I liked it.
 
It's probably the best build engine right now
It still lacks a good build system on top of it though
 
lol...
 
almost 100
 
user1804599
8:20 PM
Is it possible to have Ninja automatically do mkdir -p in the build directory?
 
user1804599
So that build $builddir/static/js/portals.coffee.js: coffee static/js/portals.coffee automatically creates $builddir/static/js if it doesn’t yet exist.
 
user1804599
I could prepend mkdir -p … && before the command. :v
 
@AlexM. I don't think that's expressible as a regex.
But if you're up to it, please share your results.
 
user3010322
@ScarletAmaranth I'm not sure what you mean by "AO", if you mean just regular Antialiasing methods I get decent results with a 2x2 antialias of either grid, jittered, random, or rotated
 
user3010322
To ensure the results stay good, for every pixel I call multisampler.shift(), which doesn't necessarily recompute the values but shuffles them around so the offsets are applied differently to the sub-pixel rays.
 
user3010322
8:27 PM
Saves computation, and avoids per-pixel patterns. Or, at least it does for my simple scenes.
 
oh hey thephd, haven't seen you in a while
 
> The world needs another language like it needs another hole in the head. - Anders Hejlsberg
 
@FredOverflow my idea was searching for "super.something(" with "something" as captured match where the match was not made inside a "something { ... }" block; now that you mention it it seems impossible yeah
but that may also be because I don't know how to regex properly
 
Why can I not get the simplest of things done in Linux like installing Foxit reader, even though I follow the instructions precisely?
 
8:33 PM
because Linux.
 
I did sudo dpkg -i FoxitReader_1.1.0_i386.deb, and the output looks promising, and I even get an entry in the start menu.
But when I click it... nothing happens :(
 
they're too busy being cool to make anything actually work.
 
Blah blah blah
 
did you take longer than 3 seconds to do that sudo dpkg thing?
 
How do I start foxit reader from the terminal? foxit doesn't work, and tabbing show no options.
 
8:33 PM
Why would you want to use Foxit ever on any system
 
if you take too long to give it a command, linux senses you are undecided and thinks you're afraid
 
@CatPlusPlus Because apparently, I can use it to annotate PDFs.
@AlexM. I don't remember exactly how long it took... maybe 5 seconds, dunno.
 
$ FoxitReader Aufgabenblatt04.pdf
bash: /usr/bin/FoxitReader: Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden
FUCK THIS SHIT
 
Yeah who uses non-English locale
 
8:35 PM
@FredOverflow that's definitely something to put you on the linux blacklist
 
@AlexM. Why?
 
your linux totally sensed you are not assertive enough
and decided to stop calling you his master
 
I make the system my bitch with sudo.
 
just kidding here you know by
2 mins ago, by Alex M.
did you take longer than 3 seconds to do that sudo dpkg thing?
I meant the time it took for you to press enter
 
Why would pressing Enter take more than 3 seconds?
It takes about 0.1 seconds usually.
 
8:37 PM
it takes way longer when you're afraid
 
oh
I just copy/pasted that from a website :)
 
@foxit I use it because it's faster than adobe's reader and google chrome doesn't remember the page I was on when closing the document
otherwise, I'd just use google chrome to view pdfs
 
ls -l /usr/bin/FoxitReader ?
 
I still don't know what that error means
 
$ ls -l /usr/bin/FoxitReader
-rwxr-xr-x 1 homer homer 3979676 Aug 10  2009 /usr/bin/FoxitReader
 
8:40 PM
I'll guess and say you've installed 32-bit thing on non-multilib 64-bit OS
Which is the default for an OS where everything in the base repos can be compiled to 64-bit without an issue
 
@CatPlusPlus That makes sense, i386 sure sounds like 32 bit.
 
Yes
Do ldd /usr/bin/FoxitReader
 
> It should perhaps be noted that the 1.1 version of FoxitReader, which is the one for which 32-bit binaries are available (June 2011), does not have the annotation features of the current Windows version which is version 5.0. You are limited to viewing the pdf, copying text and making an image of the pdf which you can do with other native Linux pdf readers.
 
one should name classes Fuu and not Foo
 
Why on earth would somebody release a 5.0 version for Windows but only a 1.1 version for Linux?!?
> So I have recently watched several videos on C++. I understand the basics, but how can I apply this into developing a game?
> Let me help put that into perspective for you... You've just watched several videos on how to use a hammer, and now want to build your own home.
 
8:53 PM
True story
 
user1804599
Hmm, fuck.
 
user1804599
The mkdir -p command probably doesn’t work on Windows.
 
user1804599
Or does Windows’ mkdir support -p?
 
Windows has mkdir?
 
user1804599
I have no idea as I have zero experience with Windows.
 
8:58 PM
@rightfold It's default
 
Windows has md.
 
md is mkdir
 
user1804599
Oh well, I’ll see when my colleague tries to invoke ninja. :P
 
user1804599
Huh, wait.
 
user1804599
Ninja does create directories implicitly.
 

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