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5:00 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Perhaps nobody talks to you from there.
Or starts events
 
ok, it seems the wrong place to ask. Sorry guys/girls
 
@HamZa If it's not clear, you can be in a room without having it open in your browser.
 
But if what you say is correct, I'd call it a bug.
 
5:01 PM
You should probably waste your time filing it on meta to never see it fixed.
 
@HamZa Ensure you click "leave" rather than simply closing your browser tab. Though I'd still expect a timeout...
 
I'm positively sure that I click "leave". This isn't the first time that I get those pings :)
Anyways, entering here from time to time isn't that bad
 
JBL
Mmh, I'd like to ask for a quick confirmation: this is UB right? (capturing by ref a local and calling the lambda outside the scope of this local).
 
So. I think it's clear that the majority think (a) is undesired, and (b) shouldn't even be there as it conflicts with the rules on the wiki-or-whatever-it-is.
 
Oh, that's just great kerning, not a ligature.
Neat.
 
One question that was perhaps missing in the poll is what % thinks the binnings are fun.
 
Isn't it supposed to start in 6 minutes?
 
@JBL Definitely
 
@JBL Looks like very much UB
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix That was nine minutes ago.
 
5:03 PM
I don't get the room event.
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix I noticed that. But the room info page admits it started
 
as for the thing, I think what really matters is not much what the questions is, but how it is asked
4
 
C++ room people are already here, other rooms are irrelevant.
 
JBL
@AndyProwl Ok thanks, I suspected that but I'm quite a newbie when it comes to lambdas :(
 
@JBL I'd say so. The ref capture doesn't expand the lifetime of the local. It couldn't
 
5:04 PM
Ah right then
 
@JohanLarsson That's next week's
 
My opinion: try to be nicer, some questions.
 
Now discussing question asking policy. Flame away.
 
@AndyProwl star yes, maybe add the number of times / time period it was asked
 
I think that the room is OK as it is
 
JBL
5:05 PM
Also, I couldn't find a way to be sure that this was the case where "gone out of scope variable but memory still sitting there".
 
Nobody seemed to think we should become a chat version of SO, which is no surprise. There was general agreement that simply instabinning and then being a twat is not called for.
 
Xeo
@Lightness, can you copy-pasta my 'other' answer to the first question?
 
if someone wanna be nicer then just be nice.
 
How... nice... of you.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum But how do you define "some"? The point IMO is that we should allow all questions, even stupid ones, as long as they are asked politely and the asker doesn't feel like we have to answer
 
5:06 PM
Well I guess it makes sense, you don't want Lounge<C++> to become the indian support team of SO
no offense to indians btw
 
@Xeo It's in the "Results" link, or should be
 
we're not indians
don't offend us
 
@AndyProwl nothing like "how do I code a game in C++". Questions like "why was std::shared_ptr designed to act like ..." are welcome. Anything that is a google query away is a waste of peoples' time.
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix sir,,,none taken!!
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix exactly.
 
5:07 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum just answer "sorry, this is not the place for such questions"
 
Xeo
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I'm on touch, so copy-pastaing is annoying
 
> If on-topic on SO, redirect. Otherwise, ignore if you have no intent to answer the question.
 
Xeo
@LightnessRacesinOrbit ye, thanks
 
7 hours ago, by Cat Plus Plus
I didn't fill the form, and I'm too lazy so here's my answers: as long as it doesn't devolve into a boring helpdesk session (get a fucking room), or the poster isn't complete shit, I don't care; no questions, unless you're contributing and not whining etc; ditto; ban everyone (if you can't take the culture, :frogout: immediately); never forget Lounge<Vlad>
 
5:08 PM
@AndyProwl this is what I meant by 'not allowed', I'm against flagging people who ask questions, it's unreasonable to expect everyone to read the rules the first time around and we don't want to be assholes.
 
JBL
@doug65536 How so? It's capturing by copy, but a copy of what? (when called outside).
 
No, it's not unreasonable to expect people to read the rules
 
@JBL copy of myLocal
 
@CatPlusPlus have you read the rules in StackOverflow before you answered?
 
"I swear officer I didn't know you couldn't murder people"
 
5:09 PM
@JBL the capture happens at instantiation, not at call
 
JBL
@doug65536 Yes. And you call the lambda outside of the scope of myLocal. Same question, it takes a copy of what ?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Oh okay. So by copy, it would actually works (thanks @doug65536)
 
(otherwise it would be totally useless as a feature)
 
@CatPlusPlus solid analogy v0v
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum ok, then. By "allowed" I meant "not binned", "not gtfo'd". I didn't actually mean that all questions should be answered. In fact, I think there is no such a duty for any question. But we should behave politely to all newcomers unless they do show a rude attitude.
 
@Abyx can be tricky to be nice post-bin
 
5:09 PM
@CatPlusPlus Murder is illegal just about everywhere. This room's rules are not only surprising but generally unique
 
JBL
@LightnessRacesinOrbit :)
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I don't remember; even if I didn't I a) have experience with shit like this b) was not exempt from the law just because I didn't read it
 
@JBL std::oops
 
@AndyProwl I'm for that, but I think it's not my place (and maybe not yours) to decide on that for people like @CatPlusPlus @LightnessRacesinOrbit or @TonyTheLion who're here much longer. Binning is rude but it's not nearly as bad as 'gtfo'
 
Btw I also believe repeating a question that received no attention is not necessarily a rude attitude. Repeating a question after someone said "please not now" or "we don't know how to help you, sorry" is rude attitude and we can release the puppy.
 
5:10 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit What I meant is that ignorance of the law is not an excuse for breaking it
 
@CatPlusPlus Thing is, the rules do not say no questions are allowed, and a majority in the poll agree with this assessment.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum much lounger, ftfy
 
I was addressing only "you can't expect people to read the rules" thing
 
@CatPlusPlus I don't disagree with that inherently. But there are different levels of punishment.
 
Xeo
@AndyProwl dunno, giving any attention might spawn the 'plsplsplsdoit' behaviour
 
5:11 PM
@AndyProwl "growl"
 
Whatever the rules are, you need to fucking know them or you have no right to whine when you get punished for not following them
 
JBL
AndyGrowl.
 
@AndyProwl It is rude if the original is still on my screen!
 
@CatPlusPlus yeah, but then again you don't really make laws. You make guidelines. StackOverflow make the rules, you can make polite suggestions and ask people to provide them.
 
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes screens, you mean
 
5:12 PM
@CatPlusPlus Do noobs even read the rules?
 
@Xeo I don't span chat across screens o_O
 
Xeo
and to be extra mean, you have them all vertically on top of each other, right?
 
@Xeo That would trigger binning if it's from the same guy. If it's someone new entering the chat, just answer the same. It doesn't take much. One sentence, maximum 2
 
@CatPlusPlus meh as if anyone did read the rules
 
How to focus on learning C++ ? What did you do ? Read books ? Online tutorials ? Close all chatroom tabs ?
 
5:12 PM
That's why not being able to ban people is crap
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix whatever ... US/Europe company even wants to hire them ... ;)
 
@HamZa Yes
 
@CatPlusPlus IIRC you wrote them but did you read'em?
 
I wrote the asking questions thing
 
@CatPlusPlus you can't ban?
 
5:13 PM
@DeadMG what is the reason for the insta bins btw?
 
cause noobs
 
Ok, Cat didn't read the rules. Go ahead and build an argument out of that now.
 
and puppy don't go well together
 
Here's an idea
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's questionable. Perhaps you perceive it as rude, IMO it is equally rude to avoid answering when someone asks a question.
 
5:13 PM
Create a room "Lounge<C++> Questions"
 
@TonyTheLion ignoring could be an option
 
Cat doesn't need to read the rules, he got how it works here before there was ever any rules
 
@CatPlusPlus "Cruel and unusual punishment" is a thing. Your conclusion is overly simplistic.
 
@HamZa please don't learn C++. thank you.
 
@JBL Just write a type that writes "goodbye cruel world!" in its destructor. Then you can always tell for sure when an object dies.
 
Xeo
5:14 PM
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix that experiment failed. twice.
 
asking once has to be fine. pressing the issue and demanding answers is where it crosses the line, imho
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix Tried. Failed.
 
I don't really understand the problem. It's been said, many times by many, that there is another place for technical questions. Questions have been dumped here because nobody answered on SO after four minutes.
I would not like to see an infestation of trolls like 'pacman guy'.
 
@Xeo how?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I don't care about the binning either way vOv
 
5:14 PM
@Abyx lol, reason ?
 
Xeo
ded
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix No one was there.
 
@HamZa because you can't.
 
Personally cba
 
any userXXXXXX should be instabinned
 
5:15 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes and the room got closed?
 
Unless it really devolves into boring helpdesk session with the person being utterly stupid
 
they, by long term experience are 98% of the time, trolls
 
room rules say something along the lines of "we'll answer if we feel like it" which is perfect
 
@CatPlusPlus My main concern is that people go "hur hur " then "hur hur read the rules you deserve this because you didn't read the rules"... but the rules say the opposite of "". What I want to get out of this is choosing one or the other (and I have come to terms with the fact that I am unlikely to successfully push for any further changes)
 
@MartinJames one potential problem could be driving away people that could be fun regs
 
5:15 PM
Again, I wrote that asking question thing
 
@Abyx Telling people you can't on first sight isn't really convincing
 
JBL
@FredOverflow Yep, but in this case I didn't know if I had this because the memory was still there (even after destruction), or because there was another mechanism at work.
 
@doug65536 No, being an owner is about as useless as expecting people to not be stupid
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix Doesn't matter. Closed or empty, same difference.
 
@JohanLarsson Yeah it's hard to imagine anyone first coming here with something other than a question, frankly
 
5:15 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I think the no-questions tag was put there because certain trolls didn't get the point
 
@JohanLarsson Heh - there is that, but you have to be in the mood for it.
 
but it can easily be removed
 
JBL
@FredOverflow I'd like to find some way of checking it's actually the first case (and then UB) and not the second.
 
@JBL If a destructor is called, the object is gone. Don't look at memory, it won't tell you anything.
 
so I finally home... we can start over in a bit once I have my hot chocolate
 
5:16 PM
@TonyTheLion So because trolls didn't get the point, you put up a lying tag and started punishing people for ignoring it? That's ... somewhat hypocritical.
 
@HamZa just don't touch our C++, ok?
 
@JohanLarsson If you get driven away by that then you didn't lurk and you probably wouldn't be fun regular
 
@CatPlusPlus I'll happily take your place if you feel useless ;)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I didn't put up the tag, but I make no claim on hypocrisy in this Lounge.
 
We get new regulars regularly
 
5:17 PM
@TonyTheLion :)
 
It's literally not a problem
 
@CatPlusPlus hard to know imo
 
@CatPlusPlus Not really
 
@Abyx not funny, not sure what's your goal: trolling or really giving advice
 
JBL
@FredOverflow I know! But here, I knew right that it was destroyed. I just couldn't figure why I had this: because UB which materializes as the value still being there or a mechanism related to how lambdas work.
 
5:17 PM
I don't think it's hard and/or time-consuming to just kindly answer "Hi, welcome to the Lounge! Please do not expect your tehcnical questions to be answered here, most often people do not have enough time and prefer chatting or relaxing (see the rules for a better explanation)"
 
@JBL If you knew that it was destroyed, what was your question?
 
@HamZa I'm saving C++ from you
 
JBL
:(
 
@JohanLarsson iow we don't want people who get driven away
 
Xeo
@AndyProwl DRY
it gets annoying quick
 
5:18 PM
@Abyx Is it because I'm a PHP guy ?
2
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Sorry, but I'll have to "pull rank" here. I've seen a reasonable cast of regulars and semi-regulars, both semi-permanent and rotating. I'm here all the time; you've been away for long :P
 
I think if you find yourself being encouraged by me to be nicer to newbs, you should take a good look at yourself. :)
 
@Xeo What gets annoying?
 
Xeo
repeating yourself
 
JBL
@FredOverflow If what I observed was UB or if lambdas had some special mechanism (though I admit it's a bit crazy) that made this behavior well-defined.
 
5:18 PM
@AndyProwl Let's see how well you do that when it happens on a regular basis
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I've been here almost constantly for like a year
 
@Xeo in this discussion you mean?
 
@HamZa PHP is a prime reason for :getout: messages
 
@HamZa not really. because you ask dumb questions
 
5:19 PM
@JBL I haven't seen your code yet. Care to drop a link for me?
 
and I won't accept arguments based on "how it used to be" before that, as they are irrelevant
 
Xeo
@AndyProwl no, as a reply to your 'just give them this short sentence'
 
@CatPlusPlus I can just copy-paste that same message, it isn't a big effort
 
5:19 PM
I'm actually amazed how much time the regulars spend in this room. it's as if their full time job is Lounge<C++>
2
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit but nostalgia
 
@AndyProwl Yeah good luck with that
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix You still alive then, or is this Ghostscript?
 
@TonyTheLion I know, I was like thinking to format it like PHP
 
@doug65536 of course :)
 
5:19 PM
@AndyProwl or just don't answer at all, then bin if spam
 
@doug65536 Don't tell my boss!
2
 
I'll be counting messages till you snap and tell someone to fuck off into the void forever
 
JBL
@doug65536 I've closed the lounge these days because I had my full time job to actually do.
 
Xeo
@doug65536 having a tab open isn't much effort
 
@JohanLarsson My point is that everyone deserves an answer - even one which is the same for everybody.
 
5:20 PM
@JBL Local variables never have their lifetime extended. That's all there is to it.
 
We've been here for a long time
 
@MartinJames what?
 
@Abyx "dumb" is relative
 
@CatPlusPlus I don't see the problem
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit it's a lounge so the only goal of this room is fun. (yes C++ might be fun). And bashing noobs is fun
 
5:20 PM
The problem is that it happens too fucking often
 
@Xeo its a trap though
 
this room is like freenode C++ IRC without the arrogant insulting jerks and 10x more people that really know what they're talking about
 
And you get tired
 
JBL
@FredOverflow That's what I thought, but as I'm a complete newb w.r.t. lambdas, I kinda thought there might be something more to it. (I'd like to think it's humility, thinking there might be some potential case I didn't think of)
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix I was wondering if you had frozen to death before you got your heater fixed:)
 
5:20 PM
And you want to close the doors and tell everyone to fuck off
 
@JBL There isn't. Case closed.
 
It's just a click and a Ctrl+V
 
See if you can keep that up for 2 years
 
So yeah, my two cents. I think it is terrible when people (who perhaps should know better, but let's put that aside) ask a question, and just see it sent to the bin with no good explanation given, besides the link. These people should just be told that dumping question is not ok here. After that, if they persist, all bets off. But it's that initial cold front that I think is the worst.
 
@MartinJames fixed with an electric toothbrush , long story
 
5:21 PM
@HamZa anyways you already have the answer to your questions - it's "yes".
 
Sometimes several times per day
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes SURPRISE!
 
@thecoshman repeating ourselves like that is annoying
 
@Abyx I knew it
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix Oh.. electric toothbrush... err.. OK:)
 
5:21 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Where are you?
 
or we need a pinned message saying that
 
@thecoshman Is driving those people away from the Lounge a good or a bad thing?
 
Also what Tony said
 
@thecoshman I'm more concerned that they don't know what binning is, especially when the bin message gets immediately replaced with "", or "fuck off". Their question just disappears. That's simply mean. If they're new, how are they supposed to know what just happened?
 
@TonyTheLion tough shit vOv
 
5:22 PM
@FredOverflow Good
 
agreed
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes SURPRISE!
 
JBL
Well. Time to go.
 
@thecoshman you're free to tell five different people the same thing in one day, if that makes you happy
 
JBL
Bye Loungers!
 
5:22 PM
@AndyProwl I agree in a way but think it is self-regulating if the question is really really poor it might be so bad that it gets ignored by everyone. In C# we don't bin at all but not all things gets much attention. Regs get replies to almost all their questions.
 
Bye!
 
That question dumping shit can and often does destroy actual fun conversations
 
@FredOverflow driving away brand new people, terrible; driving away new people who refuse to accept we have ways, good.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit FWIW, I know my boss's username on SO.
 
@doug65536 not exactly a regular but i have no job and full of time
 
5:22 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I agree that "fuck off" is a bit over the top
 
@CatPlusPlus The binning discussion is always more destructive. Always.
 
@TonyTheLion Why shouldn't we do that?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I have two. SURPRISE!
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit It's related
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit lol
 
5:23 PM
It wouldn't happen if the problem wasn't there!
 
@AndyProwl cause boring and cluttering my screen
 
@JohanLarsson Ignoring only works as long as everybody adheres to it.
 
I have more important things to read than that.
 
@TonyTheLion then don't tell them.
 
@TonyTheLion yep, "please fuck off" would be better
 
5:23 PM
@CatPlusPlus Then make the room invite-only. Oh, wait, you're on someone else's infrastructure and they want it to be public. Damn!
 
The Lounge scrolls fast enough as it is, without all that
 
@FredOverflow everyone does as they feel imo
 
@Abyx :)
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit No.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Except we could, it's just also annoying
 
5:23 PM
A realisation that this room doesn't belong to one or two room "owners" might be a good start
 
Lets ask Vlad what he thinks :P
 
There is more than enough people in this room to handle telling the FEW people that do come here the 'rule'
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Did you miss the joke I played yesterday? Invite-only is a feature of the chat.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes No.
 
@TonyTheLion OK, I just don't think it's so bad. I mean I'm having a lot more trouble following this conversation than a regular one where a noob dumps a question.
 
5:24 PM
@LightnessRacesinOrbit we also have normal people coming here
 
@Abyx hahahahahaha name one
 
@Abyx Name one
 
I'd say I didn't see any particular problem for the time I spent here.
 
Here is serious suggestion: Rename Lounge<C++> to something without the word C++ in it. This will fix almost all our problems.
 
No it won't
 
5:24 PM
@FredOverflow You mean, like the PHP questions?
 
@Abyx lol, "normal" isn't a thing around here
 
Quick poll: Star if you think rude binnings are fun :)
 
@FredOverflow TheLounge
 
@JohanLarsson We did that yesterday.
 
Lounge<GetOut>
 
5:25 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I have never seen PHP questions here. Or at least I cannot remember the last time.
 
Don't you think we haven't tried renaming the room already
 
Well he's right in that we didn't ask whether it was "fun"
 
People also need to remember that we are part of a QnA site. Yes chat is a bit of annex and not the intended place for fresh questions, but that is what brings people here.
 
@JohanLarsson Binning is rude won.
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit, @MartinJames, all of you, newbs. look at day 1st of this room log
 
5:25 PM
@CatPlusPlus did you take all the C++ tags off?
 
@CatPlusPlus When was that? And what names did you pick?
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Ahaha nobody cares about them
We called the room COBOL and we still got questions about fucking PHP
 
I don't think hiding the room or removing the C++ tags is a good idea
 
@CatPlusPlus Apparently you do a lot, indirectly, by virtue of the fact that people keep coming in asking C++ questions because of it.
 
People come in here asking all sorts of questions because it's often the first room on the list.
 
5:26 PM
@CatPlusPlus PHP is just a rampant disease that's no longer curable
 
It's one of the few rooms that consistently has a large number of people in it. No one looks at the name
 
@CatPlusPlus that's interesting
 
What Robot said
 
They even give that as an excuse.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I meant if they are fun to witness, I'm not proud of it but they are fun to watch at times cos they are so obsurd.
 
5:26 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes We need to be less busy
 
Also I think we changed tags also
 
We need to have lives, so we don't appear on to be so busy
 
I don't edit audit messages (LIKE SOME PEOPLE) so lemme look
 
Apr 1 '13 at 16:10, by Cat Plus Plus
room topic changed to COBOL: IDENTIFICATION DIVISION [cobol] [no-helpdesk]
 
I personally never saw any PHP question, rarely see questions here for the last 2 weeks
 
5:27 PM
robot was quicker
 
Yeah we've been here for what, 3 years?
 
@CatPlusPlus Don't remind me.
 
We also need to stop with the double standards. Why is it so abhorrent that a new person comes here and brings up something of topic, but a regular is allowed?
 
Don't tell us there are no patterns where we have enough data to see one kthx
 
5:27 PM
@thecoshman because regulars also contribute to other shit, where noobs mostly don't
 
@thecoshman Because that's just how most social groups work.
 
Though frankly, a blanket 'no php ever' wouldn't go amiss.
 
Also, regulars don't expect their off-topic topic to be handled
 
@thecoshman true
 
5:28 PM
add the tag no-php
 
IRC rooms often have a bot that will print out canned responses for annoying FAQs. can't do that here?
 
There's an issue of contributing to the fun
 
all problems fixed :P
 
But java is ok?
 
5:28 PM
lol
 
@doug65536 We have a bot. It's called Martinho.
 
dan
gtfo java
 
Java is a curse
 
What about C ?
 
If you barge in here, don't lurk, disregard the rules, and dump a shitty question that probably nobody can answer because you're terrible poster, why should we care about you
3
 
5:29 PM
This is turning into a star-fest. That wasn't the purpose
@HamZa No.
 
So we went from flaming all questions to flaming only PHP and Java. I guess that's an improvement?
 
@CatPlusPlus Lets pin this and that's the new rule
:)
 
That's rubbish. A new person needs to be able to join the group some how. If you don't want new people, close the doors. Do not be such a twat as to let people come over and strike up any conversation they want, then scorn them because they did not spend months before hand kissing your ass.
 
It's on wiki already
@thecoshman We don't want new people who come here thinking chat is for their personal helpdesk
 
@thecoshman new people don't have to ask questions
 
5:30 PM
@thecoshman It's a little like a bank account. On-topic conversation is like a deposit. Questions (especially totally off-topic ones) are withdrawals. If you have a large enough balance, you can make a withdrawal--but if your account currently has a zero balance, making a withdrawal will get you in trouble.
2
 
@CatPlusPlus Just because there are rude people, doesn't mean we should be rude as well. Simply say "sorry, not this time" or whatever. Then you can continue not giving a fuck
5
not saying it should be you
 
@JerryCoffin I like that :)
 
About the lurking part, I have a problem with leaving too many tabs open.
 
@Nican oh don't be silly
 
Close the other rooms!
 
5:31 PM
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix it's ok to ask but it should be a good question
 
@JerryCoffin except what we are presenting is you going to a new bank, asking to sort out a loan, and they just instantly destroy any evidence of your life.
 
@Abyx define "good question"
 
All regulars just joined
Nobody tried to helpdesk their way in
 
Probably
 
@LoïcFaure-Lacroix dunno. an interesting one
 
5:31 PM
@CatPlusPlus no. I started here asking questions.
 
You're just a weirdo
 
@thecoshman same for me
 
That's probably why you have such terrible ideas today!
 
@thecoshman No, it's not. Probing for a loan would be "hey guys, can I ask something about debugging C++ code here?". "how do I fix sgementan flaut" is clearly a direct withdrawal in that analogy.
 
I used to ask questions as well, but I also contributed to the other conversations
 
5:32 PM
@thecoshman and... you're still here. why others can't do the same?
 
@thecoshman I think you're exaggerating a bit. Nonetheless, I agree with (what I think is) your basic point. The instabinning has gotten excessive.
 
@Abyx perhaps his first question was not binned
 
I fell in here by mistake after a 'heated technical discourse', (AKA comment-war) with an existing lounger. I have been unable to escape since.
 
mine wasn't
 
instabinning is extreme I guess
 
5:33 PM
@Abyx he contributes to other conversation, whereas question dumpers, ask a question, expect an answer, and then leave
 
I'm willing to ban instabinning just because of the sheer amount of drama it generates
 
if it were, I'd probably not join again
 
@JerryCoffin yes, point is, we respond to people who DO NOT know any better with excile.
 
I don't see much "instabinning" happening. did I miss it?
 
@MartinJames I bet most loungers (especially the involved) don't remember :)
 
5:33 PM
Yes
 
@CatPlusPlus but what about my lulz?
 
@doug65536 It's often edited out :(
 
@MartinJames Welcome :)
 
Chat is shit and audit messages are editable (but not deletable because THAT makes sense) for whatever idiotic reason
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Are you hinting that it was probably me? :-)
 
5:34 PM
@JerryCoffin It wasn't.
 
I just don't get why if you personally are offended by some one asking a question, plonk them. If they turn out to be a regular nice guy who got of on a wrong foot, scope them out the bucket.
2
 
We could all move to the bin. After a few hours, there would be disagreement about 'instalounging'.
13
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes So there's somebody else with a memory as holy as mine?
 
I clicked chat by accident one day, ended up in here, and have never (though have honestly attempted) never been able to leave since
 
We care about quality of conversation here
 
5:35 PM
@JerryCoffin whistles
 
@MartinJames it's still going.
 
Plonking people is counterproductive to that goal
Because it's about disrupting whatever is happening
 
@MartinJames ahahahahahah that's hilarious
Where the fuck is @rightfold?
 
@CatPlusPlus and if you care about that, you would tell new people what that is.
 
(And also ignoring is dumb because people keep replying even if it's a stupid troll or whatever)
 
user1804599
5:36 PM
@TonyTheLion Right here.
 
user1804599
I am writing a compiler.
 
Have a nice day/night everyone
 
How about this:
- If someone new dumps a question. We ignore and pretend we don't give a fuck.
- If the person does it again and starts bugging us, we say we aren't interested.
- If the persists, we do what the puppy does best.
 
@rightfold Contribute to this most important conversation
 
user1804599
5:36 PM
I am implementing nested comments right now.
 
user1804599
Way more important.
 
@CatPlusPlus yes sadly 'dont feed the trolls' has been forgotten
 
@rightfold How long until its not finished?
 
@Mysticial It will nearly always play out like that
 
@Mysticial no, we tell them.
 
user1804599
5:37 PM
xD
 
Because people are dumb and don't get a fucking hint
 
@Mysticial I'd suggest we don't ignore them and tell them straight that we aren't interested
2
 
we've done that
 
unless somebody finds the question interesting and offers to help
 
user1804599
Well I need to write a unit test but Cabal is terrible so it might take a while.
 
5:37 PM
I am ok with binning the long spam the results from people who refuse to get it into their thick skulls that they are out of line.
 
@TonyTheLion in a polite way I mean
 
@AndyProwl Which is why I suggested ignoring first in case somebody is interested.
 
@TonyTheLion We do that. Not seldom the person just politely withdraws, in fact.
 
I so don't care about forced smiles
 
no trolling the guy, no binning, no sending him to fuck off
4
 
5:38 PM
@TonyTheLion oh you :P
 
@AndyProwl ...or even go a tiny but further, and (politely) suggest some place their question would be more suitable.
 
@ScarletAmaranth this one is similar. However, it blended with my memories of Hataraku Maou Sama, and I don't really like that.
 
@AndyProwl tell the puppy
 
@JerryCoffin I agree
 
the basic problem we have: The Puppy
 
5:39 PM
@TonyTheLion not cool dude, don't talk behind backs. @DeadMG time to weigh in.
 
"— dumb question" "Stack Overflow" "— but i dont think its worth posting there"
 
@TonyTheLion somebody already told him. Actually more than one person
 
@Mysticial good deal
 
@thecoshman he can weigh in
@AndyProwl I know he's been told
 
@AndyProwl In his defence, he does seem to have stopped with the instabins
 
5:39 PM
Jul 22 '12 at 19:17, by Oyibo
@EtiennedeMartel Sorry hadn't read that, sorry for disturbing
 
@Mysticial OK, some ignoring time is acceptable indeed. But shouldn't last too long
 
@rightfold Is there a way to escape comment closers inside comments?
 
I can pull more examples.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes god bless your powers :')
 
user1804599
@FredOverflow Yes. Prefix #) with (#. :)
 
5:40 PM
You should recognise that it's difficult for newbs to take the 'no-questions' tag seriously when there is also 'more-vlad'.
3
 
@thecoshman Dude, that was fucking hard. You know how many hits "sorry" gets you?
 
I'm too lazy to pull examples, but personally I also don't bother with engaging usually
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol
 
@thecoshman Hm, he mostly stopped sending the guy to hell, not binning/editing
 
@MartinJames lol
 
5:41 PM
@CatPlusPlus Point is that what you described is not what happens always.
 
At least I've seen that happening
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oh I know it doesn't always happen
 
Most people here are not concerned with the hopeless cases.
 
theyre all hopeless
 
@MartinJames How about canned responses? On the 3rd offense,
 
5:42 PM
@CatPlusPlus maybe you've just given up hope?
 
They're not.
 
> With all due respect sir we kindly ask that you fuck off.
 
Can we somehow technically forbid noobs from posting links?
 
no I'm not being serious. :)
 
@TonyTheLion On people knowing what the fuck? Yes
 
5:42 PM
@MartinJames I would also argue that "Would you like to EXPLODE? No? Read on, then" is not a very obvious hint that "here are the rules"
 
@CatPlusPlus bullshit
 
@Mysticial 'Three strikes and you're out'?
 
@FredOverflow read-only, but 'we' don't like that
 
brb, have to drive to work.
 
@FredOverflow No
@AndyProwl Barely anyone reads that until its shoved down their throat anyway
 
5:43 PM
@Mysticial If someone dumps an embedded SO question without any kind of introduction whatsoever, then I want to bin that immediately.
 
If we had MOTD popup on first join
 
vOv what about a bot that tells people a nice message, better than what is pinned, to read the rules.
 
@FredOverflow A significant part of the "posts" in question are just the question text, not a link.
 
@Mysticial Obviously. If you'd been serious, it would have been more "with all due respect (which is none, asshole) ..."
 
Bot would still need manual intervention, because greetbots have been banned before
 
5:44 PM
@CatPlusPlus Yeah, I thought of suggesting MOTDs on meta a while ago, but... yeah, right.
 
have it give a summary, in chat directly, about what we object to AND WHY
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I mean as soon as a link appears somewhere in the text, forbid it from being posted.
 
Because SO is a really shitty host
 
@FredOverflow But many posts are just people asking here without links.
 
@CatPlusPlus no much though right?
and can't it piggy back on a users main account?
 
5:46 PM
@Mysticial So you're talking about rewriting the room rules to make normative?
 
@CatPlusPlus Maybe. Or maybe not. It's not that I don't think it's fun, it is. But well, I as a newcomer wouldn't think of opening that if I had a question to ask here.
 
We still, at the very least, need to marry the two up
 
@ScottW knows all about marriage, ask him :)
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Never forget Lounge<Vlad> [c++] [c++11] [c++1y] [no-more-funny-tags] [oh-wait]
4
 
may be we should be linking to a nice concise list of "Reasons why you can't ask your question here"
 
5:48 PM
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Never forget Lounge<Vlad> [c++] [c++11] [c++1y]
 
Maybe we should just all show some love?
 
@TonyTheLion woah, steady on there flower boy
 
I didn't mean sexual love, damnit
 
¬_¬ ofc not
 
Might be a good idea to propose on meta "room reputation"
 
5:49 PM
I meant, being nice to noobs for at least the first five minutes of their appearance here
 
No, it's not.
1) it's not a good idea, and 2) it has been proposed before and rejected as not a good idea.
 
Meta won't change shit about chat
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Which? Proposing chat-rep or giving people a short grace period before we ream them?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes 3) they don't care about improving chat
 
5:50 PM
@JerryCoffin Chat rep. Sorry for ambiguity.
 
@TonyTheLion I knew that silly, but I do agree.
 
Anyway, I don't remember anyone fiercely defending instabinning. Did I miss it? Speak now or forever hold your peace.
 
I like the bin
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes s/peace/penis/ (he he he)
 
@TonyTheLion Rephrased.
 
5:52 PM
nice
 
I also think everyone agrees that editing the system bin message is a horrible idea, unconditionally.
 
binning long winded spammy chat and other crap, yes yes yes; instabinning someone ASAP, no no no
 
Editing any audit messages is stupid
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes VERY much so... ¬_¬ @DeadMG
 
I'd make a meta post about it, but someone probably already did and also they won't give a fuck
 
5:53 PM
inb4 sarcastic response
 
24
Q: Remove the ability to edit audit messages

R. Martinho FernandesI can't think of a decent reason to allow editing audit messages (like 'n messages moved to room' or topic changes). I have abused it for fun before but it really has no purpose other than joking or obfuscating your actions. For that I think that such messages should be untouchable. Please make t...

I wasted two bounties on it already.
 
17:52 and I still have not heard from Anne. She went to a funeral earlier for a well-loved local darts player. The reception is being held in a boozer.
This is going to be one of those 'drag my wife along the pavement like a caveman' days.
 
@MartinJames Whose funeral? Not hers, I hope.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes sigh... rep to you ¬_¬
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes 99%, anyway. I can maybe, just possibly, see (for example) binning something on April Fool's day and editing it to something snarky.
 
5:55 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes It might be, if she gets as drunk as lat time.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes when you nuke a message, the person that posted it can see it disappear, right?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes if it was hers that would make lot of sense to not see her again
 
I want you to look really hard at phrase "editable audit messages" and try not to laugh
 
I missed it, didn't I
 
@JerryCoffin oh now let's not get ped... oh... right... here
 
5:55 PM
@doug65536 If they're playing close attention... Don't see how it helps.
 
@Jefffrey you can still enjoy the last 5 minutes!
 
Just rename this place to Lounge<bin>
no more problems
 
Osama<Bin<Lounge>>
 
@TonyTheLion Do you still mean to say you like it after my rephrasing?
 
bin like binary
 
5:56 PM
except for all the messages that will end here from other rooms
 
@TonyTheLion I propose shortening that to "binge".
 
The best thing that could happen is SO deciding that they don't want us here anymore
 
and then what?
 
and then life
 
Talk of the devil.. just got an 'encrypted' text. I think whatever is left of her wants to be picked up from the Swan at 18:30.
 
5:57 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes half tempted to ask the same question again... and make it painfully clear I am only doing so to draw attention to your question...
 
I drown in my sorrow and never see the light of day again?
 
And then you'll move your asses over to something better :v
 
I have to drive home now
 
enjoy :)
 
@MartinJames good luck
 
5:57 PM
@thecoshman I find it quite ridiculous. It's quite upvoted, and it even includes a simple fix proposal.
 
But before I go I re-iterate that the room rules page and the tags must correlate, whether we decide they say "no questions" or we decide they say "some questions".
 
@TonyTheLion 1) F5 2) 404 3) GOTO 1
 
Not a single official interaction yet.
 
@thecoshman lol
 
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I nuked the tags and no one has complained yet.
 
5:58 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Get a smurf in this room, point them to the question.
 
Mods are not devs.
 
@CatPlusPlus the lounge<chat> that will never be finished?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Tags are easily scared, but they'll be back, and in greater numbers.
 
Well, not all at least.
 
@SamDeHaan Thanks. I have a small handcart with castors - maybe I'll take that, (and some rope).
 
5:59 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes We don't have time to read that, we need to redesign the main page for the 10th time!
@Jefffrey Just XMPP
 
@thecoshman I'll be there. I fought in the Great Get-Belgium-The-Fuck-Out-Of-The-Topic Wars.
 

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