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2:00 AM
er, both.
 
I guess that brings me to my next question.
I wanted to make a primitive AI.
So what I was thinking is.
 
the problem isn't making the AI for such a game smart.
 
Aim for the food.
 
it's making it less smart.
 
And change directions if you are going to kill yourself.
That might be.
 
2:02 AM
the game's rules are quite trivial enough for the AI to be perfect in every situation.
 
Wouldn't you need to look ahead?
 
yeah, and?
 
Hey, that's an idea.
Difficulty can be how many moves ahead it looks.
I don't think I have ever done such a thing before.
 
@Pawnguy7 That's what AIs normally do.
 
before I started work on Wide I had no fucking idea how to write any part of a compiler.
 
2:05 AM
I feel like making a DSL.
 
Would this be a... points based thing?
Minmax?
 
you'd be surprised at how simple intelligence can be
 
What do you need an AI for snake for?
 
@Rapptz for lonely people with no friends
 
..?
Am I missing a multiplayer component of Snake or something?
 
2:07 AM
@DeadMG as of yet, my AI experience is pong, so... basically nothing
@Rapptz it was my twist on it, theoretically
 
all about the right tool for the job.
 
Sort of like Tron.
 
having two snakes on the field sounds pretty lame unless the field is extremely big
 
@Pawnguy7 I independently invented Iterative Deepening. (Just like many other programmers did. It's common sense really.)
 
It can be as big as desired.
 
2:10 AM
@Rapptz but they could rub together
 
eh
I'm not very experienced in AI, so take what I'm gonna say with a grain of salt
but IME there's two kinds of useful AI algorithm.
there's global, like A*, and local, like PF.
 
What is PF?
 
potential fields.
 
My internet connection and provider are really bad.
 
@Jefffrey You should inform them that they suck.
 
2:13 AM
@Pawnguy7 I've suggested more of a maze kind of map with concentric rectangles with some random holes.
 
user3010322
Ugh.
 
@DeadMG can they touch diagonally?
 
@StackedCrooked They are those that suck less around here, so I better keep them close.
 
user3010322
I suppose I can't do proper searches of types within a type hierarchy using type_info, can I? =/
 
@ThePhD Not unless you have the ABI spec (in which case you might be able to)
 
2:14 AM
@Jefffrey What kind of download speeds do you get?
 
@Pawnguy7 It's your snake (although I'd go for no)
 
user3010322
Laaame.
 
@ThePhD I don't see why not. (RTTI must be enabled probably.)
 
@StackedCrooked 4.5Mb/s paying for a 7Mb/s connection. But that's not the problem, some days the connection stops working for 1 or 2 minutes. For today it's probably the 5th time now, that this occurs.
 
2:16 AM
@Jefffrey Mb/s means megabit per second?
 
@StackedCrooked That's not so much of a search as the most trivial query (does this object derive from T).
 
@StackedCrooked Yup.
 
user3010322
struct A {}; struct B {}; struct C {};

struct X : A {}; struct Y : X, C {}; struct Z : B, Y {};

Z zed;
typeid( zed ).????????; // How can one find out if `Y`'s part of the tree? How about B? A?
 
Isn't b for bits and B for bytes?
 
2:17 AM
@ThePhD You can't.
 
@ThePhD Oh, never mind.
 
@Jefffrey So around 500 kilobyte per second. I used to have a connection like up until last year.
 
You're doing insane things again.
 
user3010322
=_=
 
I got 480 KB/s max.
 
user3010322
2:18 AM
@Rapptz I am not. :c
 
user3010322
It's a reasonable request.
 
Then I got a new modem and it jumped to 3.5 MB/s. (Over twisted pair!)
 
you can only dynamic_cast an existing instance of Z to the base and check the result.
 
@ThePhD I think type_index might help. Look at the example.
:v
 
@StackedCrooked That's nice. I doubt my problem is with the modem/router though.
 
user3010322
2:19 AM
If a more-derived struct type is put into a collection of any, I want to be able to query for the less-derived type and get out a struct that is either the exact same type or more-derive.
 
@Jefffrey Is it cable? copper? fiber?
 
Cable I think. Definitely not fiber.
 
I should write getline_until
 
If the cable is fat (diameter of 0.5 cm or larger) then it's cable. If the cable has a diameter of around 2 mm then it's copper.
 
@StackedCrooked I don't want to say something extremely stupid, but the cable I attach to the modem is the one part of the telephonic line.
 
2:21 AM
@ThePhD Impossible in portable C++.
 
@StackedCrooked Cable.
 
user3010322
@DeadMG That's exceedingly depressing.
 
Huh? It is part of the telephone line and it's cable?
 
Lemme check.
 
cable is used for television normally
Telephone over cable is possible though..
 
user3010322
2:23 AM
So, what I am learning here is basically this entire framework idea I have
 
user3010322
Can be defunct as long as someone puts a more-derived type into the system.
 
one of the reasons why frameworks suck.
 
@ThePhD and what system would that be?
 
@StackedCrooked This one.
 
user3010322
@Borgleader Just a service provider.
 
2:24 AM
I'm stupid.
 
user3010322
If someone puts in a Win32Window to the service list, and someone asks for a IWindow, it won't be able to find the Win32Window because it's a more-derived type.
 
@Jefffrey Are you from Italy? I learned yesterday that Italy doesn't have cable internet for some strange reason..
 
user3010322
Awesome, C++. All your beefy type system and you can't even impart class relationships at run time when I ask for then. :v
 
Oooh, QR codes.
 
2:25 AM
@Pawnguy7 Better.
 
Somebody is going to die.
@DeadMG less fill? :D
 
user3010322
This throws a giant fucking wrench in my plans.... Where do next...
 
I was joking.
 
@Pawnguy7 Eh. Play it first.
 
@Jefffrey Btw, that's twisted pair. So you have a DSL connection.
 
2:27 AM
@ThePhD C++ never promised anything at run-time beyond dynamic_cast. All the type system is compile-time. Always has been.
 
@DeadMG Probably requires the AI.
But I am pretty sure it is suicide.
 
user3010322
@DeadMG It promised RTTI. And then it delivered a half-baked RTTI. :v
 
Though it depends on speed..
 
@StackedCrooked That obviously was the ethernet cable attached to the router. The actual connection comes from a very flat cable of almost 0.5cm, definitely more than 2mm.
 
You should check with your provider if they support VDSL2.
 
2:28 AM
@ThePhD It promised no more and no less than what is specified in the Standard.
 
user3010322
"Here's some runtime type information. We forgot to tell you, it's practically useless."
 
it's not practically useless, dynamic_cast is helpful.
 
typeid is useless
dynamic_cast isn't
 
I admit that typeid() is of limited usefulness.
 
user3010322
Well, plucking my brain, there's one way to solve this.
 
2:29 AM
@Jefffrey a very flat cable? (did you mean fat?)
 
user3010322
Can I iterate over the number of lesser-derived types at compile-time?
 
user3010322
Or is that information just not presentable to a user either?
 
Launch can be viewed live from Cape causeways or via http://SpaceX.com webcast around 5:30 local time on Monday
Sweet
 
@ThePhD what is a lesser derived type? (lol :D)
 
user3010322
Like, base classes.
 
2:30 AM
No flat. It's like this one.
 
user3010322
Given template type T, can I get it's base classes TBase0 ... TBaseN
 
No. You can't iterate over anything like that.
 
user3010322
Rubs face.
 
user3010322
Runtime reflection sucks, compile-time reflection sucks, nice.
 
user3010322
And then I still can't build clang in VS 2013, because "compiler error" :v
 
2:31 AM
Should I stick with 60x32?
 
user3010322
So I can't build my OWN reflection information and flip off the entire typeid nonsense.
 
@Jefffrey You got a DSL connection.
@Jefffrey btw, you are from Italy right?
 
user3010322
And people wonder why game engines have mega-base-types like IObject
 
@StackedCrooked yup
 
LLVM Build - SVN r194806. still can't compile iostream
sadness =/
 
2:32 AM
It's funny. My company specialises in DOCSIS (the cable spec). And yesterday someone mentioned that Italy doesn't have cable Internet at all. That's probably why you are unfamiliar with it.
 
There was a proposal..
 
@StackedCrooked I'm pretty ignorant on this things. But that I recall that is the same cable that was there 5 years ago.
 
user3010322
@Rapptz Nobody's come to any kind fo consensus about compile time or run time reflection. The last time I checked (a month ago) there was 1 person from Google who owned the reflection TS / work, and the reflection forum was EMPTY. There was a post by Nicol Bolas in another part of The Asylum asking for a bunch of stuff, and everybody argued about what was exactly even necessary, so I don't see it coming to fruition any time soon.
 
@Jefffrey You should move to Switzerland or something :)
 
2:34 AM
Not that.
I don't care about runtime/compiletime reflection
 
@Jefffrey Where in Italy do you live. If I may ask?
 
user3010322
Confetti.
 
@StackedCrooked Eh, you bet.
@StackedCrooked Verona. North east of italy.
 
Oh, so Switzerland isn't too far away :)
I took one year of Italian classes in 2007.
I forgot most of it by now.
I remember "Sono fiammingo" (I'm flemish.)
 
@StackedCrooked Nope. I'm actually like a quarter of german origins (the mum of my dad was german).
@StackedCrooked Perfect ;)
> while Abruzzo and Veneto finish at the bottom of the table with 4.2Mbps and 4.1Mbps respectively
so accurate
 
2:38 AM
So I am thinking.
Put a button above each one.
And a back button below them all.
?
 
Apparently, in Italy companies don't respect the contract they made with their customers and they get away with it.
 
Yeah, welcome to Italy. That's common.
Nobody gives a shit about contracts.
Except when you are the one that lose something.
 
hehe :)
I visited Sicily a few years ago.
 
Also I've chosen this provider only because the girl they featured in the ads was prettier.
 
@ThePhD Well I can't find it.
 
2:42 AM
@StackedCrooked Mafia!
 
It had something to do with MI.
 
@Jefffrey Such a small picture!
And her smile seems a little forced.
@Jefffrey I stayed in Cefalu.
 
@StackedCrooked But seriously, it's the wild west there. I went too, and I was astonished by how they don't give a shit about rules. Red street light? Who cares? Obligation of wearing an helmet? Maybe 1 or 2 people did that in 2 weeks of permanence.
 
I heard rumors that there were mafia living nearby.
 
@ScottW Porque nosotros no parla italiano.
 
2:44 AM
@Jefffrey Yeah, I read such things about Italy.
 
@ScottW Because nobody speak it? :P
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes That looks like a weird mix of latin diarrhoea. :s
 
Watashi wa Italiano sukoshi parlo.
 
@Rapptz Just like italian!
 
Now it's spanish.
 
2:46 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Hey! >:(
 
@Rapptz Spanish for speak is "hablar", AFAIK.
 
it is
but if you substitute your parla with hablamos then it's 100% proper spanish
 
@ScottW Yeah. I'm glad I'm not the only one here that dislikes British :) American English FTW!
 
At least we have gestures.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I remember that from the movie "Hable con ella".
 
2:47 AM
@ScottW I love the southern british accent
 
@Rapptz I don't find that surprising.
 
what is it supposed to be anyway?
 
@Jefffrey I like that.
 
@Rapptz "Because we don't speak Italian". Disclaimer: I don't really know Italian and I didn't even bother with Google Translate. It's mostly guessing.
 
user3010322
Hm.
 
user3010322
2:49 AM
I think I can solve my problem.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Looks like you typed Spanish and threw in what you believe is an italian word into the mix :P
 
@Rapptz "parla" and "italiano"
 
@ScottW TIL Latin languages are identical.
 
I read Portuguese is the last "wild flower" among the roman languages.
 
@Jefffrey Italiano is also proper Spanish! And Portuguese probably.
 
2:51 AM
@Jefffrey "no"?
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes Can you template a virtual function?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes should be "non"
 
@ThePhD no
 
user3010322
Fuck.
 
2:51 AM
@Jefffrey Dammit, had it right the first time around.
 
I also tried virtual auto f();
no avail.
 
user3010322
Lol.
 
@Jefffrey Is "we" "qui" (sp?)?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes We = Noi
 
il nostro = our
 
2:52 AM
"Qui" is "you" then?
 
It's slowly coming back. I think.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes "Qui" is "here".
 
"here"
 
@StackedCrooked yup
 
user3010322
I will break the system.
 
2:53 AM
@ScottW que lastima.
 
@Jefffrey Oh. That should have been obvious.
 
devo traversare la strada
 
lol
 
@StackedCrooked devo attraversare la strada ;)
 
@Jefffrey oh
 
2:54 AM
so mean
 
"I must cross the street."
 
Yup
 
Anyway, I only know some weird mix of Italian and Portuguese spoken by emigrants to Brazil.
 
@ScottW mafia kills you
lol
 
user3010322
... Wait
 
2:56 AM
@ScottW ok, voglio attraversare la strada
 
user3010322
Let me get this straight
 
user3010322
If you have a blank type with no inheritance,
 
user3010322
and you take a pointer of that type
 
Oo got my old name back ... although needs a bit time for it to be pushed through
 
user3010322
and try to do a dynamic_cast on it to a type that is polymorphic, instead of failing and returning null,
 
user3010322
2:57 AM
it gives you a compile-time error?
 
user3010322
... Why would it fucking do that? Arrgh why throw a wrench in my plans, C++?!
 
Why would it not do that?
 
user3010322
Welp, back to square one. =l
 
You can just write nullptr if you want a null pointer.
There's no need to fabricate nullptrs with dynamic_cast shenanigans.
 
Wow.
Telkitty has a 93 upvote question.
TIL.
 
2:59 AM
@ThePhD the compiler sees that the types are not related so it generates an error. (how could you not want this!!?)
 
user3010322
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm trying to transport 2 templates so I can do a dynamic_cast to check if one is derived from the other. The first step was hoping that dynamic_cast would just return null. The second step was setting up the machinery to get around void* & other type-erasure friends.
 

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