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12:11 AM
@AndrasDeak "declined - It is a canonical question used by the pandas community. Absent evidence that it is causing harm, locking it would not be appropriate, as it would prevent maintenance."
That from the pandas question you had an issue with
 
pfft
thanks, that's just stupid
wow there's also the same shting in R stackoverflow.com/questions/5963269/…
I mean, these are great resources but they should be on meta. If you could close something as a dupe, just close it as no MCVE
I might flag the pandas one myself, and ask on meta when it gets declined
actually, no mod is going to make that call themselves, so I should just suggest the move to meta on meta without flagging
in which case I might or might not be told that migration is not possible after 60 days of age for the question
 
12:56 AM
cabbage all
It's finally happened. My first gold badge. : )
4
 
@Simon Congratulations! Or I guess I should say pineapple, or something. :)
 
I'll just check, wait a second
Yep your right it is pineapple. I still need the guide. Tomato
It's the Fanatic badge by the way
I now have 15 badges
 
1:20 AM
I don't use many salad words, so I'm a bit rusty. And it's hard to check the room rules from the mobile view.
But I did check your profile to see which badge it was. :)
 
I hate using my mobile for SO it's horrible trying to type an answer with it.
Yep today is a good day. ; )
 
55 mins ago, by Andras Deak
actually, no mod is going to make that call themselves, so I should just suggest the move to meta on meta without flagging
Do inform if/when you decide to post.
@Simon My first badge was "Unsung Hero".
 
It bad enough just doing chat or comments, trying to post code, or even just edit code, is insane. But Martin does it, and does it faster than people on proper computers.
 
In a couple of weeks I should get the "Legendary" badge.
Nah, more like a month.
 
As long as you get it eventually that's all that counts
 
1:24 AM
@PM2Ring Martin who?
 
Unsung Hero was my first Goldie too. I foolishly missed getting an easy badge on Mathematics by forgetting to participate in the recent election.
 
You both make me look useless on SO
I haven't come close to anything like that.
 
Sorry, I meant Martijn, but I didn't notice that the yamming autocorrect mangled his name.
 
He's here now I think
 
@Simon It just takes diligence and time. But some people manage to do it faster than others. Like Coldspeed. ;)
 
1:32 AM
@PM2Ring Time I have, diligence I'm not sure. I think so.
You are right. Many people get a good rep and badge from their first question.
 
I must admit it's not easy to get points answering questions these days, with so many rubbish questions being posted. I did pretty well today, but that's as much due to luck as talent, I think.
 
I am considering asking a question. I hope it does not add to that list.
 
1:48 AM
If you follow the advice in the "How to ask" help pages you should be OK.
 
I try : s
 
Excellent. ;)
We can give "meta" advice about new questions in here, but it's against our policy to actually answer new questions.
 
I have no intention of asking it here! -if that's what you are saying
I need upvotes!
 
Understood. But we can maybe help you to make sure it's a good question.
 
That would be nice.
 
1:57 AM
It'd be great if SO had a "draft" feature, so you could formulate a question, show it in chat, get advice about it and help polishing it, if necessary, before you post it.
 
Yeah. That would decrease the amount of 'rubbish' questions
 
That was the goal of the recent mentoring project, and it seems that it was reasonably successful, so we may see more of that sort of thing happening in the not too distant future.
 
I feel like people would just start answering drafts, and then people would start writing cruddy drafts with the intent to get them answered as drafts and no intent to turn them into decent questions.
 
But obviously we don't have the manpower to do that for every Python question on SO in this room, so we have to be a bit selective...
 
I'm so glad they give you so many CVs per day + unlimited dupe hammer quota
(once you earn those privileges)
 
2:05 AM
@user2357112 Sure, that's a distinct possibility, and the only way to deal with it is to show no mercy to people that do that, both the askers and the answerers.
 
If I put my question here can I get help to improve it then put it on SO as a question to get answered?
Rhubarb. : )
 
@Simon That's fine by me, but you will need to make it clear that's what you're doing. And it may be a good idea to put it on a pasting site if its more than a dozen lines or so.
Oct 12 '16 at 11:02, by PM 2Ring
I want to get a gold badge in so I can hammer list questions in languages I don't know...
 
2:21 AM
You caught me just in time I was about to go.
 
Catch you later
 
@PM2Ring I sometimes find myself closing lang-agnostic questions in with questions from other languages.
 
If anyone can tell me how I can improve this question I would be very happy.


I have tried to resize the image to 32px by 32px with this script:

`from PIL import Image
size = 32, 32
im = Image.open("icon.png")
im.resize(size)
im.save('icon32.ico', "ico")`

There is no error when I run the script however the icon is always 16px by 16px.

I tried [This](https://stackoverflow.com/questions/273946/how-do-i-resize-an-image-using-pil-and-maintain-its-aspect-ratio) but it does not help and
I also tried the `im.thumbnail(size)` but that does not work either.
 
Huh. I have 405 tag score in . I wonder how much work it would be to specifically go for a gold badge there.
 
I do not want this question answering here if anyone is about to. As I said above I just want help to see if it is a good question or is likely to attract downvotes.
 
2:33 AM
@Simon That's a typo question... I'm not going to answer it because you don't want an answer, but it's going to get closed when you post it.
What I can do is give you a link to the docs and hope you figure it out.
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ Thanks
 
@user2357112 If you visit your older answers and retroactively add missing tags to questions involving lists, that should get you some more.
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ I'll take another look tomorrow. Thanks for the link and advice I appreciate it. : )
Right this time it really is rhubarb.
 
2:50 AM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ Really? The resize call looks fine to me, but I have been awake a long time. :) Ah. I see what you mean.
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ That sort of thing needs to be done judiciously, otherwise people could complain on SO meta. You could get away with it if you make other, genuine improvements to the page, and if you only do a few pages per batch.
 
3:17 AM
@Simon pineapples
 
 
2 hours later…
4:59 AM
@PM2Ring I generally answer about 15-20 questions and then proceed to fix everything wrong with them, especially the title and tags. Of late I've been lazy and I think I've piled up around 200 pending questions.
I was thinking of fixing them in a large chunk of say 30-40 questions... but I don't want people to complain. As I've seen, people tend to complain about anything here...
 
 
2 hours later…
7:14 AM
grumpy cbg
@JinSnow Having all the details in a single answer is not needed and is actually complicating things for no reason. Kindly stop suggesting edits that don't add value to the actual question / task at hand. There are several different resources to see how to restart Tor, platform-wise. This answer is supposed to suggest how to change the IP, let's stick to that purpose. — Ashish Nitin Patil 18 secs ago
 
7:36 AM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ - so if I create answer where combine concatenation + convert to list + to_csv() then it is combination of 3 dupes? Are you sure? I think not. I think if answer is only one function, it is dupe and corerctly it is close, but if it is combination (2 or more) then not. But if ask this problem in meta and get answer(s) I am wrong, then no problem... But inmy opinion if grey zone then better no close as dupe. Thanks. — jezrael 17 mins ago
So I closed this question as a dupe, but was reopened without any discussion.
May I request your opinions on whether the reopening was justified or not?
If you look at the edit history, you'll see the duplicates that I marked.
 
7:58 AM
@AshishNitinPatil I'm more interested in the reviewers who approved those edits instead of rejecting as "Clearly conflicts with the author's intentions"
 
Reopening a dupe so you can answer with a single-function answer is the epitome of bad form. — Andras Deak 1 min ago
Now you understand vaultah's frustration :P
 
8:15 AM
They both had 5, 11 suggestion reviews each.
Anyway, it's okay. Since I am active. But imaging answers where the OP isn't active and such suggestions get through.
 
@AndrasDeak Yeah, I understand, which is why I apologised to both him, and you, and others, and decided to learn from, and not repeat those mistakes.
So, I'd appreciate if you'd stop guilt tripping me over them :)
Also, thanks for taking action on that question.
But there's a big difference between a 5k user mishandling a new-found privilege, and a 170k rep user who's been serially abusing the same thing for as long as I can remember.
So you should take that into consideration too, this isn't the first time that user has been observed to do that, and I have raised (unsuccessful) flags in the past over it.
If you accuse me of FGITWing, then they're the universe boss of it.
 
8:34 AM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ, btw, does your name suggest more speed or less speed? What does the cold signify? Just curious as to your reasoning (if any).
 
@AshishNitinPatil Okay, that's an interesting question, because I've never thought about it, so allow me to come up with an on-spot explanation. The "Cold" is the opposite of what you'd usually associate (high) speed - heat (friction), so I guess you could say it depicts something unusual and mildly interesting :)
 
ah, that's a nice way to put it
I reserve my special usernames for gaming / IRC (e.g. !mmorta! shad0w_wa1k3r)
 
>.> my name is just my name :D nothing significant
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ never! :P
Crippling guilt builds character
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ yeah, I'm aware of that. Typical repwhfarmer
 
8:54 AM
@AtharvaPandey same as me, but I would put it as significant :-p
 
recbg
 
9:07 AM
@AndrasDeak If you were a gold badger, and you see another gold badger unjustly dupe hammer (note "unjustly" is subjective), would you reopen it yourself and explain yourself in the comments? Or would you ping the other user and try to discuss the closure?
 
If i am right wrapping my app in CORS(app) should enable get put post delete . my get is working but my post doesnt seem to work from different server
however it is working fine locally
 
FontAwesome is down, sigh. RIP production.
Maybe not, just the office internet going wonky
 
9:39 AM
Cabbage
I really hope this is just a toy program... stackoverflow.com/questions/47066585/…
 
Wow, I didn't know that about Python 2's input() function
 
The old input() was essentially eval(raw_input())
 
Cabbage
 
I have no idea why Guido thought it was a good idea. I guess it's ok if the developer is the only one using the program, but still... So unfortunately there's ancient Python tutorials that use it. And at least one prominent Python textbook uses input or eval to convert strings to other kinds of objects.
 
9:45 AM
It looks like a mix of Python 2 and 3 to me.
 
@PM2Ring just crazy
 
@Simon Maybe. By using input there a numeric string gets magically converted into a number, and obviously inorup needs to be a number for the following if...else stuff to work.
@Simon Did you figure out your PIL resizing mystery?
 
Just a guess. I never had much to do with Python 2
 
I'm envious of everyone with python2.5 badges
 
@PM2Ring No. I saw there is a second argument. I have a suspicion it's that. : (
Not had much time to work on that it was 3am by the time I got to bed.
Then I overslept.
I am also not on my PC so I can't test it.
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ why? Python 2 won't be around for much longer
 
10:02 AM
What should I do if I found a perfect duplicate of a question, but the dupe target doesn't have an accepted answer? VTC regardless?
 
Yes, exactly. Meaning no one is ever going to get another py2.5 badge in all probability.
 
@Simon The second arg is optional, so it's not that.
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ I have one new users won't be able to get.
 
The beta?
 
@Simon you should see how many gold badges Jon Skeet has!
 
10:07 AM
@Rawing Is the top answer in your target correct? If so, then that's perfectly fine. It's a shame that the OP didn't accept it, but a score of 30 is pretty convincing.
 
Alright, thanks
Actually I guess the reason why that OP didn't accept an answer was because they had a very specific problem that wasn't related to pycharm, but now the question has turned into a sort of canonical duplicate, and that answer probably isn't what most people are looking for
 
@Rawing Yeah, I just noticed that. I don't know pycharm, so it's hard for me to evaluate that page. Are all the different answers there helpful, or could they be confusing to a pycharm newbie?
If the old page is a bit confusing, you could create a new canonical answer on the new question, and we could hammer the old one to the new one.
 
I haven't read all of them, but the ones I've looked at all look alright. There are lots of "on linux it's X" on "windows it's Y", "in 2016 and upwards it's Z" answers, so I think they all have a valid reason to be there
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ not yet I'm still reveling with my gold one.
 
@Rawing Ok.
 
10:35 AM
@PM2Ring thanks for the hint.
 
No worries. Have you solved it now, or would you like another hint?
 
@PM2Ring let me think for a bit
 
Ok
 
Ah tuple. (32, 32) then.
Am I right?
 
10:54 AM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ always discuss, any kind of war is counterproductive
 
I'm using ThreadPool from the multiprocessing.pool module for making parallel requests to DB from my django service. Is it a better practice to maintain a global threadpool or create a threadpool, use and close the object?
 
@Simon The size arg in that code is correct. It makes no difference if you do size=32, 32 or size=(32, 32)
 
No idea then
 
Other hint: when functions don't do what you expect it's a good idea to check the docs to make sure that the return type is what you think it is.
 
: s
Ah it looks like not making a new image.
 
11:19 AM
You're making a new image, but you throw it away.
 
suppose I have a file with python commands written in it , I want to execute those commands in my current script based on some condition.
example:
mydct['a']=("x","y","z",[yes])
mydct['b']=("x","y","z",[no])
I parse the file if "yes" in line: execute line
 
I need to go. I'll work on it later. Rhubarb.
 
@pythonRcpp So what's the problem? Reading the file? Getting the condition right? Executing the line?
 
Executing the line? say i have the line to be executed in a variable called line
 
exec is your friend. (not really, but you know what I mean. In this case, I guess you could call it a shady friend of a friend of a friend who has a particular skill set that you need)
 
11:29 AM
I know I can split the read line and make it into a dict. But because I know my file has exact commands written I want to run them as it is
 
There's no reason to have live code in that file. Data files should be data, not code.
 
11:54 AM
urgh, I hate when people post so unbelievably trivial questions that I can't even find a dupe for them
"how can I create a string with the value of this variable embedded in it?" like, come on
 
Yep it is creating the image I was wrong.
 
cbg
 
12:14 PM
@davidism I'm happy someone's getting some use out of it :-)
 
12:35 PM
Currently trying to determine whether it's a Responsible Adult use of my money to buy a Nintendo Switch just so I can play Mario and Zelda
6
 
I don't think it needs to be...
I mean, if you're not going to be able to eat for a few weeks, probably don't. Otherwise, go for it.
 
I'm usually willing to pay 9$ for an hour of high quality entertainment... Amazon says Zelda+Mario+Console is $542... So I'd need to get 60.2 hours of fun out of the two games to justify it
BoTW on its own might cover that, actually
 
Pokemon Fire Red took me 60 hours and I did't even finish the game!
 
That's a great rule of thumb.
On that basis, KSP is one of the best value things I've ever bought.
 
12:44 PM
@Kevin those are the reasons I want one, so at least you aren't alone.
Also the console is only $299 in stores.
 
Radical. And I suppose that price might go down on Black Friday? I can wait a month, easy.
 
Hey I know selenium , I was curious to know that can I run my script in online server?What I meant is that if I have a website,If a users clicks a button user itself could see the automation going on
himself*
 
I saw people asking about that and the consensus was that a deal on the console itself was unlikely but a bundled deal was a possibility.
 
vtc as too broad...
Oh wait
 
@NimishBansal I doubt it, unless you're using some kind of screen-sharing software. But that kind of thing typically doesn't run seamlessly in a browser
 
12:48 PM
ok thanks :) I have one more doubt that python libraries like pyperclip,scikit-learn,numpy etc would work on websites made in django or flask?
 
pyperclip will work on the server's clipboard, and not the user's, but the other libraries should work fine if they're installed on the server
 
Ohkk thanks
:)
 
I use scikit, numpy and tensforflow extensively in a project that uses django. :)
 
oh wow thanks man you gave me sight of relief
what about PyQt?any Scope?
 
If you use QT to make a GUI, then the GUI will appear on the server, and not on the client's machine.
The only thing that the client sees is whatever HTML you render in their browser. The only input you can get from the client is whatever data the browser gives you from form submissions/AJAX sessions/etc.
 
1:01 PM
kk
 
anyone know of a way to sync local branches with remote branches, which also deletes local branches not on the remote?
 
The person that knows of that way is not me.
 
git commit :branch I think?
Wait, nah that's not it
 
1:17 PM
poloniex balance of one coin Needs MCVE, among other things
I suspect the question is just "how do I turn {1:2, 3:0, 4:5} into {1:2, 4:5}?" but OP had to get web scraping involved
 
@Kevin Commented. I hate questions that are "How do I cargo-cult this random script I found on the Web that I don't understand?"
 
Questions of that type tend to be irritating because they're usually written by non-programmers who do not know our Ways and Customs. Like, I think the OP spent zero seconds considering that it would be useful if his code could run on our machines without us having to provide new instances of proprietary secret data that he hid from us
How do I make this distinction... They're not being inconsiderate, per se, because the thing they ought to have considered is something that would never occur to them. An unknown unknown.
 
Ignorance is a dangerous weapon.
And I consider this wilful ignorance.
 
It's like... If you're in a foreign country where eye contact is considered rude, and you just got into a conflict because you didn't know about that rule. On one hand, it's not something you could have derived from first principles. On the other hand, it's probably something you should have learned about while you were planning your trip.
 
1:34 PM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ I know what you mean. But as Kevin said, the people posting such questions aren't programmers, and they really don't understand how programming works. As far as they're concerned, we're wizards who know The Secrets of Programming, so they just need to show us the problem code and we can use our magic to fix it.
 
It doesn't help that sometimes we can determine the problem just from looking at the code :-P
 
You guys have a very forgiving attitude towards OPs. That's nice.
 
No need to fire up the interpreter to determine why print("Hello, world!" is complaining of a syntax error
 
I've just been playing this fun game: OP:"Thanks for your code, but it doesn't work properly on my data" Me:"But I tested it on the data you posted in the question" OP:"Oh, that's not my real data, I edited it for brevity".
 
Getting mad at one-rep users is as productive as yelling at the ocean for being too salty.
 
1:38 PM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ I'm forgiving towards OPs who want to learn. I'm not forgiving to cargo-culters who don't want to learn and just want us to do free dev work for them. But sometimes it can be hard to tell the difference, so I like to ask leading questions that will get them to reveal their true colours.
 
@PM2Ring I'd delete my answer (if you can't adapt my code, that's your problem, not mine)
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ To be fair, I can understand the OP being a little confused. I originally closed his question as a dupe of a question I'd answered before, although I gave him a whole day to let me know if he thought my dupe target answered his question. But then he posted some code that showed that he really didn't understand how to use my old code. So I un-hammered the new question and wrote him some new code that he's happy with: he's upvoted & accepted my new answer.
And I really should add some explanation here. Recursive generators are awesome, but I bet they can be a bit overwhelming for the newbies, especially when you have recursive generators that call one another.
 
My most rewarding interactions on SO are when I know that I actually taught something to the OP. It's such a rare connection, though. Most of the time you can never be completely sure that they didn't just skip your explanation and copy-paste your code into their project.
 
Oh you're unpacking an arbitrarily recursive dict... smells like a dupe... hmm
Also, I can empathise with what both of you said. Helping confused OPs and teaching them something.
1
A: Python Difference between iloc indexes

cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅBefore beginning anything else, I recommend reading Understanding Python's slice notation to get a first class insight on how python's slicing notation works. In particular, look at the different slice modes available to you: a[start:end] # items start through end-1 a[start:] # items start t...

Originally hammered this question... OP had trouble understanding slice notation with data frames.
 
The best sign is when they comment like "Oh, so it's like [unique restatement of your explanation that could only be composed by someone who truly understands the concept now]". Fly free from the nest, little bird ;_;
4
 
1:47 PM
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ That code handles JSON, so it has to handle arbitrarily nested dicts and lists. Hence there are two rec gennies.
 
That's a nice answer.
 
Thanks. But I will add a "How it works" section. Hopefully, I'll do that shortly...
 
Hard mode: write a recursive data structure iterator that works on self-referential data structures, such as a = []; a.append(a)
 
I also recently used that code here: how to modify the key of a nested Json. I figured that modifying the data was a sufficiently different use case as to warrant its own answer.
 
Not strictly necessary when you're sure that the data is coming from a JSON string, since they can't be self-referential
... I think
 
1:52 PM
I'm pretty sure that JSON prohibits circular references. OTOH, it does permit duplicate keys to exist inside the same object, which is painful when parsing such objects into a Python dict.
 
cbg \o
 
The json module does have an option to check for circular dependencies in the dump / dumps functions, but it's off by default.
 
I expect you'll get a crash either way, though :-)
>>> json.dumps(a, check_circular=False)
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
  File "C:\programming\Python27\lib\json\__init__.py", line 251, in dumps
    sort_keys=sort_keys, **kw).encode(obj)
  File "C:\programming\Python27\lib\json\encoder.py", line 207, in encode
    chunks = self.iterencode(o, _one_shot=True)
  File "C:\programming\Python27\lib\json\encoder.py", line 270, in iterencode
    return _iterencode(o, 0)
RuntimeError: maximum recursion depth exceeded while encoding a JSON object
> If check_circular is false (default: True), then the circular reference check for container types will be skipped and a circular reference will result in an OverflowError (or worse).
Hmm, I'm curious what the "or worse" outcome would be. Gobbling up all your available memory, maybe?
I thought maybe [[...], [...]] would consume exponential memory as it traverses downwards, but it overflows just as quickly as [[...]]. I guess the serializer is depth-first, not breadth-first.
 
Ah, ok. It looks like it's on by default. :)
 
Your original statement was only off by one bit ;-)
I wonder how much performance overhead is incurred by checking for circular references. The only time I can see that flag being useful is if you're sure that most of your data is free from circular references, and you want the common case to be slightly faster at the expense of the rare case being much slower.
 
2:05 PM
Now I finally get to be the one to ask the perennial question: has anything changed in providing a sandboxed environment for people to code Python in with restrictions on actions that they might otherwise have permission as users of production applications to do?
 
No, don't do it.
 
Come to think of it, I expect that most uses of dumps is on non-self-referential data, so it is kind of curious that check_circular is True by default.
 
DSM
Thursday morning cabbage for all.
 
cabbage
 
Maybe I'm overlooking a failure mode that's more catastrophic than "crash with a maximum recursion depth exception, about as quickly as a circular reference detected exception" that's worth guarding against
Putting aside the hypothetical of "what if someone set the maximum recursion depth to 10e999?", because those people need to learn their lesson the hard way :-P
 
2:10 PM
Thick client model, not really solving for an 1337 HAXXOR
 
@Kevin The json module is written in Python so it does have a bit of a performance hit, and it certainly makes the code more complex. FWIW, a while ago I wrote my own encoder that subclasses json.JSONEncoder. It's almost complete, I just need to add the check_circular stuff. Poke gave me some great suggestions and even wrote some code, but I still haven't gotten around to incorporating it...
@Kevin I'm sure there are some people who do try to JSON-encode Python data structures with circular references, but I bet it's rare. For that matter, I've never seen real Python code that actually uses circular references, only toy examples.
 
I occasionally see circular references in custom class instances, but not when only built-in types are involved.
Simple example: a video game where the Screen object has a list containing all Sprites that it owns, and each Sprite has a screen attribute.
 
@AaronHall Thick clients can easily do dumb insecure stuff. Here's a recent example I posted here a few hours ago:
5 hours ago, by PM 2Ring
I really hope this is just a toy program... https://stackoverflow.com/questions/47066585/how-can-i-make-a-basic-program-that‌​-allows-someone-to-sign-in-to-an-account-prev
 
Who here has contributed to an upvote to this answer?
26318
A: Why is it faster to process a sorted array than an unsorted array?

MysticialYou are a victim of branch prediction fail. What is Branch Prediction? Consider a railroad junction: Image by Mecanismo, via Wikimedia Commons. Used under the CC-By-SA 3.0 license. Now for the sake of argument, suppose this is back in the 1800s - before long distance or radio communication...

 
Not me, but that page does look familiar. However, I rarely vote on C++ or Java questions.
 
DSM
2:18 PM
And who's contributed one of the nineteen downvotes?
 
Only 19/26K is a pretty good ratio.
 
@cᴏʟᴅsᴘᴇᴇᴅ me
 
There are a dozen answers that are just as good as this (if not better) that haven't been voted nearly as much as this.
 
dunno when though
 
Downvotes courtesy of the League of Users That Don't Like Pictures of Railoads
 
2:21 PM
And the funny thing is that this isn't even the most viewed question.
 
DSM
aaargh I was going to make a different railroad joke.
 
but you got derailed?
 
My thinking is that people have been trying to solve the sandbox problem for a long time, and the execution model should be well enough understood to solve it by now...
 
DSM
<davidism> :-| </davidism>
 
or went on a different train of thoughts altogether?
 
2:22 PM
I don't think any of the other answers even come close to that one
 
Dr. DSM. Again we see there is nothing you can possess which I cannot take away.
 
Our users have physical access to their machines. So they can pwn their machines anyways.
 
@AshishNitinPatil Or railroaded ;)
 
I just don't want to hand someone a stick of dynamite and a box of matches...
 
DSM
2:24 PM
I have a package containing a server and a client. There's nothing secret about either, but the server requires a lot more packages than the client does. What's the standard way to handle this? Make two separate packages? Make two separate requirements.txt and two wheels for the same package (one of which would fail when you tried to use the server code because of the missing dependencies)?
 
My uninformed opinion is that I would prefer two separate packages.
 
depends, if you're mitsuhiko, everything is a separate package.
If you're anaconda, monolithic distributions based on platform.
 
Data Snake Man?
 
My work is like anaconda with a common Python lib on top of it, so we occasionally check if we're on Windows or Linux...
I say do one package based on that background.
That way you easily share canonical functions.
 
@DSM make two separate alongside with common supports.
it is very unlikely that you'd always install the server and client in the exact same location... and run both in there.
 
2:42 PM
I say three!
 
#This function gets called when the widget reticulator fails.
def onReticulateError(ex):
    ...
Find all references in project for onReticulateError... Zero found
:-I
Why do you lie to me, comment
 
If the code was the documentation, the documentation would never be wrong.
 
As a sanity check, I'm going to force the reticulator to fail and see if this function gets called anyway. But if it does, I might not have any sanity left.
The reticulator is Deep Magic, and thus may have the power to call functions without calling them. I would dearly like this to not be the case.
 
I have found that when I can't grep for code that should be there the problem is usually my grep. Sometimes the code just isn't there though.
 
Ok, it is being called. Stack trace indicates it's being called from... main.py, line 0.
[his smile and optimism gone .png]
 
2:50 PM
magic indeed!
 
c extension?
 
It's actually all javascript, and I was pretending it was Python so I could complain in an on-topic manner.
 
DSM
Aww, I figured it was C#.
 
That's usually a safe bet.
 
This room is bait and switch. :P
 
2:53 PM
I have a lot of complaints about Visual Studio, but putting junk information into the stack trace window is not one of them. Firefox developer tools is to blame, this time.
 
Anyone have any experience with RestrictedPython or know of its reputation?
 
Sorry... That information is restricted...
 
Ah ha, the reticulator uses a third party library that calls global functions with specific names in response to various events, onReticulateError being one of them. I don't have the source for that library, which is why grepping didn't turn up anything.
 
@DSM was it me or was the ballgame last night lackluster compare to the rest of the series?
 
DSM
If I have a package "abc" containing subpackages abc.server, abc.client, and abc.common, is there any clean way for me to tell setup.py to bundle abc.server and abc.common? Even if I explicitly only include abc.server it seems to pick up the others.
@MooingRawr: no, it was a bit of a comedown. One team out to an early lead and then little else.
 
3:16 PM
@DSM do you mean to hide abc.client and abc.common from the top-level module namespace?
 
DSM
In this toy example, I don't even want them to be built into the wheel. But I think I've sorted out why they were being included, there was a hidden import somewhere it shouldn't have been. :-/ Let me see if this works..
.. nope. I may actually have to create the dreaded MCVE myself!
 
While looking at the reticulator error, management says "didn't we have this exact same problem six months ago?". I have no memory of this. I really should get into a habit of writing post-mortems for bug fixes that take more than five minutes to solve.
 
3:31 PM
I am sugarhigh
anyone done cryptopals lately?
 
I am my own DevnerCoder9
 
DSM
Aaargh, it works now. I blame the cache.
 
anyone got to diffe-hellllllman yet?
 
I last touched cryptopals a week and a half ago. Most things that enter my Graveyard of Half Finished Projects never leave, but there have been precedents for miraculous recovery.
Oh, nice. The C# room's transcript has a record of me complaining about ReticulationFailedErrors six months ago.
 
Ok. I added a "How it works" section to my recursive generators code. It's probably a bit too advanced for total newbies, but it may be helpful to coders who are somewhat familiar with recursion and generators. Any suggestions & constructive criticism are welcome.
 
3:37 PM
> Incidentally the ReticulationFailedError I've been working on for a week has gone away ever since I changed the target framework of ReticulatorPlusUltra to 4.0 from 2.0.
Jackpot!!!
 
Cor spliney
 
DSM
WAIT A MINUTE I THOUGHT RETICULATORS WERE JAVASCRIPT WHAT ARE YOU TRYING TO PULL KEVIN
 
@RobertGrant The brilliant mathematician after whom the spline was named?
 
@AnttiHaapala Sorry, I successfully completed 2/16 CBC bitflipping attacks, but I haven't started on the CBC padding oracle one yet. I got distracted by circles
 
My web of lies is collapsing oh noooo
 
3:40 PM
@PM2Ring now, do you really think circle packing can get you richer than crypto :D
 
I picked a bad fake error name. The javascript reticulator library uses ajax to call an asp.net web service, which uses C# and an ORM to talk to the database, but this raises a BadImageFormatException, which usually indicates that a third party library is 64 bits when it should be 32 or vice versa.
 
@AnttiHaapala No. But I don't think crypto can make me rich either. Remember, I'm just an enthusiastic amateur, with no formal qualifications.
 
isn't a good pro different from an enthusiastic amateur that they're getting paid for it...
who needs qualifications
Einstein didn't need qualifications...
 
@AnttiHaapala AFAIK, it's a bit hard to get IT jobs these days without qualifications. But I'd be very happy to be shown otherwise. :)
 
wat
@PM2Ring in Finland, the newspapers are writing: "shortage of 15000 programmers... and counting"
 
3:45 PM
IIRC Einstein wasn't particularly rich, so maybe he's not the best role model for this particular goal :-P
 
#DjangoCon will be in San Diego in 2018! I'm so excited. America's Finest City + tech's loveliest conference = 💜 💚 💙 https://twitter.com/defnado/status/926094500581269504
 
Aww yeah, a conference I can go to without traveling!
We've been working on the proposal for a long time.
 
@AnttiHaapala However, Einstein had tertiary qualifications. I don't.
 
@PM2Ring he already had discovered many Nobels' worth stuff before he got his doctorate.
after that someone thought "ah maybe he could be a lecturer at a university" :D
 
DSM
3:49 PM
Speaking of conferences, is this a sign I should go to PyCon 2018?
 
It's definitely a sign, that much is certain.
 
@AnttiHaapala I'm reasonably familiar with Einstein's story. I read Abraham Pais' excellent biography of Einstein, Subtle Is the Lord, a decade or so ago.
 
pycon 2018 mhmh
 
We could all go and pimp our SO profiles there
 
3:55 PM
:D
 
To maintain my anonymity, while in public I will hide under a box painted to look like my identicon.
 
wow nice
684 € tickets with british airways...
 
I'd have to cosplay as myself
 
I could get 6 legs for towards my frequent flyer status renewal :P
 
Ok, now that I've fixed the problem that I fixed six months ago and re-broke last week, I have written down the solution in my Diary of Troublesome Troubleshooting, so when I break this again in six months I'll be able to fix it quickly.
 
4:07 PM
six months later why won't my Diary of Troublesome Troubleshooting open?
 
Like any good diary, it is locked to prevent unauthorized access from nosy siblings
Semantics debate: am I my own sibling? I share both parents with myself, after all.
Full siblingness appears to be transitive at first glance: your brother's brother is also your brother.
 
Semantically, I'm not sure that siblings must share both parents, maybe only one. I look forward to a protracted discussion about set theory arising from the substantive question, though.
 
So says the half-blood
(so said the cousin of the mudblood)
 
Half siblings are not transitive. The child of Alice and Bob is half siblings with the child of Bob and Carol, but not with the child of Carol and Dave.
 
"A sibling is one of two or more individuals having one or both parents in common."
 
@Kevin your brother's brother belongs to the set {*your_brothers, you}
 
I just want to share that the gender neutral form of niece/nephew is "nibling". Not 100% relevant but it's a fun word
Two niblings is also one byte
 
DSM
Wait, wasn't that "nibbles"?
 
the C standard committee is discussing about standardizing a behaviour that they call "wobbly bits".
 
4:36 PM
Yet another brain-dead question from Chase Barnes: stackoverflow.com/questions/47080277/why-does-this-do-this
 
How exactly did that code print 1...?
 
@PM2Ring Chase Branes?
 
:)
 
 EC.invisibility_of_element_located((By.XPATH, 'button[2]')))
AttributeError: 'bytes' object has no attribute 'invisibility_of_element_located'
 
Oct 24 at 16:06, by Kevin
IIRC Chase has a... shall we say... Colorful history of asking questions of that kind.
 
4:46 PM
how can I say to selenium it should wait til the button is not visible?
 
Update on my Crossbowman problem, if anyone's interested: Making Unit an abstract base class and Crossbowman a class turned out to be quite messy, because now Crossbowman's class attributes are showing up on the instances and causing name conflicts
 
I'm interested. Succeed, please, so that I may live vicariously through you.
 
I think I should've made Unit a normal class, Crossbowman an instance of that class, and then make a UnitInstance class such that crossbowman = UnitInstance(Crossbowman, experience=0)
 
Sounds weird
 
I'll continue to play around with it. Maybe I'll just rename the class attributes to get rid of the name clashes
 
4:55 PM
@Rawing Name mangling prevents name clashes with subclasses. But it's really a tool of last resort, so it'd be better if you can avoid it.
 
It does indeed sound weird when done with Units, but it makes sense in my real scenario (I'm not actually writing a game, I just thought that made for an easy to understand analogy)
 
interest *= 0.75
:-P
 
sorry about that :p
 
@Suisse you can, but your EC is a wrong object.
 
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