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8:00 AM
oooh
the script blocking it works
great
so now we can all laugh at vegans
 
my gf has a colleague that went vegan
 
I'm vegan
 
Well, I would have died as well. As much as I want to laugh at vegans, I am sceptical that this is because of her veganism.
 
now she always piss everybody off with her consciousness
 
user1804599
we can all laugh at vegans who think they are superior
 
8:01 AM
bcz animal cruelty and whatnot
 
We can all laugh at people who think they are superior
 
user1804599
vegans that are also nice people are fine and need not be ridiculed
 
@NaCl I hope you're just reiterating the joke
@NaCl lmao you're not
ahahahahaha
 
@rightfold Wrong.
 
> How do you know someone is vegan?
 
user1804599
8:02 AM
@wilx Wrong.
 
He tells you
 
@rightfold No, you! :D
 
user1804599
Well they better tell me how the fuck else can I know
 
Fell free to joke around, I won't get salty :P
 
8:03 AM
oh believe me you will
it's just a matter of time
 
Yeah, whatever
 
anyway yeah the story, however tragic, is also absolutely hilarious
 
Ven
Hello
 
user1804599
The only diet I strongly oppose is one that includes meat obtained by brutally torturing animals, such as halal meat.
5
 
That's true
 
8:04 AM
like if she didn't feel compelled to tell everybody around about her malnutrition, we'd all just grief and stuff
 
wesh frer @Ven
 
user1804599
Why that shit is still legal is a mystery to me.
 
Ven
o its rerito
wassup
 
@rightfold Can be said about a lot of things in Islam
 
Ven
@rightfold stop being islamophobic all the time kthx
 
8:05 AM
I am totally fine with people being religionphobic
 
started at kbok's place
 
nothing wrong with that
 
user1804599
You can be only both islamophobic and animalophilic on this point, sorry.
 
@JerryCoffin derp, thanks that's a really good example.
 
Ven
@Rerito ptn on va lé fer treiney dan le 92 é on vera
 
8:06 AM
grv, boulbi ok
 
@rightfold BTW
> Concern about slaughtering, without prior stunning, has resulted in the religious slaughter of animals being banned in Denmark, Luxembourg, The Netherlands, Norway, Sweden and Switzerland.
 
Ven
@Cubbi at least there's a warning in clang/gcc for that
 
Ven
...and Tracer is the most researched one.
 
sure
after the ass-incident...
 
Ven
8:15 AM
you missed a pun.
 
Call Bear Grylls
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz but not import
 
user1804599
I'm so hungry, brb
 
@BartekBanachewicz why
why why why why why
 
why not?
 
Ven
8:19 AM
oh god
we have this new project in JS, and one of our "functional" guys is taken care of it. So he put in monet, Either and other stuff like that.
But now, to be accepted, it has to be merged by my tutor, a hardcore C++ fan.
This is gonna be fun.
 
Ven
because he leads the project
 
interesting
i mean when you said "a hardcore C++ fan" you meant "dumb" right
 
Ven
wow bartek you're so funny, mocking C++ {,developers} for the 423423 days in a row.
I hope you write every critique about c++ you do in your diary
 
@Ven monet is shit
It's a classic example of someone cargo culting and not understanding monads.
Their IO monad is literally just unsafePerformIO :D
 
Ven
8:25 AM
never used it
 
Also, what's a "hardcore C++ fan"?
 
Ven
would use C++ for every project if possible. Thinks c++ is "easy" (at least to use/write)
 
IOW "dumb"
 
Ven
8:26 AM
lol, that guy literally wrote if (a || false). you what
 
@Ven here's an exercise, find a case where if (a || false) behaves differently from if (a) in JavaScript.
 
hardcore C++ . wtf. I guess It means you use fucking raw pointers here and there and digging later to fikx memory leaks
 
Ven
IOW he thinks if (undefined) in JS goes through the if
@BenjaminGruenbaum there's none
 
@Ven yes, there is.
 
Ven
@BenjaminGruenbaum do tell, do tell
 
8:30 AM
If you don't figure it out in a week, I'll tell you the edge case.
 
Ven
lol ok
plonks
 
F4z
a very basic question
when I read a file like file = fopen(argv[1], "rb")
 
Wrong way to read a file but go on.
 
F4z
how would I put into a buffer each line of that file in binary grouped into 16 bits
so far I've done:
buffer = (short *) malloc(fileLen + 1);
im a little unsure though
 
nwp
that +1 looks weird, you have an extra half short
 
F4z
8:32 AM
like inside the buffer is it possible to have a 16bit item e.g.
0100010100000000
0010000000000001
 
Ven
@nwp \0, obviously. :')
 
F4z
so that doing buffer[0] = 0100010100000000
buffer[1] = 0010000000000001
 
user1804599
@Ven do you use sweetjs do notation
 
Ven
@rightfold I don't use sweetjs
 
user1804599
RIP
 
Ven
8:33 AM
I don't write JS.
actually, I did yesterday, but I used TypeScript.
 
I do write JS
 
user1804599
I'm gonna implement a compiler for the simply typed lambda calculus that targets iron
 
tyeps aren't necessary when your projects is a few hundred loc
 
user1804599
It's really easy to do that and it requires me to implement some stuff in iron.
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz huh.
 
8:35 AM
I think gradual typing is the future
@Ven I am talking from a lone hobbyist PoV now
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz it's even in Clojure nowadays, so it obviously must be
 
user1804599
Clojure is a melting pot of bad ideas
 
probably
but gradual typing is actually the shit
For one, it actually allows you to choose formal abstractions after you write the code
skipping the "code design" part saves a shitload of time
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz I'd star that, but you'd need to talk about modans as well. :P
 
but I think it also needs a truckload of experience to write this way
you need to know all of the possibilities before so that the dynamic code will be easily typed later
 
F4z
8:37 AM
something like
file = fopen(argv[1], "rb");
fseek(file, 0, SEEK_END);
fileLen = ftell(file);
fseek(file, 0, SEEK_SET);

short buffer[2048] = (short *) malloc(fileLen);

fread(buffer, fileLen, 1, file);
fclose(file);
for (int i; i < sizeof (buffer); i++) {
printf("%d", buffer[i])
}
 
otherwise you end up with a write-only codebase
@F4z oh get the hell out with this
 
First ever VR video
https://www.facebook.com/102422673508562/videos/116439402106889/
 
F4z
wut?
 
@F4z Does it look like a C room to you?
 
F4z
is there a C room?
couldnt fine it
 
8:38 AM
this code is absolutely awful
 
Ven
lol
 

C

C stands for Control.
 
F4z
yah sorry, i can't help it :( still learning
 
@F4z the first step to improve would be to stop using C
 
F4z
why?
its ok if you dont like it, im sure other would like to help :)
 
8:39 AM
No
 
Ven
not really
please read our Rules :/
 
@F4z NOT HERE.
 
F4z
guess the last time i cam here with c help , i actually did get some :P
anyway
sorry to bother
 
@F4z because C is a bad language to learn good practices. It's a good language to learn bad practices though.
 
F4z
8:40 AM
wont happen again
lol
 
It doesn't matter if there is a possibility someone at the convenience store might know about mortgages; you don't go to the convenience store to ask them about mortgages.
 
What about paperclips
 
Ven
@F4z well really, there's no reason to ask here instead of on StackOverflow. Or to google some more. Because this sounds almost trivial
 
F4z
i was going to expand on the anser but its fine
 
First rule of Convenience Store Club: you don't talk about mortgages.
 
8:41 AM
> I wrote this piece of code in a bad language, using bad practices, but now I can't fix it.
> It hurts when I poke my eye with a stick.
See how those two seemingly unrelated issues can be solved by "stop what you're doing"
 
Ven
You used to care a lot less, bartek
C is cruise control for unsafe
 
@F4z Read this stackoverflow.com/questions/4810664/…. (I know it's C++, but arrays behave pretty much the same in C)
 
F4z
thanks!
 
> On Sunday Dr Strydom's mother said she was 'praying' for her son-in-law's safety. She earlier told friends that it was the couple's 'mission' to become the 'first vegans' to climb Everest.
> 'praying'. 'mission'
I like the quotes
 
Ven
8:51 AM
'mentally retarded for doing such shit'
 
Climbing Everest is a bit of a joke these days.
 
Not when you're a vegan
 
Sherpas do all the difficult work.
 
I don't think using Sherpas counts as vegan.
 
Ven
8:56 AM
@Griwes I just would love for this to be real.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes no, but the woman who died was
> I didn't get the job.
 
Ven
I think it's best for him. Looks like a shit job
 
@BartekBanachewicz Somewhere in that article there's a hidden information that she was basically never at 3000m+ or something like that. I think.
 
> I think I count 0.90 fizz-accuracy, and 0.95 buzz-accuracy. So it's clearly harder to teach fizzing than buzzing.
@Griwes That pretty much counts as not climbing anything. Base Camp is above 5000m.
 
I know, that's what I'm saying.
Actually let me try to fact-check that.
> Strydom miaÅ‚a doÅ›wiadczenie we wspinaniu siÄ™ na góry, jednak nigdy nie próbowaÅ‚a zdobyć szczytu wyższego niż 3-5 tysiÄ™cy metrów nad poziomem morza.
This says she never climbed anything higher than 3km-5km.
Okay, so the info was far more useless than I thought, but still, never being above 5000m when trying to climb Everest is absurd.
 
8:59 AM
@Griwes lmao
 
@BartekBanachewicz right?
 
okay, so she wasn't just a vegan, she was a badlet
 
@Griwes Oh, you mean before Everest.
 
oh wait I can actually join that
 
I just found that she died on the way back to Camp 4, which means she was in the so-called "Death Zone".
 
9:00 AM
(For the non-Poles, that also says "she was experienced in climbing mountains" or whatever is the proper expression.)
Yes, obviously ;d
 
@Griwes "experienced mountain-climber"?
 
Probably sounds better, yeah.
 
clearly the solution is to make cars with bulletproof windows and more steel reinforcements
that would improve safety right
 
9:05 AM
million bucks view
 
> quit swerving all over the place you dumb ass.
 
who's that directed at
 
It's the top comment.
Pretty sure it's meant for the rider.
 
not for me
the top one with over 1k is ""Are you alright?" ... "Yeah I'm just trying to fix something under your car... Gimme a minute""
 
I have no idea how Google sorts comments.
That said, most people don't crash when they get cut off.
Priority is not absolute.
 
9:11 AM
> I hope this isn't <channel's owner> wife :( it sounds like her :(
 
user1804599
holy guacamole
 
29 mins ago, by Griwes
http://joelgrus.com/2016/05/23/fizz-buzz-in-tensorflow/ lol
it's on the starboard
 
user1804599
oh so that's where I got it from
4
 
user1804599
I forgot how I got there
 
9:22 AM
...
 
user1804599
^_^
 
don't forge to post a link to the chatroom where you found it
 
Ven
@rightfold lol...
@BartekBanachewicz I don't like this channel, its atmosphere is too unfriendly.
 
you know
 
Ven
?
 
9:34 AM
I think the world would be a better place if programming courses taught people how to name things
before introducing language constructs
 
Ven
don't trashtalk Mysticial like that
 
if you type in "for loop <lang X>" you're gonna get shitload of examples and results and tutorials
but try "how should I name my class" and suddenly you leave the world of knowledge, and enter the world of opinionated bikeshedding, most of it bad
 
@BartekBanachewicz That's a creative activity. Really hard to teach.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Schools teach art.
 
Ven
don't trashtalk Luc Danton like that
 
9:37 AM
@BartekBanachewicz Look how that works out :P
 
did you just belittle all art schools
One way to teach art is to show existing pieces
Same can be done with naming things.
 
Ven
as always, it requires to label things as "good" (as well as "bad", but that's easier, right)
 
The courses focus way too much on writing code, and not nearly enough on reading and analyzing existing code
@Ven that's why it takes an experienced lecturer. The only option, which seems to be in mainstream currently, is to offload that burden to the students
Which plainly means they use libraries and APIs and code where they can't tell good and bad apart
 
Ven
@BartekBanachewicz you'll have a really hard time having people agree on what a "good" name is
 
Before I came to the lounge I thought Singleton Objects are amazing
 
Ven
9:39 AM
Your favorite language simply gave up on naming things and only uses symbolic operators nowadays.
 
operator is also a name
@Ven at least filter out the bad ones then
 
Ven
that's more doable
 
I have to try that at codementor next time
 
@BartekBanachewicz See, now you've driven yourself into a ditch. What common rules or guidelines can you follow that can lead to both things like *> and sort?
 
Hey um
does anybody know of a good Extended Backus-Naur Form interpreter?
 
9:43 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think that *> is by far more advanced.
 
Ven
Anyone using -Wdocumentation on clang? I'd like to silence system/boost headers
 
might be a misleading example
 
Ven
@VermillionAzure for a specific language?
 
@Ven No, for the form itself
Parsers are hard to write so... yeah
 
@VermillionAzure not in Haskell. There's still the 1 hour cinch challenge BTW
 
9:44 AM
Good naming requires a good understanding of language (so you have enough vocabulary to produce names), a good understanding of the subject matter (so you have enough knowledge to know which properties are important to reflect in the name and which aren't), and a strong ability to summarise (so you know how to reflect only the properties that are important in the name).
#1 and #3 come from general education.
 
Perhaps I should try and build it myself
@BartekBanachewicz ohhh right
 
#2 requires study for every domain.
 
Haskell
 
And the rest is just practice or inate creativity.
 
I am entirely confident I can teach Parsec to you in an hour
if only just to prove sehe wrong
 
9:45 AM
@BartekBanachewicz So it's 11:45 here...
Let's start at 12pm
 
or 12am
Welp then idk
 
it's 11:45 here as well
but do you mean it's 11:45 pm or am?
@R.MartinhoFernandes apparently they don't.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Reading and analyzing existing code is also "practice"
 
@BartekBanachewicz My point is that there's really nothing specific you need to add to programming courses to teach this.
 
see above
 
9:48 AM
@BartekBanachewicz pm
 
I think the only pieces of code I was shown were algorithmic bullshit with names like i j k l
@VermillionAzure lol, okay, so it's 12h difference
we can do it when you wake up
 
@BartekBanachewicz cannot
I work all tomorrow
 
wake up earlier :P
 
9:50 AM
also what is vOv is that a shrug
or is that an "ohhhhh" emoticon?
 
it's a shrug
 
ah.
never got that... until now
 
@BartekBanachewicz I had to do work on code written by other people in at least three classes.
 
that's not the same
I didn't mean "you're given (bad) code, now interact with it"
I meant "this is the code, let's analyze it"
 
You mean doing full reviews?
 
9:53 AM
yes
 
I wonder what type of business model you could put on that
 
uh wut
my VPN server is showing traffic
I didn't use it
 
ooooweeeeeooooo
 
anyway I have to use this money because thanks to their amazing rules it will disappear soon
 
@BartekBanachewicz I actually think working on it makes it better to see what's good and what's bad (because you'll be cursing at what's bad).
 
9:58 AM
shit I actually only have like 5 months
@R.MartinhoFernandes people often don't realize what's bad
cue singletons
 
@BartekBanachewicz But hopeless cases are hopeless.
You can't just tell them "here, this is bad code; look at it closely so you know" and expect them to get there from just cargo-culting.
 
Ven
@BenjaminGruenbaum have you used Sanctuary / Fantasy-Land ? (in untyped JS)
 
so, @R.MartinhoFernandes, are you using your yubikey for ssh storage? ;)
 
10:15 AM
@BartekBanachewicz I'm going to as soon as I have an afternoon free to read about how to use it on Windows.
 
Ell
They recently moved away from free software right?
 
I have keys in it, but I am still using my old key file until I check that out. Then I'll just use the YubiKey everywhere.
@Ell ?
 
Ell
That's all I've heard about them :P I'll see if I can find what I saw
Can't find it vOv
I think it was about them stopping you from reprogramming them or something
I don't know.
 
okay, my droplet created
@Ell great
 
@Ell Oh, I found it.
 
10:22 AM
also I am proud to say I didn't use a linux for this droplet
toot toot
 
The newer ones (YK4) use a non-open-source GPG implementation.
That is really shitty.
I have a NEO, though. (Two, actually)
 
which one was neo
 
If I ever decide to get a new device, I guess I'll have to find another manufacturer.
 
oh okay I have the same one
 
Also meh, I don't want a 4.
 
10:25 AM
so hmpfh pkg gave me git 2.7.4
 
They added support for 4096-bit keys and PKCS#11, which are nice, but I can do without, I guess, and removed NFC which means I can't use it nicely with the phone.
 
and node 5.11.1, not bad
 
No NFC is a dealbreaker.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes yeah, sounds like a downgrade
 
10:26 AM
I do have a USB-A-to-microUSB adapter, but it's really annoying if I have to use that to use the key with the phone.
 
lolwut, what's "games pseudo-user"
 
@Ell You can still buy NEOs if you still want one, though. I am really happy with it.
 
Oooooh til about GitHub tokens over https
cool
 
@BartekBanachewicz ?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes you can generate one-time password for https access
I mean I am adding a deploy key now
but I tried to use https and it obv didn't work
 
10:36 AM
You mean to use git over https?
 
yeah
anyway, uh, where does FreeBSD store its keys
I deployed a Digital Ocean droplet and added a key when creating
but they key isn't on the machine anywhere :/
 
That's not a OTP.
 
ooh /etc/ssh
 
It's a regular API key.
It's basically a scoped password that you can revoke.
 
okay, so another question
is copying the root key to use it as a deploy key okay?
 
10:38 AM
I'd just generate one.
 
I am afraid of being swamped in keys
but yeah prolly a better idea
 
The keys in /etc/ssh are meant to validate the server when SSH clients connect to it.
 
I need a LastPass for ssh keys
 
@BartekBanachewicz Only a few access keys are important enough to care about losing them. Anything else can be regenerated whenever.
 
10:40 AM
The key that you use to access the server? Important. The key(s) that the server uses for anything else you might use it for? Fungible.
 
it's trivial to generate a new one and add it to GH
which I just prove by doing it
 
I never copy private keys around.
 
heh, works :3
I remember when I was like 14-16
reading about hacking and shell accounts
having a shell on a remote server was something back then
 
guise
question from Cacadi
why is this assembly output here godbolt.org/g/vtTljc so different to the what Clang produces godbolt.org/g/ATMjMw
 
Ell
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm not sure what they are for really. I know you can store keys on them
Is it for unlocking your encrypted hard drives on boot or for internet passwords or what?
 
10:53 AM
^ I do not want to watch that with sound. Can somebody watch it and tell me what is going on there? :)
 
user1804599
moveZombies s = s { zombies = _ } <$> for s.zombies \z -> do
    dx <- randomInt (-1) 1
    dy <- randomInt (-1) 1
    let x = z.position.x + dx
        y = z.position.y + dy
    pure $ if isObstacle (getWorldTile x y s.world).tile
               then z
               else z { position = {x, y} }
 
user1804599
:):):)
 
user1804599
@wilx People dancing being arrested for reasons not apparent from the video, lots of angry people commenting also without knowing what is going on.
 
@rightfold It appears they are being arrested for dancing...
 
user1804599
Maybe there's a sign that says you can't dance there? I dunno.
 
user1804599
10:57 AM
There's probably a reason for it.
 

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