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11:00
@DeadMG No, the new one replaces the old one
@StackedCrooked mark it as volatile
@Abyx Ah, right.
it still will be UB, but compiler would think that something may initialize it
I guess it won't be UB any more. You will get an unspecified value, but never order pizza.
@StackedCrooked LLVM supports it. You could write that specific function in LLVM IR, then compile it to object file, then link it.
11:02
@StackedCrooked I think there is/was an exception for type char, it was the subject of a NB comment, GB-2 in n3733
but I don't know what the resolution of that was and whether the exception stands
Never fully read/understood that issue/discussion, so I can't say for sure
@R.MartinhoFernandes but tools like the address sanitizer will bark at it.
@Abyx Oh, quite likely.
Maybe int a; char* c = reinterpret_cast<char*>(&a); *c; // in which statement is UB introduced?
user1804599
@FredOverflow it replaces the process. :v
11:05
@StackedCrooked Last one.
@StackedCrooked oh you
woops.
@DeadMG The process image gets replaced with the new one. RIP is set to the new image's entry point, etc, etc. About the only things that are kept into the "new" process image are things like open file descriptors (which is one way to redirect stdin and stdout: fork a copy of you, and in that copy replace the stdin and stdout fds as appropriate, then call exec; also works for setting up pipes)
11:30
@R.MartinhoFernandes exec is like some devious alien parasite taking over the host's body
11:45
¬_¬ if a merge works first time, something broke
@thecoshman It will work after you've flipped a few tables.
@GamesBrainiac (ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
@thecoshman hahaha copied
is that all you people think of me as? some table upending service?
No, just one of your many lovely features.
11:51
my arse
Hm, I'd like the ability to change the log-level at runtime.
@StackedCrooked Cant you do that in Python?
I mean C++
C++ doesn't have logging (apart from clog).
It's a logging utility I wrote myself.
11:55
I'd need some for of IPC.
oh great, imports have gone fucking twat ways
Maybe a named pipe.
@StackedCrooked where you do want to control the log-level from?
@thecoshman from orbit
Basically I have ssh access to the machine.
I only need to know its IP.
12:02
¬_¬
@StackedCrooked I've seen .NET loggers watching a config file and re-reading it when changed.
I think I'll rewrite my UCD parsers in Python. Since I'll require Python for the build anyway, I can remove one dependency and not care about which compiler to use to build the C# files.
2% battery
Anyway up for contributing? In truth, they can be either in Python or in C++ (since C++ compilers are also required for the build already :P).
It's just parsing some huge text files.
What do they look like?
12:17
@R.MartinhoFernandes You seem to be obsessing over Unicode for some reason.
Slowpoke.
Jul 21 '12 at 20:38, by R. Martinho Fernandes
Also, I'd like to note that, after a month of Unicode, I'm still not crazy.
Fuck, more than a year ago.
I need to take my mind off things, I can write it
Lunch time! Ping me if you want to take on the parsing task.
@R.MartinhoFernandes looks like it'd be pretty trivial
@R.MartinhoFernandes You poor bastard, still decoding all that stuff I see :P
@jalf o hai! :)
12:22
um, hi
how're you doin?
pretty good. Want to go home and play some kerbals :p
Whats with this lounge and friggin kerbals?
2 days ago, by DeadMG

Lounge<Kerbal>

What does the goo do?
12:26
Kerballin'
That room is about as popular as this one
Also, I wanted to ask, say you've been away from C++ for a while, and you need a refresher, what would you do? I've got Tour of C++, are there any other resources that can serve as a good refresher?
@GamesBrainiac I'd stay away
@GamesBrainiac a Snake clone of course.
@Jefffrey Tetris > Snake
@CatPlusPlus Oh, come on. There's got to be some other stuff!
12:27
You don't need a C++ refresher, once you've done C++ for a while, you realize how painful it is, and from then on it becomes grifted in your mind for once and for all.
user1804599
> if (pid = 0) {
My vim is broken :(
user1804599
I’m such an idiot.
@GamesBrainiac Watch all STL videos is what I would do.
@CatPlusPlus use emacs
@FredOverflow thanks :)
12:28
@rightfold Looking for stars?
@rightfold if (0 = pid) you could use.
user1804599
@FredOverflow meh yoda expressions.
How about if (!pid)?
@rightfold in C# that wouldn't even compile
How about a compiler that refuses to compile if (pid = 0)?
12:29
see above
Fuck implicit conversions
There are also C++ compilers that refuse to compile if (pid = 0) with the right options.
user1804599
@TonyTheLion It doesn’t compile in C++ either, as clang politely emits an error.
@CatPlusPlus That's your answer to everything, isn't it? ;)
12:30
@rightfold clang != C++
@rightfold go back to PHP.
user1804599
@FredOverflow Also GCC.
user1804599
(I don’t care about compilers that are not GCC or clang.)
> Inside STL (the person) lol gay C++ porn
12:32
Error? Really? I thought it would trigger a warning, at the very maximum.
user1804599
Warnings don’t exist.
Werrors are Warning errors?
Oh I didn't see the flag. :/
Warning: undefined reference to warning
12:34
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: meetingcpp 2013 - sane advice overflow [c++] [c++11] [c++1y] [no-gotchas] [no-questions] [no-tricks]
user1804599
How’s the meeting?
@sehe you paid for the wifi?
@rightfold good so far, we're just about to start the first round of non-keynote talks
user1804599
if (errno == ENOMEM) {
    throw std::bad_alloc();
} else {
    throw std::system_error(errno, std::system_category());
}
user1804599
Meh, I think this is ugly. :/
user1804599
@je4d cool :)
user1804599
12:36
Will the talks be available online?
Hint: it's not actually a meeting. And yes so far, solid value. Eric didn't disappoint - and he's already quite high in my esteem. That's quite an achievement
@rightfold no idea
@sehe Hey, did you kick out all the kerbals?
@je4d nope. Roaming
@GamesBrainiac no they entered a different orbit
@sehe Eric who?
12:37
@sehe you kicked them that hard?
lol
@rightfold should be but probably less Swift than the big conferences
@Jefffrey Niebler
@rightfold oh for the love of your vanity, stop changing your damned avatar!
Also nice to meet Jeff in real life. Less curly hair these days, I suppose. But I shouldn't comment as I'm not even wearing my bear suit :)
user1804599
You have a suit?
12:40
@kbok did you and your friend (s) make it to meeting cpp?
@rightfold several. Tuxedo, smoking, bathing, ...
user1804599
If I open up my closet I see a bunch of T-shirts and two sweaters. :P
Eric's blog looks interesting.
If I open up my back pack I see just a conference shirt
@sehe huh? I never had curly hair
user1804599
$ curl hair
curl: (6) Could not resolve host: hair
12:44
@rightfold They do at least have video cameras & mics pointed at the speakers
@je4d Oh don't mind me, that just means your gravatar is to small for me and my brain inferred the curls. See, that's important, I'm happy that's out of the way now. I hope you're not underwhelmed with my lack of light colored body hair :)
@sehe Given that polar bears are one of very few species that will actively hunt humans, I'm pretty glad you turned out to not actually be one.
Should I assume that x{y} is always better than x(y) for constructing objects?
Xeo
Xeo
no
assume that x(y) is better
12:49
@je4d good point
@Xeo Why is he using the other form almost anywhere?
I'm in track b with Somerlad talking :) I'll let you know how I cope
@sehe enjoy :)
@FredOverflow Thanks so much for the resource fred. Its a great one! :) big hug
12:56
@FredOverflow For some reason I can't keep my focus for longer than 10-20 minutes on his videos. My thoughts start wandering after a while..
@StackedCrooked Information overflow? Or do you already know all the stuff anyway and get bored?
I guess the endless rambling.
And usually most of the stuff he says I already know, with occasionally new things mixed in.
@FredOverflow Oh dear me. I feel like a kid in a candy shop :)
@GamesBrainiac That list hasn't been updated in a while, though.
Well as long as its got C++11 who cares.
13:00
4
Q: Which greedy initializer-list examples are lurking in the Standard Library?

TemplateRexSince C++11, the Standard Library containers and std::string have constructors taking an initializer-list. This constructor takes precedence over other constructors (even, as pointed out by @JohannesSchaub-litb in the comments, even ignoring other "best match" criteria). This leads to a few well-...

auto, range-based for loop and lambda's are probably the most used C++11 features.
The ones you should start with.
@StackedCrooked in-class initializers are also very convenient, I tend to use them a lot
user1804599
@StackedCrooked move semantics.
@TemplateRex I wish I could use those. (Still stuck at GCC 4.5 at work.)
@StackedCrooked ouch, that's ancient stuff
13:02
Soon we'll update to GCC 4.7.
..gentoo rootfs
in-class initializers, inheritining/delegating constructors all play nicely together
lol... someone just leaned on the emergency exit door at the back of the room and set the alarm off
the speaker is having a little trouble concentrating
@rightfold Yeah, but mostly invisible.
@TemplateRex Oh, I see the pitfalls now. Thanks.
@Jefffrey but apart from those exceptions, I write {} everywhere, makes it easier to distinguish function calls from object creation
user1804599
13:07
I want apple juice but I ran out of apple juice.
That sucks.
user1804599
Yes. :'(
@GamesBrainiac Hmm, to be honest, the C++ has been more of an obstacle than the Unicode.
@jalf Yeah, it's not hard at all, but there's a bunch of different files to process.
@CatPlusPlus Oh cool. Python then, I guess?
Yes
I'm the best at Python
hey guys what do you think of this as a paper title : "Search Based Edge Detection: A Brief Primer" ?
13:11
@CatPlusPlus Why not just write Python with C extensions if you need optimisation?
@CatPlusPlus I mean you're friggin good at the language.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Yea, well no surprise there :P
I use C# mostly lately
@GamesBrainiac because python has no real class
@CatPlusPlus C# + R# is just plain cheating.
@CatPlusPlus Data is here unicode.org/Public/UCD/latest/ucd (the UCD.zip has all the files if you want an easy download). Specs are here unicode.org/reports/tr44.
13:12
@CatPlusPlus I've tried using C#, that left a deep scar
Python is okay but I don't want dynamic typing
@BartekBanachewicz How so?
@GamesBrainiac Because he's bad
@CatPlusPlus I tried mypy, I ddnt like it.
@GamesBrainiac can you reply to messages?
13:13
@BartekBanachewicz Mate, C++ is what leaves the scarring
Cython was okay but it had some quirks.
@TonyTheLion where did I say C++ is good?
@BartekBanachewicz Sure, sorry about that.
You didn't but I assumed that is what you meant
anyway that int shader handle really turned me off
that was like a slap in the face.
13:14
what is that?
@BartekBanachewicz Yes, that's a deep problem with the language
@CatPlusPlus language is nothing w/o libraries
I'm not even going to
@CatPlusPlus me neither.
then don't. Go back to the basement.
13:15
@CatPlusPlus I also have a parser from the XML sources written in C# here: github.com/rmartinho/ogonek/blob/stable/tools/ucd2c%2B%2B/… (which is the one I am retiring).
lol, Bartek so sensitive.
This language is so terrible, I tried one library and it was awful :qq:
lol
@CatPlusPlus what language?
@GamesBrainiac C#, see above.
Do try to keep up
@R.MartinhoFernandes that was a low blow
What OpenTK did.
I weren't expecting that
caught me unprepared.
I'd think that those C# people know at least some shit about writing code.
Dear me CodepointSet is long.
I didn't even look at other libraries doing the same thing!
I don't even
@CatPlusPlus which part of turned me off didn't you get?
The part where you're acting dumb
13:19
lol I guess insulting C# is someone's weak spot
I think you mean "weak spot".
It's about making a modicum of sense
And I think what annoys him is that you're being ridiculous.
Just a tiiiiny bit at least
13:20
@R.MartinhoFernandes I know that he's incapable of being a developed species, TYVM
@R.MartinhoFernandes You didn't think I despise whole C# because OpenTK sucks, did you?
See, Robot gets it
because Cat of course did, but he's socially inapt.
I like Robot, he's smart and I don't have to break down everything into Simple English when talking with him
13:22
what that has to do with anything
7 mins ago, by Bartek Banachewicz
then don't. Go back to the basement.
@GamesBrainiac It's basically all the properties in one place. However, if you split it into smaller groups, you can save a lot of memory and make the whole thing a lot faster because it ends up needing to process less things. (It is goddamn slow).
I kinda wrote it as a one-off. That was a mistake.
Hmm, I see. I was actually looking at how you structured the whole thing. Could I take a look at some code, that you're proud of designing?
I just want to see how you structured the application.
I don't care about the language.
Hmm, look at some C++ code elsewhere in the repo, I guess.
The tools/ folder was written as legacy code from the start :(
Heh - I've been developing software for 35 years, and I can think of only a couple things that I was actually proud of designing. After delivery, my usual emotion is 'profound fear and worry'.
@R.MartinhoFernandes boost is all over the place :P
13:27
@GamesBrainiac That's because it explodes on liftoff.
@GamesBrainiac Boost.Range, mainly. I am replacing it on a separate branch. Usage of boost will then be limited to optionally Boost.Exception and hashing.
What coding standards do you guys use for class names?
Whatever fits
none, I don't write code
@Jefffrey hungarian.
13:29
Like className, ClassName, class_name..
When I'm done with that, I'll consider actually dropping all the non-optional uses of boost I have.
ClassName
@Jefffrey ClassName for functions functon_name
Whatever fits
and in C++ I like class_name
13:29
basically Python's PEP8
@TonyTheLion I'm beginning to like that too
@TonyTheLion would it not be better to have those as function names?
both
Who needs capital letters anyway?
wait so you want to call a function some_function and a property someProperty?
@Jefffrey 'TobjectPool', (left over from Delphi). It would be nice to use 'C'. but I use that for constants 'CinitialPoolDepth'.
13:31
@Jefffrey I capitalize types. Note how that sentence doesn't contain "class".
And what about private properties? m_property, _property, property_, ...?
@Jefffrey property
@BartekBanachewicz _some_property.
Xeo
Xeo
_underscore_love
@Jefffrey meh
I don't see why you should name private and public properties differently
they already have public and private in front of them (somehow)
13:33
@BartekBanachewicz Because I like to avoid get in getters.
@Jefffrey wait what
how is that related?
Think.
reasonable languages allow you to redefine property access
so I still don't see how it's related.
If a property is apple and I want to return it with a getter method, it would be apple() const { return apple; }, which collides.
then call it whatever really
what matters is the outside.
13:35
apple() const { return _apple; } does not.
I like the_ prefices. Never use them, though.
Exactly.
I usually do m_
_ in C#
Better than this->
@MartinJames what's a bject pool, and why are you converting to one? :P
@MartinJames Awful
13:37
@CatPlusPlus Thanks:)
Xeo
Xeo
I use :: as a prefix for constants. colors::red :D
@MartinJames I agree with cat, here.
Hmm, MSVC does not allow uniform_int_distribution<uint8_t>. WTF
It allows uniform_int_distribution<int8_t>, though.
Is this supposed to be?
@FredOverflow Needs updating with GN13 stuff.
I use more than one language, so I adopt a consistent approach. I'm not too bothered by the criticism - it's not the first time I've posted stuff on here that invokes mass vomiting:)
Haskell conventions are best conventions
13:39
@BartekBanachewicz where where where
Xeo
Xeo
@R.MartinhoFernandes Did you try uniform_uint_distribution? :D
@FredOverflow what what what
Xeo
Xeo
@FredOverflow Not "convention" as in "meeting", but as in "style"
@Xeo lol
@BartekBanachewicz Oh gosh, now that rightfold stopped, are you taking up that role?
@Xeo oh :(
Xeo
Xeo
13:41
@R.MartinhoFernandes He's been getting worse and worse over the last few weeks. :|
@CatPlusPlus I hate the this-> qualifier. Makes thing so ugly.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I think that those scarce good pieces of technology are worth of recognition.
Also thoughts on this (yes I know it's outdated)
user1804599
I prefer trailing _ and only if there is a member function with the same name.
@BartekBanachewicz I think that when the people that also like Haskell start to be annoyed by the constant mention of how awesome it is, it is time to stop.
I kinda understand why some people are so averse to even trying it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Uh when I'm trying to say something positive... fine!
13:42
My dislike for this-> diminished as my number of template base classes increased.
I'll get back to ranting on other things I'm trying to use
Xeo
Xeo
@StackedCrooked heh
I'm wondering about just another prototype, with Cinder and Awesomium
(*this).that = that->that;
@StackedCrooked Hmm, I don't think I have used that much, to be honest.
13:45
@User17 Heh - I don't think so:)
Hey - you edited it while I was replying!
this-> is useful when you have a local variable of the same name in the function
@MartinJames Didn't get any better, though.
Also GCC 4.5 requires this-> when accessing member variables inside lambdas.
@User17 No, that's when it is annoying.
@R.MartinhoFernandes True.
13:47
@CatPlusPlus There's TK, Tao (which was replaced by TK), OpenGL4Net (which has a sole author who states that after GL spec change community would have to wait for 4.4) and SharpGL (which apparently was last updated about 18 months ago)
@BartekBanachewicz Moral of the story: the OpenGL community sucks.
@R.MartinhoFernandes Or maybe they don't see C# as a particularly interesting language for using OpenGL
current SharpGL 2.1
date Wed Jan 30, 2013 at 9:00 AM
status Stable
Yup, 18 months, confirmed
@CatPlusPlus oh interesting
@BartekBanachewicz Oh right, that's why there are four different bindings for it. Totally zero interest.
13:48
Uh, the SharpGL page sharpgl.codeplex.com
hm alrighty let's give this one a go
I don't know
It's just first 4 results in Google for "sharpgl"
I found the old site vOv
@je4d Maybe he's just infiltrating.
I can not get into interpreting "vOv" as a shrug. I just read veee-oooo-veeee
its kind of awkward reading it that way
13:54
Amazing.
Folder "sample applications" has only binaries in it
uint[] txtnumber = new uint[1];
examples are in GL 1.x
13:57
Perfect for your Intel GPU
user1804599
@TonyTheLion I can. vOv
@CatPlusPlus :thumbsup: on "you suck for not looking at other libraries"
:thumbsup: on missing the point
13:59
Bartek & Cat cannot help but disagree with one another

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