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6:00 PM
Performance does not exist in a vacuum.
 
user1804599
You know what's slow? Advancement of technologies for cleaning your ass. I mean, why the fuck are we still using toilet paper. It's 2013.
 
@not-rightfold Not in Japan.
 
Use wet wipes.
 
What does Japan use?
Also, wet wipes sound gross.
 
@ThePhD Spray.
 
6:01 PM
Then again, toilet paper is gross.
.... Spray?
... Spray ?
 
Techno-toilets
 
You still need paper to dry off though.
 
... Oh
 
user1804599
@StackedCrooked föhn
 
@ThePhD It's sprays water up your butt.
 
6:02 PM
I don't want a wet ass after I shit. Gross.
 
@ThePhD A bidet-like toilet.
 
And you have different settings to play with.
 
user1804599
Also, unless you have incredibly good toilet paper, wiping is a pain in the ass (dat pun) if your ass is sweaty.
 
bidet's sound so awesome.
clean with water, pat dry. My butthole would be so happy
 
@EtiennedeMartel inlining is one of those special cases where a single inlined call is pretty much always faster than an actual call. Hmm.. got any good examples where it's not preferable for a call to be inlined?
 
user1804599
6:04 PM
I want to shit and be able to stand up and pull up my pants whenever I want. The toilet should be quick enough to clean it before I do that.
 
user1804599
That's technology.
 
user1804599
I don't want to have to think about it.
 
lol
eat more fiber
 
@willj ~~Bloat~~
 
Squatting is a posture where the weight of the body is on the feet (as with standing) but the knees are bent either fully (full or deep squat) or partially (partial, half, semi, parallel or monkey squat). In contrast, sitting, involves taking the weight of the body, at least in part, on the buttocks against the ground or a horizontal object such as a chair seat. may involve squatting or kneeling. It is possible to squat with one leg and assume another position (such as kneeling) with the other leg. Among Chinese and Vietnamese adults, squatting often takes the place of sitting or standing...
Why does this have such a long wiki article
 
user1804599
6:05 PM
Jar Squatter.
 
@Rapptz Squatting is important.
 
> Most western adults cannot place their heels flat on the ground when squatting because of shortened Achilles tendons largely caused by habitually:[4]
seems dubious
the little [4] seems to lend some credibility, but it cites dailymail.co.uk.
 
Xeo
@not-rightfold Blah blah, lambda, yadda yadda, unevaluated context, foo bar baz
 
It's true that footnotes give more credibility[1].
 
Xeo
[1]: Not fully researched, see [2].
 
6:11 PM
That links not broken at all!
 
Xeo
aahaha
 
masculinism.
That's quite new.
 
tubmlr.txt
Or maybe reddit.
StartSSL is silly.
You can have however many free certificates you want, but each needs to be on a different domain.
 
Still doing your reflection thing?
 
Yes.
I've been finding more resources on reflection, though.
A lot of them use template metaprogramming to get as much done at compile time as possible.
But it's still not good enough.
 
user1804599
Use a language that offers reflection. Problem solved. Next!
 
I wonder what would become of Google if lots of people did blocks ads.
 
Xeo
I have to admit, I don't quite see @jalf's problem with class templates - just have a reflection type that stands for "class template" with all parameters of the specialization in a member.
 
user1804599
6:24 PM
@Pawnguy7 Wouldn't make a slight difference.
 
huh?
Do I have a problem with class templates?
 
@Xeo The problem is, you can't instantiate that at run-time, so being told "there's a template there" is just "uh... well, okay?"
 
Xeo
@jalf Your answer on why C++ doesn't have reflection
 
@jalf From your 360+ upvoted answer on "Why C++ doesn't have reflection?"
 
@Xeo oh right
 
Xeo
6:24 PM
@ThePhD Erm, so what? If you pre-parse the code, you see which templates are potentially instantiated.
 
Yeah, so the only things that mattered are pre-instantiated templates.
Actual templates themselves are uninstantiable.
 
@not-rightfold How not? Isn't most of the income from ads?
 
(At run-time)
 
Xeo
@Pawnguy7 lolno
 
Mmmh I wrote a simple range::make_array but it returns an std::array, not a range.
 
6:25 PM
@Xeo lolyes?
 
user1804599
@Pawnguy7 No.
 
user1804599
All income is from the NSA! :P
 
@LucDanton Isn't std::array a range?
 
@Pawnguy7 Yeah.
 
@Xeo one problem is that you may end up having a lot of (otherwise irrelevant) types to generate reflection data for, which could end up quite big and bloated (think of all the traits classes, and the intermediary types instantiated under the hood in a lot of TMP'ish code
 
6:28 PM
The python troll seems to be AWOL today... :(
 
@Mysticial No i flagged one like an hour ago
 
Isn't that a good thing?
 
Not an insurmountable problem, but it might warrant a bit of thought, because a lot of C++ programs generate types like nobody's business :p
 
Can't say I'm interested in reflection.
 
Xeo
@jalf My idea is that you have one reflection object per type / template, and a template-reflection-object just has certain type-reflection-objects in a member which designates template parameters.
 
6:29 PM
@Xeo how do you handle specializations then?
 
user1804599
D.
 
Xeo
@jalf What makes them special?
 
@Xeo they need separate reflection data because they don't follow the same structure as the main template?
say you have one reflection object for std::vector, it is precisely no good for describing vector<bool>.
 
Xeo
class reflection_template : reflection_kind{
  std::vector<reflection_kind*> template_parameters;
  std::vector<reflection_kind*> members;
};
Something along those lines
I have to admit though, I haven't thought very deeply about reflection
 
-8
Q: Basic java programming

avishaWrite a program that accepts two positive integer values x and n, and uses a function to calculate the value of x raised to the power n. The result should be returned to the main function and displayed.

^^ -8 in real time
 
6:33 PM
lol
deleted
 
@Xeo That doesn't really help at run-time though, does it?
 
> Additional Check Required!
 
@willj You can't always inline.
 
Great automated system guys
 
I mean, you can describe what a template might be, but that doesn't mean its instantiation will look anything like the original template declaration.
 
Xeo
6:34 PM
@ThePhD What does runtime have to do with anything?
 
@Xeo You haven't reflected deeply about reflection. -FTFY
 
@Xeo Oh, uh. Just wondering.
I'm considering both Runtime and Compile-time reflection.
I'm building a runtime system first, and then backporting to consider compile-time stuff
 
do compile-time first, it's vastly simpler and easier.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Indeed - but when you can, why not? :)
 
@Xeo I don't see how that solves it, since different specializations of the same template can have different members, or the same members can have different types, which needs to be expressed. It could certainly be done, but getting it right would be a lot trickier than in something like C# where the set of types is easily known
 
6:35 PM
compile-time reflection is just simplifying the type_traits stuff.
 
This is PhD logic though, he probably derped somewhere along the way, and then forgot about actual logic :P
 
and which doesn't magically spout hundreds of new intermediary types which aren't actually relevant for reflection purposes, and that you normally rely on being inlined out of existence
 
@willj Code size can affect instruction cache
 
@willj What I meant is that if you can't, then perhaps you don't have to try and inline it.
Because it might not matter.
 
user1804599
I want identifier template parameters.
 
6:36 PM
36 mins ago, by Etienne de Martel
Performance does not exist in a vacuum.
 
@EtiennedeMartel vacuum cleaners have performance
 
@TonyTheLion Except @not-rightfold
 
he sucks
 
user1804599
dat pun
 
Tremendously.
 
6:37 PM
@CatPlusPlus true.. but in a way that would make the uninlined version faster? I guess that's possible in theory but I can't think of a good example
 
1:30h for food, 3h for certificate, what is it with world today.
Whatever.
@willj Because cache might matter more than call overhead, which is tiny and mostly irrelevant.
 
Xeo
@not-rightfold Yeah, I was considering making a proposal for that
But that would need to consider so many things...
 
But hey, profiling.
 
Hey @jalf, Do you think something like constexpr-ing an intersection test all the way through would allow it to optimize math out for things like the 'z' axis if the 'z' all the way through is specified to be 0?
 
I would think a vacuum cleaner only has limited processing power, so performance would be critical in that scenario
 
user1804599
6:40 PM
template<typename T, identifier foo>
using member = typename T::@foo;
 
user1804599
:D
 
@willj er, why not? A cache miss can cost 100 cycles. A cache hit costs around 3. So if your code is big enough to cost just a few cache misses, it quickly starts hurting
@ThePhD Wat? I'm not the constexpr expert around here :D
 
Hm.
Maybe I should ask Luc
 
@ScottW ohhhhh
 
But I think Luc's plonked me a long time ago because of my silliness.
So I'd have to proxy-ask him.
 
user1804599
6:41 PM
@LucDanton Did you plonk ThePhD a long time ago because of his silliness?
 
I think everybody except robot and xeo are in Luc's plonk list
4
 
Xeo
lol
 
user1804599
lol
 
It's not exactly a bad thing. Luc's at a level now that really only Xeo, Cat, and Robot can keep up with him.
Most of us would just be bothering him with questions. :c
 
6:42 PM
I thought Cat gave up on CPP
 
In terms of plonking Luc is anti-@EtiennedeMartel
 
@TonyTheLion I'm not on his plonk list!
 
Oh, and Rapptz.
 
Interestingly, Luc is one of the few people here who's here for the C++ first and the Lounge second.
 
6:43 PM
I don't know if I'm on his plonk list
 
Rapptz is like Luc's template pupil.
 
@TonyTheLion I'm not.
 
I can't recall the last time he talked about something that wasn't C++ related.
 
@jalf ah, that's true if the call is in a branch that may not be taken. The scenario in my head didn't involve any branching - a performance-critical inner-loop type of thing
 
@EtiennedeMartel I concur. He seems to appear when he needs C++.
 
6:44 PM
Oh, woops I forgot DeadMG on the list of people who can keep up with Luc.
 
Someone's gotta keep us "on topic" somehow!
 
And Minecraft.
 
I think that's everyone...
 
It's like he's in his own fantasy world.
 
Some people have less of a life than others. Which ones are which category, I'll leave up to you to decide.
 
6:44 PM
@EtiennedeMartel That tends to happen to musicians.
Is Luc French?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Templates.
 
Luc sounds like a french name.
 
@TonyTheLion The more appropriate question is, why would I want a life?
 
Sometimes German.
 
6:45 PM
@DeadMG Because you're alive
 
@ThePhD It's not his real name. It's a play on "Dans ton cul", which means "In your ass".
 
meh
 
(Also no, I can't keep up with template stuff)
 
@EtiennedeMartel OMG TIL
 
I never found that to be a particularly beneficial attribute.
 
6:45 PM
@EtiennedeMartel omfg WHAT!?!?
 
@EtiennedeMartel Hee.
 
@DeadMG You make me want to cry :'(
 
@Borgleader Pas vite vite toi, hein?
 
@EtiennedeMartel I remember when you had that revelation last year.
 
6:48 PM
@willj it doesn't have to involve branching (although that can help).
 
Oh never mind.
Oct 24 '12 at 15:59, by Cicada
> Special thanks go to the person that goes by "Luc Danton"
@LucDanton It's sad the sheer number of people who'll never get the subtle pun of this nickname :(
 
@TonyTheLion Sorry.
 
How long have I been in this Lounge.
3
 
Too long
 
@Rapptz Yes.
 
6:49 PM
Well then.
If it's been too long.
2
 
I've been here for a year and some months.
 
then what?
you stay longer
 
The longer the better, I guess.
 
I think I'll have been here for a year a week or two from now.
 
6:50 PM
coming up on four years I am
 
user1804599
fuck you team viewer
 
user1804599
Why do you have an installer.
 
user1804599
Just give me a zip of the app.
 
@jalf lol I was reading your answers and I found the disclaimer at the end of this funny
basically said "THIS EXAMPLE SUCKS, BEAR WITH ME"
 
and then a wild polar bear appears
 
6:52 PM
Requesting memory from OS is slow, not heap allocations.
 
@TonyTheLion Really? I'm only coming up on three. And you only joined the Lounge about two weeks before me.
 
@EtiennedeMartel He said it wasn't
 
Xeo
@kbok What? When?
 
I joined in 2010. That makes for three years.
 
Anyway, the guy had an unmistakable accent on Mumble. You can't fake Frenchyness of that magnitude.
 
6:54 PM
@StackedCrooked A week before Tony.
 
I've always been here. I'm ancient and forever.
 
@Xeo In a discussion with Cicada/Rakkun I think
 
hell, a lot of us seemed to join in like, October/November 2010.
 
@DeadMG Where can you see that?
 
Cat too.
@StackedCrooked Click on your name, then "user profile", and it says "Member since..."
 
6:55 PM
That's useless.
It only tells you when chat account was created.
And probably many people checked it out when it was first deployed.
 
well, you can't have been chatting in the Lounge since before that date.
 
It wasn't created randomly.
 
I've always been chatting in Lounge.
 
@Rapptz eep, I have a stalker :p
@CatPlusPlus Always... since the beginning of time
 
I found the reflection answer and out of boredom clicked on another one!
 
6:57 PM
@jalf And beyond
 
what reflection answer?
 
Now, where the fuck is that code.
 
I should order real food more often.
 
posted on August 26, 2013 by RongLu

Hello, my name is Rong Lu. I’m a PM on Visual C++ team working on graphics development features in VS, including asset designers, templates, graphics diagnostics, etc.. In preparation for planning for graphics tooling capabilities in the next version of Visual Studio, we’re trying to understand the needs of graphics developers better. We’d love to hear how your experience

 
This gives so much more energy than a pizza.
 
6:58 PM
@jalf The Big Bang was caused by his desire to chat on the Lounge.
 
362
A: Why does C++ not have reflection?

jalfThere are several problems with reflection in C++. It's a lot of work to add, and the C++ committee is fairly conservative, and don't spend time on radical new features unless they're sure it'll pay off. (A suggestion for adding a module system similar to .NET assemblies has been made, and w...

2
 
@CatPlusPlus What did you order?
 
@EtiennedeMartel WindowsMedia
 

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