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7:16 AM
Hi everyone ! Back from my (long) week-end :-p
So @StevenBeaupré, how was "le voyage de Chihiro" ? ;-)
And hi to the new "members", nice to have you here :-)
 
Hi there :-)
@CathG: although you are not asking me, I liked that one, although I liked My Neighbor Totoro more! :-P
 
g/m!
 
7:36 AM
Hi @Peque Hi @Jaap !
@Peque we had a discussion with @Tensibai and @StevenBeaupré about Miyazaki/Ghibli movies and Steven had planned to see "le voyage de Chihiro" last week-end ;-). So you're also a fan of Miyazaki ? :-)
 
@CathG so, how was your long weekend?
 
@CathG: I love cinema, but i would not consider myself a fan of Miyazaki (and I still have to watch many of his movies!) :-)
 
@Peque :-) so in the future we may have discussion in this room apart from r or soccer ;-)
 
Hello
 
@CathG: if you discuss too much about R and soccer, I may leave soon :-P
 
7:42 AM
@Jaap not bad, I was at my parents in law, who live near the see. Although it's a bit frustrating to have 35° in the office dureing the week and cloudy weather with 20° for the week-end :-/
Hi @Tensibai, so, no big "bridge" for you ;-p
 
@Tensibai good morning
 
@CathG exactly
 
@CathG I can understand that, had the same experience two weeks ago :-/
 
@Peque don't worry, there is no risk for me to discuss about soccer ;-) and as @Tensibai, I'm more from a rugby family ;-p
@Jaap at least it is still cloudy here today :-) anyway my son is on holidays so better for him to have a nice weather, I don't mind having 35° in my office (well, a bit less would be better...) but why does the nice weather always have to end on friday night ?...
 
7:59 AM
@CathG we might have to ask the weather-gods ;-)
@Peque we will do our best ;-) but there are a lot of R-aficionados in this room
 
:-)
 
@Peque you can also see it as an opportunity to learn r better ;-)
btw: not talking about R is lot harder for me than not talking about soccer ;-)
 
@Jaap: perhaps it is! I've played with R, and I like it, but I don't use it regularly
 
@Peque what do you do in daily life?
@Peque playing with it is a good thing; it brought me to the point were I'm now: the most proficient R-user in our department
which by the way still means that I have to learn a lot, but that's probably also due to the broad scope of possible applications for R
 
8:15 AM
@Jaap: algorithms for automated trading in Forex/stock exchanges
I mostly work with Python (very fast for prototyping)
 
Hi ya..
@DavidArenburg you get into this room once i came. How?
 
@Peque interesting, I have a background in economics and have written courses in the past about financial markets & investment strategies
 
@AvinashRaj hmm not sure what you mean
im afk
 
:-)
 
@Peque nice, Python is on my list for possible languages to develop a new research tool
 
8:20 AM
@Jaap: this is "all" I've done in R: rpubs.com/Peque/energy-demand-forecast
after taking a few courses online on Coursera
 
@Peque good start
 
@Jaap: I did that last summer, but since then, I have almost not touched R :-P
 
@Peque I especially like the Data Science track from John Hopkins
@Peque you can't do everything: my list of things I want to learn grows faster than the available time (which is shrinking at this moment)
 
that's the one I followed :-)
(only the first half, though)
 
morning
 
8:40 AM
@jangorecki morning
@CathG good to see you finally
 
anybody using data.table would be interested in heavily extended tables() function?
I'm thinking of developing kind of information_schema (DB term) for data.tables
dictionary of column names, keys, column types
 
Hi @DavidArenburg & @jangorecki
 
@Peque Very nice, I didn't know you are so profound in R
 
@DavidArenburg thanks, yes, I saw you missed me ;-p
 
@CathG Yes, its kind of boring when you arent around
 
8:45 AM
Hi CathG
 
@DavidArenburg:. hahahaha. I wouldn't call that profound! :-)
 
@jangorecki sounds cool, not sure if it worth your time though
 
my latest pkg heavily depends on data.tables metadata
and such tool would makes it much more easily
than I've already developed
reordering col, renaming col, detecting coltypes
 
@jangorecki g/m
 
Hi @Jaap
 
8:52 AM
@DavidArenburg lol must be the "girl power" stuff ;-)
 
@DavidArenburg hi!
 
@Peque How are the Coursera courses, are they usefull
@jangorecki I saw you did some Coursera courses too
 
@DavidArenburg: definitely! :-)
(at least for beginners)
 
@Peque usually I dont like the questions quality of people coming to SO from there
 
I started using coursera with the Machine Learning course (Stanford), and since then, I try to learn something new in there from time to time
@DavidArenburg: hahaha. Well, a massive online course has a lot of different students, of course, and I agree with you that, when the teachers encourage students to ask questions in SO, that might not always be a good idea
but that's not their fault
 
9:02 AM
@Peque You have a link for that?
I heard this one is a good one indeed
 
for what? the ML course?
right now I'm in coursera.org/course/algo (Stanford as well), IMO, they do the best courses :-)
 
yeah coursera courses are nice, but the best way to learn is practicing
usually hard without finding tasks
at least usable tasks
 
@jangorecki: sometimes learning can be the first step. Perhaps learning about a topic helps you finding a task to work with :-)
@DavidArenburg: btw, how's the voting going? :-P
 
@Peque Still 3
 
xD
 
9:11 AM
but you can ask Jaap and Cath help you
@Peque thanks
Ill try to find some time watch
 
where is our help needed?
 
@Jaap, @CathG: I'm on a quest to reopen this question, as in my opinion it is not the same thing to ask "why is Vim doing that" or "how to avoid Vim doing it"
I searched on Google "why", and ended up in that question, finding out that the answers didn't explain why, only how to avoid it...
"it is the default behavior in Vim" doesn't explain why
 
@Peque Asking for the reason of a tool behavior is off-topic on SO
 
@Peque done
 
as mainly only the devs of this tool can answer and that's not the scope of SO
(pretty sure there's a close reason matching this)
 
9:14 AM
@Tensibai: then you may want to flag it as off-topic, but still, the duplicate I think is not correct
@Tensibai: well, I think is more related to how the POSIX standard defines a line (which as you can see is another question in SO)
 
@Peque, it's reopened :-) let's see if we need to close it as OT now ;-p
 
@jaap, @CathG: thanks :-)
 
anybody knows what's wrong with that DT?
`structure(list(NAME = "d1", NROW = " 1", NCOL = " 1", SIZE = 1080, COLS = "a", .COLS = list("a"), TYPES = "double", .TYPES = list(structure("double", .Names = "a")), KEY = "", .KEY = list(NULL)), .Names = c("NAME", "NROW", "NCOL", "SIZE", "COLS", ".COLS", "TYPES", ".TYPES", "KEY", ".KEY"), class = c("data.table", "data.frame"))`
some cols are lists but that should be fine
 
Why would that happen? <= that's the default behavior of vim, on what it is based is another question I think
 
but throws Error in print(x) : unused argument (x) on creating the object
must be something with my current session
as in fresh R it is working
so don't bother
 
9:19 AM
Man akrun is Sooo fast....
@jangorecki lol
 
make him chat more here so he will be slower on answering question :)
 
BTW I can't believe the accepted answer is forcing the fileformat to dos ... yerk
 
@DavidArenburg well you both are. I see new question, want to have a look and poum, there is already an answer by akrun and by the time I finished reading the Q, here you are with your (very very nice :-) ) dt answer.... I'd better be back to work...
 
@CathG argh Work!!
who need it anyway
I never work, just sit here all day
@CathG I actually was posting the cSplit one too
 
it helps feeding the offsprings :-)
 
9:23 AM
but he beat me on the "Post Your Answer" button
@CathG good point
akrun answers usually within one minute, this must brakes some laws of physics, no?
 
@DavidArenburg he may have one of those new thechnological thing which makes the computer write as fast as you think...
 
@DavidArenburg maybe he's somewhere in space at high speed, relativity ...
 
@Tensibai uh involving Einstein into the discussion
 
:o)
 
@CathG I think he has some setup with some common answers
like a file where he copy pastes from
I think he mentioned "notes" ones
 
9:26 AM
lol that would be an explanation !!
 
I may have involved Schrödinger (He may or may not be answering, observation make the answer)
Is it possible to nest two lapply ?
 
btw @DavidArenburg, congrats on your epic badge !! :-)
 
@Tensibai you can nest how many lapplys you want
 
I should do something wrong in this case
 
but Im not taking responsibility for performance though
@CathG thanks :)
 
9:29 AM
 mats <- lapply( strsplit( intToBin( 0:(2^n - 1) ),"" ), function(x) {
    lapply( strsplit( intToBin( 0:(2^(n-1) - 1) ), ""), function(y) { Toeplitz(x,y) })
  } )
 
Also made it 40K today
 
@DavidArenburg nice !! :-) so you're twice-trusted user :-)
 
hmmm, I think I've just discovered some bug in tstrsplit...
 
congrats @DavidArenburg
 
Thanks
 
9:30 AM
@DavidArenburg :-(
 
df <- read.table(text = "ID  Value1   Value2
1   h;i;j     6;7;25", header = TRUE)

library(data.table)
setDT(df)[, lapply(.SD, tstrsplit, ";", type.convert = TRUE), by = ID]
Does anyone with a devel version also getting an NA instead of i?
 
I only have the "regular" version...
 
@CathG shame on you :)
 
I'm tempting a base R option (but far too many -apply imo)
 
@Tensibai what's that for?
 
9:39 AM
@DavidArenburg yeah... I know... ;-) still have problems to install github packages :-(
 
@CathG its looks pretty manual
 
aw, sorry, it's for this
 
what if you had 10 columns?
You also loosing all the classes of the columns
 
@DavidArenburg I agree. I'm not really a fan of this option...
@DavidArenburg yes you're right, conversion to a matrix is also a problem. Ok, deleting the awful way
 
@CathG rolf
you could modify it probably
The strsplit part you could easily imbed into lapply
 
9:41 AM
@DavidArenburg I'll try to find a way but don't want to use another -apply (like to go through all the columns)
 
@CathG lapply is not so bad for columns
it is certianly more robust
data.table use lapply for columns without losing perfomance
the standard, DT[, lapply(.SD, FUN)]
 
@DavidArenburg alright, I'll try to find a way, I'll see if I can elimate one of the other -apply
 
@CathG ok, filed and issue
Hope @Arun will find some time for this
@Arun why did you edit my answer?
 
@DavidArenburg it seems Arun found a way ;-)
 
@DavidArenburg Thanks :)
 
9:52 AM
@Tensibai hmm I was saying that Cath :)
so not sure what's the thanks for
 
@DavidArenburg for this, it gaves me an idea :)
 
@CathG dunno, he didn't use type.convert so not sure what's the edit for
my original answer gave the same result...
 
@DavidArenburg, @Jaap, @CathG: thanks for helping me opening that question, I now have posted what I think is the correct answer to that question. @Tensibai: feel free to downvote or vote to close now! :-P
 
@Peque well, I'm not there to fight on things like this, there's no harm (except the actually accepted answer)
 
@CathG uhh, I think I get it
 
9:57 AM
@Tensibai: sure, it was just a joke :-)
 
It was returning a list....
 
:)
 
@DavidArenburg check Value1 column for your answer and from my edit.
 
@Arun yes, I've got it, it was returning a list
I wonder if we can make it not to
 
@DavidArenburg that was what Arun put in the comment for the edit ;-)
 
10:00 AM
@CathG Oh, I never read those :)
 
@DavidArenburg rolf
 
@Arun btw, did you notice that type.convert returns an NA whenever i is present? setDT(df)[, lapply(.SD, function(x) unlist(tstrsplit(x, ";", fixed = TRUE, type.convert = TRUE))), by = ID]
I've opened and issue regarding it
 
@DavidArenburg finally...
 
@DavidArenburg that's weird.. thanks David.
I get NA even when I try type.convert("i", as.is=TRUE) from console on an R-session...!
Try type.convert(letters, as.is=TRUE) vs type,convert(letters[9], as.is=TRUE).
 
@Arun yes me too. very weird indeed
 
10:10 AM
@CathG I think you guys may have just found a bug in R ;-)
 
@Arun oh, don't give me any credit, David found it by himself ;-)
 
so, answered my first dplyr question with a data.table alternative :-)
 
@DavidArenburg how about a chat with Dirk ;-)
 
@CathG not sure what you mean, sorry
 
@Jaap just saw, and up-voted. Thanks :-).
 
10:12 AM
offtopic question to any native (or not) English speaker: would the opposite of "group" (as a verb) be "ungroup"? (asked in English Language & Usage, but there's no activity in the chat)
 
@Arun thanx, I will try to add a benchmark as well (never did that before)
 
@Peque This is what hadley thinks at least
 
@DavidArenburg just that if it is a bug in core R, it probably needs to be told to guys like Dirk and as he's not the more friendly guy on earth..... (it was just a reference to "his" room being the "dirktator" room and probably he doesn't receive "bugs" nicely but I may be completly wrong)
 
@CathG thanx for correcting the typo :-)
 
@CathG it's not Core R, it's in data.table
 
10:14 AM
@Jaap that's the kind of things I like to do, you can ask David ;-) (I also added some spaces ;-p )
 
* nevermind, just got someone to answer there, sorry :-)
 
@DavidArenburg I think you missed crucial parts of this discussion. Go back and read again :-).
 
@DavidArenburg type.convert is in core R. I have the bug, don't even have data.table loaded (yet)
 
@Arun oh sorry I was afk, let me check...
 
@Jaap cool!
 
10:17 AM
@A.O. welcome
 
thx @DavidArenburg :)
 
@DavidArenburg David, how do you expect us to do our "work" if you're not giving us time to ? ;-p
Hi @A.O., welcome
 
@CathG I don't think it should be told to Dirk, rather filled in here
 
Hey @CathG ! what's everybody working on?
 
@A.O. R mainly, so you may find this room boring :)
 
10:20 AM
ohhhh jackpot! ;)
 
@Peque Depends on the context but I think split or separate are better choices
 
anybody consider themselves an "R expert"?
 
@Tensibai: it would be as in an order (imperative): "you! make groups of 3! (out of a set)" --> "group!" and then "you! undo that operation!" --> "ungroup?"... so maybe its better to say merge/split? or group/split?
 
@A.O. only @CathG
@Arun I wonder how @AnandaMahto overcome this, as cSplit works cSplit(DT, sep=";", c('Value1', 'Value2'), 'long', type.convert=TRUE)
 
@Peque as in French we commonly have 3 or 4 words/verbs to say the same things with really slight differences
I can't tell
 
10:27 AM
@CathG np, I like typing efficiency and therefore often omit the spaces
 
Well, it's more opinion anyway...I'm building a basketball analytics site and I was wondering what's the advantage of R, rather what can I do with R, that I can't with mysql-php-javascript?
 
@Jaap The Meta effect is strong with this one
 
@Tensibai: mon française est très mauvais, mais je peux parler un peu :-P
3
 
@A.O. tool requests are OT on this site :)
 
@DavidArenburg my apologies
 
10:29 AM
@A.O. na I'm just kidding
 
lol
 
I'm not fimiliar with php-JS so can't tell whats better
Maybe @Peque or @Tensibai can be of help
 
@DavidArenburg ??
 
@Jaap You don't know what's Meta effect?
54
Q: Getting to Know Stack Overflow's Voting Culture

JDBThere are few topics more controversial than voting, either on the Main site or here on Meta. Whether expressed in rants on Meta or rants in comments, users frequently get angry, confused and frustrated that their post has been downvoted. We see pleas to "... be gentle on the downvoting!"1 and a...

 
@DavidArenburg now I do :-) i guess you are referring to my most recent answer
 
10:33 AM
Yeah...
 
@A.O.: well, go ahead and try what can you do with PHP and JS (I don't know what you are expecting to do), but probably will be enough. If you fail, then you might need to use other languages. The main difference is that with PHP/JS you'll have to write much more lines of codes than with R to do the same thing (that's because R has a very special purpose) ;-)
 
@DavidArenburg :-p @A.O. I totally deny that ;-) (both the fact that I am and the fact that I claim it ;-) ). David looooves to tease me... ;-)
 
@A.O.: also, one of the things that I like most about R is plotting, but most probably you wont use that anyway (perhaps you want to draw on the client side out of the raw data?), or maybe you will, generating PNGs that you serve to the browser? I don't know, its difficult to tell... ;-)
 
@Arun done
 
@A.O.: if I were you, I would try with JS on the client side for plotting, that will create interactive graphics on the browser, which are much cooler that static images :-P
 
10:38 AM
afk for lunch, after going to try to update my answer
 
@Peque Yes, I agree, the JS plots are much nicer than the R ones
Though R has many packages that provide an interface for JS like plots
 
@Jaap nice. For the future, it's usually more informative usually to benchmark on relatively bigger data sizes (gives a clear idea of how well the algorithm / tool scales).
OP also is looking to reshape it to wide (on multiple columns?), where dcast from 1.9.5 could be of help? Not sure...
 
@DavidArenburg: I don't know about that, but I bet so :-)
 
there are nice things about being unemployment, I'm able to make more PR :D
 
@jangorecki yes, if I were more comfortable with git I would do too
But it takes me ages to do the simplest stuff
 
10:52 AM
@DavidArenburg: what do you use? (out of curiosity)
 
@Peque not sure what you mean?
 
(as a version control system, sorry)
 
you have a full script of git commands to perform PRs :P
anyway any serious project developed in R should end up somewhere in git repo
so better to learn it sooner than later :)
 
@Arun he's requesting a very odd kind of reshaping, see also my comment
 
@Peque GitHub
@jangorecki the one you sent me via mail?
 
10:56 AM
yes
my todays PR went really smoothly
 
@DavidArenburg: oh! as you said "if I were more comfortable with git..." though you were perhaps using another ;-)
 
git pull upstream master
edit R files
git chechout -n new_branch
git commit -m 'msg'
git push origin new_branch
:)
 
@Peque no, I'm suck in developing
 
git add -u before commit :)
 
Im mainly leaching others works
 
10:58 AM
^^
 
@Arun and @jangorecki are heavily involved in dev
 
Arun heavily, me only top level helpers, etc, no deep quality code
:P
 
@jangorecki: what's the -n in checkout, btw?
(I always use -b)
 
it will create new branch
as checkout is used to switch between branches
 
   -b <new_branch>
       Create a new branch named <new_branch>...
 
11:01 AM
there are very simple tutorials all over the web, stackoverflow has really big git knowledge base
 
$ git checkout -n asfd
error: unknown switch `n'
I think its -b ;-)
 
hmm
sorry
yes, it was typo
 
hehehe
 
I use -b of course
 
I asked because I still don't know about many options in many git commands... ;-)
 
11:03 AM
there is not need to know as SO has answer for all git questions :)
 
hahahaha, that's true ^^
 
11:20 AM
@CathG filed a bug in BuGzilla, will see what Crandalf says
 
@DavidArenburg :-) funny nobody spotted this bug before
 
@CathG yes, I wonder how @AnandaMahto overcame it still.
Too lazy to go thru the cSplit code though
 
@DavidArenburg he'll probably answer that on his next visit here but as he said he may not be that soon...
 
@CathG Yes, this is why I used @ when mentioning him ;)
 
pretty smart of you ;-p
 
11:32 AM
@A.O. There's nothing you can't do in php/mysql but it will takes you a lot more time to code and will probably be less efficient
 
@DavidArenburg actually, cSplit uses the whole vector in type.convert, it's not doing it value by value, that's why it's working.
 
@CathG maybe
yes, probably
 
@DavidArenburg not maybe, I went inside the function ;-)
 
because tstrsplit separates it to individual values
 
@DavidArenburg yes, hence the difference. as in type.convert(letters[1:10]) vs type.convert(letters[9]), the example Arun gave
 
11:37 AM
@CathG yes, I've wrote this in the bug report
 
11:56 AM
55 rep to go to 7k :-)
 
@CathG is that an hint? You'll need to say it more explicitly for us to understand that you want us to mass upvote you )
@PierreLafortune hi
 
@DavidArenburg not at all, it's just that I told myself it would be nice to reach 7k before holidays (yes yes I'm gonna soon be on holidays... again... ;-) ) so I'm happy to move toward my goal and saying it out loud (in this room I mean ;-) )
 
Morning all!
 
@CathG Man you French....
 
Hi @PierreLafortune. So you really want us to believe you're american having this name ;-)
 
12:04 PM
@CathG yes, he looks like yet another French in this room
 
If Stamford, CT is American. I'm in : )
David where are you based out of?
 
@PierreLafortune Israel
 
@DavidArenburg I know, the number of days that I can take as holidays is indecent ;-) (27 that is)
 
@PierreLafortune originally from Russia
Or the Soviet Union.
@CathG @StevenBeaupré has 8.5 weeks
 
@PierreLafortune at least you have to have French or Canadian ancestors ;-)
 
12:07 PM
You French need a vacation from the overload of the vacations each time you take yet another vacation
 
Yes, and father has roots in Lebanon.
 
@PierreLafortune oh interesting
 
@DavidArenburg not really, he has 5 weeks, only he did not take 3.5 weeks of last year (yes, I do read you even when I'm away ;-) )
 
so we could be neighbours in a sense
@CathG 5 weeks is also insane
 
@DavidArenburg I do have what we call RTT :-D
 
12:08 PM
I have 2 weeks :(
 
same here
 
@DavidArenburg well, 2 weeks are insane but the other way around
 
@CathG yes, if you are French
 
new DT question :)
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/31430025/unlist-nested-list-columns-in-data-table
 
@DavidArenburg I've 37 days per year :)
 
12:13 PM
wow @Tensibai I don't know if anyone gets that in the US. That's great
 
I'm in France :p
 
companies fear it would hurt productivity
 
@Tensibai hm....
 
@jangorecki maybe it's because i is the index in the loops
 
12:22 PM
yes
it is the same on ubuntu
 
12:39 PM
working at a Dutch university gives you also quite some day for vacation
I think I have 42 days, but not sure. I'm never able to take them all off
@PierreLafortune I can tell you that's un unrealistic fear. Give people enough free time and it might even benefit productivity
2
@PierreLafortune even in the private sector you're entitled to at least 22 days in The Netherlands
 
@Jaap My thoughts exactly
 
12:59 PM
@DavidArenburg I wouldn't be surprised if there is a substantial body of research supporting this claim
a few weeks ago, I read an article about a lawfirm that forbids its employees to work for five days a week
 
1:23 PM
@Jaap I agree.
 
@PierreLafortune I remember the most important conclusion: in four days they did as much work as before in five days
did try out the new dcast function in data.table: I was looking for such a function for a long time :-) this is going to help me a lot
 
bind_rows (dplyr) vs rbindlist (data.table): my solution using rbindlist to this question: stackoverflow.com/questions/31320787/…
 
1:44 PM
@jangorecki I gave it a shot, don't hesitate to tell me to delete if it's as lame as I think it probably is... ;-)
 
@CathG hmm that's looks like shameless modification of my comment :)
 
@DavidArenburg could be, except that I tried that before you wrote your comment ;-) the problematic part of the answer is to make the c appear...
 
@CathG hmm.. so you worked for the past hour on how to add NA to c? :)
 
@DavidArenburg actually, I had other problems apart from that (you know, the hated thing that is called work ;-) ) but, yes, it took me quite some time to figure out how to correctly deal with the lapply(l, length) and put the right type... well, I'm still not that good at manipulating data.tables :-(
btw I don't understand why you have to put the quotes to replace a value when you have to remove them to display the variable... (except if you use with=F of course)
but as I said, if it's really obvious (except for me...) and obviously not a satisfying answer, it's not a problem for me to delete, I just did it to practice some data.table...
 
Anyway, I was thinking something like that
dt[, if(is.null(temp <- unlist(l))) {
     .(nm = NA_character_, ul = NA_integer_) } else {
     .(nm = names(temp), ul = temp)
  }, by = a]
 
1:56 PM
NA_integer_ !!!, I've been looking for that for some time !! I tried NA_integer, which of course did not work and then I was trying to find the correct spelling somewhere in the help pages and on SO but didn't find it...
 
The only problem with that is that you need to know the column classes.
@CathG Are you using RStudio?
 
@DavidArenburg no, I tried it, didn't like it
@DavidArenburg yes, exactly
 
@CathG so what then?
 
ok, I'm "stealing" NA_integer_ (if you don't mind of course...)
@DavidArenburg so what what ? I'm using regular R console (with 2 screens :-) )
 
@CathG oh
without code highlatning/completing?
Sounds hard
 
1:59 PM
oh, I'm using notepad++ for my scripts :-)
 
RStudio is definitely better than that
 
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