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10:00 AM
!!afk meeting
 
I have never had to use pointers... ever
 
Would I need to be an expert on the concept too? E.g. if I have to design software for printers, do I need to be both developer and a master of printers?
 
you are either trying to be fancy, or trying to do micro optimizations, which you shouldnt do
 
mr5
Well, technically, reference types are pointers (In C/C++ dialect)
@HéctorÁlvarez yes of course. We all rely on our software architect. He almost know all kind of programming tasks (embedded, web, mobile, desktop, graphics, etc...)
 
true, but you dont need pointers to variables
variables store pointers (usually), you shouldnt point to a variable
 
10:04 AM
@HéctorÁlvarez The trick isn't being able to do the job. The trick is being able to do the job well.
 
@mr5 Oh okay, so a software architect has to be proficient at more places than just modelling.
 
@HéctorÁlvarez No, but you'd need to read up on the interface for printers, and design the program accordingly
probably you'd use a facade for handling the interface between your program and the low-level printer commands
 
Oh okay there's no problem with that
I like researching.
Ok great example, solves a lot of doubts.
 
I tend to be good at this aspect too
I've noticed some people are better suited for debugging or writing specifications
 
mr5
Me too, but I suck
 
10:07 AM
my thing seems to be about abstraction
 
mr5
Me three
But I suck at debugging
Especially in a buggy platform such as Xamarin
 
I'm okay at it, I can find the bug. I've seem some programmers in the face of an error which to me is completely ambiguous and nonsensical, snap their fingers and go, "Oh yeah, I bet it's this.. " and will know right where to jump to test it
I'm not at that level by no means
 
@Neil this requires knowledge of the tools being used to provide the desired behavior
im sure you can do it too ;)
 
@Neil I usually do that when I've spent some time with the software
 
well, maybe for simpler projects :P
We've got a spaghetti of projects with circular dependencies.. not very easy on the eyes
 
10:11 AM
Last week we had an issue where permissions weren't loaded and I bet the problem was originating from SQL scripts in a different project that has nothing to do with this one.
 
In my defense, it was like that long before I got here
 
@Neil for example, MS has recently released a version of windows where the calculator would calculate sqrt(4) - 2 correctly
I had no clue on how this would be possible to be broken
in fact, it should be not-broken and break in other cases
until I understood how the calculator deals with numbers
then it was pretty obvious that even sqrt(4) is not calculated correctly
 
mr5
@Neil if you're a fan of abstractions, how do you deal with a debugging task that require a very short time and at the same time, the code is spaghetti or is a legacy code?
 
even though it still would show 2
 
Wrong base?
Like you enabled rads
 
10:13 AM
wrong calbubrations
 
@mr5 That's not what I mean with abstractions :)
 
but the difference is smaller than a 64-bit ieee 754 float can show
 
@mr5 My everyday code you mean? Tough as nails, but well...
 
If I have to debug code I've never seen before in a short time, I just take longer than a "short time"
 
mr5
@Neil yes but would you do it the hard way or hack fix?
 
10:13 AM
0
Q: Core 2 Tag Helpers not showing in the editor, even after multiple VS reinstalls.

Lemonade1947For anyone that doesn't already know what a tag helper is. This is what a tag helper is. <input asp-for="Forename" class="form-control" /> Previously, when I begun typing "asp-for" intelisense would suggest all the properties of the model. As you can imagine, this was extremely useful. Howev...

pls upboat
 
27 GOTOs in my current 730 line function.
 
What I mean is that I need to apply the same logic of a given class with x instead of y, and z as a wrapper, and without fully understanding how that class works (maybe it's 1000 lines long), I can refactor with few to no issues
I'm able to "black box" methods so that I can guarantee same behavior, but with my added functionality
I think if I actually tried to learn how the class worked inside and out, it'd take me twice as long to do the same thing
 
upvote my question please nice friends.
 
@mr5 If I had a short amount of time, hack fix to see if it is the issue
 
mr5
downvoted
 
10:18 AM
Then once I know that's the issue, and assuming I had the time, "hard" way
 
mr5
@Neil it's usually what they want coz short time and low cost, but in the long run, it usually breaks which is a deal breaker
 
@mr5 I'm usually fairly good about not introducing bugs
It still happens of course, but I won't refactor the program for a bug
Though sometimes you do need to do a proper analysis and not just hammer two planks of wood to cover a hole in the boat
 
Boats float better when their floor is a mess of patchwork and planks. #truestory.
 
The quick fix is sometimes necessary, but it should always be followed up by a proper fix
It actually happened to me once to have to fix an error while my colleague was doing a demo for a client
That was.. awkward
I think he used it as an excuse to get a coffee break, and when they returned, it was fixed ;)
 
"Must have been a momentary network glitch. As you can see, the software is working perfectly and had been all along".
"Maybe a hardware glitch".
"Maybe a solar flare disrupted electronic activity"
 
10:28 AM
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan ow, this reminds me of
 
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I'd lean towards this one.
 
its fun though, every modular architecture has two key parts, its traffic and its processing
in programming, we often ignore traffic
in factorio, we often ignore processing
 
Hello, is there a way to get th datetime format when i read from the dbreader?
 
this sounds like storing datetimes as strings
@John can you show an example of what you mean?
 
Yeah i keep the field type separetly and store as string
Then i want to make an update later so i get the fieldtype but then idk what's the format
 
10:41 AM
stares at John
 
:D
 
stares at John without smiling
 
Thing is with oracle i get a strange datetime
 
You're keeping the datetime format as a field in a DB table?
 
like "10 jun 2018 00:00:00"
and if if put this back into the table it won't work
 
10:42 AM
Yeah, that's a terrible idea, but probably too late to change that.
 
i have to write "to_date" and the format
 
stares at John while attempting to not cry
 
Strings are strings, datetimes are datetimes (or occasionally bigints)
 
if you store a datetime in a string, you use ISO 8601
3
 
Wietlol is blinking the eyes once
 
10:42 AM
nothing... frigging... else
@nyconing I can actually stare for pretty long
my eye hydration is low
 
Well i don't want to separate every single type i have into different fields
that's why i have one property value and one type >.>
 
what is this table?
 
Ah, you're using a generic key/value table.
 
Yes
 
hmm
 
10:44 AM
That has its own set of problems, of course, but it might explain why you're storing as strings.
 
use blob
;)
 
what's the benefit of the blob ?
 
As @Wietlol says, the solution is to only use the ISO8601 format to store datetimes. It's a rountrip-preserving, non-ambiguous universal datetime format.
 
@John its a byte[] in C# terms
it is basically the root of every object
even booleans
 
won't sovle my problem then :D
 
10:45 AM
it would be able to store byte[] which you can convert back and forth to any type that it came from
 
Storing a datetime as a byte[] doesn't really give you anything that storing it as a (sanely encoded) string doesn't.
 
but it is highly impractical for most users
 
Since there isn't really a standard representation of a C# DateTime as a byte[].
 
in any case, you must enforce storage to be in a particular format
 
Yeah that iso thing seems cool
 
10:47 AM
your programming interface should still only allow datetimes in and out
 
but i'm searching how to convert it
 
that one handles the parsing
dateTime..ToString("o") seems to be "fancy"
 
sec will tyr
 
or
> .ToString("s", System.Globalization.CultureInfo.InvariantCulture)
(just googling this shit up)
I am used to Jaba's time system, which, imho, is much smoother
 
OK so if I got this right you have a 2NF database where a single column hold different data types.
 
10:50 AM
DateTime.ParseExact("2010-08-20T15:00:00Z", "s", CultureInfo.InvariantCulture);
that one for parsing back to sanity
 
you store generic data strings and tell the database the data type in a separate column, so you can then read from the db and switch-case through the possible inline options.
 
ew, switch case
 
And your question is why is it returning weird results when retrieving the date from... where exactly? A C# app?
 
@John if you already have stuff stored in the database, in a different format, you must migrate the data
in that case, you need to parse as much as possible from it as you can, storing it back in ISO format
 
I can't really do that haha
 
10:52 AM
Are your datetimes homogeneous?
I mean do you always have text abbreviations for months and such.
 
idk what's homogenous, it's some strange oracle stuff
yeah
and that .ToString("o") didn't work
 
I will negate this if tried for programming treason, but apparently what you are forced to do right now is manually parse the dates back the same way you inserted them.
 
Sucks
 
@John why cant you?
 
Can you show us one of those errors you get?
 
10:54 AM
It's not an error it's a conversion problem, basicly i get the word "Jun" insted of 6 for example
 
@John this is as helpful as a chocolate tea-pot <3
 
if i use ToString("dd-mm-yyyy") it will work, but that's because i know the format
and i want to do that withotu knowing the format
 
@John this is not true
you dont get the word Jun
you get a DateTime object
 
@John Hence the question "Are your dates homogeneous?"
 
it doesnt have words
@AvnerShahar-Kashtan why is this a recurring question???
 
10:55 AM
If i transform into datetime i have to store as datetime and this is not viable
 
@Wietlol He does because he's parsing the date correctly but then converting to a different locale.
 
@John what do you use the stored datetimes for?
 
updating
 
is it for calculations, checks, comparisons etc?
 
Nice someone has commented on my question but I can't reply with a comment because I don't have enough rep
 
10:56 AM
@John Look, if you KNOW the dates are ALL in the format you have, you can simply do what you just showed us.
 
wait yes I can I'm retarded
 
but that's just an example, if i changed the database i'll have different formats
and right now my stuff work on any db
i don't do db specific
 
ugh
 
It's a factory pattern
 
Well duh, and how do you know that your stored data follows whatever format? Do you roll a dice?
 
10:57 AM
@John you have to take a step back
 
that was my question, how i can get the correct format x)
 
there is a bigger picture you are missing
but im afk for now
 
oh wait it worked
wth
 
@John You stored a string, which was the output of a date. Let's say it's "01-01-2017". No way to tell the day from the month because it's a string, unless you also store the pattern it follows.
What worked exactly?
the ToString?
 
Yeah i didn't pay attention
i thought 1975 was some default c# value
but it's actually in my db x)
cool .ToString("o") actualyl works
that will do
 
11:03 AM
Ultimate facepalm.
 
yup
 
11:37 AM
Looking for ideas on what to build first on the server I'm about to rent. The first idea was a webAPI with some random stuff for fun, a SQL server with replication somewhere else, and I've been suggested a workflow engine. I'll add some minor additional tasks like Teamspeak server and such, that shouldn't take much time.
I'm still looking for an idea that I could show to people, and be cool with it.
To be more precise, something that takes advantage of the newest technologies.
 
technologies are only useful if they are the right technology for your needs
 
My need is showing someone else who may or may not be tech savvy that I can build something interesting and good-looking.
 
take something interesting and good-looking and make them believe you made it
 
I'm not getting an answer to my question, am I.
I made an MS issue report, too.
Wonder if that'll go anywhere.
I'm so fucking fustrated.
 
it will go directly to the trash can
 
11:52 AM
My c*nt of a coworker is trying to make out that it's my fault.
@Wietlol Nah. They dealt with my previous issue pretty well. Just took them a few days.
 
i can see why someone would believe that
 
@Wietlol then you don't understand the problem
 
last time you had such an issue, you also made the problem... iirc
 
No?
That wasn't anything like this.
 
ow I bet
 
11:54 AM
Why are you being a twat all of a sudden?
 
you have no idea what the cause is, so such a statement is about as useful as a chocolate teapot <3
 
Headshot.
 
Did you read my question?
 
your taghelpers arent working
 
Did you read the question though
 
12:00 PM
no
 
Well then
 
I don't need questions to give reasons why you shouldn't assume answers or cross out answers
that is just general stuff
 
What have I crossed out?
Fam at this point I'm willing to sacrifice a fucking child.
 
Inb4 the blaming comment
 
> That wasn't anything like this.
 
12:02 PM
I'm saying it wasn't related to my other problem.
 
indeed
 
That was because I had fucked up my bundle config.
 
I still think it's still a problem related to either Intellisense or the wrong VS version.,
 
This has nothing to do with JS.
@HéctorÁlvarez It might be, but I've done everything I can to fix that, at least everything I know to do.
 
this has to do with VS not doing intellisense and ad-hoc error showing
last issue had to do with VS not doing intellisense and ad-hoc error showing
 
12:03 PM
It did. You're right.
But now that I know what happened, the fact I wasn't generating the js file properly, I can't see how that'd be related to a razor thing which (as far as I know, correct me if I'm wrong) doesn't have anything to do with that.
Hence my statement "I don't think this anything like that" or whatever I said.
If it is related, that's fine. I just need to fix it.
If it's my fault, then tbh that's great, because I won't make the same mistake again.
But I have -litterally- no idea where to even start looking, besides what I've already done which is check my plugins aren't messing with it, and reinstalling VS
 
maybe file extensions being wrong, maybe VS dont recognizing the project as Razor project, maybe the files being invalid for a Razor page
anything could go wrong
 
It's the same project being used by everyone else, though. and it works for them
 
and since I have no experience with either VS or Razor, Ill go and do other stuff now
 
>JS problems
huehuehue
 
They're not JS problems, tho
JS problems are in the past, now.
also it wasn't a js problem
it was a me problem
as has been established
 
12:17 PM
So where is a problem?
 
with VS
(at least I think it's with VS)
 
I discovered yesteday a bug in VS. When I copied *.cshtml file from current project to the same project, Intellisense not working with Razor
 
> it was a me problem
> So where is a problem?
> "me"
 
yes but @Wietlol we already solved that problem. We're onto a new problem now.
 
you still have no guarantee that "me" is not the cause
and you know it
 
12:21 PM
I've never said it wasn't.
I've only said that I don't think it's related to the other problem.
If it's a me problem, then fine. I'm asking for help overcoming whatever the problem is, not with overcoming me being retarded.
 
@HéctorÁlvarez or e^(i PI) + 1 = 0
 
@Neil is that still going on?
 
12:42 PM
353 New messages, neat.
 
@Neil You high?
Btw I'm back, had 600gr of bocata de tortilla.
I'm getting fatter by the day...
@Lemonade If it works for someone else it's a configuration problem on your side.
Or your lack the one tool-addin-dll that does it
 
@HéctorÁlvarez what? just thought you wanted some feedback
 
I'm lost right now
 
sigh
you said "deja vu" and so the joke is that I keep pinging you with the exact same message
do you not know what deja vu means?
 
deja vu, roughly translates form french as "already saw" means I saw something twice. Usually it means you remember that from a different situation. Spamming it all day long isn't deja vu, it's... spam.
I believe the accentuation is dejà vu
But I might be wrong, too lazy to google
 
12:50 PM
@HéctorÁlvarez Probably.. but how do I fix that :(
 
Anyway I have to shit now, IDK if the feeling comes from the food or I've spent too long coding VB6.
 
well my intention wasn't to spam you, honestly
Won't happen again
 
@Lemonade1947 Export someone else's settings or tell them to hand over their .suo
See if it works if you load their user configurations.
 
@HéctorÁlvarez I've tried resetting my settings -ALSO- there's been an interesting developement.
 
Physically ask those who got it working if they have any addins you don't have
You don't have to restart anything.
 
12:51 PM
The problem now seems to -only- happen in that one project, where as before it was happening in all projects.
Already asked them. They don't.
 
@Neil No worries, it's just getting the same message over and over again doesn't go anywhere.
don't take it personally
 
question - i someone needs to test a few SSRS reports. I emailed copies of the .rdl files however they are asking that i provide them with the datasource
any idea how i'd be able to do that
 
@Lemonade1947 I'm sure you are the only one right now that can help yourself.
!!tell koosh googleme ssrs datasource
 
@HéctorÁlvarez have now tried this too.
 
1:01 PM
Julia & Jason on July 10, 2018

Last month, Joe wrote about the Welcome Wagon work that we are doing to make Stack Overflow more welcoming and inclusive. Our current work involves projects across domains from asking questions to framing community standards and more; one project we have been working on is understanding how comments are used and misused on Stack Overflow.

We are a data engineer (Jason) and data scientist (Julia). As folks who code for a living and use Stack Overflow, as well as work here, we have certainly experienced and witnessed unwelcoming behavior in Stack Overflow comments first hand, whether through cond …

 
none of those examples of unwelcoming comments are unwelcoming.
"This first group of raters includes people from underrepresented groups in tech such as women, people of color, gay folks, and trans folks. We do not see evidence that having an identity in one or more of these groups led to an individual labeling comments as unwelcoming at a higher rate, at least not among the small group of ~60 participants in our initial task."
haha just like I said.
 
How do they even know who's female/black/gay/trans on stackoverflow?
 
I'm guessing they put out a request saying "yo gay boys do my survey"
 
@Squirrelkiller I think they asked in the poll
 
less than 10% of the comments were considered abusive by their sample.
sorry no, abusive OR just unwelcoming.
0.3% were seen to be abusive.
It really doesn't seem like a huge problem to me, idk.
maybe it's just because I'm speaking from privilege :^)
 
1:17 PM
people who are particularly sensitive about certain things will look for it even in places where there is none
not saying it doesn't happen, mind you
 
"we would conservatively estimate that a developer visiting Stack Overflow would see 1 to 3 condescending, unwelcoming comments every single month of their coding lives. Will one unwelcoming comment a month drive everyone away? Clearly not, as Stack Overflow still works for many. But it will convince some that it’s not worth it to contribute here."
Then they can go tbh.
 
But if you were fat and sensitive about your weight, and someone makes a joke about someone having their hands full with something, you'd automatically think it was a fat joke
but that could be completely untrue
 
@Neil That as well. You're asking someone to look at a comment with the question "is this abusive" they're more likely to see it as abusive than otherwise.
 
yes, exactly. The abused declare what is abusive, not the "abusivee"
 
1-3 condescending comments per month. not per DAY. PER MONTH
this is simply a non issue.
They are virtue signalling again.
 
1:19 PM
meh, I'd agree with you honestly
But for some, any non-zero value is an issue
 
It shouldn't be. Not with a comunity this large.
I'm actually very impressed it so low.
If you'd asked me before to guess, I'd have guessed -way- higher. I'd still not have been too worried about it, but I'd have guessed higher.
 
I think considering this is very much the internet, and all that comes with that, this site is very tame
 
Exactly!
this is virtue signalling to the highest degree.
 
Mostly everyone is professional and courteous
 
And now we even have numbers to back that up.
92.3% are "fine"
 
1:22 PM
It's difficult to make comparisons
 
I just see it a non issue. Honestly, I do understand we should all be nice to eachother.
but it's less than 1 in 100 comments thats abusive.
I hope they do some bigger surveys.
especially on their beloved minorities.
As a Bi/Pansexual man, I should try to get on one of the surveys.
“No. As it stands the C# marshaler is going to call CoTaskMemFree to deallocate the memory. This is now rather a waste of time. You won’t listen to my advice. If you won’t work find out how the string is allocated you can’t make progress.” - An example of an unwelcome comment.
 
1:39 PM
Depends on whether the OP really ignored the advice, or if htere's another reason for this.
 
@Lemonade1947 Not enough of the other side of the poll expresses the opposite opinion apparently
Next poll be sure to participate ;)
 
@Squirrelkiller True. But neither us, nor the people evaluating the comments know that.
@Neil I'd love to. But I don't think anyone and everyone can.
 
“And this is tagged Javascript why?”
They included me
 
1:54 PM
that, I can imagine, is probably a very reasonable comment.
If something is tagged JS and it shouldn't be.
 

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