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12:01 AM
@Scratte Did you flag that as R/A?
 
I am more of a SME on this, and even I had to parse it a bit to get to where it looks like a retread. Your flag really did need a SME as written
Since I can see it's a retread, I deleted it
 
@Dharman No. I flagged it in Triage as a close flag "Needs details or clarity" :) When other users there finds the Question to be just fine, my flag is disputed :)
 
...but they added ORDER BY. It's not the same answer anymore.
@Scratte WHAT? How can anyone consider this to be a valid question?
 
@Dharman 3 users did.. I was the only one that didn't and I don't even know Python, but I can read the comments, which is apparently not common for reviewers.
@Dharman Same with the other Python Question I mentioned here. I just skimmed the post, read the comment. Looked at the post again and flagged it. I assume the 3 other users after me didn't notice the comment.
I like comments :)
At least my flags aren't disputed when a post to sent to Help & Improvement..
 
12:58 AM
@KenWhite this question has now been edited to English stackoverflow.com/questions/63855768/…
 
1:09 AM
@Nick Thanks. I've retracted my CV on that question.
 
@KenWhite 👍
 
 
1 hour later…
@Makyen thank you for the detailed feedback. Seems like a simple and sensible adjustment to my flagging quality. Will do.
 
3:12 AM
Now, what is wrong today & here? What is wrong with this question? No explaination -- No answer -- Just downvote & vote-to-close? What is issue now????
 
define "different way"
 
Anyone may answer --- Why have you given the rights --- to such people to close, who don't even explain, the question is valid, and the code (that much which is required) is already provided? Who gave the rights --- to let them bully/stop-people from asking and sharing questions?????
 
The question itself is promising, though it could use some clarification (not much, but some). The comments, however, don't help.
 
In particular, comments like this are not constructive:
Who's the downvoter, if you can't help, kindly don't visit here. This question is for those, who wish to help or answer. — Deadpool 11 mins ago
Asking for feedback is fine, but telling people not to visit is not constructive and unlikely to help anyone, least of all you.
Saying that downvoters "just come and create a crap, and run away!" is similarly unconstructive, and likely falls into "unfriendly or unkind" territory.
 
@Deadpool Thank you for not making a request to reopen. However, you have previously been asked not to onebox your post in here. You can prevent that by adding any text in addition to the URL. Once again, please see FAQ #7.
 
3:26 AM
@RyanM So, what do you wish me todo ryan? Sit and watch? --- This was the only platform, where I could find and research and connect to people! And see, whoof ... that too is gone. What should I do, sit and watch? What's wrong have I said? If somebody is only interested in creating nauncense, then leave that questions --- where have I been wrong??? If its 1 time, I can understand, but if its over & over again -- for no reason. Then what should I do?
 
Step one: assume good intent
 
@Makyen this post -- is this what you are saying?
 
@Deadpool For one thing, these comments lashing out at users have one inevitable result: more downvotes on your question and flags against your account. It also makes users more hesitant to work with you to improve your question. If you believe your question is truly worthy of reopening, you need to defend why your question is good rather than flinging accusations and complaints. If it can't be resolved in the comments, you can always take it to Meta.
 
Can you give link to Meta? Where should I go ... it will help.
 
3:33 AM
@AlonEitan Thanks Eitan, that helps a lot!
 
Glad to help :)
 
@Deadpool Yesterday, I mentioned here about making reopen requests for posts in which you are involved. I thanked you for not doing so here. Shortly after that message, I also pointed you at FAQ #7 at that time, in addition to another person also mentioning the onebox issue. Those are what I was talking about.
 
Is this question off-topic? I'm pretty sure the second query is about licensing
 
@AlonEitan Seems like server fault to me...
 
Thanks Nick
 
3:37 AM
@Makyen Thanks, I did not understand Oneboxing. I think, the links are to be writen as --> link text. Am I correct?
 
@Deadpool I've edited your question a bit to clean it up, including linking to a closely related question.
The link for Meta Stack Overflow is meta.stackoverflow.com. Do be aware that complaining instead of advocating for why your question is good will reliably get you downvoted on Meta (and probably marked as a duplicate of Why is Stack Overflow so negative of late?)
 
+:+1:
 
You may, as a heads-up, also be downvoted if people disagree with you: see "Voting is different on Meta" here
 
@Deadpool Yes, please do it that way. For example, the link to your question was [Number of ways of Creating a new function in JavaScript?](https://stackoverflow.com/questions/63856449/number-of-ways-of-creating-a-new-function-in-javascript)
 
Also goes without saying, but just for the record: simply reposting your question on MSx would not be appreciated.
 
3:54 AM
@Deadpool Just a heads-up: the post you just put on meta is solidly "complaining instead of advocating for why your question is good"
 
4:08 AM
@RyanM: I give up
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels full marks for effort, though!
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels I tried, perhaps against my better judgement. We shall see if any of my advice is heeded...
I'd point out that it stopped getting downvoted after I edited completely rewrote it, so there's some proof that being civil helps.
 
@RyanM: yes, truth, but civility perhaps was not their intent. We'll see.
Their problem is perhaps that they are ignoring the famous Chinese proverb: "Never write a letter when you are angry". Better to compose the letter, and then sleep on it before posting, else your information gets lost in the anger.
 
5:00 AM
After speaking with Cody about migrating some Joomla questions to JSE (in this room ~ a month ago), I decided to launch into the past month's abandoned/unsupported Joomla questions and request migration since the SO community was unable to help. I thought this would be a win for all parties. However Samuel has asked me to stop. stackoverflow.com/questions/63485386/…
So is there again a problem with how I am flagging? I responded to Samuel, and I tried to summon Cody in a private chat room, but I don't know if he actually got pinged. What am I doing wrong?
I have flagged a total of 7 Joomla questions for migration -- one of which was requested by the OP and is in Pending status.
I am actually quite happy to take the "garbage" questions from SO. Some days, we get zero new questions -- so our community needs more content and we certainly have the capacity to coddle and groom users into crafting a complete question.
The flags were marked as helpful but not migrated: imgur.com/a/wYSdmNs
 
Potentially silly question: does Samuel know you're a moderator there? That "I am a moderator there and I certify that we want this question" might be valuable to include in the flag text.
 
@mickmackusa You left out the entirety of the context from your flag.
 
I guess I can't say for sure. I feel like I make enough noise that he might know.
What do you mean @Makyen
I need to write out that I am a moderator there and why I am selecting these pages for migration?
 
@mickmackusa "Might know" is a long way from a flag that says "I'm a moderator on Joomla SE. Per a [discussion with Cody Gray][link this], I'm requesting migration to Joomla of multiple questions here on SO which are not a good fit for SO. Please migrate this question to Joomla."
 
I suspect that why you picked specific questions (other than a blanket "not a good fit for SO") is less important than the context of the whole migration effort, which Makyen's proposed text explains well.
 
5:12 AM
@mickmackusa Yes, definitely, you need to say that you're a moderator on Joomla. That you're a mod there makes a huge difference. The flags you've actually raised so far will be read as "I'm a random user who may or may not know anything about Joomla. Please migrate this to Joomla."
 
I left alone joomla-tagged questions that were not mostly pertaining to Joomla and questions that were sufficiently answered. I didn't feel the need to upset the apple cart for these pages.
Okay. I'll flash my badge for all subsequent migration requests.
 
@mickmackusa That's great, but you left off the key information that you really know what your asking about wrt. having each question on Joomla (i.e. that you're a moderator there).
 
righto. reading you loud and clear.
 
@mickmackusa Thanks.
 
5:40 AM
delicious canned meat ^
 
6:28 AM
I love how a tactical move makes our transcript look weird. Specially if our members show their special taste for our diamonds ...
 
:)
 
7:28 AM
waffles
 
7:41 AM
:)
 
7:59 AM
@mickmackusa May I ask how much moderator activity you see on "your" site?
 
I think this C# Question cleared Triage by mistake. It seems the comment points out that it's not answerable, but I'm not sure.
 
8:27 AM
 
@Vega Sounds like a tasty Saturday morning breakfast :=)
 
@Scratte I'm not a C# user but that doesn't look like a full stack trace to me at least...
oh I see
yeah, that's not answerable
GLrender.Camera.PerspectiveUpdate does not appear anywhere in all that code.
 
@halfer I know you like them with maple sirop, that I forgot, sorry :)
 
@RyanM Exactly. I searched for the code and I found it strange that that the only place that line is mentioned is where they say that's the problematic line.
 
@Scratte less than 1 flag per week. There is a dismal volume of total activity. This allows me to "helicopter parent" every single post -- so there are even less things for the community to flag. This is why I am so desperate to help JSE to grow. meta.stackexchange.com/q/351032/352329
 
8:37 AM
@mickmackusa Can you answer every Joomla Question?
2
 
I, personally, am definitely enough of a SME expert to answer every question. I niche myself to answering php, js, css, database querying, and extension development questions. When I do, I am excessively generous because the people that are researching these issues are not likely to be programmers -- more times than not, they are business owners that are whacking together a website.
When I got my diamond - notice I did not say that I was elected - I was working for a Joomla agency. I have since left that role and now do zero Joomla development. I serve because I believe I am helping the community to grow and curating better content. @Scratte
 
That will be an incentive for users to ask their Question there instead of on Stack, right? I assume they are looking for Answers, so I assume that they will be more likely to get an Answer on Joomla.se then :) But do the users know this?
 
You will notice on my earlier referenced meta hyperlink that JSE is against two monsters. Joomla Forum and Stack Overflow. Stack Overflow has 3 times as many Joomla questions as JSE. I need to shift something. Look at these metric which seem to doom JSE as a beta site: area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/58842/joomla
TylerH said ~ a month ago, that he didn't even know that JSE existed. If high frequency Stack users don't know, how can I expect humanity to know.
 
@mickmackusa I'm finding "2.5 answers per question is good, only 1 answer per question needs some work." to be very strange. I wonder what the number is for Stack.
But I also think it's a bit strange that there's no guidance by the UI. I can go and ask a new Question and pick the Joomla tag and ..nothing. No popup telling me there's a dedicated site. That's ..hmm?!?.. why?
 
8:56 AM
@M-- Did disabling the request generator resolve this issue?
 
@mickmackusa Alternatively you can leave a canned message on all new Joomla Question telling them about the dedicated site.. assuming that's not against any policy.
 
@Scratte I 1000% agree with you. It would be great to have some kind of alert to the user (who either types the word "Joomla" or if one of the 30 joomla-* tags are used) which says "If your question directly pertains to Joomla or would benefit from the support of a community with an intimate understanding of the CMS and its extensions, please post your question on Joomla Stack Exchange."
I am already trolling the Joomla questions on SO and dropping these comments on a case-by-case basis.
The problem though, is that it burns my time and creates "litter" in the Network. Sometimes they duplicate the post (crosspost) -- and this redundancy isn't great.
The great thing about how small JSE is, is that the community feels more like a caring community. Downvotes and page closing is very rare. There is more patience and compassion and explanation behind all actions. Far more welcoming than SO. We can easily maintain our vibe with 10x more questions per day.
 
@mickmackusa Ahh.. cross-posting is small price to pay to the site up and running no? While it's frowned upon, I haven't actually seen any strict policy on it.
 
@mickmackusa BTW: With respect to your migrate to Joomla flags, I'd be more comfortable migrating them if either the OP has an account on Joomla (i.e. they've ever visited it), or that they indicate somewhere that they are willing/interested in having it migrated.
 
@mickmackusa Ok. So now I have a canned comment saying "Please note there is a dedicated site just for Joomla :)". Anything I should add to that?
 
9:09 AM
@Vega That's OK - I'll take whatever waffles you have, and add my own syrup :=p {yum}
 
@halfer Oops, the sirop used instead of syrup should not taste good, better add yours ;)
 
@Makyen Sure, I get your concern and I'd prefer that scenario too, but at this point I feel like if I am going to make any real impact, I need to drag the horses to water and push down on their necks.
@Scratte that will do the job. Be sure to use the available shortcode: "[joomla.se] Stack Exchange" is what I type in.
 
@mickmackusa OK. I'll add it when I see them then. But I'm just a small user, and I only review a handful of posts. I don't need to use the shortcode, when I have a canned comment :)
 
^^Spam
 
This is getting a little frustrating. Is the message "Don't bother finding a duplicate target"? Leave it as "Looks OK" as it was from Triage? I mean if the result is just a regular closure then I do not see how it's making the site any better.
This will never Roomba anyway, so what's the point of that blue bar? The title is the exact error message that the code will give. 3 users flagged / voted for the duplicate..
I mean I do not mind never trying to find a duplicate target again and just leave those Questions as they are without flagging them at all.
 
 
1 hour later…
11:13 AM
@Scratte Not sure I understand but are you upset that the question got closed? We can vote to delete in 2 days. Was this question really that useful that it should stay?
 
@Dharman I will not miss out on anything that it's closed. Nor will anyone else. But.. it had debugging details, and it's a duplicate. So I'm not happy about the banner, as I find it to be wrong. What's the author suppose to do with that? They have already added minimal code and the error text, which is even in the title, so it's easily searchable?.. The banner should say it's a duplicate, because it is.
Delete voting is will not be any different no matter the banner or the close reason.
If we can't close for the right reason, there's no point in having different reasons, we could just have one reason like "We didn't like this. We won't tell you why, but fix it"
 
"See "Perhaps you forgot to import the class."" How can you know that? Are you sure the example is MCVE?
The banner is just a comment for OP, but you left a duplicate comment with a link below the question which does the same thing.
The reason doesn't matter much unless you want to keep this question.
I don't believe this would be a good signpost so let's close for any reason and delete it soon
 
An answer which is exact copy of the question is safe for NAA?
 
11:29 AM
@ArghyaSadhu Leave at least a comment about, otherwise, I am almost sure, NAA will be declined
 
@Vega good suggestion..I just did
Ah..got helpful
 
@Dharman It will not be deleted by Roomba. And yes, I'm sure. I ran the code.
 
@Scratte Roomba forecaster says it will be eaten if the answer is downvoted. But the answer doesn't deserve a downvote, IMHO.
 
@AdrianMole Yes. I am not downvoting that Answer. I would probably even upvote it.
And perhaps some may say that the Question is low-effort, but.. its Answer is very clear on what is going on there, so anyone searching for this error that lands on it, will have their issue resolved in less than 6-8 seconds.
Which is less than my 3600 seconds when I first encountered it :D
 
11:53 AM
@ArghyaSadhu If it's a exact copy of a question, isn't it "a question"?
 
@Braiam sometimes folks answer with a question mark at the end and there is a chance that flag gets declined in that scenario unless you look at the question and match it with
 
@ArghyaSadhu If a post has a problem statement, without a solution, it should never be considered an answer.
While I try to put in my questions a grammatically correct question, I've seen enough non-question being asked as questions because they at least include a problem statement.
 
@Braiam there are always outliers..I was talking about this one stackoverflow.com/questions/63857359/…
 
12:08 PM
@ArghyaSadhu That was deleted. And no, that thing would never fly.
 
@Scratte I don't honestly remember how I voted, but I seem to have upvoted your comment suggesting the duplicate. I remember being unable to figure out what was going on due to the question being changed so many times by the OP and the answer being for a version other than what it got reverted to.
 
LoL Community User only has Not-A-Robot badge :D
3
 
At any rate, the suggested duplicate comments are valuable even if the question isn't ultimately closed as a duplicate.
(or even ultimately closed at all)
These constantly-moving-goalposts questions are kind of maddening to try and answer. "Why does it say No adapter attached; skipping layout?" "Because you set the adapter in an async callback." "Why isn't it displaying anything?" "Because you assumed that async callbacks run synchronously." "Why does it crash with NullPointerException when I fix that?" "[screaming]"
 
@RyanM Either, edit it to match a question that isn't a duplicate or close it as too broad.
 
If Samuel Liew obliterates de CV-queue down to zero, that'll have to be a first since the queue was created.
 
12:17 PM
Moving goal post aren't good sign posts :D
 
@RyanM At one point you have to tell the OP:"Open a new question. Help center says you can only change the specification "that many times" after an answer has been given."
 
@bad_coder Thing is, help center said no such thing.
 
@bad_coder I've definitely informed people "Great, that means this issue is fixed and now you're having a new issue :-)"
 
@Braiam Arrgg somewhere it says that...I know it does...But I can't and won't find it on a Saturday morning :D
 
@bad_coder It says that you may clarify the meaning, but in the interim it may stay closed.
"If you missed an obvious piece of information, be ready to respond by editing your question to include it."
 
12:25 PM
@RyanM I like that phrasing, if you don't mind I might be using it without attribution henceforth.
 
@bad_coder Go ahead, you (and anyone else) are welcome to do so
 
@Braiam Yeah....Clarify meaning goes so far as I can tell the OP: "Great, that means this issue is fixed and now you're having a new issue :-)"
Open a new question :P
 
At any rate, for that particular question: if the OP wanted their question to be closed as a duplicate instead of for a lack of debugging details, they shouldn't have edited it into a state where the code in the question did not produce the error they asked about in the title.
 
Which is why I prefer those questions closed, unless there's a issue that hasn't been asked before.
 
1:07 PM
@RyanM Is that still "my" post you're talking about?
 
@Scratte Yeah I was away for a bit and missed the original conversation in real-time
 
@RyanM That's OK. My point was that if there is an Answer and it's a duplicate, I think it should be closed as one. If users start to vote in every which way making it confusing for the author, then I see no point in flagging it as a duplicate at all. Then I'd much rather just put a note in a comment, no flags and upvote the post. It was my flag that put that post into the close vote queue, so I feel personally responsible for the confusing banner.
Of course the post was generally confusing due to various revisions, but that seemed to stop after the double rollback.
 
@Scratte the answer is to a different problem than the duplicate, though. It doesn't answer the error in the title or the current version of the question, it answers revision 5. Which was No MCVE, because that code doesn't produce that error.
 
@RyanM Yeah.. that is a little funny :) It skips the import, which is answered in the comments. And goes for the rest of the code. I see it answering both revision 4 and 5 though.
I'd say that if the banner had been correct this Answer would have made more sense.
 
1:30 PM
@Scratte It's not, though: "you give a float while you expect a BigDecimal as return type." is only applicable to Revision 5, not Revision 4 or the current revision
So the rollbacks invalidated the answer in order not to invalidate the comments
and revision 5 has the imports, which is why the answer didn't address them
 
@RyanM Hmm.. When looking at the revision history of the Question. It was at revision 4 at 09:27 :) Which is when the Answer came in.
 
@Scratte ...well, that's perplexing. I'm not sure how the answerer answered the question a minute before it was posted. Grace period edit maybe?
 
Then the Answer added more stuff at the time of the new revision to the Question.
It says the Question it was first posted at 09:23
 
errr, I got mixed up on the timing, it can't be a grace period edit.
I'm not sure what happened there, but the answer addresses revision 5's issues, causality violations notwithstanding.
 
The "Plus you give a float while you expect a BigDecimal as return type." was there from the beginning of the Answer before it was edited..
 
1:41 PM
Yeah, there's some violation of causality there. Perhaps they were both similarly confused, or their error confused the OP, or maybe the Doctor is answering SO questions in their spare time.
 
And I think you're just confused about what they mean.. :)
 
To the extent that close voters picked the wrong option (which is arguable), it's because they were dealt an extremely confusing hand. :-)
 
I read that they give a float, then they mean, you're giving a floating value as a parameter to the roundFunction.. (though they're giving a double floating value)
roundFunction(12.3, 1); <-- you're giving a float value, but the roundFunction expects an Object..
 
Oh I see, so when they say "return value" they mean "actually not a return value at all"
 
Yes.. that's a good point. I figured that was a result of a rephrasing or something because that didn't make any sense even the first time I read it :)
There were no BigDecimal return type when they first used it.. :) I think the Question author changed the return type of their method based on that very strange sentence.
 
1:49 PM
Anyway my overall point is that while I agree with many of your criticisms of sloppy close-voting, this was an extremely confusing scenario, caused in large part by the OP, that required substantial effort to unpack what was going on and figure out the exact correct close reason on a question that everyone agrees should be closed. I don't think it's reasonable to blame close voters for choosing a reason that was correct when they voted, but arguably incorrect when the full timeline is analyzed.
 
Yes.. I will go and make some hot chocolate and have a cookie and evaluate my thought process. Thanks :)
 
Enjoy! sounds nice :-)
 
2:35 PM
^The second target in comment is better
 
also with plagiarized answer
 
3:33 PM
Is this sd report a spam post? Or is it simply misguided? Anyone?
 
Whatever it is or isn't - I flagged it as spam
 
^ +1
 
M--
4:03 PM
@Makyen what issue?
Oh I see. I am on my phone. I'll check it when I get home.
 
@M-- OK. Thanks.
@Makyen Note to self: We're talking about an issue wrt. being unable to vote to close as a migration. It's hypothesized that an error is displayed in the SE UI due to an issue in the Request Generator. See this message for @M--'s mention of it, which was linked back to this reported problem. I've not been able to reproduce the issue, but I might be getting a different response, due to being a moderator.
 
4:23 PM
@M-- That's caused by Sam's Review script. When this happens you need to press the back button and select the reason manually.
 
@Dharman Ahh... good to know. Thanks.
 
5:54 PM
 
Morning chaps ... is this one "needs more focus" (as it's asking about Mac or Linux) or a dupe (as there are several questions with answers that do this for Linux)? stackoverflow.com/questions/63863219/…
 
@tink More like off topic. It has nothing to do with programming.
 
Heh ... not helping @Braiam ... now I have three options ;)
 
May 31 at 21:37, by Braiam
I go: off topic, unclear, opinion based, too broad, duplicate.
 
6:12 PM
I need to ask more questions. I've only asked one, so when it gets randomly downvoted - presumably because of someone who objects to feedback - there's no chance of it being reversed.
 
@DavidBuck That doesn't compute, it can't be randomly downvoted and at the same time have an specific reason :D
Now, on a serious note, beats us. :D
 
Semantics. Replace random with 'out of the blue'
 
Who knows if Tim lost its keys, again, and your post was downvoted.
Trying to extract deeper meaning usually ends up in futility. You may ask specific users for their input, but otherwise I doubt it could improve your status.
 
I appreciate the "I KNOW I don't have enough reputation to comment, but I have something so important to say that I know the community will desparately want to read it" brigade will never be enthusiastic about moderators and curators trying to weed the garden.
 
6:40 PM
@DavidBuck You know one can get Question banned by only two Questions if the score is low enough, right?
 
@Scratte It's going to take a while to get that low, though.
 
@DavidBuck Yes :) I assume it doesn't count if it's made into a wiki, but I'm not sure.
 
Is this spam?
 
yes
 
@tink It seems OP isn't getting login screen. Thus off-topic.
 
@Kulfy my French is rudimentary, and I couldn't be bothered using google translate ;) ... it's off-topic for being in French, too ...
 
:-P
 
For a 3 year old pug your French appears to be excellent, though ;)
 
7:26 PM
@tink I'm a 5 years old now. I didn't check my profile :P
 
7:57 PM
thanks y'all, have a nice weekend!
 
8:29 PM
 
9:24 PM
@Turing85 file under "no good deed goes unpunished"
 
@HovercraftFullOfEels Thanks =)
 
9:39 PM
 
10:25 PM
Don't know anything about php/mysqli, but the Answer on this Question seems off.
 
10:39 PM
@Scratte The whole question seems of. OP tries to connect to the phpmyadmin web UI....
 
10:50 PM
@Turing85 Confusing MySQL and phpMyAdmin is extremely common
It's up there with confusing the IDE with the platform they're developing for
 
@RyanM really? I normally do not watch the corresponding tags... I cite Babbage for those kind of question (at least internally, not as a comment, of course)
@HovercraftFullOfEels Madness? THIS IS SPARTA!
 
@Turing85: indeed
 
@RyanM This would result in me citing babbage over and over again... yeah... no.
 
@Turing85 What RyanM said.. Users are confused all the time. Some times they even post comments in Answers, which I think this one is doing :)
 
10:56 PM
I don't watch those tags either, I'm an Android dev, though sometimes we get [android] [php] questions, which are...almost never good
 
@Scratte THAT is a different story. At least if they have < 50 rep.
 
@Turing85 That rule doesn't apply to a users own Question though :)
 
@Scratte Even then, maybe they are new to the site and have not taken the time to get familiar with the UI. But if they are working with php and mysql, I assume they have at least some experience with both tools
 
@Turing85 Is "copy-pasting from Stack Overflow" experience? :-)
 
Just to be clear: All my "own" user scripts are copy'n'paste from Stack Overflow :) I have no idea how they work. They just seem to do what I need and not break ;) I've been told it's JavaScript, so that's the keywords I use to search for stuff I need :D
 
11:03 PM
@RyanM Of course it is. But it is not experience with the tools they are using... Sometimes, I get really, really scared that airplanes, cars and the like mostly run on software...
@Scratte negative introspection. A skill too many people do not have and also do not try to acquire...
 
@Turing85 Fortunately, human brains set the bar for random bugginess pretty low, so it's not too hard to make it more reliable than we are :-) security, on the other hand, is a different problem...
 
@RyanM Try searching for "Sudden unintended accesleration" on wikipedia
 
@Turing85 per room rules you should edit that to have other text to avoid the onebox
 
@RyanM 👍
 
@Turing85 I'm just not confused about the fact that I can make a small JavaScript program work in my browser, even though I have no idea how JavaScript really works.
 
11:08 PM
(apologies for the brief citationless message, was typing quickly because of the short edit grace period. see this FAQ item for more info)
 
@Turing85 All you need with the link is a character in the message, like start with a . <-- dot and a space and then your link. Or use the toilet overview []() :-)
 
The entire message can be a link, but it needs text, for instance:
 
@RyanM That's the toilet overview.. not just a link :)
 
@Scratte I wasn't quite sure what you meant by that ^^;
 
@RyanM It was Cody that once said that []() looks like a toilet seen from above, but I'm pretty sure Cody actually used the "toilet overview" phrase. It could have been overview of a toilet..
 
11:13 PM
I did get the "toilet" part, I'm actually more confused by the overview part
ahhh. I figured it was some shorthand or something rather than just "make a normal Markdown link"
Now I think I understand.
 
There is no such word as "aboveview", is there?
 
I would have used "overhead view"
 
@Scratte do you mean "overview"?
 
11:29 PM
Since I joined this chat, the number of answers I posted reduced drastically. Is this normal?
 
@Turing85 I can confirm similar results
 
@Turing85 Once you 'join' this chatroom, there is no longer anything even vaguely resembling normal!
You will be assimilated. Resistance is French.
 
@AdrianMole ITYM résistance is French ;-P
 
@RyanM shouldn't it closed at "caused by typo" then?
 
Ooh! Là, Là!
 
11:33 PM
@Turing85 Yep, I voted before I figured out the problem... whoops
 
It's like this: You either curate or you post. One cannot find time for both :)
 
hehe
 
This is among a class of NPE questions that are annoying, constantly posted, and never good, so I didn't spend too much effort before voting, but then I saw the comment and figured it out quickly. I once tried to write a canonical for them, but it got duped to a different canonical that doesn't actually help much.
 
^ We can always write another one :D You just need that Gold hammer first. Then you can un-dupe it
 
11:38 PM
Yeah, I might try it again at some point. If it's closed again I'll post on meta asking for help fixing it so that we can try to at least stem this irritating flood of low-quality NPE questions a little.
Or maybe I'll start it with a meta post looking for input on what such a canonical should cover. TBD.
 
I leave all android curation to you. All I see on those Questions is this huge wall of code and think: Wait?!? All that just to put "Hello World" on a mobile device? :D
 
@Scratte We are working on solving this problem :-) One of our leads has a not-so-secret ambition that you could fit a complete "Hello world" Android app in <10 lines of code or so.
 
@RyanM Or, as Jon Skeet would say, you just need: h.
 
@AdrianMole I'm afraid I'm not quite getting the reference
 
11:46 PM
@RyanM Any experience with flutter? Would be interesting to know if it "cleans up" the clutter.
 
Imagine the eternal September on Stack Overflow of everyone being "able" to make apps for phones with just a few lines :)
 
@RyanM See here.
 
@Scratte well right now the new project wizard gives you a hello world for zero lines of typed code :-) see every question that's asking questions about MainActivity like that's an actual concept and not just the name of the file in the template
 
'He could have easily done it with zero bytes, "but that would have been silly."' :D
 
@Turing85 Flutter's great! Jetpack Compose (new UI toolkit) got a lot of great ideas from them. Biggest downsides to Flutter are lack of easy interop with existing Kotlin/Java code/ecosystem, and need to ship a complete renderer (~several MB of code) with the app, though they've gotten it remarkably small. Big upsides are cross-platform and very consistent rendering due to shipping their own renderer.
 
11:51 PM
@Scratte You just have to admire the man's sense of humour.
 
@AdrianMole ah, that's great :-)
Completely unrelated: To satisfy my curiosity since I can't see deleted posts, what ended up happening with this post? It was deleted due to moderation overnight, but I'm curious if anything else happened or if it just got deleted due to the original content/existing comments.
 
@RyanM It (the Meta-post) was deleted by three community members (all non-diamonds); the comments section descended into a rant. First closed as a duplicate and was on -15 (all downvotes - no ups).
 
@RyanM Well... some problems sounds like they could/would be fixed if google actually makes flutter the new de-facto standard for android...
 
@RyanM it was deleted by 3 normal users, not a moderator. It ended up at -15 (gotta love that meta effect). There weren't any more comments before it got deleted.
 
Thanks! Curiosity satisfied :-)
 
11:56 PM
Spend more time Answering, you can get there in 3 days, no? Accepts are not capped ;)
 

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