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10:10 PM
(So hopefully the dean got a better haircut since. In any case, he's handing me a certificate which says 'Brian is awesome and I'm not worthy to be in his presence'. The print is kind of hard to make out in that photo.)
 
@HostileFork How do I get around the symbols _dtoa and _STRTOD not existing when building rebol from source on Windows with VS2015 pre-release?
 
@Freezerburn Hum. I do not know. I've never heard of this problem. Is Internet not being of assistance?
Note that despite my deep dark Microsoft past... I do not use their tools or support their OS.
Everything I do is under VirtualBox on a mac, of all things.
 
@HostileFork I saw it mentioned only once in relation to rebol. There seems to exist a strtod function on Windows, but dtoa doesn't seem to exist
They have definitions in one of the header files, but no bodies anywhere
 
Hurrrrm
 
And strtod is redefined as STRTOD in another header file
 
10:19 PM
Well, I can build Rebol under MINGW.
@ShixinZeng builds it under Visual Studio
 
currently trying to build with VS using the vsbuild.bat (had to modify it to be able to detect 2015 though)
Also: header file with dtoa (and also STRTOD right next to it): ./include/sys-dec-to-char.h:39
Used in f-deci.c
 
@Freezerburn Well you're certainly in the unsupported territory I think, but if you find the patches to make it work, I'm sure it will be appreciated... but check the Atronix repo first
 
I build the atronix repo with visual studio, but not the mainline repo
 
Will atronix repo work with garden?
 
@Freezerburn It should.
What's going to happen, I'm sorry to announce to everyone, is that Ren/C will be the only build that will work with Ren Garden... at least until my patches get taken...
I played nice at first because I didn't have a better answer. Now I have one.
But Shixin says he's willing and ready to believe.
And earl said:
May 23 at 21:12, by earl
1. deliberately as first item: i fully support the Ren/C effort and hope that i'll be able to contribute what time i have. i sincerely think that this is the best chance to, collaboratively, move this thing forward. i very much appreciate the effort and work you've invested into this so far, @HostileFork.
If the two of them are on board, we have a shot here.
e.g. rebolsource and zsx/r3 might well pull the ren-c patches
 
10:25 PM
@Freezerburn I would imagine it is going to be easier all around to try to build with mingw.
 
@kealist I'm sure it would be, but I'm not particularly a fan of building things on Windows by pretending you're on unix
 
And if we are to believe it, that Carl has truly delegated github rebol/rebol to earl, then we might just flatten this whole thing out
May 22 at 19:23, by Respectech
@HostileFork I just talked to Carl. He said he gave the rebol/rebol github keys to Andreas. And also he thinks that @kealist has admin control. He told me he gave Andreas permission to handle the administration of admin privileges. :-)
 
It's kind of funny that Carl may have thought something like that, probably my dad's fault (and working on the serial thing)
 
People should talk more. I think we live in our own heads too much.
We can't correct anything if people won't talk.
You can carry around a misconception for decades, and it can be guiding decisions.
It is for this reason that I am so "noisy". :-)
I want to know what I don't know.
 
Whoa, atronix repo actually has even more unresolved symbols. Even including WinMain...?
(this is just using vcbuild.bat)
Though there's an sln, so I suppose I should use that?
 
10:39 PM
@Freezerburn If you want feedback from Shixin, post an issue in the GitHub repo I think :-) I dunno, mingw builds it
 
Fair enough
Though again: I don't like building things in a non-native way on an OS (including Windows). Things should use whatever the OS defines as the native way to do something, even if that means not using the "true unix way"(TM)
(though I'm slightly hyprocritical, since I use cygwin instead of learning powershell properly)
 
@Freezerburn Rebol is crazy and we want to keep it on all the fringe systems... I agree. It's a carefully considered tool which is supposed to be just one unified executable. The "wall of binaries" as I call it.
The turnkey, zero dependency, we build on your system is the reason for existence. So all these angles should be studied.
 
Good philosophy
 
@Freezerburn No one else is doing this. Should they? Hmph. I dunno.
Maybe it's insane.
 
I somehow ended up with that philosophy as some kind of core of what I look for in libraries/programming languages. If it doesn't say it works on Linux/OS X/Windows, at least, I generally don't look at it
@HostileFork Insane? Maybe. But the better way to be
 
10:47 PM
@Freezerburn I do not recommend insanity to the youth of today. But if it ever happens to you, make the best of it.
Guess I should be finishing coherence-one, eh?
 
@HostileFork I prefer not to call it insanity. Instead I like the term "challenging". It's not insane to try and be cross-platform, but it could be challenging to get the APIs correct across the platforms and have a coherent set of abstractions that let the rest of the code not care about those API differences.
 
I'm not looking forward to coherence-two. It should take less time, however.
At some point I can check in the real changes.
 
Submitted an issue to the atronix repo about the windows build in VS2015. And now I will be back in a little bit
 
@Freezerburn There might be something about declarations not being at the beginning of scopes in a few places
 
11:03 PM
@kealist Did you read the part about me apologizing to you again? :-)
coherence-one has test regressions. :-/ I can't submit it until it doesn't.
So sorry to anyone who set aside their weekend to process it.
 
@HostileFork Yes, thank you for the kind thoughts. Just been a bit overloaded these days and don't have much time on an actual computer to read through stuff
 
@kealist Well my point is that I get in all kinds of arguments, it's what I do, and I can rail against people like Kaj who are genuinely unpleasant. But that remark was uncalled for. I so take it back.
I feel at times I lose my compass, and the world turns to noise.
I find the right people forgive quickly, adapt fast, move the future forward. The wrong people can't do that. It's the difference between right and wrong.
So I need to kill every instinct I have putting me in the wrong.
 
11:51 PM
@HostileFork Well, I find Kaj to be quite helpful consistently, so I don't really know how to respond to that
 
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