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7:34 AM
good morning
 
8:19 AM
Good evening
 
Why do suggested editors feel the need to make unhelpful language changes (colour -> color) and brand it as "fixing spelling"
 
That seems like an improper edit, much like changing code formatting
I guess they do it because the spellchecker built into the browser says it's wrong.
 
@Gimby That heavily depends on the change
It's all a question of whether it makes it objectively easier to read/convey the message.
If it's a "replaced all tabs with spaces" or "curly brackets should go on this line and not the next" it's probably inappropriate, I agree.
 
Exactly
it would get pretty tiring if we would have to specify that each and every time though ;)
 
I also don't understand why there are suggested edits with code formatting changes and the message says "Changed grammar"
Good morning :D
 
8:33 AM
ha ha :) You're questioning why people goof, basically ;)
 
There are so many of them!
 
Yeah anything to do with "grammar" is generally a garbage summary and can be ignored
 
 
4 hours later…
user3956566
12:44 PM
Mod Note: A heads up - there is a baseline level of courtesy expected on this site and anything below that is no longer tolerated. The comments have been moved to discussion. If you wish to comment, join the discussion. Any further comments will be deleted. If you have an issue about this, feel free to post a meta post and I will happily convey my viewpoint and that of the moderator team. We're well over the line of people crying foul when attacking people and having their comments deleted. The mods are doing their job and we're not here to be abused tyvm. — Yvette Colomb ♦ 3 mins ago
 
@YvetteColomb "Have been moved to discussion"?
Did you mean "Have been moved to chat"?
 
user3956566
@MadaraUchiha oh yes!! thank you.
 
@yvette Do we really need the drama of yet another meta post? Can’t you just remove BoltClock’s comment as George did all the others? Can you really not see how this appears unfair and partial from the community’s POV?
 
user3956566
@DanBron I undeleted it, because it's relevant to the changing culture of the site and we discussed it as length in the mod chat room and with @MeganRisdal
 
You can undelete comments?
 
user3956566
12:47 PM
I don't want drama, in fact I'm stopping drama, read the pinned post in here --->
 
user3956566
@geisterfurz007 mod deleted ones, yes
 
And flag deleted ones don't work?
 
I don’t need screenshots, I don’t need yet another post and more drama on Meta, I just want mods to refuse to treat everyone equally
 
user3956566
We viewed the comment as relevant and also as setting an example as coming for an extreme high rep user, who is also a mod and has altered their behaviour. A rold model if you will.
 
@geisterfurz007 We can
@geisterfurz007 You can't flag what you can't see.
 
12:49 PM
The very problem is that you discussed this in a kid only chatroom and elected to uniquely preserve it as “representing the change you [the mods] want to see”. That is the core issue. It’s editorializing, it’s an abuse of mod power.
 
No, I meant because Yvette said "mod deleted ones". So if for example I flag a "Thanks this helped me" comment and you mark it as helpful, that comment is removed. Could you undelete that as well? @MadaraUchiha
 
. If boltclock’s POV is so important, let him post it in an answer, as you would have forced any non-diamond user to have done.
 
@DanBron You know, I actually had a draft of an answer before the question was dupehammered
 
Then undupehammer, answer, redupehammer.
 
user3956566
@DanBron people are treated equally, what you're missing is, the site has a clear Code of Conduct and mission statement and as a team we're supporting that. We're shutting down unnecessary drama on meta and releasing the pressure. The pile on and undue criticism is no longer welcome. Any actions I take on meta I am fully willing to back with public explanation and most of the community respects that and probably knows that when I do something there's a very good reason behind my actions. .../
 
12:50 PM
I then posted an abridged version of my thoughts in the comments. So maybe I'll just go ahead and post an answer
 
Yes, do that, and delete the comment, and I’ll atop whining.
 
Sure. Sorry for the misunderstanding. Trust me, I'm just as lost as you are as to what is going on
 
@DanBron You're asking the wrong questions IMO
 
I want Meta to be what it’s supposed to be: the Community’s voice. We already have plenty of places for TPTB to hand down dictims
 
user3956566
.../ my actions are not random, haphazard or favouring anyone. They're always with the best interest of the site and our community on meta. I've made it super clear that the meta community is dear to me and if we want to have any sway and in fact keep a meta site we need to be squeaky clean.
 
12:52 PM
dictums
I appreciate that Yvette, and 100% I do see you as a strong and consistent advocate for the community
 
The question you should ask yourself isn't whether @BoltClock received preferential treatment in having their comment not deleted. The question you should ask yourself is whether the comment has a right to remain by virtue of itself, and whether other similarly valued comments have received this treatment.
 
user3956566
@DanBron I'm sorry, I'll tell you what I tell my adult children. I don't crumple to coercion. You will stop whining when you get your own way.? For real, this will not end well for you with that attitude. Now let's work this out. Why am I undelting this one comment?
 
But keeping it squeaky clean, is the way TPTB want it, is the same as not having it at all. There’s no use if there’s no venue for dissent
 
user3956566
@DanBron I am and believe it or not, me being direct with you it actually helping you in the long run.
 
> I would start an activism group and make a GoFundMe page about it. "Save the random numbers!".
lol
 
user3956566
12:54 PM
@DanBron there's no point in flogging a dead horse. There's no room for "dissent" that has been expressed endlessly.
 
I’m not here to work this out Yvette, I’m not here to be called an adult child, nor be condescended to with “I know better, this is for your own good”.
Then shut meta down.
It’s pointless if it’s just another CoC or stackoverflow.blog
 
grabs left over popcorn from yesterday
 
@DanBron I think she meant "children" in the sense that they are her biological spawn, not that they are somehow un-grown-up.
@NickA There's some left in Java I think.
 
user3956566
@DanBron I'm trying to tell you - this is how it is. the meta community has less sway than it ever has. The only way we will have more sway is to pull our heads in and at the very least, respect the new direction the site owners have dictated they want. We actually have no choice in that. It's either get with the program (pun intended) or leave
 
Then I’ll leave. I don’t need to write for Pravda.
 
12:58 PM
Didn't read the other comments, but @BoltClock's comment doesn't answer the question. It is, however, interesting/relevant.
/2c
 
It's interesting/relevant but IMO not necessary to be there and nothing (major) would be lost removing it
 
user3956566
@DanBron well we will miss you. I don't like losing people. I do want you to know this, there's people on here actively trying to keep meta and shape meta into something that works. Just because we don't want the same type of accusations hurled over and over, doesn't mean people cannot have a voice. People have said these types of things over and over. We are now trying to allow people who don't participate much on meta a chance to come there and do so without pile on. If we don't have new../
 
@Druckles My original draft was going to be what was in my original comments, the disclaimer serving as a preface to say "I'm not completely absolved of this and I don't pretend to be, but nevertheless I hope you will all listen to what I have to say"
 
user3956566
../ blood on meta, meta will be redundant.
 
@Yvette, I like you and I generally like the way you moderate. But I feel you erred on this one. I liked Bolt's comment, of course, but undeleting it by itself felt improper (and hard to understand, what is BoltClock disclaiming about?)
 
user3956566
1:01 PM
@DanBron Madara is going through the comments to undelete some to give a more balanced argument there.
 
@yivi This is a fair point my comment was referring to it being there alone
 
user3956566
@yivi it's all good Madara is sorting it out. I do make mistakes, and am happy to work on making things better.
 
Also, comparing users to your "adult children" feels disrespectul. I'm sure you do not mean it that way, but it feels deeply condescending. If anyone made a commend like that it would be flagged as rude/unkind in a second.
 
@yivi exactly
 
@yivi We are in agreement. I'm looking into it and seeing what can be restored (or whether nothing should and the rest should be deleted). It doesn't do to leave a biased discussion visible and deleting the rest, when there are good arguments from both sides.
 
1:02 PM
It's all good Yvette
 
user3956566
On another note, I really have to go, I'm hysterically busy. If you ping me, I'm happy to come back and reply on a break
 
@YvetteColomb We wouldn't trust you if you didn't make mistakes :)
 
user3956566
@yivi oh it was in response to - "delete it and I'll stop whining" that attitude doesn't feel very mature. Yes it could be gathered as disrespectful, I get that. It was trying to jolt out what I considered to be childish behaviour - and we all do it. so I don't intend to shame @DanBron Sorry if I did
 
"hysterically busy". My cartoon-fed brain has already painted the picture.
 
user3956566
@Gimby omg you wouldn't believe it!! and yes paint the picture, it's like that lmao
 
1:04 PM
You know what
I don't have the mental space to write my answer anymore, sorry Dan
 
@YvetteColomb I know what was in response to. That's fine. Still it's an improper comment, maybe even more so coming from a mod. We are all volunteers here. But again, it's all perfectly fine. I'm just mentioning this in the spirit of open discourse. Peace and love all around.
 
I don't know what the hell is going on, and I'm getting really stressed out because a vulnerable comment of mine was left up on the question by itself after everything had been moved off-site, without consulting me
 
user3956566
@yivi exactly = and for that I regret the comment. I'm not deleting it, as I think it serves context.
 
I do realize the state of unrest the site has been in in the 5 months I was away and fully anticipated this sort of thing when I returned at the start of this month
 
user3956566
I'll let @DanBron be the decider on that ^^
 
user3956566
1:06 PM
bbl afk
 
See ... it's all "be nice policy" and "code of conduct" fault
 
@Veljko89 Please don't go there
This really, really isn't the time for that
 
sneaks some of @NickA's popcorn
 
slaps geister's hand away
@BoltClock How was your time away anyway Bolt, get anything interesting done?
 
@all I've restored the primary comments to the thread
The one's just agreeing or just adding fluff I've kept deleted, please express your agreement with comments with upvotes.
cc @YvetteColomb @DanBron
 
1:11 PM
I'll just delete one of mine that was undeleted. I don't think it was wrong when posted, but it is no longer relevant in the overall discussion. Thanks for the work, @Madara
 
@yivi 👍
 
@NickA Got a lot of things done that had absolutely nothing to do with programming
 
@BoltClock Sounds great.
 
user3956566
@MadaraUchiha thanks Mads. I think I acted in haste on this one. It pays to not do these things when I'm uber busy
 
@yivi Like, you wouldn't believe. Best 5 months I've had in years
 
user3956566
1:19 PM
@geisterfurz007 pst give me some
 
And that's only relatively speaking
 
Thanks @Yvette and all. I do appreciate your reconsideration of this. I see there’s some back and forth on what to preserve. I’m now happy to leave the ultimate decision in your hands, as I can tell you’ve taken my criticism seriously. I briefly saw when you restored all the upvoted comments, that was my favorite.
 
@BoltClock My downtime is usually very far away from screens and internet connections. My bosses usually have to accept that when they panic and I'm on holiday, I CAN'T HELP. Five months would probably be too much for me to handle right now... Although I'm concerned that's sounds a bit like an addict talking.
 
Also don’t worry about the “children” or other comments. Meta is a heated place, we all have to put on our asbestos underpants.
 
@yivi FWIW, I'd been in contact with @TylerH all this time, so while I didn't touch the site at all in the meantime, he's at the very least kept me up to date on the general climate of whatever's been happening
 
1:24 PM
@BoltClock And you came back despite that? ;)
 
@yivi You can blame Mark Amery for that
 
slides some of the stolen popcorn over to Yvette
 
I don't know how many people on Meta truly see me as a voice of reason and someone people are willing to listen to in earnest, but apparently he does, which is nice, I guess
 
Can people stop stealing my popcorn
 
@MadaraUchiha Yea, I re-deleted them because they’re the sorts of comments that beg for continued discussion in the comments, and we went through that once already. They’ve all been moved to chat. The discussion can continue there.
 
1:28 PM
@GeorgeStocker 👍
 
@DanBron asbestos underpants :/ Somehow I imagine that is really itchy. Kevlar underpants.
 
If people would be cool we could have nice things.
 
My favorite thing about Kevlar is that it was invented by a woman
 
@GeorgeStocker If people were cool we wouldn't have needed pesky things like moderators and democracy, everyone would just be cool 😀
 
I guess they don't onebox tweets anymore?
 
1:30 PM
@BoltClock That broke at some point, no idea if it's intentional or not
 
user3956566
@DanBron look I don't always get it right and am ok to discuss things. Please feel free to ping me in here to discuss meta issues, people know they are welcome to do so in here. I'm glad it worked out. :)
 
user3956566
@geisterfurz007 mmm yum
 
user3956566
@NickA hey it's sharing and caring :p
 
@YvetteColomb selfish is relish? idk
 
1:38 PM
@NickA let me think abou- no
 
@BoltClock o/
@BoltClock yeah, that's been broken for at least a year
1 message moved to Trash can
@geisterfurz007 Apologies if I've missed some prior context but let's avoid unnecessarily inflammatory remarks like that, please
 
 
1 hour later…
3:18 PM
?
 
Where were you Kevin, people were stealing my popcorn
 
3:48 PM
@MadaraUchiha probably unintentional, but not a big enough issue to have any priority in fixing
 
 
3 hours later…
6:23 PM
@TylerH No context was missed; my apologies. Noted :)
 
 
3 hours later…
user3956566
9:23 PM
@NickA we were sharing the popcorn with him :D
 
9:36 PM
@YvetteColomb sounds like bribery
 
9:57 PM
🍿 🌽 🔥
 
user3956566
10:11 PM
@Dragonrage well, less bribery - more @geisterfurz007 and I just steal @NickA's popcorn and never apologise. It's some kinda bullying for sure :D
 
user3956566
@KevinB reverse engineering the popcorn
 

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