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7:00 PM
cool. will do
 
We have some code here that we put in most apps that provides "logging" (wraps console for IE8 and timestamps and the like), and it sets a global error handler so we can send stack traces to the server.
 
Also, your .catch is putting a falsey first parameter which is bad for node.
@ssube yeah - that's the point :) The debate is about a feature I've worked on and petka implemented in io.js
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum what do you mean?
 
@rlemon You call .done with null on error - that's like saying you handled the error.
}).catch(function(err) {
    console.log('the only place I did not log the first time');
    return done(null, false, {message:'error collecting user'}); <- here, also missing semicolon
 });
 
@Loktar, @SomeGuy, other people: youtube.com/watch?v=DVz00c5ARBM Blizzard's making an FPS
 
7:01 PM
Still though, such a basic and important library with global state, ugh
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum ohh sonofa
so that could be where I'm erroring out and I just don't see it?
 
@copy it's not really global state.
 
user1596138
@Zirak haha idk what blizzard is but that looks so cool
 
@rlemon good, now fix that SELECT *
 
user1596138
Looks a lot like LoL
 
7:02 PM
!!afk beer with buds
 
@Jhawins the previously-good half of blactivision? the diablo derps?
 
@Jhawins Warcraft? Starcraft? Diablo?
 
user1596138
I know Diablo form younger days.
 
user1596138
Starcraft is just diablo in space right lol
 
warcraft in space
 
7:03 PM
Sure
 
user1596138
Close enough
 
Diablo in space
 
see how the naming convention works?
 
Overwatch looks like LoL meets TF2
 
you guys played heroes of the storm ?
 
7:07 PM
@Zirak that literally sounds like the worst thing ever.
I wanted to like both of those games, but couldn't stand either. It was awkward, since I used to know one of the LoL devs.
 
so my gf wants to go see a medium. well, rather, already bought the tickets.
I think I need a new gf
 
Well, the feel looks like TF2, Destiny and classic Unreal thrown in; the skill/character system looks a bit like LoL or DotA
 
Yes you do
 
she tells me she is going because she finds it entertaining and not because she believes in it
.. I don't know...
 
@rlemon Spirit stuff?
 
7:11 PM
Join the singles club, where everyone is miserable, but we don't want to do anything about it
 
yup
scam artists praying on the weak
 
preying*
 
@rlemon Pretend to be a dead relative of hers. If she gets scared, she obviously believes in the supernatural. If she just kicks you out, then she was telling the truth.
 
same shit
 
not really lol
 
7:14 PM
ok well taking benji's advice I was playing around a bit more and adding more logs
the first log always hits. the second log never hits after I break it (breaking it just means leaving the user logged in for two minutes then logging out)
for good measure, here is my logout route
router.post('/logout', function(req, res) {
	req.session.destroy(function() {
		return res.redirect('/');
	});
});
pretty simple stuff I thought
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I named @rlemon as host for the next meeting
 
@SecondRikudo BenjaminGruenbaum is afk: beer with buds
 
this is the third time I have to tell you I wouldn't be a good meeting host
 
But he says that he shouldn't be the host because of timezone
 
@rlemon meh, what's the harm. It is interesting.
 
7:18 PM
I have missed the majority of meetings because of my timezone/need to do shit on the times you guys plan them
 
poorly/un-formatted code drives me up the fucking wall. Seriously, I'd rather listen to nails on chalkboard than deal with unformatted code.
 
@Zirak they make me mad because they just scam people. sure they might offer some level of closure, but I don't think they need to outright lie to people to achieve that.
@NickDugger you got smt to say boi?
 
Wasn't talking about you, but if the shoe fits, or whatever the saying is
 
> if the shoe fits, kick nick dugger in the ass with it.
 
@rlemon Oh yes, mediums and their ilk annoy the bazingles out of me, there's no question about it. But as someone on the other side of it, it could be interesting to visit one.
 
7:21 PM
I used to have to tell my senior level coworker to format his code. I swear, I had to say it at least once a day. He had no concept of quality.
 
@Zirak in other news. HALP!
:P
 
hrm?
 
I might just take the next little bit to replicate this on heroku
so people can see the issue
 
@Loktar btw, have you ever played Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning?
It's one of the better RPGs I've played, was extremely unknown for some reason
 
@Zirak there was a steam sale on it + all dlc for like 14$
Fun game
 
7:35 PM
@BasementKeyboardHero And I missed it like a goon
 
It got boring though
 
...and $40 for the entire collection is too much for me atm
@BasementKeyboardHero I can see why people would find it boring after a while, but being able to change playstyles any time you want helped with tha
When I was too good at being a rogue simply switched to wizardry for a while.
 
true, dragon age has the same option and I find it way more engaging
 
crl
Anyone interested could check this, I'm trying to make a 2048-solver, reaching 1024 very often, but not above jsfiddle.net/crl/hmthq78t
 
Haven't tried Dragon Age yet, if it's better than KoA my socks shall be off
 
7:38 PM
DA inquisition is where it's at
they promise you 80h of gameplay if you skip the sidequests :P
@crl got 2048 from the first try
 
@BasementKeyboardHero woah
 
crl
@BasementKeyboardHero oh!
 
I think I have ~40h in so far and I m not even at 50% yet
The mounts are the ugliest mounts I v ever seen though
 
Someone talk me out of converting all my dates to momentjs objects as soon as I get them from the server. I haven' found a downside, yet.
 
@Luggage moment isn't fast
 
7:42 PM
@Luggage You can't make love to momentjs objects
 
@KendallFrey love isn't a real thing anyway
 
well, i'm converting them multiple times anyway in my views to get friendly strings out of them
moment(someDate).calendar()
 
@ssube shush, they don't want us to know
 
and after accidently setting a model value to a moment and having it serialize correctly.. i figure 'why not
 
What is love?
 
7:45 PM
That feeling you get when you see a properly formatted data file.
 
crl
!!> [1+ 1==1?2:8, 1+ (1==1?2:8), 1+ (1==1)?2:8]
 
@crl [3,3,2]
@crl [8,3,2]
 
@NickDugger baby don't hurt me
 
crl
don't hurt me
 
no more
 
7:48 PM
 
I don't get it
oh wait
I had to say it out loud
 
lol
7AM WAKIN UP IN THE MORNING
 
@KendallFrey I will incinerate you. Without leaving a trace.
 
@SecondRikudo there has to be a trace on WHICH SEAT I WILL TAAAKE
 
!!youtube Brocks Dub friday
 
7:54 PM
@NickDugger That didn't make much sense. Maybe you meant: youtube
 
such hipster, won't even spell right
 
I can't even hipster
 
I can't even
 
!this.even
 
I'm odding
 
7:56 PM
@KendallFrey Do you basic bitches need some flavored vodka there?
 
@ssube BASIC? You insult me
 
is there a good IDE for Node JS with auto-complete and auto-indentation?
 
@mrpyo every modern IDE ever
 
I mean, there's limits on what you can do with auto-completion for a dynamic language like Node
 
@mrpyo Visual Studio or IntelliJ
 
7:58 PM
@Retsam "a dynamic language like Node"
 
@KendallFrey Is the nitpicking that Node isn't a language?
 
atom/sublime
 
Hangouts tonight?
 
@Retsam yeah :P
 
7:59 PM
@rlemon I'm gonna see a movie in a movie in a minute, ping me when you've organised
 
i already have intellij so I think I'll use that (somehow didn't consider that there might be plugin fo it...)
 
@BasementKeyboardHero Thanks for suggesting DA
 
@Zirak DA?
 
DeviantArt.
 
Dragon Age: Inquisition
 
8:00 PM
...if only JS had namespaces it would be perfect (ok maybe getting rid of stupid concatenation type inference would be nice too)
 
My second guess.
 
@mrpyo You may just want to consider using TypeScript.
 
no language that doesn't let you define operators is perfect
or "doesn't let you do you do 'x'" for your pet value of x
 
@JaredSmith defining your own operators is the worst possible idea
@mrpyo its JS support is good enough
 
@JaredSmith That's a true statement.
"No language that does let you define operators is perfect" is also a true statement, though.
 
8:03 PM
@Zirak How far are you?
 
@mrpyo You might also look into WebStorm; it's by Jetbrains also, but it's a little more specifically aimed at web stuff.
 
What kind of new/custom operator do you mean? :o
 
raganwald had a good blog about the concept of more powerful vs. better in terms of language design. I guess everybody falls at a different point on the power vs. safety continuum
 
@Retsam you probably accidentally defined "operators" to Optional<T> and forgot to define "is" so it throws but the exception is assigned to a ref and non-null refs are truthy so you end up with it all being true
 
for one example, could define the plus operator to concat arrays
 
8:05 PM
@Retsam WebStorm and their other IDEs are subsets of IntelliJ. They're cheaper and easier to use, but occasionally have issues with plugins and if you need more than one, IntelliJ is cheaper.
 
Webstorm has some pretty good features. But I'd probably go with something more extensible.
basically exactly what @ssube said
 
Last I read, they used the same codebase for most of their editors, just built them with different features enabled and sold them separately.
 
Which is brilliant from a business perspective
but sucks for us devs
 
meh. I have a personal IntelliJ Ult license and work has a license server with a bunch of em.
 
I use PHP storm for my PHP and JavaScript
 
8:07 PM
still cheaper than MSDN
 
truth
 
am I missing something from web storm?
 
As long as I'm asking for ponies on my js wishlist, I want the ability to modify Object.prototype/HTMLElement.prototype in a limited scope, i.e. an object literal has the methods I want but only ones created in the scope I specify. That would be sweet
 
@JaredSmith No offense, but your dream language sounds more like a nightmare to me
 
8:09 PM
@Shmiddty bro, how did I forget about you
you should totes join us tonight
 
"What methods does foo have?" "Whose asking?!"
 
@ssube also
 
different strokes
 
@Retsam isn't invited.
 
@rlemon for what?
 
8:10 PM
hangouts
because rlemon is lonely and wants friends for friday night.
 
like a google hangout?
 
yessum
 
Sure, why not
 
probably get going in a couple hours
once people have started getting off work
 
Much less of an eye sore than the whole message bg
 
8:12 PM
@rlemon maybe. Might have to go out and do stuff.
Rather just chill at home and convert some Java to C#, since I'm gonna be doing stuff all the rest of the weekend, what with valiumtimes day and the Sleater-Kinney show and all.
 
@rlemon Ouch. #hurtful
 
yea I'll be coding while on the hangouts
@Retsam I KID! you are ofc invited. but you have to wear a mask
newbie tradition
 
!!s/off/off at/
 
@KendallFrey once people have started getting off at work (source)
 
I probably shouldn't invite too many people. ten person limit :P hehe
 
8:15 PM
Are the hangouts all video or just voice or just just text?
 
it's just an orgy of hairy man ass
 
@ssube text and/or video and/or audio
also you can draw on peoples faces
 
@Shmiddty How did you know what my ass is like?
 
@KendallFrey The live feed, of course
 
Hm. Can't hurt to stop by.
 
8:17 PM
@Shmiddty I'm pretty sure anything coming from my ass is dead
 
How does one get hungout?
 
@ssube google hangouts
 
you got google plus?
 
I assume
 
or youtube, or gmail. all the same shit (unless you opted out)
 
8:18 PM
@Zirak yeah looking forward to it, reminds me a bit of TF2
 
Everyone has google plus. EVERYONE.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum lol that song is obnoxious!
 
@Loktar BenjaminGruenbaum is afk: beer with buds
 
@rlemon ayup, and the app. I've used hangouts, was asking about this one specifically.
 
In regards to namespacing, is var x = x || {}; the same as if (typeof x === 'undefined') { var x = {}; }?
 
8:19 PM
@Slipfish not even vaguely
 
@ssube ohh yea, pretty well always google handouts
 
that typescript looks interesting. Does it work nice with Node?
 
@mrpyo turns into JS, so yeah
 
cool
 
Typescript has a fair amount of overhead, so I wouldn't recommend it for small stuff. For large projects across multiple teams, it has the potential to save a lot of confusion by documenting and checking types.
 
8:20 PM
@ssube, what's the difference? Or, is there something I can read to learn the difference?
 
@rlemon google handouts? now they're investing in bums
 
function foo(x) {
  x = x || {}; // if you pass "", 0, FALSE, etc.. I will fail.
  x = typeof x === 'undefined' ? {} : x; // I need to be not passed
}
 
@Slipfish it's all about type coercion and falsy-ness.
 
about operator overloading - it is really useful if you do a lot of math stuff...
 
@KendallFrey damn laptop keyboard
fat fingers all over
 
8:21 PM
@mrpyo thank you
 
like @rlemon said, || is logical OR, so if the left-hand is falsy then the right-hand is returned
 
makes sense, thanks.
 
@rlemon function foo(x = {}) { /* ES6! */ }
 
yes, and I await the day I can actually use it without a transpiler or 6to5
 
@SecondRikudo That creates a new object on every call, right?
 
8:26 PM
@rlemon I want to go to either Europe or Spain.
@copy Nope, only if x isn't passed.
 
@SecondRikudo ??
 
@rlemon 6to5 is a transpiler :P
transpiler or 6to5 is always a transpiler :P
 
@SecondRikudo I mean, calling foo without arguments creates two distinct objects
 
@copy Correct.
 
Unlike Python :-(
 
8:28 PM
@SecondRikudo well yea, but they call themselves a "different kind of transpiler"
 
@rlemon vOv
 
maybe I misread the page
 
In [1]: def foo(x = []): return x

In [2]: foo().append(4); foo()
Out[2]: [4]
 
1 sec
ok, my bad, they are just a 'readable transpiler'
 
@rlemon "readable" gets tricky after enough transpiling. :\
6to5 and Typescript are both good, but they still make some odd code
 
8:30 PM
I will give it to 6to5, most of it is readable
 
source maps, No runtime dependency, ect. ect.
 
better than CoffeeScript outputs imo
 
@rlemon set your bar low enough... :P
 
The only thing that I'm missing from 6to5 is the ability to debug in node.
 
Am I the only one who comes here who actually likes coffeescript? (agree about the readability of the output js though)
 
8:32 PM
If I'm using require('6to5/register') setting breakpoints is impossible.
I have to add debugger; expressions everywhere.
 
@JaredSmith probably. It isn't very popular among people who use JS for work.
 
@JaredSmith sure, I get people like writing js in that syntax, and others here do as well. I can't complain enough about the outputs I've seen
granted, I've also been told it was shitty input that produced it
I just haven't seen good input I suppose
 
it's a mushy language for mushy people
and gods know JS doesn't need to be mushier
 
@phenomnomnominal I believe uses it
 
JavaScript is great.
 
8:33 PM
same with a few other regulars
 
It uses a syntax familiar from C and Java and PHP
Lots of people learn and know it
What does CoffeeScript do better?
 
@SecondRikudo because all of those are terrific languages to model after :P
 
I like both quite a bit, but I write coffeescript 6-8 hrs a day at work and then go write it for another 1-2 hrs at home
 
I dream in JS
mind.push('zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz')
 
i like the terser syntax, array comprehensions, range comparisons, etc
 
8:34 PM
I get paid in JS
 
yeah, I've been forced to write CS for work for the past few weeks... not really a fan.
 
@Loktar dude, that's probably not legal. JS isn't worth anything on the open market.
 
@ssube my boss said they are the next crypto currency :(
 
maybe because I started with ruby and python
 
@JaredSmith if terse syntax is important to you, invest in a mechanical keyboard and typistry class
 
8:35 PM
@Loktar I'll trade you your entire steam collection for this array of numbers [1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,0]
 
I have a mechanical keyboard
cherry mx blues
 
you know my account, I expect prompt payment
 
lol
 
There are parts of coffeescript I like, and parts I really don't like, but the net result is I don't think it's worth the conceptual overhead of forcing everyone to learn a second syntax on top of the JS syntax to contribute to your project.
 
lol, the parts of CoffeeScript I liked are landing in JS
 
8:36 PM
@Retsam the second part are my exact thoughts.
 
@Loktar if code was part of the currency, we'd get into some crazy loop where hacking the currency produced more of it, devaluing but propagating it
 
And, yeah, what @rlemon just said; a lot of my favorite parts of CS are ES6, anyways.
 
@Retsam I suppose that's true but anyone who knows ruby and python should find it pretty familiar
 
@ssube memory leak, I'm a millionaire!
 
@Retsam same issue with TS. It adds some value, but selling it is a pain.
 
8:37 PM
Yeah, because Brrendan Eich reportedly uses CS
 
@ssube Yeah, but my opinion is what TS offers: type safety, is a lot more valuable than "the syntax is a bit shorter".
 
@Retsam agreed, for sure.
That's why my suggestion when people ask about CS or Ruby is just "get a better keyboard and learn to type"
 
Its not about typing
its about thinking at a higher level of abstraction. Tell me that array comprehensions are somehow less readable than nested for loops
 
@JaredSmith I mean, it sort of is. The vast majority of CS improvements are just slightly shorter syntax.
 
@JaredSmith comprehensions take a fair amount more time to read
you get functional enough and things are utterly unreadable
 
8:39 PM
agreed, it can certainly be carried too far
 
@Zirak briefly it was pretty good. Its been on sale a bunch of times on Steam and was given to PS+ members for free on the PS3
 
and yeah, I know its just sugar, but still
 
But it's sugar with a cost.
It's sugar that 1) requires everyone else to learn your sugar AND know JS, and 2) it makes things more complicated to build and run, since you've got to translate the code
 
first you get de sugar.
then you get de powah.
then you get de women.
 
it depends. what languages do the people you work with already know? if they all come from a java background or strictly js background, then it probably isn't worth it
 
8:41 PM
The only free sugar I've ever gotten was from your mom.
 
coffeescript is easy enough to debug in chrome
 
js is easier :D
 
Look at Scala and stuff: you get so far into comprehensions and callbacks and lambdas that it's essentially impossible to reason about the code
 
true
 
@JaredSmith The argument "hey it's pretty much just Python" isn't that good, because you still need to know JS to use it right. The difference is, CS requires you to know two languages, and JS requires you to know one.
 
8:42 PM
no way to tell what your scope or closure might be at any point
 
user1596138
Oh god on google street view at my house we were camping in the yard. Is that redneck
 
user1596138
 
CS might make things a lot more concise, but they're also much harder to read and reason about later.
@Jhawins every time you need to ask, just assume it is :P
 
I'm not arguing that its perfect, or even that its better, just that it has useful features and that my opinion is that they're useful enough for me to use
and as far as the readability goes you can write obtuse code in any language
you can also write readable code in any language
 
You can write bad code in any language, but there are languages that encourage it.
 
8:44 PM
like js, or PHP
 
@JaredSmith nope. The first bit is true, that is not.
 
:D
 
user1596138
One time I was camping in the yard and someone teepeed my tent
 
JS, CS, Ruby, and PHP are all terrible offenders.
 
nothing in befunge is readable
 
8:45 PM
@ssube true true
 
Perl doesn't count because it doesn't fall under the usual space-time laws.
 
still my favorite though (js)
 
user1596138
And I chased them away but I didn't recognize them...
 
Hey, if you want to write CS, that's your call. I just don't think I'll be contributing to any of your projects :P
 
fair enough
 
8:46 PM
>              v
v  ,,,,,"Hello"<
>48*,          v
v,,,,,,"World!"<
>25*,@
 
certainly something for any OS projects to consider
 
sure you know what the end result likely is, but can you read that code?
 
@rlemon actually, yes, that one's pretty obvious.
 
I've messed with Befunge before, so sort of.
 
++++++++[>++++[>++>+++>+++>+<<<<-]>+>+>->>+[<]<-]>>.>---.+++++++..+++.>>.<-.<.+++.‌​------.--------.>>+.>++.
 
8:47 PM
@ssube knowing what the end result likely will be and being able to read the code is not the same
 
Arrows tell you where to go, , does something related to memory (probably moving a pointer one cell over), str constants, 48* sets a register and probably puts it in a cell, @ terminates and/or dumps
 
see you're guessing
 
I think , prints the top memory stack
 
just like I would with parts of coffeescript
unless I hit a reference page
 
I have Sublime setup with a plugin that translates CS to JS
Whenever I'm not sure what's going on, I read the produced output.
 
8:48 PM
does it work any better than the CS compiler? I've already conceeded the shoddiness of the output
 
@rlemon so are you hosting?
 
I'm pretty sure it's just literally the CS compiler packaged as a plugin.
 
Can you set up a gist etc if you are and if you're not let me know?
 
gotcha
 
It's only cause I'm pretty comfortable with stuff like .bind, .call, etc that I'm able to read the CS output pretty well
It's probably more of a nightmare for people who are newer to JS.
 
8:52 PM
doubtless. I just find it visually tiring to wade through all the anonymous function wrappers
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum when I get off work yes
 
you guys referring to the meeting?
 
I thought he was talking about hangouts
 
@JaredSmith functions wrapping functions is hard for you to read, and hard for the VM to optimize
 
8:54 PM
ah when is the next meeting?
I noticed the room froze a while ago lol
 
doubtless. although I rarely write any apps where I have to worry about that level of optimization compared to network latency/db queries
 
Damn, I missed the daily coffeescript discussion.
 
@rlemon I was talking about the meeting
@Loktar not sure, @SecondRikudo said he named @rlemon to host it.
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum And again, @rlemon said he thinks he shouldn't.
So I tasked him with naming a successor since he was my backup
 

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