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Yeah I think it is
but I dont what that firefox API is for or when I should be using it
its cool for plugins I guess
Its also rage it doesnt use node.js 's api >_>
 
=)
I found out that underscore makes sorting harder and also slower :D stackoverflow.com/questions/8408434/…
 
12:20 AM
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
jQuery's .data only reads from dataset, it doesn't write to it
This is rage
Thank god I have a gist to edit every time I rage at jQuery
 
@Raynos what do you mean by not writing?
 
I was pretty close to throwin in travis, actually
but the laziness kicked in and also i wasnt sure if people would even want the module
 
@ThomasBlobaum travis is a sign of a pro ;)
I avoid using code that doesnt have unit tests
 
i use travis for my analytics project
i do too, actually, lol
 
What analytics project ¬_¬
 
12:26 AM
an OS one
dont you pay attention in #expressling
 
No
is it because I miss snippets?
 
hmm, no but we were talking about it for a bit and may have even pinged you
 
cant remember
github link?
 
its on GH
but its private
you want to be of makings contribution?
 
I dont know what it is
and how can you say "open source" but be private
 
12:36 AM
because its not to a point where random developers could just contribute
 
why not
issue tracking, alpha testing, code review
these are all things that can be done
 
because i want to give it a good initial direction, and im only about 96% there atm
 
Oh ok
How should my DOM-shim do browser support?
I dont want to have to test FF 3.6 <-> 8
but if I ignore FF 3.6 shouldnt I also ignore IE8 ?
 
@Raynos Selenium?
What changes in the DOM code of FF3.5 ....FFn?
I say run a diff on the DOM code, test only things that show up in the diff.
So full test 3.5, diffs also get tested.
(in theory this works)
 
12:42 AM
@Incognito browser bugs
 
In the series of "only with jQuery is this possible" stackoverflow.com/questions/8408826/bind-event-only-once/… :D
 
@Incognito it's more about should I put code in the DOM-shim to support older browsers
Where do I draw the line for browser support?
 
@Raynos What type of bugs aren't isolated nicely from the DOM api code?
 
addEventListener(name, cb /*, forgot bool */)
That throws an error because you forgot the "optional" parameter
this is fixed in ff8
 
@Raynos Draw the line where users do. Why aren't you worried about trying to shim Tim's browser Mosaic?
 
12:43 AM
theres plenty of other code thats fixed in ff8 but wont work in ff 3.6
@Incognito I guess you right, I draw the line where the users do
 
(I downloaded Mosaic for kicks one day, whole thing breaks)
 
It's just ugh. I see no reason to support FF < 8
Users should upgrade
 
Does anyone use FF<8?
 
I also want to say fuck ie8 but that 30% market share is annoying me
 
@Raynos: if you draw the line where users do, you need to fully support IE6 and 7
 
12:44 AM
@Incognito my main problem is i'm being preferential to IE8
@jAndy there are fundamental problems with ie6 and ie7 that makes this difficult
 
just saying..
 
it they were easy to support I would do it
 
@jAndy Don't troll, ie6 is dead.
 
I'm thinking of saying "screw ie8"
and just bin all my ie8 code
 
@Incognito: look at asia, india, and south america
 
12:46 AM
paypal uses IE7
 
Can I drop ff3.6 & ie8 support?
 
Actually south america is on par with the world.
 
@Incognito: even if IE6 would have a global share of what, 2%, how much users would that be?
 
my brother works at a hospital where every computer onlyhas IE6, because of activeX
 
is dropping browser support going to damage the dom-shim in terms of being useful to being a toy?
 
12:47 AM
yes
 
I'm just saying, "drawing the line where users do" is bullsh**
 
you should support what jquery supports, no trollies
 
you draw the line at a defined point
 
jQuery doesn't support hasOwnProperty =)
 
@jAndy 40 million people, 2million outside of the great firewall of china.
 
12:47 AM
-_-
0
A: which jquery is best to use

Glenn SlavenI would use removeAttr as it better represents what's actually happening (ie the selected attribute is being removed from the HTML)

 
cowbelljs is the best jquery to use
 
@ThomasBlobaum ...
 
fact
 
I have no issue what-so-ever not supporting china: they don't support the internet.
 
@Incognito theres probably 20milion people in the US still using ie6
totally rampant in businesses
 
12:48 AM
@RyanKinal I was debating upvoting to troll them.
 
lol
 
@ThomasBlobaum 20 million? Where do you get those numbers?
 
even more are using FF3.5, so yes it is a lot of blood to unify a DOM abstraction
your only chance is to clearly define, which you gonna to support
 
@Incognito i completely made up that number
 
1% of american browsers are ie6.
that's roughly 3 million.
 
12:50 AM
I don't know the numbers, but its a lot of people. Not to mention "oldish" firefox, IE7 and foremost 8
 
ie6 is deprecated by all major sites
 
I don't think we are even considering mobile browsers do we ?
 
@Incognito what i know from first hand experience is that IE6/7 are very often used in businesses and they do not give 2 shits about how old it is or what they "should" be using
 
Why is that?
 
Why do I need to support legacy platforms? :\
 
12:51 AM
you don't
 
like i said, paypal uses IE7. i do contract work for some people there, and they are always at terminals where they can only use IE7
 
you just need to make up your mind to drop possibly millions of users
 
But then again do I want to write websites that only reach about 40% of the internet
 
"theoretically"
 
@Raynos I wouldn't. I'd draw the line at 80%-95% user share.
 
12:52 AM
i know that every hospital that uses General Electrics as its Health Information Systems provider uses IE6, only, and that is a lot of people
 
ok, you can argue that employees in a hospital won't visit cutting edge websites all day
but ofc, you're right
 
it is lurking all over the place
is the point...
no, they do visit facebook all day, and it works the same on IE7/6
 
Touché
 
Facebook doesn't support ie6.
 
so does pandora, which they also use
sure it does
 
12:54 AM
Facebook does not support IE6 ?
personally, what I do is to have a conditional in my index.html which checks for IE6/7 and then, suggest to install chrome frame
I guess that is a half devent solution for single websites
but ofc, not anything which claims to be a 'framework' or solid library
 
@Incognito 80% is modern browsers, ie8 & ff3.6 :\
I only want to support modern browsers
 
@Raynos 80% of use is 20% of browser quantity.
 
so, yes why not. Nothing wrong with that decision @Raynos
 
bottom 20% of browsers is like 80% of browser market.
 
look at Zepto :p
 
12:57 AM
But I also want the DOM-shim to be a reputable browser
@jAndy zepto is build for mobiles
dom-shim isnt going to touch mobiles >_<
 
why is the dom differnt on mobiles?
 
@Raynos: I don't believe that.. I crawled through the code a while and they certainly try to support non-mobile browsers as well
 
@Incognito it's not
 
but also, only top-level ones I guess
 
half of the DOM-shim is emulating the DOM
 
12:58 AM
@Raynos I know it's not.
 
and the other half is specific bug detection and fixing them
bugs.js is tiny at the moment
but as the DOM-shim grows into production ready go, it will be the largest part of the DOM-shim
because modern browsers are not missing dom apis as such, they are implementing half broken apis
 
actually, that is also a great strenght of jQuery, fixing very browser(even version) specific DOM bugs
 

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