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3:00 PM
@Gemtastic no it wasn't
 
@Unihedro Luckily. People dying is sad :(
 
agree
 
@fge What if I need both? Does that makes the asnwer to my first question as yes?
 
Is there a Import All missing imports keyboard shortcut in Idea?
 
3:05 PM
LMFAO
can you pass on the link?
 
1
A: java.lang.Class and java.lang.Object

aliteralmind 3) classes in Java are not just compiler artifacts - but at run time, are represented by the instances of the class java.lang.Class This is not correct. Java objects are objects. They also have an attribute that represents their class type. public class Test { public static final void m...

I have an answer above his' :p
 
Today, Java is the object of my affections
 
> Java objects are stored in class files
wtf ???
 
That is indeed true.
 
3:09 PM
class Foo {}
 
@Unihedro Aren't objects a runtime entity?
 
@ItachiUchiha Heard of "object files"?
Object files represents a class, runtime entities are represented by instances of Object.
"objects" != "instances of Object"
 
Also... When did I ever say anything about JOOQ?
 
Back to what I was saying, here you have class Foo {} class Bar {} in FileName.java.
 
ok..
 
3:11 PM
By compiling this file, you get Foo.class and Bar.class, both of which are Java objects.
It's like Foo.o in cpp.
 
Foo.class is a Java object?
I thought they are called as "Class files"
 
When you have Foo foo = new Foo(), you're constructing an instance of Foo, which is a runtime entity represented by an instance of Foo, which is a subclass of Object. That's not the "objects" in context.
 
usually called class files, but they're the rough equivalent of object files for native code
 
@ItachiUchiha Class files are object files..
An object file is a file containing object code, meaning relocatable format machine code that is usually not directly executable. Object files are produced by an assembler, compiler, or other language translator, and used as input to the linker, which in turn typically generates an executable or library by combining parts of object files. There are various formats for object files, and the same object code can be packaged in different object files. In addition to the object code itself, object files may contain metadata used for linking or debugging, including: information to resolve symbolic cross...
Object file contains object code. If you're NOT running on Windows (important premise here), instances of Object are not represented by files, but a subprocess or even one of its own the the JVM deems it necessary.
 
This is something new, well I understand what is Object file :)
 
3:13 PM
(Though, if you're on Windows, Windows creates a file for every stupid thing you do anyway.)
I quote from the wikipedia article:
> An object file format is a computer file format used for the storage of object code and related data.

There are many different object file formats; [...] and used on different kinds of systems. It is possible for the same file format to be used both as linker input and output, and thus as the library and executable file format.
Java objects (object files) as Foo.class and Bar.class are somehow understood by the JVM, and the instances of Object created are not strictly dependent, however follows the contract because the JVM does many optimizations on the lower levels anyway.
It is however easier to understand "objects" in the sense of the instance level, which means that class -> the static level thing away from instances; objects -> the instances of anything from subclasses of Object; However a Java object does not really refer to that.
 
Then what does it refer to?
 
A... Java object
 
Duh.
 
Haha, I like how Bitbucket lets you sign in through Github,
 
3:25 PM
They are good. And Github with it's vendor lock-in is bad
 
RIP several local repositories, since I never need to access them anymore I'm putting them onto private Bitbucket areas and scrapping them
for disc space
 
How big they are?
Are they forks of Linux Kernel, Symbian or something? :P
 
haha
 
Uh several boxes of dozens of dozens
to be exact, over 2 gigabytes
 
Not much
 
3:27 PM
I know it's not a lot, but meh.
 
2 gigs of code without the libs is something
 
Kernel is >2GB and Symbian's raw repository (i.e. with binary and other stuff) is >7GB (IIRC)
 
Yep, my old code for the EmberCraft server software :)
Zero dependencies because I never knew Guava existed :|
Actually, I made that before I learned to use proper tools, so most of them are from scratch - kinda stupid now that I think about it, but gave me lots of experience
 
26 mins ago, by ItachiUchiha
Is there a Import All missing imports keyboard shortcut in Idea?
 
I don't know.
 
3:29 PM
^^ Do we have that for Idea?
 
I just go to the red type names and alt+enter to select the proper import and fix.
 
I miss eclipse shortcuts, I was so used to them
 
If you paste code into a file and imports and missing thus leading more compile time errors, it prompts you to fix, so.
 
Idea has eclipse keyboard mode
 
... Wait, really? Why couldn't I find it?
 
3:31 PM
at least android studio has
 
@kiheru How do I do it?
 
Ohhh, I found my autobiography. I thought I deleted it.
 
You wrote this :O
 
3:33 PM
It was only 13 KBs. Sad.
DOD 5220.22-scrapped.
 
I turned that on fairly quickly. Basically seeing a startup tip with both ctrl-w and ctrl-q being defined for something weird convinced me that the jetbrains guys have never heard about platform standards
 
3:54 PM
getResourceAsStream() is not working in eclipse. It is returning null.
 
Eh...
 
you probably do not have correct path to the resource
 
^^^
 
actually I am trying to access a folder in the src/resources/properties folder.
and my classes reside in src folder
and I have used this..
p.load(StemmerDBTopology.class.getResourceAsStream("properties/config.properties‌​"));
 
Well...
 
4:02 PM
But, I am getting NullpointerException
is there anything that I'll have to modify in build paths?
 
I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and ask what happens when you put a / in front of properties?
p.load(StemmerDBTopology.class.getResourceAsStream("/properties/config.propertie‌​s‌​"));
 
@Gemtastic then chances are you're doing it right
 
@Unihedro Woohoo I don't entirely suck!
 
that worked! Thank you
 
@JavaTechnical When you write a path, the / is the thing that changes the directory. In other words, you'd still be in the resources folder and trying to access something in the folder, not moving into the next directory which is properties. If you write it how you wrote it
 
fge
4:07 PM
@JavaTechnical generally speaking you should ALWAYS check the return value of .getResource{,AsStream}()
If it is null, it means the resource could not be found
 
fge
All done! New version of the debugger is out
 
Yay!
 
fge
Now, what next...
 
I suppose what's next is me finishing the logo ;P
 
4:16 PM
Is it safe to delete .m2/repository?
 
fge
Good question
 
@fge do you have something like Ramda in Java? I think it would be really nice.
 
fge
@BenjaminGruenbaum I don't even know what that is
github.com/ramda/ramda <-- is that it?
 
Yeah, in second thought it's not very common - it's like the stream API (stuff like .map and .filter) only it curries by default and it allows functional decomposition. I've been enjoying it in JS.
Yeah - that.
 
4:18 PM
This lecture is an interesting idea on why an API like lodash/streaming is problematic youtube.com/watch?v=m3svKOdZijA&app=desktop
It should be easy to port to Java and a nice way to get stars on GH and a popular library. Wondering if it's already done.
 
It looks like a good idea.
 
fge
watching
Uh, one thing I don't like with functional programming is that their proponents seem to be completely oblivious about errors from what I've seen
 
Hi All
 
@fge Ramda is a very pragmatic library - it's not Haskell. You can make opinionated choices :) I'm wondering if anyone is building auto-curried functions that compose so well in Java.
 
I use the below code to get days before 30 days ago.
 
fge
4:25 PM
Well, uh, I still don't have a real use for JS at the moment so...
 
long one_month_ago = System.currentTimeMillis() - (30 * 24 * 60 * 60 * 1000);
 
Ugh, magic numbers.
 
But, it does not work as I expected
 
Use paranthesis
 
fge
@CoKoder use TimeUnit.DAYS.toMillis(30L)
Don't bother calculating what the JVM can calculate for you
 
4:26 PM
Is there an overflow issue that I am missing?
 
@Unihedro he is literally putting it in a variable there - that's not a magic number :D
Also yeah, dates are hard use a library, the standard one of Skeet's one.
 
fge
Joda Time is not Skeet's
It's Stephen Colebourne's
 
But, it works for 7 days ago???
 
fge
And by the way nowadays you should use threetenbp for new projects
@CoKoder why wouldn't it? And anyway, this looks like a XY problem so what do you really want to do in the first place?
@BenjaminGruenbaum that would be pretty easy to do in Java with the new default methods
(the video, I mean)
 
Yeah, it's super useful and something that sounds like it's fun to do in Java. Since you're the only guy I know who likes coding Java and you're into the more functional parts with lambdas - it sounded like a short and useful project you'd enjoy.
 
4:31 PM
LOL
 
fge
Sorry but I have my hands really full at the moment
 
I like coding java too, but I suppose I don't matter because I'm a n00b
 
fge
Can't take on another project
@Gemtastic well you can have a go at this one
It's quite easy
 
@fge, it worked!
long one_month_ago  = System.currentTimeMillis() - TimeUnit.DAYS.toMillis(30L);
 
fge
You'll be sick of generics after you're done with it, though, since you're going to have to write a lot of them :p
And you won't want to hear the word PECS anymore either
 
4:33 PM
@fge Nah I'm just moping because I'm a n00b ;P
I'm trying to get through this design principles book >_>
 
fge
Well stop moping and start coding :p
 
@CoKoder that's not one month ago though, I hope you realize that.
 
rofl :p I'm not really up to the task of doing all that since I'm also coding another library and I'm not going to like committing so much to it, but if anyone else attempts it, I'm willing to help!
 
@fge lol, I don't think he can - there is a lot of background to understand first like currying, functional composition, pure functions and so on.
 
@fge Well, SQL is on my highest priority atm. I don't even know what I was supposed to do
 
fge
4:35 PM
@Gemtastic well then port your school project to use jooq :p
I can even help on that
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum, what do you mean? it is 30 days ago, right?
 
@CoKoder but not one month ago.
Not all months have 30 days.
 
^^^^^
 
fge
@CoKoder we're in February right now; you do know how many days there are in Februrary, right?
 
In fact, less than half of all months have 30 days, so it's going to be inaccurate > half of the time.
 
4:36 PM
@fge I haven't started it yet since I need to find out if I can do it alone or if I have to be in a group. Noone wanted to group with me :/
 
fge
As I said --> stop moping, start coding :p
 
I'm reading!
 
that is fine for my purpose guys, I just need to go back around 30 days ago :)
 
I have started imagining the structure for the tables though
 
@CoKoder why not LocalDateTime.now().minusMonths(1)?
It's simpler and more readable, no numbers to consider ETC.
 
4:40 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum, how to convert it to long, cause it is joda date
 
My strategy is to first learn how to do it without using the frameworks. Then I'll try both JOOQ and Hibernate (Hibernate is what they "teach" in class)
Then, I'm gonna try a lot of different databases
 
fge
What do you mean, "without the frameworks"?
You want to use raw JDBC?
 
PostgreSQL looks a bit interesting because it looks more readable to me
@fge Yep. That's step 1
 
fge
Uh
 
@CoKoder that's a standard Java date, not a Joda date. Also it has a .getLong method.
 
fge
4:42 PM
Honestly, I believe this to a waste of time
But do as you wish
 
It's not very efficient, but I want to get dirty with the raw stuff first
That's just how I roll
 
Embercraft server software uses raw jdbc.
 
Raw JDBC is horrible but you can easily wrap it in your own data mapper with generics and utility methods.
 
I did back then, but I wish I found out about jooq.
 
fge
@Unihedro jooq is not very old either
 
4:43 PM
If only there was a "all you need to know as a Java dev" site somewhere...
 
@Unihedro I'm kinda with you on what you said earlier; you did a lot of things raw before you found out about dependencies and librarys. It was unefficient and hard, but you learned a lot.
To me, I understand it more if I get to do it raw
I learn how it works, not just how to do it
 
Good thinking.
Plus, it's certainly lots of fun. :P
 
@Unihedro That's what I'm planning on making when I'm confident enough
@Unihedro Agreed ^^
I also like working through the command line
 
There's a reason classes make you write things like basic data structures, but you really should not write them yourself for real :-D
 
4:45 PM
Kinda feels like cheating using the workbench in my IDE
 
@kiheru there are lots of use cases for writing your own data structures. It's just most developers are not good enough to get there :D
 
Let's drop create all the tables!
 
fge
<-- has been doing systems engineering for 15 years, so he knows what "doing it raw" means
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum Ah, yes - even for the basic ones if you're doing embedded.
 
fge
Which is why I really appreciate when there's a library which does things for you; or writing such libraries
 
4:47 PM
@fge Noone said you didn't
 
You should never implement a DB though :D
 
The thing is, I want to be someone who makes librarys, so I think it's pretty vital for me to know how it's done raw
 
If you wanna make libraries just make tons of libraries.
 
I suspect implementing a DB would teach quite a bit
 
fge
@BenjaminGruenbaum uhm, why? Not that I have the need to anyway
 
4:48 PM
Because it takes a lot of work to get right.
 
fge
And then what DB? An RDMBS?
RDBMS, sorry
 
No, any kind of DB - it's just too hard for one guy to do right in a reasonable amount of time.
 
@Gemtastic Welcome aboard! I love making libraries.
 
But it's not too hard for a woman! GURL POWAH! (just kidding)
 
in Tavern on the Meta on Meta Stack Exchange Chat, 3 mins ago, by Bart
And you just turned my happiness into despair. Let me curl up and cry myself to sleep
 
4:52 PM
@Unihedro What did I do? :(
 
idk
 
You made it seem like it was response to my joke
 
fge
OK, back to work on java7-fs-* now
 
I'm starting to regret the hypercaching done with JCE.
Oh well.
 
fge
Hypercaching?
 
5:06 PM
So much caching!@@!!!!@one!
 
fge
And you cache what exactly?
 
information that is never going to be needed anyway
 
fge
Ick! I had forgotten that my fs projects were using Java 7
I was about to write Arrays.stream(opts).forEach(Objects::requireNonNull))
 
:p
YES, There's an official Let Me Duck Duck Go That For You site!!!!
 
5:15 PM
Idea + Eclipse-keymap rocks. Thanks @kiheru
 
you're welcome @ItachiUchiha :-)
 
6:08 PM
I think the universe just told me to go on a diet...
I dropped a plate full of food :(
 
ow :-(
Gravity sucks
 
Indeed
Sometime's gotta be the first I suppose...
Luckily I had more food but now tomorrows dinner is threatened :/
 
fge
6:57 PM
It's been long since I've been doing JSR 203 code
 
fge
7:56 PM
Hmm, pretty dead around here
 
yeah
May be the weekend effect
 
fge
Well, I'd expect the room to be more active on weekends, not less
 
Well, it is always the same on weekends
+ today people must be busy celebrating the V-day
 
I've been busy cleaning up the food I spilled and having a conversation with a guy that doesn't understand his privilege.
 
Neighbour?
 
8:01 PM
No, someone's friend on facebook. He thinks feminist = feminazi
And just because he has it bad, noone can have it worse. Pretty bold for a white man in a first world socialist country...
 
I'm sorry to say but, if you live in sweden and are poor as well as an outcast, you still have it pretty good compared to most of the world
 
"Feminist" has so many meanings that it's basically meaningless
 
Feminist only has one meaning; equality for all regardless of gender.
Then of course, there are people calling themselves feminists when they aren't
Feminazies are just as bad as misogynist people
 
When people pick a label for themselves, I don't think it's my place to tell them they're not real scotsmen or whatever the label is
 
8:08 PM
Personally, I think all labeling and separation into groups is bad
 
Hard to avoid though. Classification is a part of the normal thought process
 
We are all humans, we are all individuals. Everyone's special and noone's special. We all deserve the same things as a basic right, then you can work your way to better things.
Everyone deserves a basic amount of respect, but everyone also have the right to lose the respect for someone who is acting in a bad way.
Anyway, this particular guy is wearing a victim coat and keeps picking fights with my friend entirely unprovoked.
Don't ask me why I'm talking to him... He doesn't want to understand that there are more people in the world than him >_>
 
fge
looks to see if he's really in the Java chat room
 
:-P
 
8:14 PM
See; you don't want me to be more active :(
 
<- opened a wine bottle for dinner. Does Gemtastic have an excuse?
 
Excuse for what?
 
for the off topic discussion
 
Well, the excuse for it was that fge wanted the room to be more active. Now, on the other hand I could have an apology for it ;)
 
fge
Actually, I believe that not even the half of discussions going on in this room is about Java, now that I think of it
<-- still on JSR 203
 
8:18 PM
The room is a lot more lively than it was half a year ago (or was it then? I'm not sure - at least the room was half dead for a long time). I don't really mind if it's partly off topic. Having at least some discussion going on keeps people in the room, so that when java is discussed, we have people here to talk about it
 
fge
I want Google Drive done, and then conversion of java7-fs-ftp to java7-fs-base
@kiheru you have a point, I guess
 
@kiheru +1. I remember when only I used to come here to find kiheru to be the only one here :)
 
And I'm not much of a talker
 
True that
:P :P
 
Even if the room is OT you can ALWAYS butt in with something Java
 
8:21 PM
I wonder how it would be to have a F2F conversation with kiheru
 
I read that as File to File :')
 
I'm mostly quiet in every language I speak
Oh, but File sucks!
 
fge
twitch File twitch
 
@kiheru I doubt you're quiet when you speak Java ;D
Your IDE probably had more conversations with you than anyone else~
 
more a graphics than sound person :-P
 
8:24 PM
^^ can't help but it was worth a star
 
Does that mean you have the Swing or FX accent? ;)
 
Swing. Need to support older java versions. I'll start considering FX once it starts coming with the standard library
 
fge
Well, it does with 1.8
 
It does not. It's not included in openjdk
 
@kiheru It is included in Java8 oracle's JDK
 
8:27 PM
jfx is now open source
and should be available with openjdk
 
fge
@kiheru so why do I run now the latest OpenJDK 8 with JavaFX with no problem?
 
It's not that hard to learn if you already know swing
 
fge
(my debugger, more precisely)
 
@kiheru with 1.8, it is
<--- stuck with a design issue
 
fge
@ItachiUchiha your media player?
 
8:29 PM
yeah
 
fge
I know I had a very hard time coming up with the design of my debugger
I spent more time yelling than coding until I found my current design
 
<-- Will switch to MVP as soon as I am done with a stable version
 
fge
If you want we can have a quick hangout so I show you how I've done it :p It may be easier to port your media player to it than you think
 
It's open source, and included with in oracle's java 8, but it didn't come with my system's (fedora 21) openjdk, unless it's been included in some recent update and I did not notice
 
fge
@kiheru and is that OpenJDK 8 with Fedora?
Anyway, downloading it from openjdk.java.net --> done
Maybe jpackage has a package for it too
 
8:31 PM
@fge Nice idea, but can we do it like after an hour? I am still trying to finish my current design.
 
anyway, I added a warning just before christmas about 1.6 or older that they're being phased out, and that's not yet released... Takes some time before I can rely on v 8 libraries
 
fge
One hour from now, you mean?
 
yeah
 
fge
Fine by me
 
8:32 PM
I have openjdk 8
 
@kiheru Are you a full time programmer?
 
I does not matter if I have javafx. I can always install it, but the users need it
 
fge
Again with those unnecessary abbreviations slap
 
ouch
 
@ItachiUchiha No, an amateur
 
8:34 PM
thinks how is amateur the answer to my question
 
fge
Well, we are at least two then
 
not full time either :-P
 
Thinks when will he match what fge or kiheru already have
 
I have done something remarkable?
 
you have remarkable knowledge on Java
 
fge
8:38 PM
<-- hasn't done anything remarkable either
 
quite lacking in the latest features (though I itch to be able to use those. I have always missed some functional features in java)
 
@fge You shouldn't be saying that. You have achieved the most out of us all. You have a github profile to die for.
@kiheru Those are easy to learn. Moreover, everyone can't know everything.
 
 
1 hour later…
9:40 PM
@fge You have the Grappa debugger. I have a textbased BlackJack game and a shitty webstore in my portfolio >_>
 
fge
@Gemtastic uh yeah, but that's my first GUI app
@ItachiUchiha are you here?
 
@fge All of it it is impressive
 
fge
Well, thanks for the appreciation :)
But it's far from being done
I still haven't started remote debugging for instance
 
It still shows that you're good at what you're doing.
People could just look at that code and decide that they wanna hire you. My code is.. well.. "I see you jsut started programming. Keep it up"
at best
 
fge
I told you already, don't hesitate to ask for help
 
9:56 PM
I am, all of the time :P
Without Ita I wouldn't have made my deadline with my webapp, in fact, I might still not be done with it
Feel free to look at it if you want to give some criticism on the parts of the code you understand.
There's no read me, but there's some JavaDoc
 

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