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2:34 AM
@Sjon Thanks for that. It reduced peak CPU usage about 25%
 
3:16 AM
...
@Girgias I believe putting feelings into words can at least provide clarity:
Nov 26, 2021 at 18:41, by Danack
For the record I am entirely disgusted by the attitude of people who work for companies who give totally biased advice that is based solely on their own interests, but expressed as if they are neutral parties.
Nov 26, 2021 at 18:44, by Danack
This happens in every discussion where people who work for companies don't get want they want. They just instantly go to emotive language to try to get their way, instead of ponying up some cash.
Nov 26, 2021 at 18:45, by Danack
> I know that saying 'no' to users is draining as they so often try to
guilt maintainers into doing work for free. If anyone would like me to
help explain to users "your company needs to start sponsoring this
project before this project will acknowledge this issue", in any of
their projects repos, please ping me on twitter
 
 
3 hours later…
6:30 AM
@Danack Yes, I'm using a global constant (in a namespace though) to determine if debug logic runs - by using a constant it gets compiled to nothing when the condition is false.
 
 
2 hours later…
8:20 AM
mornign all
I'm trying to write an regexp but haven't done them for a while, I'm struggling how to ignore PHP namespaces which contains numbers at the beginning of any namespace level.
This is what I got so far https://regex101.com/r/mFe38B/1

^((?!([0-9]+\w+\\))(?:\w+\\)(?:\w+\\)*\*)$

But it also match to `"Doctrine\123Yield\*" which is wrong
The lookahead matches only at the beginning, but wanna it to ignore the middle words
The desire is to match PHP namespace with wildcard "\*" at the end
 
8:35 AM
I also get this in PHP which is valid on regex101

preg_match(): Compilation failed: missing closing parenthesis at offset 39
On regex101.com with selected PCRE2 flavour it is ok
:/
Ok I see I need to double escape "\\\\" sequences but dunno how to change the lookahead yet
 
8:57 AM
@Danack Laravel is sponsoring though.
 
 
1 hour later…
cmb
10:03 AM
@Girgias I've sent an invite for the doc-team.
 
 
3 hours later…
1:08 PM
Morning
 
Hello.
 
@Derick i) technically Mr Otwell does not Laravel, and it's a trivial amount compared to how much he has benefited from PHP. ii) he doesn't sponsor me, or projects like PHPStan/PHPUnit even though Laravel wraps those tools and hides their name from Laravel's users, which limits how much they can appeal directly to people for sponsorship.
iii) that wasn't about them but : twitter.com/ewbarnard/status/1600155473646260225
 
Most of the issues with BC breaks could be solved if php could offer LTS
it would certainly slow down adoption of new features, but if you get say 6 or 7 years of security fixes.
If it would be in the best interests of the language or not is another matter
 
1:38 PM
@MarkR extended support is something for "Enterprise", and most enterprise distro offer it (btw, I don't like the LTS term, which is related to 1 distro, and is confusing)
 
@Danack "wraps those tools and hides their name from Laravel's users" i hate that they keep doing that, and most recently php-cs-fixer.
 
@SaifEddinGmati do you know of any others excluding those I mentioned?
 
league/oauth2-server? ( https://github.com/laravel/passport)

there's probably more tho
that whole lib is just wrappers so that end users don't see League\ namespace in their code lol
introduction "Laravel Passport is an OAuth2 server" while it should be "Laravel Passport is a bridge for league/oauth2-server".
 
cmb
@RemiCollet That. And there is also Zend, and they still offer PHP 5.6 (!) support.
 
I refer the honourable gentleman to my earlier answer:
Dec 7, 2021 at 14:52, by Danack
I meant the first bit more - that Laravel is a platform, and doesn't want it's users to investigate the rest of the PHP world.
 
1:47 PM
@cmb I also still maintain 5.6 on github.com/remicollet/php-src-security ;)
 
cmb
Oh, totally forgot about that. :)
 
@Danack yea, symfony is not any better as well, however, using rust, i was met with the complete opposite, e.g: github.com/tokio-rs/axum#high-level-features
 
@RemiCollet I disagree, while enterprise certainly wants and needs LTS, I think there's a strong case to be made for a long-term support version for community needs as well. Especially considering how little resources it would take.
 
> for community needs
do you mean free?
 
2:03 PM
Yes, that's how community editions usually work, the community closing in on being funded by close to 1m in donations at this point
 
notice that the work is done and exists (see my link above)
and is public / open / free
 
Zend is paid-for isn't it?
 
(of course, it exists because I'm paid to maintain EOL versions for an Enterprise distro)
 
So given that, what would be the cons to you being paid by say the foundation to provide the same service and then "PHP" offer it as opposed to the distro?
 
really different work
 
cmb
2:11 PM
I don't think that would work out for the community. There are so many packages whose authors seem to be happy to not have to support old PHP version anymore. And if those libraries won't support old PHP version, you need to upgrade anyway.
 
@Danack ah
@MarkR LTS does exits, but is provided by commercial entities.
@cmb I'm sure they'd be happily paid to do so.... for the right amount.
 
@cmb ...I was going to say something similar. If PHP foundation is going to bother to support a LTS version, I think it needs to address more than just itself...and find a way to get funding to all the packages that companies need.
 
I understand Derick, my comment was aimed at saying that the people complaining about BC breaks could to a certain degree be quietened if the "standard" language didn't have BC breaks every 5 years. By standard I mean the officially supported version.
 
@Derick also provided for free: for RPM users of my repo ;)
 
@MarkR Sure, but we don't have the time for that. It's also really shit work.
@RemiCollet Right, and noted. How would people generally feel about that not being "official RedHat"?
 
2:19 PM
@Derick not being "official Red Hat" may be an issue for some RH customers, but is usually not for CentOS or clones users (Alma, Rocky, OEL...) which is >90% of download
 
Actually, I'll say this clearly; I don't think doing the bare minimum that meets companies desires to be able to avoid upgrade costs, but leaves the wider PHP community unfunded is a thing worth doing. The goal should be a stable ecosystem or it's just shifting the immorality around.
 
Talking about the immorality of it doesn't help all that much. At its heart it's a question of does the default 3 year window of support after a breaking change detract from individuals and companies using the language, and people writing code and libraries for it.
 
> Talking about the immorality of it doesn't help all that much. At its heart....
If you don't understand what the counterpart in a negotiation is even talking about, you're less likely to have a successful negotiation.
 
 
1 hour later…
3:38 PM
@LeviMorrison I think I found a crash bug with observer and an overriden execute_ex, in combination with some other weird things
with user stream operations, I am guessing
 
Alright, I look forward to the weird bug report :)
 
A preview:

```
==1068908== Invalid read of size 8
==1068908== at 0x9A53AD: ZEND_CALL_TRAMPOLINE_SPEC_OBSERVER_HANDLER (zend_vm_execute.h:3459)
==1068908== by 0xA110C6: execute_ex (zend_vm_execute.h:55911)
==1068908== by 0x48591DE: skeleton_execute_ex (skeleton.c:48)
==1068908== by 0x94BAEE: zend_call_function (zend_execute_API.c:908)
==1068908== by 0x94AFFA: _call_user_function_impl (zend_execute_API.c:708)
==1068908== by 0x8F1479: php_userstreamop_close (userspace.c:708)
==1068908== by 0x8E3313: _php_stream_free (streams.c:475)
WHy would there be a TRAMPOLINE_SPEC_OBSERVER_HANDLER when observing isn't done?
 
 
1 hour later…
4:52 PM
Why am I only seeing builds for PHP-7.4 on Azure DevOps? dev.azure.com/phpazuredevops/PHP/_build?definitionId=1
 
cmb
5:24 PM
@ramsey Because we migrated to GH actions (and keep Travis, AppVeyor and CircleCI for otherwise unsupported architectures). That migration was necessary, because there have been serious issues with Azure CI a couple of months ago.
 
Gotcha. I must have missed that.
 
5:59 PM
@cm
ugh... stackoverflow chat... by the time I submitted my edit, it was too late, and it was a long message, so I lost it
@cmb @Derick @SergeyPanteleev @RemiCollet I have confused myself on the changes we've made to the release calendar. I just tagged PHP-8.1.14RC1 because that's what I have on my calendar, and that's what I thought we agreed to when we set this week for 8.2.0, but in looking at the thread, it looks we we agreed for next week to be 8.1.14RC1? Still, even if we do 8.1.14RC1 this week or next, that puts 8.1.14 and 8.2.1RC1 both releasing on 5 Jan, which means our RCs and GAs no longer line up.
 
WOO HOO, actually doing some PHP today!
 
cmb
6:28 PM
@ramsey See github.com/php/php-src/issues/8066 for details. (I just replied to the RM list, BTW)
 
 
3 hours later…
9:27 PM
Can a monolog "extra" be treated as just another context field
 
9:51 PM
@Jimbus you can add a formatter to do that
 

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