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12:15 AM
@cmb do you happen to know whether it's possible to get windows to bond/team 2 NICs and make them behave as a switch/hub? I want to be able to MITM wireshark capture some traffic without a routing hop, preferably using just my laptop and a USB ethernet adapter thingy, it's quite hard to google because all the results are talking about NIC teaming for bandwidth/failover reasons rather than as a bridge
or indeed anyone else
it's quite a niche requirement obv, but it's a thing I would often like to be able to and I don't really want to have to carry another device around with me just for that specific purpose that only comes up once a month or so
 
@DaveRandom what're you testing?
 
right this second I'm debugging a misbehaving SIP phone, which is a thing I do a lot, but also I often want to see what e.g. printers are doing on the network or sometimes just to check if some device is soliciting DHCP or sending out sensible DNS requests
it's just a thing I have idly wanted for ages for a lot of reasons
 
I'll ask someone who might know
 
I have my home PC set up with routing enabled and 2 NICs so I have a chunk of the network that I control and can sniff at will, but it adds a routing hop and fundamentally changes what's going on, most of the time that doesn't matter but it would be better not to have that
I suppose I could write a little service app to do it without too much difficulty (acting as a hub you just blindly repeat everything out of every other port than you received it) but I'd rather use built in windows features if they exist
 
12:35 AM
Does this help at all?
> What he wants is a pass through bridge, but he needs to not use DHCP
> DHCP will address both NICs in the bridge
 
brb googling, that is a magic combination of keywords I have not tried
oooohhhh I remember this now, from the before times, in the long long ago
like windows 98 or some shit
I think this is indeed what I want
thanks :-)
holy shit, TIL win+X as well, how did I not know that :-S
 
Makes me think of Windex
Are you avoiding WhatsApp again?
 
maybe you should suggest the CCleaner rename themselves to that, they must be scrabbling for a rebrand rn
oh yeh, sorry :-P
 
Alright
 
because reasons, basically I had a big fat falling out with someone who is kind of a psycho and will be stalking my "online" status on whatsapp
 
12:42 AM
o.O you can't turn that off?
I thought you could
 
not afaik
afaik all you can turn off is receipts
and I don't want to turn that off anyway
 
@DaveRandom just keep whatsapp open on the PC which you never turn off … nwo you're always online, thus the actual state is meaningless
 
it's fine, this happens occasionally, I will receive the warranted apology by like tues/wed, everything is under control
and I know that sounds super shitty but this is someone who would be first to admit that they require serious "management"
 
@DaveRandom three dots -> account -> privacy -> status then change who is allowed to see you online
 
ooh shiny
brb
@bwoebi already do :-P it shows as online when you have the window focused and have interacted with it in some way in the last 30 seconds (yes, I have tested it :-P)
 
12:47 AM
@DaveRandom well :-P
 
@Tiffany isn't that to do with the "status" tab thing that no-one uses?
there's this weird facebook-esque "status" you can post for no reason to people who don't give a shit
 
@DaveRandom I thought that was "About"?
 
i.e. exactly facebook
 
Yeah, mine is a JoJo reference that I forgot to change and don't really care anymore
 
@Tiffany no there's this other thing you've probably never seen cos no-one uses it
look at the top on the main chats page between "chats" and "calls"
 
12:49 AM
@DaveRandom the one for you that says "Wetware as a service"?
^ which is your "About" section, not status
 
lol I forgot about that
I was drunk obv
no there's this other stupid thing
I don't want to open whatsapp to screenshot it :-P
 
Lol
Fine
 
anyway yeh just hang fire til like wed
or email me
no, write me a real letter an post it
wax seal
 
Have it shipped via boat like in the 1800s
 
it's called "shipping" for a reason
ugh I hate this keyboard, # is too close to return key
it's a laptop, I hate them all without exception
at least this one has a num pad
 
12:53 AM
I really don't like those tiny mechanical keyboards without numpads
Sure, they look adorable, but I don't see how they're practical for work
 
I have a super expensive stupid cherry one at home that I love with all my heart, other than that I tend to use the logitech mk330
cheap and reliable wireless mouse/keyboard which is acceptably robust and has a keystroke that I don't hate
 
Logitech g710+, Cherry Browns with O rings. It's <3
 
can't remember what my cherry one is, had it for like 6 years
still as good as the day I got it though
 
I have Cherry Red board in a closet, though the noteworthy thing about that keyboard is I could rely on it during a zombie apocalypse. Durable as fuck.
 
right anyway I need to do some work
ttyl
 
12:57 AM
@DaveRandom should I watch DS9 or Voyager after finishing TNG? Those are the only two available on Netflix.
(or anyone for that matter)
 
DS9, there's a rough chronology there in that TNG kicks off DS9, worf jumps ship to DS9 at some point, and DS9 kicks of voyager
they all reference events in each other, and the "logically correct order" is TNG -> DS9 -> Voyager
they are both a bit more soap-opera-esque than TNG (which is already a bit...) and Voyager in particular is very hit and miss, but the back end if voyager (basically after 7 of 9 arrives) is absolutely mint
 
Alright, thanks
 
DS9 also has this weird very un-scifi mystic element but it actually works pretty well
 
I did start off the first episode of DS9 but haven't finished it. I hope Sisko and Picard make up at some point cause seeing the hostility towards Picard made me sad. Completely understandable, but still sad.
 
also watch Picard, but watch Voyager first
 
1:05 AM
Can't remember, did you say if you liked Discovery?
 
@Tiffany as with almost all shows like that, the universe setup is really awkard and a bit hammy in places, but persevere a bit
@Tiffany yes that is also very good, that pretty much stands alone though
 
Semi-related but I'm almost disappointed with my child self for not getting into TNG. I may have been too young to understand what was happening, but there are episodes that aren't even sci-fi, just drama and are pretty good.
 
it has some (very) loose tie-ins with TOS and provides a lot of back story for the future timelines but it's kind of it's own thing
 
@DaveRandom so like SGU...
 
and most/all franchises, if we're totally honest...
 
1:08 AM
Parks and Rec...
 
I've never got into it, and deliberately seen very little of it because I want to binge it
right I really actually have to work
:-P
bbiab
 
:P enjoy
 
2:02 AM
(reported)
:-P
also sod off I'm trying to do stuff :-P
 
2:18 AM
@DaveRandom I wonder, the test emails I've sent from my php.net email, do they report the same?
 
to where/when?
 
Eh, they're random. Whenever I enable my php.net account on Gmail to email from it, I send a test email to you first because I almost always get the configuration wrong
They just have subject line "test"
 
oh, then they get eaten by a spam filter somewhere
fyi it works better if you send them to some other account that you control :-P
 
Lol. Doesn't matter really, I'll get a bounce back if the configuration is wrong. I know it works when it doesn't bounce back...
 
like hotmail or whatever you kids are calling it these days
 
2:24 AM
Though, now I'm a tiny bit worried if other emails from my php.net email are eaten by spam filters
 
@Tiffany i would argue that is a poor test since i apparently do not receive them, which would seem to be the point of an email
also, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence
check your scientific method, yo :-P
 
@DaveRandom as long as I don't get a bounce back... but you're right, it's not the best test.
 
email yourself on another platform, then you can actually see both ends and look at the headers and shit
 
I've emailed another friend's Gmail and they received it fine
@DaveRandom I think I've tried this and IIRC, Gmail filtered it... though I guess I can email one of my other email accounts...
 
yes it needs to be outside gmail, that's a black box of magic
 
2:28 AM
I sent a thank you email from my php.net account to a potential employer, mostly to show off because the fact I'm a doc contributions seemed impressive in the interview, but now I'm worried it was eaten by a spam filter :(
 
3 mins ago, by DaveRandom
check your scientific method, yo :-P
srsly working
 
@DaveRandom I have my doubts
 
No I really actually am trying to :-P
 
Okay, okay, I'll leave you alone
Sorry btw
@Crell gist.github.com/Crell/… is nothing assigned because $a was already initialized in line 20 (the assumption being the code would have been executed in order)
and that almost seems .. opposite to what PHP would do, unless something like readonly or writeonce properties exist, unless there's something I'm misunderstanding regarding the concept
@Crell gist.github.com/Crell/… I don't really follow what this does, or why it would be used
@Crell gist.github.com/Crell/… does this mean that because ::Kilometers wasn't previously defined, it's uninitialized and would return garbage?
 
3:15 AM
Add a function to get the length of hash algorithm ・ hash related ・ #80036
 
How is the job search going?
 
3:32 AM
hello all
i have a regex using in PCRE PHP, it to wrap text, but when i try to using in javascript, it got some problem

Here is the regex:

(?:(?:(?>(.{1,10})(?:(?<=[^\S\r\n])[^\S\r\n]?|(?<=[,.;:!\/?])|(?=\r?\n|[-#%&*@_])|[^\S\r\n]))|(.{1,10}))(?:\r?\n)?|(?:\r?\n))


It seem that the

?>


are not support in javascript, any idea to replace this for?
I changed ?> to ?:, the result seem work, is ?: same as ?>
 
3:51 AM
@SalOrozco I have contract work at the moment. I also have a second interview at a different place tomorrow. The place I'm interviewing at only does two interviews, a tech challenge, then makes hiring decision based on that. I'm hopeful for this job because it would give me good experience.
 
I'm happy for you. Hope you get the job.
 
 
3 hours later…
6:57 AM
@heyman yeah you can always replace atomic groups, they are only there for performance
 
Wes
7:13 AM
reddit.com/r/Scotland/comments/ig9jia/… i love internet mysteries like this one. WHY? is that a joke? pushed a bit too far? he's genuinely trying? without ever realizing how bad he is? omg if i love this stuff
 
 
2 hours later…
8:43 AM
Typed property must not be accessed before initialization when __get() declared ・ *General Issues ・ #80037
 
8:56 AM
PECL imagick 3.4.4 deprecated Imagick::getimagematte ・ imagick ・ #80038
Illegal string offset and Cannot create references to/from string offsets ・ *General Issues ・ #80039
 
9:24 AM
Oops: error: cannot fork() for hooks/post-receive: Cannot allocate memory
 
@NikiC Do you have time to review this so we can merge it in time for beta 3? github.com/php/php-src/pull/5994
 
@salathe You don't happen to have ssh for php-git2?
 
@NikiC nope
 
I do but can't connect right now ... I'm not sure if that's because that's broken as well, or because I don't have the right ssh key on this machine
 
9:41 AM
Okay, set up the right ssh key and works now
But it looks like the problem already resolved itself or someone else fixed it
 
@Sjon Thank you @Sjon
 
10:24 AM
I think there are transient networking issues somewhere
 
10:38 AM
@Derick maybe related to blog.cloudflare.com/… ?
 
10:48 AM
function foo( ...$values) {
    var_dump($values);
}

foo(1, 2, 3);
foo(values: [1, 2, 3]);
@NikiC my instinct is that the output of those two would be the same, but they aren't. Presumably intentional, and I just don't grok it? Or that varargs are terrible...
 
@Danack Your instinct is wrong :P
 
If someone wanted to call a function that takes a vararg, is there a way to do it with named params so that it's equivalent to calling with positional?
 
@Danack No
You cannot target the variadic parameter via named args
 
cool. I'm fine with that (as varargs are weird) but that is likely to catch people out and cause whining.
 
Everything causes whining :)
fwiw I did check that this is the standard interpretation of varargs + named params in other languages as well
Well, modulo the fact that we don't make a distinction between positional and named varargs in PHP. That part is potentially un-great.
Wouldn't change anything about the fundamental behavior here though
 
11:06 AM
@NikiC you've obviously thought about it, and I don't really understand the problem/explanation, but would it be possible and better to error there, rather than doing a quite surprising thing?
 
cmb
11:30 AM
@Derick, apparently the timelib update broke a test. Could you please have a look?
 
I had already spotted it, and just pushed a fix
 
11:52 AM
morns
 
12:09 PM
howdy howdy howdy
I'm trying to better understand some (probably) common, likely PHP based hacks
is this the place for that?
 
questions on how to make stuff are fine. Questions on how to hack websites are less fine. But also, "Don't ask to ask, just ask."
 
well, I unfortunately do volunteer website work at a local charity
and it gets hacked aaaaaaaaaaall the time, because of course it does
so I'm trying to figure out how this latest hack works
my php.ini disallows all the common stuff, including file upload
my htaccess has permissions set to 505
 
@NikiC Did the flood of issues you fixed recently (like the one for the default value reflection) come out from the fuzzer you added?
 
@GorchestopherH How to secure websites are allowed...maybe say what you're running e.g. wordpress?
 
joomla, but, in this case, I'm not sure it even matters it's Joomla
 
12:23 PM
php version?
 
5
let me check specifics...
 
any reason you can't upgrade to 7? 7.2 at least... 7.3 or 7.4 preferably
 
ah, because it's an old GoDaddy shared server that offers 4 or 5
 
oh dear.
that's your first task then → UPGRADE
 
can you purchase a new server, and then migrate? :D
(something I'm currently working on atm)
I'm working with a "shiny" new Godaddy server with CentOS 7.8 (I still have a poor opinion of godaddy)
 
12:25 PM
I mean, that's the long goal (probably a month or more), the short goal is try to stop daily edits to my .htaccess file with whatever ninjery I can muster
I figured that permissions of 505, disabling chmod, etc. etc. would do that
but I guess not haha
 
the sites I'm currently bandaiding are running wordpress... but I imagine some of the methods would be similar. are you familiar with linux at all?
 
Somebody has access to your server I think. Burn it all and migrate to something new.
 
@GorchestopherH not if they have a backdoor to your server
^ what Derick said
you can apply bandaids but it won't fix the issue
 
Never try to fix compromised servers.
You never know whether there is a root kit hiding things.
 
I mean, it's always going to be a shared server
 
12:27 PM
@Derick in my situation, I have to bandaid the live server otherwise sites go down and customers complain... but the things I've done are just quick fixes
@GorchestopherH how's your familiarity with Linux?
and if that server does anything with online payment, for the love of somethingIdunno, take that shit down
 
ha, pretty poor, other than the bare minimums
oh, no the site doesn't even have users, no payment, no nothing
 
good
 
no login, no user submitted anything
 
@GorchestopherH

What version of Joomla? I remember old days that v1 and maybe even v2 had serious security issues.Since it is all rolling on the top of old installations (regarding PHP version) it could be possible some bad version of Joomla is there. Google for "Joomla security issues".
 
I guess my primary question is... if files are getting changed that have access set to 505, is it basically a case of backdoor access and there's really no PHP locking that can help?
oh, I'm aware of Joomla security issues, which is why I've manually locked down everything, especially all user interaction
frankly though, even if I delete Joomla entirely
I still have an .htaccess file that's getting hacked somehow
 
12:32 PM
@GorchestopherH in my situation, there are files added to the server by an outside source that do things I haven't figured out because attackers have the privilege of not needing clean code, and actually bad code benefits them -_-
 
in the past my biggest headaches were people messing with Joomla files, making them do things they aren't supposed to
 
Looks like the git.php.net troubles are being caused by someone accessing php-distributions archives en-masse
 
now, my problem is that new files get added, and htaccess is modified to redirect to them
 
if you're most familiar with cpanel, look for files that look out of place, sometimes they hide in plain sight, with names like error.php or class.php... but view the the contents of the file and if it looks like a bunch of gibberish, strong chance it's bad... but keep in mind this is a bandaid solution and will not solve your primary issue
 
@GorchestopherH read Apache and PHP log files. There should be hunch where start from.
 
12:34 PM
if you have access to linux terminal to the server, you can write a small shell script that finds these files and deletes them automatically
 
@NikiC that's interesting. Does that cause bandwidth issues? Or are those archives exported dynamically?
 
@Tpojka I think godaddy offers a scanning tool as well... but I don't know if that's just my situation... the other dev interacts with godaddy, not me
 
@Tiffany I do this with filezilla often, base64 junk injected places, new files, etc. But for example, if I try to hack myself, what PHP file could I possibly run to edit my htaccess? With chmod disabled, and htaccess' permissions set to 505?
 
@Tiffany Meaning in this case? I am not using GoDaddy, but there should be some log menu in dashboard or file in Filemanager to check.
 
@GorchestopherH I don't know off-hand. Maybe they're overwriting your htaccess file or appending to it with a PHP script?
 
12:37 PM
@GorchestopherH Check all log files Apache log and PHP logs. You have to examine those and of course to know what you are looking/searching for.
 
@Sjon dynamically. Causes cpu and memory usage issues
 
@Tpojka it scanned for "bad" files and quarantined the files. I don't know what criteria is used to detect if a file is bad.
 
@Tpojka Unfortunately it looks like GoDaddy either discontinued those logs, or the support team doesn't know about them anymore. Also, I've scanned these logs before, and I've had the date a bad file was added, and in the logs there's nothing malicious, just normal page requests
 
@GorchestopherH should be in like /var/logs or something, whatever the folder above your public_html folder is
 
Problems are stacking. Now google for "Joomla <your_version_number> security issues".
 
12:39 PM
I've now disabled the snapshot feature in gitweb
 
@GorchestopherH also something to set up for your new server: back ups
 
@MateKocsis yeah
 
@NikiC depending on the architecture you could put an nginx caching webserver in front of github, is pretty easy using fastcgi_cache
 
@Tiffany I do have backups
@Tiffany My access logs used to be located in a folder called "Access Logs" but as of August 19th, that's been disabled by GoDaddy
not sure why, their tech support pretends that it never existed... and that I need a subpoena to request them
 
@Sjon I'll see if someone complains first :)
 
12:44 PM
@GorchestopherH I would suggest restoring a backup from before the exploit began, but that's futile at this point because it'll just happen again regardless, since the attacker is already aware that your server is vulnerable to the exploit. Your effort is better focused on bringing up a new server that has latest versions of stuff, while doing the bare minimum to keep the current site running.
as for what exploit is used, like @Tpojka said, it would be something you'd have to research, but I wouldn't consider that a priority until after you have a new server live
 
morning all
 
@IluTov =D
@Tiffany Thank you!
 
is there a ready to use httplug plugin handling OAuth2 access token retrieval and refreshing ?
I cannot find something suitable on packagist
 
@Tiffany I did restore a backup, I guess my question is answered, it's unlikely that any of this is happening over PHP
 
@Tiffany One can't know what is priority here: whether it's upgrading PHP, whether moving from GoDaddy to sane hosting, whether to check if it's used Joomla with well known security issues. I would in doubt where to start because this all looks like one big problem (or several ones).
 
12:50 PM
@Tpojka current server is on PHP 5 because it's an old server, it's likely an attacker found a vulnerability and is exploiting the hell out of it. Because of the age of the server, the likelihood of upgrading PHP probably is not possible. Migrating to a new server will alleviate the PHP version issue.
@Tpojka and while I agree about migrating Godaddy to sane hosting, that choice isn't always left up to the developer. The agency I'm currently contracted with, the owner likes godaddy because the support has helped him through tight spots when no one else was available.
 
I didn't say anything that is opposite.
I am just layering problems down for @GorchestopherH
 
fair enough, sorry
 
He should decide how to approach to solution and what is best for them.
Because any strictly advice now is possibly opening tons of new rabbit holes and possibly problems of new.
1. Logs; 2. Security issues of current software and applications; 3. New server/hosting
 
Thanks for your help, both of you. I do realize that old GoDaddy hosts, old versions of PHP, trying to fix a site that's been hacked, and Joomla in general is a disaster. I do have a plan to migrate to a new provider, new platform, etc.
 
cmb
@Derick thanks! Have you already spotted that you broke the master builds? :) Problem is that php_date_parse_tzfile_wrapper isn't a timelib_tz_get_wrapper (first param const vs. non-const)
 
12:55 PM
@cmb I've fixed that already
 
cmb
ta!
 
@GorchestopherH Test that identical backup in localhost
 
@Tpojka I did, it works... Live site works too. Just trying to learn about the attack.
 
@GorchestopherH Test it thoroughly, QA-it frontend and admin too. Maybe in some point malicious code activates. You could try it with QA (clicking all links [at least mostly used] and testing daily used functionalities).
 
@Tpojka Ah, cool idea...
 
1:00 PM
@GorchestopherH possibly look into pen testing or ethical hacking if you're curious (sorry for double ping)
 
Make one more backup of exact state as now/today and try that in localhost.
To avoid some unexpected issues, I'd use Docker or Vagrant.
 
@Tpojka I don't believe the site has anything malicious in it currently, besides the various htaccess, php.ini, and configuration.php changes I've made, the rest of the site is identical per win-merge with a clean backup
 
You can't screw up with htaccess and ini files' rules in localhost. In localhost you can just check this above - if there is some malicious code that activates in work. But I agree that you should set as much as similar/identical environment to one online.
 
@NikiC That's awesome! It's a pity though that we have those many issues.
 
@MateKocsis Just scratching the tip of the iceberg here :)
 
1:16 PM
@Tiffany OK, sounds like the eventual RFC is going to have to spend a lot of time on exposition. :-)
 
@Tpojka Any reasons to use Docker/Vagrant over say XAMPP?
 
@GorchestopherH people can check out a project and start running it with a single command, rather than having to fart around getting xampp setup.
 
@Danack Hmm, sounds pretty interesting, which of the two is preferred?
 
Null coalescing operator ignores notices and warnings ・ Compile Warning ・ #80040
 
@GorchestopherH I have a strong preference for docker, and it probably is a good choice for you. There can be reasons to use vagrant still, but docker is way easier for collaboration imo.
 
1:22 PM
@Crell hopefully I gave valuable feedback
 
"exact" was just a typo. Each of the example lines is intended to be mostly independent, but to the second point, $a is not assigned by that line. (It may have had something done to it elsewhere, but not relevant.)
For the rest, are you familiar with enum? (It sounds like not, in which case, no, I wouldn't expect the rest to make any sense.)
 
@Crell I have to keep reminding myself to think of enums like defining a week as a construct, and the days of the week are part of that construct
 
A common example, yes. Or the classic enum, boolean.
 
@Crell with my limited understanding, regarding gist.github.com/Crell/…, my assumption would be that $a would be assigned 5, but obviously I am misunderstanding something.
but I don't know what I am misunderstanding :)
 
It would be assigned to 5 iff the pattern matches. Since the array [1, 2, 3, 4, 5] does not match [4, anything], because it does not begin with 4, it doesn't match.
More precisely, key 0 is 4, which doesn't match 1 (key 0 in $arr)
 
1:28 PM
okay, that makes sense
so the pattern matching is intrinsically key-based?
 
That's the proposal, anyway.
Although @IluTov is now not sure if we want to go that route at all, so who knows. :-)
 
@IluTov Sorry for the delay. I looked into this now and I think I found a simpler solution: github.com/php/php-src/pull/6056
At least, this passes the tests you added
 
should I ignore a debug-build throwing Zend/zend_types.h:1162: zend_gc_delref: Assertion 'p->refcount > 0' failed ?
 
@GorchestopherH Separated environment so if something is pretty bad for system/server - more chance to avoid infection of host system.
 
@Sjon no
That's definitely a bug
 
1:40 PM
@NikiC okay, well it happens in a huge unittest so I could try ;) I'll go hunting and report back
Total 906 memory leaks detected :/
 
yay
 
2:12 PM
@cmb Odd. Compiled here.
 
@Crell Honestly I'm completely clueless atm. Both approaches kind of have major drawbacks...
 
Incident on 2020-08-31 14:13 UTC ・ Issues, PRs, Dashboard, Projects has Partial Outage
 
What's the drawback of the pattern match approach? The basic model seems decent, even if we ca quibble about parts of the syntax.
 
@Crell Complexity, inconsistency.
 
cmb
@Derick was a -Werror thingy; Nikita fixed it already
 
2:15 PM
And again, I would consider the improvements marginal. If we can access ADT values in some other way I think I'd prefer that.
Some pattern matching would be nice, like is string in match. But I'm not sure we really need full-blown pattern matching.
 
Well, for variable attached values we can constructor promote those to properties, and possibly make them read only. For static attached values, though, there's nothing we can build on. Plus then we need to figure out what match() does for attached values since === would always be false.
 
@Crell The point is, if Option\Some was it's own type you could type check and then access the named property manually.
$result = match ($option) {
    is Option\Some => $option->value,
    is Option\None => 'Nothing',
};
 
Then we need the "is". And I don't have a problem with Optional::Some being instanceof/is/whatever-able.
That wouldn't allow branching to different arms based on what is IN the ADT, though. Well, I guess with an &&, but now we're getting kinda verbose.
 
@Crell is would be nicer but we don't necessarily need it, instanceof would also do.
 
Wouldn't that be a parse error right now?
 
2:23 PM
@Crell Don't understand that one.
@Crell Sure. As mentioned above, I'm not against some pattern matching features. But I'm not sure we should add full pattern matching just to make ADTs work.
 
@Crell Oh yeah sorry. Yes, you'd need to use a match without (true) and &&, but honestly from the comparison from match v1 rfc it's not so bad.
Or much worse.
@Crell Yeah of course, I mean that as a new feature :P
 
From a DX perspective, having to repeat "$f instance of" on each line eliminates many of the benefits of match().
Esp the compact/non-repetitive factor.
 
@cmb can we make that default with --maintainer ?
 
@Crell I guess. What we could do is allow guards per arm.
 
2:26 PM
o/
 
Still not perfect, but slightly better.
 
I guess I'm struggling to figure out what junior pattern matching would look like that wouldn't lead us right back to "if we're going that far, just go all out."
 
cmb
@Derick guess that would clash with -Wall
 
-Werror and -Wall are easily combined
 
echo match ($p) {
    is Point if $p->x === 10 => $p->y,
    // vs
    *Point(10, $y) => $p->y
};
 
cmb
2:28 PM
not absolutely sure, but I think combination won't compile
 
@Crell ^ Example of a guard. I admit the latter is better but the question is is it worth the huge complexity of pattern matching.
 
@cmb that's another issue ;-)
 
Logical complexity or implementation complexity? (I cannot speak to the latter.)
 
@Crell Implementation complexity.
 
OK. If you say that's too hard, I'll take your word for it. I just think the DX complexity is a solvable problem. (And the kind I find fun.)
 
2:33 PM
@Crell My experience form the last 3 RFCs: Even if it looks easy it's hard. If it looks hard... Well I haven't gotten to one of those yet xD
 
Ha
"If it looks hard, buy @NikiC a case of beer and pray."
 
2:49 PM
@MarkR One of my favorite tracks by Two Steps From Hell is the first song on this compilation. youtube.com/watch?v=qiSlPOp5wAI
 
@Crell Well, maybe I'll just have to do some more prototyping. If we introduce pattern matching for ADTs I'd definitely be in favor of restricting it to the most basic things (ADT pattern, variable binding) and do the rest in a separate RFC.
Or do it the other way around I guess.
 
I figured we'd do pattern matching first, with a big "this is designed for enums, in this other RFC that is already written" warning on it.
But I'd be open to both; patterns only really interest me for ADT purposes, but others may disagree.
 
@Crell If pattern matching is only really useful for enums, do we really want that? We might want to keep pattern matching to a bare minimum. So allow deconstructing more than anything else.
And if we ever want to extend it, we can.
 
So do %Optional::Some($x) (both in match and not) and nothing else, and if someone wants arrays they can make their own RFC?
 
@Crell Something like that yeah.
 
2:57 PM
If the list is OK with that, I'm OK with that.
 
All issues have been resolved!
 
@Jeeves lies
 
3:19 PM
Incident on 2020-08-31 15:19 UTC
 
Is there something (interesting) new for DCE (https://github.com/php/php-src/commits/master/ext/opcache/Optimizer/dce.c) for PHP 8.0? I want to add a slide on my PHP 8.0 take is so :)

cc @IluTov
talk*
 
Incident on 2020-08-31 15:19 UTC ・ API Requests has Partial Outage
Incident on 2020-08-31 15:19 UTC ・ API Requests has Partial Outage ・ GitHub Pages has Partial Outage
Incident on 2020-08-31 15:19 UTC ・ API Requests has Partial Outage ・ Notifications has Partial Outage ・ GitHub Pages has Partial Outage
 
3:37 PM
@Tiffany You were right.
 
3:53 PM
@PeeHaa Gist you were helping me with a while back. Action.php errors: Undefined variable $class and Unhandled Reflection Exception...? gist.github.com/statikstasis/68e64b752d1ab7869cf1e03ca2be93eb
 
Are those questions? :)
$class -> $this
Fixed it for you :P
 
@Danack Did you ever message me about getting off Datadog? If so I've missed it.
 
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