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12:04 AM
Can someone proof read this email I'm planning on sending on internals? gist.github.com/Girgias/29ca86e4af859e5ebf743f826f2a3d4a
 
Bad link for [3] because of the [4]
Makes sense to me. With scalar objects I imagine we'll get splice()
 
That's just the gist markdown formatting acutally
I have newlines after every link but they all got put onto a line
Now I just need to figure out where my memory leak comes from ...
And I'm confused as to why the CI tests still have the old behaviour whereas on my machine it works as intendeded
 
I think you're perhaps overly complicating it by allowing more than 1 byte replacement
IMO that's less intuative
 
Is it? I find it pretty intuitive personally, but I'm not freeing something currently
 
If I replace a brick in a wall, and try to shove a breeze block in its place, something is gonna break. Replacing it like-for-like makes perfect sense, putting something bigger in doesn't
 
12:20 AM
Yeah but we are not talking about a wall here, I do get your point
By here the usage I'm seeing more is if you change something into another char but that is just encoded as multiple bytes in your encoding
 
I think that's more suited for function-land personally. Or exploding to a char array and using replacement on that
 
Fair enough, but anyway something should error out if you pass multiple bytes then
Instead of just silently truncating
 
Yup.
 
@Girgias if you want a break line, add two spaces at the end of the line, then carriage return
Markdown is weird
 
@Tiffany huh, well it's getting send as an email anyway :')
 
12:28 AM
Fair enough, won't matter for that
At some point, I would like to get back into messing with PHP dev, but need to clear some other projects out of the way. I need to get Stripe integration into my dad's site, which has taken me nearly two years :X
Blah. Maybe I'll have a look at that this coming week...
 
12:51 AM
No wonder the php.net redirect system is a clusterfuck >.< git shows it made in 2002
I'm calling it quits for the weekend. Goodnight all o7
 
1:21 AM
Night :)
 
 
4 hours later…
 
2 hours later…
7:40 AM
posted on December 13, 2019

You want two late comics in a row? Okay, if you insist. Nothing but the finest for my readers. I’m glad you requested a late comic. I had a few technical difficulties this week. While the delays were significantly less serious than last week, I learned a valuable lesson: humidity and electronics do not mix. After powering up the computer on Wednesday, I was treated to a display of sparks..

 
@JoeWatkins what sparked your tweet? For some OSS i write these things into README, or github issue templates.
 
maybe three quarters of the issues that are opened are not really bug reports but requests for help ... if I answered all of them I would have no time at all to work on open code, so I must answer none of them ...
I tried an issue template before, it's mostly ignored, as I expect the tweet will be ...
afk school run
 
8:39 AM
@cmb Can you take a quick look at bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=78957 to see if there's anything actionable there?
I assume something changed due to sqlite unbundling?
 
8:52 AM
anyone have insights on why streamwrapper doesn't have a copy handler?
a steam weapper would in fact be an amazing thing but I think the time for that has long passed.
 
Morning
 
o/
 
\o
 
@salathe! can you give me any feedback on gist.github.com/tiffany-taylor/2656a8011794e367530c33c0a689e0d0?
I would like to add it to PHP docs, but I wanted feedback (if there is any to give), before I submit it
@JoeWatkins just start responding with your hourly rate and copy/paste a message stating why you can't help with these sort of issues (you don't have the time), or delegate someone else to do it, depending on how much time you've available
It may seem flippant to respond with your hourly rate, but you don't want these requests to be opened as issues anyway, so being a bit of a dick will help keep those people away
 
cmb
9:33 AM
@NikiC, thanks for the ping.
 
9:46 AM
Yo!
 
9:59 AM
@JoeWatkins I feel your pain... I get emails asking for support too. I now have a standard reply: xdebug.org/support
 
10:25 AM
yeah, it's just too much ... I want to work on the code I publish, and that includes fixing bugs ... but I'm not going to design your shit for you because you can't figure it out ... not for free anyway ...
it's taken so many years to see the difference ... I see it clearly now ...
 
10:42 AM
A couple questions regarding the php docbook editor. I want to create a new page for covariance/contravariance. 1) I'm thinking it should go under en/language/oop5, or is there a better place it should go? 2) When creating a new page, should I use a template, and if so, which one?
 
@NikiC I had a look at #78793 and it looks good to me, this should fix it for JPEG. From a quick glance I can see that the TIFF counterpart was already built with this in mind, so +1 from me
@Derick I like the new xdebug.org look, gj
 
@Kalle Hm, now that you said, this I'm no longer sure it's right :D
It looks like the other uses of exif_process_IFD_TAG don't adjust the length either
 
@NikiC At least the value has to be calculated before the first call as its recursively called throughout the parsing process, else it just re-uses the original supplied IDFLength
 
So to check if my understanding is right here: Does the IFDlength start from dir_entry or from offset_base?
 
11:01 AM
@NikiC it should be dir_entry yeah because the offset may vary depending on the byte order (Intel / Motorola) and is used as a hint for reading, but the IFDLength should remain to that of dir_entry
but I haven't looked at this code for a while, the flow is well, interesting to say at least of ext/exif
 
@Kalle heh
		offset_val = php_ifd_get32u(dir_entry+8, ImageInfo->motorola_intel);
		/* If its bigger than 4 bytes, the dir entry contains an offset. */
		value_ptr = offset_base+offset_val;
		if (byte_count > IFDlength || offset_val > IFDlength-byte_count || value_ptr < dir_entry || offset_val < (size_t)(dir_entry-offset_base) || dir_entry <= offset_base) {
@Kalle I'm asking because the offset_val > IFDlength-byte_count check here only really makes sense if it's relative to offset_base
 
cmb
@Tiffany, a new file under en/language/oop5 looks appropriate. It seems there is no suitable skeleton, so start fresh, or copy the contents of another file of that directory.
And thanks for working on that!
 
@cmb thanks, I'll get to it.
 
11:25 AM
how long does it normally take the doc editor to create a new file? it's been stuck on "Loading..." for five or so minutes
 
o/ !
Are there users here working with Windows?
 
I did at one time ...
depends on your question
 
I have to do something I've never done haha.
Need to connect to a RedHat OpenShift platform but I need to use proxy credentials.
 
like SSH?
 
Now I wonder how this command would look like in Windows:

HTTP_PROXY=http://USERNAME:PASSWORD@IPADDRESS:8080/ oc login https://<server>.com --token=<token>
I was searcing how to set that HTTP_PROXY thing in Windows.
 
11:32 AM
could you use something like MinGW?
 
My wild guess was:
SET HTTP_PROXY=blablala
SET

But then I don't know from this point how to use it.
( I have not used Windows like in 10 years :p )
 
or are you making a .bat script or something?
 
I have to connect to the OpenShift platform. But I have to pss a proxy in front of it.
 
what I mean is, if you just have to connect and you're already familiar with bash shell, couldn't you use a bash shell app on Windows like MinGW or Cygwin? or do you need to write a script for logging in?
I don't know for sure if the command will work in mingw/cygwin, but so far what I've tried in mingw with regards to linux commands, it has worked
@cmb or @salathe how long does it normally take to create a file in the doc editor? it's been stuck on "Loading..." for around 20 minutes now. Is there a character limit or something on file names?
 
sounds broken
 
cmb
11:44 AM
That might just be a bug. Can you somehow stop it, and try again?
Could also be caused by connection issues to svn.php.net.
 
I wonder if I fudged it. I created a file or two prior and "closed" the files, they didn't appear in the file hierarchy so I was hoping either they deleted automatically, or didn't save
something to do with "Empty file" for template. If I select a template, it loads automatically.
 
12:02 PM
testing Tiffany
 
cmb
@Tiffany, if it doesn't work, it might be best to submit a PR for github.com/php/doc-en
 
is the use of <em> discouraged? I wanted to italicize a word for emphasis, but I'm noticing that italics are used for <literal>
 
12:18 PM
that's not a docbook tag
 
<literal>? when I inspect element on a word that is inside a <literal> tag from the editor, the literal tag is transformed to <em>
to rephrase, I inspect element on a page (e.g. php.net/manual/en/language.oop5.properties.php) and the italicized words are in <em>, but in the doc editor, they're in <literal>
I guess my question is, can I apply emphasis to a word with in the doc editor, and if so, what tag should I use?
 
cmb
Use <emphasis>
 
@JoeWatkins I have "It is selfish to expect the extension author to provide a comparison tailored to your specific need for free when the extension author works on a variety of projects, not just parallel." typed up, should I send it, or just leave it?
 
I wouldn't send it ...
 
Morning
 
I don't care if the person wants to argue with me over it, I can take it, but I don't want to cause extra friction for you
more or less, do you care if I white-knight for you? lol
 
@JoeWatkins you might want to close down that repo
As in "archive"
 
12:56 PM
@NikiC yeah I said I was going to when 7.4 was in RC, but some users argued with me and I backed off ...
 
@Kalle Thanks :-)
 
when a doc editor with commit access has time, can edit.php.net/?patch=en/language/oop5/… be reviewed? please and thanks
 
1:26 PM
@Tiffany I'll try and have a look during my lunch break, failing that I'll look this evening. Keep poking me if I haven't given any feedback. :)
 
@salathe :thumbsup:
trying to figure out what next I should work on... I'm looking at the list of new features from the migration guide, maybe a page for typed properties?
but typed properties seem pretty self-explanatory
 
cmb
1:40 PM
I think typed properties should be documented on php.net/manual/en/language.oop5.properties.php
 
2:00 PM
@NikiC Sorry for the absense earlier, you are right, you need the offset there, if you look in exif_process_IFD_in_TIFF() you can see around line 3932 that it is hardcoded there as the offset
 
2:32 PM
Odd, I'm seeing my post on news-web.php.net/php.webmaster/28454 but not on the NNTP group, but did after I had posted it
Is anyone using NNTP to read that could double check for me please?
 
@NikiC @JoeWatkins I'm digging into opcodes. And there is interesting question about getting values from opcodes. From the one hand, each PHP function has an associated list of op codes at op_array field, but it's impossible to resolve values for IS_CV, IS_TMP_VAR and IS_VAR operand types without an active stack frame for that function. Right? Only IS_CONST operands are allocated with current opline?
 
> but it's impossible to resolve values for IS_CV, IS_TMP_VAR and IS_VAR
what ?
how could it be otherwise ?
 
Say, I have a pointer to function and its opcodes, I want to resolve IS_CV variable during runtime.
EX_VAR() macro requires execute_data for that function frame
 
sorry, I'm not sure I understand what the problem is, I might not be thinking straight ... but in what sense is it runtime if you don't have a reference to the frame ?
 
so, If want to get a value for variable at specific opcode line, i should also use concrete zend_execute_data stack frame...
@JoeWatkins when I call FFI function I have nested stack frame
Thus, to resolve values in previous frame, I need to look at previous frame + logic of resolving values for IS_CV operand type to get an exact pointer in the memory
 
2:47 PM
call or look at zend_get_zval_ptr
 
yes, already done
issue with EX_VAR()
typically it's called in current frame (always)
but I need to call it for previous frame...
 
ZEND_CALL_VAR
 
uggh, hard way...
to resolve all variables in given call context...
 
well the easy way is using the api ...
 
But I can't see better way though
 
2:50 PM
I'd have used the api ... you are relying on too many implementation details already, this one can be avoided, and in general vm details should be avoided, hardly any of it is abi/public/exported ... for a reason ...
 
zend_get_zval_ptr requires a lot of information to resolve, including current stack frame. And I want to dump opcodes even I don't have a current stack frame (like simple reflection or opcode dumper)
but with installed user opcode handler, I want to access current opline operands easily. This should be possible, because I'll receive a current stack frame as a callback arg...
 
if you don't have that information, you cannot resolve it, whether you use the api, or copy it's detail ... sorry I don't really get what the problem is
IS_CV/IS_TMP/IS_VAR only have values with respect to a stack frame, talking of dumping them without a reference to a frame makes no sense
 
Ok, understood. Thanks!
 
@MarkR it is not visible on externals.io either so "something" might be broken
 
externals.io is for the internals mailing list, this was sent to the webmasters one. I'd guess thunderbird is just acting up
 
3:00 PM
ah, yes of course. Sorry for the noise. +1 for your work by the way
 
ty, fingers crossed we can get it to a point of being releasable
 
cmb
3:18 PM
message was delivered thru NNTP here
 
Ta. My client is probably just playing up, might have imported one too many headers
ah there we go, unsubscribed and re-downloaded and it shows again. I didn't want to end up in a situation where it wasn't visible that I had asked for wider input (and given the opportunity to offer it)
 
3:59 PM
o/
I recently started reading Patterns of Enterprise Application Architecture by Martin Fowler. Just finished the chapter 2 and started wondering if I'm going to be able to keep up with the book. I mean, he's talking about these approaches as I should know (at least) a little about them, but I dont. I recently started using MVC/CodeIgniter, and currently building an enterprise-ish application. It's been a little over 3 months now, and I want to learn/do things right.
Should I be reading something else? or something else before this one?
Or just suck it up and fihish it? :)
 
try Clean Code by Robert C. Martin, or Refactoring by Martin Fowler
and I'm going to parrot teresko since he's not here, CodeIgniter isn't MVC
 
Or just hire Ocramus, he'll tell you everything you do is wrong either way :p
 
lol
 
4:15 PM
well ...
 
am I able to make a change to the doc I created without submitting a new patch?
 
there's nothing I can really do about that ... I'm not happy about it, think it's harmful, but whatever I can't stop it happening ...
@cmb
 
I made a mistake in my verbiage in a section, it needs to be fixed
 
I mean I can't see how practically this will pan out, will there be two lots of manual pages for the concurrent extension with two apis ?
and eventually I plan to propose parallel for inclusion ... and also it's flat out wrong that there are no alternatives to pthreads, obviously ...
 
4:20 PM
@Tiffany Will look into these
@Tiffany My point exactly. CodeIgniter tricked me :)
 
@MarkR Proven false by the Night King
 
> may
 
@Tiffany "may never do X" is the same as "will never do X" or "cannot do X"
Negatives are weird.
 
not to me, "may" means it maybe can, or maybe can't... though typically it is implied in one direction
 
4:23 PM
"concurrent" shouldn't be two branches, if they want to do that, but two extensions as they have/will have a different API
 
But if it's two branches of the same module... they can be developed... concurrently
... i'll see my way out
 
@Tiffany Lol. The book I'm reading is at the bottom of the list :D
 
@akinuri yeah, it is a recommended book, but if it's too much for you right now, have a look at the other stuff to ease yourself in
there's also something I wrote up a while back, I think it's still relevant: room-11.github.io/tutorials.html
 
cmb
I don't think it's useful to spend time on an ext which has fundamental issues, which may not be resolvable. @JoeWatkins, you may consider to propose bundling of parallel soonish. :)
 
well it's not ready yet, but I feel the pressure ...
 
4:27 PM
It'd be 8.0 at the earliest, so you've got a couple of years?
 
they don't care that it has issues, they built software with it anyway ...
@MarkR end of next year
 
can you push them to refactor to use parallel?
 
they don't understand it
 
cmb
Well, if they know it has issues, and still use, that's their problem. But publishing on PECL is something else.
 
4:30 PM
What sort of issues does it have (besides "threads are hard")? Because if it's anything that can easily crash the runtime, it shouldn't be in PECL.
 
the reason I stopped developing it is because it's fundamentally incompatible with the JIT, and multiple (vm only) threads that are slower than one thread (on the cpu) make no sense ... I could make it not crash for 7.4, it would take a very long time and have a lifetime of one version, it's continued development makes no sense for anybody ...
I haven't properly maintained it for a few versions, it is not in good shape, it will very easily crash right now ... principally because I left the maintenance to people who don't really know what they are doing ...
 
like this Bastian fella?
 
yes
 
luckily getting a pecl account takes ages unless @cmb or I get involved ;-)
 
excellent ...
 
4:37 PM
Nice account request there... would be a shame if something... happened to it.
3
 
@MarkR :D
 
exactly
 
does typed properties only support primitive types?
 
@Tiffany no, they support all types apart from callable
 
cool
 
4:46 PM
@Tiffany I liked that covariance explanation btw - did you manage to get that into the docs, or is that blocked somewhere?
 
@Derick I added it this morning, waiting on @salathe to review it :P
 
then @salathe needs to get the move on ;-)
 
he said he'll try looking at it during his lunch break, or after work, but said I could keep poking him until he looks at it @salathe
he'll come back to a million notifications
 
Hello guys please am new into freelancing as a php developer. I want to ask apart from freelancing.com, fiverr and upwork, which other top ranking platform can I get a job
 
good question, I'd like to know too :P
on the properties page, it states "They are defined by using one of the keywords public, protected, or private, followed by a normal variable declaration." I want to change it to "They are defined by using of the keywords public, protected, or private, as of PHP 7.4 can optionally be followed by a type, followed by a normal variable declaration." but I'm unsure of the wording.
Should I state "as of PHP 7.4" or just say "can optionally be followed by a type"
 
5:00 PM
the manual tends to reflect the latest version of the language
since PHP X you can do X and since PHP Y you can also do Y and if the moon is in position Z you can do Z ...
 
> As of PHP 5.3.0 heredocs and nowdocs can be used in any static data context, including property declarations.
but it's way down the page
 
not in a changelog ?
meh, I'd avoid it whatever ...
 
yeah, I don't like including it, makes the sentence awkward
 
document how it works now, and put a thing in changelog, if there's a section for that on appropriate page, should probably be the thing to do ...
 
The PHP manual assumes PHP 5.0.0, so thats why we have a lot of "As of PHP X.Y.Z"
 
5:25 PM
every function signature is the latest version though ...
 
Might it not be an idea to branch it and aim everything at the latest ver, like the php-src itself?
 
Create a legacy "pre-PHP7" archive of the current site, then update everything to assume 7.0... :)
 
user7732694
hey guys, does anyone know how to retrieve data on a weekly basis with php/mysql? like say for the past year you want all the data organized by week
 
@MarkR makes upgrading challenging (visibility of behavior differences is harder to see). Also, it provides a driver to upgrade, since the benefits are clear "I need this functionality, but it's only >= X, so I guess I need to upgrade" :)
 
Personally I'd aim to have the independent branches then combine them onto a single page with tabs or something like that.
 
5:52 PM
@MarkR have you worked much with MySQL? Their docs do something like that, but it's pretty fragile and not great
 
cmb
I'd still be happy to remove pre 5.3 or 5.4 related docs for now (see news-web.php.net/php.doc/969387263, 2nd part). It's too early to remove pre 7.0 docs, I think.
 
MySQL is my daily driver, but I was more thinking along the likes of the MSDN where it shows multiple languages you can toggle between for examples etc
Perhaps keep 5.6 and change the template to spam it with "You desperately need to upgrade"?
 
cmb
@MarkR And if the page is translated, I switch to en, because I usually can't understand their de.
 
one day of debugging, single line fix :(
 
I meant the other kind of languages :p C#, VB.NET etc
Youch ^
 
cmb
6:01 PM
@MarkR ah! :)
 
@NikiC Fun! Which one?
I'm in favour of removing pre PHP 7 docs
 
I'm willing to help with removing or modifying pre whichever-version docs, assuming it's not done with a preg match script or something
 
@NikiC Looks like it's three lines!
 
@Derick that's the magic of generated code :P
 
6:12 PM
pfff
 
6:23 PM
Hello, I’m trying to improve the performance of our PHP extension.. one thing we do is inside the execute_ex hook, we find the function name to compare and see if we should do specific action on it.. here, for every function that is called, we are using a emalloc and at the end of it, efree.. instead, we tested changing the variable to a module_globals variable and then using a erealloc - so the free is done now only at the end of the request..
questions 1. Would erealloc be better compared to emalloc+efree. 2. Any recommendations against using a module global variable here
 
7:13 PM
@NikiC Didn't find this one via fuzzer?
 
@LeviMorrison we don't do execution fuzzing
 
That's a fun one to encounter, then.
 
7:45 PM
3 hours and 15 minutes until my first experience with a Sensory Deprivation Tank! I'm excited!
 
8:08 PM
@JAamish What are you using emalloc/efree for?
It sounds like you're storing the function name in there? Which doesn't make much sense
Also, please don't tell me you're also maintaining an APM extension
@Kalle I think I just understood how this is supposed to work
It's a bit crazy
We usually have the layout offset_base ... dir_entry ... offset_base + IFDlength
In which case only the memory from dir_entry up to offset_base + IFDlength is valid
So IFDlength is relative to offset_base, but the memory from offset_base to dir_entry is not necessarily valid
But, if we are dealing with MAKERNOTE, then actually the dir_entry might be separately allocated memory which is not part of offset_base ... offset_base + IFDlength at all
And the code is trying to somehow account for both possibilities and regularly failing at that in new ways ... the latest fix is also not right in that sense (though it's not wrong either)
I don't know yet what the actual right way to deal with this is though ^^ Probably the "base offset" and the "available file region" need to be separated
 
8:46 PM
@Tiffany you've got mail :-)
 
\o/ and you've got a response
 
@NikiC :) We are not maintaining an APM extension.. but sort of.. we also measure some function call's performance, but not all.. it is custom built only for our own use case.. When the execute_ex calls come in, we are building the full function name (class::function) and then using it against a set of functions that we would like to perform some actions or also measure performance as well (if required).. What we do is, we are constructing this name for all functions that come in..
 
@salathe I also made a change to properties php.net/manual/en/language.oop5.properties.php if you can look at it when you have time
 
we are looking now for ways to reduce our own extension's overhead as we think that our extension is causing some performance slowdown..
 
I added info about typed properties and made a little example
 
9:01 PM
@JAamish okay yeah, that's pretty inefficient
did you consider instead doing two ht lookups (first class then function)?
 
hmm, we haven't tried that yet..
 
@JAamish oh god
well, before you do anything more extreme...
Please tell me you're not using snprintf to construct the class::function string
 
@NikiC I think we do :(
may be 2 ht looksup may be a good solution
 
@JAamish In that case, I'd start by replacing that with some manual code (two memcpy's). printf style functions tend to be very slow, probably a good bit slower than the emalloc/efree.
But yes, I think doing two ht lookups would be better
 
thanks a ton for tips @NikiC.. I'll check that.. but how to link the first with the 2nd ht.. ie.. when the 1st matches, how to have the 2nd map to the 1st match
any sample ht looks (similar) within other php extensions or core
 
9:11 PM
@JAamish At the very least, reuse a large buffer and a zend_concact3 type function.
Although I guess depending on how long it needs to live I guess you can't do that.
 
zend_contact3 seems to be a option as well - which I assume will be better than emalloc+snprintf ... but it also does a zend_alloc internally, so I'll be then changing it to the memcpy that @NikiC suggested first..
 
9:42 PM
php-web.markrandall.uk/downloads thoughts as to more white?
 
9:59 PM
@MarkR Why you changing my design?!?!? Just kidding. My thought is that if you are changing anything, the #1 thing is to get rid of the sticky header :)
I also just noticed that there is a dropdown menu. I do not like.
 
It seems it's moved itself to the left rather than be placed under. I probably deleted the element it bounds to!
I'm not particularly thrilled about the hover-over menu either (due to when I make it responsive) but I'm having a hard time coming up with a consistent hierarchy.
 
cmb
10:32 PM
I'm so used to the php.net website, that the white background actually feels a bit strange.
Regarding the contents: I think adding links to installation instructions is a good idea, but I'd rather link to the manual (and overhaul the installation chapter there).
 
The manual is pretty fixed isn't it?
 
cmb
"fixed"? wrt. layout?
 
@MarkR I've optimized the boxes on the right a bit: imgur.com/8ZQtXQN
 
Fixed in that they're all static pages.
 
cmb
Indeed. But would that be a problem?
Ah, I see ...
 
10:36 PM
Take a look at what I'm doing here with regards to dynamic helpers - php-web.markrandall.uk/versions/7.3/install/ubuntu_ppa - The Docker one is going to take a while longer
 
@MarkR Those could be implemented using JS.
 
I'd like to get a copy-pasta compile-from-source one done but it's way above my paygrade.
 
cmb
@MarkR Yes, just saw that (had only looked at the Win setup, which is pretty good, btw). Still, I'd prefer to have links to static docs in the manual, and either link from there to dynamic helpers, or let point some of the links to those pages directly (whereever they'd live).
 
Are the manual's manuals up to date in this respect?
@kelunik I've applied that header style
@cmb re: php.net/manual/en/install.windows.tools.php would you say WebPI is still the recommended version as it's shipping quite outdated versions? (7.2.19, 7.1.29 and 7.3.7)
 
11:05 PM
does anyone else constantly press F5 when they've made a change to see it go live, or is it just me?
 
Ctrl F5 :P
Did you get your manual page up? :-)
 
I need to reword the narrative though, make it more formal
 
I like how OOP is so shiny it's still prefixed with oop5 :p i always read it as 'oops'
Glad you got your doc up :-)
 
I may have to change "nom noms" to "eats" :(
 
11:22 PM
@MarkR I think I need to subscribe to the webmaster list lol
What's the subscriber email I need to send to?
Also @Tiffany thanks for working on the docs :D
 
I could post to it straight away because im subscribed to internals, but so far as I can tell it's just git notifications,
 
Well every list has a different subscribtion
 
Ah, I just used thunderbird to read it and gmail to send to it.
 
@Girgias happy to help
 
:)
 
11:26 PM
I don't have a job, and my brain-vacation soul-searching is over, so I have a lot of free time, might as well be productive with it
 
I know I pissed off one of the Russian translator when I was bulk removing mentions to PHP 4 :')
 
Desperately need some articles for this site. There needs to be a big f-off banner on the front page saying "Read how PHP 7.4 improves performance".
 
@MarkR <marquee> and all?
 
and blink.
 
@MarkR I don't really care about the php 7.4 perf in the very most cases though … the main issue is typically db latency
 
11:31 PM
I agree in real world applications IO is typically the deciding factor, but a few synthetic benchmarks would be a great marketing element to show that PHP continues to improve in that department @bwoebi
I'm quite sure that no-one cares that there's 3 different announcements for 7.4.0RCX on the front page, so IMO we should be using it to talk-up the language, it's ecosystem and the community.

A big "Start using PHP Now" button at the top. Followed be a list of upcoming events / conferences. Details on the latest release of each branch, a developer spotlight to show off who's working on PHP (to encourage others to do so). Articles on performance and how to get the best out of it.

It can be a promotional tool *and* a technical site. IMHO, that's what I'm aiming at anyway.
 
11:57 PM
In other words, try to turn PHP away from the butt of every joke... I can't finish that sentence without laughing...
 
Wishful thinking... but yes :p
 

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