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4:00 AM
@Maxpm You're trying to change from "package manager deals with it" to "I deal with it"?
 
It's a complete waste of time, not to mention error-prone.
Will you remember about security updates?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I'm trying to change from "package manager deals with it" to "I don't need a package manager to deal with it."
 
To every single piece of software installed?
Or any updates, for that matter.
 
@Maxpm Because you have these scripts you mentioned.
 
@CatPlusPlus No.
 
4:00 AM
Scripts are software, you know?
 
Then your approach is seriously flawed.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes The scripts aren't strictly necessary. They're just sugar.
 
So you're dealing with it by hand.
Updating the symlinks and whatnot.
 
It's not particularly difficult.
 
Exactly. That's why a machine can do it just fine.
 
4:02 AM
At least some of Windows software updates itself. You'll just sit there with an outdated system for months.
Or spend most of the day updating symlinks.
Have fun.
 
Thanks.
 
(There's a reason not even Slackware goes without package manager these days.)
 
Because they want to slack!
 
This is an article by one of the GoboLinux creators defending his viewpoint. He's probably more eloquent than I.
 
GoboLinux has a package manager.
Breaking existing standards is beside the point.
(And silly.)
 
4:07 AM
It does have a package manager, but you don't ever have to touch it.
 
And that's an argument for...?
You can compile and install stuff manually in any distro.
 
It basically doesn't have a package manager.
But removing them can be a problem.
 
Not really.
Not that removing packages is very common.
 
No, it isn't common. Granted.
 
@Maxpm I remove stuff I compiled with pacman -R.
 
4:11 AM
Solving one not-problem by introducing a whole new range of problems isn't really a win.
 
hello room
:)
 
I suppose I'm not doing this to solve a problem, but to bend Linux to something that better suits my personal taste. Almost everything in Linux is customizable, from the desktop environment to the kernel itself; yet no one customizes the hierarchy. Maybe that's for a good reason--like you said, there is a whole range of potential problems--but I think it's worth it.
@user1220811 Ahoy.
 
Anyway, what's different between what you're trying to do and Gobo?
 
Breaking standards is rarely worth it.
 
Nothing. Gobo is outdated to the point where I couldn't get it up to date from the LiveCD.
 
4:15 AM
Because then it's you vs world.
Gobo is outdated, because nobody uses it. Hint hint.
 
I'm aware.
 
Also: building and maintaining a Linux distro is time- and effort-consuming.
 
I definitely do plan on using this on my school computer, though. I won't have root privileges.
 
Especially one that intends to break one of the basic standards.
 
@Maxpm Can't you take advantage of chroot or something?
 
4:18 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes No chroot on OS X.
Though that would be lovely.
 
Don't you need to be root to chroot?
 
@CatPlusPlus Do you?
 
@Maxpm what flavor are you running?
Ret Hat?
 
4:19 AM
@CatPlusPlus Oh, you do.
 
> Only a privileged process (Linux: one with the CAP_SYS_CHROOT capability) may call chroot().
 
I'm typing on Linux Mint right now.
 
neat
 
Looks like there's a fakechroot package for Debian. I wonder if it'll work on OS X.
 
That's for building packages.
And no, it won't.
 
4:21 AM
It's too bad sync.in doesn't have a compile thingy.
And that no shared hosting provider would let me compile shit like that.
 
What shit?
 
> Intuitive & inavative design make it so you can do everything quick
Apt.
 
It's '99 all over again.
 
hi people
 
4:25 AM
Dammit, I'm sleepy.
I don't have time for this.
 
@lakshmikant Hiya.
 
hi maxpm...
 
@Maxpm what your talking about might work very well
all you need is a kernel module
 
i am first time in this chat .. can i ask my c++ doubt
 
that does what the resourcemanager does
 
4:27 AM
here
 
Guys
Oh wait, that's not me...
Hi all! :-)
 
Woah, @Johannes hacked @Jerry's account.
Hi.
 
Yeah. I'm still trying to figure out how the kernel and all the special filesystems are going to fit in.
/proc and the like.
 
@Maxpm do you have a site for this?
 
@TaylorBioniks No.
I'm waiting for my hosting with Network Solutions to run out, and then I'm going to stay away from web development. PHP is a mess.
 
4:29 AM
I'll point out the obvious: if you need a kernel module, you won't get this to work on your school's no-superuser OS X machines.
 
@Maxpm what do you call thhis system?
 
PHP isn't web development.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I figured if I used his "greeting", maybe I'd get better at all those arcane details of templates too...
 
And web development isn't PHP.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes I'd use the system on my home computer, too, probably.
 
4:29 AM
@JerryCoffin Haha, nice try.
 
@CatPlusPlus PHP is ulcer development.
2
 
Though, now that I think about it, it's probably better to have it live within a pre-existing operating system.
X11 stuff looks messy.
 
X's middle name is Messy.
 
"We rewrote it 11 times and it still sucks."
 
I'm surprised no one else has made a windowing system.
How hard could it be?
 
4:32 AM
There's Wayland.
 
@Maxpm MIT has some pretty smart guys, and they still managed 10 versions even worse than (current) X. I'm voting for "pretty darned hard".
 
working on one
called DisplayManager
 
How creative ;)
 
Apt.
 
First thing you learn when starting playing with kernels is "you won't do GUI. Really".
 
4:34 AM
@CatPlusPlus I have to end I work from
 
Because getting this right is years of work alone.
 
everything meats at CLIB
 
Why is the kernel so big, anyway? It's just users, programs and filesystems. Is it all just hardware support code?
 
Actually others have. In all honesty, most of them really were better than X, in at least some ways. If you can dig up some information about it, Sun NeWS was honestly pretty cool, but too far ahead of its time -- rendering performance wasn't so good at the time. Then again, OS/X has stolen a lot of the same ideas, though in an environment where it doesn't get as much good from them.
 
4:35 AM
There are so many layers to GUI desktops.
 
NeWS (for Network extensible Window System) was a windowing system developed by Sun Microsystems in the mid 1980s. Originally known as "SunDew", its primary authors were James Gosling and David S. H. Rosenthal. The NeWS interpreter was based on PostScript (as was the later Display PostScript, although the two projects were otherwise unrelated) extending it to allow interaction and multiple "contexts" to support windows. Like PostScript, NeWS could be used as a complete programming language, but unlike PostScript, NeWS could be used to make complete interactive programs with mouse support ...
 
There's that word again.
 
@Maxpm what exactly are you trying to make?
 
Also funny thing to hear from someone who chose monolithic kernel design.
 
4:37 AM
@TaylorBioniks Nothing. Just looking into different distributions.
 
Rewriting sentences on the fly fail.
 
@Maxpm seen any cool ones?
 
How is the Linux kernel monolithic if it has modules?
 
it all runs in kernel space
 
@TaylorBioniks Gentoo is cool. Funtoo is cooler. Mint is nice. Gobo is sweet.
@TaylorBioniks Ah.
 
4:39 AM
@Maxpm Going to check them out
 
Well, it's modular now, more or less, but still has strong monolithic roots. Preferring drivers to be in the tree, having no stable API to speak of.
 
It could definitely use some organizing.
Haiku is like OS X in that it feels a lot like Linux, but it's really rather closed and it has strong, definitive APIs.
I wonder what will eventually replace Linux.
 
guys, when you want to use like a global enum, the same one over the entire program, how would you declare it?
 
Probably nothing.
 
@vorbis5 Put it in a header file and include it where you want to use it.
 
4:41 AM
 
@vorbis5 enum thingy { thingies, go, in, here };?
@Insilico Repost!
 
@RMartinhoFernandes yeah
 
Every post is a repost.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: I'm sorry for not going on chat 24/7. :-)
 
We should ban you for that.
 
4:43 AM
@Maxpm thank you, is defining it at the top of every header a bad idea anyway?
 
Repent, sinner.
 
@vorbis5 Put it in one (and only one) header. Include that header elsewhere as needed.
 
@CatPlusPlus @vorbis5 @Insilico @Maxpm any of you on the networks?
 
Okay, gotta go write the stupid test.
What networks?
 
@TaylorBioniks: What networks?
 
4:44 AM
@JerryCoffin kk :)
 
Though luck.
 
facebook twitter
 
I mean, good luck.
 
I'm on my Wifi network.
 
I'm on lots of networks
 
4:44 AM
@TaylorBioniks I'm on Facebook, but I'd rather not give out my name. SyntaxColoring on Tumblr.
 
I have a Facebook but I do almost nothing on it
 
What's Facebook?
 
(No, I won't add you)
 
4:46 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes: It's a website where you can give your personal information so that companies can use it however they wish.
 
Oh, sounds fun.
 
It's cool, you should try it.
 
Shouldn't you be travelling to some place where you will take a test?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yes, it's lots of fun. Everybody's doing it.
 
On a related note, my friend made me create an account on Badoo, and apparently you can't have a cat as a profile picture there.
 
4:47 AM
Wut.
 
Those serious sites. Beh.
 
What's Badoo? This time I honestly don't know.
 
I should probably actually write about coding on my coding blog.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: A "social discovery site"
Badoo is a social discovery website, founded in 2006. It is managed out of its Soho, London headquarters but owned by a company in Cyprus and ultimately by Russian entrepreneur Andrey Andreev. In September 2011, The Economist wrote an article explaining how Badoo has a shot at becoming "one of Europe’s leading internet firms" and that Badoo seems to have discovered a large new market. The site operates in 180 countries and is most active in Latin America, Spain, Italy and France. Badoo ranks as the 52nd most popular site in France and the 117th globally, according to Alexa Internet. In...
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Badoo is a cute name for a monkey.
 
4:48 AM
Whatever the fuck "social discovery" means
 
@Insilico That certainly helps :S
 
Is "social discovery" what they call "going out and meeting other people" now?
 
> it creates the opportunity to meet new people
 
Social discovery is the synergistic application of crowdsourcing to rethink abstract guerilla media.
2
 
@RMartinhoFernandes: And I need a website to do that? :-P
 
4:49 AM
Supposedly there's sex involved somewhere.
3
 
I don't remember having to log on a web site to discover other people
 
@CatPlusPlus Wait, what?
It's a dating site?
 
@Maxpm I bow to your buzzword mastery.
 
Do you guys capitalize your classes and structs?
 
No.
 
4:50 AM
> According to TopTenReviews Badoo is "like a chat room, dating site and picture rating site disguised as a social network."
 
I think that's the primary goal, yeah.
 
@Maxpm: I do, but that's by habit
 
@GManNickG Never.
 
@Maxpm No.
 
@Maxpm I only use capitals on macros, template parameter names and template aliases.
 
4:50 AM
@JerryCoffin Ever.
 
Hmm.
 
What's the difference between a social network and a chat room/dating/picture rating site?
People do that on Facebook already
 
@Insilico It's okay to friend your mom on a social network.
 
More one night stands? Don't ask me, not my element.
 
@maxpm: I wouldn't put it past some people with respect to that on the Internet
 
4:52 AM
@Insilico I think the general notion is that a social network is mostly about keeping up with people you already know. Badoo is more about meeting people you don't know (yet, anyway).
 
Hmm.
 
@JerryCoffin: I think that's the distinction
 
The room topic is as relevant as ever.
 
@JerryCoffin So, that explains people having 1000+ friends.
 
Although I always meet new people in person
(despite my introversion)
 
4:53 AM
Uuugh. I can't wait for method.ac.
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: This room topic is relevant. [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Yup -- I have at least 1000 really close, personal frie..hahaha! okay, I couldn't even type it without laughing... :-)
 
I think I have ~150 friends.
I kept myself at 128 for a while.
 
I don't think I can name that many people I know.
 
I have 35 female friends and 3 male friends
2
and in real I have 3 female friends & 0 male friends
 
4:58 AM
I have ~200 complex friends
They each have a real and an imaginary component
 
Ho ho.
 
Facebook says I have 80 friends. I have actually met most of those, but nearly all of them are much more my wife's friends than mine -- but since I take most of the pictures, I'm required to have them as friends so they can see the pictures of our kids and such...
 
@JerryCoffin: So your wife doesn't upload the pictures herself?
 
@Insilico I usually used to use that line about the complexity of the costs/benefits of the boss' latest hairbraned scheme (but was more specific about: "The costs are real, the benefits imaginary).
@Insilico No -- her Macintosh "just works" too well to include anything to read flash cards.
 
5:03 AM
lol
 
@JerryCoffin I know I hate that about my macbook not using right now
 
That's one I've never quite figure out. Macs are supposedly great for graphics arts types and such, but don't have a reader for any flash media?
 
@JerryCoffin: There isn't a card reader or anything like that?
 
@Insilico: He is the card reader.
 
Maybe Apple sells those separately?
 
5:06 AM
@RMartinhoFernandes: They probably do at 10x the price.
 
@Insilico And it doesn't work on another machine.
 
@Insilico There may be on some, but definitely not on either of hers (24" iMac, iPad 2).
 
@JerryCoffin: Surely it's not technically impossible to have a Mac card reader?
 
@Insilico I'm sure you could hang one off of a USB port, but that's not allowed since it's more a fashion accessory than a computer. Question is, why isn't it built in? It certainly is on my ancient Frankenstein Computer...
 
@JerryCoffin: I'm clearly not fashionable enough then. I'm too used to computers that provides a possibility to get shit done.
@JerryCoffin: This laptop I'm using now has a built-in card reader and it's at least a few years old now, so that is quite weird
 
5:13 AM
Should a .cpp file (other than main.cpp) contain any "#include <...>" other than header file includes? or should all "#include <...>"s be in my header files?
 
@vorbis5: Your files should include only what's necessary
 
@Insilico I've never been fashionable enough to go for laptops much either. I still go for a big box that I can cram all sorts of weird crap into, and upgrade for years before I move to a new one.
 
@vorbis5: Include what you need and prefer to it be as local as possible (header if it's needed there and don't repeat in the source, or only source if your header doesn't need it).
 
@vorbis5 A header should include enough that nothing else needs to be included for it to do its thing, but nothing beyond that. For example, lots of Microsoft's headers that require you to #include <windows.h> before you can include them are, IMO, badly designed.
 
@JerryCoffin Same here. The last desktop I had before the one I use now was in use for 7 years
(It had many upgrades along the way, but it's still pushing it)
 
5:17 AM
@GManNickG Ok, I was just wondering if for example "Cube.cpp" should only have to include "Cube.h", and in "Cube.h" I would have "#include <string>" and all that.
 
@vorbis5: If cube.h requires the full definition of std::string, then put it in there
 
@vorbis5 If it depends on <string>, then yes, it should include it (IMO, of course -- there are definitely people, some quite reputable, who disagree).
 
@vorbis5: Cube.h should have <string> only if it needs it.
 
Otherwise, put it in the source file
Never use using namespace std; in a header file
 
I just got a new computer
Lenovo
 
5:19 AM
Fully type out std::string, etc.
 
Ubuntu 11.10
 
thanks, but if both my "cube.h" and my "cube.cpp" have std::string written in them, i would have to #include <string> in both files?
 
@vorbis5: No, if cube.cpp includes cube.h
 
Thanks :P
 
@vorbis5 No, not normally. Have cube.h include <string>, and have cube.cpp include cube.h.
 
5:20 AM
kk
 
@JerryCoffin In some shops it's fashionable to forward declare classes instead of including headers, as much as possible, and I think that's because their systems are designed in a way that build times become excessive. Relevant euphemism: "complexity". :-)
 
@CheersandhthAlf: That's pretty much my strategy w.r.t. includes
Only #include what's necessary
 
@CheersandhthAlf Build times are always excessive when using C++ :p
 
Although I might write something like <iosfwd> for more complicated forward declarations
 
^ I think the camouflage didn't work very well
 
5:29 AM
I always prefer to #include a header anywhere it's used, even if it's indirectly included by another header.
 
posted on April 11, 2012 by Scott Meyers

I'm becoming increasingly concerned that C++11's support for move semantics is leading some people to conclude that we no longer have to pay as much attention to the cost of copying objects as we used to.  "Many copies will silently become moves," they exclaim, "and moves are cheap!" Such reasoning is invalid in a number of ways.  First, not all copy requests can be replaced by moves

 
5:45 AM
@Feeds I didn't know GCC uses reference-counting for std::string. Is it copy-on-write?
 
@StackCrooked: Yeah, that was news to me too
 
I thought copy-on-write was abandoned years ago.
 
No, we have to drag it to nearest base for examination
Holy COW!
It was sad, I stumbled on a girl's review of that movie. She thought it was a serious movie, so was disappointed by the Area 51 thing (not believable!). But most sad, she thought that the aliens were within other aliens, she did not understand the concept of a bio-technology suit. This gave me some insight. Maybe they simply don't understand things.
?
 
@CheersandhthAlf: I'm leaning towards a failure of understanding things as the primary reason
 
5:54 AM
Does anyone happen to know if it's possible to manually specify a permalink for a particular WordPress post? My Google-fu is only returning results about changing the permalink format, which is not what I need.
 
can you use goo.gl or tinyurl.com or something?
 
wat.
Ah, nevermind.
It's not possible.
Bleh.
 
they let you assign a readable name to the short URL, if that's what you need?
 
Naw, I wanted to specify the entire URL manually.
Problem is that on SO there are lots of links to a particular post I had prior to my data being lost.
So I'm going to repost it, but the URL is going to be different so I'm going to have to edit all those posts to have the corrected URL.
 
If it's on wordpress.com then I don't think you can do it, but if it's your own site using Wordpress then maybe. The URL must be in database. So you could just try it out with a dummy posting first, and search database for unique part of URL?
If that works should reduce problem to modify own site's database
or i'm stupid you can just set up redirection if it's your own site
 
6:04 AM
Yeah, I thought of doing each of those, but I'm also balancing with my laziness.
 
(My fear being that if WordPress doesn't allow it, it also won't expect it, so it could break some things, perhaps later on when that URL is auto-generated again.)
 
At least my Wordpress blog URLs always contain the posting date. So little chance of being generated again.
^ Example
 
wtf...
0
Q: Java Programming Questions Site

Inder Prakash SharmaI am new member to this.I want to know is there any good site for providing practical questions on JAVA to solve. I don't want theoretical questions.I want programming questions...like using collections solve this and that etc.-2. Hope my friend will help me. Thanks and regards . Inder

closed as off topic by Adil Soomro, Jon Skeet, Hristo, Chuck Norris, Corbin 3 mins ago
 
6:41 AM
xD
 
7:25 AM
morning all
 
7:36 AM
I think Apple might need to consider giving their retina display a new name
Cthulu
¬_¬ well, that's not any sort of Easter Egg is it
 
I accidentally opened source view, and saw there was a key value pair egg:"Cthulu" thought it might have been some sort of 'secret' thing
 
It is.
But the trigger is not that.
 
:O
oh I see
care to share?
 
7:44 AM
oh right, that one :P
<[^>]+>
weeeee
huh... not as mad as I remember it being
<[^>]+>
 
Aren't you at work?
 
that's more like it
yeah I am why?
it is early mind, very few people around
 
I pictured you rotating around in your chair, saying "weeeee".
 
I don't think I have done that at this job yet...
personally, I think racing along on stools is more fun. In science at high school, we had tall stools, which if you sat on side ways, you could race along pull sort of flicking it out from underneath you
 
@thecoshman so mature
 
7:51 AM
@CatPlusPlus I notice it's been a while since you update glskel, is it stable, or have you got bored?
 
No time. :(
I'm swamped with uni work.
 
@sehe I would proclaim that it was during high school and that I am much more groan grown up now, but that's just an all out lie
well, I guess that's a valid reason to not work on it
 
@thecoshman groan
 
Oh, you're a frog?
 
@RMartinhoFernandes That'd be cool. Frogs are amphibious and cold-blooded
 
7:52 AM
I know words, honest
 
...
 
damn it
 
sbi
What's a common size of a double?
 
I'm at a loss too
 
7:53 AM
@sbi 8 bytes, IIRC
 
@sbi 8 bytes
 
sbi
Ok, thought so. Thanks!
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Winner
 
@RMartinhoFernandes 8 what, elephants?
 
sbi
7:54 AM
@thecoshman Oliphants.
 
sehe won that one
 
@sbi Laughing out loud
@thecoshman 8 typos
 
sbi
@sehe ??
 
@sbi Oliphaunts.
 
I am not at work
 
sbi
7:55 AM
@sehe Is that a challenge? Because then you have lost. I bet he can do 8 typos in two words.
 
@thecoshman Are you trying to cryptically tell us you installed a spillchucker in 30 seconds?
 
@sehe are you trying to cryptically tell us you are at work?
 
sbi
@sehe Yeah, I read that. Why are you posting this in reply to me? What's the bolding for?
 
@sbi hay, I'm not that bad :(
 
sbi
7:56 AM
@thecoshman I was praising your abilities!?
 
@sbi (a) Fixed the former long since (b) I like the latter
 
@sbi :'(
 
sbi
@sehe Whatever. That went completely over my head. I give up.
 
I'm at a loss too.
 
7:59 AM
@TonyTheLion g'day
 
what's up?
 
nothing fancy, you?
 

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