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user1646075
14:00
so i expect the suggestion to use a global will cause angry-face just to start.
Ell
Ell
yeah
user1646075
still, when you understand the rules, you can decide when it's ok to break them.
user1646075
also, a single global holding your env is the simplest thing in the world to repackage if it proves necessary. As long as you know how to grep.
user1646075
when i first started programming, all Rah Rah C, some engineers threw some FORTRAN at me and said "do some work on this - FORTRAN is great!" and it scared the crap out of me. No locals whatsoever. Amongst all the other crap...
Rust macros use quasiquotation splices. Kewl.
14:05
Rust macros use quasiquotation splices.
Nope. Doesn't exactly become clear. Do you mean it does variadics where the arguments are quasiquoted - meaning you can have real macros?
I don't know how variadics are relevant.
Ell
Ell
I'm not sure how to read this signature: (JNIEnv *env, jobject obj, jmethodID methodID, ...);
versus this: (JNIEnv *env, jobject obj, jmethodID methodID, const jvalue *args); and this: (JNIEnv *env, jobject obj, jmethodID methodID, va_list args);
call some segment of it?
@R.MartinhoFernandes That's not really an answer, though :S
It uses quasiquotations that can be spliced. :P
:D
value's
@Chantola have you tried anything? Curiosity is a great thing. But you can't have laziness at the same time.
user1646075
14:12
@Chantola wtf? are you hoping there will be new people who'll go through it all again?
user1646075
@Chantola you asked all this about 2 hours ago
@Chantola does your sister also sit on the internet connection? Oh wait. Just on google then?
@Sofffia yes
Bartek says "i don't get it". I say "you never get anything, man."
it was funnier when no-one knew what it meant
user1646075
@Ell these are subtle variations - the first is a true vararg overload, the 2nd lets you pass an array of jvalue's, and the 3rd lets you pass a va_arg object that you've presumably collected in another varargs function.
@Chantola your sister is using the C++ book? cool! we need more girls doing programming.
14:14
Actually I think I was the only one having doubts about what it meant.
@Chantola You're soo unlucky
because dum
Ell
Ell
@aclarke Ahh. I thought va_arg was a C way of doing variadics and I didn't have a clue of the first one
Ell
Ell
I'm using the second one way anyway
14:15
9 messages moved to bin See here for all your wishes
:19074930 that's probably a human rights violation
@sehe wat
wth
those messages were doing zero harm. now there's a big gap in the conversation. awesome work.
user1646075
@Ell look at vfprintf for a sample - the man pages describe a classic case
Ell
Ell
Gosh. I think I need some macro magic to generate a little bit of static reflection
#define magic lightness
5 hours ago, by Lightness Races in Orbit
jesus who gives a fuck seriously
14:16
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Yeah my older sister is 17, she's into game development and she's currently taking the Beginning C++ class where we learn basically everything, (so am I) and also the Data Structures class. She complains about the teacher alot.
Ell
Ell
I've never written a macro before
@sehe btw I was kidding :P
@LightnessRacesinOrbit ¬_¬ ergh, defines
user1646075
@Chantola now this is starting to sound like a troll. a long-game troll.
Ell
Ell
14:17
That's odd. typing macro into the search box of cppreference redirects me to std::ratio. this can't be correct
7
@aclarke what troll?
@Chantola If your teacher is an alot, no wonder you're having trouble.
user1646075
lives under a bridge?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit ??
14:18
@Chantola giggle
@LightnessRacesinOrbit using magical = lightness; there fixed that for you
4
@sehe ??
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Alots have alot trouble these days.
14:18
@aclarke On the contrary! "She complains about the teacher alot." - now this is sounding like there might be potential
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Seemed rather obvious to me and I just quietly starred it.
@R.MartinhoFernandes well, that's because you are at least vaguely intelligent.
user1646075
@sehe Maybe Someone will help then. Someone Should.
Ell
Ell
I don't know how to report a bug or edit the search
@aclarke you forgot to capitalise some of the words in that sentence
user1646075
14:20
@LightnessRacesinOrbit only the important points.
edit the search
lol
macro appears precisely zero times in that article
good job cppreference
@LightnessRacesinOrbit Capital Period Is Required:
@LightnessRacesinOrbit better question is that a typedef or a namespace alias...
14:22
@R.MartinhoFernandes context probably helps though v_v
@R.MartinhoFernandes Keep in mind that StackOverflow finds cplusplus a better reference than cppreference
lol
Which Stack Overflow?
user1646075
@Chantola but seriously, this is not a place to ask about homework or self-tuition. This is a place where serious discussions take place, well beyond the ken of mere mortals like you or I. Try things, see what blows up. Try something else. Rinse, Repeat. Learn. Grow. Enjoy.
@Chantola Definitely not the C++ community on Stack Overflow.
@Chantola weak trolling.
14:23
serious discussions
lol
@R.MartinhoFernandes what about that other C++ community?
@thecoshman ???
user1646075
@thecoshman the one called C# ?
@Chantola See here: stackoverflow.com/tags/c%2b%2b/info. Find me a link to cplusplus.com there.
@aclarke yes... C#...
@R.MartinhoFernandes <edits tag wiki>
14:24
@R.MartinhoFernandes that was a comment to one of my answers the other day.
@R.MartinhoFernandes just quoting it.
user1646075
@thecoshman they love to help. Because everyone knows that # is really a well-integrated pair of +
@aclarke you mean disfigured.
Granted, I'm a self-appointed curator of the tag wiki, but :P
user1646075
(^) (^) soooo cooollddddd.... that kind of pair
say, where can I get a copy of the 14 spec? You know, one I can trust to be update
Check the tag wiki.
the only way to get an accurate version is to buy it
otherwise it's just a draft
14:28
@Mgetz lol, outdated.
@TonyTheLion ¬_¬ stop it. we has @feeds to spam that at us.
@TonyTheLion By now you should be aware that xkcds are automatically reposts.
It was even starred.
calm down
@R.MartinhoFernandes you know feeds is slow
@TonyTheLion I'M GONNA SHIT DOWN YOUR THROAT(ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻
14:29
I know words.
Let the end of the day come quickly
@R.MartinhoFernandes do so, don't see a link to latest copy of 14
The C++14 wiki?
It's there.
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh, it's on the C++14 tag, I was just looking at what a normal person would look at, the c++ tag
also, why not inter links those tag wikis?
14:31
ie, from link to
I'd do it, but you know, lazy I'll do it.
Ell
Ell
meh I'll add static typing later
I've done it... now for review
oh, there's too
@thecoshman maybe you could consider kiss/mute again?
@sehe maybe you should get some context?
Yeah - do you really want me to go find it for you?
6 hours ago, by Lightness Races in Orbit
@thecoshman /kiss
user1804599
14:43
@sehe dat query
@sehe ... yes, he said that to me... oh, you realise I didn't actually kick him... right?
allow me to be skeptical
Perhaps you can ask your teacher for his Stack Overflow name, so you can invite him? — sehe 13 secs ago
haha
14:45
@thecoshman how would I know :)
¬_¬ well done guys.
Does boost::optional<> ad a leading space for the stream insertion operator? I've never noticed this before
Never used optional output.
@sehe the fact he posted a response very shortly afterwards and the fact he (nor anyone else) didn't complain. To be fair, it should be clear, again, where the fuck are our audits. Further, if you not think that I can fathom using the owner tools responsible, then feel free to call me out on it. I've yet to hear any serious questioning of me wielding such almighty italics (seriously, don't take away my italics)
oh oh oh... were you being jovial?
14:49
the smiley face in sehe's message should tell you
@thecoshman Okay, we'll take care of that lack. Are you sure you can be responsible in wielding the almighty italics? Will you ensure against keming them? Do you swear by whatever you hold holy that you will wield them but never weld them?
@JerryCoffin ... well sir, I have had to turn of the 'fonts don't make your eyes bleed' 'features' on my work laptop...
Will you assure us that you will never, ever, edit the CSS to display your name in Comic Sans Italic? Do you....oh fuck it.
user1804599
I would like the world sans Comic Sans.
14:53
o_0 I could just use a custom css thingy... balls to that, too much effort.
Oh, and do you promise that you'll never misspell "off" as "of"?
@JerryCoffin you're asking a bit much
lower your expectations and happiness shall overwhelm you :P
4
Ell
Ell
@TonyTheLion I like this :P
user1804599
It's impossible to lower expectations more than to nothing
Everything's terrible
14:55
@TonyTheLion I'm only asking if he'll do these things, not placing any demands on him.
@TonyTheLion How can he find happiness without beer?
@JerryCoffin :( now that's just means.
@EtiennedeMartel By going to a vineyard?
@EtiennedeMartel Don't expect beer -> happiness
@thecoshman It's actually medians, but whatever.
14:56
@JerryCoffin modes
@TonyTheLion Remember, alcohol is not the answer. Alcohol is the question (and "yes" is the answer).
@EtiennedeMartel long walks off short cliffs.
I have some cider
@JerryCoffin Interesting theory
Ell
Ell
I have a big plastic bottle of "white cider". I have no idea who left it here
it looks bad
14:57
@CatPlusPlus That's one half of a black velvet.
@CatPlusPlus I have a dicer.
@JerryCoffin you've been riced...
after he was sliced?
@EtiennedeMartel what's that? I think I could guess...
@TonyTheLion GTFO
@Ell of course it is.
@thecoshman do not rustle my jimmies
15:00
@TonyTheLion fine, I'll just whip them off
feeling a bit aggressive today?
@thecoshman Cider and some kind of stout.
(Technically it requires champagne, but fuck that)
@TonyTheLion vOv that or frisky...
frisky is cat food
are you feeling like cat food?
@EtiennedeMartel oh ok. I was thinking of snake bite, cider and beer.
@TonyTheLion o_0
15:03
@thecoshman Yeah, that's probably the same thing.
We kinda have different terms for similar things.
well, stout is very different from 'larger'
you mean lager?
... maybe...
shh
why is everybody shhing me
15:04
butthurt
i ain't shhing for shit
@EtiennedeMartel Don't fuck the champagne, drink it. Though I did know this girl who said that champagne in ... the right place created some truly wild sensations as the bubbles popped.
@Sofffia you have to sshhhhh for the shhhh'er, not for shit
fuck you :D
fuck you too :D
15:05
yay :,D
oh god i need to sleep
@JerryCoffin ... front or back
We're all fucked!! Yay!
Ell
Ell
I wonder what the correct way to make your own exception types is in c++
@thecoshman Seem pretty much the same to me. I'm getting way too stout--much larger than I should be.
@JerryCoffin you shut up too
15:06
@Ell class myexception : public std::exception
@thecoshman Front.
@thecoshman Okay. Talk to you all later.
kthxbye
I should try to find out why my shit isn't working
but I don't know where to start
inb4 at the beginning
@Mgetz you'll never find out...
Ell
Ell
maybe I'll just throw a runtime_error for not being able to find a particular item
@TonyTheLion virtual!
Ell
Ell
15:08
or out_of_range is probably more acceptable
@TonyTheLion well erm, you go to the toilet, pants down, and sort of erm... push down with yourself...
@LightnessRacesinOrbit somehow magical::races::in::orbit just doesn't work
@thecoshman lel
¬_¬ stop say 'lel' you boob
15:09
have literally checked my code like a billion times
impressive
@thecoshman kek
thats a lot
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I blame unsigned int underflowing
Xeo
Xeo
Unsigned types don't over- / underflow.
@LightnessRacesinOrbit he's literally a twat
15:11
@Xeo they don't?
@Xeo wat
i thought they did
do they trigger an error?
@AlexM. wrapping around*
Ell
Ell
@TonyTheLion not with unsigned
15:12
@Sofffia no
Ell
Ell
IIRC.
Unsigned by definition cannot overflow or underflow
Xeo
Xeo
Signed types over-/underflow, and cause UB if they do
Xeo
Xeo
unsigned types operate on modulo 2^bitsize
15:12
floating-point underflow is amusing
@LightnessRacesinOrbit isn't wrapping around a reaction to under/overflowing?
@LightnessRacesinOrbit wrapping around is just a side effect of overflow/underflow
@AlexM. wrapping around is a prevention against under/overflowing
@Sofffia not really no
@Sofffia i mean i see where you're coming from
i've been lied all my life
it could probably be argued both ways in a terminology war
15:13
^^
AFAIK, the general concensus is to say that no under/overflow occurs at all because wraparound gets there first
I still don't understand why unsigned types can't under/overflow
what makes them so special
their guarantee to wrap around
you can still go over and below their limit values
15:14
wrap around
Ugh teammates doing stupid things with code
This is why we can't have nice things
@AlexM. the value wrapped around. it did not underflow. the wrap around took effect, preventing any possible underflow condition from arising, because the standard says so
decrementing the minimum value of an unsigned int is defined to result in the maximum value, not to underflow
but wrapping around wouldn't have happened if the underflow condition wasn't met
Ell
Ell
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I didn't know this was the correct terminology
but I like it
15:15
underflow does not mean "write code that would go underneath the acceptable range for some other type"
@AlexM. there is no underflow condition. it's a wrap-around condition
he seems unable to wrap his head around it
underflow/overflow implies losing your value because you fucked up and tried to make it go beyond the range
In computer programming, an integer overflow occurs when an arithmetic operation attempts to create a numeric value that is too large to be represented within the available storage space.
@TonyTheLion ... well played
but you can't go beyond the range of unsigned. it's not possible. you can't even attempt it because the arithmetic operators do not exist to let you try it
Xeo
Xeo
15:16
^
The standard dictates that any operation on an unsigned types operates in the modulo 2^n boundary
@AlexM. Right, which is what you're not doing here, because UINT_MAX+1 results in 0, rather than attempting to create a numeric value that is too large to be represented within the available storage space
(UINT_MIN lol)
@LightnessRacesinOrbit what happens at the lower level in that case though
the contents are obviously interpreted as unsigned
have integer
make it max value
apply increment operation
is it unsigned? wrap around
is it signed? overflow, sucker
@AlexM. the CPU makes it wrap around
be unsigned
The most common result in these cases is for the least significant representable bits of the result to be stored (the result is said to wrap).
15:18
be incremented
^^ that, right?
be wrapping around
@AlexM. yeah that's true
but it's the result of UB if you have signed int. IN PRACTICE you get wraparound often for signeds, but it's not guaranteed by C++
tfw going in circles
circlejerk
in short, unsigned types have circlejerk implemented
I'm full of shit, don't mind me
15:20
whereas unsigneds simply never over/under flow in the first place. the wraparound is defined to happen before this "will they? won't they?" logic can kick in
but unsigneds in this case don't overflow because the C++ standard says so
am I wrong?
@AlexM. it's because IEEE 1234 says so
@TonyTheLion I told you how to poop didn't I?
@AlexM. and by extension your CPU
@thecoshman you did
15:21
C++ just says "i assume you're using IEEE 1234" bitch
@thecoshman yup
@TonyTheLion well I've done my part
to be fair, I suppose a CPU could use some other implementation of unsigneds and then yuor C++ compiler would have to implement a check on EVERY increment/decrement and do the work itself
so how exactly does the CPU treat unsigneds and signeds differently in the case of going over the available space?
then you couldn't even pretend to suggest that there's overflow/underflow occurring ;p
@AlexM. ask the CPU manufacturer
15:22
@sehe right right... still though... do we have a question on meta I can winge n about lack of audit messages for kissing kicking?
@thecoshman I just thought it was funny to say kiss/mute again since you sounded like you could use it :)
@sehe /kick
I dunno, my only low level adventure was in x86 asm and there I just had a location in memory that I was free to interpret however I wanted
@thecoshman I dunno. Where's meta? :|
either as a signed or unsigned integer for example
15:23
@thecoshman /kek
@sehe huh? ... I didn't type 'meat'...
You've lost me
@thecoshman lol
@sehe ... meta... where we winge... and nothing gets sorted....
nothing ever does. (just... wut?)
15:24
@thecoshman I left a comment under the original post but nobody cares
I laughed so hard my jaws hurt
@TonyTheLion suck it bitch
@CatPlusPlus good enough ;(
Chat is using "one step forward, two steps back, fall down, vomit all over yourself" model of development
7
@thecoshman kick-mutes, tbf
@CatPlusPlus must try this new model
seems useful
15:30
seems dirty
by the way allauth is working exceptionally fine
@CatPlusPlus We call that drunk development, it's an offshoot of "Ballmer peak" development
but i guess that if you need anything different from what they have planned, then allauth is not a good option
also the library code needs serious mainteinance and testing
/cc @CatPlusPlus
Told you it's crap
15:34
Pretty sure I can implement async/await on top of those macros too.
This is the category of libraries where a monolithic inflexible crap is not suitable for p much anything
@R.MartinhoFernandes moe
It's also perfectly readable.
Right?
Ell
Ell
a doe a deer, a female deer
yeah something like that
kinda
Are those macros hygienic?
Actually, the only messy part in the macro syntax is $($t);*
Dat 7331 for "shit;"?
@Ell ray drops a golden son
@Sofffia I'm going to penetration test it with the akhbar toolset
Meh - a name I call my SELECT queries.
@sehe is that a pun?
15:48
@sehe what
@Sofffia Die leute leiteten laut ihr liederliches Leiblied leider ein Litanie.
I don't do puns. Ever.
Oh ok. For a moment there I was worried I could actually understand what you are talking about.
Bullet dodged.
It's meaningish. And senseless
But I read that as "I have been a song all my life".
No respect for capitals, I see.
@R.MartinhoFernandes I see no respect for sentence structure.
15:55
Fuck the grammatical system
who wants to check if my paypal donation button works?
You're not allowed to talk about your shitty PayPal button tia
@CatPlusPlus why u so mean?
@R.MartinhoFernandes wHat?
@TonyTheLion certainly sounds better than what I'm used to :(
@R.MartinhoFernandes xD
@Chantola LRIO does
15:59
Why so many polish people here?
@sehe sorry?
@Chantola Because one.
@R.MartinhoFernandes ??
It's a polish convention. We even have polish bears
@Chantola There's only one.

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