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00:00
why does he think its going to be money well spend?
^^ about the article amt Australia posted by Martinho F. ;p
@psj01 Because imperial measurements are better for the construction industry.
@SlippD.Thompson how is that?
Metric certainly has the edge in sciences where base-10 is paramount, but base-6 and base-12 measures are much more advantageous in industries where thirds and quarters need to be quickly made by people who are not mathematicians, and where the scale of numbers is limited.
The same reason why the graphic design industry still uses inches, picas, and points, rather than mms.
interesting.
Oculus has the chance to create the most social platform ever, and change the way we work, play and communicate.
lmao
stupid Facebook. Stop buying things :(
00:05
Boost Bind was really underrated by me before C++11 got them. Today, I don't seem to be able to C++03 without Boost Bind (or the TR1 of course)
Update The C++03 version with boost is Live On Coliru now too. (I've added timestamps to the output as a bonus, there) — sehe 2 mins ago
@Rapptz Yeah right. As if.
google and facebook is going to own the world!
lol
@psj01 He doesn't. It's a satire website.
@SlippD.Thompson I can see your point but this seems a fake argument:
where thirds and quarters need to be quickly made by people who are not mathematicians
@sehe Why's that?
Sure. I hope people who aren't mathematicians can do basic arithmetics. Or they refrain from building my stuff.
00:06
Buildings are designed by engineers and architects.
@R.MartinhoFernandes haha okay that makes sense then!
Aw.
But built by laborers. And things don't always measure up exactly to spec.
Yugioh new rules are going to be applied soon.
@SlippD.Thompson They know how to use measuring tape.
00:08
@SlippD.Thompson Yeah. But those margins aren't factors of 3, 4, 6 or 12.
The rest of the world can build shit just fine with the metric system.
Fine shit
@SlippD.Thompson why is ur website intentionally left blank ? ;p
Are you claiming Australian construction workers are dumber than your average construction worker and somehow imperial measurement units make it easier for them?
There are many industries that use their own units for various reasons. Construction isn't one of them.
@psj01 because he dreads commenters using leetspeak
00:10
And the kicker is: they use their own units within the industry. It doesn't need to leak out.
I feel like I'm beating a dead horse here. For any interested in why both systems still exist, read Wikipedia. For those who want a pissing fight over two relatively systems of accomplishing the same goals, GTH.
You are the dead horse :)
@sehe My point exactly.
But at least you're approx 6ft tall :)
@psj01: Ha. ;-) Because social sites slowly and surely have removed every use for my site, except maybe a place to have links to every social site.
00:12
@SlippD.Thompson I was merely countering your argument.
The article (re. Austrialia) seems flippant though. Could be fake.
labourers won't be put off when their ledger is ~0.2" short. Imagine the agony if they had to do all the mental math to see that it's actually 0.5cm short
@SlippD.Thompson Wake up
30 mins ago, by R. Martinho Fernandes
(That's a joke btw)
@sehe Here, fractional decimals aren't used. It's either an integer (1/3 of a foot is 4in, natch) or kept as a fraction. So you'd never see “0.2"”. You'd see “1/6 in”.
Which is not the same!
@SlippD.Thompson Wait. WTF? Are you a construction worker? No? Quick change careers! You're bad at maths
00:18
Which is good enough when dealing with wood and metal.
Nope, just knowledgeable in why the world is the way it is.
Oh. No clue about that
Anyway. I'm gunna go. This room is neither covering the main topic (C++) nor very objective when discussing technical/societal matters. I could ask what makes base-10 so good at everything, but I digress.
I smell a gigantic bias.
Reminds me of the time when we switched to the Euro. Gosh, who pays in Euros?! It just makes so much more sense to call it dimes, pennys, quid, buck, ballen, knaken, etc. It's what the market salesmen use
@SlippD.Thompson It's good at 1 thing: signifying the n in base-n
@SlippD.Thompson Our main topic is not C++.
@SlippD.Thompson What do you mean by "[not] very objective"? Did I give one biased argument? I would appreciate if you pointed out my bias then, instead of acting condescending.
00:21
c++ our main gripe. Our bonding matter
robot
I dislike template argument deduction
I've been thinking about it and I think it just doesn't really fit.
What's the issue?
well, here's the first issue.
let's say that I'm in a function template.
the expressions that give the argument types now have totally different meanings.
I need to unpick them and try to determine what, if anything, I'm supposed to deduce.
instead of just evaluating it like a normal expression.
and secondly
I've been thinking about some of the things you can do with deduction in C++ and I'm beginning to conclude that it's more like encoding a constraint.
I'm not inherently happy with saying "This function accepts anything that's a vector(T)" and "This function accepts anything that's a range" using two completely different systems.
not to mention all the fun you can have with template arguments that are deduced but used in more than one parameter.
starting to feel like implementing deduction means implementing Prolog.
by "encoding a constraint" I mean I'm getting the feeling like some of them should really be written as functions or constant expressions rather than written in as deduction.
00:36
Do you have pseudo code? I'm pretty sure it will remind people of stuff.
Reminds me of Haskell's type constructors
well
right now I'm looking at
template(f, s) type Pair {
    first := f;
    second := s;
}
template(f, s) func(Pair(f, s) arg) {
    // Can't just evaluate type because f, s unknown.
}
evaluating the type of the argument is poor because it's not really an expression.
it's a kind of DSL-pattern-matching-something.
I mean, if I suggest something like
template(f, s, t) func(Pair(f, s) arg, Pair(s, t) arg2) {}
I'm unpicking the expressions of all of the types and then pattern-matching them against the argument types and the template arguments.
if I had something like
f(Pair arg1, Pair arg2) prolog { return decltype(arg1.second) == decltype(arg2.first); } // ??
{}
it feels more natural, the argument type expressions are just expressions again, the constraints are written in the same language as everything else, and they're more flexible.
the DSL-pattern-matching-thing only really works if you want equality, it's hard to say "The size of the first must match the size of the second" or "The first must be is-a the second".
I mean, I can use concepts to handle constraints in most cases but they become problematic when you want to constrain multiple arguments in relation to each other.
all I'm saying is, between concepts and a better handling of something-like-SFINAE, I'm not sure that template argument deduction is actually terribly useful.
00:55
2 hours ago, by Lightness Races in Orbit
http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/210012/would-it-be-possible-to-lighten-t‌​he-color-of-the-new-top-bar?newsletter=1&nlcode=83%7ca920#comment673673_210012
ah I'm just talking to myself.
I need sleep but can't :(
@LightnessRacesinOrbit I don't even notice it any more.
01:14
@DeadMG This seems way too messy and verbose, though.
I'm not sure that I like the price the terseness is asking me to pay.
What is more correct? "wildlife and its conservation" or "wildlife and their conservation"?
and frankly, I'm not sure how applicable it will really be.
@telkitty.exe "wildlife and its conservation" is correct. The other alternative is sorta 'off' - wildlife has no plural.
perhaps I should simply stick with concepts alone for now and then move on to other constraint forms when and if they turn out to be necessary.
usage experience would be more useful here I feel
also being able to stand up without shaking
01:26
Contract based programming always sounded cool to me. A language feature to generate assertions so as to connect runtime constraints with compile-time constraints would be cool.
meh
when to use assertions and when to use exceptions is a complicated problem.
Exactly why the language should help out.
exactly why the language would get it totally wrong.
blindly generating ten million assertions would not be helpful.
A class definition specifies how it participates in protocols. Functions refer into that to inherit assertions.
The build mode (debug, release) combines with some specifiers to determine what sort of check actually occurs.
At least, that's my intuition. I haven't any experience with an actual contract programming system. :P
which is utterly worthless.
only a human programmer can accurately determine if process termination is necessary
01:30
You're taking a very narrow view there.
If abort isn't what you want, then use something else :P .
checking every condition and choosing what I want for all of them would be, well, coding them myself.
which would make the feature useless.
At the very least, it would allow the programmer to encode the protocol separately from its implementation.
could be done now
At the best, it allows the compiler to automatically specialize the class for subsections of the protocol on the critical path.
@DeadMG Well, any turing complete language can do anything. So yes.
right, so it can produce nice fast code that performs completely the wrong functionality.
let's go back here
what on earth even is a "protocol"?
that's not a normal term.
01:34
@DeadMG Let's just say, invariants applying to members.
E.g. if memberA is 3, then memberB < memberC.size().
right.
since members are implementation details, how could you possibly encode such a thing separately to the implementation?
@DeadMG By coding them in terms of the implementation.
right.
so they're not separate at all, they're totally dependent on the implementation.
After clear() then size() == 0.
For encapsulation, you need to tie the external interface to the internal interface using another protocol: if size() == 0 then beginPtr == endPtr == nullptr.
right, so we're just coding error checking like normal.
01:39
Except there's a protocol based on a contract. Hooray for declarative programming!
Like I said, this is just something I feel would be cool and my intuition says it could be helpful.
Just a suggestion.
@Potatoswatter But what has this actually bought you?
you're still going around coding all the error checking manually like before.
@Rapptz Notice what?
the black bar
I find it sexually arousing
the black bar is cool
the green of the "accepted tick" on the other hand...
01:47
@Rapptz I was joking
disappointed you didn't notice
sigh
oh it wasn't directed at anyone
just a general comment
ok
then i'm not disappointed any more
urgh, sitting around waiting to sleep is tits boring
02:03
Tits are boring?
pretty sure you'd find them boring four hours later
this is why you're in the lounge
at 02.05am
wait...
shit.
night
gee gee
I'm in the lounge at 02:05 am because it's impossible for me to sleep right now
Well, I tried to look for the Futurama clip where Fry is disappointed when he's no longer sharing a body with Amy, but the query "futurama fry amy boobs" failed miserably.
Hkkghghhhrrhhh… Fuck the flu.
02:30
IIRC Fox got super aggressive about copyright claims on YT
so many of the videos were taken down
03:07
No, the query only returns porn because of "boobs".
03:20
bob with the extra 'o' huh?
03:40
well for me, it ain't no choice
I've basically just been sitting here for three hours waiting to sleep.
03:53
If I really wanted to be asleep, usually I laying in my bed waiting for that to happen.
04:29
When the Lounge says "Morning". What time zone are we talking about? Or is it always morning in the Lounge?
the time zone they're in
GMT + ?
Hello guys , any one have idea for my sql nested cursors stackoverflow.com/questions/22640228/…
04:49
@Nican The lounge exists in a chrono-synclastic infundibulum, so it's always at all times.
05:19
any win driver guys here?
05:51
user image
6
06:04
morning
Why the flag?
@Mysticial The pic?
Eh, it's art.
It's OFFENSIVE
06:10
@Mysticial Because the fag.
06:21
I am finalizing the design for the dwelling that I am building at the moment ...
option 1:
option 2:
I designed both of them - they are not perfect, mainly because of the area restriction imposed by the NSW government
one bathroom but two bedrooms?
3 bedrooms ... maximizing the rental return :x
could be used as 2 bedrooms + 1 study
total area is only 60 square metres ...
one bathroom?
why only one?
06:27
maximum total area is 60 square metres
I guess aside from that #1 is better
Rapptz would convert the spare bedroom into a master bathroom :P
I have 3 bathrooms where I live :v
What's the extra doodad in the #2 bathroom?
@Rapptz Reserved to you personally?
06:30
yes
If you open the front door you immediately are inside the living room?
that's how it usually is
In my apartment it is like that.
#2 seems to have an upgraded bathroom appliance and kitchenette, a study desk, and a bigger TV. What's the trade-off? Also the back door opens the wrong way in #1, you need a double door to the outside.
But this is a house right?
06:33
it's like that in houses too
Maybe Belgian houses are different then.
@telkitty.exe #1 has more "living space", considering that there are 3 bedrooms, better "balance" perhaps?
it will be a rental property ... so I am not going to fuss about the more bathrooms and extra large ancillary areas. The truth is that the tenant is going to be more concerned with the rental they pay than the extra large lounge room :'(
must suck to have 1 bathroom and 3 bedrooms
Most single-floored houses here have that layout.
06:35
A 4-table dinette doesn't seem sufficient for a 3-bedroom apt, never mind living space. Get an expanding table and find somewhere to put the spare chairs.
4 rooms on 60qm? way too crammed
Speaking of storage space, where do the people put all the things?
storage space beneath
@Potatoswatter TIL of an expanding table.
extra 3 square metres not drawn on the plan
06:36
@MarkGarcia You pull the ends and the middle pops up. Voila!
@telkitty.exe 3 sqm is no storage. it's a joke
and there's no room to do anything in that kitchen, because if someone actually sits at that table, his back is against the kitchen furniture
I assumed it wasn't drawn to scale.
lol, you can spend $1000 a week on a 3 bedroom, 3 bathroom, 150 square metres penthouse apartment or $480 for a house like mine, choice is yours
I'd rather not live in Australia.
you mean you prefer to not live in Sydney
06:43
Nah. Australia in general
I love it here - plenty of nature scenery and wildlife
and houses here are generally quite large
just mine ... a few restrictions ... well I will just treat it as an experiment and see what happens
@telkitty.exe there's nothing wrong with 60sqm. If there are only 3 or 2.5 rooms
I just moved out of an appartment that size.
there is also a private backyard of about 20 square metres
and a car space
extra storage
maybe it had 70sqm, but it had a small hall - much needed storage space.
use the bedroom as your storage space
06:49
@Rapptz you'll probably have to - or sell much of your stuff ;-)
well think about this way: if 3 single people or a couple with 2 children are going to rent a place, they are more likely to choose 3 small bedroom over 2 larger bedrooms
expecially there will be extra storage underneath
Even if I was going to live by myself in a place like that, I still prefer more rooms so I can assign each for a differnt use
07:03
Wow, Facebook bought Oculus Rift.
I'm probably being late to the party.
But it still surprises me.
I am using neither, so it doesn't concern me ...
I have long learned that the most stable industry are the most primative industries, like farming, housing and energy
human might spend twice as much time working than wild birds and feral animals on a typical working day , but we don't create much more, which is very sad
uhm I just noted the prices you said above - 480$ per week? For 60sqm?
and I thought Hamburg was expensive...
07:21
Well ok, I still think the 4 rooms on 60sqm are too crammed, too little space and uncomfortable - but anything else does not seem affordable...
depends on how many people are living in it - we have rented a large 3 bedroom house to someone. The tenant sublet a part of the house and the house ended up being very crowded and we have not got a single cent return from that
they also rented the front yard to others we suspect because the property is very close to the train station and there are constantly 4 cars on the property
yet again we have received not an extra cent for that
I have not raised the rent for 3 years for the tenants
This is from another tenant
07:40
You mean they turned the yard into a parking lot?
Isn't that against zoning? You need to enforce that before the police do.
07:52
according to them, sometimes their cousins/relatives/friends park there
Apparently they bought a place and are going to move out in a couple of months time, but they are asking us whether we are still interested in renting the place out because their friends are interested in renting the property
@StackedCrooked yeah, a sad day for all.
user1804599
08:09
@StackedCrooked s/Rift/VR/
Here's a good laugh: my old boss was always on about how Internet Explorer 6 was really good. "If you had such a large portion of the market you should decide what the standards are?"
user1804599
That is not funny.
user1804599
@Rapptz lol
@Rapptz and... that strikes you as efficient use of the available area? :p
yes
I have 3 floors though
I'm not exactly cramped for space
08:17
Too many bathrooms create maintenance issues. 2:1 is optimal… 3:1 isn't so bad except it needs to be a lot bigger.
@Potatoswatter apparently, that depends on who you are. For some people, it sounds like 1:2 is optimal
3:1 what?
bed:bath
I've never had maintenance issues with the bathrooms
@Rapptz you're unable to climb stairs when you need to pee?
@Rapptz other than having to clean three of them instead of one. ;)
08:19
wait I just realised you guys think I live alone
If you've been holding it in for long enough, everything will seem difficult.
@Rapptz It was the gist of my joke.
@Rapptz well, someone asked if they were reserved to just you, and you said yes, so that was kind of a logical assumption for us to make, wasn't it? :p
I was kidding
why would I have 3 bathrooms to myself?
@Rapptz that's what I was wondering
08:20
@Rapptz If you clog one, you can use another while the stools from the first one soften overnight to become flushable.
2
one of the bathrooms is actually a "guest" bathroom
or well, it's the only logical assumption I can make considering it's so tiny
@Rapptz for when you do really stinky shits
user1804599
One bathroom is enough.
@Potatoswatter depends how many people too - for example 2 people might be 2:1, but for 6 people, you might only need 2. For a dom with 20 people, 3 might be sufficient ... probability theory
ITT @rightfold just picks out his big shits if they don't flush
user1804599
08:22
Also toilet and bath in separate rooms pl0x.
I noticed that every time I take a shit, it smells like shit. Oh wait...
5 people live here.
user1804599
@Mysticial Eat healthier food.
@telkitty.exe Be sure to mention that in the ad.
@rightfold I eat whatever they give us at work. I trust my health to Google. But not my privacy. ahaha
08:24
@Mysticial That stool softening thing never works, it just makes the bathroom smell extra disgusting.
lol ... people will decide for themselves, we advertise, people will inspect and decide on whether they would like to rent it
@Rapptz That's why you close the door and turn on the air.
rule #1, don't decide for others when you don't have to
@Rapptz Then seal the toilet. :P
@MarkGarcia You can easily seal a clogged toilet by shitting more into it.
08:25
@telkitty.exe have you considered using this?
huh? it's not holiday rental
oic
user1804599
@Mysticial Don't worry. They know what you eat even when you are not at work.
it's not built yet too :p
in hindsight
no one goes to Australia for holidays pfft
08:28
@rightfold Google could be analyzing its employees' shit for more data, er knowledge graph.
Tourism is an important industry for the Australian economy. In the financial year 2010/11, the tourism industry represented 2.5% of Australia's GDP at a value of approximately A$35 billion to the national economy. This is equivalent to tourism contributing $94.8 million a day to the Australian economy. Domestic tourism is a significant part of the tourism industry, and was responsible for 73% of the total direct tourism GDP. The 2010-11 financial year saw a record number of overseas arrivals in the financial year, with 5.9 million short-term visitor arrivals to Australia (or ...
@MarkGarcia IOW, Google analyzes our shit to determine what kind of ads to serve us.
5.9 million short term visitors in a year for a country with only 22 million people
NYC alone gets 35 million people per year.
@Mysticial Wait. Employees being served ads, ads create revenue. Checks out! gwei.org
08:32
I remember seeing that on HN.
@Rapptz and the rest of the country?
user1804599
@Mysticial Install AdBlock. Haha.
Xeo
Xeo
wheee, cake
The rest of the country doesn't go to NYC every year.
@telkitty.exe probably a metric assload.
:v
08:34
@telkitty.exe You mean where all the theme parks are? Also, the US federal government doesn't exactly make hospitality a priority. Half the world isn't even allowed to visit.
Look, even the missing MH370 made an attempt to come to Australia ... it did not go to NYC , did it? :p
@Mysticial they analyze the shit to determine which ads did have an impact :P
@Xeo Oh... um... You weren't exactly wrong when you said this. I spoke too soon.
@Potatoswatter and Australia does?
1.19 billion trips to and from the US in 2005? dang
user1804599
08:37
@songyuanyao no, it will be moved. — rightfold 6 secs ago
user1804599
Ugh ugh ugh.
@telkitty.exe Does Australia regularly get sued by diplomats for invasion of privacy at the airports?
Xeo
Xeo
@Mysticial Bullshit magic numbers :|
Why the fuck wasn't there simply a static float const _1over255 = ...; somewhere?
he explains that in his answer
@Xeo dunno. Plenty of bad code out there?
08:39
performance desperation!
@Rapptz I don't explain why the author didn't make a constant.
since I have no idea
@Potatoswatter that's a positive thing because ... ? Besides we have beagles ... I was once checked by the custom officer because I was looking at a cute beagle, then it looked at me and walked closer - the act was deemed suspicious by the custom officer
oh it was probably someone else
@telkitty.exe They should only use really ugly sniffer dogs.
so true
Martin, you always know the best in regards to dogs!
08:42
@telkitty.exe What did the check consist of?
Xeo
Xeo
Facebook reveal Oculus Rift redesign. http://t.co/22mR9zUFaB
hah
opening the bag, undo bags and bags of underwear and other personal items
@telkitty.exe but not the underwear you were wearing.
lol
they do that in the U.S.?
08:44
sometimes
not the last two times when I visited there
if you're Islamic your chances will rise
Well, the guys doing the checks are mostly teenagers, who for the life of me seem to be picked from inner-city gangs. They can't exactly guess who belongs to what religion.
Don't get me wrong, I like the U.S. but it has 10x as many people as here. Maybe the world of rich and powerful love to live in a place like the NYC, but there will always be tough loners like myself who dislike a human infested city full of chicken cage sized accomodations stacked on top of each other. I love nature, I love wildlife, that's why I love it here :p
wear a turban or a scarf
08:51
@Xeo speaking of which i was reading the comments on a "Facebook bought Oculus" article and practically all of it was negative. In the end though, I'm not sure that all change anything though
BTW I love NYC as a visitor! Just not as long term place to live
Xeo
Xeo
Facebook did make a comment to let Oculus run its course for the mean time, but get involved later on
Most people seemed to have an issue with them "selling out" more than Facebook being involved in the development
user1804599
Virtual Reality is not going to change the world
4
08:53
@RequestMapping(value="/hotels/{hotel}/bookings/{booking}",
                method=RequestMethod.GET)
public String getBooking(
        @PathVariable("hotel") long hotelId,
        @PathVariable("booking") long bookingId,
        Model model) {               // WOW! I SAVED A LINE!
    Hotel hotel = hotelService.getHotel(hotelId);
    Booking booking = hotel.getBooking(bookingId);
    model.addAttribute("booking", booking);
    return "booking";
}
@rightfold But the age of waifu!
Xeo
Xeo
@sehe ugh
The example is contrived. But brings it across :)
user1804599
08:55
@sehe Only a fool counts a brace on a line as a line.
I'd do that. One-brace lines piss me off. If I want blank space I'll add a blank line.
user1804599
Also, eww.
Irrelevant. Everyone reads it. Counting is not important
Xeo
Xeo
brace-only lines are good for spatial separation
@rightfold slow poke
Xeo
Xeo
08:55
also a nice place for a comment
user1804599
@RequestMapping(value="/hotels/{hotel}/bookings/{booking}",
                method=RequestMethod.GET)
public String getBooking(@PathVariable("hotel") long hotelId,
                         @PathVariable("booking") long bookingId,
                         Model model) {
    Hotel hotel = hotelService.getHotel(hotelId);
    Booking booking = hotel.getBooking(bookingId);
    model.addAttribute("booking", booking);
    return "booking";
}
user1804599
Woop much better.
I don't care much for brace placement. But readability is important. As soon as param list is multiline, I need the brace to mark the start/indentlevel of the body.
user1804599
Also eww impure getter.
@rightfold return "booking";
08:57
In other news. Azure Portal not letting me in.
honestly that function is just weird
the name is misleading though straightforward at the same time
user1804599
Written by the clueless.
user1804599
It is bad code.
user1804599
It must be deleted.

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