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12:00 AM
As the [css] top user and [html] number 2, my comparison of their Documentation tags to W3Schools ("W3Schools is better") holds true. Half of them are mediocre attempts at examples, the other half are attempts at copying official or other third-party docs while still somehow managing to get things wrong. How can people - in plural, collaboratively - make something that's worse than the already notoriously bad W3Schools?! I honestly don't remember the last time I approved an improvement request that added content rather than deleting it. — BoltClock ♦ 8 hours ago
^^ ahaha. So "documentation" now replaces W3Schools as the new adjective for something that has failed miserably.
I haven't been paying attention to documentation at all so I have no idea of the state of affairs their. Apparently, it isn't good.
 
@Mysticial I'm not sure failed miserably is really fair. wW3Schools has been terrible for a decade or so now. Docs has only been around for a few months. That's not to say it's good (I wouldn't know--I don't pay much attention either). At this point the real question is whether it's actually getting better, or just collecting still more mediocre information. I don't really know the answer to that, but "it isn't good" is a whole lot different from "it isn't good yet".
 
Ven
12:21 AM
It's really bad.
Jul 21 at 11:17, by Ven
I hereby declare documentation.SO terrible.
(Trolling aside, I did write a short explanation of "why" afterwards, but the comments on that meta post sum the issues up nicely)
Jul 21 at 11:17, by Ven
I hereby declare documentation.SO terrible.
 
Ell
@ScarletAmaranth I take back allowing you to decline to help me :(
 
1:00 AM
Trying to disambiguate and properly separate my grammar is like ripping out teeth.
 
so I saw this today
 
Ven
very bad troll tbh
"J. Doe"
 
ah, I never saw it, it was deleted by the time I opened the link :(
 
Ven
1:10 AM
@jaggedSpire but did you see my kittens? those havn't been deleted. :P
 
@Ven :O
I did not!
my notifications have been funky today
awwwwww
 
kitten talks :p
 
@Ven tyvm
 
Ven
:3
 
Hahahaha its face
"Human, why you do dis"
 
1:13 AM
"For this indignity, you shall suffer."
 
forbes hates adblock
 
let's find a different article then
done
 
Ven
@jaggedSpire shitty clickbait :(
 
@Ven but it's mozart!
 
Ven
"You Will Never Understand Why We Add Caps To Every First Letter"
 
1:31 AM
who expects Mozart for most popular of anything
except maybe classical composer?
sorry.
 
Ven
i certainly didn't :p
 
@Ven Because English Does That To Titles For Whatever Reason
 
Title Case!
 
Ven
s/English/Clickbait Writers/
 
1:40 AM
technically short words that aren't pronouns don't need to be
 
Ven
Damn Rekt, Kid.
 
or rather common ones that frequently act as filler
like as, for and or
if too
 
Ven
foo bar and baz as well
 
Yes, That is Quite Apparent When You Have to Read Newspapers in Bad Language (Further Referred to as English)
 
lel
 
1:43 AM
"English is virtually 50% French and 50% German"
 
Quite so Indeed
 
France and Germany have a history of fighting, therefore English is bad.
 
Just like you have a history of shitting your pants, so please stop impressing your opinions on the world
 
I'm sorry, I do not understand your statement. ¿habla español?
 
Ven
no soy capaz de hablar español.
huh
where's my /shrug, snakchat
 
1:55 AM
Les jeunes de nos jours, hein?
 
Ven
Une espace avant ton "?", le vieux.
 
Parles vous français?
 
Ven
you don't
 
@EtiennedeMartel Pas trop enneigé par chez vous?
 
Ven
1 min ago, by Ven
Une espace avant ton "?", le vieux.
 
1:58 AM
Neige en crisse.
@Ven Ti-gars, tu sauras qu'ici, on s'en crisse de cette règle là.
 
Ven
Je n'suis pas étonné que vous vous amusiez à massacrer une langue qui ne vous a rien fait :-).
 
@EtiennedeMartel DID I SEE "NEIGE" IN MY NICE CHRISTIAN SUBURBS?
THAT HAS TO BE FRENCH FOR "NIGGER"
TO JAIL WITH THIS MAN, WITH HIS HAET CRIMES
 
Ven
hat crimes
sounds like a weird al parody
 
@Ven You say "hat crime", I give you:
 
Ven
Is this Padme?
 
2:01 AM
@набиячлэвэли Means "snow".
 
@EtiennedeMartel idc otherwise I'd've run it through GTranslate
 
Les français ont bon vin
 
As I said once already, can you stop impressing your opinions upon the world?
 
It's not an opinion, it's a fact.
 
@набиячлэвэли ah yes, the toilet seat hat
 
2:05 AM
The sole fact that you use French not as a meme but instead in an attempt at serious communication eliminates you from the pool of people who are to be taken seriously at any stage of their lives
 
Ven
y u aff to be mad
 
Hello plonkhammer my old friend
@Ven Oh I am not mad, just memeing
 
Ven
and what i said wasn't a meme?
twat
 
It's a good thing I don't speak French then
 
Probably was, judging by the time of night and your presumed approximate geographical location
 
Ven
2:07 AM
congratulatory 3AM mark then
 
@Ven Praise Be Unto Him
 
Ven
2:26 AM
I'm somewhat bored. Admittedly.
 
@набиячлэвэли Careful. I almost flagged that as offensive.
 
Ven
I still can't believe Hacker News.
> Bizarre Story of the Girl with No Vagina Who Was Stabbed and Had a Baby (2013)
 
hats ... because you worth it!
 
Ven
Hatful crimes.
 
2:41 AM
36 degrees outside
I wish I had better camera
 
@Telkitty that one on the top left has misery written all over his face
 
4 parrots on the tree in backyard
 
3:19 AM
@Borgleader Here it is:
 
Ven
@Mysticial link please?
ohai @Nooble
 
Ven
oh, I need 10k on meta as well ;o).
 
@Ven hi
 
Ven
3:22 AM
tbf not being allowed to delete your own account is pretty fucking ridiculous
I don't want to write a letter to them
 
I miss you from thiscoard
 
Ven
liez
 
@Mysticial lol
 
Ven
shit, 4:30AM already.
 
I'm actually fluent in French
 
Ven
3:25 AM
nice
 
baguette eiffel tower bonjour
 
Ven
hon hon hon.
 
@Mysticial oh wow
it's like a cross between a human being and a markov chain
 
you're a markov chain
 
Ven
are you
 
3:29 AM
we're all markov chains
I just have more internal state
 
fun fact
meh actually this one doesn't sound impressive
 
I wonder how many times fallacy appears on that page
 
@jaggedSpire I have a question for you since you're a culinary expert
If you had to eat only one kind of vegetable for the rest of your life
Which would it be
 
@Nooble add more hot sauce
is this a culinary vegetable
 
It is a vegetable
 
3:34 AM
...
 
It grows from the ground or whatever
I mean gosh i don't know what vegetables even are
 
we need a strict definition of vegetable here, nooble
if beans are counted as a vegetable by your metric because they are plants with mushy bits you can eat my choice will be significantly different than if they are not
 
plant edible things that aren't fruits
 
jesus nooble
I would die of malnutrition you realize
 
I mean I'm sure beans count but like
you can only use one kind of bean
 
3:36 AM
you can't get all required proteins from any one plant
 
says who
 
best combination is rice + bean
 
@jaggedSpire convince him that potatoes are vegitables
@jaggedSpire potatoes
 
see that doesn't work because those are two vegetables not really vegetables
how about beans and rice made out of beans
 
@Nooble missing key nutrients
 
3:37 AM
@MooingDuck you know I'd forgtten they offered a complete balance of proteins
@Nooble nooble wat r u even doin
 
what are nutrients where do they come from
 
we eat some and we manufacture some
check your nearest nutrition label for more information
 
I mean like
are nutrients really neccessary
 
@Nooble yes. without them, you die
 
we can manufacture about of third of the kinds of protein we need, IIRC. We need to ingest the other kinds. We need vitamin A and vitamin D, but if we can produce sufficient vitamin D for ourselves if we get enough sun, we need some minerals as well, like iron.
and C and stuff
 
3:40 AM
@Nooble if you don't get vitimin C, you get scurvy, and die. if you don't get vitimin A, you go blind
 
my mother would be mortified if she knew I couldn't list all them :|
actually
ask your health professional parental unit about nutrients nooble. Be sure to ask about every kind of Vitamin B, and for details regarding the gaps in the numbering.
 
how about fish
they're not vegetables but
do they contain everything I need to survive
 
nooble I'm vegetarian not pescatarian
though given a restriction to exactly one type of plant matter I imagine that would change
 
okay well like what if you were dropped in an island without vehetabke
 
god, no spices even
 
3:43 AM
yeah exactly
 
interesting conversation
 
Ketosis is a metabolic state in which some of the body's energy supply comes from ketone bodies in the blood, in contrast to a state of glycolysis in which blood glucose provides most of the energy. Ketosis is a nutritional process characterised by serum concentrations of ketone bodies over 0.5 mM, with low and stable levels of insulin and blood glucose. It is almost always generalized with hyperketonemia, that is, an elevated level of ketone bodies in the blood throughout the body. Ketone bodies are formed by ketogenesis when liver glycogen stores are depleted (or from metabolising medium-chain...
 
@littlepootis terribly on topic don't you think
 
This room is always on-topic.
4
 
of course
this is exactly what on-topic looks like
 
3:46 AM
wait wait speaking of which
can I live purely off of like
um
 
coconuts
 
soylent green? yes
you can live off soylent green
 
are those coconuts
 
no
it's people
soylent green is people
 
3:50 AM
so I've learned of these things called carbohydrates and like
apparently you need them but
you could survive for like a bunch of weeks without food
@jaggedSpire have you tried soylent
 
@Nooble I have a friend who has
I enjoy taste and crunchy things too much
 
do you eat chocolates or is that not a vegetable
wait no that's not how it works is it
 
ITT nooble discovers that not all plant life may be classified as a vegetable
beans are legumes, by the way
and mushrooms are culinary vegetables, but are not plants at all
 
why aren't you called like a plantatarian instead then hm
 
strange isn't it
I also eat fruit and fungi
 
3:58 AM
what would you call someone who eats strictly vegetables
 
you know I don't know
it wouldn't even be a paleo diet
paleo/raw vegan maybe?
well, wouldn't necessarily have to be raw, it's just raw vegans tend not to eat grains
on account of not eating cooked things
 
wait why would they do that
 
Oh man.
 
I believe they've decided it's healthier
@ThePhD did you enter into another ambitious group project with a group that has now proven completely incompetent/mysteriously vanished into the winds?
you really need to start holding tryouts for positions in your groups
and where is my imitation vanilla
 
No, but implementing all this is a pain and my body grows weak.
 
4:04 AM
@ThePhD drawing on The Majesty of Catface will grant you the strength you need
:3
embrace The Way
 
:I
 
:3
do you want to make a deal?
 
Ven
:3
 
Ven pls
Not you too.
 
it's only a small price, really
you won't pay even a single cent
 
Ven
4:06 AM
It's 5am and I've stayed up this late only for such a reason.
:3
 
:3
and really, once it's gone
you won't miss it at all
and the way they prepare it really is quite scrumptious
The Catface can give you such strength of will
 
are we talking about turning to a purely legume diet
 
and yet you refuse
 
oh lol nvm
 
Ven
no about souls tbqh
they're a bit like legumes tho
delicious
 
4:09 AM
do you enjoy pain, PhD?
 
oooh
 
Is that why you persist in your refusal?
 
I wish I did, since I end up in these kinds of situations.
 
Catface can grant you much, PhD
why not take a chance?
:3
ANYHOW
today I learned about forward_as_tuple which is a pretty neat thing
lets you unpack nested tuples
 
Ven
never nest your tuples lest you want rouble
 
4:15 AM
lol
yeah, found it looking for dupe targets to a question I'd already answered
I answered it before dupe-searching because I was being a badlet
 
Ven
:O
 
but I found a dupe target, deleted my answer, voted to close as dupe and then the asker deleted it so
 
Ven
the catface is not pleased. :e
oh.
it is pleased :3.
 
:3
I was redeemed
 
Ven
Your soul was blissfully devoured.
 
4:18 AM
joyous are the mercies of Catface
and delicious
 
You both scare me endlessly.
 
Ven
next I'll write some ocaml
be prepared :3.
 
@ThePhD <3
 
Right.
I need to bikeshed and implement
a way of handling memory
lib.new( size_in_bytes ) ?
 
just malloc everything
flawless
 
4:31 AM
I need something better than that, I guess.
Need a std::unique_ptr I guess.
Just what to call it in my language...
Maybe a type name?
var m : memory = lib.new( 5000 );
 
owning something perhaps?
unique_ptr's role isn't immediately obvious from its name
 
I don't have pointers an crap in my language.
I DO want to have constructors / destructors.
But I don't know how I would orchestrate that with things like a raw block of memory.
 
if you're not going to have pointers and crap how are you doing argument passing?
by value?
 
Everything is by value.
(For now).
 
and there's no reference-by-value nonsense happening?
 
4:40 AM
Problem is, I don't know what the "by value" semantics of a raw chunk of memory should be.
@jaggedSpire So far, no, but memory is proving to be a significant challenge.
lib.new( size_in_bytes, destructor_func ) ?
 
user406009
If you don't mind me asking, what is the point of this language?
 
School.
That's its only point.
 
user406009
A language without pointers seems like it wouldn't be useful for most purposes.
 
Ah but I don't have lambdas.
 
user406009
@ThePhD Why do you even need lib.new anyways?
 
4:42 AM
So I can't capture things like "how many items have bene initialized".
@Lalaland Because I can't do everything on the stack.
I want to make some mildly interesting programs, eventually.
Even if I have less than 8 days and am working solo.
 
user406009
The simple solution is to just add pointers back in to a certain extent. Have Boxed<foobar> or whatnot.
 
user406009
lib.new<foobar>() just returns a boxed<foobar>
 
user406009
Special case it if you have to.
 
user406009
Actually the simplest solution is to ditch the whole lack of pointers stuff. Do a C clone.
 
What about memory of mixed sizes?
I guess that's structs...
Welp.
 
user406009
4:45 AM
Don't allow objects of varying sizes.
 
What I mean is
 
user406009
And don't mix pointers and arrays.
 
struct array {
var mem : memory_type;

array ( .. ) { mem = lib.new( ... ); }
~array( ) { /* mem destroys itself by automatically calling free*/ }
}
I guess I can't build destruction semantics into lib.new for whatever people construct in the space of that memory
unless they use proper RAII. I guess I'll ask people to do proper RAII.
Guess I'll have a memory type.
 
why do you need the memory type?
 
5:02 AM
Because I need arbitrary sections of memory to be allocated and used at the program's discretion (e.g., to make any sort of interesting data structure).
 
5:34 AM
Fuck, I made the mistake of catching up on Izetta with one episode yet to air.
 
Hello.
Is it necessary to close a filestream, which was opened in a function?
Eg:
void some () {
ifstream file ...;
.
.
file.close(); // <- is it necessary
}
 
nope, RAII is awesome
the destructor closes it for you
 
oh thanks i can delete 4 lines off my code :)
 
you really want to read up on RAII
it's how resource management in C++ is done and it massively simplifies a lot of code
and it helps massively with exception safety too
A+ language feature
 
5:50 AM
This grammar ambiguity makes me sad.
Grammars make me sad.
I can't get the qualified ID to behave proper, damnit.
 
:(
you know what would be fun
starting a discussion on how you'd redesign C++ i/o
I think I'll do that sometime
not tonight though
tonight it's bedtime
@ThePhD why not?
 
Because my parser recurses on itself. Same thing I was banging my head against earlier.
I'm trying to separate it out, but it's not working properly.
if a is an object type...
++a.b.c is a valid parse.
So I'd want a.b.c grouped together, and then ++ (expr) to be a thing
I have the precendence rules for it but yacc complains it has two valid shift/reduce from teh way I set it up
so I'm trying to split up all my shit so that it behaves properly and I am not getting far in the slightest.
 
hello, dooes anzone here programm c++ on xcode?
 
what is c++?
2
 
@littlepootis lol
@ThePhD yie
 
5:58 AM
Im always missing headers like "winerror.h". how can i avoid that?
 
@ThePhD Just implement ECMAScript
 

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