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7:00 PM
Oh no, not Smalltalk.
 
sbi
 
Als
@sbi: Just read the comments over in meta...
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Discussions of e.g. Haskell, Python, Java, Smalltalk and exam woes [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
 
Als
@sbi : Why is there so much traffic on that one today
because it seems TimPost informed them and woke them off their not so ignorant bliss.
 
sbi
@Als Yeah, I didn't know Shog9 has such a bad temper. What a prick.
 
7:07 PM
link?
 
Als
30
Q: Shouldn't anonymous serial downvoters be banned from SO?

sbiThere was a discussion about unexplained anonymous serial down-voting in the C++ room this morning (starting here). The user affected by it explained it to me thus: It started on a particular Q, Wherein, I had a rub-in with a particular user over one of my answer. Immediately,within seconds,...

 
sbi
@AlfPSteinbach The comments under this: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/108538/…
@Als I dunno. maybe just because it's already close to 1k views, making it stay at meta's front page? It's not just mods, after all. (But, yeah, Won't and Shog9 suddenly showing up could be explained quite well by your reasoning.)
 
Als
@sbi: From what I reckon most of the mods are against the belief that they are the ones to take care of this.
While Jeff says they should
So either its an genuine confusion or just a few mods trying to keep their hands off hot pots.
 
i can't find the remote for the stereo. argh!
 
> Please do not write funny comments under questions, when you have not any answer. plz plz plz
Lol.
 
7:24 PM
Yeah, silly right?
> I disagree. How else would you select a design pattern?
Btw, can anyone tell what the problem is in that "robotics" question that "needs" a design pattern?
 
@Als I suspect some of the mods may be just a tiny bit more excited about the privileges than the responsibilities of the position. That doesn't excuse their behavior, but I think expecting otherwise is probably a bit unreasonable as well.
 
Als
@JerryCoffin: Hmm..true, Is is just that All these days the thread existed but none of the mods except TimPost seemed to even add a comment on it.
Today Tim commented he pretty much found the source and has informed other mods
and then the other swing in to action to say how this is not so correct.
They should have said so earlier instead of just turning a blind eye.
I do not blame anyone for the situation, but the thing is there is a problem and it needs to be sorted not avoided
as it seems from responses there, most mods with exception of TimPost seem to be happy just trying to ignore the whole thing off.
 
room topic changed to Lounge<C++>: Discussions of e.g. Haskell, Python, Java, Smalltalk, Prolog and exam woes [c++] [c++11] [c++-faq]
 
7:40 PM
@Als Yup -- and (unfortunately) none of us can see the direct evidence to form any really solid judgement on our own. This shows one place shog9 was clearly dead wrong: he basically demanded proof of wrongdoing, despite the fact that the site is specifically designed to assure that only moderators have the access necessary to provide such proof.
 
Als
@JerryCoffin: True. I am just expecting a closure. tell me yes we got the source or tell me atleast that no all those are valid and I should live with it.
Just saying we need proof is like living in deinal.
 
sbi
@JerryCoffin Not even mods have enough access to the DB to directly see the proof.
 
Here's a closure: [&]{ return x; }.
 
is it true , insert() and push_back() ( suppose at end() ) both expands the container ?
 
@JerryCoffin i wonder if the mods here have a mailing list or other private forum. that has been helpful for clc++m. everything's up in the light of day, so to speak
 
sbi
7:42 PM
@AlfPSteinbach They have private chat rooms, I believe.
 
@MrAnubis yes, as necessary
hm i forgot C#, there was a bit of that yesterday
 
should add?
 
That was once discussed too.
I don't remember the Smalltalk though.
 
It's my birthday :D
 
7:45 PM
@AlfPSteinbach I'm not sure, but definitely get the impression that they do communicate privately -- though I have no idea how much they really use it. I dunno though -- at times I've seen pretty serious problems with clc++m moderation too, so I'm not sure it's any kind of panacea either.
 
@KianMayne cong ratz! :-)
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes Do you dare to add that to the tagline? :)
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes Have you been hiding under a rock?
 
Oh the censor thing?
Wasn't that question mooted out?
 
sbi
7:46 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes Indeed.
 
@sbi Okay -- I'll take your word for that. Regardless of what they can see, he's well aware that normal users don't have sufficient access in any case.
 
Anyway, we've had PHP too.
And Perl.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Well, it was closed anyway...
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes That's my interpretation, too. I'd doubt the mullahs would agree. But go ahead, I'd like to see the results.
 
sbi
7:47 PM
@JerryCoffin Actually it's what several of the mods said in that thread.
 
Heck, why not just go with Discussions of pretty much every language and their dogs and exam woes?
 
sbi
@RMartinhoFernandes Was that the language that was translated to JS via C with the help of XSLT? ;-)
 
That was INTERCAL (Computer Language With No Pronounceable Acronym).
 
@sbi Okay -- I didn't try to read the whole thing by any means. With my kids off school this week, I'm already getting my full quota of petty squabbles.
 
Is it snowing or something?
 
sbi
7:50 PM
@JerryCoffin I don't begrudge anyone not taking the time to read through that. Hadn't I done it iteratively...
 
I haven't even read the entirety of the question, tbh.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes No -- "fall break". I'm not quite sure of the point -- they've moved to starting school weeks earlier, so now they go to school for about a month, and then get a week off...
 
When saw these slides I expected the atmosphere at the conference to be pretty tense. However when seeing the video I'm surprised how laid back it actually is.
 
It does feel strange.
 
Als
7:54 PM
okay folks off for the day the entire meta thing wears me off
 
@StackedCrooked It helps that it's Andrei -- he's obviously highly respected, and also quite charismatic. Many others making the same assertions (even with as good of support) probably wouldn't have been quite so well received.
@Als Can't blame you. Later.
 
Slides got me hooked. Gotta watch the video.
 
Head. Hurts.
 
sbi
@StackedCrooked That's pretty old, though. And was disregarded. I mean, we still have iterators, no?
@JohnDibling Sorry. About. That.
 
Does anybody know if the 14882:2011 iso.org/iso/iso_catalogue/catalogue_tc/… is free for academic institutions?
 
sbi
8:02 PM
@CaptainGiraffe Never was, I doubt it's now.
 
@sbi Having two STLs would be a bit weird, no?
 
So I have this operator,
inline Vec2 operator / (const float f);
Now I have a function inline float length(const Vec2 &v1); which takes a Vec2 and returns a float,

When I want to normalize the vector, I then want to do,

inline Vec2 normalize(const Vec2 &v)
{
return v / length(v);
}

But this is illegal since length(v) doesn't return a const float. Do I have do add yet ANOTHER operator / (float f)?
 
sbi
But the latest draft was freely available. Only the front page should differ.
 
Really nice video. Nothing new for me, but very interesting to listen to.
 
8:03 PM
k, composing a sobbing letter to boss
 
@Captain: Just get the draft?
 
@sbi We have a nice financial situation at the department though, so we should be able to afford the authority =)
+ @John
 
sbi
@CaptainGiraffe That's a hefty price for a front page, if you ask me.
Anyway, gotta go, too. Bye.
 
@sbi Thanks bye
 
What would you guys suggest i use for fixed bit width types?
Is it alright to use cstdint?
 
8:06 PM
That's the way to do it.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes char has been pretty solid the last 30 years though
 
Sorry, what?
 
8 bit chars?
 
The size of char is not required to be exactly 8 bits.
 
The standard doesn't say that a char has 8 bits.
 
8:08 PM
YES i know =)
 
It must be at least 8 bits.
 
Any counterexamples would be helpful where the char is not 8-bit and the system is not from 35 years ago
 
@CaptainGiraffe TI DSP
 
is it natural that g++ complains about cstdint being a part of the new ISO C++ standard and requires a specific compiler option to compile?
 
8:12 PM
I think so.
Fail.
 
@Alf P What is the char bits on the TI's?
 
neat =)
Any links to motivate this oddity?
Or is it just a dsp wont ever encounter an ascii character?
 
16 bits can handle ASCII characters.
 
8:17 PM
no, you need to write a bunch of crappy code when dealing with stuff where you can receive / send characters, like a comm channel for instance
 
What's the obsession with ASCII?
 
ASCII is 7-bit, btw.
 
std::unique_ptr supports incomplete types, right?
As in, you know what I mean.
 
why does google translate "Meine Nachbarin hat Kohlmeisen aber was macht der Hahn auf meinem Esel" so oddly to english ?
 
8:18 PM
@CaptainGiraffe u can just google it. but generally 16. i think they have some with CHAR_BIT = 32 also. e.g. see velocityreviews.com/forums/…
 
@CatPlusPlus I'm not entirely sure.
GCC doesn't seem to like it because of the destructor.
 
@AlfPSteinbach Really? And I thought dealing with the C2000 family (CHAR_BIT = 16) was a pain in the ass!
 
@AlfPSteinbach I tried, but my google fu was not strong enough.
@RMartinhoFernandes Yes, but please.
 
But what?
If 8 bits can handle ASCII, why can't 16?
 
> The template parameter T of unique_ptr may be an incomplete type
Cool.
 
8:20 PM
@RMartinhoFernandes So would 65536
@AlfPSteinbach Thanks for the link.
 
Wait, maybe I was doing something wrong.
 
@CatPlusPlus for example it can be int[]
 
28
Q: Exotic architectures the standard committee cares about

ybungalobillI know that the C++ standard leaves many aspects of the language implementation-defined just because if there had been an architecture with other characteristics, it would be impossible to write a standard conforming compiler for it. I know that 40 years ago any computer had it's own unique spec...

 
Like say, never ever completing the type.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Do you know how pimpl works?
 
8:24 PM
@AlfPSteinbach Thanks again. I keep forgetting we should use c++ to program our kids =)
 
@RMartinhoFernandes Minimalistic example.
 
wow weird example Jameskanze gives there about base8 floating points
 
You don't have to use a separate type for the deleter, void(*)(impl*) works as well.
 
void(*)(impl*) and pass it [](impl *i) { ... } should work
 
But note that using void(*)(impl*) robs you of the empty base optimization so the two are not equivalent.
 
8:31 PM
i mean to use the operator alias<void(*)()>() of the lambda
 
Ugh, my head.
 
but I did not think about EBO. good point
 
@JohannesSchaublitb What's operator alias?
 
you cannot specify a function declarator in a conversion type id of a conversion function
so you need the workaround by an identity template or alias template
 
8:33 PM
Come to think of it, wouldn't std::default_deleter<impl> just do the right thing? I wrote a deleter type out of habit, I tend to use pimpl when bridging with another API that typically uses a special function to dispose of resources. (And I want the EBO).
E.g. I have a std::unique_ptr<lua_State, custom_deleter> rather than a std::unique_ptr<lua_State, void(*)(lua_State*)>.
 
@RMartinhoFernandes same for arrays
 
8:55 PM
Ok, the atmosphere does get a little tense at 42:00.
Time for a song.
 

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