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12:05 AM
rgchris has made a change to the feeds posted into this room
 
May need to clean up the metadata in the feed a bit. Need to go out too, will think on it...
 
12:18 AM
1
A: Save a value to a block instead of the word label that represents it

Graham ChiuReduce will also reset the name of the field which is also "contact-name". So, this would be better append/only saved-data-block reduce [ to-set-word contact-name get-face contact-name ]

2
A: Save a value to a block instead of the word label that represents it

HostileForkIf you aren't required to specifically use reduce, compose can be a better way of calling out the parts you want to be "left alone". Only things in parentheses will be evaluated, everything else untouched. So for instance: append/only saved-data-block compose [contact-name: (get-face contact-n...

4
A: Why does return/redo evaluate result functions in the calling context, but block results are not evaluated?

LadislavWhile the question originally asked why return/redo did not evaluate blocks, there were also formulations like: "is cool because you can do things like tail call optimization", "[can write] a wrapper for the return functionality", "it seems to be getting more and more useful the more we think abo...

4
A: What is the 'reword' function in Rebol and how do I use it?

BrianHHere there be dragons! The reword function is a bit of an experiment to add shell-style string interpolation to Rebol in a way that works with the way we do things. Unlike a lot of Rebol's series functions, it really is optimized for working on just string types, and the design reflects that. Th...

1
A: What's the fastest/most efficient way to count lines in Rebol?

endo64remove-each can be fast as it is native s: "1^/2^/3" a: length? s print a - length? remove-each v s [v = #"^/"] ; >> 2 or as a function >> f: func [s] [print [(length? s) - (length? remove-each v s [v = #"^/"])]] >> f "1^/2^/3" == 2

 
12:38 AM
@rgchris Brilliant! (Especially the R3 altxml bit :)
 
 
4 hours later…
5:06 AM
@rgchris Awesome!
Drummed up a bit of excitement about Rebol tonight, I have been invited to give a talk at a hacker group about it (in March)
 
KK.
5:22 AM
@HostileFork Great! Congrats.
 
@KK. It's so much easier to talk about it when they ask "is it open source", you say "yes" then "what's the license" and you say "Apache 2.0"...
You couldn't GIVE Rebol away before.
People would just laugh at you.
I think I might have to pretty much admit I was wrong by advocating the GPL. People seem to hate the GPL. There's a big anti-GPL movement right now, I didn't know until I started asking.
@KK. In India, do you think there is a perception that the GPL is important or is it considered a nuisance?
 
KK.
@HostileFork We just copy and paste code here. Just saying "open source" is enough.
 
@KK. Probably not a lot of Free Software Foundation people conducting lawsuits in Indian courts, I guess. :-)
 
KK.
In fact, I got to know about the every-part-of-your-project is GPL if it uses even a few lines of GPL at programmers.SE
@HostileFork Yes.
Before 2000 AD, you could not even enforce any kind of software lawsuits in India.
Even it is more of an e-commerce kind of act.
Code and IT issues are generally considered under copyrights or privacy.
@HostileFork I am sure you will videograph your talk in March and put it on youtube as usual.
I am currently viewing a cheyenne-webserver talk by @DocKimbel
 
@KK. Hmm, interesting. I do not know if you have watched much of Richard Stallman's activism or talks in that vein, but this is one of my favorite recent talks from a famous writer that is very... important. The coming war on general computation. Well I think it is very important to hear what he is saying. He is less weird than Stallman... oh, well this will have to go in your queue then. :-)
@KK. Doc has new plans for Red's webserver...I'm not sure how many of the ideas he's keeping vs. throwing out...but he says it will be quite different.
 
KK.
5:35 AM
@HostileFork No worries, its good to just listen to what he is saying :-)
Maybe you guys don't understand it, but there is a lot of honest, down to earth experience in this room.
I read a few blog posts/pages written by Stallman. Did not complete the Cathedral and the Bazaar, but I kind of get what he wants to say.
 
@KK. Cathedral and the Bazaar is by Eric Raymond, he's a different guy...
 
KK.
Ok. I made a mistake :-)
 
@KK. To me this, is essay is a nice pure capture of Stallman's most basic insight: Why Software Should Be Free
"In the 1970s, there were articles on “computer addiction”: users were “onlining” and had hundred-dollar-a-week habits. It was generally understood that people frequently loved programming enough to break up their marriages. Today, it is generally understood that no one would program except for a high rate of pay. People have forgotten what they knew back then." :-)
 
KK.
5:51 AM
You read fast. I am a few paragraphs behind you.
 
Rebol is kind of like crack cocaine. Said Carl: "A friend of mine says it's like the movie 'Matrix' where you are offered either the red pill or the blue pill. Most programmers stick with the blue pill. The folks who take the REBOL red pill wake up and can never go back. I've had companies call me to complain that a few of their programmers started using REBOL and are now 'ruined' because they refuse to go back. REBOL is a highly disruptive technology." :-)
A little grandiose, but there's some truth in it.
I can still have some fun seeing things work in languages where the bindings are more mature, and it's honestly easier to get things done...but it's not really a fault of the Rebol language design...just its closed nature and ultra slow development timeline.
With some momentum and attention, I hope we can get the best of both worlds. But we have a LOT of catching up to do. So at least the handcuffs are off, it's a fair fight now.
 
KK.
You know, when I started coming to this room about a month back,
there used to be around 3-4 people at a time here
But now there are 7-8 people here whenever I come
 
@KK. Well AltME has people, the same ol' people it has had forever and ever. And I'm trying to get them to take interest in connecting, because it's really fun to share Rebol. But I think the future is going to be driven largely by new people like you and others...
Young programmers worldwide, India... China...
Jerry Tsai wrote a Rebol book, in Chinese, that sold (what was, to me) a shocking number of copies in China.
People in the US don't always use their heads, I think they are bigger suckers for advertising and gimmicks. This is just my impression. People in other countries seem to face "reality" more, and when they look at reality they will care more for what a language brings to the table than some marketing they heard...
(Well, I mean, no culture or country has a monopoly on being foolish...)
 
KK.
@HostileFork Not really. This is true with people everywhere :-)
IMO people normally think unconsciously that a good language is one with lots of search results on the internet.
 
KK.
6:01 AM
Rebol has 685,000 python has 189,000,000 and C has 3,500,000,000 results
 
@KK. You just kicked my ass!
 
KK.
@HostileFork "KK" is just two letters combined, and your name is something you made yourself. There is a Hindi singer who goes by KK in India. I am sure there are KKs everywhere, be it celebrities or abbreviations.
 
@KK. I know, joking. :-) I didn't come up with the term, I just saw it was getting popular and bought the domain and drew a cartoon fork. The rest is... just what happened after that.
My website for my so-called "real name" is rather simple. :-) briandickens.com
I use "KK" in chat as an abreviation for "okay". Like "okie dokie" => kk
 
KK.
@HostileFork KK
 
"o'kay o'kay", basically.
Hey, so here is a question for you. If I asked you the difference between when someone said "I have work to do" and "I have work work to do" would you assume typo or are you aware of a distinction in meaning?
 
KK.
6:07 AM
@HostileFork I would say typo
 
@KK. Interesting. It actually means something in English, when intoned. When you say "I have work work to do"... you are saying not just something you have to do, but something that you get paid for.
Like REAL work. you know. work work...
Not just fixing the gutters, which is a challenge and in a sense work, but you mean your boss is on the phone and if you don't do the work you don't get paid. work work.
 
KK.
So in work work the first work means important enough to warrant full focus/effort, and the second work means work
 
I bring this up because Doc assumed Carl made a typo here, and was surprised that he would make such an obviously weird typo... but I had to explain it's an idiom.
 
KK.
I wonder why he calls himself dockimbel
He is otherwise public with his name and all :-)
 
Delegation is interesting. The C/C++ group I run has had a lot of growth and enthusiasm relative to where it was before...we even had Bjarne Stroustrup which was a big deal to me personally and also for some others... and I sort of am having a bit of a hard time handing it off. Trusting people is difficult.
@KK. It's like Dr. Manhattan... you watched that scene from Watchmen, right? :-) We're building hyperdimensional machines invisible to most people...
Phone call from my friend at Matterport, bbiab
 
6:36 AM
rgchris has made a change to the feeds posted into this room
 
KK.
@HostileFork I am gonna leave for lunch. ttyl.
 
 
1 hour later…
8:02 AM
@HostileFork wow, neat idea ...
 
Graham, have you tried anything yet for rotating your house?
@rgchris are you against adding your xml scripts to the script library at rebol.org? I don't think altxml came up as a result.
 
8:23 AM
@Adrian No, not against it—an early version is in there as xml-dom.
 
@Adrian Not yet .. talking to builders etc. House moving guy said it would cost a mint.
 
@GrahamChiu You wanted to rotate to build an extension?
@rgchris, how tolerant of malformed HTML is your parser?
I ask about HTML because I see you use that as an example.
 
It's not tolerant at all.
But a lot of sites still use markup that's XML-compatible.
I'd love to add an HTML parser that works the same way—afaik, Gabriele has the only holistic HTML parser in Rebol.
I haven't fully evaluated the dependencies to see what the minimum code would be to build an 'AltHTML'
 
his Power Mezz was just for R2, no?
 
I think at least some of it is updated.
HTML Parser in Rebol ← link to documentation page.
 
8:54 AM
@Adrian yeah and also create a drive way to access the back section of the property
 
9:11 AM
Dependencies for the parser. (pretty sure the PowerMezz package has a more elegant module loader than this one :)
 
@rgchris Why next words-of module ? The words-of function doesn't need next. Is there something other than self that you're skipping?
 
I added 'header to reference the script header.
context compose [header: (load/header url)]
 
9:28 AM
@rgchris OK, cool. With the old R2 reflection functions you had to skip past self. With the *-of reflectors, we fixed that :)
 
Yep, I'm still getting used to having them in R2—the old tendency to write 'third (or whatever) is strong :)
I guess to test the R3-ness of the PowerMezz scripts is to turn all the 'knows into 'dos.
Btw, I'm sure there's a more deliberate test, but I realised any-word? #issue is a fairly quick, safe way to test R2 vs R3 in a hybrid script.
(my gripes about issue changing notwithstanding :)
@pekr Ask a question! Submit an answer! We're waiting for you :)
 
I usually use this pattern: either system/version > 2.100.0 ['R3-code] ['R2-code]
The csv-tools.r script uses that pattern, for instance, as does my shared rebol.r
 
There's that too, but I've a growing aversion to paths (don't ask).
 
9:43 AM
They're a little better in R3, but I think that they could use a little work.
What's the license for your XML parser? I could use it, even as a start.
 
Could do MIT?
 
MIT or Apache would work for me just fine. R3 itself is Apache, so that would make it have the best chance of being adapted to be incorporated.
 
Apache seems fine too.
 
It would be nice to have a delay-loaded XML parsing module built into R3 :)
 
Indeed, except—hopefully not forever!
 
 
6 hours later…
KK.
3:38 PM
In r2, using append to add something to the end of a block returns the block with the thing appended to it, but why does the same not happen with insert ?
>> members: [karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl]
== [karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl]
>> append members 'brianH
== [karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl brianH]
>> insert members 'petr
== [karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl brianH]
>> probe members
[petr karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl brianH]
Here, it did not return members with 'petr inserted at the front when I inserted it.
Don't know why, but I thought using the same functionality in a function would have different results, but it does not.
>> add-member: func [series addition] [
insert series addition
]
>> add-member members 'dockimbel
== [petr karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl brianH]
>> probe members
[dockimbel petr karunesh hostilefork rgchris graham-chiu adrian earl brianH]
(I actually meant to write pekr, but wrote petr. Sorry, @pekr :-) )
 
@KK. >> help insert
```
>> help insert
USAGE:
INSERT series value /part range /only /dup count

DESCRIPTION:
Inserts a value into a series and returns the series after the insert.
INSERT is an action value.
returns the series after the insert.
 
KK.
3:55 PM
@DocKimbel So insert does not update the head of the series after the insertion?
 
Series can have different indexes, they are not always pointing at first position.
INSERT returns the series pointing after the inserted value, in your case above, it will point at index position 2.
Every series value is like a "view" of the series in memory, so each "view" can have its own different starting offset.
So, you can have as much "views" of a given series as you need, each one with its own starting position, but all refering to the same underlying collection in memory.
 
KK.
Ok. Thanks to your quick pointing to help rebol-function (had forgotton it :-) ), I am reading help for insert , append and change , and am noticing that append is a function value, while insert and change are action values. Does it matter what kind of value a function is?
 
It doesn't matter as long as you don't need to distinguish them in your code (e.g. for reflective needs).
 
KK.
@DocKimbel Only read about reflection once or twice, got no idea what it is. Hopefully, I will need to use it someday, and then I will get it :-)
 
Reflection: it's part of the metaprogramming side, you can leave that to later once you master the basics. ;-)
 
4:59 PM
If there isn't one already, I'd encourage something like this to inspire interest in Rebol.
 
 
1 hour later…
6:03 PM
@GrahamChiu It's very cool... it's like those panoramic photo stitching algorithms... 'cept you can drop a unit into a few places in a building and then play Quake in it...
(I assume everyone has figured out that you can click on the little reply arrow and get to the message someone is replying to...)
KKs question would have made a good actual question, I think it's time for him to start asking there instead of chat.
@KK. Take note of what I said there ---^
 
hi there :)
 
Speaking of evolution, I think I've found the new organizers for the C/C++ group, next meeting I'm going to have them run and I'll just keep quiet.
@KamilTomšík Hey how's it going?
 
6:19 PM
hehe, I'm working on syntax highlighter - never done such thing before, so I'm quite excited :)
 
@KamilTomšík What platform and what are you trying to highlight?
 
and I've also wondered how it could look like in rebol, since its not regular parsing (highligting has to work even on unterminated expressions and even in a totally crippled input)
@HostileFork no specific platform, but probably PHP since its most complicated I could imagine
 
@KamilTomšík @rgchris is kind of the master of syntax highlighting around here, not only did he write the thing to query the answers on stackoverflow to questions tagged Rebol (they don't offer this as a default feed) but he also wrote the highlighter he used to share the source code: reb4.me/r3/altxml
I think his highlighter is great.
Hello @Ellipsis ... I see you have just enough points to chat! 20 is the magic number... check out our FAQ to know a bit about us and also how to set your avatar to something other than a weirdo pattern. :-)
 
@HostileFork thank you! do you think it could highlight even incomplete xml?
 
@KamilTomšík There is a person to talk about that code with and he is... apparently asleep or something. :-) But he'll be back.
@rgchris ---^
 
6:25 PM
I'm quite new to rebol, so I am not really sure if we want to disturb him :)
 
@KamilTomšík We're addicts here, it's like a drug addiction or virus, we always want to talk about it.
 
however it looks like parser, not that it couldnt be used for highlighting but it could be unnecessary slow.
 
@KamilTomšík The amazing thing about Rebol parse is in fact how fast it is, because it's hand-optimized C inside...
5
Q: What's the fastest/most efficient way to count lines in Rebol?

rgchrisGiven a string string, what is the fastest/most-efficient way to count lines therein? Will accept best answers for any flavour of Rebol. I've been working under the assumption that the parse [some [thru]] combination was the fastest way to traverse a string, but then I don't know that for certain...

 
@HostileFork hehe, but that doesnt mean I should parse whole file every time the one character was changed :)
 
So interestingly you can use parse code on like 4mb files on disk and it will finish in a tenth of a second for tasks like that.
@KamilTomšík You have to always test when it comes to performance, your intuition might be wrong. have you used repl.it ?
 
6:30 PM
@HostileFork yeap, we can agree on that, however I am not going to do that :) if I change one character, and language is (usually) left-to-right, theres no need to re-parse everything
@HostileFork no I havent, looks interesting! :)
 
@KamilTomšík If you see what they did there, it's kind of mind blowing. They used Clang (as opposed to GCC) to compile the interpreters for popular languages, then someone made a LLVM backend to... Javascript. You're running interpreters written in C in your browser. Write an infinite loop in said interpreter? You just hang your own browser. :-)
 
@HostileFork yep, looks pretty badass :)
 
@KamilTomšík The progress bar you get when you pick a language is downloading the executable of compiled C code for popular interpreters... on a JavaScript VM. We are going to do this for Rebol too.
 
that reminded me bellard.org/jslinux
@HostileFork well, thumbs up!
 
@KamilTomšík Remember, if we look all scattered and like chickens with our heads cut off... we only got the source in December. Give us a second. :-)
I think having automated build and test for three platforms is pretty darn impressive, thanks to @earl : rebolsource.net
And it's only mid-February
 
6:36 PM
impressive :)
 
Imagine what we'll have done by June! :-)
@KamilTomšík I got invited by one of our influential local hacker groups to give a talk in March on Rebol, they wouldn't have invited me if it were closed-source...they might not have invited me had it been GPL either...there's an anti-GPL sentiment right now.
 
@HostileFork well, I dont like GPL either, however I can respect that
 
I'm one of the "Stallman is right!" people but it looks like, for now, the short-term reality is GPL is not popular.
I argued for Rebol being GPL3 and was shot down, hence Apache 2.
@KamilTomšík One of the Apache people, Larry Rosen, actually was probably the main person who made the license go the way it did. He's pretty sharp, so I guess I'll defer to his more realistic while perhaps less idealistic vision.
Hello @Lele, I see you have enough reputation to chat. How's your day?
 
@HostileFork I personally do not see anything bad on closed-source or either commercal (but open-source), its the author's decision
but I also think BSD is better than GPL
 
@KamilTomšík You're one of those "free will is good" people, aren't you?
 
6:46 PM
@HostileFork not sure what you mean :) but if there is good sw, runs fast, is easy to use, I'm okay with paying for it
 
@KamilTomšík Edited for context, it's perhaps a little idiomatic.
The idea that it's best if people are allowed to make their own choices vs. being told what is right and wrong.
I'm an engineer so when things don't work my reflex is: "no, you shouldn't be allowed to do something that won't work"
@KamilTomšík While chatting abstractly is fun, I will say that even more fun is Rebol programming. Got any questions related to that? Want to be shown fun stuff?
 
@HostileFork just playing with that load-xml
load-xml "<ab><c>some text</c></ab>"
== [
<ab>> none
]
not sure if it works :)
 
@KamilTomšík Wish @rgchris was here to tell you what was up. I didn't look at it.
But try this: code: [<ab><c>"Some Text"</c></ab>]
 
@KamilTomšík are you using the Rebol 3 version of altxml?
 
6:56 PM
I just tried your xml with that and I got the following:
 
oooooh
no im not :-)
 
`>> load-xml "<ab><c>some text</c></ab>"
== [
<ab> [
<c> "some text"
]
]`
 
@KamilTomšík Still, do try my example. :-) It demonstrates a different point...
 
i did
 
6:58 PM
@KamilTomšík Then length? code And type? first code
 
@HostileFork yep, nice :)
 
@KamilTomšík It's kind of like you can write type? http://hostilefork.com or how about to string! read http://hostilefork.com
 
>> load-xml "hello <a b='c'>D</a"
== []
I want to highlight even incorrect input
so this might be a dead end for now...
 
@KamilTomšík I wouldn't jump to conclusions, @rgchris is clever.
 
thx anyway, I'll study that parser :)
 
7:02 PM
@KamilTomšík - look back over the chat transcript for last night
the subject of malformed content came up
 
@HostileFork I'm quite sure he is, but I really think highlighting is a different problem
 
@KamilTomšík Yes, but that doesn't mean Rebol parse cannot be applied.
 
Gabriele has a tolerant parser that is part of his Power Mezz tools, but I think at this point it's for Rebol 2 only.
 
@KamilTomšík Rebol 3's parse has new power user features, is cleaned up, and perhaps most importantly Rebol 3 is Unicode.
 
11 hours ago, by rgchris
It's not tolerant at all.
 
7:04 PM
@HostileFork yeah, I do like a lot!
@Adrian hmmm, thank you!
 
@KamilTomšík You can look at what has historically passed for documentation (cough) in the Rebol world here: Parse Project. The main organizer of that is here, sometimes: @BrianH
@KamilTomšík Remember that parse is general purpose. So parse "aaabb" [some "a" 2 "b"] matches some (non-zero) number of a's, then precisely two b's. If it reaches the end of the input successfully, you get true. That's why parse "aaabbb" [some "a" 2 "b"] returns false...
But on the general purpose note, it doesn't have to be textual. parse [apple apple apple banana banana] [some 'apple 2 'banana] for instance, it's the same logic.
And if you want zero or more (instead of one or more) then instead of some you use the word any. That document opens doors to all the power and flexibility of the dialect.
 
I saw that in docs.
its very powerful
anyway, I'll give it a try later, I'm probably done for today :-/
 
@KamilTomšík It's also optimized C, and symbolic. So that parse [apple apple ...] stuff isn't doing string comparisons, just pointer comparisons. Fast.
 
:-)
gtg, thx!
 
@KamilTomšík Appreciate you coming back, hope you return and eventually you'll appreciate that we kept you coming back, because you won't want to go back :-)
And we gotta finish this language.
5
A: What is the 'reword' function in Rebol and how do I use it?

BrianHHere there be dragons! The reword function is a bit of an experiment to add shell-style string interpolation to Rebol in a way that works with the way we do things. Unlike a lot of Rebol's series functions, it really is optimized for working on just string types, and the design reflects that. Th...

That did come out very interesting. Good call, @Adrian
 
7:26 PM
A pretty neat function, I agree.
 
I figured out how to add case-sensitivity and trailing delimiters to reword, so once those are done I think that we can declare this experiment a success. Then, it can be my first attempt at a complex from-scratch native :)
 
@BrianH Once you finish fixing the Unicode comparison bug, you mean...
 
@HostileFork of course. Priorities. Still, it's good that I have a method waiting for me when the task comes up.
 
@BrianH I had an impressive amount of Rebol interest last night with my group, I took the laptop and pitched it...people were really interested.
Would be great to get some more C/C++ coders involved
 
I had to brush up on my C, actually. Hadn't needed to use it in a long time.
 
7:36 PM
Getting kids off PHP and JavaScript is always a good feeling, but, it will be a long time before they could contribute to the interpreter itself.
Need some more open-minded 40 year old hackers who can crack open a GDB session and not blink.
I might be able to get a couple more of those.
 
Never needed to use GDB before. The last time I had to debug other people's C code was before GDB existed, when I was the one who ported Little Smalltalk to DOS so I could use my local machine for one of my beginner's programming classes. For my own code I just never made those kinds of bugs. And lately I seem to use VC more for debugging, since I mostly have to do Windows builds.
 
@BrianH MS still makes the best dev tools in the business. Sad fact.
My financials involve betting against them. But they could make a comeback.
 
@HostileFork not sad, when you consider who they had to hire to do so, and that they had to pay around $112 million in a court settlement to even be allowed to hire those people. MS may be bad on many levels, but their dev tools group is extremely competent and even morally upstanding.
 
Speaking of which: 1 out of 10 for Surface pro fixability. Guess they really did learn from Apple.
"I have seen the future, and it is glue."
 
7:54 PM
Those fixability ratings for the thin-and-light stuff is more of a rating of the lack of ability of the people doing the testing to fix stuff. To make those kinds of things small, sturdy and leave enough room for batteries, they just have to use glue sometimes. The only time I thought that was a legit criticism was for the new iMac, which actually lost features in order to become thinner for no damn reason.
 
@BrianH You don't look at your iMac from the side? Hm. I always thought it was way too fat.
It was blocking my view of the wall.
 
My iMac is a G5 :) Oh, the new iMac isn't actually much thinner, it just has a thinner edge for no good reason at all. It bulges in the back. And the thinner edge loses the optical drive, and makes it harder to repair, but isn't necessary to make it lighter because it sits on a desk and runs plugged into the mains. It's just dumb.
 
@HostileFork there's no excuse for this. It's like they're shouting "screw the environment".
But the problem is that it's "driven" by the consumer.
 
@Adrian Evil people all over. Fear Factory - Daily Show
 
8:12 PM
I suppose over-density leads to this. You get disposable products, disposable people.
 
8:23 PM
@Adrian I don't think it's a fait accompli. This stuff will change, it has to.
 
Yeah, but it might only come after a shock to the system. Don't know if that's something to look forward to.
 
@Adrian I worry some, and I don't worry some. Rebol and Red are probably good things either way.
I'd be more worried if I had kids, but I don't, so I just kind of worry more abstractly.
 
 
2 hours later…
10:55 PM
0
A: What's the fastest/most efficient way to count lines in Rebol?

rebolekWith parse: i: 1 ; add one as TextMate parse text [ any [ newline (++i) | skip ] ] print i

 
11:17 PM
Another +1 to this answer will enable @rebolek to join us...
@KamilTomšík I'm not certain how this happened—which script did you do, and which interpreter did you use?
There's two versions: AltXML for Rebol 2 and AltXML for Rebol 3.
Ok, @rebolek—you're on!
 
@rgchris done. @rebolek your answer could use a little editing to make it better, but it will probably be the best approach once it's done.
 
@BrianH Excellent. For some reason, the addition of ++ passed me by...
That's why you ask questions :)
 
@rgchris Yeah, we added that one back in 2008. I backported it to R2 as well.
 
Yey for backporting. (especially the *-of functions—just need to start using them!)
Just goes to show how closely I pay attention to changelogs though, for shame.
 

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