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1:27 PM
so good news and bad news
good news is we got and installed the cpu
bad news is we are still getting lockups
so we ordered a new motherboard. I guess we'll have to keep going down the "most likely to be broken" part list until we fix it
 
 
5 hours later…
6:04 PM
@TinyGiant Did you try removing the AC and pressing the power button for a while? On all the laptops I've had, it would result in a reset of the BIOS circuits (it did not reset to default the settings in the CMOS, just returned the BIOS to a good state).
 
@TinyGiant, got a reply from my friend, might be migrating this conversation to the testing facility
 
user4639281
@gunr2171 Sounds good
 
3 messages moved from SO Close Vote Reviewers
message from my friend:
> Ask him if it hangs on grub or bios (before even attempted to boot off the drive) and if so, if he's tried another bootloader such as syslinux
 
@TinyGiant I'm not sure how long you need to hold it. On my current laptop it is clear when it takes effect because the laptop powers up, and then it will power down again once the button press has done its work. I'd google with the laptop model and see what people say.
 
user4639281
It won't boot past the BIOS, unless I do the trick with the BIOS settings.
 
6:06 PM
@gunr2171 Oh, the conversation has been moved here?
 
@Louis just to keep it from flooding
 
user4639281
Then sometimes, depending on the circumstances around the crash, it will break grub as well.
 
user4639281
I have not tried another bootloader, but I was under the impression that grub was the only one that could handle UEFI
 
@gunr2171 My last message in the SOCVR room needs moving too. (I guess I cannot move it myself....)
 
Hmm, are you using GPT or MBR for your partition table?
 
user4639281
6:09 PM
mbr
 
1 message moved from SO Close Vote Reviewers
@Louis done. and only room owners can move messages away
 
user4639281
I think, I can't remember. Pretty sure it was grub's default
 
I don't have too much knowledge about UEFI and MBR but the firmware on the laptop might be having problems with it
Although, I guess asking you to try GPT would be a pain if you're already set up
 
user4639281
How can I tell if I'm using GPT or MBR?
 
GPT will have a small FAT32 partition as the first one for UEFI, also I think fdisk and gdisk will tell you (if you have one of them installed)
(so fdisk /dev/sdX where X is the hard drive number
)
gparted will probably tell you too
 
user4639281
6:18 PM
Well I install grub directly to /dev/sda would that not mean that it is on the MBR?
 
Yeah, it should have installed MBR then
Also, I'm pretty sure fedora would have formatted it as MBR
Is this a completely new install or is the problem new?
 
user4639281
No, I've been dealing with it for over a year, since fedora 20
 
user4639281
Debian had no problem mind you
 
huh, that's odd... Does the laptop support booting with BIOS rather than UEFI?
 
user4639281
Yeah, realized that recently.
 
user4639281
6:22 PM
But I don't really want to reinstall the system
 
Does it have the same problem when not using UEFI then? The laptop could have an incomplete UEFI implementation. You should only need to install your bootloader again to change to booting with straight BIOS
 
user4639281
Oh ok
 
user4639281
Hmmm, I can try it. So I would just need to change to CSM boot, then boot up the live system and reinstall the bootloader?
 
Yep, pretty much
If you ever reinstall the OS again and what to use UEFI, I'd say go with GPT because it's part of the UEFI spec and will probably work
 
user4639281
Ahhh ok
 
user4639281
6:25 PM
Alright, I'll try that and ping you here when it's done. Are you gunr's linux friend?
 
yep
 
Yep :)
 
user4639281
Lol awesome, back in a bit
 
thanks linden
 
Hey it's not over yet, it could still not work after he changes it over if it was another problem
 
6:26 PM
@Lindenk sounds like nagato
 
I know right...
 
JAL
Hey Linden, you joining us for TF2 tonight?
 
user4639281
Wouldn't boot the live system in CSM mode
 
Sure! I usually get back around 6:30 or so, so I might be a little late
 
user4639281
It just kept telling me to insert a bootable device
 
6:34 PM
Huh, what live image are you using?
 
user4639281
Fedora 23 workstation on a usb
 
user4639281
Maybe it would have to be on a cd?
 
It might be setup to only boot with UEFI
 
user4639281
The usb?
 
well that image of fadora
 
user4639281
6:36 PM
I don't think so... hold on I'll check it out
 
Oh, also have you tried just booting to your existing system in CSM?
 
user4639281
Yeah, it gives me the same screen
 
Hmm...
 
user4639281
Fedora-Live-Workstation-x86_64-23-10.iso
 
user4639281
That's the name of the ISO, so I can't see it being set up for UEFI.
 
user4639281
6:40 PM
It is weird that it won't boot it in CSM mode, though it could be an issue with USB in CSM mode
 
It looks like grub is usually installed to boot in either BIOS or UEFI. Yeah, that could also be the reason it isn't booting the usb
 
user4639281
I don't have any blank cd's though
 
Well, you should be able to load the usb in UEFI
Then install the bootloader, then switch it back to CSM after
 
user4639281
I can in UEFI, but then how do I install the bootloader as CSM?
 
How are you installing the bootloader?
At least with command line grub, you should be able to specify if it writes to the MBR or sets up EFI for UEFI
 
user4639281
6:43 PM
su -
cd /mnt
mount /dev/fedora/root ./
mount /dev/fedora/home home/
mount -t proc proc proc/
mount --rbind /sys sys/
mount --rbind /dev dev/
mount --rbind /var/run/ var/run/
chroot /mnt/
mount -a
dhclient `/sbin/route -n | grep "^0.0.0.0" | rev | cut -d' ' -f1 | rev`
dnf -y update
dnf -y reinstall grub2 grub2-efi grub2-efi-modules shim
grub2-mkconfig -o /boot/grub2/grub.cfg
grub2-install /dev/sda
 
skip the line


`--target=i386-pc --grub-setup=/bin/true --debug /dev/sda`
opps
skip the line dnf -y reinstall grub2 grub2-efi grub2-efi-modules shim
 
OMG!!!
 
and run grub2-install --target=i386-pc --grub-setup=/bin/true --debug /dev/sda`
 
What's happening here?
 
user4639281
I r fixin mah puter
 
6:47 PM
o wait wait dfn is the package manager herp derp
 
user4639281
yup, lol
 
user4639281
it isn't yum anymore
 
remove grub2-efi and grub2-efi-modules
 
user4639281
Too many people getting the munchies
 
I didn't relize that lol
 
user4639281
6:48 PM
K
 
user4639281
Shouldn't it be i686?
 
I'm pretty sure it's --target=i386-pc (because that's what the arch wiki says)
 
user4639281
ok
 
user4639281
I'm just wondering because it is a 64bit system
 
user4639281
Whoa, I wonder if shim has anything to do with the problem...
 
6:52 PM
good point, I would assume it's more that installing it as 32-bit should still work. It might, I've never heard of shim 0.o
 
user4639281
It's a fedora thing, that would explain why debian didn't have an issue
 
user4639281
> Fedora uses a first-stage boot loader called shim which embeds a self-signed CA certificate. This CA is then used to verify the GRUB 2 boot loader (UEFI version, a PE/COFF program signed with AuthentiCode). Before booting a kernel, GRUB 2 calls back into shim to verify the AuthentiCode signature of the kernel.
 
user4639281
interesting
 
user4639281
Using efibootmgr it shows me a bunch of old stuff that shouldn't be there anymore
 
user4639281
Unfortunately it doesn't show me the versions, so I can't tell which ones to remove
 
user4639281
6:59 PM
It would be nice if I could find a log file for shim
 
All the old entries? Yeah, they should be harmless (although maybe a little annoying)
Well, you could try installing grub without it or the efi stuff. I would guess grub won't set up shim if it isn't installed
 
user4639281
Yeah... I'll try that and see. Back in a bit.
 
user4639281
7:12 PM
Ok, I'm in the live system
 
user4639281
installing a bunch of updates
 
Ok, so it looks like as long as you specify i386-pc or i686-pc as the target, it will install to the MBR rather than efi. For shim, I guess you could try with it and without it. It's probably loaded by grub when you install like osprobe does
 
user4639281
ok
 
user4639281
This is the command set I'm using
 
Looks good to me
the --debug isn't really necessary, but it gives you some more info about what it's doing
 
user4639281
7:19 PM
yeah
 
user4639281
 
user4639281
The only line that seems interesting is:
 
user4639281
grub2-install: info: NOT RUNNING: grub-bios-setup  --verbose     --directory='/boot/grub2/i386-pc' --device-map='/boot/grub2/device.map' '/dev/sda'.
 
user4639281
Should I be running that?
 
7:34 PM
Yeah, it should run that... Did it say why it didn't?
well....is the size of /boot/grub2/i396-pc bigger than the space at the beginning of your hard drive?
I'm pretty sure MBR always leaves room for the bootloader
 
user4639281
Shouldn't be, how can I tell?
 
I think gparted will tell you were the partitions line up
where*
 
user4639281
bash: grub-bios-setup: command not found...
 
user4639281
facepalm
 
oh
maybe it's a seperate package in fedora
 
user4639281
7:37 PM
[root@localhost /]# dnf search grub
Last metadata expiration check performed 0:58:37 ago on Tue Feb 23 10:38:39 2016.
================================================================= N/S Matched: grub ==================================================================
grub2-efi.x86_64 : GRUB for EFI systems.
grub2-tools.x86_64 : Support tools for GRUB.
ostree-grub2.x86_64 : GRUB2 integration for OSTree
grub-customizer.x86_64 : Graphical GRUB2 settings manager
grub2-starfield-theme.x86_64 : An example theme for GRUB.
 
I'm suprised it isn't installed with grub itself, even the fedora wiki seems to expect it to be included fedoraproject.org/wiki/GRUB_2
Looks like it's in grub2-tools
 
user4639281
wow totally missed that one
 
user4639281
Package grub2-tools-1:2.02-0.25.fc23.x86_64 is already installed, skipping.
 
0.o
oh
are you running it as root?
because it installs to sbin
 
user4639281
lol, it was grub2-bios-setup instead of grub-bios-setup
 
7:49 PM
-.- I hate those kinds of errors lol
 
user4639281
grub2-bios-setup: warning: this GPT partition label contains no BIOS Boot Partition; embedding won't be possible.
grub2-bios-setup: warning: Embedding is not possible.  GRUB can only be installed in this setup by using blocklists.  However, blocklists are UNRELIABLE and their use is discouraged..
grub2-bios-setup: error: will not proceed with blocklists.
 
...
wait wait
So you are using GPT?
 
user4639281
I didn't think so...
 
Well, run parted --list
 
user4639281
Disk /dev/sda: 465.8 GiB, 500107862016 bytes, 976773168 sectors
Units: sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 4096 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 4096 bytes / 4096 bytes
Disklabel type: gpt
Disk identifier: F04EBCA2-C953-4EA3-AF16-E011A7C7E61D

Device         Start       End   Sectors   Size Type
/dev/sda1       2048   1050623   1048576   512M EFI System
/dev/sda2    1050624 105908223 104857600    50G Linux filesystem
/dev/sda3  105908224 114063359   8155136   3.9G Linux swap
 
user4639281
7:53 PM
that was fdisk
 
user4639281
I should have checked earlier
 
Yep, that's gpt all right
 
user4639281
Shit so now I'm stuck with efi then aren't i?
 
Yeah....
Hmm, but then I'm suprised the laptop can't boot it
It's arch, but should still be relevant wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/GRUB#UEFI
 
user4639281
hrm, I'm going to reintall grub efi then I guess...
 
7:58 PM
You could still try it without shim
 
user4639281
I think shim is necessary for efi mode because of the whole microsoft key crap
 
Shim is for secure boot right? Can you disable secure boot?
 
user4639281
secure boot is disabled, but isn't it uefi that requires the key or just secure boot?
 
I have no idea. I've never needed to set up a certificate for gpt and uefi whenever I've done it
 
user4639281
hmm, I'll try it without shim
 
user4639281
8:11 PM
everything installed fine without shim
 
user4639281
rebooting
 
Good luck
 
stop flagging out of spite
@TinyGiant you've stepped on someones butthurt button. you've been flagged twice for silly messages
 
8:33 PM
any luck @TinyGiant?
 
user4639281
Well it won't boot without shim
 
user4639281
@rlemon Oh yeah, which ones?
 
ugh, can't remember the second one now. clearly they were just chosen at random
45 mins ago, by Tiny Giant
Shit so now I'm stuck with efi then aren't i?
but this was flagged
 
user4639281
Really?
 
yea people flag random crap out of spite sometimes
not sure what they expect to achieve
 
user4639281
8:41 PM
Were they both in here?
 
i believe so
 
user4639281
Weird, no one comes in here.
 
you can flag from the transcript iirc
 
user4639281
Which is funny because there are so many people in here currently
 
:/
broken system
 
8:43 PM
so if we flag more stuff, we can break it more, and 404 everything!
 
Yeah, we watch you
 
(that's a joke)
 
user4639281
I don't recall hurting anyone's butt recently...
 
meh
 
Think ... @TinyGiant .... Think ...
 
user4639281
8:45 PM
Lol, come on, I step on so many people toes, now I'm supposed to be able to recall them?
 
ask them to wear shoes first
 
user4639281
There we go, steel toed boots for all
 
user4639281
Anyways, I think shim is the problem with my boot. Now if only I could find some logs for it.
 
Does man shim give you anything?
 
user4639281
Yep, it gives me:
 
user4639281
8:50 PM
No manual entry for shim
 
lol, well it looks like there's only binaries in the package. Apparently there's also a shim-signed package, but I don't know if that would be any better
I don't think there can be a log for shim or grub actually, since they most likely never mounted a filesystem to write to
 
user4639281
Yeah, that's what I was thinking as well
 
user4639281
I'm going to see if I can get onto an IRC with these guys and figure something out.
 
well, there's probably something in the generated grub config
Yeah, I'm kind of stumped. #linux, #fedora or #grub might know
 
user4639281
 
Sam
9:03 PM
I need a test subject volunteer with 3K+ rep for a few secs.
 
@Sam Whats up
 
Sam
I just need you to review an item from the CVQ.
 
@Sam Not needing help eating waffles then
 
Sam
But give me a sec to fire up something...
 
@Sam let me know when you are ready
 
Sam
9:07 PM
@Jo7 ... no
@NathanOliver Ready
 
I did one. Need some more?
 
Sam
Thanks
Nah, that's fine. :)
 
user4639281
9:22 PM
Bah, to get on #fedora, you need to register with freenode, but freenode is down, so you cant register.
 

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