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2:00 PM
dd/mm/yyyy master race
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes glad you liked it :P
@AlexM. you are literally dateler
 
it goes from small to big
days < months < years
 
1 hour ago, by orlp
tar --help
 
@AlexM. I'm not starring that
 
yyyy? short lifed newblets :p
 
2:00 PM
@LightningRacisinObrit you know you want to
 
@AlexM. Big endian is totes lame
 
I propose yymdydyymyyyy
 
proposal accepted
motion carries
 
woo!
 
2:02 PM
I want ramen
but I know that if I go to the mall they're out of eggs again
 
VS2015: variadic templates still not up to par.
:<
 
@AlexM. your mall out of eggs?
 
@orlp no the ramen place is out of eggs
if I go to the mall today then I'll get there ~1 hour before closing
 
not sure if tea or coffee
 
and I can't eat my ramen without at least 2 eggs
 
2:04 PM
@AlexM. bring your own eggs?
 
Yeah, bring those balls
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes guess you won't be doing any Code Golf then
wow I scored a hole in one with that joke
inb4 no it was an own goal
 
that's not chocolate croissant!
 
@chmod711telkitty yes it is
don't be so close-minded and judgemental
not every chocolate croissant is born in the right body
cis-croissant scum
 
my eye stung because someone turned on the AC
fucking
 
2:08 PM
@AlexM. what does stung mean?
 
Thanks, google
 
so Norway wants to turn off FM radio
 
repost
 
I wonder when then Internet will get reasonable broadcasting capabilities
 
2:09 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Doesn't it already?
Things like Twitch, for example.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes buffering
Twitch only gets that way because they have broadcasting waypoints all over the place.
"edge servers" I think is what they call them.
 
Does that mean we only have reasonable broadcasting capabilities because we set up reasonable broadcasting capabilities?
 
bingo
and most mom-and-pop local radio stations don't have that kind of money
I can understand iHeartRadio affiliates in the US
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz I want to be able to broadcast packets over the internet.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes If there's a 100 people on one network watching twitch, they will open 100 connections
each of those connections will transmit almost the same data
 
2:12 PM
that's what "multicast" is about in ipv6
 
I learned about that term in the networking class
 
@FlorianMargaine what about auth, though? What if I need to authenticate for a stream?
 
I passed with 5/10, basically an expert
 
technically, ipv4 has multicast too, but only on private networks afaik
 
@FlorianMargaine that's what I thought
 
2:13 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Er, different level of abstraction o_O?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I'm just not sure how the thing is supposed to work
is the packet annotated with multiple IP addresses?
hmm nah that would be dumb. Could increase payload by kilobytes if there were many recipients
 
there's a broadcast address for IP4 on a subnet, if im not talking shite
 
yeah I'm not talking about subnets now
The scenario is: you want to stream a HD video to 100k people. How do you do it?
 
you mean in ip6?
 
user1804599
Tree structure.
 
2:17 PM
mhm
 
Use broadcast, recipients need to use private keys to unlock the stream?
 
@rightfold elaborate
 
I swear this place puts more effort into working out who should fix something than actually fixing something :(
 
user1804599
You stream to N computers, they all stream to M computers, they all stream to L computers, until you have enough capacity to serve 100k clients.
 
@chmod711telkitty so with 10 streams going on in a 100PC network, everyone is flooded with 10 full HD streams' packets?
 
2:18 PM
@BartekBanachewicz from multiple sources
 
@rightfold mmm so each of those has to be aware and set up as a streaming server
 
@BartekBanachewicz Only broadcast to the addresses which subscribed to the channel?
 
user1804599
The best way, though, is to outsource it to e.g. Ustream.
 
@BartekBanachewicz Er, how do you want to stream without streaming servers?
 
@BartekBanachewicz an IP packet has exactly one address as part of it's header, the content can off course contain more.
 
2:19 PM
@chmod711telkitty how do you "subscribe"?
@R.MartinhoFernandes Well I was thinking about some standarized infrastructure
 
user1804599
@BartekBanachewicz Also more fault-tolerant!
 
@BartekBanachewicz ... ie a bit torrent client...
 
so that spotify, twitch, whatever don't all have to set up their servers
 
user1804599
Spotify was P2P last time I checked.
 
@thecoshman that's P2P, it's a different thing
@rightfold hmm
 
user1804599
2:20 PM
Partially, at least.
 
it all sounds a bit messy
 
@rightfold The streaming or just the download for offline mode?
 
@BartekBanachewicz Register with request to the broadcaster, then the broadcaster send streams only to those IP addresses?
 
@BartekBanachewicz oh, well that's a different problem. Easier solved by having local mirrors/buffers/proxies
 
user1804599
Oh, no idea. Something was P2P. :P
 
2:21 PM
@BartekBanachewicz You mean like a generic streaming service?
 
@BartekBanachewicz it probably is
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes mhm
ideally I'd see it as a part of standarized internet
 
Er, who the fuck pays for that?
 
@BartekBanachewicz not hugely... only with torrents data flows in a 'random' direction
 
one FM radio can broadcast to basically unlimited number of people
@thecoshman yeah well and the point is that in streaming you mostly want to just listen, i.e. one-way
 
2:22 PM
Don't forget, streaming over HTTP is not what HTTP was originally designed for, it was meant to be "get one thing, hang up"
 
@BartekBanachewicz No, it cannot. It is limited by range.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes still, you can place hundreds of thousands of receivers in that range
 
@BartekBanachewicz yeah, it is up to providers to provide the infrastructure to distribute the load for the streaming.
 
with a relatively inexpensive radio station
to stream to hundreds of thousands of people you need shitload of money for internet infrastructure
 
2:24 PM
In telecommunications and computer networks, multiplexing (sometimes contracted to muxing) is a method by which multiple analog message signals or digital data streams are combined into one signal over a shared medium. The aim is to share an expensive resource. For example, in telecommunications, several telephone calls may be carried using one wire. Multiplexing originated in telegraphy in the 1870s, and is now widely applied in communications. In telephony, George Owen Squier is credited with the development of telephone carrier multiplexing in 1910. The multiplexed signal is transmitted over...
 
@BartekBanachewicz but if you 'stream' over a given Hz, you block out any one else from using the Hz. The internet effectively has only one Hz, so we take turns.
 
most of those being basically overprices signal repeaters
 
Frequency-division multiplexing is similar to radio frequencies
each channel is sent over a different frequency
 
Source-specific multicast (SSM) is a method of delivering multicast packets in which the only packets that are delivered to a receiver are those originating from a specific source address requested by the receiver. By so limiting the source, SSM reduces demands on the network and improves security. SSM requires that the receiver specify the source address and explicitly excludes the use of the (*,G) join for all multicast groups in RFC 3376, which is possible only in IPv4's IGMPv3 and IPv6's MLDv2. Source-specific multicast is best understood in contrast to any-source multicast (ASM). In the ASM...
I suppose this is relevant
 
@BartekBanachewicz No, you don't.
Not if you stick to the same parameters of your FM radio example.
You're comparing apples to oranges.
 
2:27 PM
IP multicast is a method of sending Internet Protocol (IP) datagrams to a group of interested receivers in a single transmission. It is often employed for streaming media applications on the Internet and private networks. The method is the IP-specific version of the general concept of multicast networking. It uses specially reserved multicast address blocks in IPv4 and IPv6. In IPv6, IP multicast addressing replaces broadcast addressing as implemented in IPv4. IP multicast is described in RFC 1112. IP multicast was first standardized in 1986. Its specifications have been augmented in RFC 4604 to...
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes The range, however, can be large enough that the limit is still equal to (or theoretically greater than) the number of people on earth.
 
@JerryCoffin give me a screen large enough, and I can stream to the world with ease vOv
though xkcd comes to mind...
 
> You put packets in at one end, and the network conspires to deliver them to anyone who asks
hmm
 
it's a conspiracy!
 
@BartekBanachewicz hmm... that sounds like it would not solve the problem...
 
2:29 PM
@chmod711telkitty can't use asymmetric encryption (rather not feasible) for stream encryption - would also imply n - number of streams for n subscribers
 
@thecoshman Why not? It just leaves the details to magic.
 
@Nisk "unlock" might well mean "obtain the current key"
 
(It's a description of a goal, not of a solution)
 
thought with a streaming cipher it might be impossible to join in later
once the transmission starts you might need the previous data to compute the next key if I understand the idea right
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes oh, I've already defined the magic protocol, it magically does everything you want perfectly
 
2:32 PM
@BartekBanachewicz might - but wasn't specific.
@BartekBanachewicz depends on cipher mode
or encryption mode if you will
 
@Xeo can you use arbitrary libraries with UE4?
 
@Nisk see message above
 
I mean can you do something like linking with Boost?
 
Oh well. I was too late with my troll answer stackoverflow.com/a/29800826/85371
 
@BartekBanachewicz what? see the arrow
 
2:34 PM
@BartekBanachewicz Yes, sort of--but quite a few will allow you to pick up a message in the middle or re-synchronize as long as you know exactly what point in the message you're starting from.
@Nisk The usual modes (OFB, CFB, CBC, etc.) are mostly ways of getting block ciphers to act (at least roughly) like stream ciphers. If you're starting with a stream cipher, most of them don't apply at all.
 
so basically if the stream isn't public you have to request the key, then subscribe to the broadcast
you can subscribe anyway but you'll get garbage
 
@JerryCoffin touche.
@BartekBanachewicz shouldn't be able to subscribe without the key, otherwise you can probably do DoS
 
@BartekBanachewicz ...if all you do is send a raw encrypted stream. If you want to, however, it's entirely possible to (for example) encode the stream as a number of blocks, so periodically there's a synch packet of some sort that a user can identify, and know what key to start using from that point. Send one of these every, say, 10 seconds, and a user can start receiving from nearly any point with minimal delay to get synched up.
 
> The default mode for C is now -std=gnu11 instead of -std=gnu89.
Wow.
 
2:48 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes 1 down, 1 to go (before C is universally a 21st century language).
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes cooool
 
> template<template<typename> typename X> struct D; // OK
Yeah
A bit of consistency for C++ too
 
wow.
This is gonna change a few things for some people
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes You don't like it?
 
2:52 PM
No, it reads horribly.
 
ow :(
Well, what I like is that you have the choice
now there's one fewer exception to the rule
 
As if template and typename weren't visually similar already, now you can add more confusion!
 
just don't upgrade your GCC & you should be fine?
 
@AndyProwl There was never an exception here.
The syntax for a template template parameter is template<typename> class. No exceptions.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Why not? typename and class are interchangeable for declaring type parameters, but not when you're declaring the type parameter of a template parameter
 
2:54 PM
@AndyProwl Er, no, that's a lie.
 
Ah, wait, yeah that's a lie
I shall rephrase that
 
It's only the class at the end, which is of a different nature.
 
Yeah
 
(Honestly, I'd rather it just not be there)
 
Ven
@sehe That was a pretty amazing answer
 
2:55 PM
But I like how typename and class are now fully interchangeable
 
@AndyProwl They are not!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes In that context
 
Exceptions!
Booo
 
there are less rules to remember about the contexts in which they are interchangeable when declaring a template
 
2:56 PM
someone pin the 5.1 plz
 
Now you know that in a template parameter list's declaration when you can use class you can use typename and vice versa
 
lol
It's C++; what did you expect?
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes But this does not make typename bad
 
lol relevant and just posted
0
Q: How to create a compile time constant instance of a structure in C++11

martin sIn my current project I am trying to create a compile time const static instance of a structure with c++11. My code compiles and works fine in clang (Apple LLVM version 6.1.0) but it does not work with g++ (GCC) 4.8.3. GCC throws the error that the parameter was not declared 'constexpr'. Is ther...

 
2:58 PM
> organic rapeseed accounts for less than one per cent of the crops grown in the region. Canola is now king.
 
@AndyProwl Yes, it does. These kinds of minimal changes cost way too much time if you do them one at a time.
 
> Full support for Cilk Plus has been added to the GCC compiler. Cilk Plus is an extension to the C and C++ languages to support data and task parallelism.
wooooo
this is interesting
 
Uhhh, "Canola" is the market name for a strain of rape plant used to make canola oil.
 
That is especially important now that the committee gets so many proposals.
They should do like Java and make a "Project Coin".
Shove all small thingies in there and fix them all at once, with minimal bureaucratic overhead.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't understand what you mean. The fact that you cannot use struct does not mean that making the rules for class/typename interchangeability simpler is a bad thing
 

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