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12:06 AM
@ReedCopsey you around?
 
yes
 
if you have 5 minutes or so to look at something, mind if I ping you on gchat?
 
Ugh, pet adoption agencies are so hippy
 
sre
 
@RyanTernier yeah, they can be. What did you run into?
@ReedCopsey I volunteered to be the Android point man for a Hackathon here on Friday, so they asked me to write up that doc to get people started
 
12:24 AM
:)
 
12:38 AM
@CharlieBrown - Finally was able to get that cleaned up. Realized another issue along the way. My directive was using the attribute source which kendo apparently reserves for use strictly as a Data Source. It's been causing all sorts of weird issues I couldn't quite nail down. Thanks for your help.
 
All that and I got the message to bind cleanly.
It was a good day haha.
 
1:10 AM
anybody here familiar with unit testing code with EF?
 
DI, mock our your repository
 
but what if I'm not using a repository but rather using EF code in my business code?
 
then you should refactor
because thats not only a pain in the ass to unit test, but its completely unmaintainable
you can 'hack' it together, and hope it works, in a very fragile way by adding records to the db during the unit tests initialization, then remove them after they run, but thats really shitty, and i don't recommend that
at all
don't do it
i regret mentioning it
 
hah I already thought about it being a pain to unit test, but I decided to try not having a repository layer based on some people arguing that EF itself is the repository layer
lol, I don't think I want to try doing that
 
no, you should still have repositories
because what if you want to change ORMs? you now have ALLLLL of that framework specific code sprinkled throughout your entire code-base
 
1:16 AM
yeah it's a valid point
 
or if you updated EF to a new version (like from 4 to 6), and they change method names? (they did)
 
@Steve DB unit tests like that can be useful. Albeit not in an EF context
but unit testing my Dapper queries saved me a lot of heartache when I had to update them
 
ah, didn't know that, we do it sometimes for integration tests, but even then i wasn't sure if that was the best practice
 
Note: We comment those tests out for our build server
but having them and running them when making changes to the persistence layer is awesome
of course, I mock that class out for everything else
And I run it against its own database
so as not to break my production-testing one :)
 
:)
i'm still half noobish, only been doing this full time for a year :p
 
1:20 AM
Ef, unit testing? ask away
ive been doing ef since 1.0
@AndrewKim EF itself is the repository layer, so yes, best not to duplicate it. Then you can mock it quite easily
 
:?
 
Yeah, that statement didn't sound right to me either
 
I've thought about mocking it, but does it get a bit more complicated when dealing with async queries?
 
must be a matter of preference, i've heard people argue the opposite
pro mvc by apress uses EF + repositories
 
not really, its about the same. would you like an example?
 
1:25 AM
i think lol
 
I guess sure
 
people who want repos actually want a service layer, they just dont know it
 
@CharlieBrown How would you mock EF?
 
Ef provides native interfaces for it, but I prefer to build my own interface
 
So do you just build a small wrapper around the generated context?
 
1:28 AM
IDbContext and IDbSet are provided in EF6. To see how I do it instead, you can see my linke above
 
Ah that's interesting
 
In either case, you would normally use Moq or some mocking framework
 
msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/data/dn314429.aspx I tried learning from this article, which recommended to simply mock the class (without interface)
 
but, you could build a wrapper too, which is easy
 
So whats the deal with asynchronous programming?
 
1:29 AM
I build mine like I do, b/c I dont always use EF as the ORM, sometimes I use dapper, sometimes mongodb
 
that actually solves the issue of changing the orm, huh
 
i have an example of taht too
 
Where are your interfaces? I don't see IUCareDataContext anywhere
 
@Tokencodingnewbie Care to be more specific?
 
1:32 AM
@BradleyDotNET I dunno it somehow got brought up while I was reading and I had no idea wtf any of it meant.
 
Well... its asynchronous
so it doesn't block the calling thread
 
@Tokencodingnewbie i wouldn't dig into it until you have more experience in C#, that hole goes deep
 
@CharlieBrown So do you do a lot of editing on the generated context file?
 
@BradleyDotNET code first only
i havent done anything but code first for at least 5 years
 
ah, that explains some of it
Yeah, you could definitely mock/test that code
harder when you do model-first :)
 
1:35 AM
rather sleep on forks than do db- or model-first
next version of EF is code first by default anyway, so peeps better get used to it
 
Guess I better learn it next time I use EF
 
everything will be CF, but they will still have generators available
 
1:50 AM
hi All
@CharlieBrown you are here tonight :) never seen you at this time here b4
good evening everyone
 
finishing up
 
:)
Hi @BradleyDotNET last night i told you i will publish something and get back to you . it took me 24 hours to figure it out
Gang, i need your opinion and fair assessment
 
Glad you got it done
 
i've been working on a project for a year now. it started as graduation project with 3 other guys , but after that i took over and was trying to expand it and commercialize it in the future (couple years from now) last few months i was able to get a client to test/use the app for a very low fee , the company owner is an
entrepreneur and promised to get more clients in the future. My problem is that i work on this project part time (after 5 and on weekend) and in order to take to the next level i need help. I was thinking of Github and make it public this way i can get someone (s) to help but not sure about this. i know it's risky and tough for anyone to spend days/months on a project without getting paid , but i guess it's the risk some people can/will take
here's the demo i published last night osboxdemo.sadellah.com
thoughts ?! feedback? advice?
the project still need a lot of things that's why i need help
 
its a decent start, but you need 3 devs total to finish it
 
2:02 AM
I see
what do you think of the github idea?
 
If you're trying to commercialize it, it will be hard to convince people to work on it for free.
 
thats how i do it, with a private repo
 
@KendallFrey i think the ultimate goal is to work with a team and set a business goal and be honest
i guess
i think the biggest challenge is to get someone interest
we all know most of the dev guys are busy
to get them to believe in th eproject is maybe the biggest challenge
 
I don't see what this offers that isn't already on the market
 
@CharlieBrown what would you put in the private depo?! Never done something like github before
 
2:05 AM
the codez
 
(aside from a yellow screen of death for not having control license for the dhtmlx scheduler component)
 
github is like any other source control
 
@TetsujinnoOni that's intentional :)
 
@CharlieBrown source control host, that is
github is not source control
 
yah yah
 
2:07 AM
@TetsujinnoOni I do have a client that i can engage and also potential clients for this specific app
@TetsujinnoOni i think if we believe that anything we want to do exists on the market already , there will be very few things that we can actually do
@TetsujinnoOni i will give you some examples for successful stories
check this out : login.xtensiahr.com
 
well, all that stuff exists on the market already, at least 20 times over
 
it's a basic timesheet system that i am sure 1000 timesheet exists already
 
probably more. im betting you have about 50 competitors
 
i know
 
yeah, and most of them suck. You should be able to elevator pitch me on what you bring to the market that those other 999 don't.
 
2:10 AM
@TetsujinnoOni Agreed
 
I don't hear an elevator pitch. If you can't elevator pitch me when I'm in a decent mood, you're not gonna interest me in contributing to your project on spec.
 
I use toggl.com for time tracking my consulting work
basecamp for projects, github for code & bug tracking
 
@TetsujinnoOni i am not trying to convince anyone here in this chat room . i am just seeking advice
basecamp is a successful one as well
 
that's my advice: know what makes your project different, interesting, and worth contributing to.
My point is that you didn't even HAVE an elevator pitch to explain the "why".
 
my first answer is "Simplicity"
 
2:13 AM
hipchat, flowdock, glip for chat depending on the team
 
a system that is very simple to use and does exactly what you expect it to do
take salesforce for instance and Sharepoint
do you believe any decent person can use those?
the end user should always be the focus. by the end of the day is not the developer who will be using the system
 
ah, you just gave me a weasel word. Yes, I believe any decent person can use those. I have just set my threshold for "decent" differently enough from yours that our conversation becomes.... sidetracked.
 
@TetsujinnoOni i apologize if i misunderstood you . and i totally respect and value your opinion/critic
Maybe it's just a dream that will come true .... maybe it's just waste of time who knows
 
oh, i've got a passion project / pet project. I've also got thumping noises downstairs that i need to go invetigate
 
LOL
what pet do you have
?
 
2:20 AM
seems to be a massive chunk of ice coming free from the roof. My landlady isn't home yet, her daughter is asleep and the babysitter is awake. All seems nominal.
 
Good luck buddy, we're expecting a snow storm tonight
we'll see
i need some wine . who wants a glass
??
I am hesitant about publishing the app on github publicly or not ???
doing that i will get someone to work on it (hopefully) but at the same time I will share it with everyone else
 
@CharlieBrown What's the best way to deal with virtual properties of EF models in the ctor?
I'm setting some of these properties as virtual to enable lazy loading
But having it virtual prevents it from being set in the ctor
 
2:45 AM
... if you're setting it in the ctor that also breaks lazy loading....
 
...huh. wait, what was I thinking
eek stupid moment
 
been there, done that, kicked self in the same place on the ankle when I finally realized.
 
3:33 AM
hi there
 
3:55 AM
hello
 
 
1 hour later…
5:21 AM
Hi guys ...
Morning
 
0
Q: How to clear datatable values when using two datatables?

Mohan LalI have two DataTables after passing query the second DataTable Shows the FirstDataTable values. Please find my code My connection class is public class Connection { conn = new SqlConnection(ConfigurationManager.ConnectionStrings["ApplicationServices"].ConnectionString); public SqlDataAdap...

please take a look on this question
 
morning!
 
@BenjaminDiele - Any idea man how can i call an aspect Conditionally
?
 
a what now how now?
 
?
 
5:26 AM
What is an "aspect"? And what do you mean with "conditionally"?
 
6:08 AM
@bhuvin: You using postsharp?
@BenjaminDiele: I think he means aspect, as in aspect oriented programming AOP
what he said
:)
 
The only AOP I know is Array Oriented Programming :D
haven't used the real AOP yet though
 
try postsharp, it's cool
cool
didnt know that :)
only AOP I've done is some simple postsharp stuff
procedural ftw
 
Alright, time to go to work. Today we have an "employee update" meeting, urgently scheduled. I'm curious what axe will fall.
 
Yea, I'm off too. Gotta get the kids out of bed first :p
 
gnight
 
6:14 AM
watch out for the bed bugs!
 
Sorry guys i was off to a meeting ... Yup using Postsharp
@ton.yeung : good night man
@BenjaminDiele - Best of luck man ...
@scheien - hows ya man?
 
7:02 AM
Im good mate
 
7:12 AM
@bhuvin: What did you mean about calling an aspect condtionally?
Not sure if there is anything built-in to check whether or not to execute code in the aspect, but you could parameters from config which you can check against in the aspect.
 
hi everyone :)
 
hi @Jase
 
@scheien how r u? are you busy at the moment?
 
scheien is always looking busy :D
 
Im good mate. Always busy, but what's up?
@BenjaminDiele: Don't tell them!
 
7:24 AM
haha
 
making some awesome screenshots for a customer, which is.. boring.
 
Well I just wrote some code but it's not working as expected. I was gonna see if I could post it and have you guys tell me what you think the code as it is written should do?
 
Depends on the amount of code :p
 
7 if you exclude single-character lines :)
            Bitmap bitmap = new Bitmap(10, 10);

            for (int i = 0; i < pin.Length; ++i)
            {
                int characterPosition = pin.IndexOf(pin[i]);

                bitmap.SetPixel(
                    characterPosition,
                    i,
                    Color.Tomato);
            }

            Graphics g = panel1.CreateGraphics();
            g.DrawImageUnscaled(bitmap, 0, 0);
So, the above code is going through a string, getting each char, oh crap. nevermind. I just realised what the problem was. Thanks guys!
 
Rubber duck debugging is an informal term used in software engineering for a method of debugging code. The name is a reference to a story in the book The Pragmatic Programmer in which a programmer would carry around a rubber duck and debug their code by forcing themselves to explain it, line-by-line, to the duck. Many other terms exist for this technique, often involving different inanimate objects. Many programmers have had the experience of explaining a programming problem to someone else, possibly even to someone who knows nothing about programming, and then hitting upon the solution in the...
2
 
7:31 AM
Scheien is the best rubber duck
 
@scheien looks effective :D :D :D
a litle retard though...
 
lmao
 
I was made aware of the name by @Pheonixblade9 some time ago, but I guess every developer have experienced the concept a few times without knowing that it even has a name.
 
@scheien Yeah, like most design patterns.
 
Indeed
and you go like "oh, so it has a name? awesome"
:)
 
7:39 AM
:D
 
7:57 AM
morning guys :D
 
8:11 AM
mornin' peeps
 
morning @Squiggle
 
aww yiss, brownie cake at work
 
ya git.
 
u jelly
 
did anyone of you had to put your neck on the line for some program you barley knew about? and how do you handled it?
 
8:15 AM
@SebastianL I'm doing that right now :(
I'm handling it with alcohol and sarcasm
A+++. Would recommend.
 
@BenjaminDiele i had to yesterday ... ^^
 
strictly keep myself away from such encounters
 
are you depressed yet sebastian?
 
@SebastianL: What do you mean by "put your neck on the line"?
 
@Rusty the one who should do this was ill and so i had no real choice ... .
 
8:17 AM
Did you choose to do it?
 
@scheien it ended in disaster and i knew it would before i started
@scheien nope, the boss decided
 
Did your boss assign that to you?
Was he aware of the consequence?
Well, shit happens :)
 
@scheien i told him that it would end like that
 
@SebastianL at my previous job I was contracted out to pick up the maintenance of 10 pieces of business-critical software at a large company after the previous development team left en masse.
 
@Squiggle my problem is i cant access all the code
 
8:20 AM
That sounds like a joyful task @Squiggle
 
@Squiggle because half of it got "outsourced"
 
@SebastianL aye, I've seen that before.
 
@Squiggle is this normal? does it happen regulary?
 
One old web project here has similar functionality to another older web project, so what they did was copy the old web binary to the /bin folder and use it as a library.
and then the old project was retired, and we no longer have the source for it.
 
@Squiggle sounds like fun. "There's a bug in the old project"
 
8:25 AM
My main complaint is when "clever" developers find a way to put business logic in the database.
"It's configurable!"
"No, it's undeployable. Well done."
 
You have those kinda people? Shiiit
 
I have a project like that. One assembly with some aspx markup files, which we don't have the sourcecode for.
Much fun
 
The inner-platform effect is the tendency of software architects to create a system so customizable as to become a replica, and often a poor replica, of the software development platform they are using. This is generally inefficient and such systems are often considered by William J. Brown et al. to be examples of an anti-pattern. == Examples == Examples are visible in plugin-based software such as some text editors and web browsers which often have people creating plugins that recreate software that would normally run on top of the operating system itself. The Firefox add-on mechanism has been...
this, too
 
Didn't know it had a name
 
That give me the creeps
 
8:29 AM
I've seen it in pretty much every place I've worked
but yeah - I was tasked to maintain one of the worst inner-platform monstrosities at this previous company.
one night they hit the Big Red Button because the data import process failed. I was in there at 6am wading through some of the ugliest code I've seen.
turned out it was doing some data transforms in-memory, and trying to DataTable.Fill() with >4GB data (in a 32bit application)
"Why aren't you using SSIS?"
"...what's SSIS?"
[facepalm]
 
I must say I don't know SSIS either. How do you learn stuff you don't know exists?
 
good question :)
 
@Squiggle: A former colleague of mine was tasked with a similar crappy application, with stuff going on everywhere.
 
@scheien : Actually this is situation :
I have my Software almost ready , but what i want is that there should be some way to Completely trace the Same properly; i.e. Which method was Executed after what with What Parameters , etc . Since my app communicates on network , with Custom Protocol, with different CRONs running in background; wont be known in case its facing issues with any particular Customer Machine. So currently m using Postsharp and learning through it to Write a Logger (Which works Only On Exceptions) & a Tracer Which Traces through the Whole App.
 
He rewrote it, from taking 6+ hours to 10mins
it ran every 6 hours, and as the amount of data became larger, it crash and burned hard. :p
after the rewrite it worked like a charm
 
8:43 AM
yeah
sounds about right :)
brb - reboot
 
The main problem was that the guy who initially wrote it, was an accountant with hobby programming skills
needless to say that when you CSV 1million rows, and sending it everywhere that shit hits the fan
 
@scheien lawl. he sent CSV over the network to communicate?
 
aye
 
But Now , since aspect works this way that It will insert IL while Compilation ; & then it will just keep on Instantiating the Aspect related code; but then this is what would slow down the App loads; so just finding the solution how to keep the Exception and the Tracer Mutually exclusive and Configurable ...
 
9:02 AM
Damnit, to start the trial for Pluralsight you need a credit card :(
 
@BenjaminDiele just use a prepaid credit card they cost 20$ a year
 
@SebastianL Well, I recently changed banks so I don't have my CC yet. Now I need to wait on the bank, and we all know how fast they work..
 
Quick check; there is no pre-made 'BeforeSave' method in EF?
 
Seems like it
>The SavingChanges event is raised before a SaveChanges operation is processed. Handle this event to implement custom business logic before changes are saved to the database.
 
Yeah that's essentially building it yourself. Thought so.
 
9:22 AM
@scheien 1,000,000 rows in a CSV? Well at least it wasn't an XML file...
.Net still doesn't come with a serial XML parser, does it?
 
hi ^_^
 
@Squiggle The only thing worse than XML and CSV in this Context i can imagine is using UDP :D
 
XML vs. CSV is like comparing apples to oranges
XML vs. UDP is like comparing apples to French
 
@Squiggle i am not comparing them ^^ (in that way)
 
@Squiggle: It was horrible, truly horrible.
 
9:30 AM
@Squiggle i am comparing them in terms of usability ^^
 
@scheien So are the French :D
 
even apples and french have something common, for example they are edible ^^
 
So we hate the french now?
 
@SebastianL They both stink after a week?
 
@BenjaminDiele another example :D
 
9:32 AM
Can't say I have anything against them though
 
Eh, good-natured humor between neigbouring countries
 
:p
 
Like in Belgium we laugh with the Dutch, and vice versa
 
@BenjaminDiele do the Belgians have a phrase like "It's all Greek to me" - i.e. I don't understand this at all
?
I know the French say it's all Spanish, and the Spanish say it's all Portugese...
 
@Squiggle Almost identically the same. Here it's "It's all Chinese to me"
 
9:34 AM
We dutch use Chinese instead of Greek, but same thing. Belgians are just poor knock offs from Dutch anyway, so I'll amuse they copied that too! @BenjaminDiele
See. Knock offs.
:P
 
@RoelvanUden And you guys can't make decent fries.
 
haha
:D
 
With your wooden forks and fries of 2 meters wide.
 
@BenjaminDiele Correct! Yay for vlaamse frieten!
 
You're a good guy!
Lose the accent and come on over :D
 
9:36 AM
Oh man I love the Belgium accent on cute girls. It's adorable.
For guys... not so much.
 
@RoelvanUden You wouldn't say that when you meet a girl from Ghent though. That accent is really off-putting for girls imho
 
like a girl from Birmingham, UK
 
@BenjaminDiele Hmm, not sure. I've mostly heard the accents from the Vlaamse regions. Those are really nice. Is from Ghent quite different, then?
 
@RoelvanUden Ghent is a "language island", or how do you say that in english.
@Squiggle Is that like the one from Misfits?
 
Pariah?
@BenjaminDiele ...perhaps? I don't watch Misfits. Does she sound slack-jawed and a bit 'backward'?
 
9:39 AM
@Squiggle Slow in the head, with an alcohol problem and 5 kids in tow.
@RoelvanUden Gents -> nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gents
 
Gentlemen
 
@BenjaminDiele Ahhh. Ok, I don't know that then. Perhaps good :D
 
@RoelvanUden Most important part of that page: "Drugekluut: saai nors iemand"
 
@BenjaminDiele change the language token of wikipedia and get so different results :D
 
@BenjaminDiele Where do you live?
 
9:46 AM
@SebastianL Article is only in dutch :(
@RoelvanUden I used to live in the only city in belgium: Ghent. Now I live 10km north of it
 
@BenjaminDiele lol aight.
 

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