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7:00 PM
@davidism must have missed the usb part in my aggressive scrolling...
however, my personal retina pro is still working great
 
The only reason I know this is because the Mac fans in the office were scrambling to convince IT to buy them right now.
 
so I don't have a reason to upgrade.
 
@idjaw more like U BS, amirite? *holds up palm*
 
haha
 
My main worry is about the touchbar having Linux support
 
7:03 PM
you mean the lack thereof?
 
I don't like the fact that the pro does not have standard USB....That rejects every standard peripheral
 
why should a new mac have linux support?
 
wtf
 
Hardware doesn't have Linux support as much as Linux supports hardware. I doubt there will be any open specifications for it, so it'll have to be reverse-engineered
 
if you want open, buy a non-mac?:P
 
7:06 PM
God, that Mac's horrible.
Kinda seals the deal about what my next machine is, then.
 
a mac?
 
DSM
[you know what, I don't want that neologism associated with my initials]
 
Macs have been perfectly fine* for Linux for years. I don't use them, but many love it for the quality of the hardware, ubiquity of adapters / plugs, etc.
 
ubiquity of adapters?
 
the retina pro I currently own seems to be one of the best pro devices Apple made recently
 
7:08 PM
As in, your house is full of them in order to be compliant with other systems?
 
No, as in everyone else has macs so they have the adapters or things already support them.
 
DSM
I liked Macs well enough back when the academic discount applied. Haven't missed them much since that ended, to be honest.
 
@AndrasDeak Definitely Not-A-Mac
 
Things can be de-facto standards even if they're not written down somewhere.
 
Note that I only have a distilled view of macs since I never cared too much. But my impression is that "ubiquity of plugs" is the exact opposite of a mac
Oh, VGA plug, no problem, let me find my adapter. Oh, HDMI? It's okay, I have this other adapter too...
(I know it's not called VGA, but I'm an animal)
 
7:10 PM
If your example includes VGA, then yes, you definitely have a distilled view. Or maybe my example is shaped by my college experience which has more recent projector plugs?
 
Highly possible:) HDMI is very rare here with projectors.....
 
My lenovo I used at the time had mini-displayport and mini-HDMI. People who had macs were the only reason I could use projectors. Yes, maybe that's my fault for getting that lenovo.
 
although I've been to Germany or UK where only VGA was available, so I wasn't sure if we were being underdeveloped
 
I disagree with the removal of a standard USB port on a high end device like the MacBook Pro
 
wait, which standard? ;)
I could even understand ditching some of those plugs, since they are bulky. But usb is flat, even the big one...
 
7:12 PM
the standard which doesn't require you to have to buy an adapter for the 99% of devices that still has a standard sized USB port to plug in to whatever device or adapter to charge it or transfer data
I can understand removing standard HDMI port...I never used it on my retina pro
display ports are fine
 
But things should be trying to move towards USB3 type C. A heavy mover like the MBP adopting it as the only option is a great way to force the industry's hand. That's what they mean by "courage".
 
wasn't courage the catch phrase for switching from standard jack to proprietary?
 
I don't disagree with that. It's just a shitty thing when it's out of the consumer's pocket to deal with it to try to push the industry to catch up, because now people are going to happily spend money on adapters until everyone else catches up and/or also start providing usbc cables. I don't see that happening over night.
 
I'm not against a usb that is rotationally invariant
I think Oneplus phones come with that too, now
 
neither am I. I think USB-C is faster than 3.0?
 
7:20 PM
is it a new standard inside too?
(would make sense)
 
I think next computer will be a razer blade, they have too many pretty colors
 
green USB?
it seems like a very liberal laptop
 
@AndrasDeak yeah I'm not going back to that "courage* bs from the headphone fiasco. eff that.
 
so rainbow rainbows are so great
 
I'm holding off on buying a new computer until the future gets here so I can have a holographic display a la Minority Report
 
7:26 PM
any minute now
 
Kevin, just get a Kinect and use your imagination.
 
If I can't overlay the 3d blueprint of the World's Fair with an atomic nucleus in real time using hand gestures interpreted by my robot butler, I'm not interested
 
(have I mentioned that the single greatest pet peeve of mine is the ubiquitous holographic displays in every sci-fi/action flick?)
 
That sounds like my single greatest pet peeve, which is when a computer screen in a movie projects its contents perfectly onto the face of the person looking at it
Not even mirrored or anything either
 
yup
 
7:28 PM
War Games would have been flawless if not for this
 
the problem with the ubiquity of those holographic displays is that laymen don't even realize how ridiculously impossible they are
they just expect it to be real sooner or later (but they know that some American labs already have it, obviously)
 
DSM
Aww, I was about to make a joke but @Ffisegydd made it before me. :-(
 
haha
 
From that history search, I see I've complained about War Games before. Everything old is new again.
 
I should edit that into wikipedia, there's even a source:P
I mean, the onion is the source
 
7:31 PM
It's the only news source I trust.
 
It's true. I always go there to fact check.
It's been working well for me
 
DSM
@Kevin: at least you're consistent! I was looking to see if I'd mentioned my old Macbook before and found out that I said I missed it once even though I don't miss it now. Antinostalgia, I guess..
 
it's as if your mind wasn't an uninterrupted stream of consciousness
 
wim
USB-C is a standard usb port
 
Apparently my memory is failing me because War Games would have been flawless if not for this and the highly improbable password cracking scene that I complained about months ago and then forgot about.
 
wim
7:41 PM
it's a shame the iPhone also doesn't use USB-C so that you could share chargers
 
@wim thank you!
seriously...it's yammin' ridiculous.
My usage of the term standard is more in terms of market-standard.
 
wim
they cannot use the old USB port because the plug is too big
I'm all for moving away from that
the rest of the world should move more quickly to USB-C , so good on apple for that
 
I just don't like the fact that in this whole transition the constant loser here is the consumer
 
Umm...isn't that the exact thing that drives these decisions?
Moar adapters, $$$
 
wim
Also, the old usb port are really annoying because they're not reversible -->
 
7:44 PM
spin-1/2 needs 720 degree rotation for identity
 
wim
I'm surprised the macbook still has the headphone jack
 
24 mins ago, by Andras Deak
I'm not against a usb that is rotationally invariant
and I know it's not invariant, I'm lying-to-children
 
wim
Making the plug reversible is such a freaking obvious thing to do that it should have been in the original USB spec tbh
 
or being lazy
 
wim
anyway, I'm about to order the 15"
 
7:46 PM
good for you :)
 
good luck
 
have fun with it
 
wim
I've waited a year for these freaking things to be upgraded
 
what are you upgrading from?
 
the previous pro?:P
 
wim
7:47 PM
I have a macbook 12" for play, but want a second one for work
the 12" thing is kind of underpowered
But I couldn't bear to buy a macbook pro because that thing was so long in the tooth
I think the touchbar seems cool, I see great potential use cases for that
 
I'm still pretty happy with mine. However, I understand as someone who is looking for a new laptop recently knowing they haven't been renewed in a little while, I wouldn't be so sure about purchasing one.
My retina pro is serving me well so I have no reason to upgrade. I haven't had any performance issues as of yet. So I'm glad that Im not in a situation where I need to upgrade. Because the current price hike in combination of having to spend more money on adapters does not make sense to me as a consumer
Maybe this is just because I'm in Canada, but the base 13" is 2299$. That's obscene
 
I'm tempted by an XPS 13
 
^^ yeah
 
Non-touch, shove Linux on it
 
When it comes time to upgrade, if the gap between usbc and 99% of the market is still not converging, I'd probably go the XPS/linux route
 
7:54 PM
@MartijnPieters I say go with it. Perhaps they know something you don't.
Course, I say 13, but if I get a 15 I can get a moderately decent gfx card in it
 
@RobertGrant Chrome won't let me :-( Now whom to believe, does Chrome know something I don't as well?
 
It knows you better than you do yourself :-)
Also, I finally got a new phone: OnePlus 3, thought it was worth a punt
Like it so far
 
Co-worker has that too, he loves it.
have you played around with the camera?
 
Not really, why?
I do like that it's dual-sim, so I can put my work sim in it as well and run data through that
 
Oh, just wanted to know if you were happy with it. I am extremely happy with the camera on the iphone 6
I have been toying getting an android device again, but I really want a camera that competes well
 
7:57 PM
Yeah it seems good to me
 
I don't always have my good camera with me, so when I need to snap some pictures of my kids, I want to have something decent on hand.
 
It was £320, whereas an iPhone is what? £650? I can buy a DSLR with the difference :-)
 
I was extremely disappointed with my Nexus 4's camera in comparison to the iphone 4.
 
wim
My favourite thing about Apple is how aggressively they deprecate old stuff. My least favourite thing is how hostile they are to competitors / how little they will cooperate with other companies
 
Yeah but Nexus is budget, and again presumably cost much less than the iphone
 
7:59 PM
yup...lesson learned :)
and I don't know why, but I've been really eyeing the bigger sized phones, like the one plus 3 size.
 
wim
The fact that you can't load music onto your phone by plugging it in and just copying over some mp3 files is a travesty
 
haha yeah.
But, since I got a spotify subscription, that problem got covered up
 
wim
itunes might be the worst piece of software in existence
 
@wim that's what you're paying the money for: Jony Ive gets to make that call for you
 
hey look at that! I just threw money at a problem to fix it! =/
 
8:05 PM
@RobertGrant dell \o/
 
They've definitely got something since they unfloated a couple of years ago
 
unfloated?
 
Yeah they came off the stock market and own themselves again
 
ahh, I see
 
Like an anchor
 
8:08 PM
@QuestionC thanks?:P
 
Python's binary integer literals are unsigned, right? For instance, 0b1111_1111 -> 255.
 
wim
who unfloated?
 
dell, from context?
 
wim
oh ok
what does that involve? just buying all your shares back from owners?
 
wim
8:13 PM
I still see DVMT for sale on robinhood
 
Once you hit something like 95% the last 5% have to sell, something like that
 
wim
Oh DVMT must be something else, it says founded jan 2013
 
well google oneboxes "Dell Technologies Inc NYSE: DVMT - Oct 27, 4:04 PM EDT ..." if you just google dvmt
complete with dell logo
 
wim
It must be some subsidiary or whatnot
 
Perhaps I made it up to subtly manipulate you into doing my bidding
 
8:16 PM
are you The Emperor?
 
@RobertGrant unless it's part of the agreement of the holding then that doesn't exist
 
Am I the Emperor?
 
@RobertGrant if you are.. Please tell me you're not wearing those new clothes!
 
PUP!
 
for some reason James Earl Jones saying "What is Thy bidding, my Master?" is an overwhelming beacon in my associative cognitive processes
 
8:17 PM
@JonClements hey! :)
 
@JonClements you don't like them? Do you think the crotch is a bit tight? shows Jon
 
@idjaw not been sacked yet I see :-P
 
@JonClements Now that's easier to dispose of my adversaries, it's become easier.
 
@RobertGrant well... Tight? Guess not - didn't have to be that big in the first place by the looks of it :-P
 
8:24 PM
I'll have you know that's just because I make no effort in personal grooming, and that's just what it looks li-shut up!
But seriously. Too tight? shows Jon again
 
@idjaw got around to kicking anyone yet... We might have a volunteer! :-D
 
@JonClements No kicking yet, boss. I feel like my Canadianess might get in the way here.
I should practice on Andras.
Hey Andras, can I kick you a few times?
You know, for science?
 
getting your kicks for science - the best way :)
Evening all
 
I think Jon had the Robert one in mind:P
@JRichardSnape good evening:)
 
Hi Andras.
 
8:29 PM
What? I can't imagine why.
 
I've been busy. I have many stories to fuel a theoretical physicists disdain of engineers' mathematical ability.
:D
 
This is a real look in the crotch.
 
I believe I'm already in saturation
 
Is Bobby talking bllcks again? ;)
 
8:30 PM
snuffed something, now he thinks he's wearing clothes
 
@AndrasDeak probably so.
 
Is anyone else cold?
 
wim
@idjaw you can kick me
 
@JRichardSnape anyway, I'll gladly listen to any stories reinforcing my prejudices:D
 
I have, though, had to explain gently that if x=-4, then x^2 is not -16 an unhealthy amount of times.
 
8:31 PM
Nice!
We had an economics teacher who had to be thoroughly introduced to the fact that A=2B means that A is twice as much as B and not the other way around. But I know economics people are fish in a barrel.
 
4 weeks of 1st year maths teaching at least makes me (temporarily) assume that I am some kind of mathematical demi-god :)
 
hehe:D
 
wim
Well, your economics teacher was correct for the special case of B=0
 
the alternative being "what the hell are you all doing here and what am I doing here?" is much less flattering
 
Oooh - congratulations on your slopy letters @idjaw.
@AndrasDeak I do have 1 student (of 120) that is giving me a run for my money. He solved a quartic equation almost on sight.
 
8:35 PM
@JRichardSnape his soul is ours now.... Muhahahahaba
 
@JRichardSnape those are the worst:P
 
@idjaw well done :-)
 
I was starting to splutter when he revealed that in fact, if you know how to use the university regulation calculators fully, you can solve them symbollically.
 
give him a millennium prize problem to distract him for the semester
 
I thought I had some kind of human computer on my hands.
 
8:36 PM
haha, nice:)
 
@AndrasDeak good call.
I think I'll just say, "can you 4 colour a 17x17 square?" and casually walk away.
 
Amazing how long it takes people to notice, hey? :-D
 
That distracted me for about 3 months at one point.
 
wim
> x^2 is not -16
yep, because only ints between -5 and 256 are interned
 
@wim Thanks for stepping up to the plate. Much appreciated
@JRichardSnape haha thank you
@RobertGrant thanks
 
8:37 PM
I just googled quartic equations, and no, that student should not know these things
@idjaw you should start kissing babies right now
 
@wim nice
 
wim
Try explaining that 5 + 1 = 3! (true mathematicians will understand...)
 
@AndrasDeak right right...Thanks.
(I'm so winning the presidency)
 
@JRichardSnape what kind of engineers are these? Isn't that guy misplaced?
 
@AndrasDeak Don't google the 4 colouring one. There, I've warned you.
 
8:40 PM
@JRichardSnape You're not filming Good Will Hunting per chance?
 
Although, maybe it's been solved by now.
 
@JRichardSnape I'll try:D
 
wim
How do you put the quote and the reply in the same chat?
like
> a quote
a reply
I wrote them in different chats but you get the picture
 
@wim just like you did, it won't print the name but it will reply
 
@wim The reply still gets notified
 
8:41 PM
just like with oneboxes
 
(I did like the interning comment BTW)
 
Any mac users here have "python2" as a working command? (by default, without you having aliased it manually at one point)
 
38 secs ago, by wim
> a quote
 
@AndrasDeak Probably. He likes trig identities too. Probably should be doing maths.
 
So what kind of engineers?:) Some CS?
 
wim
8:43 PM
> a quote

a reply
 
closing as unclear what you're asking
 
@AndrasDeak Mainly Mech Eng (180/245), some Elec Eng (40/245) and even some physicists (the rest).
I get to have all the physicists in my tutorial. It's a good tutorial.
The physicists and engineers to common maths 1001 here.
(at my uni, not at most unis)
 
@JRichardSnape spoiler alert: 17x17 has been solved
 
8:45 PM
@AndrasDeak Bah - my months really were wasted.
 
Hah - no matter.
 
@JRichardSnape thanks:)
 
wim
Andras how do you do the quote with the human readable time and the author like that
 
one-box the permalink of the chat message:)
 
8:47 PM
> The only grid that we do not know if it is 4-colorable is 12x21. This is still open and you are URGED to work on it. Sorry, no cash on this one. Do it for the glory!
 
you can get that from the context menu of the message, and works cross-rooms too
 
wim
"one-box " ?
 
So, my time can still be wasted...
 
@wim just input the raw link without any fluff
 
@wim Post only the permalink to the chat message
 
wim
8:48 PM
18 secs ago, by Andras Deak
@wim just input the raw link without any fluff
oh ok
 
wim
thx
 
and here's a reply version of mine, its history: chat.stackoverflow.com/messages/33743519/history
 
alright mystery solved. the python2 command is not available system level by default. Setting up a virtualenv, python2 works.
Funny I just learn this now about Mac...
 
wim
it would be nice if the chat help said some of this stuff
 
8:49 PM
@wim it does talk about one-boxing
 
TIL: users are allowed to change their suggested edit within some grace period, and the change won't be visible to anyone
 
@vaultah probably the same 5-minute window?
no, suggested edits might be longer
or do you mean approved suggested edit post approval?
 
ah ok, during review
weird but understandable
 
wim
It doesn't talk about using ">" to quote
 
8:52 PM
well that's another thing entirely
that might be missing indeed, but at least that's the same as markdown
multi-line fixed formatting is also missing, I believe
 
@AndrasDeak I am now worried that I have self-nerd-sniped as I find myself opening this: informatik.tu-freiberg.de/prof2/publikationen/…
 
haha, good luck:D
equation (9) gives me the creeps:S
just throwing text into a math environment should be a felony
 
did I just find a glitch in the matrix?
 
@AndrasDeak And surely * should be convolution in a maths paper...
 
8:57 PM
is that a travelling charge bank?
@JRichardSnape baaah, yes, fortunately I missed that
 
yeah just plug it into itself and you have infinite charge
 
Whilst messing around one day, @corvid invented a perpetual motion machine.
 
@corvid see you on the white side of the singularity
 
Unfortunately, it was shiny, so he immediately pecked it into submission.
 
just make sure it wasn't designed by the Note 7 guys
 
9:25 PM
that loss, yo.
 
witty title is witty
There has to be a reason why most manufacturers don't distribute explosive batteries for their phones, so they kind of had it coming.
 
wim
9:51 PM
That's weird, I just got a banner popping up to say I was awarded "Epic" badge
but it doesn't show up on my profile at all
anyone already saw that behaviour?
 
blame caching
was it on SO?
 
wim
yeah
I'm certainly not hitting the rep cap 50 times on any other site ..
 
yeah, I see now
I think I've heard similar, it should show up soon
if you click the notification, it should take you to the "wim got this badge" page (I think), but you're not on the public list yet
If you look at the public list I just linked to, you'll see that until a few months ago these badges were assigned at midnight
only newer ones have non-midnight time stamps
my suspicion is that the algorithm has been changed so that it gets assigned midday, but it probably still only registers at midnight UTC (2 more hours)
 
@wim can't remember the exact scenario but different sections showing badges being out of sync is very common for me.
 
tag badges also used to have some issues when certain scheduled scripts were running and dying erratically
 

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