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3:00 PM
... Except in elaborate corner cases like print(factorial(100000)*0)
 
@Kevin you can't prove that! in my head executing a program in MooScript takes bit a mere instant xD
Also MooScript sometime likes to return don't know ask me later
 
Reminds me of a language I read about where it would sometimes skip an instruction if it didn't feel like running it
 
@WayneWerner golf languages have become a lot sillier since I last checked in.
 
@WayneWerner I like your solution to day 1. Very oopy.
@davidism Yes. Yes they have.
 
I like the language wher eyou have to be polite, gotta put enough please and thank you in it
 
3:02 PM
 
@MooingRawr INTERCAL, IIRC
 
@WayneWerner I like his sense of humor
 
@PeterVaro hmm, that site doesn't load for me.
 
@davidism coub?
 
That particular page loads for me, but not coub.com. Peculiar.
 
3:05 PM
hmm.. well, it is a russian startup.. so who knows..
 
Oh, there it goes. Took a while.
 
morning cbg
 
I should figure out how to do drop shadows.
 
what does cbg mean
 
3:07 PM
@Kevin exactly! :)
 
@davidism thanks for the link.
 
XD
< grean bean
 
@Kevin.a that shows that you've not read the room rules.
 
i want some edamame now ;(
 
usually rules are just common sense
 
3:12 PM
i should have made my name 'EdamameNom' or something...
 
So i dont really read it i just behave like my mom taught me @BhargavRao
didn't*
 
Rule 1 of interface design: users don't read.
 
Besidees
In the rule section of sopython
there is nothing mentioned about salad language
 
Technically yes, but two paragraphs above the rules section, it has "Incidentally, if you've just been greeted with the word "cbg" or "cabbage" then you may want to have a look [here]... "
 
3:16 PM
cbg
 
cbg
 
yes
but thats not under the "Rules:" part
 
So it appears nobody at this store realized the Surface Book is detachable from the base Should I steal it https://t.co/hGiOf1FGGx
 
@PM2Ring
 
wim
3:17 PM
Hi everybody, could we please keep AoC solutions behind a spoiler link in this room
 
Anyone else having issues with SO connections? I keep getting connection reset... will be rebooting my Internet soon
 
Rules
Be nice.
If nobody responds to your question, that means no-one in the room is able to help (either because they don't know, or are too busy to answer right now). Please don't spam the room with further requests for help on the same question. It will only annoy people and make them less likely to want to help you in future.
Especially don't use @username notification unless that user has already told you it's okay to ping them; that's like jabbing someone in the shoulder and saying "Hey! Answer me!", and will quickly mark you out as someone to be avoided.
 
 
@Kevin.a so what? Speaking Salad is not a rule
 
wim
And room owners, if you agree, would you please pro-actively delete any AoC code dumps here and ask them to post just links instead?
 
3:19 PM
Incidentally, and this is not an explicit room rule, but trying to rules-lawyer your way out of an argument with an RO or mod usually does not have a happy outcome
 
I know, but someone implied i didn't read the rules because i didnt know what salad language was. @vaultah
 
"I read the room rules and the specific paragraph entitled 'room rules' doesn't mention the thing you said (although the page containing the room rules does mention the thing you said)" is not the bulletproof defense you wish it was
 
Oh my cabbage, I can't believe you're still arguing about this. The point is that if you read the link in the room description, you get everything you need to know, not just the rules.
Go solve Advent of Code instead!
 
@wim I'll be happy to trash AoC code dumps, sure.
 
wim
@Kevin thanks
 
3:21 PM
Yeah, if it's not in a repo or paste, it's in the trash.
Although it's fine to talk generally about solving.
 
wim
agreed
 
So i have to read the whole page to find a specific piece of info ? which in my case is the rules. @Kevin
 
Beaten by davidism, but I was going to say: textually discussing approaches to the problem, ex. "storing the position as a complex number simplified things for me", is more of a gray area.
 
@Kevin.a nah, there is a big section named "rules"
 
thats why there are titles Rules
 
3:22 PM
1 min ago, by davidism
Go solve Advent of Code instead!
 
@Kevin.a Just do your best :-)
 
wim
oh noes, more kevins
kevin overload
 
rules is like a h2 for a reason
 
Kevinception?
 
We need a kevin quota
 
3:23 PM
Remember, cutting a Kevin in half will just cause two Kevins to grow in their place. Always dispose of Kevins using fire or acid.
13
 
@wim I see you really liked Kevin's imaginary numbers from yesterday. :-)
 
wim
Although, the laws of thermodynamics make it impossible to get down to exactly 0 Kevin
 
omg omg omg Mads Mikkelsen is in Death Stranding
<3 I can't wait for this
 
@idjaw All the kevins.
 
Also don't feed the Kevins after midnight.
 
3:24 PM
And never say their name three times in a row
ever
 
wim
@davidism Yes using complex as a poor man's 2d vector was a great trick. I only wish I had thought of it first!
 
especially when staring in a mirror
 
I only vaguely understand what's going on in those solutions.
 
@idjaw defuq did I just watch
 
Checking filmography of Mads Mikkelsen... The only thing I've seen him in is Dr Strange, apparently.
Was he the bad guy? The bad guy had some good moments.
 
3:26 PM
@khajvah You watched the new Hideo Kojimo game. Just enjoy it.
 
what's hannibal doing there?
 
The juxtaposition of guy crying over receiving an award for his game about his dead son and GILLETTE ROBOT SUIT MAN is something
 
Death Stranding is the invisible baby game, right? That was an interesting trailer.
 
does AoC check your coding practice? or does it just want the answer? I can't find where to upload the code
 
Poor crossbow guy from Walking Dead... Out of one weird apocalypse and right into another
@MooingRawr You just submit the answer.
 
wim
3:27 PM
just the answer
 
@davidism eeeeeessh.
 
wim
your coding practice is checked indirectly in a part b) of each problem
 
We're all posting our code on pastebin/gist/bitbucket/etc and linking to it in sopython.com/wiki/Advent_of_Code, but that's strictly unofficial and optional
 
@Kevin hahah :)
 
wim
in that, if you wrote it well in part a) your code is easily adapted or sometimes even trivial to generalize
if you were sloppy in part a) you might have to rewrite completely
it's quite clever really
 
3:29 PM
Rhubarb
 
@Kevin Mads Mikkelsen is great!
he's Hannibal in the new series
 
I see.... i like day 2's if i only had access to my home computer i can grab my mini game engine and play with it that way... oh well ;(
 
list append is O(1) right?
 
wim
yes
 
the missus saw him in some Scandinavian pedophile-related movie, not my cuppa
 
3:30 PM
@khajvah yup
 
wim
unless the list has to be resized
 
@Kevin seriously, you haven't seen casino royale:?
 
@wim How is CPython doing it?
 
@khajvah amortization
 
@Kevin Hannibal <3
 
3:33 PM
O(1) average
 
ah
I see
 
@AnttiHaapala Nope. I'm not a big Bond guy.
 
you're fat?
 
No he's just not a chemist.
 
it's usually used the other way around
 
3:40 PM
in C, 8 mins ago, by Peter Varo
assembly FTW: https://youtu.be/GH94fKtGr0M
 
*bracing for IKEA*
 
3:57 PM
I don't think I've needed to brace anything I've got from IKEA
 
That's how you get pinned under a bookshelf.
 
is there a way to achieve something like x,y += 1,1 or do I have to write it multiple lines ?
 
x, y = x + 1, y + 1
 
oh i see... doesnt know which to apply
make sense thanks ....
 
unpacking assignment doesn't work with augmented assignment operators
 
4:03 PM
I wonder why not, though.
 
time to make a SO question i guess?
or research first at least
 
it will most definitely be a duplicate
 
"Why doesn't [language] do [thing]?" posts tend to get closed as opinion based / too broad unless you word them real carefully
Rule of thumb: if the only answer worth posting is a quote from a mailing list post from the BDFL explaining his internal thought process, you're not going to get a lot of internet detectives willing to step up to the plate
 
4
Q: Can I use += on multiple variables on one line?

Theo Pearson-BrayWhile shortening my code I was cutting down a few variable declarations onto one line- ##For example- going from- Var1 =15 Var2 = 26 Var3 = 922 ##To- Var1, Var2, Var3 = 15, 26, 922 However, when I tried doing the same thing to this code- User_Input += Master_Key[Input_ref] Key += Master_Key[...

It doesn't explain the rationale behind this though
 
4:16 PM
Don't think I get Jeff's point there. a, b = map(iadd, (a, b), t) seems like sensible behavior.
I feel like he was trying to get to a conclusion of "... And you can see that this behavior would obviously be absurd" but I feel like I missed a step
brb implementing in-place-add on arbitrarily many left-hand-side parameters in KevinScript, because it's a great idea
 
@MooingRawr You could also do x, y = tuple(map(sum, zip([x, y], [1,1]))).
 
that seems more overhead than a simple unpacking but thanks
 
You guys are my favorite
 
@corvid and you're my favorite bird-human hybrid.
 
what about the pidgeon man from hey arnold?
 
4:33 PM
you're betterer, corvid
 
Man, Part 2 of day 2 is much more different than I was expecting.
My part 1 solution doesn't apply at all. :/
 
I've been out of the loop with advent of code, do you have to get your solution on that given day
I see a timer
oh the timer is for unlocking the next one
 
You can do them whenever you want.
 
ok good.
 
4:46 PM
Excellent! I'm alone in the office. I can divert 15 mins to finishing d1p2
 
wim
@MorganThrapp how can you write part1 and not have it work for part2 ?
guess I lucked out, same idea worked for both, just passing in a different data (spoiler)
 
@wim you can see my part 1 and 2 code
 
wim
mine is same as Antti but using scalars instead of pairs
 
DSM
I haven't done today's yet, so I do appreciate everyone's use of spoiler protection!
Barely-still morning cabbage for all.
 
We've all got unique inputs/answers yeah?
 
wim
4:51 PM
good question
i wondered if they were autogenerated
or just picked from a big set
 
If so, it could be quite interesting to compile unit tests from all the people who have correctly answered it
 
wim
what do you hope to gain from that
I think it would be pretty hard to write a solution which works with your input but breaks with someone elses input ..
I mean, hard to do that accidentally
 
Less chance of internal embarrassment if I click "Submit" once and it rejects me. Will involve less rocking in my chair hugging myself
 
my program that i threw together in less than 5 minutes isn't working and i have no idea why (not working as in the answer is wrong... logic is incorrect somewhere guess I get to fix it during lunch)
 
@wim Yeah, I didn't get that fancy with it.
I have my part 1 in my repo. spoiler
 
wim
@IntrepidBrit they often include a smaller test case (and example correct answer) for you in the question. run your code on that first
 
I have done so in the past. I'm not struggling or anything
 
wim
Django 2.0 (release scheduled for December 2017) will be python 3.5+ only!
living on the edge, Antti-style
I'm sure Django devs will be delighted to rip out all their cross-compat hacks, that's a diff I look forward to seeing ...
 
thanks :P
 
5:11 PM
GREAT suggested edit
 
Normally, I'd be delighted to hear that about Django - but I've spent today bringing some legacy code up from some god awful version to 1.10
 
it means that a lot of pepople will stuck on 1.9 ;d
 
@IntrepidBrit what's wrong with 1.10 (hanen't tried yet)
 
No idea yet - I still haven't finished tweaking the legacy code so that it actually works
 
damn, I have to port mine too
but each release changes too much
I can't keep up
 
wim
5:15 PM
@marxin Huh? Django 1.11 LTS is supported up until mid 2020
and python2 is only supported till 2020
 
@wim actually i meant <2.0
 
@khajvah To be fair, I do like Django (winces as he expects imminent wrath from Antti), but let's be honest - the devs have done rakes of weird stuff that ought to changed
 
wim
Django is awesome
There are not many OSS projects with better documentation than Django
 
@enderland did you mod flag the user who approved that?
 
@davidism yeah I just flagged my post with a link to the review
 
5:17 PM
@wim obvious
 
they aren't a 100% approve/0% reject user either, so they might just be clueless
 
my aoc repo, I am trying to do some speedhacks here :D
 
Ok, so could someone put me out of my misery and tell me if pandas is able to load ods files? — Gabriel 35 secs ago
Can anyone answer this? :] The OP wants a simple Yes/No answer
 
DSM
 
wim
@AnttiHaapala a directory called range? ewww.
 
5:24 PM
@wim wtf :D
for i in range {03..25}; do touch $i/part2.py; done
lool
too much python I guess
 
nice
 
wim
LMAO
I think having part1.py and part2.py is going to come back to bite you
it will encourage you to copy-paste code from part1.py into part2.py
when the idea often seems to be to write part1 in a nice enough way to preempt the generalization which will come in part 2
 
Who needs copy+paste when you have from part1 import *
 
@wim often but not always...
@wim there were many cases where the assumptions were totally overturned in the 2nd part last year
 
is there a straightforward approach to a generic "lock" type function that I can use in a module?
without using dedicated threads?
nm, I should just be able to use the generic mutex
since I'm in python 2.7 wooo
 
5:30 PM
I'm pretty sure there's a built-in Lock object in the std libs somewhere.
 
@enderland what's a generic "lock"
 
wim
thankfully I've never had to use that
 
@wim the only good thing about Django
Hobestly, I don't think there is use case for ut
 
wim
hmm, actually on closer look at the graphs it's pretty much a tie
2x faster than node js !
 
@wim but is it webscale like node.js?
And MongoDB
 
5:41 PM
Ok added a readme too
 
Hoho, just hammered a question of a 174k user
 
@vaultah wheree
 
wim
@AnttiHaapala overengineering ftw :P
 
@AnttiHaapala here
 
5:46 PM
@wim I hadn't seen that, very cool.
 
wim
It's just a 174k ruby user :P
 
yeah, n00b
@vaultah HMI Lead at NVIDIA, Inc.
 
It looks like they broke out an http parser from the server too, very nice.
 
wim
rubies = rupees, pythons = diamonds
bad exchange rate
 
5:48 PM
I can't like uvloop because of its creator
 
very related to this talk
 
uuuuggggh. Restarted network devices and still having connectivity issues
 
@vaultah what's wrong with MagicStack? Never heard of them.
 
wim
Yury ? what's your beef
he was arguably the best speaker at EuroPython 2016
 
"I closed the issue because I no longer need your project" github.com/MattDMo/PythonImproved/issues/45#event-436839679
 
wim
5:51 PM
> Preferably one that uses a minimum number of import statements
total n00b speak
 
yea
because it is much nicer to reinvent the wheel itertools
 
wim
What is with people that don't like to import stuff? It's like telling the waiter not to bring you any knife and fork with your meal, because it will be more convenient to carve them yourself from the leg of the table
 
@vaultah Speaking from the perspective of someone with ~2 lifetime hours spent interacting with the open source community, is that really so bad? If you open an issue on someone's project to make a request for functionality, and then later discover you don't need that functionality, and nobody else wants the functionality, then just leaving it quietly open means that the maintainer will waste his time implementing the thing that nobody wants.
Granted, "support Python 3.5" is probably not a feature that nobody wants...
 

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