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12:22 AM
neat
that website is running on
 
And it can't run a command line hello world in Ruby
 
Is that a nude photo of CapricaSix?
Sexy.
 
1:06 AM
@Luggage How difficult is it to uninstall Homebrew on mac? Like completely remove it, no trace, back to what the system was before it was installed.
 
I linked you uninstall instrcutions earlier, but.. I've never had occasion to uninstall it myself and I don't know about 'without a trace'.
but homebrew is used by lots of people that also do iphone deveopment. i can't image it'd break anything
it IS possible you could install a command that override a built-in one, but you can always uninstall. homebrew install everthing to /usr/local so it won't touch system files.
read the homebrew homepage. it talks about how keeps itself out of your shit.
 
Coming from Windows, I'm used to one application installing stuff all over the system that is later left behind even though the uninstaller uninstalled "everything".
 
that's why I don't like installers and prefer either homebrew or 'drag to applications' installs.
> Homebrew won’t install files outside its prefix, and you can place a Homebrew installation wherever you like. -Homebrew home page
 
Alright, I'm trusting you on this one and installing Homebrew, hopefully it doesn't install stuff elsewhere in the system that I have to manually go and delete.
 
homebrew is awesome. it's a must-have for macs to install packages.
 
1:12 AM
wait, home-brew won't override any system stuff though, right?
 
node, git, postgres, etc. all in homebrew
 
I remember reading somewhere that after installing, you had to run some "export path" command, and then do brew doctor. That's not going change system settings right?
 
not replace files, but it can place similarly named commands in /usr/local. For example, if you install git with homebrew, you'll use that when you type 'git' but the built-in system one will still be in /usr/bin
I don't know, man. i didn't have to do any of that..
I have one mac, I installed homebrew once. never been an issue ever. that's my only experience.
 
So you did:
$ ruby -e "$(curl -fsSL https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Homebrew/install/master/install)"
$ brew doctor
and that's it?
 
still don't know wha brew doctor is
 
1:14 AM
None of this $ echo 'export PATH="/usr/local/bin:$PATH"' >> ~/.bash_profile they apparently want me to do?
 
the homepage doesn't list that step, so i never did it
ohh, yes, i probabyl fixed my path, yes.
 
why did you have to do that?
 
Do you know what a path is?
 
On Windows I do, not sure on Mac though.
Unless it's the same.
 
yes, paths work the same
that's all it's doing. it's adding /usr/local/bin into the path (Before others).
check what your path is before you change it
echo $PATH
 
1:19 AM
/usr/bin:/bin:/usr/sbin:/sbin:/usr/local/bin
 
I don't see a reference to /usr/local/bin in my bash_profile so it might have already been set.
ok, it's there, at the end. just leave it and try.
brew install node
 
I haven't installed home-brew yet though
 
you suck
 
He's scared of fucking up his dev environment.
 
by installing homebrew?
 
1:20 AM
One last thing, I see a lot of debate about installing Node via official repositories vs brew.
 
yea, I told him it'd be fine
 
you won't fuck anything up
 
the official install is a installer package that puts files god-knows-where
 
@nick Well, I don't want to install anything that will leave zombie files around the system that I have to chase and clean up.
 
i'd use homebrew if you are worried about that kind of thing.
 
1:21 AM
I'm going too far, but I feel like I should back up.
 
the installer package is fine
 
Homebrew takes care to keep the files separate. That's a goal.
yea, i'm sure it is, but homebrew is more awesomeer.
 
homebrew will give you the option to update node easily, though it does depend on whether those formulas are kept updated by the maintainers
 
worst case:
1. brew uninstall node
2. Go d/l official installer
 
generally it is not recommended to install node on ubuntu via apt-get though, as there are conflicts
 
1:25 AM
even backing up is not easy, what the heck!
 
what
backing things up is for scrubs
 
i just remember all my code.
 
i do not concern myself with such petty matters
 
I'm not backing up for code!
 
@Luggage I don't even have to do that, my skills are enough for me to regenerate everything in no time at all
 
1:27 AM
I'm backing up so if I end up destroying my system, I can bring it back.
 
holy shit you're not going to destroy your system
 
Exterminate, Regenerate
 
it's not windows and it's not 2005 you're safe
 
rmraf('~')
 
if it was that easy to fuck it up, my system would be gone.
 
1:28 AM
@SomeKittens Thats such a cute little face! gonna type it in my console
 
If home-brew's uninstall script really brings the mac back to what it was before I installed it, then i'll go ahead and install it.
 
@Luggage You haven't truely borked it until you've done sudo chown somekittens -R /usr/bin
 
ask homebrew.
i've never uninstalled.
also, i wouldn't know eve if I did
 
I have, and yeah, it removes it
 
@SomeKittens were you able to fix that?
i could fix it on linux.. not sure what it'd do to osx
 
1:30 AM
@Luggage Yeah. The big issue is that the command sudo is no longer owned by super user
 
ah.
 
@SomeKittens wat
 
1 min ago, by SomeKittens
@Luggage You haven't truely borked it until you've done sudo chown somekittens -R /usr/bin
 
@SomeKittens I can't sudo if I install it?
 
@DemCodeLines no, no, no. You can't sudo if you're an idiot and chown /usr/bin
 
1:32 AM
Sorry, I somehow read that as, "If homebrew is installed, then sudo is no longer owned by me"
 
@DemCodeLines two conversations at once
 
shit, i think i'm gonn ahve to do this update when i have no users.. time ot set my alarm for 3am.
data-structure change..
 
ban your users
 
fuck it.. i think it'll be ok. pushing it, now.
 
There you go
 
1:44 AM
looks ok, waitinf to see successful api calls from real users before i stop watching
 
I'm getting that free T shirt i swear
 
for pull requests?
 
yup
 
what are you contributing to?
 
not much right now
 
1:52 AM
Well, I have installed home-brew...
 
one merged PR on some guy's custom node http server so far
 
i need to do that. i signed up. no PR's yet
 
another PR on my own fork of easyrtc (was updating to master, dont hate pls)
 
i have a couple that I've been meaning to do anyway. small changes to ibraries I use.
 
good idea
might do something for ShareJS soon but that might be out of my league
I'm pushing for TTL on change operations (someone already made a PR a year ago and implemented this) but needless to say the lead maintainers are hesitant to merge it
needs more tests I believe
I think I've only really been active on GitHub over the past week or so. feels good collaborating, working on problems, seeing new code go up
this could replace my CS:GO addiction
 
2:01 AM
Mac experts, I downloaded MySQL Workbench, put it into Applications folder, but then decided I don't want it, so dragged and dropped it into Trash. Is that the right way of removing it?
 
yes
 
What the heck, I can't uninstall MySQL from home-brew now!
never mind
 
2:46 AM
I was in the camp that MySQL is good enough. I am now in the camp that MySQL is a toy...
 
relational DB's still definitely have their uses
 
a toy?
 
yes I keep it in my nightstand drawer with the handcuffs
 
They definitely have their uses, yes. I am now in the camp of SQL Server.
 
i'm n the postgres camp, but have used SQL Server for years
 
2:52 AM
ah
 
and there isn't much sql server can't do
except be inexpensive.
I was looking at a quarter million dollar license fee for an upgrade I was proposing at my last job for sql server.
i think they are more forgiving, now, though with the rules on per-core licensing
 
@rlemon I am going to submit a PR for flat design on Notifier.js and you better merge it or there will be consequences
@Luggage damn, I certainly hope so
 
we had a 50 terabyte db and needed the top sql server for encryption, off site hot backups, etc
 
SQL Server Express is feature rich enough and free. I find it a good balance between lighter databases and real heavy databases, with good support of features and standards - as long as you remember to put an 'N' before the strings.
 
top as in features set.. enterprise, i think it was
 
2:55 AM
But if you need the enterprise features... yeah XD
 
yea, sql express is decent feature-wise, we we ended up moving to sqlite for user-installed DBs due to upgrade problems
and those were 2gb+ databases.
 
lol sqlite
 
Yup. It worked as well as MSSQL for our use.
but not for all. mssql has a lot of features. crazy shit.
 
3:09 AM
@Sheepy I was seriously thinking about MongoDB. But then I realized that SQL > NoSQL.
 
∞% more SQL.
 
it depends what the application is
 
🐙
does that show as the emoji?
 
Anything that's more than 2 pages and requires more than 2 data entry points.
 
fuk ur opinions octopus
 
3:11 AM
Yes
If I'm building a user-focused app, I am not storing their interests, likes, comments, pictures and everything else in one table. That's just an over-bloated mess waiting to happen.
 
a relational DB is good for that purpose
 
Again, anything that's not a single page app = sql
 
meh I think that's a poor generalization
 
It could be, but I have realized that NoSQL is no where close to what it's hyped up to be.
 
your flavor of web client has nothing to do what how the server stores the data for you app.
 
3:15 AM
My experience with NoSQL is limited to "NoSQL for dummies" - a 300 pages "introduction book", IIRC, stuffed full of technical terms. It truly amused the colleagues in other departments.
 
@Luggage All I'm saying is, most legitimate applications are relational. And trying to stuff all that information into one collection is not gonna be fun when you come back and look at it a couple thousand records later.
 
i agree that most apps are relational
but you still ahve as many collections as you need and structure your data in a document db, too.
 
I'm using mongo simply because my app's model fits it perfectly
i am literally storing user documents (plaintext snapshots with various meta properties)
 
Opps. Sorry. The "Dummy" book has 456 pages. A pretty big book.
 
3:20 AM
sounds more like solr.
You can stop. we're all on the relational db side.
 
Lol
 
@Luggage I wasn't trying to "pursue" anyone. In case you forgot, I was here not too long ago asking the same question.
 
//@nick
CREATE TABLE documents (id uuid not null primary key, someProperty int, someProperty2 varchar, userData json);
 
I'm curious- generally my document snapshots stored on mongo aren't subjected to heavy read-writes but I require a separate database to store and track change operations
 
separate db or just separate table/collection?
/bucket/whatever
 
3:30 AM
oplogs would be subject to heavy read/writes when users are active so if my mongo instance ever fails that would be the point of failure I believe
separate DB
how would you structure that in a relational DB?
there would be an oplog for every single document stored on the main snapshot DB, and the oplog represents every single change to the document ever
I guess I would need a new table for every oplog correct?
 
what's an oplog?
one table should be all you need..
TABLE changes (id, date, who, diff)
 
like five people read my article!
hurrah!
 
hory shet
are you sure it wasn't just you refreshing the page 5 times?
that's what I do on all my profiles because I love myself so much
@Luggage think of it as every commit in a repo
 
right.
 
and the head is the document snapshot on the other database
so a table for every document
 
3:37 AM
that's not how you use relational dbs
 
how else could I structure it?
I believe most relational databases only have 2 dimensions per table correct? :P
 
any other way. one table per type of object you are storing, generally.
well, postgres has arrayss and json blobs.
but they all have relations between tables.. which is how you do structures, traditionally
 
ah
between tables? what does this mean?
 
as in how one table's data related to another.
well, let's say you want to store:
 
@nick e.g. You may have a Course table listing the courses, a Student table listing the students, and an Enroll table that associates student id with course id. (a "many to many" relationship)
 
3:41 AM
    { //person
        firstName: 'nick',
        lastName: 'dugger',
        projects: [
            { name: 'project 1' },
            { name: 'project 2' },
        ]
    }
one table for the all person objects, one for all the projects of all people.
 
I am not Dick Nugger thank you very much
 
how am i suppsed to know that when you impersonate him.
 
@Sheepy I see
@Luggage I think we had this discussion already and it ended up with you plonking me
 
i got over it but now you changed your name to even the the same
or i'm mixing up which is which.
 
this was my username before you were joined our wonderful room
 
3:44 AM
which is likely.
 
this was my name before you were even born
 
you weren't recently upsidedown nick?
 
doubtful
yes
Dugger is thomas the tank engine
 
ohh, ok.
well, most things i know of you two blur together
 
you can usually tell because his username is Nick and he Capitalizes the first word of his sentences like a good boy
 
3:45 AM
ok, well, i don't vare
 
also he drives a honda fit and loves it so that should tell you something about him /cc @Nick
 
you'l just have to deal with not having an identity until you stop imitating other people
so don't get annoyed when people mistake you.
 
the only similarity at this point is our name, and it is the name our mothers gave us
 
well, shared avatars
 
hasn't been the same avatar in months
anyhow
 
3:48 AM
right, but the confusion is already there, since you just changed you name to match the other
how can you not get that someone would get confused when two people have used the same avatater and change their names BACK AND FORTH
I moved on, but you have to deal wirth the fact that I don't know you two apart. I don't remeber which orientation you avatar was as the time you said somethign and it's all the same to me
 
@Luggage every operation is a few pieces of data (like in your example somewhere above)
 
so one table per type of flat item.
 
@nick oh drat
 
To do my example as a table, you'r have a 'projects' table that has the columns: id, userId, name
there are likely some much better explanations of relational DBs online
with pictures
 
per type?
 
3:53 AM
yes.
 
@SomeKittens don't think I don't know your games mister
 
a user, project, document, change, whatever
 
so yeah I think that's what I was getting at, I just misinterpreted you
thinking is hard right now
 
same
 
@nick I love the tetrises
 
4:00 AM
@SomeKittens does your blog engine still output old stuff?
 
uh oh
why?
 
probably gonna file an issue so I can feel superior
 
open a PR for the shirt
 
just wondering? I thought you mentioned something this morning
k I will decorate your code with helpful comments
// this is crap wtf
 
oh, it was fixed
 
4:01 AM
// what even is this
ah good to hear
 
I managed to send booleans backwards
 
function nopeNopeNopeFuckThisImOut (e) {
    error()(e);
    process.exit(1);
}
5
best thing I wrote today.
 
@SomeKittens wat
@phenomnomnominal lol
I'd include this in my code and never use it once
it is nice to have an escape route but if you use it you suck
 
The "Send the publish value to the server" code triggered before the "set the publish value to the new value"
 
 
4:04 AM
I see
 
What is generally a better option for scaling content in a canvas, would you use ctx.scale(); or drawImage with a scale applied to the image?
 
@nick usage, in our build: Promise.onPossiblyUnhandledRejection(nopeNopeNopeFuckThisImOut);
 
you crash with every exception?
 
as you should.
unhandled only.
 
BUT YOU'RE HANDLING IT
 
4:11 AM
I mean, you shouldn't eat exceptions but logging the error is a good place to start
 
@nick this is the exact opposite of eating it.
 
Wow. After putting out fire of a wordpress site, I come back to find the chatroom burned...
 
yes but there is a middle ground :P
 
You catch other exeptions and do things, like return an error to the client
but an unhandled one.. you might be leaving connections hanging
this should be rare, and a problem to fix quickly.
 
This is on a build. If something goes wrong, I don't want it to be deployed do I?
 
4:13 AM
but it is being handled technically :)
yes I see, it's for in-dev code strictly
 
4:51 AM
express().listen(3000, cb); -> is this a sync call? #nodejs #express
 
I.. don't think so?
there's no reason it should be. why do you ask?
 
Need to write a program that starts up two http servers...
Hence I want the sync version of listen...
You know...one after another...
 
just make another http server and have it listen on a different port
 
I want the other server up and running before I start the next one...so does this mean I have to write all the start-server-B logic in the callback of server-A?
 
@deostroll You can use bluebird/generators and do something like github.com/petkaantonov/bluebird/blob/master/…
 
5:00 AM
@deostroll you could do that or use promises like ivarni said but the end result is the same
 
Indeed, and in a server startup script wrapping callbacks probably isn't a huge issue
 
you don't have to do all the server-B config in the callback of server-A (unless there's a reason?). I assume you would only need the .listen line to start it up
 
unless ports are dynamic and B needs to know what port A got
 
fair enough but setting them explicitly is far easier :)
 
exactly. Poor job security ;)
 
5:03 AM
actually server A isn't a server...its a middleware...
 
or is it... a battle station?
 
I am trying out my own live-reload server...
 
If you're just testing stuff out I'd just go ahead and wrap the callback and then come back later to shave that jak if the project gets anywhere past the trying-out stage
!!afk coffee and a typing course
 
@ivarni /mind-blown
 
@nick ivarni is afk: coffee and a typing course
 
5:10 AM
k hipster
 
@ivarni or is it... a moon?
 
@phenomnomnominal ivarni is afk: coffee and a typing course
 
well crap, seems webpack is sooo last month now: github.com/nolanlawson/rollup-comparison
> Rather than excluding dead code, we should be including live code
That.
 
@ivarni hipster nonsense
 
Oh right, the internet favors exclusion over inclusion, I keep forgetting that :)
 
5:24 AM
haha, nice
doesn't look nearly mature enough
I just switched to Webpack
 
nah, but I like the idea
Likewise, switched in july
Might use it for hobby projects though so I can keep an eye on it
 
!!urban hipster
 
@argentum47 hipster Hipsters are a subculture of men and women typically in their 20's and 30's that value independent thinking, counter-culture, progressive politics, an appreciation of art and indie-rock, creativity, intelligence, and witty banter. The greatest concentrations of hipsters can be found living in the Williamsburg, Wicker Park, and Mission District neighborhoods of major cosmopolitan centers such as N(snip)
 
Also beards
 
5:41 AM
can a page have multiple canvas ?
 
@CapricaSix I used to live in Mission am I a hipster?
and I cannot believe glasses were not mentioned
 
hipstahz
 
6:08 AM
@argentum47 Only if you're l337 enough to have them
 
oh! 1337 comes from leet? It all makes sense now!
 
whats l337?
 
"el" + "eet"
you're making me feel old, man, stop it
 
!!urban l337
 
@argentum47 l337 17'5 4 (0mpu73r l4ngu4g3. 17 g375 4nn0'/1ng 4f73r 4 wh1l3. 700 b4d 1f u (4n'7 r34d 7h15.
 
6:13 AM
ok I get it
 
It's originally from back in the days when we used modems to connect to BBSes over the phone lines, back when phones were connected to walls
 
user3119231
Morning -> w3schools.com/cert/default.asp ._________.
 
user3119231
Hate will come in 3, 2, 1...
 
back when if you had a isdn connection, you managed to get less than 1000ms ping and had a full second advantage and would annoying call yourself l337
needless to say, I wasn't one of those with the isdn connection :(
 
6:16 AM
for those of you who played doom in multiplayer, you'd know there was a certain satisfaction to launch a rocket ahead of another player and gibbing them
 
I can't ever remember ping being an issue to get access to "elite" BBSes but bandwidth sure were, noone wanted you to hog their phoneline for 3 days just to download UFO
We didn't get ISDN lines in Norway untill 94, but elite hubs were around for a long time already by then
 
user3119231
Anyone an idea to this? I want to create a strain from a plant vertically -> repeat-y
 
user3119231
should I use canvas or what?
 
@ivarni heh at one point I got lucky, we had an extra phoneline installed by my dads company, they forgot about it for 2 years
used to run the line to my room and download stuff all day/night
I remember a UT99 mod (total conversion) taking 48 hours to dl.
 
I begged my parents for a 2nd phone line for years
 
6:21 AM
used gozilla I think it was called
 
I was the happiest boy alive when they got one
 
because it could resume downloads.
 
We fell back to magnetic tapes shipped over snailmail. I think they could hold as much as 256 MB
 
@Neil haha I bet!
 
geezers
 
6:22 AM
I don't know what softcore porn sounds like through the phone line, but I'd bet my parents heard it often (@´_`@)
 
LOL man that brings back some memories
@Neil haha I remember images loading line by line... waiting for the good bits to load!
 
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-inch_cartridge <-- These models were heavily used for pirating via snailmail.
 
good ol' netscape, depixelizing the images pass by pass
 
@ivarni damn nice, I remember just going to warez sites and my friends IRC group to get stuff
heh on the warez sites you would download like 56 2.5mb files
 
warez sites, oh man that brings back memories
 
6:25 AM
@Neil man they were such a crapshoot too, so many fake ones lol
 
yeah, not sure if they were fake or if the links were well hidden under a mountain of pop-ups and advertisements
 
haha yea
SO MANY popups
 
they'd actually make it ambiguous which links to click
 
I remember telling my parents if they found porn in the history it was due to popups
 
so that occasionally you'd click the wrong one I suppose
LOL
i was guilty of that too
 
6:27 AM
man young people today will never experience popup hell
like.. I remember 20 or more popups, no joke
it was so damned insane
 
it got so bad that at a certain point that they had the school librarian routinely check the screens of the students at my school
 
hahah
 
no pop-up protection
so very annoying
just when you think you'd closed them all, another one pops up
 
yeah, and sometimes they would have sound, ect.
> I don't want to download your stupid dancing desktop stripper program!
 
Anyone used cheerio here...when I try to put a query-string url into an element ,say el.attribs.href = url the &in the url gets converted to &amp;...which is what I don't want...any workarounds to this?
 
6:33 AM
Mornin'
 
gave us a solid appreciation for having a browser without plugins I think
you can always tell the people who learned to use the internet after 2000, because they have browsers full of plugins that take up half the page
almost always internet explorer for that matter
Take my boss
please
 
what is an ellipse with one side (of the major axis) tapered called
 
@argentum47 egg?
I don't know if that technically qualifies as an ellipse
I figured an ellipse was to rectangle as circle is to square
 
6:48 AM
Simple.
Adblock, SO indenter, Tampermonkey.
 
like an egg, yes.. but a little elongated ...
 
rounded cone?
I don't think there's a technical name for that
 
If it is similar to an egg, just call it an egg, otherwise it is a cone or trapezoid with both ends rounded
 
egg-ish :P
 
6:55 AM
bonus points for being fun to pronounce
 

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