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3:00 PM
I prefer to spell it "falsey", I think it looks less like a typo that way.
 
@NickCraver false-like values? :P
 
@YiJiang for 0, undefined and such
 
I don't know, is falsy the technical term for those?
 
Maybe we should lobby a large dictionary organization to include "falsey" in their next unabridged English dictionary
 
@elduderino It's a paraphrase of Stephen Colbert, via Crockford
 
3:00 PM
Nan, empty string
@pointy - ah ok
 
Google: JavaScript+Falsey = 5790 results google.com/search?q=javascript+falsey
Google: JavaScript+Falsy = 31,900,000 results google.com/search?q=javascript+falsy
I'm a bandwagoner :)
 
truthy
 
Eeek, chat looks wierd on mobile webkit browser
 
@NickCraver lol
 
@jAndy did you switch it to regular view or are you using the mobile view?
 
3:02 PM
is there a mobile view? or are you just screwing with him?
cause that'd be a great gag
 
Regular view so far
 
well, perhaps try the mobile view (;
 
Input box is like miles away from the.bottom where it should be
 
Please can someone throw some light on this question: [stackoverflow.com/questions/4015297/… cheers
 
throws @Greg a torchlight
 
3:05 PM
need batteries...
 
@rchern: ok mobile view to the rescue :p
 
@NickCraver Time to write 26,000 answers on SO all containing the spelling "falsey" :-P
 
@AndyE - way to get us all google-banned, jerk!
 
Why write new ones? Just edit every existing javascript question to contain that word.
 
@jAndy, it's kinda, ya know, there for a reason (:
 
3:07 PM
@NickCraver haha
 
@AndyE Or, you know, you can just create the tag and edit the wiki
Then point people to it whenever they ask you about the correct spelling
 
@ChrisFarmer - I'm not sure how the re-indexing works, I see old answers in google with me having significantly lower rep, so they were indexed some time ago
 
heh i wonder how successful the Promote JS campaign has been
seeing that #1 result is jquery and #2 is java.com, #fail
 
Using a custom validator in ASP.NET that applies a javascript regex check. However, window.event is coming up as null why could this be?
 
3:08 PM
@YiJiang hmm.. that might be a little quicker than writing 26,000 answers
 
@NickCraver wouldn't that make you a bandwagoneer?
 
@rchern indeed, but I don't like mobile views in general. Droids webkit browser does perform pretty good in standard view
 
I mean as long as we are talking semantics haha
 
@HurnsMobile - touche
 
@Greg just answered with a possibility I found in the jstree documentation
 
3:14 PM
Is this a bad place to ask HTML questions?
 
@Pointy ok thanks, I'll give that a try and let you know how it goes
 
@raynos probably not...
 
@EtonB maybe because you're using Firefox?
 
jsfiddle.net/k24GG Why does every row get forced into the first colgroup?
 
@Raynos: is there a HTML chat room? You could create one if there isn't. The topic here is (supposed to be) JavaScript, but it should be fine to ask your question as long as we don't stray too off topic.
 
3:18 PM
@NickCraver What is vapor best used for? Is this an alternative to Jquery or to be used in tandem?
 
@MikeFielden Both! That's the beauty of it!
 
@MikeFielden, I'd just use vapor.js. The performance is amazing.
 
I think Ill start up a HTML/CSS room if the CSS doesnt exist yet
 
@Raynos CSS exists, but is very quiet

CSS

for discussion on CSS issues
 
That vapor site has to be the most basic barebones site ever, tells me literally nothing.
 
3:20 PM
For some reason I feel HTML & CSS go hand in hand
 
Ironically, the extra http request required for vapor.js is a performance hit, but I don't want to ruin the incredibly awesome meme :-P
 
would it be bad to create a room for both since CSS already exists?
Better take this to the meta chat room
 
I finally clicked the link to vapor.js and checked out the source on git. Very impressed by how concise it is.
 
@HurnsMobile: I've never seen such clarity in a framework before!
 
Is that chart on their homepage accurate as far as the other comparisons are concerned? Does jQuery really poop on mootols and prototype that hard?
 
3:23 PM
@Pointy I'm getting that error on IE too :(
 
@YiJiang is there any documentation on Vapor out there?
 
Ben
How would I go about loading vapor.js dynamically?
 
@MikeFielden All you need to do is to look at the README
 
@EtonB well "window.event" is an IE thing, so it'll never be there in FF. Might want to post a full-blown question so you can show the code, event handler, etc
 
@AndyE sure, that one request, but the performance gains you get later make up for it easily.
 
Ben
3:25 PM
I don't want to load vapor.js twice if it's already included on a page.
 
@Pointy thanks, didn't know that. here: stackoverflow.com/questions/4015974/…
 
Does this actually work:
1
A: Finding an OPTION element in a SELECT element using jQuery

sje397$('#music-groups option[text=New Order]').length != 0

 
Usage:

<script src="vapor.js"></script>

On modern browsers, you can inline it with a data URL:

<script src="data:application/javascript,"></script>

Alternatively, inline the whole code, like this:

<script></script>

(In this case, you can also omit the <script> tag completely for the ultimate in optimizations and efficiency!)
 
@AndyE - yeah it does
 
See, it's the best Javascript library in the world!
 
3:26 PM
heh
 
That IS ultimate
 
works well with the /dev/null database too
for web scale
 
does the /dev/null database support sharding?
 
instant sharding
all your data will instantly be sharded
read: blown away
 
fantastic.
 
3:27 PM
@NickCraver That makes very little sense, text isn't an attribute. Does it work like that in the CSS selectors spec?
 
@YiJiang seems like a joke im not getting....
 
ive always thought this job would be a lot easier without all that backend data
 
You guys actaully made me see whether vapor.js is a good library.
Bad humour
 
a bunch of programmers in a single chat room and you're shocked at bad humor floating around?
 
@HurnsMobile Good point...
 
3:29 PM
@AndyE - it's a property and Sizzle fetches like this:
 
@Pointy Thanks, I marked your answer as useful!
 
elem[ name ] != null ? elem[ name ] : elem.getAttribute( name ) code: github.com/jeresig/sizzle/blob/master/sizzle.js#L670
 
In what javascript engine does object[ "name" ] not work when getAttribute does?
 
@Raynos - blackberry's browser
the pre-webkit one, but that's not saying much since it pretty much sucked all around
things like "images" were too advanced
 
user405398
hi to all...
 
3:31 PM
@NickCraver Sounds like lynx
 
Selecting options by text seems kind-of fragile, esp. if i18n is a possibility
 
Hello, I'm wondering how to submit a parameter to a javascript function through textfiled.
 
@NickCraver ahh, I see. text isn't a valid property on all elements, so I hope that doesn't confuse the OP in the future.
 
also it depends on the property, for example the question @AndyE linked, element["text"] or element.text works, but it's not an attribute
@AndyE - oh ok I see where the confusion comes in there, yes I agree a comment on that answer would be appropriate pointing it out has nothing to do with jQuery.text().
 
@NickCraver Already done (sort of).
 
3:36 PM
does anyone know much about the history api?
 
@MildFuzz Linky?
 
what's the topic here right now?
 
trying to develop a better deep linking system html5demos.com/history
 
@didxga Anything you want to talk about.
 
3:39 PM
okey, great
 
tr.find(":disabled").css("disabled", "false"); (jQuery) that doesn't work :(
Why does .css("disabled", "false"); misbehave ?
 
It was about the greatest new js on the planet Vapor but we moved away from that
 
@YiJiang within the subject of JavaScript, of course.
 
shouldn't it be attr('disabled', false)
 
Are you disabling a <tr>?
 
3:40 PM
@Raynos Erm... disabled isn't a CSS property
 
@Raynos because the string "false" is not falsy.
 
yes disabled isn't css
 
so if you want private fields but can't use a closure, is the standard way to just prefix the name with an underscore? eg this._somePrivateField ?
 
argh -.-
 
oh yes also ".attr" not ".css"
 
3:41 PM
Classic mistake. Thanks Yi Jiang
 
@Raynos just use the keyword false and not a string
 
@washwithcare nope it's actually .attr("disabled", "disabled")
 
@KeeperOfTheSoul Yes, underscore is a pretty common convention for private variables.
 
@knight0323 that is not true - it works because the string "disabled" is truthy
@sworoc I don't like it because leading _ means "not a real variable" in Erlang
 
I always pass strings into .attr and .css does it matter whether its strings or number/booleans ?
 
3:43 PM
@Raynos it matters - setting the "disabled" attribute to the string "false" will set it to boolean true
 
>>> 'false' == true
false
>>> 'false' == false
false
.....
 
@Pointy I'm not sure I like underscore either, I just noted that it was a common convention.
 
@YiJiang if ('false') alert('false is true')
 
@Pointy Hmmm... okay
 
what does if ("string") get compared to?
does if(a) === if(!(a == null)) or something?
or more logically if(!a) === if(a == null)
 
Ben
3:47 PM
if() always checks if truthy or falsy for whatever is inside the parenthesis
 
@Raynos any non-empty string is true
 
I suppose, though !!a is simpler
 
@Raynos the semantic nuances of evaluating expression, with Javascript type conversion thrown in, take a long time to describe fully
 
I mean can i basically do if (x == truthy) ?
 
if(!!a) { } if you need a boolean
 
3:47 PM
@YiJiang When comparing a string to a boolean with == the string is first converted to a number.
 
you can do if(x == true)
 
@Raynos problem is that the "==" thing does the type conversion differently than a "truthiness check" does
 
I guess so.
 
"1" == true //-> true
"0" == false //-> true
 
Oh gawd... this truth thingy is a lot worse then I thought it is
 
3:49 PM
and of course, NaN doesn't equal anything :-P
 
How can I reference the control being validated in a javascript function? An example function would be myFunction(source,args) { .. }
 
It's worse than a bug, because even trying to account for it, you can still be wrong.
 
That's why I prefer ===
 
I am calling the function through a custom validator
 
Ben
it gets worse:
("1" == true) ? true : false -> true
("0" == true) ? true : false -> false
 
3:50 PM
Or have 3 pages of type coercing printed out and in front of me whenever I type ==
 
@Ben that's not worse, that's perverse
 
Ben
eh
nvm
 
rayfd.wordpress.com/2007/03/18/… - for anyone having trouble understanding 'truthiness' in js this is a must read
 
@Ben uh... that's pretty much the same :-)
 
Once you understand how js does its type conversion equality is a snap
 
Ben
3:52 PM
I guess I shouldn't be juggling my brain atm =P
 
@Ben if you feel like juggling i've got some regular expressions you could write for me ;)
 
Ben
lol, after I get this done I'm going to have a nice slow day -_o
 
@HurnsMobil Debugging edge cases because you forgot one little bit of the rule is so painful though :(
 
Ben
writing regex on a mon morning wouldn't be fun =/
 
This kind of off topic for JS but is this Chat functionality in the stackoverflow api?
 
3:54 PM
@MikeFielden: not that I'm aware of. I don't think the API has been updated since chat was launched
 
@AndyE Ok thanks... This would be great for the team where I work. Guess I'll wait.. :)
 
@MikeFielden It's not, no unfortunately
 
@MikeFielden that's a question for @balpha
 
yes it is and no it is not
glad to be of help :)
 
whacks @balpha with the JavaScript truth table
 
3:58 PM
whacks @YiJiang with an upper case S
 
no wonder, most people are in JS room
 
The only thing that's missing in JS to make the truth stuff really fun is Python's: True = False
 
@AndyE Haha!
 
0
Q: javascript window.event coming up null ?

Eton B.I am using a CustomValidator in ASP.NET as follows: <asp:CustomValidator ID="cvComment" ControlToValidate="txtComment" Display="None" EnableClientScript="true" ClientValidationFunction="validateComment" runat="server" ></asp:CustomValidator> And this is the function tha...

 
lol
 
3:59 PM
$.and() truth table

        | $.true  | $.false
---------------------------
$.true  | $.true  | $.false
$.false | $.false | $.false
2
 
omg what os tjos
aspdoi
 
@balpha that is great
 
hehe
reminds me of the jQelse plugin
 
btw, what is the backend of this chatroom?
 
@EtonB you need to reply to the people commenting on your question using @name. For example, @AndyE.
 
4:00 PM
@itsnotvalid - It's fortran based node.js
 
@balpha just broke my mind
 
@NickC
@NickCraver Fortran really?
 
Wow node.js, all javascript stull
 
@AndyE does that send them a notification ?
 
@NickCraver are you just kidding? Fortran?
 
4:01 PM
yep, raw speed!
 
@Raynos Also, vapor.js for raw speed!
 
@EtonB Yep.
 
@EtonB Yes sir
 
I thought the DB bindings were written in COBOL? :(
 
@YiJiang You ruined the believable hoax
 
4:01 PM
node.js is event driven ,very speedy
 
any code snippets for Fortran based node.js?
 
@Raynos Right, because node .js was written in FORTRAN. Hmmm....
 
@AndyE thanks!
 
@EtonB: No problem :) Remember, only one @ notification goes through per comment
 
@itsnotvalid - we don't have any, the SO guys keep the code a closely guarded secret
 
4:03 PM
sorry but what's Fortran
 
best language evar
 
fortran's an older language, what the druids wrote code in iirc
2
 
@MooGoo That would be lolcodez
 
I thought jQuery was the best language evar?
 
@YiJiang in my memory node.js is written in C++...
 
4:04 PM
in Chat feedback, Oct 15 at 16:05, by balpha
the server is running cobol, the client is written in brainf*ck and translated to JS with Google's &%/$§%&"&% compiler
 
jquery is the language of god
 
stonehenge = like a fort, fortran
 
@Andy E jquery is a language?
 
@AndyE jQuery is work of the devil
 
@didxga: didn't you know!?
 
4:04 PM
@Andy E it's a framework for javascript
 
@didxga - not yet but I think some people are working on getting that approved
 
Stop sprouting nonsense
Its rather silly.
Some people are actaully taking you seriously. Its mean
 
@Raynos I am thinking that they are testing the reputation system of chat.stackoverflow
 
@AndyE yes, it change the way people write javascript.
 
@Raynos l apologise :p
 
4:06 PM
@didxga - he knows, he's one of the top JavaScript and jQuery posters :) stackoverflow.com/tags/javascript/topusers
 
IE9 compiled Javascript... discuss!
 
Theres a reputation system?
 
@Atømix - a.k.a. broken?
 
@NickCraver Bottom last 30 days, I've been slacking ;-)
 
Is the stupid question quotient higher for javascript than other topics
 
4:07 PM
@AndyE - you always show up on the bottom so you can compare :)
@MooGoo - I dunno, there are a lot of vb.net questions...
 
Hmmm.... and it sounded like a pretty good idea.
 
@NickCraver of course, I forgot about that. Not even bottom then! dang...
 
@NickCraver so are you sure there is some Fortran code in this specific node.js? If not, I am going to test the reputation system. Just don't get this too wrong
 
You can get IE9 style behavior with your JavaScript today, just insert random invalid characters like crazy to break it
 
@NickCraver Geesh... well, you don't have to look far from HTML + CSS...
 
4:08 PM
@itsnotvalid - there's no fortran involved here :)
 
Javascript RegEx validations for GridView fields is b eing a lot more complicated than I had hoped :(
 
So... is it the implementation... or the fact that it's compiled. IOW, is compiled javascript a good idea, if implemented well?
 
Is there any way to call a javascript function within a RegularExpressionValidator?
 
well... that is great... it was so close that I am about to delete my account here if they are really using some customized version of node.js written in Fortran...
 
what do you mean compiled
into some kinda bytecode
 
4:09 PM
@EtonB Use Regex literals if your regexes are static. I can spot one problem in your code.
new RegExp("^[a-zA-Z0-9',!;?@#%*.\s]{1,1000}$");
 
@Atømix - it's their marketting department, it's traced and inlined like every other browser has been doing for some time now, it's nothing new
 
\s should be \\s when constructing a regex with a string. Inside a regex literal you can stick to \s
 
The problem is IE9 has serious JS bugs, they need to fix those, this is true of any language: performance means nothing if the result isn't correct.
 
new bugs or just inherited from previous ie's?
 
@EtonB so your code becomes:
/^[a-zA-Z0-9',!;?@#%*.\s]{1,1000}$/
 
4:11 PM
@MooGoo - both, but mostly new ones
 
@NickCraver Thanx. Trying to separate the wheat from the chaff.
 
Why compile javascript? :\
 
I mean hey IE6 rendered pretty fast too, it's quicker when you don't do things like calculate margins, etc
 
@NickCraver The biggest problem is ECMAScript / JavaScript discrepancies. It would be nice to consolidate the spec, which we are slowly moving closer to.
 
@AndyE , as in var reComment = new RegExp(/^[a-zA-Z0-9',!;?@#%*.\s]{1,1000}$/); ?
 
4:12 PM
@EtonB: lose the constructor. var reComment = /^[a-zA-Z0-9',!;?@#%*.\s]{1,1000}$/;
 
Did they(MS) update their beta in anyways? Last time I checked FABridge was broken...
 
@sworoc - make sure you qualify that you're saying the JavaScript specification that Mozilla maintains, there's a big difference most are ambiguous on
 
compared to the hell of ie 6, ie 8/9's issues never seemed that bad to me
 
@sworoc The biggest problem is multiple browsers
 
I think Mozilla's frustration lies in the speed of ECMAScript, a decade passed between the last 2 revisions (3rd and 5th)
 
4:13 PM
@NickCraver Right, sorry. Still looking forward to having a yield statement cross-browser :)
 
@EtonB: Spotted something else - you also want to escape a period, . becomes \.
 
aye, agreed many JS 1.x features will be nice
 
yes emcascript evolves at a glacial pace
would be nice if even the mozilla extensions were implemented in version 5
 
though, until corps start moving off IE6 and even IE8 which is a long way off, we're still constrained
 
but instead the language is virtually unchanged
 
4:14 PM
@NickCraver The problem was getting everyone on board with 4th. That failed, and caused huge delays.
 
On the other hand, what a powerful base language, look at all of the things built from it!
 
@AndyE, I see, thanks. Works right :) Still can't find out how I can replace window.event to make it browser compatible
 
anyone know how to convert tabular data to .CVS in non IE browser??
 
Trying to validate a certain field being edited within a gridview that is inside another gridview...
So I figured RegularExpressionValidator next to the field would work but I need it to trigger a javascript function for an alert , is that possible?
 
@EtonB It's hard to tell from your code and I'm not very well versed in ASP.net, but it looks like the source argument should be the event object in other browsers.
4 messages moved to Sandbox ner ner
 
4:20 PM
@AndyE true - not sure how much of an issue is it these days
 
how come scrollHeight is returning equal values for an iframe that has a scroll and no scroll?
 
@Espresso how come your using an iframe?
 
@NickCraver Hopefully "Harmony" will be able to live up to its name and help move the standard forward.
 
@Raynos why not? it exists, it is valuable in a way
 
@Espresso: An element will always have scrollHeight, whether its scrollbars are displayed or not.
 
4:26 PM
@Raynos it's for a tumblr theme. i want to dynamically adjust the iframe height so there won't be any ugly vertical scrollbars.
 
@Espresso i just did this today in the work
 
@AndyE I hope so too, not holding my breath though :)
time to order the OS drive replacement! newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148348
awww newegg doesn't get a preview box
 
@didxga I thought html5 depecrated both iframes & frames. Apparently iframes are still valid
 
@Raynos what's the alternative for iframe in HTML5?
 
4:30 PM
$250 ouch
 
Ben
That's cheap, I paid $350 for my 128gb ~feb
 
Yeah, not bad for an SSD
 
Id rather pay $30
 
I'd rather put that on my Christmas list
 
wow, what happened to irc?
 
4:32 PM
I'm running my machine off a 7200rpm drive atm though, dog slow compared to the 300gb 10k it was on
 
@DenizDogan ?
 
I don't want to rebuild twice, better to grab the drive and go ahead
 
@rchern i'm joking, but this is like IRC on drugs (and with points!)
 
they each have their strengths and weaknesses
 
Well, it displays points :)
 
4:34 PM
that's true, nick, lots of irc channels have karma in at least one resident bot
 
anytime mentions irc, the server should add that message! LOL
 
so this is all logged?
 
aye
 
:( i should stop talking about drugs then
what small world it is though, i recognize both rchern and nick from SO
anyways, i
'm out of here
 
Is it possible to get rep here?
 
4:39 PM

Sandbox

Where you can play with regular chat features (except flagging...
2 messages moved to Sandbox
@EtonB - not that I'm aware of
 
nope, no gaining rep. but you could lose rep via spam
 
Ben
wow, this is nice
 
Any way to see who's in the chatroom ?
 
the gravatars on the right?
 
@rchern psh, i can be such a moron sometimes. thanks
 
Tom
Does anyone recommend a framework for server sided object creation/inheritance for Javascript (run with Node.js)? Also related to my question here: stackoverflow.com/questions/4008766/…
 
@AndyE I managed to solve my problem but I can't answer my own question yet. Could you add the answer if I provide it to you so I can close the question and prevent someone to spend time on it? I mean, you helped me in a way anyways
Nevermind, I can answer it
Err.. didn't work on Firefox, even though I am using the source argument as such:
`var check = document.getElementById(source.id);
var checky = check.attributes["controltovalidate"].value;
var checkyo = document.getElementById(checky);
var validHour = reOutHour.test(checkyo.value);`
How can I debug a VS2005 website with Firefox ?
 
How widely is node.js used today on server side?
 
What part are you trying to debug ?
@vivekian2 from my understanding it's mostly for real-time application
 
@vivekian2 It's sufficiently buggy that only the brave and insane are using it in production
 
4:59 PM
public ValidationContext(object instance, IServiceProvider serviceProvider, IDictionary<object, object> items) documentation: msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd538582.aspx
if you label the parameters as optional, actually make them optional, k?
 
Tom
Pointy, what makes you think it's that buggy?
 

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