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user1125394
1:00 PM
have to remember that review means downvote
 
um, what?
 
user1125394
 
@cyril No, it doesn't. It means "review". We have been known to bring posts that we believe are worthy of a downvote to general attention, but you should go into with an open mind, just like you should with and - I don't cv/delv everything that lands on my desk, and neither should you ;-)
 
user1125394
yes no prob
 
https://codeanywhere.net/
https://c9.io/

Is this the same?
 
1:13 PM
@webarto "the same", i dunno. but they certainly sound alike
 
user1125394
isn't fiddler2.com/fiddler2 also similar?
 
@cHao Yes, not same per se, similar in purpose. I don't think this is good idea... Thanks...
 
g'day
 
<?='Write your code in the cloud'?>
 
Thats wrong in so many ways..
 
1:28 PM
im trying to write a ACL class, but first I want to create an Authentication class which authenticates whether the user exist in db and the passwords are correct. so I have a method checkCreditentials in my authentication class , which does a query and checks if the username and password are correct
but it first has to decrypt the password before doing the query. should I put the decryption method in Users class?
 
user1125394
define "decrypt the password"
 
when i save the password, i encrypt it
 
user1125394
how
 
by any encryption method md5 which I know is bad
I will later focus on the encrytion methods to be used
 
user1125394
just compare the hashes
 
1:35 PM
my question the operation such as comparing hashes
should I have a class called Security that handles these stuff
 
Hashing != Encryption :)
 
or put them in User Class or in Authentication class
 
user1125394
if (md5("salt".$password) === $savedpassword)
 
i love collisions.. puts enjoyment in my life every now and then :)
 
user895378
@DaveRandom So I'm slowly familiarizing myself with RFC 1035 and the php-dns-lib code and I'll probably have some questions that will seem pretty obvious to you. The first of which is, Does a response message also contain the original Question data as well? Or just the ID allowing the client to match a response to the original request?
 
user895378
1:42 PM
+---------------------+
|        Header       |
+---------------------+
|       Question      | <--- Do responses have this too?
+---------------------+
|        Answer       |
+---------------------+
|      Authority      |
+---------------------+
|      Additional     |
+---------------------+
 
@rdlowrey I think the standard is a little non-specific on the first point, the ID is always present and identical. In practical terms, however, I have not yet seen a response that doesn't contain the original question.
 
user895378
@DaveRandom I see. Thanks :)
 
@rdlowrey Please note: it has been brought to my attention that my API and particularly the inheritance sucks. I am doing something about this today. Also note that I only implemented the original record types set out in RFC1035, many of are redundant, and a lot of commonly used record types are not included. I have just added AAAA to my local repo, but I'm not pushing anything until the whole thing has been reworked. I am planning to push before the end of the day.
 
user895378
Okay :) I asked because I was surprised to see the question properties and methods as part of the response classes as well.
 
user895378
It's fine -- OOP is a constant, iterative refinement process ... at least it is for me.
 
user895378
1:47 PM
If all we needed to do was "make it work," then we wouldn't waste time meticulously fitting classes to the underlying domain model.
 
Also I have yet to provoke a response that contains any "additional" records.
@rdlowrey First sentence of section 4.1 sums up the reason for that:
> All communications inside of the domain protocol are carried in a single format called a message.
The Packet class is only really there to provide a simple string pointer mechanism, basically it's a stream. I'm probably going to make it writable in the reworking, because I think it will be an easy way to deal with the compression.
 
user895378
When I first started working my way through the RFC I was like, @DaveRandom is a liar! This is way longer than ten pages! Then I realized most of it is describing details that are only relevent if you're creating a DNS server and not just posing questions.
 
@rdlowrey Yeh the only parts that are really relevant to implementing the protocol are sec3.1-3.4 and sec4, 3.5 as well if you want to handle PTR lookups.
 
user895378
I skimmed the RFC a couple of times this weekend. Now I'm in the process of matching up your code with the various concepts (which makes it easier to grasp what's supposed to happen -- like putting a face with a name). I'll probably need to read the relevant sections a few more times to really feel comfortable with the protocol before I can contribute anything useful, though.
 
:-)
 
user895378
2:05 PM
/me worries we scared off PHPers with scary DNS talk
 
dns is too simple to be scary.
Well it is at the basics level ;)
 
user1125394
@rdlowrey if you managed http, dns should do it
 
@Christian I don't get it.
 
2:23 PM
@cyril not sure if unsetting the array in the callback has defined behavior.
 
user1125394
@Gordon java doesn't like this :p
 
user895378
Has the idea of an immutable sequence datatype ever come up on php internals? Something like a python tuple?
 
user895378
You basically can't do anything in PHP without mutable state ... every time I want to return a sequence of values and not variables I have to manually implement Iterator. Is this difficult? No, but it seems like a native immutable sequence type would be a no-brainer.
 
user895378
2:40 PM
Of course, it's possible that iteration is a separate concern and that's what the IteratorAggregate interface is for ...
 
user895378
But still ...
 
user1125394
just curious are there people with PhD around
 
PhD in what...
 
user1125394
Science
 
I assume Computer Science... probably not, what is the reason you are asking?
 
user1125394
2:53 PM
going to try to apply
 
user1125394
research is more fun than harsh development
 
user895378
Research is fun ... but don't kid yourself ... you have to publish or you'll be out of a job quick.
 
its a mill
 
I prefer making money...
 
user895378
And publishing can be even more stressful than production work because you can spend massive amounts of time and journals can subjectively deem that your work isn't interesting or worthy of publication. At least with production you can point to a specific, functioning result that works.
 
2:57 PM
Morning all
 
user1125394
yea, I have been with phd's for some time
 
@MikeB morning
@rdlowrey First time in ages I've seen you this early. Or is it because I just don't see it?
 
user1125394
underpaid, and used by professors, but you can work on innovations on the other hand
 
user895378
@PeeHaa lol no. Amazingly, I've actually been awake for almost two hours!
 
That is amazingly :)
 
3:02 PM
Hello guys, nice to meet u all
 
Resen
 
@TemporaryNickName hiya
 
@PeeHaa hey
Ermm, guys I have a stupid question
Is it safe to carry around data (i.e. password) between pages using session?
#note I'm not trying to store password into cookies, just want to pass data using session
 
u are already logged in what ya mean
 
@TemporaryNickName Why do you think you need to pass the password around?
 
3:05 PM
save the password as a hash but u are already in
connect with ssl slam dunk nothing in the clear
 
"An update on the LinkedIn GitHub Application"
...
"...we wanted to let you know that we will be closing the application today."
 
@Christian What is a linkedin? ;)
 
@PeeHaa Not the point. My point is, since when removing support for something is considered an "update"?
 
@Christian I can think of some software packets ;-)
 
@PeeHaa Uhm, you lost me there.
 
3:08 PM
yeah sometimes a removal is an upgrade
 
Anyhow, at its best, it would be a downgrade.
 
What's that for an application?
 
@DrewPierce That's misuse of terms.
 
you know what i mean
 
@Christian You can not misuse terms. You use them. If they have a different meaning, you still use them, just redefining them. Language is fluid.
 
3:09 PM
like let's say you remove McAfee. now that is an upgrade
 
@DrewPierce Are any of those others fucked up bloated scanners. Yep
 
lol
 
Oh, wanna upgrade to Norton?
 
@DrewPierce Sure, metaphorically.
 
Zend studio to editplus -> also upgrade
 
3:11 PM
@hakre "You're an idiot." See what I did there?
 
@Christian You're offensive because of what I wrote I assume :P
 
@hakre Nope. I misused "idiot".
 
Btw, Idiot is really a great word.
 
The actual term would have been, "you misunderstand".
 
lol
 
3:13 PM
@Christian Well, I cared more about the term "misuse". I find it rather inflexibly used here ;)
 
@PeeHaa I don't think I need to pass around password at all in my application. Sorry about that lol
 
@hakre I'm a firm believer in language change for a purpose, not by popular consensus. Though I admit it gets harder by the minute.
 
@TemporaryNickName np :)
 
just dont connect in the clear
 
what do you mean by don't connect in the clear?
 
3:15 PM
 
@Christian Well, normally, the plebs set the language, no idea if that is the group you wanted to name by "popular consensus".
 
use ssl
 
Ah and then there was television. But, uhm, did that work out well?
 
a lot of wiresharks out there temp
 
And nowadays, oh gosh, it's the internets.
 
3:16 PM
I mean, we write our own dictionaries and encyclopediae on the web nowadays.
Right, we used to write dictionaries with the TV.
 
seems like 90% of connects are done with like posts without any encryption
people are tards
 
Well, if anything, TV set the path to downfall (via the 'net).
 
Oprah set the downfall
no Jerry Springer
 
So let's raise the intellectual level in this channel at least.
 
@DrewPierce That's it, I'm out for now. 'Laters all.
 
3:18 PM
@DrewPierce Thx, SSL looks reliable
 
Is that irony?
 
That's good Christian because 5 syllable words hurt my skull
of course unless you beat Beast or Crime attacks your website blows
few people take security seriously
 
so does SSL works similar to the Session but more secure way?
 
user895378
SSL and sessions have nothing to do with one another.
 
ssl is a secure connection based on pki and a certificate authority
sessions are like a bucket of variables on the server
if your data store means anything other than a recipe database you need to get your website upgraded to be better than TLS 1.0 otherwise ssl/tls can be hacked
prob is that many browsers don't support > tls1.0
 
3:30 PM
@DrewPierce are there any web reference or anything that I can update myself about security info around web?
 
ssllabs.com point it to your https server
get a ssl cert at startssl.com free 1 yr
greenbar no less
 
@TemporaryNickName owasp.org
 
thx guys!
 
have at least your initial login dones via ssl then you can go homegrown with php mod crypt but if you are working for a bank why not just stay ssl the whole time
and never store passwords in the clear or transmit them that way. Salt your crypt.
 
@TemporaryNickName cve.mitre.org
@TemporaryNickName cwe.mitre.org/top25
 
3:37 PM
lol i remember it from a CCNA course at uni. They taught me similar one called 30 Top security issues or something
 
@TemporaryNickName webappsec.org
Been a while since I had to trawl for those links tbh
 
If the data on your website needs to be protected all the time (e.g. it is sensitive data) considerer either: Not running a HTTP service if you can get away with it, or at least implementing Strict Transport Security headers so browsers will in the future rewrite HTTP URLs to HTTPS.
If it is a public website the first suggestion probably won't work, as users are likely to connect over HTTP first.
 
u could use mod rewrite to force https
 
@NiekBergman Not sure how widely HSTS is supported
 
@Leigh: True, but it won't hurt anything if you send the headers :)
It would also be recommended to rewrite the URLs on your own to HTTPS then :)
E.g. if a user visits yoursecuresite.com it should redirect to yoursecuresite.com
 
3:42 PM
@NiekBergman Absolutely, send headers, and send a permanently moved header redirecting
 
HTTPS is so cheap these days, I use it for my personal site
 
Also, do note that you can't "take back" a HSTS header easily... if you want to experiment with it, set it to a low TTL :)
 
for instance if you goto secure.mathpdq.com/demo it forces https via mod rewrite
 
@DrewPierce Mod rewrite is for chumps ;)
 
3:44 PM
lol
mod rewrite is a pain in the ...
 
@DrewPierce What I mean is... nginx doesn't have mod rewrite ;)
 
i know
 
and nginx works really well as an https terminator
 
whatever their scheme you can redirect
then there is node.js which is completely screwed up
 
what do you mean?
 
3:47 PM
better to put a bullet in your head than use node
google node.js denial of service u will get the picture. brings your server down
 
user895378
Why anyone would want to write server-side code in js is completely beyond me ...
 
js is like dog crap
 
...
 
Unless it's jquery
 
hats off to rd for that comment
 
3:49 PM
Because it's less crappy than PHP!
 
@rdlowrey I have a project going using react at the moment :D
 
user895378
I'll never feel good about Prototypal inheritance ...
 
And node is pretty nice for realtime stuff; mainly websockets.
 
prototype give me a break
 
@ThiefMaster Ratchet (react) is pretty damn good at it too.
 
3:50 PM
but a fool can crash your node server
what good is it then
 
@ThiefMaster did you mentioned its fast too :3
 
user895378
@DrewPierce That looks like roughly the same hash collision attack that php was vulnerable to back in 2011
 
it's not fast if it is down
 
@DrewPierce Yeh, 'cos PHP is bulletproof...
3
 
dos on apache ?
 
3:52 PM
@DrewPierce a fool cant
if a fool can you are a super fool :3
to write such a pony server
 
user895378
I think multiple server-side languages had the same problem not too long ago where you could perpetrate a hash collision attack with a large POST request
 
u wanna see the links
 
@DrewPierce send em :3
@DaveRandom you think so ?
 
alright hold on i will do your homework
 
@DaveRandom IT WALKED???
 
just for an idea of how fast node.js can be
 
hooray inconsistent segfaults when running phpunit
 
show me a node server i will take it down
 
@rdlowrey Easily solved with sane values. I think I set my max post vars at 20... I kinda figured, take my typical use, double it, add on some, then add on some more for good luck.
 
user895378
3:55 PM
@Leigh Yeah, I agree -- I'm just saying that it's not just "a node.js issue" ... Ruby had the same problem as well.
 
Dec 30, 2011 - V8 has been changed since then like 7 times
 
not solved it is still the same ab
 
Hmm
 
post the link to your node.js server we will see how it goes with V8
cripple the mofo
 
@hakre You still here?
 
3:56 PM
@webarto Yes it even sort of runs. It's getting harder and harder to sit down...
 
@PeeHaa hello :)
 
@Abhishek </sarcasm>
 
@hakre DOMdoc / xpath question.
Is it possible to get all textnodes which arent in a tag?
 
Did you know? - Line feeds in attribute values are allowed in HTML 5.
 
@PeeHaa -1 not enough jQuery
 
@PeeHaa Well, you mean outside of the document?
 
@PeeHaa Everything is in a tag
 
@hakre Directly under the body tag, but not in a child tag
 
@DrewPierce try it on expressjs.com
and besides here is why you want to write a server on node.js , can u write a realtime app in php ?
 
@PeeHaa Part of your problem to get them might be because a parent p element is added, let me check.
 
4:00 PM
i will bring your server down not theirs !
 
@hakre Exactly. That's the problem
 
@DrewPierce well , i havent got one that i would volunteer for it :P
 
(hacky but works)
 
but the best practice is to put node.js behind ngnix , oh yet another thing node.js is usually for realtime apps :P i wonder why the heck are you actually bitching it on something its not even supposed to do ?
 
<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/loose.dtd">
<html><body><p>dit wel</p><p>dit ook niet</p><test>maar niet dit</test></body></html>
 
4:03 PM
@DaveRandom Huh? Ow lol it's @DaveRandom. hoi :) And hacky, but works for me :)
 
I just though I'd join @Lusitanian and screw with you people by changing my avatar
 
@PeeHaa codepad.viper-7.com/bRvIkj (taking body instead of div)
 
of course you are not using node.js. we knew that. what I hate is my server shutting down because it is single threaded and cant handle denial of service attacks which node has not addressed
real time apps dont work too well when the server gets flooded and croaks
 
@hakre @DaveRandom I love you guys, but you already know that right :)
 
If your server "shuts down" (probably just hangs or runs into the oom-killer) you did not configure your rlimits properly.
 
4:05 PM
so do your homework
 
And why not submit a patch to fix the problem? :)
 
@DrewPierce here
node.js is a scripting machine , much like php
 
@Abhishek eeeeeew ;)
 
i challenge u to implement a pure php http server in php , then we try to DoS it :3
@PeeHaa bad comparision but i dunt know how to explain him
 
Hey guys, want to see the best way to implement a PHP script that shows your IP? niekie.com/pi/whatismyip.php.txt OH GOD IT BURNS.
 
4:07 PM
@hakre Oh duh I never thought of that.
 
(at least you can't complain it doesn't have enough comments ;-))
 
the only thing that can protect node is a firewall it is well documented
 
@ThiefMaster got a server ?
with ngnix ? lets give this person a bait :D
 
the tools are there. give a url.
 
@webarto stockport.aquacool.ltd.uk/urlpoller - UI not as polished as yours (yet) and have yet to implement websockets but mine is Faster Than Yoursâ„¢ :-P
 
4:10 PM
@Abhishek fbi.com/node-admin :p
 
lol u jokers
 
@MikeB ;D cia.gov/node sounds better no ?
 
@NiekBergman wtf man :P
 
anyway we are in a php forum probably because we believe in it
 
@DaveRandom Mine is bigger, oh, wait, looks good :D And it's much better IMHO. I saw a notification few days ago, thank you for help and share some code :) I was AFK
 
4:11 PM
@PeeHaa: exactly ;)
 
@webarto NP - the DNS stuff is work-in-progress and not recommended for use by anyone for anything at all at the moment. Will share the full source when it is less likely to make you vomit on your keyboard.
 
user895378
To whom it may concern: I've just placed a bounty of +100 on Law of Demeter - Data objects. I don't feel the accepted answer is worthy of the question. @tereško you may be interested in this topic ...
 
@DaveRandom I guess you haven't seen the horrors I have :D I'm sure your code is fine and you have OCD or something.
 
@DrewPierce Btw to end this (end+sense) less debate Php and Node.js are two different philosophies you just cant compare them , for a small dynamic page sometimes php can be a better solution , node.js on the other hand is for realtime applications when u want 100,000 web-sockets to provide realtime content to your clients .. you just cant do that with php i tried to write a socket server in php scaled upto 100 clients and then to execution was barely reasonable. Its just not made to do the work
 
@webarto Oh if only you knew...
 
4:15 PM
@Abhishek You probably did it wrong
 
@Leigh nah
it was a celeron D as test case (x and a ball on one html page which animated
the result should look the same on all clients
 
i am cool with that ab but i cannot stand its vulnerabilities. i used to write low level code. nothing will compete against flat out assembly or C like layers of apache. but it the server dies then you do not have 100k sockets
 
@DrewPierce use ngnix in front of it
 
dos does not go away
 
hell does DoS doesnt go away with shoutcast , its still used nearly everywhere!
 
4:17 PM
@Abhishek did you use a socket stream server listener and dispatch to worker threads?
 
@Leigh no
 
yeah cuz they have a firewall
 
i was comparing it to node
 
So you did it wrong
 
Hey folks
 
4:18 PM
@NiekBergman you do not need the head and body HTML tags here.
 
so let em stay similar *
 
@DaveRandom: DNS stuff? Tell me more :-)
 
cisco is protecting shoutcast
 
@DrewPierce DaFuQ ?
 
node itself is vulnerable
 
4:19 PM
you can host a shoutcast server at your house , how can cisco protect your homeserer ?
 
@rdlowrey cheap ass ;)
 
@DaveRandom: because I recently tried to implement a script doing huge zone transfers in PHP with Net_DNS2 but it used way too much memory.
 
i thought u meant a service at shoutcast so then u will go down at home
 
user895378
@PeeHaa lol I can't afford much -- still trying to get to 10k :)
 
user895378
not trying very hard, admittedly, but still ...
 
4:20 PM
@rdlowrey 10K is useless. Aim for 20.
 
@Leigh lets make a benchmark shall we :D
 
@rdlowrey Let me find a good answer by you tonight so I can help you reach it :)
 
user895378
@PeeHaa You might have to look for a while :)
 
@rdlowrey I like the traits one
 
@PeeHaa Link?
 
4:22 PM
51
A: PHP: Traits vs. Interfaces

rdlowreyLet's start by saying this: Object-Oriented Programming (OOP) can be a difficult paradigm to grasp. Just because you're using classes doesn't mean your code is Object-Oriented (OO). To write OO code you need to understand that OOP is really about the capabilities of your objects. You've...

first post!
 
@PeeHaa Only because my connection sucks.
 
:)
 
Let's make him write a canonical, for something that doesn't have it yet :D
 
there are some that suggest that php is not oop
 
user895378
4:27 PM
Oh geez. A language isn't OOP or not. PHP gives you everything you need to write OOP code. Whether you do or not is up to you.
7
 
@DrewPierce That ^^^
 
yeah some say it is object aware
 
user895378
Certainly, php isn't an object-oriented language. Everything isn't an object like Python, for example. That doesn't mean you can't write OO code with it.
 
well most don't write classes. my question is do you think PHP can be one.
 
user895378
That's part of why PHP is popular ... it's like Swiss-army knife -- you can use it to do pretty much anything.
 
4:29 PM
or is it a script kiddy nightmare
 
user895378
You either write OO code or you don't. PHP has no bearing on that.
 
@DaveRandom stop :(
 
@rdlowrey or Ruby :P
 
I love when i come here with a question and by writing it i find an answer
 
@webarto Ruby is off-topic here :) I should put that in our room description or something.
3
 
@LeviMorrison Hey, my loyalty is not to be questioned because of my statement :P
 
Hey guys one question. How can i check if joined rows exists since i have two left joins inside the query and first result always exists? I was thinkig something like this.
 
user1125394
can you write a quite big OO design in node.js ? or is it continually callbacks inside callbacks
 
5:13 PM
@cyril Wrong question. The real question is: would you like to be the maintainer of a large OO node.js project?
 
user1125394
@LeviMorrison I mean when the code becomes big, it's better to turn it OO, but not sure node.js is done for
 
user1125394
sorry to reput this subject btw
 
Good work, PHP chat room. I didn't have to moderate any stars when I came into chat today.
 
user1125394
and i think best events servers might be rather in python and java
 
5:28 PM
I mentioned Ruby in one sentence and I'm accused of blasphemy, off-topic, and whatnot...
 
@webarto YOU HEATHEN!!!! PITCHFORKS IN YOUR FACE!!!!
 
@webarto honestly, though, I've noticed that any complaining about a response you get on here either gets ignored or turns into a completely useless back and forth taking up screens of messages. You're better off calling your Mom and complaining about her mistreatment of you when you were 5.
 
@Stephane I don't get it, what does it have to do with me?
 
@webarto Pfft Ruby... Can't use jQuery with Ruby...
 
5:34 PM
@MadaraUchiha Server side jQuery, sounds awesome :D
 
@webarto Heard of phpQuery?
 
@webarto your comment about Ruby got you some negative responses and you seem to want people to respond differently. I'm saying good luck with that. This place doesn't work that way. This is the most helpful place but also often completely unsympathetic.
 
@MadaraUchiha lolwut, who needs this, really?
 
@webarto No idea really. I was sure you developed it.
 
@webarto I hope you know that I wasn't bullying you. :)
 
5:37 PM
@LeviMorrison and I think it's awesome how much time some of you put into moderating and helping.
It's appreciated greatly.
 
@Stephane Oh, OK. I don't like Ruby, I just replied to @rdlowrey when he said that everything in Python is an object. @LeviMorrison Oh, no worries, internet raised me :P
I don't complain, I kick ass...
 
Dayum.
 
anyone has some experience with phing?
 
@Stephane It is not completely true that this room is unsympathetic, for one, if you are getting help for free, then it sure is sympathy... You sometimes don't get smile on top of that, but what are you going to do...
 
So my workplace figured how to make me stay longer without realising it
 
5:42 PM
I want to specify the path of my custom build.xml file, I need to be in its directory right now to launch any command, it kinda sucks...
 
@Leigh Say
 
they gave me free beer, and i've been coding for an hour past when I'd normally leave
didn't even look at the time
 
user1125394
@FlorianMargaine no but nice name, sounds like phpthing
 
well, it is a php thing :)
 
monday 16:30, i was issued beer and cake, my productivity is the highest it's been all day
 
5:43 PM
@Leigh Clever & sneaky bastards. Don't ever leave them :D
 
@webarto to clarify, if you have an opinion that differs from the hivemind, it doesn't go anywhere. I've seen people try to explain themselves and it's never changed anyone's mind. This place is awesome. Really. And it can be difficult to get your point across. So usually I just ask and listen. If I don't get what I want, I go elsewhere or ask again in a different way at a different time. I don't fight what I get.
 
user1125394
Traits are essentially language assisted copy and paste. — Shahid Nov 14 at 5:58
 
@Stephane Don't trust the individual negative response, only when they come en masse should you consider they may have a basis ;)
There's a lot of "experts" here, who's "expert opinion" is based on google + clicking w3schools.
3
 
@Leigh haha true you always have to filter. And I've gotten great help from many of you. It's not about trusting or not trusting a response, it's that people that are helping are sometimes easily frustrated by someone questioning their help and I've learned to avoid questions to certain people on here because of how they jump on people. Even these comments are helpful, it's just a little one-sided sometimes.
 
@steph u can rely on my answers. stay close to them.
 
5:55 PM
Cute
 
@FlorianMargaine Negatory.
I think maybe @rdlowrey has used it though.
 

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