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3:00 PM
If you could see it on a crappy monitor you would see the whole page is effectively the EXACT same color.
 
especially since the font colors don't actually blend with the color scheme
 
@hakre was in just terms of the generic question.. the Inline PHP is something everyone starts with.. The question that you posted was bad, but I was just saying everyone starts some where, thats all :)
 
It does not pop.
 
my eyes are drawn to the reds and greens before actually paying attention to the content
 
@LeviMorrison allow to switch :D
 
3:00 PM
@CarrieKendall It helps that it is front and center :)
I'm not set on B, I'm just trying to find something better than A.
 
@TutelageSystems jup, normally a kind link to the PHP manual is provided, however that guy is just dumping the next code-block.
 
@LeviMorrison doesn't pop as in it's not the first thing your eyes go to, but it does stand out, since you have a large block of solid color (white) where there isn't anywhere else on the page
 
@ircmaxell There's quite a lot of white on the page. And nearly everything on the page is a light color.
Maybe I'm just way out of touch or something. I still think it's you guys though.
 
it clear to me what you should do, peanut butter jelly time the background
 
@LeviMorrison not a single white box of size that's a box (the changelog above it is white, but it's clearly different)
@CarrieKendall OH GOD, THE FLASHBACKS
/me runs away
 
3:03 PM
hmhmhmhmhm, now you can design in peace @LeviMorrison >:]
 
Anonymous
@LeviMorrison B is good. But too bluish. So: A
 
> do we need .htacess for this or can we this using architecture in php ? How to write a php oop related to this ? Architecture = MVC I need a simple and clean solution for this
 
-1
Q: how does page urls work with php and htaccess

ఠ_ఠI have a question regarding this since i was starting to work with php.How can this be done ? do we need a architecture before ? how do we plan it ? so on.lets make it sense. Example: index.php?bla=country&bla=town&foo=title And how would i make the page URL like bellow /country/town/titl...

 
@hakre reply that the SO code generator is currently down for maintenance ;]
 
Anonymous
@Fabien teamwork now :p
 
Aye, sitting there.
 
Anonymous
@PeeHaa First thing I learn about HTML
 
Anonymous
@Fabien ajax room?
 
Anonymous
I think it would be faster
 
3:08 PM
@Simon_eQ Yeah? I doubt that. I learned to the minimum requirement for a valid HTML page
Maybe you started reading somewhere in the middle of the book / tutorial :P
 
Anonymous
> Maybe you started reading somewhere in the middle of the book / tutorial :P
 
There now too then.
 
Anonymous
as always !!
 
Im officially confused.
 
Left or Right?
 
3:09 PM
Left!
 
Left.
 
neither!
 
@hakre wat?
 
Anonymous
left
 
So why left?
 
3:11 PM
left is easier on the eyes
 
Indeed :)
 
@LeviMorrison I've gotta be honest, I'm starting to feel like this:
 
@hakre Ooooooooh that's why I have him in my ignore list
 
the background contrast of the code sample on the right is too high
 
3:12 PM
later people. beer time
 
Anonymous
@LeviMorrison like @TutelageSystems said. Its easier. If you choose right, the fonts should be a bit brighter.
 
@LeviMorrison still saying, stick with white
 
goodbye!
 
God damn it!!!
Has anyone got enough karma to commit edit.php.net/?patchID=963&project=PHP ?
I've just spent ages researching/validating it and making sure it builds and I don't have karma on doc-base so I can't commit it
 
@PeeHaa see ya
 
3:15 PM
Anyone good with linux? Trying to install ffmpeg with --enable-libmp3lame, I get "Command line option --enable-libmp3lame is not understood" - possibly an issue because it's on amazon s3 so stopping command line tools working properly?
 
@Jimbo They may have a quite old version - you should check what version you're actually installing vs when that option was added/removed.
 
Still the left one.
 
@Bracketworks dat! :D
 
3:19 PM
I'm sorry, but I just don't like either. I want a light background and dark text.
 
@DaveRandom + 9,001
 
I'm glad you made it 9001, I wouldn't have taken 9000 seriously.
 
well, yeah.. i'm not new
 
9000+(1 / INF)
 
3:21 PM
@DaveRandom I have
If you swear to me that I won't break the build, I can apply it :)
 
@NikiC It worked when I just built it on my machine, the guy who supplied it didn't add an external URL entity for the SQLite docs but I have added it which is, ironically, why I can't commit it.
Commit message is:
There is a createCollation method in class SQLite3 since 5.3.11 that is undocumented.  This patch adds a page for that method.

--
Provided by b dewar (macdewar@gmail.com)
 
@DaveRandom hrm, as you are the patch owner I can't commit it via the online editor
and I don't have an svn docs checkout
 
ffs
broken PHDOE is broken
 
I think honestly I have two problems with color choice in the current, light background design. The red for strings is just horrendous. If it was short-strings only it would be okay, but anything more than 5 or so characters and the red is too much. Secondly, orange comments? orange? Yuck, especially when it's right next to the red strings.
 
I'm not in the admin list for en language, so I can't take over patches from you ^^
 
3:24 PM
I'm going to badger @salathe and see if I can get him to give me the karma for doc-base
 
Ask salathe to do it ;)
 
This is not the last time I will have this issue, I am sure
 
@DaveRandom Yeah, I think they put you in the wrong line in any case
you ended up in the line with phpdoc/en only, rather than the usual phpdoc,phd.git,web/doc.git,web/doc-editor.git
 
@LeviMorrison so you don't want it to stand out?
 
@CarrieKendall The orange and red clash horrendously. It's not so much about sticking out.
 
3:26 PM
@LeviMorrison that I agree with...
 
@LeviMorrison i am not a fan of the orange, but i do like that the colors dont match the color scheme
 
green for comments, blue for constructs, etc
 
@DaveRandom If you want karma salathe is the wrong person to badger though (not in SVNROOT). Just ask on #php.doc and someone will do it
 
Meh, I've not done too badly anyway. Down to 5 outstanding patches from about 15 this morning, 2 of which I would commit but I can't because I'm not admin in en
@NikiC kk thx
 
3:36 PM
ERMERGHERD
 
Fact: Programmers are left-brained, designers are right-brained, and people who talk about left/right-brained people are blasted idiots.
2
 
Left or Right?
 
neither, I don't like green for strings. Green is for comments...
swap the green and orange, and the right gets my vote
 
@ircmaxell My honest opinion on that is that it's really dumb to directly associate a color to programming construct.
 
3:44 PM
@LeviMorrison fair enough, but still
 
Honestly, green for strings is the most common denominator in all the themes I have looked at in the past 2 months.
 
@ircmaxell gray is for comments
 
+1 on swap green/orange in the right
 
/me has never seen it... Actually, I say that but my blog's theme uses green for strings
 
@ircmaxell you're not using PHPStorm? Default Color for strings is green. Comments are gray.
 
3:46 PM
no
 
I use sublime and VIM mostly
 
^ Gray comments.
 
@LeviMorrison the right, too much blue, change functions to dark grey / black... I like the progress though!
 
@ircmaxell ... there's the same amount of blue on the right as on the left. You are crazy.
 
3:48 PM
Hey all
 
Unless you are counting the blue in the purple.
 
anyone ever have trouble with array_diff?
 
@Neal Tons.
 
@LeviMorrison yes, but the blue on the left is balanced by the orange (which breaks it up), the grey is a lot more subdued...
 
Would u like to help me out @LeviMorrison ? :-(
This is my results:
 
3:48 PM
@Neal You have to tell us your problem first ;-)
 
<pre>Array
(
    [0] => 1
    [1] => 2
    [2] => 4
)
</pre><pre>Array
(
    [0] => 1
    [1] => 2
    [2] => 4
    [3] => 10
    [4] => 17
    [5] =>
)
</pre><pre class='xdebug-var-dump' dir='ltr'>
<b>array</b>
  <i><font color='#888a85'>empty</font></i>
</pre>
 
lol who flagged that?
 
Code:
        _pr($oldTables); _pr($newTables); var_dump(array_diff($oldTables, $newTables));
 
xD
 
_pr is my shorthand for print_r
 
3:49 PM
Honestly, I feel the left "pops", even if it's hard to read, while the right is easier to read but stands out less...
@DaveRandom seriously, who flagged that?
 
@Neal OK, and output?
 
Why does the _diff come up empty?
 
(string) $a === (string) $b <- that's the comparison for array_diff. That's the most common source of problems with array_diff.
 
@Neal right, because writing out a commonly used function name is too hard...
 
1 min ago, by Neal
<pre>Array
(
    [0] => 1
    [1] => 2
    [2] => 4
)
</pre><pre>Array
(
    [0] => 1
    [1] => 2
    [2] => 4
    [3] => 10
    [4] => 17
    [5] =>
)
</pre><pre class='xdebug-var-dump' dir='ltr'>
<b>array</b>
  <i><font color='#888a85'>empty</font></i>
</pre>
 
3:50 PM
@ircmaxell The left pops because there is way too much red and orange.
 
@LeviMorrison not arguing, but there's a lot less contrast in the right version
 
@ircmaxell I like wrapping in pre tags
 
/me face-palms
 
@Neal Ahh right sorry
 
:-(
 
3:50 PM
@LeviMorrison I like the red
 
@Neal read the docs, it explains quite clearly why you get empty
 
The following is the results os var_dump($oldTables); var_dump($newTables); var_dump(array_diff($oldTables, $newTables));
<pre class='xdebug-var-dump' dir='ltr'>
<b>array</b>
  0 <font color='#888a85'>=&gt;</font> <small>int</small> <font color='#4e9a06'>1</font>
  1 <font color='#888a85'>=&gt;</font> <small>int</small> <font color='#4e9a06'>2</font>
  2 <font color='#888a85'>=&gt;</font> <small>int</small> <font color='#4e9a06'>4</font>
</pre><pre class='xdebug-var-dump' dir='ltr'>
<b>array</b>
  0 <font color='#888a85'>=&gt;</font> <small>string</small> <font color='#cc0000'>'1'</font> <i>(length=1)</i>
  1 <font color='#888a85'>=&gt;</font> <small>string</small> <font color='#cc0000'>'2'</font> <i>(length=1
 
maybe green to red on the right will make it perfect
 
I read them...
 
3:51 PM
> Returns an array containing all the entries from array1 that are not present in any of the other arrays.
straight forward
 
@iroegbu Red overwhelms most other colors. This is why it's primarily used as an accent in all sorts of design mediums. Red is very distinct and overwhelming.
 
(it's about the order of the args, if you still don't get it)
 
FACE PALM
I had the arguments backwards... thanks @ircmaxell
 
@LeviMorrison not arguing. Just saying that a little more contrast may be good
Really, that flag is still active? WTF?
 
broken flagging is broken, I keep getting sticky blue numbers on my avatar when there are no active flags
 
3:53 PM
I know a color you guys will just love for comments. Just a moment.
 
@DaveRandom refresh the page
 
I keep meaning to meta it and then forgetting/being too lazy
@ircmaxell Yeh I do but it's a recent bug
 
ya\
hmmm, I want to write a blog post, I know what I want to write about, I just can't get started... I need to get over this writers block
 
There's a few DOM changes pushed recently, the cv-pls helper keeps breaking avatars on requests that are edited as well which is, to be fair, exactly why @balpha reminds us time and time again to rely on the DOM structure as little as possible
 
3:56 PM
@LeviMorrison actually...
 
(Right side is what I want you to look at, didn't notice I had changed left side until just now)
 
I kind of like the gold
 
@ircmaxell I won't do it :) That color is so nasty (and fairly hard to read)
 
still would like to see T_STRING being black
@LeviMorrison what if you made the background a deep gray instead of purple?
 
@ircmaxell I've done that before and people didn't like it either. Just a second and I'll redo it.
 
3:58 PM
I think good progress is being made
 
gold over grey
 
@LeviMorrison The parameters explanation is actually helpful for once :P
 
@ircmaxell ^
 
I like the one on the right, it just feels slightly out of place. Perhaps a transition border?
 
That's probably because I forgot to kill the border.
 
4:03 PM
I like the one on the left more. More contrast ^^
 
fair
 
Again the right one is easier on the eyes :) Just curious how many times has it been changed? :D
 
Thousands already, perhaps.
 
Anonymous
@LeviMorrison Why didn't you go with wireframing ?
 
@Simon_eQ Not sure what you are asking?
 
Anonymous
4:07 PM
I just thought, it seems a lot of task to code and check instead of mocking the layout in photoshop first.
 
Oh, I see.
It's because A) I don't have photoshop B) there are always differences when you render into HTML.
Text especially.
 
left is good
 
left is good, but I'd figure out a better border or transition to make it feel less out of place (perhaps a simulation of a terminal window border)
 
^ Edges are more crisp.
 
Anonymous
I am quite sure, the variables color is called "nameless" :p
 
4:12 PM
@LeviMorrison still feels very out of place in the purple/white page...
 
@ircmaxell Which is why eventually the background made it's way towards the purplesque background.
 
right, but the purple feels even weirder IMHO
I guess I'm mostly wondering if there's a way to better fit that gray (because I like that)...
 
I think if we want to have the darker background we need to add more contrast in the side in general.
Everything is very light at the moment.
 
right
 
Left or Right? @ircmaxell @Gordon @PeeHaa @Bracketworks @SweetieBelle @rdlowrey
@NikiC ^
 
4:16 PM
left code block, but I still feel it is slightly out of place... not sure where to go...
 
I have an idea.
All example code basically has a header.
What if I make that like the 'header' of a terminal?
 
give it a shot...
that could be interesting...
 
Anonymous
@HamZa sup. We need you dude :)
 
I'm not sure if that will work out with PhD though. Will experiment.
 
OHHHHHHH... IDEA
 
user895378
4:18 PM
@LeviMorrison I like both. Left is better because I'm old and I need high contrast.
 
hmmm... How to build a PHP emulator in JS
 
@ircmaxell there is one
 
Oh yeah? Functional?
 
likely called php.js
 
no, that's bringing php functions to JS
but it's still JS
I'm talking where you can run PHP in the browser
/me disappears for 6 months
 
4:20 PM
@ircmaxell you don't mean something like: writecodeonline.com/php
 
without ajax
without a server-side component
 
@ircmaxell I know that there is one
I talked to someone from that project about their lexer
 
can't we compile PHP C code into JS?
 
@NikiC there is one, looking it up now...
 
4:22 PM
aw crap
 
yep, just found it too
 
Parse error: Object [object Object] has no method 'Node_Expr_Closure' in /console.htm on line undefined
 
still waiting for someone to compile PHP with emscripten
 
Looks like they are using a (partial) port of my parser
 
yeah, I think so.
 
4:26 PM
Okay, this is really rough, but:
 
oh yeah, this is getting cool
 
this is good... make the bg darker though
 
@LeviMorrison I like it. Makes it a lot clearer
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison +1
 
@LeviMorrison I think it looks pretty good. But I'm not sure it's suitable as the "default" style
 
4:31 PM
this is a very nice variety with the "all blue everywhere" at a very reasonable place. looks really nifty in my eyes.
 
Some minor improvements (I think):
 
@LeviMorrison MUCH better!
 
yes
 
4:52 PM
@NikiC Very nice RFC. I have several places I could make use of it.
 
It certainly pops
 
@LeviMorrison can we see multiple examples?
 
in JavaScript, 7 secs ago, by rlemon
also, http://www.reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/1l7baq/creating_a_user_from_the_web_problem/ holy good shit
 
@rlemon I saw that early.. it is worth the read.. I feel bad for that person.. bad things will happen along their road of learning
 
reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/1l7baq/… best comment ever (3rd down)
 
4:58 PM
@CarrieKendall At the moment, no. I'm not set up to do anything like that. Each code sample is run through parser manually.
 
user895378
@rlemon of course that HTTP message is not valid and would should never make it past the frontend server :)
 
This example has empty space above it. I would theoretically use this space to add tools.
This example, unlike the previous one, is actually doable without modifying documentation pages and/or the docbook renderer.
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison What kind of tools? Like a "copy to clipboard" icon or something?
 
@rdlowrey Yeah. Something like that.
 
@rdlowrey "run" :)
if you click it the code is run and you get an inline editor
 
user895378
5:04 PM
"Compile to JS and execute in console"
 
dreaming
nah, not in js, just to some execution API
not that PHP has anything reliable & fast
 
user895378
Well with websockets this is possible ... I'm still working out how best to create a "safe" realtime PHP codepad like $ php -a
 
no need for realtime and websockets
just the usual (like viper7)
But without the damn downtimes ^^
 
user895378
Ah that's boring.
 
user895378
live codepad or nothing!
 
5:06 PM
you're boring
sorry, I mean your mother is boring
 
user895378
That's not what your mother said, Trebeck. Too slow!
 
@rdlowrey Ha!
 
What about a "report a problem with this snippet" option?
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison Hopefully that would be so infrequently used as to obviate the need.
 
@LeviMorrison I think all you'll get "I'm running PHP 4.6 and I get a syntax error..."
 
5:07 PM
Then help me brainstorm.
What options would you use?
 
(Of course not mentioning the part about 4.6 and just saying the code doesn't work)
 
Oh!
There are a fair amount of OOP and Procedural examples.
We could put them in tabs instead of two examples.
 
user895378
I have one major request for the php.net:
 
user895378
PLEASE return the function page for a match in the search box
 
user895378
Don't make me click on a link after I search.
 
5:09 PM
Oh certainly.
That's just a bug.
 
user895378
Okay good, that drives me nuts.
 
I'm not keen a theme switcher but that could be an option.
Switch to Solarized
Light/dark
 
@rdlowrey YEEEES
 
user895378
@NikiC Also, this is /me crossing my fingers that good sense prevails and Derrick agrees to your date.timezone compromise
 
5:13 PM
Left or Right? @iroegbu @ircmaxell @Bracketworks @NikiC @rdlowrey @PeeHaa
 
@rdlowrey yes, I'm hoping that too
 
left
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison left, duh.
 
@LeviMorrison Yea, I think you got the wrong one on the right; so left.
 
@Bracketworks No, no mistake. Sometimes I need to remind people how much work I've actually put into this website :)
 
5:15 PM
@LeviMorrison Well your work isn't going unappreciated here
LEFT FTW!
 
high fives for @levi !
 
@CarrieKendall What, we don't give out internets anymore?
 
error: broken pipe
 
user895378
Free intarnets for @LeviMorrison!
 
Glorious... GLORIOUS INTERNETS!
 
5:19 PM
 
night people
 
@LeviMorrison multiple monitors? high five! :D
 
@DaveChen Yeah. I have 2 30" monitors.
^ We can definitely do that. I wasn't thinking straight before.
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison I live having the title text. The only "tools" I could think of were maybe "copy to clipboard" and "save to file" icons right justified in the title block.
 
@rdlowrey Which we can probably still do if we want.
 
5:25 PM
@LeviMorrison left, snippet looks great
 
@LeviMorrison is it possible to add a line in the changelog so that there is a clear separation between Version / Description... Right now you have the Description title centered, but the text below left aligned.. seems to throw it off..
 
@TutelageSystems I haven't looked at tables much at all. Can probably do that.
 
@LeviMorrison I know you have been focusing on the code table, but just looking at it and going between the original and new, it just threw me off. I am liking the darker code table now.. It definitely stands out. The title (white bold text) it a little harsh I believe but could be just me.. it just really is bold and out there
 
I find the white text easier to stare at lol. Are you just working on styling or functionality? (Sorry late the to chat)
 
5:37 PM
Both. Code snippets are one area that I felt needed some particular styling to help distinguish them while at the same time improving readability.
Code snippets generally look better on dark backgrounds, and in this case the dark background makes it 'pop' to the user.
 
Anonymous
5:51 PM
@TutelageSystems I can't seem to stand it however
 
hello guys, anybody here is a PhalconPHP developer?
 
no
 
Well, I will leave here the question anyway... I want do a simple sql query like 'select id from table where x=y' but with phql everything is treated like an object, but i do not need this, there's any way to do a simple query using the default connection?
 
@LeviMorrison so much better!
 

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