last day (77 days later) » 

10:22 AM
hello
 
Hello.
I think we can reject that one ? ^
 
11:10 AM
Looks like it
Not sure for what reason, though.
 
it's not really an good example of Constructor functions too
It's using jQuery AJAX, so should be in jQuery doc..
 
seems ok
Meanwhile: stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/30521 is pending (edit of mine)
thanks
 
What consensus do we have about recommending/using libraries in examples.. I think an example using Q and co in generators was approved..
 
jQuery seems nearly mandatory, at times
More obscure libraries? Rather not, imo
Or they may have an topic of their own
 
11:56 AM
Well using one library might spawn same examples using other libraries..
Some big libraries and frameworks have their own tags..
 
12:59 PM
Probably
 
1:09 PM
 
Are you reviewing? @Cerbrus
 
Not actively
 
I just removed one confirm and it's back again.. stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/31746
 
1 rejection
 
Can I just say, "Please do not add more examples to how to say hello in javascript."
 
1:59 PM
Is there a ES6 topic?
 
Arrow functions are in functions, generators have their own topic.... map/set is in collection i think..
 
There we go, that was what I needed :D
 
Promises and arrow functions are both es2015+ no?
 
2:14 PM
Arrow functions are. Promises... not so sure
Still, the link does help. But then again, I'm biased in favor of my edit :D
 
Promises are in 2015 spec, but libraries can support them in es5... if someone reads promises examples but hasn't read about arrows.. i guess it could be helpful...
 
 
2 hours later…
4:24 PM
Thanks for joining.
 
Thanks for the invite
 
Already got it haha
 
Saying hello from Javascript is going out of control..
 
By the way, after thinking about it, I think you're right @MarcoScabbiolo. We don't need another level of hierarchy. Just different sections would work just fine.
@cswl Dude, right? I've rejected so many edits to that. In my opinion, that section should be as simple as possible.
 
4:29 PM
Some of them were, apply css to console.log and install console-polyfill on ie7 compatiblity mode..
 
That's ridiculuous
 
> This is not part of the JavaScript language. Isn't there a better topic area like "Web platform APIs"? Domenic 1 hour ago
Hmm.... the css in console.log has not been rejected.. stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/30525
 
Taken care of.
Yeah, I think we should definitely create a separate section for web APIs or something. That's going to be hard without migration tools though
 
moving examples from one topic to another got added.... and there was proposal to move from one tag to another..
 
Oh really? I guess I missed that.
 
4:40 PM
2
A: Documentation retag or move request

Shog9You can do this yourself - click the "move example" icon on the topic: This will then let you select the example(s) you wish to move: ...and pick a target topic: The final step creates two drafts, one on each topic, that actually implement the movement. I've taken care of moving the ASP...

And, css in console.log is back again.. stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/34625
 
That guy keeps retracting his edits. I've been trying to tell him to remove the semicolon from the end of an if block but he retracts it before I get to finish my comment.
 
Greetings
 
Yo
 
prompt('hello world')
 
@MikeC it is going to be way faster to create new tags than having the hierarchy implemented, if that ever happens.
 
I agree. While it'd be nice for this particular use case, I also don't think it'd be a good "one size fits all" solution. What would be the, if you will, environment level in the hierarchy be for things like R? The new tags is a better solution.
@cswl I'm conflicted on that one. I don't think that's a very comprehensive look at the topic, nor a terribly good example of minification, but it's not terrible.
 
@cswl Would say reject? You don't minify without a tool, and posting examples of tools to minify javascript is... an invitation for ads.
 
@Sumurai8 Good point about the tools
 
But a topic about JavaScript post-processing (transpiling, minifying) wouldn't be bad. It would be hard to keep the libraries out.
 
Please use === and !== instead of == and !=. I have seen this wrong so many times.
 
4:51 PM
@MarcoScabbiolo Maybe that's a better solution. Have a topic on post-processing and have minification as an example rather than having an entire topic dedicated to minification.
 
@MikeC I say we go for that
 
Well we would have to talk about tools from build to bundle, and yeah JavaScript is all about tooling these days..
And I think someone was requesting about unit testing...
 
If we want to avoid library ads, I personally think it's best to avoid a JavaScript specific topic on unit testing. I think that maybe a "Testing" section makes sense and have unit testing as a topic of that section. Unit testing is a very general software topic
 
Oh now linting... ESlint
 
The problem is post-processing, testing, linting, are all crucial parts of good JS development. They all require to include at least one library to give a working example. It's a hard one.
 
5:00 PM
^
I'll let you guys sort that out while I go get some lunch
 
What if the only type of library we accept are open-source, broadly used libraries? Ads and commercial usage of the site would be ruled out.
 
Documentations aren't for training people to become good developers?
I mean we'd just create another gulp+webpack+babel+react tutorial.. not examples..
 
Many examples assume ES6 support. Is this okay?
 
The major problem I have with documentation is that people treat it too much like a book. E.g. the entire post about the == and === is great, but it is not an example. It is an essay of some kind at this point, and still people want to extend it more.
@2426021684 Yes, especially if the topic is marked as such, or the example is marked as >= ES6. I think we should focus on creating very recent examples, as creating examples using old syntax will only become older with time.
 
@2426021684 I agree with Samurai8
 
5:09 PM
People that need to support Netscape 1.0 will know what not to use. (Or you know, IE 9)
 
Yeah, so far we have a Language Reference, Introductory Concept, Advanced Concept...
 
@Sumurai8 I wrote the == and === post initially, and yes, it is not exactly an example. But if you would need to teach a developer JavaScript, you would have to tell him/her at some point that its better to use === and why right? There is a very fine line between what is an example, and what is to properly document the language
I tried my best on that post to focus on examples that illustrate what i was trying to document, but prose is needed too :/
 
I think it's because we aren't sure of exactly what documentation should be like yet... they say examples.. but you can't have examples without explanation...
 
@MarcoScabbiolo Yes, it is important that a developer knows about those, but I think part of it can just be linked in a Q&A on SO. We can even just say "strict equality should always be used, unless there is a good reason not to do so", then show that a == b, b == c, but c != a in some cases and just link to a Q&A on SO for future reading. The last version I saw, "the solution" was buried under almost a page of text.
I might suggest an edit on it somewhere in the future
But I'll have to think about it some more.
 
@Sumurai8 That's a very good way to handle it. I'm ok with doing the edit right now
 
5:23 PM
I think we should have a consensus of what could be documented..
 
Should examples use () => { ... } or function(){ ... }? I see a lot of both.
 
So far there have been request/proposals to document each and every tool, pattern, concept, of JavaScript..
 
Awesome
 
@2426021684 I think examples should use ES5 syntax or use the version tags to document what version they are compatible with. So you can use arrow functions, but just mark the examples as ES6.
@cswl Yeah, I'm thinking we should stop adding topics around the DOM at least, as that has its own tag now: stackoverflow.com/documentation/dom
 
@2426021684 If the topic handles something modern I would say () => { ... }. If the topic handles window.setTimeout() you probably want to use function() { }. If you are just looking at a proposed change, I would not wheelwar about it.
 
5:36 PM
I see 2 or 3 topics related to DOM in JavaScript.. the rest are other Web APIs .. canvas, ws, webaudio.. etc.. @MikeMcCaughan
-1
score
1
1 example
1 contributors
 
@cswl Yeah, those should really be in something like "browser API" or "Browser OM", or even "web-api" (which would cause confusion I'm sure)...
@Sumurai8 I had to look up "wheelwar". Now I know a new word :).
 
@MarcoScabbiolo Edit looks great :)
 
MDN calls them Web technologies.. it has a tag too stackoverflow.com/tags/web-technologies/info
 
50 questions though. I think we need 500 for docs. :(
 
Yeah, the tag looks like just added by few..
 
5:46 PM
Does one use things like "brb" on SO chats? I'm not very active... anyway, brb :)
 
stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/35318 Do we need step by step explanation of examples?
 
@cswl That could get ugly real quick. I think if someone's unclear on it, they should be able to look up what each of those steps does (i.e., look up split(), reverse(), join()).
 
Yeah, I guess we should assume people at least know some JavaScript...
 
To address the missing tag for Web APIs / Web technologies we need to find a proper SO Q&A tag with more than 500 questions and people to commit to it.
I couldn't find the tag myself
 
Well most people just use, dom html5-canvas webgl
 
6:01 PM
DOM is already proposed
In fact it is already created
 
DOM might work, even though technically those are not part of the DOM (window, for instance, is not part of the DOM specs).
 
Is there something like frontend maybe that works.. heh
 
web-technologies would be a great
now we just need to spam 450 questions about it :P
 
So saying hello from JavaScript is showcasing all the stuffs JS can do ???, stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/21142
 
We could just apply the tag to 450 questions which are about web technologies... I don't think that would be too bad. *hides*
@cswl Next up: Saying hello from JavaScript using CSS
 
6:15 PM
I had rejected a one using jQuery..
 
@Mike thats actually a very good idea.
 
I have been invited because someone considered my review there to be wrong, or?
 
@nicael there is a new tag for the DOM
 
@nicael Also, my personal opinion, that's a lot to take in for someone essentially trying to do "Hello World"
 
@MikeC Hm - I do agree that's quite a massive "Hello World". It's still a valid example though, and could be shortened. The idea itself is nice.
Going to make easier and shorter.
 
6:31 PM
@nicael I thought the point of Hello World was to illustrate, simply, how to do something in the language itself. That example is anything but simple, no matter whether it's shorter or not. It might be good as an example for working with canvas, but for JavaScript?
 
^ That's kind of my thinking. I think it could be broken into two parts: how to initialize a canvas and how to draw text. Separately, I think it would be very useful but not as an intro to the language.
 
Uh
 
@nicael What do you think? I suppose we're talking about the scope of the "Saying Hello from JavaScript". Mike and I seem to think that it should be as simple as possible and act as an introduction to the language. Do you think it should have a different scope?
 
I believe that, by getting rid of those transform / size sets / color / fonts / aligning canvas could still be a valid example, a three - four lines is an acceptable size for Hello World. Definitely some other topics will duplicate and expand the technique used in the Hello World example, I think it's inevitable.
 
6:47 PM
@nicael I could see that. I just wonder if it would require more setup than that topic would suggest. I see that topic as an almost "copy-paste to see something" kind of a thing. But that's just my opinion. I'm totally on board for at least reducing it to the essential statements required to display text
 
@nicael, @MikeC, I guess my question is where do we draw the line? Because you know we'll start seeing how to say Hello World using the Audio API or through Bluetooth speakers connected to RaspberryPI dongle using Node. We're getting away from JavaScript as a language, and more as a way of interacting with external APIs.
 
@MikeMcCaughan Good point. That's why I still vote for moving this information to the canvas topic or removing it entirely.
 
@MikeC I agree
 
Yes, that was exactly what I was trying to bring up.. thanks for putting it.. @Mike
 
@MikeMcCaughan canvas is not external api. Would you treat this as something verbose? I think it makes a good "Hello World".
 
7:00 PM
Please reject stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/36043 so we stop having more and more topics not related to the language directly.
 
@nicael Canvas is an external api. It's not native JavaScript. It's a DOM API and should be documented there (stackoverflow.com/documentation/dom/topics).
 
Ok. Then deleting that example?
 
@nicael There is no way right now to move it to the DOM topic directly, you will need to manually create it, and then delete the current example
DOM tag* sry
 
2D canvas has already a topic in JavaScript.. so that's awkward..
 
Assuming it's reasonable to believe we'll be able to move topics between tags, I would put it under the 2D canvas topic for now so it will be included when the topic is moved.
 
7:15 PM
The Web Storage API close as dupe of Web Storage ?
 
I think so.
Am I wrong in thinking that this example isn't helpful? As far as I understand, they both pose the same memory concerns but the suggested way actually has the possibility of going out of scope, leading to a perceived leak.
 
7:33 PM
is var i a global?
 
As far as I can tell from the example. I think the fact that you're not sure already means it has some issues
 
7:49 PM
it's not accidentally creating a global even if it was.., the example doesn't leak anything.. as far as i can tell..
 
I'm not talking about an accidental global. What I mean is that if you create a closure then you create essentially an object which can be stored in another object or an array. If you forget about it, your memory might fill up. The first example doesn't have this problem nor does it exhibit any other memory problem
Basically, at best it's backwards and at worst it's just wrong.
 
Ah, yeah if you have stored in somewhere else.. I need some sleep..
 
@cswl closed as duplicate ;)
 
This stuff should already be in array.. stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/36494
 
It should and it incorrectly states that you can only do that stuff in version 1 of JS. I'd reject it but I'm out of rejections for the day.
 
8:06 PM
Unless we're going to pull in Map and Set and their Weak relatives, which would make it quite broad...
 
Those already have their own topics...
There is iteration protocols lacking... but then we might just document the whole language..
 
@cswl I was kind of worried about that. MDN does a really good job with a lot of these topics. I feel like we're redocumenting things which don't need it.
 
8:22 PM
Well, I guess documentation is all about examples and rep.. mostly rep.
 
How does one install or set up the DOM?
 
DOMContentLoaded
maybe it's a template?
 
Yeah, I'm thinking I should just delete that automatically added one. And sorry, this is the JavaScript chat. Wrong place to ask :)
 
8:45 PM
What happened to web-tech or frontend tag.. :D
 
9:43 PM
We need web-tech to grow, frontend is not suitable for Web APIs :(
I've been editing a lot of questions, but since you have a pending edits limit, it is really hard to get to the 500
we're on 55
 
9:55 PM
Please reject stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/… , topic already exists.
Also Please reject stackoverflow.com/documentation/proposed/changes/33402 , another topic that already exists
 

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