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12:25 AM
 
lol
 
Hey hey, that's old news, it's saturday! :P
 
12:40 AM
hello everybuddy!
 
hia
 
1:17 AM
 
> I couldn't really learn Erlang, 'cos it didn't exist, so I invented it)
 
@igorw psssh old people =oP "Back in my day..."
 
ROFL
 
guys, is there an API that can take result=123&result2=234&.... and change it to <result>123</result><esult2>234<result2> ??
 
1:38 AM
@user1831003 use parse_str() and then run the resulting array through one of the PHP XML classes, or just loop through it.
 
@crypticツ yep :-)
old dude with creepy mustache
@crypticツ it should be noted that those values are unescaped
 
good catch, let me write it using XMLWriter
 
1:55 AM
@crypticツ DOM ftw
 
viper-7.com/NhhNpx so that would be wrong?
1 message moved to Trash can
 
@crypticツ Actually that's way better for a stream of tags rather than an actual document/document fragment
I still love DOMDocument to the end though, it is my partner and also my lover.
Yay random links
 
2:33 AM
Any morning?
 
@sectus let me check
 
MGE
2:55 AM
Hello
what kind of filter, have I to use in filter_input if I want to delete all "/" in the string?
 
@MGE , you can use str_replace
 
MGE
I know, but there is not any input filter?
 
@MGE , you can use callback %)
 
MGE
:(
 
@MGE Filters aren't just for arbitrary requirements, stripping forward slashes doesn't have a very wide use case. What's wrong with a callback?
The predefined filters generally validate or sanitise some pre-defined data format, like URLs or IP addresses.
 
MGE
3:02 AM
function($arg) { return $arg || $arg === '/'; }
 
@MGE , what is the purpose of this function?
 
Wait, what? Isn't that the URI thing you were doing? How would filter_input help with that?
I still think you should just preg_split('#/+#', $uri, -1, PREG_SPLIT_NO_EMPTY) anyway
<--
 
MGE
thanks
tomorrow more
have a good night
 
3:28 AM
@crypticツ I want to know if there's an API that's already doing this? I'm working in a very limited interface that only consume web-api's and not use any php functions.
 
 
1 hour later…
4:37 AM
@user1831003 not sure how you can use an API using PHP and not use any PHP functions...
@user1831003 you saw this this right? viper-7.com/NhhNpx
 
 
1 hour later…
user895378
5:41 AM
It's 1:41 in the morning and I just asynchronously invoked and received the results from a Python function inside a PHP script 21,882 times in one second entirely from PHP userland. Ah, it's the small things in life :)
3
 
5:57 AM
@Nile just fyi, recently posting "what have you tried" has been banned and linking to that website will surely be banned as well soon.
 
@crypticツ oh okay, well deleted. x), where has it been banned?
 
okay, thanks.
 
6:41 AM
how can one layer connect to another layer in a testable way
@rdlowrey you live 12 hours from me
how can the model layer send entities to the persistence layer in a testable way?
 
@andho With interfaces and mocks.
 
I was thinking about a way to inject the Persistence mechanism into the Model layer
 
6:57 AM
You inject a persistence layer in form of a mock into the model layer then.
You then can unit-test a model without testing the persistence unit.
 
@hakre i'm trying to find a way to do that
i guess something like this
class UserModule {

    private $_persistence;

    public function __construct(PersistenceInterface $persistence) {
        $this->_persistence = $persistence;
    }

}
 
@andho yes that is common constructor based dependency injection.
 
@hakre do you know any other method except constructor based and DIC
i don't want userland code to be like:
 
Well there is also setter based DI.
 
$userModule = new UserModule($persistence);
i don't want them to worry about getting hold of the persistence object
 
7:10 AM
And the DIC - the DI _C_ontainer - normally takes care of creating that so your userland code must not exist in the end.
 
yeah that would be the bootstrapping that I have always struggled with
 
11
A: PHP Dependency Injection

tereškoDependency Injection !== DIC People should really stop confusing them. Dependency Injection is idea that comes from Dependency Inversion principle. The DIC is "magic cure", which promises to let you use dependency injection, but in PHP is usually implemented by breaking every other principle of...

 
this would mean that basically in a MVC Controller, you can call $this->_helper->persistence
 
@andho yes, something like that for easy access, but keep in mind for that variant you will statically have the same persistence layer in your whole application.
depending on how the container'ing is done DIC is more or less a global static loading.
albeit the dependency injection for your testing is independent to that.
see the hint @tereško gives in the answer I linked, if an object has too many dependencies and as well that DIC =/= DI.
 
yeah it depends. It could rebuild the layer in every dispatch cycle maybe.
@hakre i agree with that
 
7:20 AM
So if you write your own, start with DI and for the userland-code you think you write over and over again, create some helper or just some (global) function. you can refactor later. keep it simple.
 
alright, thanks man
 
@Baba no. I dont. For the reasons you gave in your comment.
 
/me punches OSS licenses RAAAAAAGE!
oh, morning
RAAAAAAAAGE!
 
@Ocramius good morning! and what is hurting your feet?
 
@hakre
So I finally implemented lazy service proxies as PRs for the DICs of #zf2 and #symfony - https://github.com/zendframework/zf2/pull/4146 https://github.com/symfony/symfony/pull/7527
But things can't go right:
FLOSS licenses... WHY?! https://github.com/symfony/symfony/pull/7527#issuecomment-15669150 :(
So I'm speed-rewriting my lib
 
7:53 AM
GPLv2+ licensed code is compatible with Apache 2.0 by upgrading to GPLv3+. Just FYI
 
@hakre so you want to convince the drupal foundation to upgrade within tomorrow? :)
 
So any user can achieve compatibility if she/he wants to.
@Ocramius Well it should not pose any problem normally.
 
@hakre it was one of the drupal guys to bring that up :\
 
@Ocramius And that guy wrote they are GPLv2+ (not GPL v2 only), therefore I at least see some air here.
 
@hakre yep, but this is still a break. It would force anyone upgrading sf 2.3 to have the license change, which is a non-trivial thing anyway. To do that in Doctrine, we needed 2 months to contact all contributors.
While it is indeed sure that everyone will agree, it's still a PITA, plus you take the risk of upgrading even if some people didn't answer, which means that they could virtually sue you for <dunno-why-but-they-can>
 
7:58 AM
Yes, what that guy write is founded. GPL v2 is incompatible with Apache 2.0. Apache 2.0 was released to make it GPL compatible but that is for GPL v3 and onward.
Well what I don't understand in the first place is, that the pull request announces the license being MIT while it is not (the whole story).
I think you should edit the table at the top so this is visible which licenses are involved.
 
@hakre it's a dependency of my lib that is not MIT
 
@Ocramius Dependency could mean derivative work (EU copyright laws), therefore the derivate should outline this precisely.
 
Anyway, I'm working on rewriting the lib. Should be done in ~1h
 
@Ocramius Take care to not keep the derivative character otherwise the translation might still keep the original license.
 
@hakre perfectly understandable, but I didn't (ever) care for those things and that's obviously a fault. I checked that I didn't keep pieces of code that are duplicates of the CG lib
 
8:05 AM
@Ocramius It's not only about the code but just being able to read that code earlier and then write code that does the same influenced by what has been read (aka the translation).
Best thing is if that was a true dependency to just remove the dependency without looking into it.
 
@hakre that's what I'm doing. The only negative thing here is that ZF2's CG is actually ~95% the same =_= I actually think Johannes copied from it
 
Then write your own. You might be allowed to re-use the API if that was intended by the original library so that part does not fall under copyright at all (user-interface), however that is normally fishy and not yet settled.
Let me take a look at the dependency.
@Ocramius Where do I find the Zend sources? I found Johannes here: github.com/schmittjoh/cg-library
 
Anonymous
What are mysql connection details called? database resources or database connection object?
 
@hakre if you look at my diffs at github.com/Ocramius/ProxyManager/pull/18/files, you'll see that most method calls don't change
 
@Ocramius That must not mean that Johannes copied that over.
 
8:12 AM
@hakre this stuff has been around since early zf1... yes, that doesn't mean it, I just find it really fishy now :\
@phpNoOb credentials?
 
@Ocramius hmm, maybe best is to ask Johannes and if he took over, he should also place the ZF2 BSD requirements in there (Apache 2.0 is compatible with BSD-3-Clause so the license chain should not be broken if the copyright statements are preserved).
 
@hakre I'll do later today. For now I just want to move away from this giant license mistake
 
@Ocramius Well, list the licenses of the dependencies and you're fine I'd say.
Same for ZF2 cg, it's not MIT either but BSD-3-Clause.
 
@hakre yes, but I spoke with the drupal guy and BSD-3-Clause is no prob
 
well, it's not MIT and symfony requires the code under MIT. See their contribution requirements.
This is why it is important to make visible upfront which licenses are used in all dependencies.
 
8:18 AM
@hakre that's up to fabien - I'll update the PR as soon as I get the lib updated
 
Otherwise somebody else will later on need to research all this and then really puke.
@Ocramius Sure, but outline with the pull request the licenses that are used. Right now this is giving the wrong picture in the table on top.
So fabien would probably think: Oh this is MIT, fine. But infact it's not only MIT.
 
@hakre lol, there's a giant shitstorm incoming on that one, I don't think it will be just "ok, merge" :P
 
@Ocramius nah, I mean so far nothing really happened and the problem has been highlighted to you. Just make the correct documentation and then say what your plans are.
Also before you make yourself too much work, you could ask fabien what would be OK upfront.
And I'm with you that Johannes licensing looks fishy and would need more clarification first if you want to stay with that dependency.
 
I think there's some good reasons to move to zend\code: 1) more stability 2) there's more eyes on it 3) there's ralph on it 4) it is a point of junction that finally forces the two communities to touch each other (I don't like holy wars) 5) looks like the license problem on Johannes' stuff is more widespread than just this case, and I don't want to be part of the problem
so I just move out for now and let the sf2 community handle the other problem internally
 
8:34 AM
@Ocramius yes, fabot can decide if it's okay to have BSD-3-Clause zf2 dependencies next to symfony defaults MIT. On the licensing level I do not see much of a problem with that. Maybe this even isn't the first time in the symfony project?
 
@hakre well, consider that zf2 uses doctrine as dep, which is MIT in BSD-3-Clause. Should not be a problem to do the opposite either. Sure, it's a bit of a mess because you now have two licenses, but both basically state "do whatever, just let the original name in"
 
@Ocramius If ZF2 makes doctrine a feature of it's own, ZF2 is not BSD-3-Clause (strictly spoken). Apart from that, all I can relate to for the symfony project are the contribution guidelines which say: "If the "license" is not MIT, just don't submit the pull request as it won't be accepted anyway."
 
@hakre yep, again, that's up to fabien. This apache thing leaked anyway everywhere, so I wanna see how (if) it ends
 
The rest is in fabiens hands I think so I suggest to document properly in the ticket/issue upfront, write that you can port to a BSD lib and ask him if that's okay.
@Ocramius As far as you mean johannes codebase, one could influence that by adding an issue there to clarify the copyright and licensing "on guess" as the copyright of zend is probably missing. That could speed up things a little (when it works out well) or at least would have the issue documented. However it might be more friendly to just shoot him an email and ask first. Maybe you wanna mail him as you wondered directly?
 
8:51 AM
@hakre it was a wild guess. Knowing johannes he may even have written it from scratch without knowing. I'll surely ping him later. For now I just want to GTFO from the problem :)
 
@Ocramius you don't have any problem if you write upfront it's not all MIT. The drupal guy is very sane and friendly. He does not write any bs. So don't feel pushed or shaked or something. You are taking care so I do not see anything wrong or problematic here.
 
mornings
 
@hakre I will do, just let me finish my coding XD
 
Uby
mornings
 
mornings
@Ocramius schnell, schnell, das muss fertig werden ;)
 
9:00 AM
@hakre halt die klappe und lass mich arbeiten XD
 
so now back to english, that's sounding less insulting in my german ears :)
 
I hate it when I win the FGITW and the other guy still gets accepted and upvoted more than me
Oi @tereško! My bounty's about to expire
You planning on updating your answer?
 
i did a small update
but decided that largely there is nothing much i could add
 
Alright then, and since no one added anything new as well
Congrats
You're now 200 rep richer :P
Also, my other suggestion is still in effect
 
9:16 AM
@MadaraUchiha question IMHO is actually "not constructive" however your duplicate revealed that ;)
 
@hakre How is it not constructive?
 
@MadaraUchiha "easier" - not clear what is asked for.
 
@hakre That's NARQ, not NC
Also it's pretty easy to define "easy" in this case
"Not using an array with 30294320543 items"
 
@MadaraUchiha oh, as you can see I'm bad with picking the right reason ^^
 
@hakre didn't mean to insult, sorry :\
 
9:23 AM
@MadaraUchiha hmm, user decided that this is easier.
 
Guess my italian "insult" entry level is set too high :)
 
That would be his problem, not mine :P
 
@Ocramius nah, just saying, I pinged you to death.
 
In German "I'm going to kill you" sounds a lot better than "I love you".
 
@MadaraUchiha yeah, a question just asked for the opportunity.
 
9:24 AM
(For someone who doesn't understand German, yes?)
 
@hakre :P
 
@MadaraUchiha Let me answer that with bender: "Kiss my shiny metal ass".
 
@MadaraUchiha but indeed you receive more nuances if you know the language better. so my bitching-around skills are much better in german than in english.
^ not only didn't the question asker search, also the answer-answers didn't browse the related column on the right.
 
9:57 AM
@hakre is it supposed to take forever to save on the PHP doc editor?
 
@MadaraUchiha no, normally not.
open it in a new tab and see if you're still logged in
 
@hakre Meh, I've copied the changes and refreshed
Alright, so.. it did save it (because when I entered again the changes were there), how do I submit it as a patch though??
 
@MadaraUchiha I posted an image yesterday, it's in the left pane, locate your change, right-click it for the patch.
or was it left click?
23 hours ago, by hakre
user image
 
Aha, found it. Thanks
 
I didn't understood that as well in the first place. It's somewhat hidden / unclear.
e.g. why don't I see my work in progress more prominently?
 
10:09 AM
@hakre Because the table won't sort :|
Oh well, at least I have a name there, I don't need to be anonymous#2482375
 
blah, finally tests pass
frikking licenses
 
well, what I don't understand is why you don't ask fabien first. Not that in the end all the changes is for nothing.
that would be really pushing down your mood.
 
10:25 AM
@hakre That stuff was way too fishy, as said. Got myself out of it first :)
 
Not a PHP question at all but can someone help to identify which one is the extension in this USA Phone Number
(123)345 - 0979 X 123
 
@Ocramius okay, forgot that, good point.
 
I have to make the extension optional when someone enter phone number
 
@hakre You're on a roll! Going over the close queue?
 
don't anyone aware of US phone number format
?
 
@hakre Working on killing the tag?
@sunlight US folks are asleep :) Try in a few hours
 
Is it after X or what?
 
@sunlight Have you tried the US office for telecommunication (if there is any)?
@sunlight Have you tried asking here: english.stackexchange.com ?
It might qualify as US-english that phone-number format.
 
@hakre Unlikely. @sunlight read their FAQ first.
 
10:38 AM
> Assertions should be used as a debugging feature only. You may use them for sanity-checks that test for conditions that should always be TRUE and that indicate some programming errors if not or to check for the presence of certain features like extension functions or certain system limits and features. - php.net/assert
why?
 
@hakre: Thanks. Asked
 
0
Q: What is the meaning of the word "Extension" in an USA Phone Number

hakreI found a nice listing in the answer to "Standard format for phone numbers" however it never uses the term Extension verbatim. The question "What do you call the main telephone number?" does describe the term Extension quite well but it does not define the exact meaning. It is probably not even...

 
11:08 AM
hmm .. SO is experiencing some problems
 
@tereško Such as?
 
0
A: "Mega" Dynamic acces to static method/property in PHP 5.3?

hakreIf you do not want to use a variable (as you said in a comment), think twice. Variables are cool in PHP, very fast and just the needed glue to work-around it's really limited parser (which of it was said makes PHP quite fast). So why not use a variable here? It's easy to type and quickly done. I...

^ problems like questions like this one get answered :)
 
@MadaraUchiha the tag search seems to be glitching , it gave me 0 results for php+oop
 
@hakre A bit too complicated, don't you think?
at least the first static property fetch should be directly, not via refl
 
@NikiC that's why I wrote, the variable should be used.
 
@hakre that one can be fetched inline either way
 
@NikiC I was not able to.
 
Duh, this one is obvious, isn't it? ${!${''}=$run::$where}::$place_nameNikiC 16 secs ago
@hakre you weren't able to use $run::$where instead of (new ReflectionClass($run))->getStaticPropertyValue('where')?
 
11:32 AM
@NikiC shure, that one, true
but that would hide the argument a little.
okay you pushed the assignment into the inner.
 
anyway, I think we will fix this for 5.6 by allowing paren-exprs as the left hand side for a few dereferencing operations
At least [], ->, ->() and ()
:: was not really in the plans, but I guess one could add it too
 
I don't get !${''}
 
@NikiC What sorcery is that?!
 
@Ocramius saucery
 
ah
now I understand. That is really a nifty cheat.
 
11:42 AM
/me still doesn't get it
 
A variable with an empty name. As ${false}.
me is off for a moment, cu laters.
 
11:56 AM
Good morning
@NikiC please do
 
Anonymous
@tereško thanks for downvoting me. When I saw, the DV, I just knew it was you. have a nice day
 
Anonymous
@ircmaxell thanks
 
@phpNoOb , is your goal in life to become just like kolink who's profile can double as repository of low quality questions ?
 
@tereško can I ask - if model is a layer, then layer is always data abstraction?
 
12:19 PM
@metal_fan , presentation layer (that contains controllers and views) is also a layer .. it's not abstracting data
also , you should not looks at model as glorified DB abstraction
 
Anonymous
@tereško I know, my posts are of low quality, but I really want to get to the 3k rep cap, and there is no other way to do it, unless I answer on questions I know I can help.
 
@tereško Well, a model itself consists of several parts like, Service, Data Access(sql and the like), and business logic itself. But wait, lets take something outside php. Say in js, model can not consist aforementioned parts, so it always comes down to logic abstraction, true?
@tereško or, what is exactly layer ?
 
layer is an abstract group of structures that all server same purpose
 
0
Q: PHP OOP ~ Multiple Classes Require Same Class

Steffan LongI currently have multiple classes that all depend on one class, the Database class. Each class requires an instance of the Database class to function, and with that, I am a little concerned. Before I convert all my procedural code to object-oriented code I need to figure this out. I Currently ha...

well, then layer could be defined as logic abstraction (because they all do serve the same purpose - app logic)
 
@metal_fan .. stackoverflow.com/a/11369679/727208 , what's your point ?
@metal_fan there is a wiki article on the whole subject : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Layer_(object-oriented_design) ... updated the link .. there was one better suited
also , sorry for multiple pings
 
12:31 PM
hi
 
@tereško factory is kinda good point, but lazy initialization: stackoverflow.com/a/14774042/1208233
 
12:57 PM
 
@metal_fan seems like a lot of excuses for bad and global-dependent code
also the closure there is mostly for purposes of extracting the configuration form the factory
 
@ircmaxell I think I always have the desire to cripple anything that uses :: :D
 
:-D
I love reddit. Almost 3k video views since Wednesday
 
@tereško well, when you use closures - doesn't it mix OOP with procedural ?
 
Morning
 
1:07 PM
@metal_fan procedural !== functional
use of closures and partials comes from functional programming paradigm
 
@DaveRandom nice find
 
damn ... i was too late — teresko 30 secs ago
@tereško of course. after all, i have the gold oop badge, not you ;)
 
@tereško okay - the closures have some logic, (like retrieving an instance) -- why not to keep the same stuff in a class (+satisfying the SRP) then? why closures exactly? the same can be done via classes
 
@Gordon .. riight ... rub it in
 
1:14 PM
what is cvs-pls ?
 
@metal_fan bad practise. use git or at least svn
 
then delvs is kinda opposite?
gordon
 
@metal_fan no, delv is just short for deletion vote
 
@metal_fan gist.github.com/1689430 ... holy meatball oneboxing
 
@Gordon for the project I am currently working on I have to use svn again. All the annoying things of git are forgiven at once
 
1:16 PM
@PeeHaa Ever tried merging branches with SVN ?
 
@PeeHaa , is there a way to add a file to an ignore list in SVN ?
 
@metal_fan hint: @tereško's link explains what cv-pls means, but you asked for cvs-pls, hence my answer about git and svn ;)
 
"cvs-pls" is a battle cry/sob thing for a developer who's really into BDSM
 
lol
 
1:19 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum , does not work
maybe i am doing it wrong , but i have tried all of the variations of that ignore command
nothing helps
 
@tereško To be honest, I'm not a huge fan of SVN to begin with. At work we use some stupid GUI called tortoisesvn that lets you right click your file and click 'remove' which removes it from the repository
 
@tereško You should be able to easily ignore stuff. However we are talking about svn so your success rate may fluctuate
Or did you already commit the file?
 
@tereško Maybe stackoverflow.com/questions/3579636/… is what you're trying to do ?
 
@phpNoOb printing HTML tags is a bad idea
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum , i have seen them all , tried most of it
some time next month, when i fix my work pc, i will also look into making the ignore work
bot not now
 
1:28 PM
Larry Wall switched to PHP
 
@metal_fan Isn't that the guy who created Perl?
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum yep
 
@metal_fan I've always thought of PHP like a better PERL, but I'm sure a lot of people disagree
> We've also seen the rise of PHP, which takes the worse-is-better approach to dazzling new depths, as it were. By and large PHP seems to be making the same progression of mistakes as early Perl did, only slower. The one thing it does better is packaging. And when I say packaging, I don't mean namespaces.
Larry Wall ^
 
1:33 PM
@BenjaminGruenbaum at least PHP does not look like RSA encryption
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum well, Perl is kinda complex for regular users. Just to compare: PHP: function foo($arg){} Perl: sub foo { my $arg = @_arg; }
 
> Perl - The only language that looks the same before and after RSA encryption. -- Keith Bostic
 
@Gordon Huh? I've always thought Perl is written in base64
 
Larry Wall also said: I think ugly can be beautiful, and that beautiful can get ugly real quick. I think in particular of Lisp, which is the most beautiful language in the world, and every program in Lisp is real ugly.
 
@metal_fan Isn't PERL being inconvenient for rapid development back then part of why PHP got so popular?
 
1:38 PM
And the same Larry Wall also said: Lisp has all the visual appeal of oatmeal with fingernail clippings mixed in.
Allan Kay On PerlLanguage: "...[Java]'s a pop culture. A commercial hit record for teenagers doesn't have to have any particular musical merits. I think a lot of the success of various programming languages is expeditious gap-filling. Perl is another example of filling a tiny, short-term need, and then being a real problem in the longer term." (source: acmqueue.com/…)
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum well, HTMLMason ("module" which makes perl embeddings possible ) should be always installed (which is rare on most providers)... PHP is one of easiest languages ever, that's why its so popular.
@Gordon its just another opinion :)
 
@metal_fan I think it's not so much about being easy (Writing good PHP code, like writing good code in other easy languages can be extremely hard), I think the big appeal in php is the fact you can be really productive really fast.
 
@metal_fan my point was merely to illustrate that everyone has some ;)
 
:)
 
1:45 PM
although he is spot on about commercial hit records
 
That's why most web developers I know who do back-end started with PHP. It's also really easy/cheap to deploy which is considered a big plus.
 
stackoverflow.com/a/15719057/1698924 <- I wonder if there was any point in answering that
 
@BenjaminGruenbaum I saw so many kids 13-14 y.old coding in php (even oop)- the point here is that php isn't complex if kids can grasp it
@tereško I can't believe you opened a question tagged with codeigniter
 
15 mins ago, by Gordon
@BenjaminGruenbaum at least PHP does not look like RSA encryption
bahaha
 
1:50 PM
@metal_fan , see the last edit
 
@tereško oh, seems like you opened it to remove mvc tag
Yes codeigniter is a great place to start, i must say it was one of the easiest MVC frameworks to learn, also their documentation is easy to follow - lol
 
@metal_fan its true. CI is easy to learn and their docs are usually praised.
 
@Gordon are you kidding?
 
You’ve been misled: If you wanted a quiet, backroom job avoiding people and personal relationships - software development is not it.
 
@metal_fan no. I am not.
 
1:55 PM
it is easy to learn CI ... that does not mean that by learning CI you learn anything good
just because it is easy to take a piss on a sidewalk , does not make it a good idea
 
@Gordon why so many people follow CI, when they can easily learn ZF2 (it has great docs too) what do you think?
 
@metal_fan , why do you use MySQL ?
 
@metal_fan you have no clue how often I have heard complaints about the ZF docs being totally inferior to CI docs.
 
are you aware that, compared to PostgreSQL is is quite inferior? If so ... why do you still use MySQL.
 
@metal_fan besides CI is apparently much easier to learn than ZF
 
1:57 PM
People use stuff because other people use said stuff
 
Jeeze
 
@tereško Well, some of them do. In fact - not all of them, but beginners only.
@Gordon yeah ZF1 docs suck, while ZF2 don't
 

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