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12:00 AM
Will someone please explain to me what this person's problem is?
 
@andrewjackson He's got a point, actually. Being a little scathing, though, especially with the grammar that he could just edit easily. =P
 
Word
 
Maybe you could just keep the one solution and he'd remove the downvote.
 
I really don't care about the downvote, I just don't understand his problem
it's a valid answer using valid functions to address files that are not UTF-8 encoded
 
The problem is that, although in ANSI 163 is £, in most other encodings it's a non-display character.
To be on the safe side, just keep your
echo "£"
That's the right solution. Although @LightnessRacesInOrbit might have put it harshly... it's true.
 
12:10 AM
I was addressing how to produce the char in PHP not in HTML.
There wasn't even an HTML tag
 
Okay, but the code in the original question was how you do it in PHP - as a literal.
So it's the encoding of the output that matters.
+1 anyway.
 
He'd had to use the char for a database though... you're right though. I forgot the encoding part...
isn't it the browser's job to handle "£" anyways??
so long as pound is part of any encoding being used?
lol okay... I'm not gonna worry about
 
12:36 AM
i am leaving the computer hating programming. i will be back in approximately 12 hours crazed and in need of coffee and vim :P farewell
 
Anyone here know how to identify a link from an HTML button?
I am trying to get a link from this button but the source code isnt clear
 
@JohnSmith don't get the question
 
I am trying to figure out the link underneath the 7:00 reservation
so I can email it to a relative
but the source code is unhelpful
and I don't know if this is Javascript or PHP or what
 
javascript
 
you mean this: `<li a="['3/26/2012 7:00:00 PM',100,0,1]" class="ti exact">
<span class="t">7:00 PM</span>
</li>` ?
 
12:41 AM
yes
 
there must be an event listener on that LI
 
I don't understand for the life of me how to get a link out of it
 
@tereško yes
 
Maybe you should ask the company , if they have a public API
 
i don't think i'd ever get a response for something like that
this is just an arbirtrary webpage
 
12:43 AM
well .. then maybe you should not try to fuck with that arbitrary web page
 
@JohnSmith you can't
it's not a link
 
right but clicking it takes you to a new page
hence the "link underlying the button" best way I can describe it
 
ajax request, then response can be anything
there is no link
 
it's not a real link but somehow it is constructing it
and following it
 
your click triggers an event, which can include an ajax call to the server
the server may do anything including reroute
 
12:45 AM
how do you know it's an event?
 
@JohnSmith obviously it's not a valid html link
so obviously there is a javascript listener attached to the node
it's clear, that's how it works :)
 
yes teresko but that is easy to get after you click the link
I am talking about getting the link ahead of time
 
@JohnSmith it's not possible
because it's not handled client side
 
@JohnSmith it's not possible for you
 
12:50 AM
where is the line showing that is it making a server-side call
where the link is being constructed entirely on their end
 
if it is, you'd need to actually parse the js
 
@JohnSmith where is my contract for doing work for you ?
 
of course you can go through all the js and see if you can extract the function producing the link
 
I don't need your help; all you've been doing is giving snide, snarky remarks. Will be ignoring you now
 
and then rebuilding it on your side
 
12:51 AM
@markus yeah that is what I am doing at the current moment, anyway
 
teresko does that all the time
he knows his stuff but he uses irony, sarcasm and rudeness all too often
 
... notice how he isn't disagreeing with the point i made
 
no, I'm not because you're usually right or at least you have valid points
you even sometimes communicate nicer already but you seem to fall back into jerkness also quite often...
I don't know why you need that
 
I see no evidence that he knows his stuff; I can be a dick too and pretend like I know something I don't
 
well, just now about this he didn't really make any clear point
 
12:54 AM
Besides, I'm getting closer anyway -- was just hoping someone would help move things along, but eesh. I don't see the need for being needlessly unfriendly to people you don't even know, for no reason
 
yes, he needs to learn that
as stupid as it may sound
it's more important than knowing tech
but there are a couple of other people around here recently who are actually much worse in one or another way
teresko helps ppl on a good day
 
6 mins ago, by John Smith
where is the line showing that is it making a server-side call
6 mins ago, by John Smith
where the link is being constructed entirely on their end
 
@JohnSmith and nothing any of us said, helped you even the least bit, you knew it all already?
 
to me this did not sound like someone asking for help
 
I already know it involves some sort of Javascript -- I just don't know how it's operating. So I am just trying to figure out how everything's structured
 
12:57 AM
it sounded more like someone demanding answers
 
1:10 AM
@JohnSmith the site uses .NET, and .NET has some built-in AJAX controls that allow transfer of information between JS functions and server-side functions. You might probably need some .NET initiation before you can figure it out, especially since many of the .NET AJAX functions are auto-generated by the framework.
 
We're talking about .NET here?
 
hmm
 
@ircmaxell no....just a site that uses .NET
 
I think most of this data can be synthesized except for this "iid" variable
 
@JohnSmith did you look at the event listeners on the table element?
 
1:16 AM
@JohnSmith lol....you can give it a shot, but knowing .NET, there's a control for almost everything, which makes it unnecessarily bloated
 
I don't know JS, as I've already said; I have it somewhat traced back to a JS chunk inside the source
but none of it really makes much sense to me
The ID is SearchResults_ResultsGrid
 
the whole thing seems very overcomplicated and hacky with imagemaps and stuff
yeah, bloated seems the correct term
 
and it shows ResultProperties.Request.IID = '';
when you click a link you can see iid=some number in the URL but it's not obvious where that number is coming from; but likely this resultproperties thing
everything else is easy enough to synthesize
iid is the problem point
so is this control serverside?
 
is it in a JS file?
 
I dont think so
 
1:24 AM
then, it COULD be
 
I've looked and could not find anything
 
the AJAX control in a .NET allows the .NET framework to pre-write some AJAX functions
 
I am trying to figure out how it generates the link clicking on the time buttons
*the (click a time to reserve) stuff
the element ID around that section is SearchResults_ResultsGrid which also shows up in another spot in the source code
where it shows things like ResultProperties.Request.IID = '';
 
user895378
Very sad: the 5-star link to the group thread about why you shouldn't post bug reports while cruising for porn has been removed :(
 
user895378
14 hours ago, by JohnP
This is why you shouldn't be posting bug reports while surfing for porn - https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/group/chromium-dev/browse_thread/thread/d30ae1c692ff53c3?pli=1
 
1:26 AM
basically trying to see how it creates links like secure.opentable.com/…
 
user895378
Did anybody by any chance snag a screenshot?
 
@JohnSmith isn't the time generated from the DropDown box?
 
user895378
Because it was hilarious ...
 
no i mean the buttons
that show availabilities
 
@JohnSmith the time in the querystring controls what time is shown on the buttons
 
1:29 AM
@rdlowrey what? did he post a porn link?
or was is a screen shot with a porn tab? lol
 
i see the area in the source code
but i dont see how to synthesize a click
it's just a span
not a link or button etc
 
user895378
@andrewjackson JACKPOT!
 
user895378
hehe that's awesome
 
"chache: url" into Google, works for most sites ;)
better take a screenshot though, because it'll go away soon
"I think that link had a few backdoors" lmao
I like how everyone else jsut pretended it didn't happen
 
user895378
1:33 AM
"I think the link here doesn't go where you intended it to go."
...
"Oh my, no. No it doesn't. "
 
I'm gonna have to watch that later >.<
 
user895378
Thank you Google cache (and Levi Weintraub). Remember kids, the Internet never forgets.
 
user895378
@andrewjackson Where in CA are you?
 
Lemoore... about 20min south of Fresno
 
user895378
Cool. Lived in L.A. for a few years after school -- good times.
 
1:40 AM
@JohnSmith John, the event listener on the table element points to the prototype js and this file is full of ajax calls
 
is there anything showing where iid comes from?
 
Lemoore's pretty boring... grew up here, that's why I ended up working with computers
It'd be much better if I lived a little closer to the ocean
 
not as far as I can see, but that's because the iid is sent back in the response
 
although, there's several rivers near where I live, so that's good for the summer
 
as far as I can tell, the javascript evaluates, what html element has triggered the click handler to fire, then threw that convoluted piece of js that element is sent to the server
the server processes it and sends back an iid
 
user895378
1:43 AM
@andrewjackson Yeah, I picked up surfing when I lived there now I have to live next to the ocean. Doesn't matter which one, I just need ocean.
 
@JohnSmith I'm not sure about this, it's just my best bet and I'm not gonna invest more time, and I've learned that .NET does a really really bad job
 
I always wanted to surf growin up.... had to settle for water skiing =[
 
at creating valid, readable, semantic markup
 
@markustharkun welcome to the club lol
 
1:45 AM
@andrewjackson which club :)
 
user895378
Water skiing is still cool -- death by fiery boat crash is cooler than death by shark attack.
 
I am using Mechanize in Python
if that helps
maybe there is a way to click spans/list links?
 
@JohnSmith install this and load your own copy of Prototype... then mod page all your want figure it out
 
replace it with your own prototype, and you can load it with console.log
 
1:48 AM
@JohnSmith sorry, how do you mean, apart from event listeners?
 
why do you want this link anyways?
 
@JohnSmith CSS and JS allow you to click a list
 
I am making a one-click script for a relative of mine who has eyesight problems
so she can access reservations easily
but I can't just re-use the same link because it is partially dynamic, it seems
I am making a script in mechanize currently
so far it gets right up to this page correctly
but clicking the reservation times = not sure how this is done
 
why not just modify the font sizes on the page?
or better yet, use your browser's zoom features
 
she's practically blind
and old
 
1:53 AM
Alternatively, just use something like:
 
making font size bigger won't help
 
Good evening ^^
I can not speak on the android room why?
 
$('whatever-id').click()
 
I've tried to target the link itself and it doesn't seemm to work
 
@JohnSmith what do you mean it doesn't seem to work?
 
1:55 AM
I can't figure out how to target the desired reservation time and "click" it
it's a <li> "a" element and not a form or button or a href etc
 
@JohnSmith why do you keep repeating that
 
well, basically, there's no <a> in that li
 
you can attach an event listener for click to ANY element
 
@markus I was asked
 
@JohnSmith yeah, but that's not the point of the whole question
a link can be anything
 
1:57 AM
CSS was used to change the cursor to a pointer, and JS was used to obtain the value of the a attribute in that li
 
your problem is not that it is not a link, your problem is how the target url is created
 
Correct
but the link thing is a problem for Mechanize
 
and since that most probably happens on the server side, chances are big that you won't succeed
 
Which is why I am trying to figure out how it's generated manually
 
well if mechanize can't deal with non <a> links then it's not of much use, is it?
 
1:59 AM
 
oh well, thanks anyway
 
2:14 AM
hi
 
using traits, can I only inherit some methods, or should I just adjust the trait method visibility?
 
huh?
 
nm, i think i have to do it the second way
like use HelloWorld { sayHello as protected; }
 
why the heck would you do that?
 
user895378
2:25 AM
A word of advice ... I have yet to encounter a situation where I wasn't better served to avoid using a trait in favor of traditional vertical inheritance. And I've tried :)
 
@rdlowrey I'll extend that to say I have yet to encounter many situations where it wasn't better served avoiding vertical inheritance over composition. And I've tried...
 
user895378
Well said, sir.
 
not to say it doesn't have its uses (same for traits), but I use them as a last resort, instead of a first-pull...
 
user895378
Unrelated: It's really great when you almost ask a dumb question, then spend the extra 30 seconds to research before you do and find out the answer ... thereby avoiding looking like a moron.
 
user895378
I almost made myself look like the ultimate git n00b
 
2:31 AM
Nothing wrong with asking a question then later solving it oneself.
 
@rdlowrey Don't Be Afraid To Ask Dumb Questions
 
If it gets answered while searching for a solution, great. If you solve it
then someone answers with a better solution, so what?>
 
user895378
Oh don't worry, I was on the verge of asking it -- I just stumbled across the answer in the moment before hitting send :)
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu @rdlowrey be afraid of bigots, not of asking potentially silly questions
 
2:33 AM
@TuralTeyyuboglu the only dumb question is the one unasked
 
@rdlowrey How goes it?
 
@MichaelRobinson bigots?
@ircmaxell exactly
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison I think we have a successful submodule, but you might wanna verify that.
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu big·ot·ed/ˈbigətid/
Adjective:
Obstinately convinced of the superiority or correctness of one's own opinions and prejudiced against those who hold different opinions.
Expressing or characterized by prejudice and intolerance.
 
@MichaelRobinson ok)
 
user895378
2:37 AM
@LeviMorrison I assume it's enough for you to be a collaborator on the core repo but I went ahead an just added you onto the Http repo as well
 
@rdlowrey Looks good. I was able to pull, and init and update submodules.
Lovely.
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu great post
 
user895378
“Does he run Internet Explorer 6?”
“Yes.”
 
user895378
Problem solved.
 
2:41 AM
@MichaelRobinson agree))
 
@rdlowrey I spent most of the day learning Inkscape so I can make beautiful SVG images. It was worth it.
 
user895378
I've been wanting to dig into SVG for a while and just haven't been able to get away from writing PHP lately
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison If I'm a Photoshop wizard with zero GIMP experience, how much of a learning curve would you say Inkscape presents?
 
user895378
Make that a Level 42 Photoshop Warlock carrying the Helm of Disintegration.
 
user895378
Actually, I'm pretty comfortable with Illustrator as well, and the Inkscape site says "with capabilities similar to Illustrator"
 
2:54 AM
I think Im going to write my next project using only global variables, traits, and goto's, rather than all the useless OO stuff people go on about
 
@rdlowrey Do you lean more towards designing or programming?
 
user895378
@user705339 Programming. I do almost zero design these days.
 
user895378
I like programming so much more because there's less subjectivity as far as the end user is concerned.
 
user895378
It either works or it doesn't.
 
user895378
With design you have to deal with things like "drafts" and "reviews" and "stylistic editorial control"
 
2:56 AM
and you are very good with PhotoShop?
 
@rdlowrey Not in my experience...
 
user895378
Yeah -- it's one of those things I picked up in school and have been using for like 10 years at this point.
 
user895378
@ircmaxell I'm speaking in terms of outward-facing functionality with the customer. The internals of coding are the same as creative design, but I find that's generally dealt with in-house and not with a customer ...
 
@rdlowrey oh ok.....I used to hate designing more than programming. Just learning to adapt to both
 
@rdlowrey No, I mean that I think that outward facing functionality is a lot more subjective. Sure, you can spec it out to death, but most customers don't know what their spec really means...
 
user895378
3:00 AM
Oh I see what you're saying. I agree.
 
user895378
I would change what I said to ...
 
user895378
Customers tend to think they know more about what does or doesn't look good than they might about whether or not something works correctly, if that makes any sense. I think the average person is more likely to question a creative decision than a technical one.
 
user895378
BUT, you're definitely right that they probably have no idea what their spec actually means :)
 
user895378
So the only real answer is to get filthy rich so you don't have to deal with customers.
 
@rdlowrey lol.....so, who'll deal with 'em?
 
user895378
3:04 AM
@user705339 Someone else.
 
@rdlowrey lol...unless you are the co-founder who deals with the technical aspect, you might have to deal with some
 
user895378
@user705339 One word, three syllables: figurehead :)
 
figurehead indeed
 
@rdlowrey Does illustrator do SVG?
I would think so.
 
user895378
Yeah I would too, though I've never bothered to try.
 
3:09 AM
I'll show you what I've been up to in a moment.
 
user895378
Okay, don't take too long because in a bit I'm going to lie about going to bed early so I can go read The Hunger Games (don't laugh).
 
I am on a netbook, so when I get a lot of stuff going on, my comp struggles.
Shouldn't be too long.
 
Guys, need your advice. Want to create website with blog and portfolio pages. But don't want to reinvent the wheel (I mean blog part). I have no customization experience with any CMS or blogging engine, so I got question: Is it hard to integrate wordpress blogging engine into existing project?
 
user895378
Ugh, I would roll my own several times before trying to fight with Wordpress ... but that's just me
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu not really hard to integrate wordpress, but be warned: the codebase will give you nightmares
 
user895378
3:15 AM
Wordpress is such a terrible spaghetti mess ... it's so sad that it's the main reference point for "PHP Software"
 
@rdlowrey Actually, I'm thinking about building from scratch. Is there any simple blogging engine for this purpose? I mean simple to customize
Not so huge as WP
 
Honestly I've had nightmares about it. In my dreams I attempted to refactor it. Insanity.
 
@MichaelRobinson in my dreams... rofl)))
 
user895378
I can't suggest any, though I'm pretty sure there are some open-source blogging engines out there for the same reasons you're citing.
 
user895378
Basic CMS functionality is pretty simple to achieve on your own, though.
 
3:18 AM
@rdlowrey yeah.. agree with you. but comments, rating etc...
@rdlowrey time consuming things. not hard
Ok, seems you're suggesting to build from scratch, right?
 
user895378
True. A quick googling of "lightweight php cms" seems to turn up plenty of results ... Of course the top SO result advocates wordpress and drupal ... And I'd completely disagree with those options.
 
user895378
It just depends on what it's for ... If it's just for you, all you really need is posts, categories, comments and users. I suspect there are very basic CMS options out there, but I can't recommend one
 
user895378
throw in a "category_links" table for left-joining categories to posts and presto
 
144 people publicly endorse this chyrp.net
 
user895378
But yeah, all the forms and stuff would be a bit of drudgery to implement ...
 
3:22 AM
@rdlowrey I'm done, but I've having trouble exporting it as a .png for viewing pleasure.
 
@rdlowrey Yeah just for myself. Again, it's not hard but time consuming. I'm searching for faster way. If will not find anything, will build it from scratch
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison I also accept gif, jpeg and tiff with high compression levels
 
user895378
@MichaelRobinson It looks like it's built on top of Symfony 2, so it's probably good enough ...
 
user895378
Wait, did someone just drop an iOS interface into chat?!?!? Oh no, that's just @LeviMorrison's sweet vector graphics :)
 
3:25 AM
@rdlowrey hehe. iOS interface))
 
@rdlowrey :) Thanks for the compliment.
 
user895378
@TuralTeyyuboglu If it was just for my own use, and I didn't have way too much going on to justify the time wasting I'd definitely roll my own, but that's just me.
 
@rdlowrey hmm good idea. I agree with you
 
user895378
@LeviMorrison I assume you'll be merging those into a single PNG for CSS sprite use?
 
@rdlowrey That is a single image PNG for CSS sprite use :)
 
user895378
3:28 AM
Aha!
 
@LeviMorrison :3008246 why don't you use CSS3 for getting this result? Just because of backward compatibility issue?
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu You don't see alot of the detail because of how small it is, but good luck doing that in CSS3 . . .
 
user895378
Yeah, the little white buttons would still need an image (or an insane amount of hacking to get it to look good across browsers)
 
@LeviMorrison pikproduction.az my work. 80% of things got work with CSS3. Also take a look at photo and video galleries: pikproduction.az/?lang=az&page=3 and pikproduction.az/?lang=az&page=11
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu Impressive, but I promise it isn't as detailed as what I have. Maybe I'll post a higher resolution version.
 
user895378
3:32 AM
Vector graphics FTW
 
@LeviMorrison I haven't said that your is not imressive. Just saying that we can get nearly same result with new web technologies
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu Also, keep in mind that CSS3 renders slowly. The graphic renders MUCH quicker. Of course, it takes longer to download . . . :)
 
@LeviMorrison hehe. Render faster than download))
@LeviMorrison BTW.. Video gallery I made with Zend + Youtube api. That was something big. Have you tried to click on video thumbnail to see what happens?
 
@TuralTeyyuboglu False: I only download once
 
@LeviMorrison That's not game graphics for you))) lol. New CPU and GPU's will render them in nanosecs
 
user895378
3:35 AM
Browser caching FTW. Also, sometimes background-image CSS sprites and the :hover pseudo class are just vastly simpler.
 
user895378
And pixel-perfect.
 
@rdlowrey not nearly as much fun as fussing over CSS for hours though, admit it.
 
@rdlowrey CSS3 is pixel perfect yeah
 
user895378
@MichaelRobinson Not since IE6 died, anyway :)
 
@rdlowrey Who cares about IE6. lol))
 
user895378
3:37 AM
Thank goodness nobody really has to anymore
 
If interesting for you, open this link to see the power of youtube api + zend framework: pikproduction.az/?lang=az&page=11#jrKpTwENkZs All data from youtube channel
 
What's IE6's current market share anyway?
 
@user705339 no one cares)))
 
user895378
Unfortunately, because of the still-widespread use of IE6-8, full CSS3 just isn't an option for me. I can't show ~30% of people an inconsistent design.
 
user895378
Another reason why I prefer programming to design ...
 
3:40 AM
@TuralTeyyuboglu if you are in an online advertising firm, your boss certainly cares
 
user895378
Well, not JS, though. Stupid JS implementation differences ...
 
@rdlowrey I see what browsers my visitors generally using. Really, didn't catch any visitor with IE6 til today
 
@LeviMorrison cool
 
user895378
I would go bananas if I spent all day trying to hack awesome standards-compliant CSS3 layouts into working for special-needs browsers. Backend all the way.
 
3:43 AM
@rdlowrey Lol. I didn't see anything simpler than css in web programming.
 
user895378
@TuralTeyyuboglu If you can duplicate @LeviMorrison's graphics "simply" in a cross-browser fashion (that includes IE7) then I'll happily change my stance.
 
user895378
But somehow I don't think "simple" is the correct term for that.
 
@rdlowrey I don't have time for that, sorry, but just take a look at examples lab.simurai.com/umbrui or jonathanmoore.com/post/1054102023/bonbon-buttons
 
user895378
I'm on board all the way for CSS. It's great in my bleeding edge Chrome. But how simple is that for IE7 without images? Not at all. That's the problem.
 
@rdlowrey It's just my opinion: I really don't care about IE6 and IE7 issues. I'm checking browser on page load. If browser is IE6 allerting message with link to newest browsers pages
 
user895378
3:48 AM
I'm 100% pro-CSS. You're preaching to the choir. Instead, you need to find Michael J. Fox, a Dolorean and go back in time and tell the IE people not to perpetrate horrible crimes against the Internet.
 
user895378
But anyway, I hafta make up an excuse now to cover up for the fact that I'm going to run off and indulge my inner teenage girl by finishing "The Hunger Games." And by that I mean ... I'm going to bed. Yep. Definitely not reading young-adult fiction targeted at 16-year-old girls.
 
@rdlowrey I don't need to find anything or anyone.
@rdlowrey what was that?))))
 
user895378
The Hunger Games is a young adult novel written by Suzanne Collins. It was originally published in hardcover on September 14, 2008, by Scholastic. It is written in first person and introduces sixteen-year-old Katniss Everdeen, who lives in a post-apocalyptic world in the country of Panem where the countries of North America once existed. The Capitol, a highly advanced metropolis, holds absolute power over the rest of the nation. The Hunger Games are an annual event in which one boy and one girl aged 12 to 18 from each of the 12 districts surrounding the Capitol are selected by lottery to...
 
@rdlowrey Ok. good nite. try to learn CSS3 & HTML5 Canvas things))
 
user895378
I know CSS3! Very well. Internet Explorer doesn't. You've missed the entire point of my argument.
 
user895378
3:53 AM
That is all. Shenanigans.
 
@rdlowrey I'm tired too. it's 07:54 am in my country lol)) I g2g some sleep
nite guys. I'm gone
 
user557846
<not related to this chat at all rant> there are some people who are a special kind of stupid</rant>
 
Daaaaaaaagon
 
@Dagon who for ex?)) anyway to call someone stupid not good
 
user557846
perhaps, but true.
 
user557846
3:59 AM
the gene pool could do with some cleaning
 
Eugenics ftw
 
user557846
exams at 10, cull those who fail.
 

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