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1:09 AM
@NikiC Here you go: 174.121.25.12/RTCE
Notes:
- it is currently limited to 10 clients at a time
- you cannot make use of custom file URI functionality (security reasons)
 
appearently this isn't working, any suggestions on an alternative? array_pshift($varPDOArray, ":for" => $for . "%", ":for2" => "%" . $for . "%");
 
1:25 AM
@Justin WTF is that??
you can't have a ..."a"=>"b"... outside an array(...) construct
 
1:38 AM
I'm trying to push this element into an array
I'm trying to simplify my search query's
for PDO
 
If I could suggest something, you should learn PHP's syntax first...
for what's it worth, what you want is:

$varPDOArray[':for'] = $for . '%';
$varPDOArray[':for2'] = '%' . $for . '%';
@NikiC if it gets lonely on the RTCE, try 174.121.25.12/RTCE/multi.php
It allows "multi-user" on the same page.
 
Will this work on an array with no items?
usually I'm creating an array like: $varArray = array(":for" => $for ."%", ":for2" => "%" . $for . "%");
but now I'm starting with a blank array $varPDOArray = array(); and have to add these items later. I also may not be adding any items at all. So I need the item count to be reguluar.
 
2:10 AM
@CharlesSprayberry I totally agree, the worst is when you type it in a string and your IDE tells you that no such escape character exists
 
Ok after doing that now my test to see "if (count($varArray) > 0) {" if array has no items is failing
 
@sebastien I get all kind of problems trying to parse documentation with all the escape characters littered through the code.
 
@Justin you can also just say if ($varArray) {
@CharlesSprayberry I really don’t understand why they didn’t take :: they already use it as a scope operator, so it makes sense
 
@sebastien Well, I understand how you could have ambiguities using a scope operator and a namespace separator as the same symbol. I just don't like that they chose what is universally accepted as an escape character instead.
I would have rather seen ::: or even ..
 
Well, you can’t use self, static or parent as class or namespace names anyway
so theres no collision
 
2:17 AM
Hi, I have a doubt in installing codeigniter in an ftp server and setting the base url in config.php
can someone help me with it.?
 
whats your doubt
by base url you mean the base directory ?
 
I uploaded codeigniter to the ftp server. I followed the installation instructions at codeigniter.com/user_guide/installation/index.html. But am not sure what they meant by base url.
I am new to php. So am not sure what exactly i should do
 
usually base url refers to if your website is not at /
 
@sebastien Foo::Bar::Something() ... is that a call to a static Bar::Something() in namespace Foo? Is it a call to a function Something() in namespace Foo::Bar? Maybe it is a call to a class Something in Foo::Bar that has a __invoke method. How is the Zend engine supposed to know?
 
2:20 AM
They have asked to modify the config.php file. So should I modify it in my local host and the upload it to the ftp server.?
 
for basic config, base url would be just /
 
oh thanks. let me try that
 
@CharlesSprayberry Thats not a scope operator problem, your exemple remains good with the \
 
@sebastian: should I modify the config.php in my local host and then upload it separately to the ftp server.?
 
@sebastien What I'm saying is that had they used :: as a namespace separator you would run into issues with that problem
 
2:23 AM
And i say, we have those problems with the current implementation. It is not related to the scope operator
@SyncMaster how is it configured on your local host? Have you tried to get it running on your machine first ?
 
nope. how can i figure out the configuration on my local host. can i just use, localhost/MyUserName
?
 
wut?
 
As I am new to php, not very clear how I should proceed
 
do you have any idea of what you are doing ?
ok ok
do you have a proper web server installed on your computer ?
 
nope. I have an ftp server which I can use.
 
2:28 AM
I very strongly suggest you to do
so*
you do so *
because uploading files via FTP is a pain to develop
and if you want to test a bit, you will want a different environment than your main one
so if you screw things up, nothing is lost
are you on windows ?
 
yeah.
on windows 7
 
start by installing Apache
heres one for drupal/xampp
I’m gonna leave you on this, good luck :)
 
thanks a lot for your suggestion
 
np, have a nice one
 
 
2 hours later…
4:11 AM
Hiya
Anyone down here?
 
@Ozbekov Yes.
I'm busy writing an RFC for PHP to improve the SPL. If you mention me by name, I'll always respond when I hear the ping.
 
Acronyms forevaaaa
It's at these times of the day where I want to put my headphones on and code like a psychopathic maniac while listening to classical music.
 
4:30 AM
@Ozbekov I love classical music :)
 
@LeviMorrison Really? I'm studying classical music performance and composition at university.
 
@Ozbekov I wish I had the time. I am studying Computer Science. :)
 
@LeviMorrison I'm studying that as well :P
 
5:09 AM
@Ozbekov @ircmaxell Could you read the following article and give me your thoughts? wiki.php.net/rfc/spl-improvements
 
OK Gimme a moment I have to settle my brain down
@LeviMorrison How do you get the PHP mail?
 
@Ozbekov Do you mean, how is it delivered? Or how did I obtain a php.net address?
 
Latter
 
@Ozbekov It comes with an SVN account.
 
@LeviMorrison The last point before the proposal is very intriguing.
This looks fine
Do you know this: bitstorm.org/edwin/en/php
I had to dig into my bookmarks for that :-P But I think it's a good document PHP developers should check out.
 
5:27 AM
@Ozbekov Thank you for the link. Interesting read.
Do you have any other comments on my RFC?
 
Nope, I think it looks good.
And it's rather interesting too
I've always found PHP to provide good documentation/reference.
Unlike Python's documentations, where every function is an essay in and of itself and has no conclusion.
 
5:47 AM
@Ozbekov I agree, except in the Spl. :)
 
6:01 AM
hiii
 
@Urvisha Good morning / evening
 
6:20 AM
good morning guys , gals and everyone else
 
@tereško good morning
 
@tereško Here is my initial and unfinished proposal regarding the SPL if you care to read it: wiki.php.net/rfc/spl-improvements
@Anfurny welcome!
 
Sup
 
That's what's up for me :)
Any feedback is welcome.
 
Nice
I agree with at least pieces of that. Especially about the documentation sucking
I had to learn SPL for zend certification and... ugh...
 
6:35 AM
lol
I'd like to hear about it.
 
It just felt so... java and so NOT python.
 
@Anfurny If it was Java, it would at least be better than what we have . .
To some degree
The basic Java collections are quite nice.
 
It's like they went out of their way to make an OOP solution which meant memorizing a bunch of classes and stuff for basic iteration type things that should be natively supported imho with nice language constructs.
Most of all it just fundamentally failed to justify itself. Nowhere did I see anything on "What problem do I solve?" (and I read a bunch of random crap).
 
@Anfurny lol
 
like filter iterator, compare that to python, prime example.
In python I can simply say [x*2 for x in [1,2,3] if x > 2]
which means return x*2 for every value in the array(1,2,3) which has a value x > 2
thus [6]
I don't understand why I should memorize some weird high-level class with all its particular methods to get a similar result in php.
 
6:45 AM
@Anfurny Well, PHP is not python is the short answer.
 
Well as I see it, all programming languages need to strive to be C++ or strive to be Python.
 
but if you're trying to be c++ and not a scripting language, it better be because you're getting major speed benefits by not offering the dynamism of Python.
More realistic / advanced example
[aFile.upper() for aFile in os.listdir('.') if aFile[-3:] == '.jpg']
Will return an array of uppercase filenames of all files ending with jpg in the current directory. I'm sure filter iterator plus directory iterator can do this with SPL, in fact this is probably what the two were made for, but the memorization involved plus the space and typing time just make the python solution so much better in every way.
 
Oh well.
 
Please correct me if I'm wrong
 
7:02 AM
@Anfurny I don't believe that syntax will ever be supported in PHP. Sorry, but I don't. You might just be a Python guy :)
 
I don't need that exact syntax, I just want a 1 line solution to what's a 4 line problem in most lame languages.
 
@Anfurny While it may be a one liner for you, most of my filtering is more complex than that. It makes sense to use more lines.
 
@LeviMorrison Well with python you can always use a function with that type of construct too. The only difference is python allows simple 1 line or complex multi line, crappy languages allow complex multiline only.
 
anything interesting happening
?
 
@tereško That depends on what you think is interesting.
 
7:14 AM
dunno.. i have slept for past 18 hours , any update would be nice
 
Let's update @tereško to new version.
 
@tereško It's been fairly quiet.
I was hoping that people would be more active so I could get comments on wiki.php.net/rfc/spl-improvements
 
i doubt you will get many
most of people ignore SPL
 
@tereško I believe it. I think part of the problem is that the SPL isn't good enough for generic people to say, oh yeah, that would be nice.
But for those who do use it, the stuff I mention really matters.
Where are @NikiC and @ircmaxell when I want their opinions? In the past they've always been here! Patience is tough sometimes :/
 
7:27 AM
It's 2:27am and bedtime.
Good night
 
Okay, so here's the 1-liner in php equivalent to that python line.
array_map("strtoupper", array_filter(scandir('.'), function($x) {return substr($x, -3) == 'xcf';}));
without SPL
 
That's not too bad.
 
yes, which is only possible in 1 line now because php finally has recently added closures
 
@Anfurny PHP is improving. Finally. It will be a long time before it's a good language. It's a good tool sometimes, but that's different altogether.
 
i got mail in my spam folder using mail()
whats the problem?
in yii
I dnt want in spam.I want in Inbox
 
7:34 AM
The problem is that it looks like spam, and doesn't come from a reputable domain.
 
It's because your server, whatever it is, thinks it's coming from a bad domain.
A domain with bad reputation.
 
any solution?
 
If your domain is a known spam source, no.
Now, back to sleep :-P
 
@Urvisha if you want reliable mail delivery, you should probably use something like postmarkapp.com
 
7:48 AM
Wait, I get SPL finally.
 
@Anfurny ?
 
So at first blush it seems like iterators are nothing more than complicated unnecessary expansions on things like scandir, array_walk, array_filter as mentioned above
but since iterators directly operate on ANY traversable element, not just arrays, it has a minor overhead reduction advantage.
So now you can apply filter functions to linked lists seamlessly
 
@Anfurny Instead of converting to an array and then pushing it back in.
 
Of course, the python solution would be "convert everything traversible to an array, then use array_map then put it back"
Yes. So really it comes down to a performance boost, which isn't super compelling since I never used php for speed, it's more PHP going in the direction of C++.
But nobody is FORCED to use SPL so since it still has all the old map functions (even if they are more typing than the pithy python) it is almost getting the best of both worlds.
In short: I'm glad SPL is there now that I finally get it. I just wish somebody would have explained it better.
 
@tereško Released a test demo of my RTCE.... if you're interested
 
7:52 AM
i doubt that i can
my mouse is still broken
i really should go an buy a new one
 
If you're on windows, you could turn your keypad into a mouse :D
 
@tereško Any 'real' editor is usable without a mouse :)
 
please , stop being an asshole
 
you might need to a mouse to 'select' a file.
 
doesnt work
 
7:55 AM
for some reason the first file's bugged
what doesn't?
 
Though I still don't get ArrayObject
 
@Anfurny It's to help you build your own datastructures.
 
@ChristianSciberras , you are assuming that every browser has WebSockets
 
@tereško likey? :D
 
@ChristianSciberras I was the one typing can I haz stuff
 
7:57 AM
how's it any different than
 
@LeviMorrison XD
 
foreach ($key=>$val in $myArray)
?
 
@tereško I was going to release it for a personal project, which is chrome-based. Which is also why I didn't bother with other browsers (yet) sorry.
 
@Anfurny That doesn't make sense to me. You must be referring to some part of ArrayObject and not the thing as a whole?
 
@ChristianSciberras , then you are stupid
sorry , i cannot be nice about it
if you are ignoring every other browse but the one you use , then you are stupid
 
7:59 AM
"The ArrayObject allows for external traversal of arrays and to create instances of ArrayIterator."
 
No no, this wasn't intended for a web project
 
But I always could iterate an array with foreach @LeviMorrison
 
it was intended for a desktop application
which happens to use chrome as the rendering engine :)
being web-based is an unintended side-effect
When the editor is stable enough, I'll proceed to cross-browser-enabling-it
 
@Anfurny The main use of ArrayObject is when you want something to extend an array. Say I have a class, Node. If I have a bunch of Nodes, I may want a name for it. We'll call this Nodes. Nodes could extend ArrayObject and all it has to do is overload offset* to verify it is only working with Node objects, and viola, done.
It's really handy.
 
and if I have an arrayObject it can respond to [] ?
 
8:03 AM
anyway, I'm off for now.
cya later guys
 
@Anfurny Yes. That's because ArrayObject implements ArrayAccess.
@ChristianSciberras ciao
 
So I can even pass it to built-in functions that usually only accept arrays, eh?
 
@Anfurny eh. . . sort of
if they use array type-checking, no
In that case you have to cast it to an array first.
 
Well, then I don't get it.
Or really I don't get how it will come in handy
 
The cast in that case doesn't do anything
Except allow it through
 
8:06 AM
No I don't get what arrayObject lets me do now with fewer lines than before
 
@Anfurny I write less code in my data-structures that use it.
 
8:21 AM
@Gordon I'd appreciate your comments on wiki.php.net/rfc/spl-improvements if you have the time.
It's still a work in progress, but complete enough to ask for suggestions.
 
Morning! Guys, could anyone explain to me what for is ther a functionality for adding Subforms for example in Zend? Why not two separate forms?
 
@Eugene I don't use Zend much. Sorry.
 
@Eugene for instance, when you create a new customer, you might want to two subforms for address: billing and shipping
can you please say ZF. Zend is just the company and I will start ranting if you keep saying it wrong
@Eugene iirc, Subforms are also the only way create form elements with names like foo[]. in other words, you will get an array in $_POST[foo]
@LeviMorrison "This article attempts" -> "This wiki attempts"
 
@Gordon Okey. Sorry, @Gordon. But I still don't understand why not two separate forms. If they will have different names woun't I be able to distinctly assign submited data to the fields either way?
 
@Gordon Thank you. Any other suggestions?
 
8:33 AM
@LeviMorrison nice effort. looks good.
@Eugene you can only submit one form at a time. SubForms allow you to logically separate conceptual parts of a form. think of it as stuff you'd put into a <fieldset>
 
@Gordon So subforms are needed if there is more than one form per action?
@Gordon Still it is odd. Why can't I create two forms, pass them to view and when one or both are submited just check via form name, which one is submitted. Or if I understand correctly then it is for creating one visual form in html, but field names having diff. prefix( form name )?
 
8:54 AM
@Eugene no. subforms are fieldsets
> Sub forms serve several purposes:
> Creating logical element groups. Since sub forms are simply forms, you can validate subforms as individual entities.
> Creating multi-page forms. Since sub forms are simply forms, you can display a separate sub form per page, building up multi-page forms where each form has its own validation logic. Only once all sub forms validate would the form be considered complete.
> Display groupings. Like display groups, sub forms, when rendered as part of a larger form, can be used to group elements. Be aware, however, that the master form object will have no awareness of the elements in sub forms.
well, fieldsets and multipage forms. its really about the logical separation, like i said
you can create two forms but you can only submit one at a time. so no "when both are submited"
@Eugene example:
<form action="/customer" method="post">
	<div>
		<fieldset>
			<legend>Shipping</legend>
			<input name="shipping[street]"/>
			<input name="shipping[zip]"/>
			<input name="shipping[city]"/>
		</fieldset>
		<fieldset>
			<legend>Billing</legend>
			<input name="billing[street]"/>
			<input name="billing[zip]"/>
			<input name="billing[city]"/>
		</fieldset>
	</div>
</form>
if you had two separate forms for that on the same page you would only be able to submit one of the two forms
so you use a fieldset and group the element names under a shared name, e.g. shipping and billing
then you submit only that one form
and SubForms in ZF allow you to create this programmatically
 
9:10 AM
@Gordon I see know. Thank you very much.
 
@Eugene yw
 
@Gordon https://wiki.php.net/rfc/spl-improvements#proposal
I modified that portion heavily. I'd like to know your thoughts on the namespacing idea.
 
@LeviMorrison i like "SplObjectStorage should be split into two structures, a Map and a Set." i only use it as a set anyways. never had the need for object dictionary
@LeviMorrison not sure about the namespacing. i dont know how well that would work out with the BC
 
@Gordon Perhaps it was unclear: the Spl would exist namespaced (with all the changes) and as it currently is.
For a time there would be two copies. Confusing while it lasts, but it could speed up and ease the process.
 
@LeviMorrison hmm. yeah, that could probably work
 
9:18 AM
@Gordon It would be ugly in the meantime, I admit.
 
@LeviMorrison actually, that could work for a lot of things in the core
 
@Gordon Exactly.
 
@LeviMorrison its kinda like forking without forking
 
@Gordon And it namespaces things in PHP, something that probably should have been done long ago. This could be a major goal for the next major PHP version after 6.0.
 
Is there a solution other than quitting PHP to get rid of headaches?
 
9:22 AM
@wabbble aspirine will help temporarily
 
yes, been using that as a routine already
thing is, doesn't help always
 
@wabbble well, there is always stronger things to abuse
 
I think I'm taking the strongest
 
@wabbble rest in peace :)
 
that's another issue, can't sleep much (solution is another pill) lol
 
9:25 AM
@Gordon Also, I think the Spl should have a high-level API of a low-level implementation of an array. SplFixedArray does not always solve the needs because it requires that you know the size beforehand.
 
@LeviMorrison more information please
 
talking of arrays .. is it very bad when I have a file in what there's only an array, but the file size is 24mb~
 
@wabbble not if you can live with the memory usage
 
@Gordon PHP arrays perform all sorts of duties. They are quite large and inefficient in terms of memory. Sometimes a much narrower structure that doesn't do the other stuff is needed. If you need a real array, then SplFixedArray only goes so far. It requires that you know the size beforehand. That's not always feasible.
 
@wabbble though a db might be better suited
 
9:28 AM
it doesn't slow down the site for a visitor, right?
it uses both the array and db
site was made back in 03 I think
boss says I need to make it faster, so I'm thinking maybe it's the array
 
@wabbble if you need to make it faster, use a profiler to see where it goes slow and then improve those parts
 
@wabbble What do you do with the data?
 
All right.
It keeps user information on db and, from what I can tell, page content, configuration settings and all other yada-yada is in the array
 
@wabbble if its key/value pairs only you could also have a look at pecl.php.net/package/chdb
though apc and memcached would work for k/v stores as well
 
Interesting - Oops! Google Chrome could not connect to pecl.php.net
cached page works tho'
 
9:36 AM
 
@Gordon What I'm thinking of seems more like Judy.
 
@LeviMorrison i guess most sites that PHP is used on doesnt have a need for more efficient data structures
 
@Gordon I agree with you. That doesn't mean there isn't a viable need. The fact is that you gave me two links to packages similar to what I suggested. That demonstrates that at least two groups see a big enough need to publicly develop it.
 
@LeviMorrison well, yes, but they are pecl, so i guess people will tell you that we already have them :)
 
@Gordon Neither one is past beta. There's nothing wrong with having it in the Spl, is there?
 
9:46 AM
@LeviMorrison i think we shouldnt start throwing any possible new datastructure into spl but only general purpose stuff
 
@Gordon If PHP never provides the tools that advanced users need, then advanced users will not be choosing PHP for new projects. To me, that's a simple fact. PHP, before 5.3, was pretty much a toy language. Now, it's better, but it's not a serious tool.
 
@LeviMorrison market share proves you wrong :)
 
@Gordon The only issue I have with that statement is: what is the meaning 'general purpose'?
@Gordon And Facebook proves that PHP needs performance improvements. I'm not saying they would have benefitted from the structure I'm proposing, only that PHP lacks certain kinds of tools.
 
@LeviMorrison yeah, thats a good question. i'd say anything that is a data structure not catering to a special implementation? its argueable, i know.
@LeviMorrison fb is different. they are already turning php into their own variant of the language
 
@Gordon How many BIG websites do you know of that use PHP?
 
9:50 AM
@LeviMorrison how big is big?
iirc, bbc, ny times and even ms to some extent
 
@Gordon Probably because PHP didn't provide them with what they needed. Maybe PHP is just the wrong language for the job. I believe that PHP could be what it needs to for that type of thing.
 
the largest telecommunications provider in germany uses it too
 
So, I just found this: phpsadness.com
 
@wabbble pointless site is pointless
@LeviMorrison what type of thing? being the largest social network on the planet? that would be a niche ;)
 
@Gordon phpsadness.com/sad/8 That one is very real and annoying, though
@Gordon Let's say we're dealing with sites that make top 500 in the world. How adequately does PHP serve them?
 
9:54 AM
@LeviMorrison there is a lot of annoyances in php. no doubt about it. its not a perfect language but its also a very capable language.
 
@Gordon That last point is exactly why I'm pushing Spl improvements :)
 
@LeviMorrison i dont know. find out which sites that are and see if you can find out whether they use PHP. My naive guess for a large portion of them is yes, they do.
 
@Gordon My guess is that those who use it have some serious complaints about it. Emphasis on guess.
 
@LeviMorrison imo, the main strength of PHP is its easy scalability due to shared nothing and SAPI integration and its many connectivity features. basically, there is an extension for everything out there.
 
@wabbble While that site outlines a lot of things I agree with, he's definitely one picky dude.
 
9:56 AM
@LeviMorrison i consider whoever wrote that a sad troll
 
Yeah, just thought it might be interesting for ya.
one thing he wrote there even got fixed in the rc3 of php 5.4
thanks to that site actually
 
@wabbble eh, probably not.
 
yes.
I discovered it via the changelog where I found mick weiss's site where I found phpsadness
 
I mean, this is ridiculous: phpsadness.com/sad/37
@wabbble I've also seen that elsewhere.
 
I think the site is bullshit because of the ads
I mean, if he wants to make a point, why try to make a profit with it? None who wants to give back so desperately that he creates a site like that would ever think of putting ads to it, so he either is, like @Gordon said, a sad troll or I'm just an idiot for thinking that.
 
10:01 AM
@salathe Care to explain why you are against wiki.php.net/rfc/strncmpnegativelen ? I'm curious.
 
@LeviMorrison No.
 
@salathe Fair enough :)
@salathe I was just shocked to Rasmus, Iliaa and Salathe all on against. It seems like a helpful, small addition. I was hoping to find out if there was some deeper problem I didn't see before I voted.
 
Try and find the internals thread on that topic.
 
hello all this is my question pastebin.com/7vydumeh
 
@Harsh this is the classic definition of a fat controller. this is not how MVC is supposed to work. you are doing controller work, model work and view work all in that action. if you do it this way, you can just as well throw out ZF and use a procedural script.
 
10:07 AM
@salathe I'm still very new to all of this. Could you point me in the right direction? I'm not sure how to find it.
 
8
A: Understanding MVC: Whats the concept of "Fat" on models, "Skinny" on controllers?

GordonYour application is the M. It should be able to stand independent from V and C. V and C form the User Interface to your application. Whether this is a web interface or a command line interface shouldn't matter for the core business logic of your application to run. You want the model to be fat wi...

 
14
A: in MVC, where do you draw the line between a controller and model?

GordonThe line between controller and model is actually quite clear. Model is your application's heart. It contains the business/domain logic required to solve the problem your application was written for. The Model is usually layered into several other layers, e.g. persistence, services, domain, etc....

 
@salathe Thank you very much!
 
Good time everyone !
 
10:10 AM
@LeviMorrison for what it's worth, my thoughts echoed Rasmus's
 
Rasmus, asmus, smus, mus, us, s …
echoed Rasmus
 
@salathe I didn't notice how the return value might be changed. Thank you for your time.
 
:2144869 Your views shouldn't even know about DB.
 
:2144869 the usual way in ZF would be to have the controller tell the model to give it the data and then pass the data to the view. the view then renders that data either in the template or via a View Helper.
 
@LeviMorrison no problemo :)
 
10:18 AM
@salathe Is there a document somewhere I haven't found that talks about writing RFCs? Something that addresses format, time frame things should exist in which section, etc? I'm writing my first and such a document would be very useful.
 
@LeviMorrison "A new page in this RFC namespace will automatically be loaded with a template for an RFC. Customize as needed." and time frames should respect wiki.php.net/rfc/voting
 
@salathe Thank you very much.
 
ok
 
11:09 AM
greetings, peers
 
@LeviMorrison Etienne replied to you in #php.pecl :)
gist: 1496714, 2011-12-19 11:17:17Z
[11:01] <@ekneuss> If somebody could please paste him my replies when he comes back 
                   online, that would be great
[11:03] <@ekneuss> LeviM, 1) SPL Exceptions were introduced quite a while ago, and 
                   it is indeed quite ambiguous which one to use in which case. On 
                   top of that, I believe their use-cases are overlapping. If you 
                   feel like you can make the docs clearer and the usages in the code 
                   more consistent, that's great.
[11:06] <@ekneuss> LeviM, 2) For SplStack and SplQueue, I aggree that it would have 
                   been cleaner to have them as interfaces, with various possible 
                   implementations. Now, I don't believe having an implementation of 
                   a stack that extends a DLL is as bad as you describe.
[11:08] <@ekneuss> LeviM, The SplStack implementation using DLLs as-is is a specific 
                   case of implementation of a DLL, and thus it fits well as a subclass.
[11:08] * jpauli1 (~julien@187.118.210.62.te-dns.org) has joined #php.pecl
[11:08] * jpauli (~julien@187.118.210.62.te-dns.org) Quit (Read error: No route to host)
[11:10] <@ekneuss> LeviM, 3) For SplObjectStorage, I aggree, it was first implemented 
                   as a set, and then became a map since a map is strictly more useful 
                   than a set. I'm fine with having SplObjectMap and SplObjectSet 
                   alongside of SplObjectStorage and deprecating SplObjectStorage.
[11:11] <@ekneuss> However, we would have to take care of 1) whether we allow only 
                   objects or other types for the keys (currently SplOS only allows 
                   objects), it wouldn't be too hard to support any kind of key types.
[11:12] <@ekneuss> and 2) Again, those should be interfaces, and implementations should be 
                   given via i.e. hashsets/hashmaps
[11:12] <@ekneuss> but but but :)
[11:13] <@ekneuss> Now that we have traits, it would make much more sense to use them to 
                   implement common features of datastructures, like iteration, counting, 
                   etc.. However I'm not convinced that the implementation of traits that 
                   we currently have allows us to do that nicely.
[11:15] <@ekneuss> oh, and last thing: The namespacing discussion has happened in the past, 
                   it is not clear given the current engine implementation of namespaces how 
                   to allow a nice transition to namespaced Spl classes while deprecating 
                   the old ones.
 
11:59 AM
hi.
 

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