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2:03 PM
And both setters are void setWireColor(QColor c); Makes me uncomfortable.
 
When you are run DROP DATABASE you are have of many problem but Big Data is not of one of them.
 
BORAT was such a shitty film
 
:)
 
freakin' friggin!
 
2:12 PM
my brain feels like concrete
 
My compiler just let me create a local variable after another local variable with the same name had been defined
 
That's shadowing.
 
That still causes a compile error doesn't it?
Fuck shadowing, i just threw away 15 minutes of my life because of shadowing
 
Only in the same scope AFAIK
 
@Neil you're lucky it's only 15 mins
could have been much longer
 
2:13 PM
@TonyTheLion Too true
 
No, you lost 15 minutes because your variable's names suck. :)
 
lol
 
I had like CString A; if(something) { CString A = value; } return A;
 
What I said.
 
wow, that's fail
you're still using CString?
 
2:15 PM
CString sucks ass
 
@DeadMG Yes, if you want to redo my project for std::string, be my guest
 
naw
I've got concretebrain right now
 
> Tip Where possible, allocate CString objects on the frame rather than on the heap. This saves memory and simplifies parameter passing.
lol
@DeadMG I used to have that a lot
 
@DeadMG What is that?
 
where your head just feels like someone's filled it up with lead
just very solid
 
2:16 PM
@TonyTheLion Don't take this the wrong way, but all I read is: "Tip When possible, don't bring up anything c++ in Lounge<C++>"
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes It's when 2 + 2 = Come back later
 
@Neil lol. We don't like C++ here, you should know that already :P
 
I have read a book about Objective-C yesterday, this is a surprisingly trivial language
It's really the OO C superset all those people wanted C++ to be.
 
Ell
it looks horrible
 
It's a surprisingly ugly language
 
2:18 PM
With pointers and simplicity and the complete lack of features and stuff.
You don't need guidelines in Objective-C because you can't really do anything sensible anyway
2
 
"with pointers and simplicity" ... :P
 
@kbok Some would consider "lack of features" a bad thing. I think that's what helps a programmer more than anything else
 
if you like spending your time writing boilerplate code
 
what, having to repeat your code for every single fucking type ever because there's no templates?
 
@Neil Use assembly then.
 
2:21 PM
@kbok Nah, that still has too many features. Most assemblers have macros.
 
@kbok That's lack of features and lack of high level programming which is what lets you program efficiently
 
Use a hex editor. Simplest language ever.
@Neil I don't see your point.
 
High-level constructs are features, right?
 
"Too much features" is a stupid complaint and is generally due to something else the speaker doesn't even understand.
"My body has too much features, let's cut my left hand off."
 
It's redundant!
And it can't scribble as well as the right one.
 
2:24 PM
Also who needs legs we have planes for transportation.
 
There are things every language should have, but you understand the difference between being able to open a file and being able to write in LINQ halfway in the code for no apparent reason
 
Many programmers do stupid stuff, and pointless and confusing LINQ are a part of that, not the language designer's fault
You can do stupid things in feature-famine languages too
 
> With a combination of C++11 and the Boost library, I think that it is possible to write code in a style that is almost as painless as in a modern dynamic language like Python.
erm...
no
 
As I see it, that's like putting a carpenter in a small shed with saws, pickaxes, sledge hammers hanging from the ceiling and minimal room to swing a hammer, then say it's the carpenter's fault that he hurt himself while swinging
 
Python has even less gunk to type.
like def func(): whereas C++ would be void func() {}
eh
 
2:30 PM
In other words, the language should let you write clear programs easily.. if it doesn't do that or allows you to do it in a way you shouldn't, these are limitations of languages, not features
 
@Neil That's where you're wrong
 
Here's the thing: there's no other craft like programming. Silly analogies won't win you an argument.
6
 
That's what sucks with saying "feature clutter". Like there's less room after you add a feature.
It's harder to maintain for the implementation provider, but the programmer can just leave it aside if he doesn't needs it.
 
Ell
@TonyTheLion or how about ruby's def func
 
@kbok It's probably the other way around. The more features you have the more "room" the programmer has to work.
 
2:34 PM
@TonyTheLion OTOH, in the right situation in C++ it could be just [](){} (okay, technically not a function, but close enough for most purposes).
 
@JerryCoffin []{}!
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes True
 
Ell
how much should one know about computers before learning to programme? is being a "super user" a pre-requisite?
 
I don't think so.
 
33
Q: Is there any evidence that drugs can actually help programmers produce "better" code?

sytycsI just read this quote from Steve Jobs: "Doing LSD was one of the two or three most important things I have done in my life." Also a quote from that article: He was hardly alone among computer scientists in his appreciation of hallucinogenics and their capacity to liberate human thought f...

 
2:38 PM
Basic math and a logical mind. That's all :)
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Either way the overhead is hardly massive. Granted, it's unlikely to ever compete with golfcode or even Haskell for terseness, but the biggest place it loses is just a lot of names being fairly long (e.g., what C++ calls std::accumulate APL would manage with simply /+ (and you'd normally just give it a variable name without having to specify starting and ending points).
 
and a desire to work with computers would also be a qualification I'd say
 
It's the most important IMO. The will to do it.
 
@Ell I'm not even sure what the qualifications for a superuser would be, not to mention ever having been one. I would say one important qualification is a borderline devious mind -- the willingness and desire to find the easiest way out of a situation, not just the most obvious. The kind of person who responded to a school punishment with a single sentence saying: "I will not talk in class 100 times."
But maybe I just think that because I'm (at least a little) conceited.
 
@kbok It takes that too. Will and persistence
 
2:44 PM
That's stupid, it's obvious that you will get punished more.
 
Patience is an important quality too, but one I don't posses enough of.
 
Using a photocopier is more clever IMO
I tried using several pens at once but it didn't work out
 
@kbok Feature creep is a thing.
 
@TonyTheLion This would explain so much of the legacy code I have to maintain :I
 
Ell
I think will power is very important in any hobby
or profession
 
2:45 PM
write the line once, scan it, photoshop it
 
@kbok The teacher tried. My dad called her up and gave her a lecture on specifying requirements more precisely. After he threatened to take it to the school board, she backed down.
 
Software that tries to do everything usually can't do shit properly.
 
@Ell I find it even harder in a profession.
 
Ell
Will power is my biggest problem with anything - I have none :L
 
I made from my hobby my profession, but coding as a job isn't nearly as fun as doing it in your free time
 
2:46 PM
But you're paid by the hour.
 
@kbok They existed, but access was quite limited, at the time.
 
Ah, well, this sucks then.
 
Money don't make things fun.
 
I'm paid monthly, and I have to do x many hours, and anything over isn't paid
 
2:47 PM
Wait, what?
 
If it was hourly, then if I did 15hrs in a day, I'd get paid for 15hrs at x rate
 
Ah well, but I mean you're not paid by your productivity.
 
I think one other characteristic is often missed: although programmers often tell rather pessimistic jokes and such, to program long enough to become any good, you have to be pretty close to incurably optimistic. The sort of person who honestly believes "this time it's going to work" for 20000 runs of the compiler in a row.
 
I'm paid monthly as well.
 
Ell
@JerryCoffin haha amen to "this time it's going to work"
 
2:49 PM
Fuck optimism.
 
@kbok Isn't that the standard in France?
 
@JerryCoffin yes, I tend to agree with that. Although I've found my optimism definitely hasn't increased since starting to work.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Yep. Only gardeners and the like get paid by the day.
 
I get paid every two weeks.
 
You should get paid for the time you worked.
 
2:49 PM
I was far more optimistic when I started, then reality struck.
 
(My mother hired a gardener. They're fucking expensive.)
 
If they don't pay you for more than X time, then well, don't ever do more than X hours.
 
@CatPlusPlus mostly works, on occasion you have to put in more hours, but they can't really demand that.
 
Fuck that.
 
@CatPlusPlus I have to work 40 hours per week, so I get paid for that. And I'm not paid overtime, so if I work more than that, too bad. If I work less, then that means some explaining to do with my boss.
 
2:51 PM
@TonyTheLion Well, not necessarily in the face of things like office politics and such. That's rather a more difficult problem than just having to be perfect.
 
I'm not working with deadlines and shit for personal satisfaction.
 
they can compensate extra time in terms of days off though, afaik
 
Anyone who says otherwise is lying.
Or stupid.
Or both.
 
I enjoy work when I can get something done and see progress
but otherwise, it sucks
 
If it's my own project, sure.
 
2:52 PM
but you're the cat, you're a pessimist to your very core
 
If it's shitty cookie cutter project by agency X that will be forgotten 2 months from now, fuck no.
 
us normal people still have some optimism left in us
pessimism probably drives you
 
@CatPlusPlus Speaking of which, it's about nine AM for me -- I'd better get off of here and go gain some personal satisfaction from my two current projects (deadlines on Nov 1 and 2 respectively).
 
If you work free overtime, then you're just a sucker.
 
Meow.
 
2:53 PM
If you let them fuck you over, they will.
 
@JerryCoffin Are you on holiday ?
@CatPlusPlus It depends.
My company expects you to work overtime when necessary. OTOH, they pay 1.5 the market price.
 
For free?
 
Ell
are programmer wages good? above averages? below?
 
@CatPlusPlus Video game development in North America is built around unpaid overtime.
In fact, I'm pretty sure it's that way in the whole world too.
 
Overtime for free yeah. If you're not happy with that you can just leave.
 
2:56 PM
@EtiennedeMartel I know. Gamedevs are terrible.
 
So, next time you play a AAA game, think it's been made by "suckers".
 
It's like wearing Nike shoes.
 
Ell
really? o.O
 
OTOH I could do 1000% overtime if the company was mine, and I was working on my projects.
It's a matter of where the :effort: goes
If it's not even acknowledged by expecting me to work for free, well. I have options.
 
Ell
have any of you considered working freelance? or starting your own company? or selling your own library/game/application/whatever ?
 
Freelance you can pretty much only do webdev, and it's terrible crap for terrible money.
Company, yeah.
I might actually do that. Not in the near future, but still.
 

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