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4:04 PM
major improvement
flag system was fixed too
 
Since when as OO meant OO
 
@fredoverflow Because everyone has a different definition of what "OO" means
 
@fredoverflow Ever since "OO" became synonymous with "crappy design" (i.e., around 1988).
 
@JerryCoffin What happened in 1988?
 
@fredoverflow Because no-one knows what OO is.
 
4:24 PM
 
@fredoverflow Object orientation started to move from an esoteric concept restricted to a rare few at Xerox PARC and such, into the mainstream. C++, of course, is the primary culprit here--the first language with some support for OO that moved into the mainstream, leading to both the language and the concepts being misunderstood by millions.
 
Hm, those suggestions are actually quite reasonable.
@JerryCoffin Does anybody except Scott understand C++?
 
Nooble does
 
According to the above tool, Haskell programmers should learn JavaScript and PHP, lol.
(followed by Go and Swift)
 
Has anyone managed to get out from the matrix?
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/quit-your-job-you-matrix-simon-squibb
 
4:27 PM
@fredoverflow A fair number of others do to at least some degree.
 
What would be the point of life then, if not to twerk
for 40 years
 
I managed to get out from the matrix twice. had the period of vacation like a year. It's so fucking awesome if you know how to balance your life
 
> My first professional programming language was this mutant called VBScript, and of course a little bit of JavaScript on the client side, sprinkled with lots of “if this is Netscape do this, else do that” because back then I had no idea how to use JavaScript properly. Interestingly, it’s 2016 and we are barely starting to understand how to do anything in JavaScript.
 
every text gets funnier when you replace 'JavaScript' with 'that language designed for animating snowflakes on websites'
 
user1804599
Use React and a type checker.
 
user1804599
4:30 PM
@milleniumbug CSS 3?
 
@fredoverflow Like taking a nun to a mud wrestling match...
 
@milleniumbug According to Anders, JavaScript was invented to make the monkey dance on websites ;)
@JerryCoffin lol good one
 
@fredoverflow IOW BonziBuddy is the cause of all world's problems :D
 
BonziBuddy = CoffeeSpell?
> The first advice I can give you all is, do not pay attention to hype. Every year there is a new programming language, framework, library, pattern, component architecture or paradigm that takes the blogosphere by storm. People get crazy about it. Conferences are given. Books are written. Gartner hype cycles rise and fall. Consultants charge insane amounts of money to teach, deploy or otherwise fuckup the lives of people in this industry.
Are Monads hype?
 
no
Monads are simply monoids in the category of endofunctors
 
4:35 PM
^ probably worst Monad tutorial ever
 
they are a trivial idea to compose shit that doesn't compose naturally
end of tutorial
 
@fredoverflow No, but we'd probably be better off if all hype were wrapped up in monads, so we wouldn't have to experience it directly any more.
 
user1804599
"The 11 in C++11 refers to the number of legs [..] nailed onto the dog whilst attempting to build a better octopus." - Dylan Beattie 🐶🐙
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow yeah it's awful
 
user1804599
Man, this burning diarrhea. I'm so butt hurt.
 
4:43 PM
@fredoverflow title is pretty bad too
 
Ell
@fredoverflow I also don't like that he bashes syntax colouring :V
 
lol how can you bash syntax colouring
 
Ell
> I'm a grown up and a professional programmer so I don't need bright colours to know what is a variable, what is a string
or sthng
 
@Zoidberg Anybody with the insecurity/arrogance complex necessary to name his account "CodeWisdom" deserves to be ignored permanently.
 
4:47 PM
@Ell The other day some guy on reddit claimed that turning off syntax-highlighting makes you more productive.
 
@fredoverflow I wonder when these guys are going to learn that not every person on earth is the same as they are (nor is every project or programming language identical).
 
Well, except Java is basically C++ with garbage collection, right?
Also C# is basically Java, but you can write string instead of String if you want to.
 
Xeo
I like syntax colouring not because I need the colours for any kind of information, but simply because I don't wanna stare at a monocoloured mess of characters
 
@fredoverflow Java is a mixture of BASIC, C syntax, and an attempt at imitating Keith Gorlen's attempt at imitating the Smalltalk library in C++.
 
@fredoverflow devops?
 
4:54 PM
@fredoverflow I like how on related link to the article they try to convince you why syntax highlighting is terrible because you wouldn't do that with natural text
And to be honest, it backfires very much
It's actually easier to read because I know what can I ignore
(well, if it was a sane colouring and not a rainbow, then yes. But they've chosed to make it a rainbow scheme to exaggerate the problem)
Now I want syntax highlighting in natural text
 
@milleniumbug Sounds like a solid argument against that horrible "one statement per line, indentation to match flow control" style so many of those poor misled "programmers" try to follow too...
 
user1804599
@Ven No, it can't.
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow And with proper polymorphism, instead of horrible mess like templates.
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow And C# lacks checked exceptions, ugh.
 
user1804599
Other than that, and a few other things, C# is pretty much Java.
 
user1804599
5:00 PM
The similarity between C# and Java is underestimated because people don't know any other programming languages.
 
user1804599
When somebody tells you to learn another language, don't learn one that is essentially the same as the one you already know. -_-
 
cool guy
I'd love to see him here in this shit room
 
nwp
some time ago I wanted to make a semantic highlighter that colors variables by type
never really got started on it
 
user1804599
Color by hash value of their name.
 
user1804599
That's useful.
 
user1804599
5:03 PM
It allows easier distinction.
 
nwp
also auto completion shouldn't give you all variables, just the ones that fit semantically
 
user1804599
No, it should give everything that matches the same order of characters. (e.g. typing foo matches foobar as well as fabulousowl).
 
user1804599
It is much more useful.
 
user1804599
I often write code in such a way that things come before other things so that the computer can't make accurate predictions.
 
user1804599
You might want to highlight or float-to-top the things that match semantically, but don't hide everything else.
 
nwp
5:06 PM
yeah, ordering is probably a better idea
 
How can I enforce that I get passed ForwardIterators to the function? I don't actually use anything specific in the function, but I don't want to promise overly accepting interface. Will static_assert(std::is_convertible<std::iterator_traits<It>::iterator_category, std::forward_iterator_tag>::value, "expecting forward iterators"); do?
 
@Zoidberg What about different variables with the same name in different scopes? I want distinct colors for them!
 
user1804599
Ok hash the (scope, name) pair. :)
 
user1804599
Also stop shadowing.
 
What if the shadowing variable literally projected a shadow onto the shadowed variable? :)
 
nwp
5:12 PM
@fredoverflow you adapt your color scheme to visualize that
 
What I meant was it doesn't have to stop at colors.
For example, IntelliJ underlines variables, IIRC.
 
@nwp Our new IDE enables dynamic shadowing (DX11 or higher hardware required).
 
nwp
yeah, one could literally add a shadow to shadowing variables
 
@nwp Oh, but why stop at just shadowing? I want an IDE that does real-time ray-tracing... :-)
 
nwp
where would the rays go? starting from main and following all code paths?
 
user1804599
5:17 PM
 
awesome, now give both xs different colors!
 
user1804599
No. I already closed Inkscape.
 
@JerryCoffin rofl
 
nwp
@nwp ifs will split the ray, return might join them together
dead code is dark
 
5:21 PM
Did you just freehand the coloured xs on top?
 
nwp
mspaint masterrace
 
Are concepts well overdue for C++?
 
concepts lite are rubbish and trash
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Sure looks like it (unless he left that little shadow intentionally).
 
axiom or bust
 
5:23 PM
@ScarletAmaranth Does rubbish differ from trash?
 
@JerryCoffin I don't know, English is not my mother tongue
 
user1804599
@fredoverflow I wrote an optimisation step that turns f (A x) = A x into f a@(A _) = a. :)
 
nice
 
user1804599
And it's only 33 LoC!
 
Ell
@ScarletAmaranth I see what you did there
 
5:26 PM
^^
 
user1804599
English is not my mother's thong.
 
Ell
balls
I did something wrong with git
and lost stuff
either that or I'm going batty
 
Git is a mess :-\
 
Ell
fuck
what did I do
I'm so confused.
 
You never lose commits on git unless you do a gc. Did you do a gc?
git reflog
 
user1804599
5:34 PM
Git does a GC automatically sometimes.
 
Hopefully not 5 minutes after you screwed up :)
 
user1804599
Also, it doesn't matter @Ell.
 
user1804599
Just reset a backup.
 
@Ell Which? Installed it, or (worse yet) used it? I can only think of one thing worse than using it. Unfortunately, that worse thing is not using it...
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
5:41 PM
How do you pronounce "Haskell"?
 
@Zoidberg Just like Mr. Curry's first name, of course.
 
user1804599
That guy also did a "C++" tutorial.
 
user1804599
It was horrible and got many upvotes, as usual.
 
user1804599
Not a single lack of new was given.
 
nwp
5:44 PM
yeah, but I believe the pronunciation of haskell is correct
 
user1804599
Nice.
 
The title is clickbait, though.
 
user1804599
Yeah but the video is very educational.
 
yes
Hm, lots of comments on that video about Clojure being Nirvana? strange
Clojure has no control over effects at all, does it?
 
user1804599
5:52 PM
@fredoverflow Wrong.
 
user1804599
You can for example not write to arbitrary locations in memory.
 
user1804599
The JVM restricts this, and so Clojure has to too.
 
Right, but every function can call any Java method.
 
user1804599
Yes, absolutely.
 
@Mysticial I had some really bad experiences with Knights Landing, it requires a lot of code rewrite and wasn't able to outperform a high end 780 GPU (at that time). Time spent to convert to their architecture negates any savings. (I can't tell you the exact numbers because of the NDA)
 
5:56 PM
Pop quiz, what does the following C program do?
typedef int x;
x foo(x x) { return x; }
int main() { return foo(42); }
 
does it even compile?
 
Good question.
 
yes.
it's legal and returns 42
 
@milleniumbug may depend on compiler flags
 
@Puppy Which compiler did you try with which options?
 
5:58 PM
I bet clang doesn't let it compile with errors as warnings and Weverything
 
-fpermissive
 
me with awesome options
also G++ is quite happy with its close relative coliru.stacked-crooked.com/a/1e551c6e67b8e1dc
 
Anyway, it's illegal C as I understand it: "An identifier declared as a typedef name shall not be redeclared as a parameter."
 
Can't believe my pc keyboard is just turned 7 years
The "Enter" key is only malfunctioning. it gets stalled occasionally . it's fine though
 
user1804599
> In Haskell, you can do this:
 
user1804599
6:06 PM
data FooBar = Foo String Int | Bar String Number

isFoo :: FooBar -> Bool
isFoo Foo{} = True
isFoo _ = False
 
user1804599
TIL
 
user1804599
Foo{} is the same as Foo _ _.
 
?
I went to a Haskell meetup on Saturday, we made a functional web page that used NASA's API to pull pretty pictures. :)
I didn't do the API part, I figured as long as it compiled as I followed along with the guy who ran the workshop, it should work.
brb
 
Ell
6:24 PM
@fredoverflow it seems I never committed the right things in the first place or something
because the commit with the right message in the reflog does not appear to have the corresponding changes I needed
@Zoidberg I don't make backups every 5 minutes :S
or half hour even
 
user1804599
LOSER!
 
Ven
@Zoidberg would be annoying otherwise :v
hey, I have 4 messages on the starboard. That shows how little I've accomplished today.
@Zoidberg aw, that'd be cool :)
@fredoverflow isn't it a new scope? I only read the c++ standard's pov on this, though...
No, I'm thinking about enum a { b = b };
 
cousins
 
Ven
@milleniumbug sorry :/
@fredoverflow ;D
 
6:34 PM
lol that's terrible
 
Ven
this sort of stuff I discovered reading the standard :P
 
user1804599
exports.hashNumber = function(a) {
    if (isNaN(a)) {
        return Math.random();
    }
    // ...
};
 
Ell
not sure if I have some kind of RSI or wat
 
@Ell "or what" covers quite a few possibilities.
 
Ell
yeah, it's quite an escape clause
 
6:40 PM
@Zoidberg Bad idea. This could accidentally show two NaNs as being equal, which isn't allowed (not even once in ~4 billion times).
 
Ven
not even on full moons?
 
6:53 PM
@Ven That depends on whether you mean "thing in the sky at night looks round" or "girl who seems to have lost the bottom of her bikini."
 
user1804599
instance hashFoldable :: (Foldable f, Hash a) => Hash (f a) where
  hash = foldl (\h x -> combine h (hash x)) 1
 
user1804599
:3 :3 :3
 
Ven
@JerryCoffin now that's offensive. A man could also lose a bottom
@Zoidberg flip combine . hash?
:P
 
user1804599
I don't think that works.
 
@Ven Yes, but when/if he does, it has no effect on floating point comparison.
 
user1804599
6:55 PM
Type error due to arity.
 
Ven
@Zoidberg mh?
 
user1804599
<<< doesn't really work like that.
 
user1804599
You need the boob operator (<<<)<<<(<<<) or something.
 
Ven
lol
ah fuck it'd be easier if it was \x h
 
user1804599
6:56 PM
Manboob operator.
 
Ven
but with this order it's just not readable enough
flip $ flip combine . hash
 
user1804599
Terrible.
 
Ven
ew, I'm starting to hate myself
 
user1804599
Well I can use foldr instead.
 
@Ven Welcome to the club.
 
Ven
6:59 PM
@Morwenn oh, no, no, no. You don't have anything on me
 
I hate you ♥
 
Ven
@Morwenn ♥♥♥
 
@BartekBanachewicz wakey wakey
 
@Morwenn Mighty ambitious of you. Hatred takes a lot of energy and gives nothing in return. Any more, I think twice about expending the energy to even mildly dislike somebody, not to mention hating them.
 
@JerryCoffin Yeah, there are a few things I actually hate and it's a bit draining.
 
Ven
7:03 PM
yes, but sometimes I wish I could hate.
would help me move forward
 
Not really. Sometimes you hate things you can't really do anything about.
 
Ven
well, there's something I can't do anything to. But I can't manage to hate it. So I can't manage to forget about it, or put it in the back of my mind
 
frustration is not helpful
some times, just taking a break is the best way forward
 
Ven
it's hard when it's literally what "moves" or "dictates" your life that you want to hate :)
 
Your dick?
 
7:12 PM
I must be stupid, that sentence didnt make much sense
 
Thanks, but I'm not very good with template programming. Can you provide a small example to make it more clear? — user4979733 2 hours ago
Sorry. In that case, your work around seems just fine. Why do you want me to do things you don't want to? You can always come to SO with concrete questions if you get stuck. — sehe 19 secs ago
 
Ven
@Morwenn eh non
 
Ven
@Zoidberg gg
it does look like mud
@james please don't
 
user1804599
:'(
 
7:18 PM
> >GenericGF
Your very own face
 
.@_MauricioRobles @mirikramer @xeni https://t.co/7kcylxTP85
We need something like #femsplaining
This is it, at its finest
 
seems to me like he has a fundamentally valid, if not necessarily appropriate or relevant, point.
 
7:41 PM
@Puppy Yes, but that is a different point.
 
well, the Twitter link doesn't contain a lot of context, but it seems pretty much the same point to me.
obviously it's stupid for men to lecture women on something subjective like that but there's plenty that solid objective science can say and it can tell that to anyone of any gender.
 
@Puppy Yes but a random gynecologist won't approach a woman on the street and tell her all about menstruation.
 
the Twitter link doesn't state or imply that any such thing happened.
 
Indeed. That's just what I inferred.
 
7:44 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I ended up getting a 24 GB Laptop.
The problem is, I'm not using Linux, so the chances of it being used are like. 0. :v
VC++ doesn't even make a 64-bit executable, IIRC.
And it certainly doesn't use it by default if they do.
 
@EtiennedeMartel Maybe I'm just not paying attention, but I don't recall seeing a non-gynecologist do anything similar to that either.
 
nwp
@ThePhD you can, just got some issues with finding 64bit versions of libs
 
I love how everybody ~knows what other people mean and all, but still like to pursue non-sensical debates with more-than-expected arguments.
 
@nwp No I mean, the VC++ team doesn't make a 64-bit cl.exe.
 
nwp
@ThePhD you mean you need to link stuff that exceeds 3GB in object files?
I remember firefox having that issue
 
7:49 PM
They have a /bigobj flag for that, IIRC.
Still, that's not really my issue.
 
nwp
which increases the limit from 2 to 3 GB
 
Ven
@Morwenn it's a very annoying thing about the lounge, yes
 
It's just that the compiler itself just won't use more of my RAM for stuff.
Like, say, writing to RAM instead before flushing it all the disks at once.
 
@Ven And not only the lounge :/
 
@ThePhD 16 GB ram disk.
 
nwp
7:51 PM
@ThePhD what size does the project need to be for that to become an issue?
 
@nwp A big one that compiles 15 different libraries before compiling itself. :B
Also @Borgleader I got the 1.8K USD one.
 
@ThePhD Counting all the distinct LLVM and Clang libraries, and the Boost ones, I think I might be up to like, 40-50
 
Ell
@ThePhD oh why
 
@Puppy Dats... a lot.
@Ell Because I didn't want to stay with 12 GB of memory space, and that one was the only regular "next step up".
 
nwp
@ThePhD but that would launch multiple processes so the limit is increased by x15 which is more RAM than you have
 
Ell
7:54 PM
you don't have a desktop? :P
 
I unfortunately paid a HEFTY price since it also ONLY came with that 256 GB SSD.
@Ell No. I (currently) have 2 derelict laptops.
 
Ell
:(
this saddens me
why not desktop for performance + laptop for not performance?
 
1 of them, the screen is broken so I use it LIKE a desktop, but it's old and crufty and while it will work for probably 2 more years it can't play the latest games. It CAN Do OpenGl 4.3, though.
 
Ell
to me, laptop will never be optimal for performance anything :/
 
I have a laptop with 6GB RAM and that's pretty much enough for me.
 
7:55 PM
My current one had a super-heating problem.
 
@ThePhD Not related.
 
@ThePhD Haha, my old one too. It was too hot to actually go on my lap.
 
I actually just got done cracking it open and fixing the heating issue, but while I did that I sort of fucked up the shift key (it works but I need to pinky-stab it),
and the ctrl key, and I ALSO killed the trackpad.
 
they market laptops alot too
 
But it doesn't overheat anymore when I try to open VS.
 
7:56 PM
do stationary computers not need marketing?
 
Do your builds in RAM
Oh, Jerry mentioned already
 
I need to learn how to make a RAM Disk for Windows.
 
@nick D:
 
@ThePhD You shall wreck all the noobs \o/
 
8:01 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Oooh boy.
 
I don't even
 
@Charlie They might need it, but they don't get any. The market is pretty easy to get into, so profit margins are right on the line between "low" and "nonexistent".
 
I think of it like this, imagine you go to a car dealership
 
Ven
@Morwenn sure
 
and the seller starts suggesting a fancy convertible
why isnt he selling the stationwagon? because it sells itself
u dont need to market a good product, not much anyway
 
8:06 PM
@JerryCoffin I was probably just projecting, but I was understanding it as a reference to the concept of "mansplaining". Hence my assumptions that it was random dudes telling women things that women should know better about.
 
Ell
hey some women should know better about some things :V
let's not do this actually
 
lol
chicken
 
@EtiennedeMartel I s'pose that's possible, but it seems pretty far-fetched to me. Most cases I see like this follow a pattern like: 1) woman rips guys head off for no reason. 2) Man has nerve to guess this might have something to do with her hormones. 3) remains of said man are ripped into even smaller shreds, usually specifically because his guess was accurate.
 
@Nooble HE'S ALIVE
Praise the Koala
 
But I've always been alive.
 
8:11 PM
@JerryCoffin You know, I never once encountered this strange situation where women act all irrational and angry and stuff. Maybe you just met the wrong women ;)
 
Sometimes I wonder how it happened that computer science is one of the very few fields where people work days and days writing software for free for then leaving it to the public under an open source license and expect people to help out.
Maybe that's a sign of how bad and complicated computer science is.
If you take the open source world as its own, you might even see a spark of a sort of socialism.
It's just interesting.
Wait so nabjijdioshfj and Nooble are two different people?
 
there's a simple language hiding inside modern C, but it's hiding really really well https://twitter.com/bmastenbrook/status/725048588053655554
Winner
 
@EtiennedeMartel Could be. It's certainly true that quite a few women just avoid most social situations to the extent they can when they realize they aren't feeling particularly sociable. As such, those who see it the most tend to be family and the very closest friends.
 
@ThePhD 4 kg?!
I'd need a roady
 
It's nothing compared to yo mama.
 
8:18 PM
@R.MartinhoFernandes I didn't know (a) there was a thing like "men's size" (b) I wear women's size
 
Yeah, Sentinel-1B just launched.
Even more work in perspective ._____.
 
8 messages moved to bin
Damn. Ell. Get an avatar ;(
6 messages moved to bin
 
Ell
Sorry >.<
 
Should be back shortly
 
Ell
it's okay :)
there was nothing of worth really
 
8:30 PM
8 messages moved from bin
Your avatar is almost identical :)
 
user1804599
Super fancy.
 
Ven
you're not providing nearly enough code for us to help you here... — Ven 6 secs ago
SO should add quick-replies.
 
yeah
Both quick comments and quick answers
Like the "use std::vector" one
 
8:46 PM
@Ven There's a userscript for you
 
Ven
@набиячлэвэлиь surely :)
 
user1804599
8:57 PM
@Shoe you mean quickdupes
 
user1804599
In the case of std::vector, a quickdupe of tinyurl.com/so-cxxbooks
 
Answers are superior. At least you have a chance of farming some sweet internet points
 
@Ven Opera had that built in :(
@Zoidberg Graph and network topology is a nice subject
@Puppy The problem to me is the generalizing "Hey men, don't do X, k thx bai" - does she get approached by men all the time explaining stuff about menstruation? IDGI
 
> >Hey, do you know your vagina bleeds about each moon month?
 
If she has just had a weird encounter where a man was lecturing women on menstruation, that's tweet worthy "Okay, just had man explain to me/a bunch of women how menstruation works. Pro tip: don't do that" - e.g.
 
9:03 PM
tbh I don't quite see why not but sure
 
It's a different thing from "Hey, men, stop being obnoxious".
 
There's always a distinct possibility of said "bunch of women" not knowing how menstruation works in detail v0v
 
Well. There's no reason to assume stuff like that
I am surprised, as I know Spanish has article. — peterh 3 hours ago
+1 for irony
 
user1804599
22:58 < ely-se> My CPU rests in a socket. And my eye does too.
23:04 < thimoteus> just the one eye, eh
23:05 < ely-se> the other one is in a jar
23:05 < ely-se> a Java developer stole it from me because he didn't C#
23:06 < thimoteus> badum pshhhhh
7
 
Not bad. Ready mades. Well deployed.
> My initiation on the subject was when I made the serialization library. The library was pretty popular so the documentation was subjected to much criticism and scrutiny. I had a really, really hard time figuring out how to do this.
> It was the subject of a long, contentious, threads about how to do it. I was subjected to the didactic style of boosts legendary "Mr. Personality" David Abrahams who sadly has moved to the dark side (working for Apple) to support his family. Without going into more details, you'll find it more pleasant to get suggestions from me.
Robert Ramey about learning how to write Boost Documentation guided by Dave Abrahams
 
nwp
9:42 PM
I have a test that tests loading "long name with spaces and weird c̼̯ͨ̂͐̈͋͠ͅhͧ̿̿̐̈́ͯ̃a͈̙͕͍̳̥ͅr͙͍̳̜̞̦̊ͪͪ̋͊̋͝a̟̰̟̥̮̭͗͐c͔̘͈̠͓̖̱͋ͯ̀t̩͇͉̥͊̓̑͌͝e̎̍rͯ̇̇ͦ̋̚‌​̰s̱̻̬ͥ̍ͪ̿" and clang-format gets confused and breaks the code
 
@DmitriBudnikov en fait je me demande si à ce moment-là tu venais pas d’admettre que tu es un visiteur de JV.com
 
nwp
send a bug report or stop risking Zalgo eating us all?
 

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