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user1804599
12:00 AM
muhmuh
 
user1804599
bikeshedding~
 
there's nothing bikeshedding - half of doing something right is that simple things should be simple
 
@Mikhail IME the most painful bits of GUI toolkits are event handling and composability.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Kinda, but when you get those correct (like I did :-P ), you don't want to be stuck with something that looks bad.
You can see this tradeoff in the widespread use of bootstrap.
Honestly, I might be suffering from PTSD from the failings of Qt. All I wanted, was for my combox to be center aligned.
 
it seems so simple and yet
and yet
 
user1804599
12:12 AM
@R.MartinhoFernandes Not so much event handling, but state propagation, IMO
 
user1804599
State propagation in combination with composition. The rest is easy.
 
user1804599
Phil did something incomprehensible with comonads to conquer this. I should read up on that again.
 
user1804599
Well yeah, state propagation happens when state changes, which happens when an event is triggered.
 
Yeah so, the correct thing to do is to respond to the state change. This is a minimal requirement...
 
user1804599
Of course, if you don't update the interface when the state changes, why bother changing the state.
 
12:19 AM
Yeah, that was obvious, the less obvious to achieve part is to only propagate the state you need. But also not to mirror the state, between GUI and program logic.
 
user1804599
Quite easy if it's immutable.
 
user1804599
O(0) copy, and you can diff it.
 
Yeah, so obviously the real challenge in GUI design is the aesthetic part (and not fucking it up)
 
user1804599
CSS
 
Which eliminates MFC (among others)
 
12:23 AM
CSS is pretty shit I feel
 
CSS > Win32
 
Ell
I think GUIs are hard
getting html elements to go where you want can be difficult
 
> Essonne : une élue PS condamnée pour ses achats de vêtements avec de l'argent public
@Luc welp
13k€ even, donc elle faisait pas ses achats chez Gémo
 
12:42 AM
Okay. Getting my memory to run at 2400 MHz was more difficult than it should've been. This isn't looking good.
 
@Mikhail lol
 
1:10 AM
@Mysticial You have my sympathies.
 
FWIW, it won't even post at 2666 MHz. Even with the relevant voltages heavily overvolted and the timings relaxed to their 3200 MHz settings.
I definitely didn't expect to get it all the up to the 3200 Mhz which the memory was rated for. But I certainly didn't expect to hit a wall past 2400 MHz.
 
Heh money.stackexchange.com/questions/77407/… I pay less taxes than this guy and I live in 'taxed to death' Sweden.
 
@Mysticial lol CPU-Z says my DRAM Frequency is 800MHz, apparently I have pleb RAM
 
1600, there's a factor of 2
 
Why factor of 2?
 
1:18 AM
I believe the double data rate
 
Oh
That,s still 50% slower though?
(Not sure how much a diff that makes in practice)
 
Yeah, but you're probably using DDR3.
 
I am
 
DDR4 has min frequency of 2133 MHz.
And that's what my mobo is defaulting to.
I had to to mess with almost all the settings to get it to post at 2400 MHz.
 
AVX is unsustainable, we need to get GPU computing on the integrated iGPU. I think OCL goes through AVX?
Also I want a three argument std::max
@Mysticial Look at this iGPU
Its more iGPU than CPU!
 
1:27 AM
Let's see if AMD forces them in the other direction.
 
But AVX?
 
@Mikhail I still think its fucking stupid to have an iGPU on for example an i7, if I get an i7 chances are ill also be getting a discrete gpu
at least give me a choice to not pay for 2/3rd of a chip im not going to use
ffs
@Mysticial :O oh neat
 
Well for mobile you have a power saving advantage, perhaps similar for desktops.
 
@Mysticial I would say it was AMD that forced them into this, but I'm not at all sure AMD sold enough of their "APU"s to force anything on anybody.
@Borgleader Pretty sure that percentage drops when you get more CPU cores (i.e., the iGPU stays the same size, but more cores use more space).
 
MY MOM BOUGHT MY DOG A PARKA AND HES TOO FAT FOR IT TO BUTTON https://t.co/42ZAwCiYv4
a barka
 
1:38 AM
@jaggedSpire The human version of this isn't nearly as cute, s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7a/5c/c0/…
 
1:51 AM
@Borgleader I like having an iGPU in general in case my graphics card fucks up and I need to investigate what's going on.
 
Many server boards have an external "integrated" gpu for that purpose.
 
@Mikhail On CPU yes
 
@AldwinCheung Is that an answer to my recent question on SO?
 
let me see
well, huseyin already answered you lol
BTW Intel iGPUs are surprisingly powerful since the 5500 series
 
2:09 AM
Maybe in the future they will share a cache.
 
@Borgleader Disagree, think of laptops. I have an XPS with i7 and the iGPU allows me to play Overwatch just fine.
@Mikhail The good thing is that they can share the same memory space through OpenCL, so you get 0 copies.
Unlike discrete GPUs which require a copy
 
Yep. The next step is for them to share some level of cache, although this would be non-trivial as GPU's need high speed local texture style cache units.
Its interesting but if your algorithm is compute bound, you're only using half the GPU, and maybe >25% of the compute throughput on a 2 core laptop system.
This explains why you can do 4k video playback on a tablet, but good luck getting that on a 2 core CPU system?
 
Good luck getting an algorithm to be compute bound on GPU :)
 
@AldwinCheung Not sure if you're being serious. Actually that is really easy? For example, the 3x3 convolution paper, where they get a speedup by removing computing overhead associated with computing the indexes of the shared memory, and instead use the built in texture lookup?
 
Those types of algos are really far and few between. And yes I'm serious?
 
2:17 AM
On Kepler, our convolution implementations with small filters can exceed the global memory bandwidth bound by using the texture cache.
@AldwinCheung Oh. When required I typically optimize the work per element like in halide-lang.org, so in the image processing stuff I do, I often come close...
I killed at least two computers due to overheating. (all from iBuyPower, btw)
 
@Mikhail Maybe I'm misunderstanding something, but doesn't that exactly say that the algo is memory bound...?
 
@AldwinCheung Yeah, but it was compute bound before?
 
What!
Compute bound = you're doing it right
 
Wait yeah, fuck
 
2:25 AM
Mikhail go to sleep
 
No
I need to write a response to these reviewers
 
Sure. Either way, point being, it's really difficult IME to make GPU kernels that are compute bound nowadays, and I can't (personally) think of anything that is arithmetically intensive enough for that.
 
I think the misconception is that being bound either by compute or memory access is neither good or bad. You're going to be bound by something. In their paper, they show how they moved from being compute bound to being memory bound.
 
I don't think they're being compute bound on indices, they're bound on global memory bandwidth more likely?
And can't keep enough data in flight
 
When they did it right, they were bound by global memory, when they did it wrong they were bound by indices and similar. But doing it right required using texture memory.
 
2:29 AM
Well I didn't read the paper so vOv
How complex does your index computation have to be to make your kernal compute bound
 
http://parlab.eecs.berkeley.edu/sites/all/parlab/files/Communication-Minimizing%20Convulsion-%20Keutzer.pdf
^ Figure 3
And now with bindless textures, we loose the bullshit overhead for using texture memory. Curiously, the overhead still exists if you choose to bind textures on hardware that supports bindless textures - maybe for compatibility reasons?
 
No idea, I don't get to use texture memory.
 
Notice how that hasn't stopped me :-)
 
@Mikhail At one time you had to apply to patch to Windows to run it on the (then) latest processors, because they'd optimized a few instructions that Windows was using for delays (specifically jmp $+1, if memory serves) to the point that they didn't delay correctly any more...
 
2:46 AM
"run it" <- What is it? How does jmp have anything to do with OpenGL/CUDA API calls?
 
@Mikhail It = Windows. Nothing whatsoever to do with CUDA/OpenGL--just related to pessimization for compatibility reasons.
 
That sounds like an interesting story, but I don't know what exact you're referring to :-)
 
2:59 AM
I'm still perplexed as to why you starred my earlier message? Star shaming or what
 
I didn't
 
Then I'm even more perplexed
 
If you think that is bad, I know some people who think the NCSA is spying on them. In retrospect its should have been obvious as to why the product was sold by Spyglass, inc!
 
Hi anyone know how to use event scheduler in mysql?
 
@EarvinNillCastillo no, contact your local Oracle sales rep
 
3:11 AM
@Mikhail aw
 
4:04 AM
 
 
1 hour later…
5:20 AM
Hi, Everyone good morning.
Today i very happy. After hard struggle 2 days. I able to merge (kinetic + ORB_SLAM2) windows. :>
 
ScY
nice!!
 
result really very good release version 32bit.
 
Did they just use SLAM with ORB? Can you do SIFT-SLAM if you don't get a fuck what David Lowe thinks?
 
@Mikhail Do not understand. Do not use bad world like f*** you can use dash.
 
@AlexCerry Its not a bad word in American English
@AlexCerry Also go fuck yourself
 
5:30 AM
@Mikhail very bad not polite in any language.
 
Mikhail please keep the discussion civil and avoid foul language, thank you.
 
5:58 AM
Hello, I am trying to find out a solution for my problem.
<p>test</p>
<p>testing</p>
<code>
<p>replace text here<p>
</code>
<p>testing</p>
Here I want to replace text inside <p> tags withing <code></code> without effecting the <p> tags outside <code>
How can I achieve this?
 
@Phoenix use template engine. or java script.
 
@AlexCerry : Can you suggest any method? With Javascript or C#? An example would help a lot since I am in learning mode
Thank you
 
@Phoenix Yes this is Lounge<HTML>
 
@Phoenix you can easily find on internet. Google or bing.
 
@AlexCerry : I can find lot of examples which selects a portion and do string manipulations... But i am looking for a solution that will manipulate string only inside a particular block of the string without affecting any other part of the string
 
6:03 AM
@Phoenix Like Aldwin meaning. If you have any problem about html or related to website. You must to go in another room related to website.
 
@AlexCerry : Okay sorry for the trouble... Thank you
 
>2016/01/21
By the way Steve Jobs is dead
 
Thank god, fuck that guy (Steve). Cult of image instead of substance.
In honour of Saint Patrick's Day we should post traditional Scottish balds
 
6:46 AM
help please T_T
 
7:10 AM
@Phantom check this This->template fn2<short>(5)
@Phantom For detail. Read this stackoverflow.com/questions/610245/…
 
7:54 AM
Sup guise
 
Steve jobs will always be alive in my iphone
 
Guise I'm writing a variant class (as an exercise)
Should it be able to hold references?
 
you'd need to specialcase it with ref_wrapper
I'd rather move that to the user
 
@Rerito it’s entirely your call
 
8:06 AM
What should I do: silently remove references in the input types or output an error eg. with a static_assert?
@LucDanton Well refs seem to be a pain in the ass somehow :(
For instance, what should I do if I get a variant with both int and int&
it renders perfect forwarding a nightmare to assign the variant
 
@Rerito the latter
 
8:21 AM
neat, std::result_of[_t] deprecated in favour of std::invoke_result[_t] in C++17
no is_callable but oh well
 
typedef std::map<std::string, plugin_list> plugin_map; uh that's such a bad name
@R.MartinhoFernandes nooo you're using New Relic
 
8:38 AM
@BartekBanachewicz I don't know who does tbh. There's too many teams around.
Don't even know what it is :D
 
@BartekBanachewicz plugins_by_name
 
Ell
plugins
 
robert
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes basically our direct market competitor :D
@AldwinCheung typedef std::map<std::string, plugin_info> plugins_by_name;
it's in the same file
 
plugins_by_name_the_return
plugins_by_name_attack_of_the_aliases
plugins_by_name_collision_wars
 
8:45 AM
@BartekBanachewicz lol, sorry. I honestly don't know who uses it here. I know the maintainer of the public repo, but only because we FOSS-oriented peeps all had a meeting together to decide policy.
 
> PR libstdc++/80041 fix codecvt_utf16<wchar_t> to use UTF-16 not UTF-8
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes lol it's fine
 
> homophobie affichée pour faire plaisir à Sens Commun mais très paradoxale quand on connaît ses pratiques personnelles dans le Marais; comme disait Sarkozy quand celui-ci était son "collaborateur", "méfiez-vous de Fillon, il est sournois !"
XD internet comments
never change
 
on présume que lesdites pratiques sont connues parce qu’untel était sur place au moment des évènements, mais évidemment pour des motifs parfaitement innocents
 
untel inside
 
9:04 AM
@BartekBanachewicz there will be cooler stuff out in the future. Our audio file loading/saving lib is starting to look pretty good.
 
@AldwinCheung Shiny :D
 
I so tired eyes pain too much. I close all project.
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes Nice. Fun fact - I actually wrote a converter and a player for our proprietary sound format back at my previous job.
It was called RTAC, for Real-Time Audio Codec
and as far as I can tell, it wasn't much more than a wave file which you could just shove down the OpenAL's throat
 
Hi
 
@BartekBanachewicz Are you from the OIND (Obvious Initials Naming Department)
 
9:12 AM
doesn’t seem that obvious to me if you have to spell it out
 
lol
I didn't pick that name
 
That's the best way to attract downvotes
Post it again I'm sure you'll get an answer the 3rd time
 
@Impavid dude, there's another room for these kinds of questions, it's a lounge room :3 so chill and take a drink
@Impavid judging by the tags, it is related to c++ world, so you may try to test your luck here: chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/116940/c-questions-and-answers
 
> error: could not convert 'std::__cxx11::basic_string<std::basic_string_view<char>
oh dear
 
Fine. Thank you@ login_not_failed
 
9:22 AM
@Impavid it's closed as unclear what you're asking
 
@BartekBanachewicz please help with the solution
 
how does one debug deduction guiding?
 
carefully
 
> template<typename _Tp, typename = _If_sv<_Tp, void>> basic_string(const _Tp& __t, …
here we go, that used to be an std::basic_string_view-taking constructor but is now a constrained template
 
10:12 AM
soo
how do I put an IO action in the HSpec tree again
runIO is supposed to do just that, but it doesn't want to cooperate
Couldn't match type `IO'
               with `hspec-core-2.2.3:Test.Hspec.Core.Spec.Monad.SpecM a0'
Expected type: hspec-core-2.2.3:Test.Hspec.Core.Spec.Monad.SpecM
                 a0 ()
  Actual type: Expectation
oooh, right, it needs to be outside of the Expectation
well that makes sense
now how do I make this look less bad
 
Joe
is there any room for arduino question?
 
Hey, Turnip can run this now!!!!
local t = function(x)
  local f = function(s,v)
     if v > 0 then
      return v - 1
    else
      return nil
    end
  end
  local s = nil
  local v = x
  return f, s, v
end
local cnt = 0
for i in t(4) do
  cnt = cnt + i
end
return cnt
#proud
 
@Joe Stack Overflow or Arduino is where the questions go.
 
and the generic for impl isn't like ultra terrible
it's somewhere between very terrible and quite terrible
 
Joe
@R.MartinhoFernandes thank you
 
10:29 AM
    runIO (readFile "Test/lua/for-loop-basic.lua") >>=
      \fileContents -> it "should correctly handle a synthetic iterator" $ do
        runParse fileContents `shouldBe` [Number 6.0]
okay, this at least tries to scope fileContents, but it's still kinda meh
 
VS 2017 CMake support can be pretty usable actually.
 
@AlexCerry Thanks bro.
 
360	        auto&& [ctx, from, to] = rng;
(gdb) p &ctx == &rng.context
$16 = false
???
 
10:45 AM
@Mysticial if anyone asks you what you do, just say you work on much smaller versions of The Megaprocessor
 
11:15 AM
@LucDanton lol
 
it’s a nightmare, an immediate assert( &ctx == &rng.context ); won’t fire but I end up with garbage down the line. replacing the decomposition by the obvious auto& ctx = rng.context; … makes everything work
oh and of course I can’t reproduce in a minimal testcase
 
11:30 AM
auto&& [ctx, from, to] = rng;
auto& help = rng.context;
assert( &ctx == &rng.context );
assert( &ctx == &help );
only the second assert fires
 
user1804599
 
user1804599
@milleniumbug I am very open to new technology.
 
11:45 AM
@BartekBanachewicz This should not execute successfully - v is not in scope when f is created. Not sure if this is the result of fucked-up semantics in Lua or your implementation
 
user1804599
@Puppy v is a parameter.
 
oh, the name shadowing confuseth me
 
user1804599
It's not shadowing, v isn't in scope there yet.
 
user1804599
It shadows the global only.
 
okay, I think I got it. can I get a sanity check?
 
11:54 AM
yep looks good
 
12:17 PM
@Puppy yep, lua agrees
 
@Mysticial read your name in a Russian hardware site 3dnews.ru =) congrats on the Ryzen fma3 bug discovery!
 
-14
Q: Javascript equivalent to C#.NET i.e. need to convert below code to c#.net

SattyMath.floor(new Date().setDate((new Date().getDate() + 1)) / 1000); Output on 17th march 2017 =1489837872069

/cc @Mysticial
 
12:43 PM
@rightfold interesting url
@DatCorno Please don't dump bad questions here. We can find them on the main site if desired.
1 message moved to bin
 
@Puppy @rightfold do you generally keep all lang tests in code files or hardcoded strings
I'm kinda thinking about a mixed approach
 
1:00 PM
files
the Wide test runner simply finds all the wide files in a folder (recursive) and runs them
 
hmm
what about success conditions?
 
written into the wide files.
the test file's Main() function returns boolean success
 
@Puppy oh ok
yeah I have to restructure those tests soon
 
I could have exposed an assert() function I guess
 
also wut someone random blocked me on twitter
I have to make an addon that circumvents this silliness and allows to simply load the account w/o going into private mode
 
1:11 PM
hmm
> Mayo’s CEO, Dr. John Noseworthy
 
Oh apparently I don't have == implemented
that might prove difficult when implementing tests that check values :D
 
Ven
1:35 PM
@BartekBanachewicz lang tests?
you're working on your lua VM?
 
well
note that I consider these integration tests, not unit tests
 
@Ven yep
@Puppy yeah well I thought about testing the evaluation engine w/o the parser but decided that it's quite a lot of unnecessary work
it's just a pain to write AST by hand where I can be pretty sure the parser will spit out the same thing directly from the source
 
I think that it would be fine to have unit tests for evaluation engine that invokes lexer/parser first
 
that's more or less what I have. The parser suite puts in strings and verifies the AST, the eval suite puts in strings or files and verifies the runtime output
I could actually verify the VM state as well, but so far it was enough to simply check the value directly
 
wait
you can't run your evaluation engine without AST?
 
1:40 PM
@Puppy my evaluation engine turns the AST into the VM monad
I am not really sure how I'd run it "without AST"
 
Ell
@BartekBanachewicz you only have to write them once
 
@Ell mm, they really check different edge cases
I can imagine a few big scripts touching a lot of things that could be useful for both though
 
Ell
@Puppy how could it?
 
eval :: AST.Expr -> Closure -> LuaM [Value]
execBlock :: AST.Block -> Closure -> LuaM Bubble
 
well, the Wide semantic analyzer builds up a semantic tree from AST, and then we run a bunch of functions based on that.
 
1:43 PM
oh so you just have an intermediate form before the execution
I thought about that (actually still am)
but so far it's been simpler to just interpret the AST directly
 
well it's mostly useful for semantic analysis which isn't really required
but presumably, your evaluation engine is not entirely one single large function, right?
 
@Puppy actually, look above
it's two :)
 
seems to me then that you can't unit test it because your units are too big
even if I did not have an intermediate form, I could unit test the Wide semantic analyzer since the parts that are built from AST are separate and I can just define the small bit I need
 
I guess you could say that, but then again, those functions are different pattern matches
e.g.
execStmt (AST.CallStmt f ps) cls = do
    _ <- eval (AST.Call f ps) cls
    return EmptyBubble
and the tests for that look like that
    it "should eval functions" $ do
        runParse "function f() end; return f()" `shouldBe` [Nil]
        runParse "function f() return 5 end; return f()" `shouldBe` [Number 5.0]
        runParse "function f(x) return x end; return f(6)" `shouldBe` [Number 6.0]
so they aren't exactly testing that unit, but they focus on actual functionality
 
1:59 PM
case (vmin, vmax) of
    (Number n, Number i) -> loopBody cls' i n step
    _ -> throwError "'for' limits must be numbers"
pattern matching is so amazingly useful
 
2:10 PM
^ Welp. Answer to my yesterday's question.
 
@wilx I missed the question
 
yesterday, by wilx
I am trying to determine if the news here telling me that Wilders' rise was stopped is true or not.
 
It's an opinion thing. I think Wilders did reasonably well. The "stopping" part seems to be irrational (it's like saying 2016 was a very good year for Poland, after all, since no terrorist attacks on nuclear reactors have taken place)
It's mostly not as bad as people feared. That's good news, but nothing "stopping" IMO
I don't get the severe spin to make it seem like gaining 1/4th of seats is a defeat
 
2:34 PM
<U+1F3F3 WAVING WHITE FLAG, U+FE0F VARIATION SELECTOR-16, U+200D ZERO WIDTH JOINER, U+1F308 RAINBOW> yields emojipedia-us.s3.amazonaws.com/cache/58/9b/…
4
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes I don't know how I got through my day w/o that information
ouch. I got a pattern match fail in my TH code
this is gonna be so not fun
 
@R.MartinhoFernandes how do I flip the rainbow upside down though
 
  match :: [Q Pat]
  -- to accept more args, it'd need to use ConP '(:) [m, WildP]
  -- but I'm too lazy to write it right now
what the fuck were I thinking when writing this
 
@BartekBanachewicz "This is so clever! I am so clever!"
 
@wilx probably
Honestly I had hoped I won't have to touch that code ever
TH is crossing that fine line between "complex, but readable FP code" and "freaking insanity"
 
2:42 PM
@LucDanton Well, there are eleven variation selectors without standardized behaviour. You could say add U+FE03 and use a font that supports it.
 
hmm I think I simply forgot to add the match fail that errors out gracefully
match = [return . ListP $ (map fst $ matches)] only generates one pattern
oh, that's the WildP
oh now I know what I meant
oh.
 
cool
 
@BartekBanachewicz: Is it possible to get the actual code that you generate with TH or is forever just imaginary and then compiled?
 
@wilx there's an option to dump the splices to file
lua43_ahck [Number x_ahcx, Number x_ahcy]
  = (return $ [Number ((+) x_ahcx x_ahcy)])
I am pretty sure the failing function is this one
 
@BartekBanachewicz It is named hack for a reason. :D
 
2:50 PM
lol
I am pretty happy with the code it generates, but getting to that stage took me quite some time
OP_FORLOOP,/*   A sBx   R(A)+=R(A+2);
                        if R(A) <?= R(A+1) then { pc+=sBx; R(A+3)=R(A) }*/
OP_FORPREP,/*   A sBx   R(A)-=R(A+2); pc+=sBx                           */

OP_TFORCALL,/*  A C     R(A+3), ... ,R(A+2+C) := R(A)(R(A+1), R(A+2));  */
OP_TFORLOOP,/*  A sBx   if R(A+1) ~= nil then { R(A)=R(A+1); pc += sBx }*/
is it cheating if I read Lua source?
 

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